Re: extract only PART of an archive
On Sun, 28 Sep 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've searched through the dpkg info and man pages and haven't found any way to do this (I might be blind, though). Is there anyway to do it with out doing dpkg -R /tmp/ file.deb and then moving the one file and clearing /tmp? I use Midnight Commander for this. It has a feature that lets you dive into a .deb file (it may require a patch to mc.ext, see below) and view the contents. You can also copy any file you see out to another directory using Midnight Commander. As I said, some of the latest version of mc don't have the following patch applied. It is simply a matter of checking /etc/mc/mc.ext to see if it contains the following: I downloaded the upstream mc and did a standard build to get these features and more. I use mc for lots of important things so I don't see why the debianized package is many months behind the upstream. Especially since this is an official GNU program. PW -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Building Your own Boot Disks
On Fri, 22 Aug 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: imo, everyone should compile their own kernel - the boot/rescue floppy is good to install a system with, but a linux box really should have a kernel compiled especially for itwith only the drivers that it needs compiled in (or as modules), no more and no less. Often true, but it is better to use kernel-package which builds a Debian kernel-image package for this. One great reason is that you can build these packages on a machine that has all the tools and compiles fast. The resulting .deb file is easily installed with dpkg and will take care or making the hard disk boot the new kernel (while preserving the previous one) and creating a boot floppy. Manoj even helped me get a shell script going that will rebuild several custom kernels at a time. His kernel-package is a big help to me as I have several old machines that would take a few hours to build a kernel on. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Show me the money Re: Donations to Debian
On 21 Aug 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dale Scheetz writes: Each revision will be properly noted. We aren't doing this for the benefit of CD makers. This is for the benefit of the end user (remember them?) who needs to be able to go to a local retailer and purchase the Debian distribution. If the CD manufacturer is forced to loose his shirt every time he tries to distribute this product, he is not likely to try again, and others who might have tried will be discouraged from the attempt. This is the part that baffles me. Do you really believe that users who won't buy 1.3.1 because 1.3.2 is out will buy 1.3 revision 1 after 1.3 revision 2 comes out? As much as we may dislike having such discussions, marketing issues must be addressed if this goal is to be met. And choosing a simple, consistent, and comprehensible release naming scheme is such an issue. Hambone, bopeep, 1.3.1, and now revision 2... all very confusing. I've been trying to convince the people in the seul project to use Debian: they think Debian is flaky. I like Debian. I use Debian. I'd contribute if I had the resources. But I'm beginning to agree with them. Good point, John. It seems that the sugar-coated explanation still doesn't taste very good. Hey, users who are listening - Debian 1.3.3 is out but it's still called 1.3.1 so nobody who buys those CD sets will feel inferior? We need someone with a Ph.D. in policy analysis to convince us that it really does taste good. Why don't we just call it Debian GNU/Linux 1.3.1.your_lucky_number? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: shielding from liability
On 21 Aug 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bruce writes: However there are negligence scenarios, for example a maintainer who accepts a patch without realizing that it contains a trojan-horse program. I want to shield our developers from individual liability in that sort of case. Is every maintainer an employee or agent of SPI, then? Or is SPI going to purchase liability insurance and name all the maintainers as beneficiaries? I don't really think there is much risk, though. Where's the duty? Has there ever actually been a negligence suit over free software? If it was free you couldn't sue for a refund. I really think you could only sue a party that intentionally and maliciously damaged you. That would require a serious effort to instill a false sense of trust in the software. Microsoft did this to me with a database product called Access. I should have sued them for my $99 plus damages. Yeah, fat chance. A smaller entity like SPI is much more likely to be sued than a rich fascist company like u-no-hoo. It would be a nuisance suit, but SPI doesn't have a legal department with full-time attorneys to quickly dispose of such things. Anybody who is breathing US air these days is a potential victim of unwarranted, frivilous legal actions. Paranoia helps the insurance companies sell policies. Highly insured defendants means more of the money awarded by courts is actually collectible. This increases the paranoia and more insurance is purchased. There are 2 things which are getting to be worse than any tax: insurance premiums and the percentage that merchants pay on every credit card sale. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Show me the money Re: Donations to Debian
On Thu, 21 Aug 1997, Syrus Nemat-Nasser wrote: On Fri, 22 Aug 1997, Paul Wade wrote: Good point, John. It seems that the sugar-coated explanation still doesn't taste very good. Hey, users who are listening - Debian 1.3.3 is out but it's still called 1.3.1 so nobody who buys those CD sets will feel inferior? We need someone with a Ph.D. in policy analysis to convince us that it really does taste good. Why don't we just call it Debian GNU/Linux 1.3.1.your_lucky_number? Sorry friend, but this is false. 1.3.1 is out. The few changes that have been made to it were done so in error. I believe that resulted from Guy's ^ Then they should have been reversed. If they were done in error, where was the warning message to prevent people from using the 'bad' Debian? absense. But, mistakes will be made occaisionally in any case. None of the packages in bo-updates have been released into the official distribution. In case you haven't noticed, we've been trying to implement some new quality control procedures with 1.3, and it's up to the testing manager, Dale, to approve the packages before they go into the main distribution. This is the first time we've tried this, and it looks like bo-updates was the wrong name for the updates that are not yet approved by ^^^ the testing group. That is a bit of an understatement. The readme file in that directory is not entirely clear to many people. It sounds like it should have been called bo-whataretheseanyway. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: This ugly policy discussion on debian-user.
On Thu, 21 Aug 1997, Syrus Nemat-Nasser wrote: Hello Dave and Paul. It's nice that you have all this energy available to carry on this discussion, but I've grown quite weary of reading you posts. Thus, I'm probably going to take Dave's advice, from one of his early messages, and make some new entries in my kill file. Before I do kill one or more addresses, I'd like to say a few things. Go ahead if it makes you feel better. I think my reply to your previous post was valid on the 2 points: 1) If the ftp archive was changed in ERROR, it should have been reversed or a clear PUBLIC warning given not to use it. I don't believe it was an error, but was an update. 2) Your comments about the bo-updates name is quite an understatement. You have every right to filter out the truth, but it will still be the truth. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: changes in a release without any numbers changing
On Thu, 21 Aug 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: From: Dave Cinege [EMAIL PROTECTED] No I'm talking about the same revs conatining differences. Something that the developers are conviently ignoring. I already admitted it was a mistake today, and we won't do it again. I think the person who made the change understands that now. Yes, you did and some other people didn't see that and continued to say that it never happened. You said that the changes will be made and I believe that will happen. As far as incorporation and donations go, I see no problem with that. I don't expect to see any 'Debian telethons' taking over my TV in the near future or get any telephone calls from fundraising contractors. :) I agree that retail placement is good for Debian. Encouraging multiple vendors to produce copies of identical CD images won't further that goal because there will be more stale leftover inventory. I noticed that one of the Official CD vendors had to cut the price when another vendor jumped into it. Maybe some of them will produce the next version solely as a way to draw traffic to the website where they sell Redhat, Caldera, etc. at a better profit margin. I don't have those other distributions for sale. I sell Debian because I like it and tried to meet a need. As I said before, the priority should be on painless upgrades from any installed version. Perhaps a hack/patch to have dselect always do certain things first (like install an upgraded version of itself and restart) would be important. Along the same lines, it could also check for a package in base (Debian-upgrade.x.x.x.deb?) which takes care of those critical 'first steps'. This would help a lot with changes like the recent tetex packages and the upcoming libc6. A possible quicker implementation of this would be a runme.x.x.x.sh script which is clearly mentioned in the topmost readme. It would primarily use some invocations of dpkg to get things updated before dselect is invoked. One reason I favor this approach is that it could be written to smooth out the upgrades from 1.1.x and higher to any current release. If this could be accomplished, the value of an older CD (especially one that came with a book) would be much higher. I have seriously considered mass production of a really cheap Debian Starter CD. Most users can get the upgrades and any source they care to play with via ftp. They might be content to replace the CD 2 or 3 times a year. People who want all the updates on CD or want all the source don't mind paying more for CD-R products. I got tired of carrying a 'mirror' computer and ethernet hardware with me to do installs and upgrades. Soon, I hope, there will be enough Debian users to warrant a monthly CD press run of binary/source stable/unstable. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Debian only like larger businesses
On Fri, 22 Aug 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: Paul Wade: Hey, users who are listening - Debian 1.3.3 is out but it's still called 1.3.1 so nobody who buys those CD sets will feel inferior? Why am I taking so much guff from you when I work for free as a volunteer and you take my work and make money off of it? Or are you only annoying me as a hobby, Mr. President of Greenbush Corporation? Sorry, Bruce, but this is baloney! I have private email from you on both occasions when the archive changed without a release number change. The first time you said it was bad release engineering and would look into it. The second time you finally admitted that other CD vendors objected to changing the release number. What it boils down to is that you let the vendors tell you how to run the project! You could have had the decency to warn me in advance to get out of the CD business because Debian was more interested in catering to vendors who simply sell it along with other Linux distributions. I take your work (and all the other volunteers work) and lose money off of it. What is really happening is that SPI is 'covering the ass' of certain vendors. The credibility of Debian is already damaged by your actions and will only get worse if you continue in this direction. The users are smart enough to know figure out which product meets their needs. If those vendors can't sell older 1.3.1 sets to people who know the difference, they need to go back to school. few months behind when it gets to the user. You and your small CD-R business help a little, and you serve a useful niche market, but you are not first in my priorities and you are far from essential to Debian's survival. You are way out of line. I only sell Debian and I only use Debian in my 'small' business. I'm beginning to think your resignation is what will be essential to Debian's survival, but maybe a public apology to *all* the Debian users is enough. You owe it to them because you have compromised the integrity of the Debian project. What you are saying is that Debian prefers relationships with larger businesses. That makes no sense for a free software organization. Here is a list of what is updated (so far) in bo-updates. This is what you would lose if you bought a mass-market CD rather than the Paul Wade version. Please feel free to use this change-log (and its successors) in your advertising. Please let the mass market business take care of itself, and please don't get in its way. Absolutely ridiculous! You are the one that is tampering with the market. I can't believe that your actions are appropriate for something that is called GNU/Linux. I think the Free Software Foundation is lots more careful in its dealings with commercial entities. If Debian is truly a non-profit organization, then why not put the articles of incorporation on the website immediately. It just isn't ethical to ask for donations without showing the public how the organization is controlled, how officers and directors are elected and exactly what the outlook is for changing the leadership should problems arise. It's time to face the music. Your Official CD program will not work. After all, if I press 2000 sets tomorrow will you hold the release numbers for another month? Do you have to check in with multiple vendors and get their 'blessing' before 1.3.next is released? If you keep this up, another Debian group will emerge and it will all become very counter-productive. I think your marketing ideas are a bit grandoise at this time. Debian is not yet an easy replacement for the average Windows user. There is a lot of work to be done before it will sell in big numbers. In the meantime, every revision is important to help get it there. Sincerely, Paul Wade -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Updating with dselect
On Fri, 22 Aug 1997, Shaleh wrote: Paul mentioned this and I have been wondering -- what is the best procedure to update from an ftp via dselect? How do I upgrade a package I already have installed? I have only seen an add and a remove option. Where is 'upgrade'? I am now a month old Debian user and I still am impressed. Great job guys, keep it up. When you change your dselect access method to ftp, the next step is to update the list of available packages. Dselect will get it from the ftp site. After that, the select packages screen will show any installed packages that have newer versions and the default action will be to upgrade them. When you choose the install option, the new packages will be downloaded and installed as replacements to the earlier versions. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: PPP dialup problems
If that new eide card has serial ports, double check your io port and irq settings for conflicts first. I have some cheap i/o ide cards and they can cause all kinds of problems in some systems but work okay in others. On Fri, 22 Aug 1997, Chad D. Zimmerman wrote: I had ppp working ... installed an eide controller card ... now it seems my dialup / modem doesn't want to work right. Here is what I get in my messages log file when I try to connect: Aug 20 21:05:12 localhost pppd[568]: pppd 2.2.0 started by root, uid 0 Aug 20 21:05:13 localhost chat[569]: abort on (BUSY) Aug 20 21:05:13 localhost chat[569]: abort on (NO CARRIER) Aug 20 21:05:13 localhost chat[569]: abort on (VOICE) Aug 20 21:05:13 localhost chat[569]: abort on (NO DIALTONE) Aug 20 21:05:13 localhost chat[569]: send (ATDT6464942^M) Aug 20 21:05:13 localhost chat[569]: expect (CONNECT) Aug 20 21:05:42 localhost chat[569]: ATDT6464942^M^M Aug 20 21:05:58 localhost chat[569]:N M S U - N E T Aug 20 21:05:58 localhost chat[569]: alarm Aug 20 21:05:58 localhost chat[569]: Failed The chatscript is the same .. worked before ... any ideas? switch back to my old controller card maybe? Chad -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Chad D. Zimmerman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Southwest Technology Development Institute New Mexico State University --- HP: http://dabcc-www.nmsu.edu/~chad/ DBP: http://dabcc-www.nmsu.edu/~chad/Debian/ LCAO: http://dabcc-www.nmsu.edu/~chad/Las_Cruces_Art/ -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Anarchy! Yes, Anarchy!
Long live anarchy! Long live the Revolution and the Counter-Revolution! Long live the Dedicated Diehard Debianist! I will be running a special on 1.3.whatever_it_really_is binary CD's starting this weekend and continuing for at least one month. Longer if that's what it takes to clean this up. I will make it cheaper to get a 1.3.really_current binary CD than the 1.3.1 Official set. Details will be up at http://www.greenbush.com/ by noon tomorrow. On Thu, 21 Aug 1997, Paul Serice wrote: Now for your anarchist side, when governments become overbearing they tend to nationalize -- meaning they take property away from corporations (and other private organizations or individuals) for the supposed general welfare. So, it is not difficult to see that freedom from intrusive government does not necessarily imply fewer corporations. As a matter of fact, strong and health corporations arguably contribute as much to your personal autonomy as any other single factor. Does Microsoft contribute to my personal autonomy? If so, I prefer anarchy. Linux is revolutionary in nature. What if Linus had decided instead to develop something that required Windows or SCO Unix? I notice that the people behind Debian like to avoid dependencies on commercial products. It is a reality that many users could not create their first rescue floppy without MS-DOS, but we have to live with it because we don't want to be such 'purists' that we have to ship floppies to get people started. Imitating the large software company is anethema to the philosophies of dedicated Linux enthusiasts. The honest thing to do is let the consumer know exactly what he is getting. The 1.3.1 Official CD files are timestamped July 7. Since then, the stable ftp archive has had at least 2 changes which warrant a DEFINITE DISTINCTION from those CD sets. Those 2 changes were the replacement of disks/current. Since these are the images that install the base, the change is not trivial. Otherwise they would be in a testing or incoming directory. They were installed into stable to fix bugs or add features, I assume. Therefore, the ftp archive should CLEARLY differentiate itself from the 1.3.1 that was pressed onto so many discs that the foolish vendors now need to unload. So call it 1.3.3 or 1.3.1R3 or whatever, but make it obvious. If you don't do that you will need a corporation to protect the developers from personal liability. Why? Because Debian is going to great lengths to protect a few vendors who made a bad decision and need to get rid of the 'dead horse' inventory. When that is done it will it be okay to move things from bo-updates to bo and change the symlink to 1.3.2? Maybe the people who bought those CD sets will start thinking they've been fooled a bit and will hate Debian more than Microsoft. Dave used some strong language because he is rightfully pissed off. Now let me say this as a vendor of freshly recorded (1.3.?) Debian CD-R products: F___ the CD vendors. All of them including myself. If I wanted to just duplicate a CD image, I would copy a Slackware or Redhat CD and actually make a profit. Those of us who actually organize CD images would be better off if Debian would go back to the good old numbering scheme and concentrate on the concept of painless upgrading. That way people who found an old 1.1.x CD could pop in one of our 1.3.999 discs and upgrade their system without a lot of hassles. I say increment the release numbers. I doubt that the vendors who are still stuck with 1.3.1 inventory will decide to press the next release whenever it comes out. If there is a need (and a market) for cheap Debian CD's let me be honest enough to tell everyone the costs: 1000 CD-ROM's $750 Paper sleeves 5 cents Sturdy mailer 20 cents So it costs about $1.80 for a binary/source set with 2 colors printed on the discs. It costs another 78 cents to mail them to US customers. Grand total of $2.58. These vendors are charging $8.99 with shipping and handling and they need protection? I suppose the rationale is that they are paying good wages to the people who put the discs in the sleeves and seal the mailer. I preferred it before when it went from 1.2 to 1.2.18 in about 7 months. I mean the upgrades were free, right? Look at it this way: if you had to pay $50.00 per upgrade to a commercial OS that would be a $900.00 value! When I was asked if the 'Official CD' would hurt my business, I said it wouldn't because of the revision frequency of Debian. I didn't expect this new fuzzy numbering system to go along with it! Well, it has hurt my business. But don't expect me to give up and go away. Oh, I almost forgot. F___ Microsoft, too! Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Show me the money Re: Donations to Debian
On Thu, 21 Aug 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: Why change the version numbering scheme? It is a small change, it makes sense for marketing reasons, it is easy to do, and there was no reason not to do it. We're not holding up releases because of it. I suppose all 67 megs in bo-updates is being held there for some other reason? Look at my signature. This is very frustrating. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Show me the money Re: Donations to Debian
It sounds so good, but where is the clear admission that the 1.3.1 on ftp is not the same as the CD? It should be at least 1.3.1 r2 by now. The consumer should be able to quickly visit ftp.debian.org before he hands money to a retailer for a product. Expecting a software buyer not to do that is tantamount to calling him an idiot. On 21 Aug 1997, Manoj Srivastava wrote: For those who care, the old scheme was to have revisions called 2.0.1 etc, the new scheme calles them revisions. old new === === 2.0.02.0 2.0.12.0 r1 2.0.22.0 r2 There are no fewer release. All releases are numbered (with revisions, not point versions). Technically, the two schemes are the same. Mr Cinege has escalated a percived, non-technical difference into a jihad. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Anarchy! Yes, Anarchy!
On Thu, 21 Aug 1997, Paul Serice wrote: Does Microsoft contribute to my personal autonomy? If so, I prefer anarchy. Perhaps Microsoft does. Perhaps it doesn't. But, I'm almost certain Greenbush Technologies Corporation does. ;-) ^^^ There is nothing in my articles of incorporation that states a goal of contributing to the personal autonomy of others. If that is a side-effect of business operations, I hope the beneficiaries are only 'good guys'. If this is really a 'civilized' world, then I hope my little corporation contributes some anarchy to it. Autonomy is partly a matter of mind and attitude, anyway. You can achieve that with or without incorporating. The real reason I incorporated is that I like being called 'Mr. President'. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Show me the money Re: Donations to Debian
On Thu, 21 Aug 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: From: Paul Wade [EMAIL PROTECTED] I suppose all 67 megs in bo-updates is being held there for some other reason? I had a phone conversation with Guy Maor. He says he'll make the release next week. He says he has no problem with the version numbering scheme. He was not waiting for me. He says he understands why someone would be impatient with 67 megs sitting there, and says that bo-updates was only a temporary solution and this should not be the usual state of our release engineering. That's good to hear. Some of us vendors actually use Debian in our business operations so we benefit along with our customers. A substantial part of that 67MB is the X change for Richard Stallman. XDM prints Debian GNU/Linux rather than Debian Linux. All of X got rebuilt to keep the release numbers consistent. I have no problem accomodating Richard, but I don't need to rush this change to every last user and make them spend money to get it, do I? As long as it doesn't print 'Microsoft' or 'Slackware', it doesn't bother me a bit. This is the type of change that I normally note on my 'busy list' of things to do before releasing the next needed upgrade. I usually upgrade packages for the bug fixes and new features. Inserting 'GNU/' in a constant is neither. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Swap additions
Actually, if you put use_files=true in your mirror defaults file or the parameter file for the mirror job, mirror will create temporary dbm files instead of building so much in memory. This seems to run faster. If you have trouble with a mirror run, the tmp files don't always get deleted but you can easily delete them yourself. I have tested this on slow machines with 8mb ram and it is definitely faster. On Wed, 13 Aug 1997, David M wrote: Dear friends, I have Debin Linux (1.3.1) and when I installed I setup a 128MB swap partition. Unfortunately, mirror.pl requires heaps of memory when mirroring large ftp sites and as I was initializing time stamps it ran out of memory. I would like to add a swap file so that I can initiate the mirror and set the time stamps and then if I do not require the extra swap and have HDD space shortage I can always remove the swap file. In IRIX the swap command can be used but I am not sure what is the proper way to do it on Debian Linux. Could some of you guys show me a step by step procedure on how to setup an additional 128MB swap file? Or alternatively where I can find this info. Thank you. Dave +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Fresh Debian GNU/Linux CD products + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: SPAM
I would agree in the case of the changes list. There should be no reason that an outsider would post to lists used for development and maintenance of the Debian distribution. The user list needs to be open so people can get help by email using whatever net access they can borrow/steal until they have a running Debian GNU/Linux system. The SPAM did not have a Cc or To header naming a debian listserver. This would be a good reason to reject messages to any list. On Wed, 13 Aug 1997, Oliver Elphick wrote: Today there was a SPAM message on debian-changes. Can the list server not be configured to refuse postings from addresses that aren't subscribed to the list the posting is intended for? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: magicfilter Espon Stylus Color II
I got it to work in color on a friend's redhat system. I forget what it is
supposed to be compatible with (IBM, LQ, or deskjet), but I printed a
webpage in color from netscape with it. I have a IIs that I primarily use
for printing email, but I have a color cartridge for it. If you don't get
it going soon, I will see if I can get this one running here with
magicfilter and let you know what is needed.
On Sat, 9 Aug 1997, Bob Billson wrote:
Has anyone already gotten magicfilter to work with the Espon Stylus Color
II (ink jet) printer? Is is compatiable with one of the other Espon ink
printers? I don't want to write my own configuration file if it has
already been done.
Thanks.
Bob
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Re: signify
If signify is the one that uses a fifo for .signature, I tried that and it worked fine. Doing a cat .signature generated different signatures each time. Pine didn't like it at all. On Fri, 8 Aug 1997, Michael B. Taylor wrote: Does anybody know how to use signify with pine? I've copied one example as my .signify in my $HOME dir., but I'm clueless on how to make it work with pine. Try .signature +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Basic networking setup
I have 2 cards of that type, but what I did was boot dos from floppy and
then run the card setup utility to turn off pnp and set the ioport and irq
values. Then I ran modconf to install the ne module. They work fine that
way. I only use isapnp on devices that don't allow you to explicity set
the values. With win95, I do the same. I would be more comfortable with
pnp if there were only pnp cards installed in a system. Otherwise, you
have to be sure the pnp auto configurator knows what resources are
reserved by other hardware. I have a hand scanner and a speech recognizer
that are not detected by w95 or pnp. The cards are jumpered for DMA and
IRQ selection. A software test would have to know what is needed to
generate these signals in order to figure out which lines are selected.
On Fri, 8 Aug 1997, Dominic Davidson wrote:
I've been trying to set up a *very* simple network with two peers
recently. This is my first exploration into ethernet related issues
under Linux.
Before I get started properly, the FM's I have read are the NAG,
NET-3-HOWTO and the Ethernet-HOWTO.
The cards I am using are two NE2000 clones, manufactured by Trust and
with a RealTek chipset (according to Win95). They are PNP, but isapnp
seems to work, as does modprobe ne. We are connecting via 10Base2 (the
cable has been checked and is fine, and the fact that isapnp and
modprobe don't fail suggests that the cards are OK. The ne2k diagnostic
program finds the card too. The T pieces and terminators were brand new
with the card).
On boot, the cards are assigned addresses by /etc/init.d/network (both
are Debian 1.3 machines). This is what mine looks like, the other
machine has one exactly the same save for the ip address being
192.168.0.2.
#! /bin/sh
ifconfig lo 127.0.0.1
route add -net 127.0.0.0
IPADDR=192.168.0.1
NETMASK=255.255.255.0
NETWORK=192.168.0.0
BROADCAST=192.168.0.255
GATEWAY=
ifconfig eth0 ${IPADDR} netmask ${NETMASK} broadcast ${BROADCAST}
route add -net ${NETWORK}
[ ${GATEWAY} ] route add default gw ${GATEWAY} metric 1
However, pinging 192.168.0.2 gives *no* error messages (such as 'no
route to host), it just fails quietly.
I've tried playing around with arp stuff, routes and many other things,
but still it fails. This list is my last resort before I take the cards
back and resign myself to a net quake free life :).
Thanks in advance,
Dom
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Re: Does Linux use BIOS parameters for disk?
I have had no problems partitioning and installing Linux on 1.2 gig and 3.5 gig drives on old 386 machines. I boot the install floppy and proceed from there. I usually just create a boot floppy. This loads the kernel into memory and IDE access from there is handled w/o the obsolete BIOS. On Thu, 7 Aug 1997, Chris Brown wrote: I have several old 386 machines around that would be nice for different tasks. These machines have older BIOSs in them that can't deal with larger IDE drives. My experience with DOS is that you need to fdisk and format the drive on a machine that properly supports the particular disk but once that is done DOS is happy to ignore the BIOS. Is this the case with Linux? Is it necessary to pass the disk parameters to the kernel at boot time? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: procmail filter and splitting up debian-user
Is this thread introducing even more noise or not? We also need 2 more new lists, debian-argue and debian-flame. Just kidding (I should have sent this to debian-clown). +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Debian-lite
That's why the name Debian-lite makes me sick. It reminds me of those commercial products where you have to pay for a full version of the product. If the name is to be changed at all, it should be 'complete' or 'universal'. I actually prefer to keep the current name unless research shows that 'Debian95' or 'Debian-NT' will sell better. :) On Sat, 2 Aug 1997, Hamish Moffatt wrote: On Fri, Aug 01, 1997 at 05:29:13PM -0700, Travis Cole wrote: On 01-Aug-97 Paul Wade wrote: A single CD that allowed a wide range of installation types should have a powerful name. Debian Complete? Debian Universal Linux? Multiple Personality Debian? :) Take a look at Caldara's naming conventions. Open Linux Base, Open Linux Standard, and Open Linux Deluxe. Why not just Debian? It sounds like you are suggesting that actual different versions should be shipped! With free software, there's no price difference, so no need. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: ? boot from CD?
On Fri, 1 Aug 1997, Paul Tanner wrote: What's the magic incantation? My machine finds the CD, gets to the boot: prompt. Then it reboots (after each of my many guesses). I have sucessfully installed by booting from floppy, but I'm still curious. BTW I have an Intel Zappa board, and my CD is /dev/hdc. There may be something you need to do in your BIOS setup but read on before you get your hopes up. I have seen the same type of behavior on several machines. A proper bootable CD actually provides a standard floppy image for the BIOS to use for bootup. If the machine boots a rescue floppy with the same image then you would think the code on the image is properly written. I can take one of my CD products to various machines and get results that fall into 4 basic categories: 1) Nothing. The hardware/BIOS probably won't boot any CD. This could be a BIOS setup problem or a hardware problem (drive is not really compatible?). 2) LDLINUX line appears and system resets. (infinite loop) 3) LDLINUX line appears and system resets when I press enter. 4) Image boots just like a floppy and zero floppy installation is fine. On systems that exhibited behavior 2 and 3 above I have been able to install using msdos. A msdos floppy with the appropriate msdos cd drivers was booted. I changed to the e: drive, changed to the boot directory and typed bootenter. The kernel loaded and rescue/install menu came up. From there I was able to perform a complete install without additional floppies. I could be wrong, but I think that some of these machines are needing a BIOS upgrade. If installation from floppy or msdos didn't work either, I wouldn't be so suspicious. My experience has been that the same CD boots fine on 1 machine and not on another. Because of this, I am not buying any new motherboards without testing the CD boot capability. If there is a easy solution to this problem, I would love to hear about it. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: splitting up the debian-user mailing list
debian-help is a good name. Some people are offended by newbie or novice labels because those words are often used in conjunction with expletives by rude netizens. Mailing lists are a fine way to go. News postings take too long to propagate and many ISP news servers just don't work right. Some of them spool 19000 groups to a small hard drive so an important answer would only be available for 1 day. There are web packages like wwwboard for html chat. The simple ones usually work with all browsers although you have to hit reload to see the new messages. I'm sure someone (myself included) would be glad to host such a package. If anyone has preferences, let me know. The package should work OK with lynx and be easily modified/configured (that means perl). This would provide a place for general discussions including friendly arguments like 'what is the best mailer to use'. On Fri, 1 Aug 1997, George Bonser wrote: On Fri, 1 Aug 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: I am afraid that we have to get organized about this - have maintainers or power users on duty or something so that we are sure every message gets handled. I could see one additional list at first, something like debian-help for people that have problems with something and the current debian-users for general information exchange. Most might subscribe to the help list and it would fee up the general discussion list for more in-depth discussion of the pros and cons of different ideas. To be honest, I would think that something like debian-help and debian-install might make better newsgroups under linux.* than mailing lists. Folks could read and respond from places other than their subscribed emailing address and articles do no fill a mailbox. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: speed of X
Pete, I mentioned windows because I understand it exhibits both problems. It doesn't use a large swap space and it can slow down with the management overhead. I haven't noticed any difference in speed with Linux when I give it a 128mb swap even if 20 mb is enough. In other words, a system with only 8mb ram runs about the same as long as there is enough swap space with Linux. Windows swapping seems to be oriented around some ratio between physical and virtual memory. On 4 Aug 1997, Pete Templin wrote: On Mon, 4 Aug 1997, Paul Wade wrote: Linux will use a swap partition of up to 128 meg. You can add swap files if you need more. I haven't heard anything about slowdowns. Maybe you're thinking about windows swap usage and performance? Somebody correct me if I'm wrong. I know that Linux (or at least Debian, but this sure seems like a Linux issue) can use multiple swap partitions (I think up to 8, perhaps even 16, being up to almost 128MB each). I had two 120M swap partitions at one time, but removed the second due to IDE performance problems (I had a cron-scheduled process that would heavily access the slave drive while swapping to the master drive, and due to my configuration, this was happening on BOTH IDE controllers at the same time. Yuk!!!). I think you can have up to 16 swap files, and I think swap files can be up to 16MB each, but I'm not sure. I was unable to create a swap file in a IDE-based Multiple Drives (md) RAID-0 array, but YMMV. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: splitting up the debian-user mailing list
Yes, please create debian-help and keep it simple to use. Many of these new users will be using whatever means they have for email access while they try to get Debian running. I have received email that was sent from library workstations and the like for this reason. On 5 Aug 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Christian Lynbech writes: This is only as an option in addition to a set of supertopics, such as HELP, MAIL, X11 and MODEM. They still have to understand that they must put a supertopic in the Subject: line, figure out which one, and get it right. This is too complicated. Most newbies will expect the to work like ordinary email. They'll send off a message with a subject such as how do I get on the net, get it back with an incomprehensible error message, and give up. Please create debian-help, and change the install script to offer every newbie a chance to subscribe. I will subscribe to it and help when I can. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Distributing a procmail filter (was: Re: splitting up the...)
The word 'newbie' just plain sucks, but why not use it anyway? We can even think of ways to 'haze' them until they are considered part of the elite! I use procmail to meet my needs, not because it is required. Some unfortunate user who is trying to install Debian because we told him it was better than slackware doesn't have ppp working. He sends mail to a debian list using his mother's palmtop (windows-CE) or webTV. Obviously he needs help so he can get his personal hardware operational. Why not keep it simple? He sends mail to debian-help and checks his pop3 mailbox to see whether the cavalry will come to his rescue or not. After we get him up and running, he can participate in other discussions and hear about the pros and cons of emacs, which mta to use, the perfect procmail setup, and the like. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: speed of X
Linux will use a swap partition of up to 128 meg. You can add swap files if you need more. I haven't heard anything about slowdowns. Maybe you're thinking about windows swap usage and performance? Somebody correct me if I'm wrong. On Mon, 4 Aug 1997, Paul Miller wrote: I have a 64MB swap disk.. I know hard drives are about 100x slower (at least) .. anyhow I heard something about having at swap disk over 16 megs will slow things down.. and Linux won't even use past 16 megs.. is this true? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Debian-Lite : The Project
Alan is absolutely right. The base install will always include a dpkg/dselect tool. There are certain components of base that are always necessary in order to provide a maintainable and upgradable system. These will always need to be installed and kept available. The current packaging system already allows for changing selections, so the installation procedure could present choices and then set the database accordingly. This could mark packages for removal or installation. This raises the question of whether a package belongs in base or not. If there is to be no serial port usage at all (not uncommon) why is setserial found in binary/base? It would be best if packages in base were only removed when replaced with upgrades or alternatives. Fragmentation of packages could actually be desirable if done right. Sometimes all a user wants is foo-util and has to install foo-tools to get it. For those who upgrade via ftp proper fragmentation could be a big help. Sometimes a large package file is downloaded because a few lines of text have changed. It can be worse with source. The xfree86 source is packed into a 42mb file. Additional control info fields might be a help. When experienced users are building a server, they don't want any docs or examples installed. Network installation of a package would put shared files on one machine but there could be private config or status files which are needed on each local machine. This would allow the package installer to simply verify that the latest binaries are present (even though they are readonly) and then install the local files. This would make it easy to build network workstations. On Sun, 3 Aug 1997, Alan Eugene Davis wrote: Possibly the need for Debian Lite would be lessened with completion of a friendly dselect or replacement for dselect, that would present some reasonable options. My biggest worry is the multiplication of packages. Perhaps it is an inevitable situation with the kind of distribution that Debian is, but I am beginning to be intimidated by the fragmentation of packages into this and that spin-off. Like *-altdev, for example. I still use dpkg, cause I don't seem to jibe with the dselect mentality---I live in fear of completely trashing my system, irrevocably, using dselect, and any other software that makes those kinds of global decisions for me. I'm never sure when I have everything turned off. I also think that it may be useful to incorporate new fields into the info file for each package, indicating more information about relationships to other packages than only conflicts and requires. Alan Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Linus uses Red Hat?
On Thu, 31 Jul 1997, E.L. Meijer (Eric) wrote: George Bonser Why is it that the same people that tell us that manned space flight is a waste of money also tell us that we have been visited by aliens? It all makes perfect sense when you think of it: since they are coming to us already, we don't need to go to them ! If they're already running Debian, we don't need to be spending money on space shuttle missions just to get a decent OS into orbit. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Debian-lite
On Fri, 1 Aug 1997, Tan Wee Yeh wrote: That way, we can forgo the trouble of setting up a nice UI (additional work??) and at the same time can cater for beginners as well. We just have to ensure that the questions are not excessively complicated (like IP-masquarading??) that they will stump the starters and our suggested setup works. Comments?? I have been thinking a lot about this for over a month now. I don't see why you can't have a CD that contains all the packages but allows different setups. X should strictly be a chosen option. I have low-end systems that are very useful as routers, gateways, etc. I can change VGA cards freely because I never run graphic modes. The concept of a highly X-oriented distribution makes me think of the typical NT server. I know of an ISP that will probably fail soon (unless I buy the business). The first thing I noticed is that the primary server (NT) has an expensive video card and a nice 17 inch monitor. This is the typical NT-loving idiot sysadmin. The other partner does all the graphics and web design on a workstation that has much less in the video department. We must remember that the best Linux will be the one that allows you to easily turn leftover computer parts into mail servers, news servers, modem communications routers, and also build graphics workstations. You should be able to take 1 CD, a truckload of hardware and some knowledge, add energy, and create a productive network. Anybody who has navigated the course from the original IBM PC to the Nth-generation stuff we have now is well aware of this. There were many msdos programs with user-friendly interfaces. They worked well with/without a mouse or color display. The biggest problem was often the user. Rather than press F1 for help, he pressed the buttons on his telephone and called people like us. A GUI in the hands of the incompetent computer owner is no solution. If anything, it speeds up the destruction of a good configuration. Point, click, break ... As for the 'Debian Lite' name, it reminds me of crippled versions that you get with a hardware product. Then you are expected to buy a complete version to get the features you actually need. A single CD that allowed a wide range of installation types should have a powerful name. Debian Complete? Debian Universal Linux? Multiple Personality Debian? :) +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Debian-lite
I forgot to mention my new book project. It will be called 'Debian for dummies' and will be about 10 pages long. It will sell for at least $99.00, since people who think of themselves as dummies will pay whatever price I ask. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: What linux needs (off topic)
Is this something that requires a valid username/password to send mail? I am interested in anything like this for mailing and posting control. It wouldn't bother me a bit if the non-linux users had to use local dialup to send mail or news. They can wait for Microsoft to give them a new mail client. On Thu, 31 Jul 1997, George Bonser wrote: Something that linux SORELY needs is a mail client that can use the Xtnd Xmit POP3 command to SEND email via POP3. This should not be very difficult to build and can make life easier for systems that must access another network's mail server for email that denies external access to SMTP sending for anti-spam reasons. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.X + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Will the real Debian 1.3.1 please stand up?
I notice that the bo archive got changed 15JUL1997 with a newer disk set symlinked to current. Shouldn't the version be incremented to 1.3.2 to distinguish it from the previous one? Even if the package set didn't change, any changes in the base install would seem to constitute a new stable release. After all, it's now different from the 1.3.1 of 14JUL1997. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.? + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
MAJOR SPAMMER: Is Your Web Site A Secret?
On Tue, 8 Jul 1997, Matthew C. Thompson wrote: EVERYONE should send these bozos an email telling them how much we DON'T appreciate it and that we'll tell everyone we know not to use or recommend them. Maybe they'll get the message, but probably not. :( Send it to [EMAIL PROTECTED] because this guy spams all over the place. I have gotten his crap at several domains and complaints to him are a waste of time. I ran a traceroute and nya.net is his provider. If enough people complain then HIS web site will be a permanent secret. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Minimal hardware for web server
On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote: On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Paul Wade wrote: I would think that 16mb ram would be a minimum regardless of CPU. 8 Mb should be enough too. I don't know about that. Like I said before apache runs ok on the 8mb machine until I run some cgi/perl script. It was even worse when I had slackware and then redhat on the machine. Even a 486DX2 was sluggish until I went from 8mb to 12mb. I suppose I could eliminate some daemons to free up memory, but that would take away from the joy of running linux. I find that the 386 w/8mb works well as a combination router, firewall, file server, print server, and more. It will run X if you don't mind the startup time. Maybe there are a few tweaks I need to try. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: a question about SAMBA!!!
On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Eliezer Figueroa wrote: I can use SAMBA as an internet router?. I mean, if I have SAMBA installed in a computer with Linux, that computer is connected to internet using a SLIP connection, and I have various computer with windows95 as clients of the computer with Linux and SAMBA connected to the computer with Linux using ethernet cards; those computer with windows95 will be able to access to internet?. How can I get info about doing that?. If someone already has made a connection like this please contact me. Samba provides file and print services to windows clients. I don't know about SLIP, but with PPP you can use Linux as a router/gateway. It will involve compiling a kernel, but will work nicely with win4workgroup and w95 clients. I have converted a few servers from netware and lantastic to linux because they were tired of buying upgrades and add-on programs. The other option is to buy a gateway program for 95. You will probably be expected to buy a license for the number of clients that connect. When you install it, it will do funny things to the 95 file system in the spirit of 'copy protection' (which can be easily cracked by a smart child, anyway). The major drawback is that your gateway machine will be running 95 and will crash or require rebooting often. I tried this once and found it to be bien j___ido. I have run a linux gateway for weeks at a time without a disconnect/redial on the line. The few disconnects were usually caused by severe storms. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.1 + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Minimal hardware for web server
On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Nicolás Lichtmaier wrote: On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Paul Wade wrote: 8 Mb should be enough too. I don't know about that. Like I said before apache runs ok on the 8mb machine until I run some cgi/perl script. It was even worse when I had Well... Maybe it's that I don't use perl.. =) I've always used compiled c programs... You can write some very tiny perl programs, but it takes some time and memory to load and initialize perl. The idea is to quickly get some code that works and then optimize. Well... Maybe I don't use c.. =) I've always used the Intel x86 books and coded directly in binary (hexadecimal is for weak minds). I prefer the simplicity of ones and zeroes. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: a question about SAMBA!!!
On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, George Bonser wrote: 1/ IP Masquerading compiled into the kernel It can get to be quite a pain ITA. If you allow realaudio, etc. people will use more of the limited (modem) bandwidth. 2/ IP Forwarding installed into the kernel and a valid subnet routed through your provider. Here in Maine that can mean $150/month instead of $20/month. It doesn't make sense but that's how they usually price it. 3/ A proxy server(s) setup to allow access for the Win95 machines (Squid is a good place to start looking). Apache will give you proxy and more. I have had good results using apache proxy, samba, and a standard kernel. If people want to do other things, they telnet to the linux server from their windows machine. Some of them actually get to like using pine or elm for email, especially when you educate them about the security issues. If you set up samba properly their E:(or whatever) drive is actually their home directory. Tell them to use it for data and it will be backed up every night. Then they start to get the picture - if they follow the suggested procedure they don't need to worry about people using their workstation. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.1 + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: a question about SAMBA!!!
On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, George Bonser wrote: On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, Paul Wade wrote: 1/ IP Masquerading compiled into the kernel It can get to be quite a pain ITA. If you allow realaudio, etc. people will use more of the limited (modem) bandwidth. You can leave out the realaudio module or deny packets (RealAudio uses UDP but I am unsure of the port, it can also be configured for TCP but with degraded performance). Still a PITA. They're windows users. You have to be sure that they warrant the effort of setting it up. Anybody who is going to use these protocols/ports in a productive manner would be better off with a 'nix or 'nux OS. For the true windows devotees add a 'crash daemon' and they'll feel right at home. How about just a bash script that gives them 'The system must be restarted for changed settings to take effect. The program has performed an illegal operation and will be shut down. Formatting drive C: ...' -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: a question about SAMBA!!!
On Mon, 7 Jul 1997, George Bonser wrote: I don't know, all it took here is changing a couple of options in the kernel config and a recompile. About 5 lines in rc.local (could heve been reduced to three) and a reboot. Not any trouble. Probably easier than setting up Apache as a proxy and the users can query a remote POP3 server for their mail. I will concede that it is easily done. Then they can download every RUNME.EXE file that they are offered and get their system totally screwed up. That's what I mean when I say it's a PITA situation. You try to give them a good firewall (w95 definitely needs one) and they go ahead and do something really dumb. As far as POP3 goes, there is an advantage to using the Linux box for email. If a user has more than one remote email account, he can have fetchmail or popclient pick it all up and put it in his inbox on the Linux server. That way he can retrieve it all using netscape on the windows machine. If he uses netscape 4, he can easily filter the mail into netscape folders. I set this up for a few people who didn't mind the price of Eudora Pro, but preferred to keep everything under netscape. I guess the concept of launching 2 programs was overwhelming. Makes you wonder why we are so critical of the lousy w95 multitasking with so many single-tasking users out there. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Minimal hardware for web server
On Mon, 7 Jul 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I have offered to set up a web server for computer science students
here at Western Kentucky University to practice their cgi and perhaps
java skills on. The machine would never have to support more than
about 5 simultaneous users, and usually would have only one user at a
time. The idea is to have a machine that students can bang on without
endangering vital files on one of our big servers.
I administer a sun sparc with a few hundred users, and I run linux on
my personal machine, but I've never supported multiple users on a
linux box. I'm not sure how much load I can handle with linux for a
given level of hardware. This is a chance to show what debian linux
can do, so I'm excited -- but the hardware I will have will be very
marginal at best. Will a 386 work? I might be able to wheedle
something a little better, but I'm not sure. I know java grinds down
fairly sustantial machines -- would there be any hope of getting java
to run at all on a 386? Maybe we can reduce the web resource
requirements by running boa instead of apache. Are there any other
tricks for marginal hardware I can use that immediately spring to
mind?
I'd hate to fall on my face because of weak hardware and have people
blame linux; it would be better to cancel the whole thing rather than
bomb out.
How low can the hardware go?
If they blame linux, they aren't good CS students. However, they may get
very annoyed with the performance.
Stay with apache so people can develop and test cgi that runs on the 'big
boys'. Memory is the killer. When I run perl5/cgi/apache on a 386 with 8mb
there is a noticable delay while memory swaps. I can view flat html with
large graphics at good speeds. The performance should be better than this
because it is easy to switch to an open edit in telnet, add the missing {
or whatever and save the file. Then you switch back to netscape and click
on reload. If it takes 30 seconds to create another 'server error' page,
they will not blame linux or the hardware. They will blame you.
I would think that 16mb ram would be a minimum regardless of CPU. As far
as Java goes, if the client is weak it becomes annoying. I usually try not
to waste mips and have a lot of tasks running. I really hate it when I get
to a website that has 'cute' applets because they can really slow things
down on a 486 or slower pentium.
If the machine is going to be a server/workstation with X available, you
may want even more ram.
+--+
+ Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation +
+ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ +
+--+
+ http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Now shipping version 1.3.1 +
+--+
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Re: DEBIAN NEWS
On Mon, 30 Jun 1997, Dale Scheetz wrote: On Mon, 30 Jun 1997, Ronald van Loon wrote: In a message to me, Hamish Moffatt, you wrote: |Unfortunately, LSL (and similar companies like CheapBytes) |have outrageous overseas shipping policies, which will see |me pay $4.95 for two discs, making a $5 donation |to SPI, and a $22 donation to whatever courier company |or shipping agent it is they use. I would be happy to pay |$9.95 for the disc and $7 odd for postage, which is what |Walnut Creek/Pacific HiTech charge me on their monthly Linux discs. Shipping to Europe is only $8 - I don't see why Australia should be much different. I ship CDs all over the world, and none have ever cost me more than $5.00, not even Australia! Same here. Outside of US, Canada, and Mexico I charge a $6.00 shipping and handling fee regardless of quantity ordered for first class mail. Some of these 'vendors' are just lazy and greedy. They don't want overseas orders because it involves some reading, mathematics, a customs tag, and an insurance tag. This would mean actually working for a living! I only charge $3.00 shipping and handling to US, Canada, and Mexico. When I have looked for supplies and equipment on the Internet, I found many vendors seem to only want US customers with credit cards. Some of them ship everything by expensive air freight. I opened a UPS daily pickup account thinking that many people would want overnight delivery. It turns out the majority of them prefer to save some money and use the mails. So many that I just ordered a postage meter. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: cd now working
On Thu, 26 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: This means you finally got the CD drive working? Another one, actually. I plugged it into the controller, inserted the module, and mounted with no problem. THe other drive is indeed bad :( Gee, it was all so easy with a working piece :) However, it does strike me as a problem that the bad drive can hang the system. Is this a bug, or acceptable behavior? If the scsi card is well-designed and functioning properly, this is unacceptable behavior for device driver software. A bad peripheral on the scsi side of the card shouldn't lock a system. There is a rare exception where the initial access to a bad component triggers a power supply overload. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Official Debian 1.3 CD-ROM/Release Methodology
On Thu, 26 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: Friends, Is there yet an Official 1.3 CD-ROM available from anywhere? Talk Paul Wade of Greenbush on this list. He very generously donated a pair of 1.3 cds to our project here. The website is lagging. I dropped prices and am busy doing a subscription run. I hope to get the new stuff posted tonight. Email is best until then. the Timestamp is Thu Jun 19 15:57:01 UTC 1997 This means you finally got the CD drive working? Is it bootable? The binary/install CD is bootable on machines that support 'El Torito' specification bootable CD's. My experience with different test machines varied. If I were buying a motherboard or SCSI card today, I would make sure the BIOS really works with bootable CD's. Several with award BIOS booted it from IDE CD drives with no problem. A Dell and 2 Gateway machines went into a reset loop, although I was able to do a 0floppy install using dos/loadlin without problems. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Why is pine so slow?
Colin, I did this and it works fine. I didn't want to change to a smarthost because smail is set up for my needs. Thanks. On Thu, 26 Jun 1997, Colin R. Telmer wrote: It seems that when pine did the last major upstream release, the config file changed (at least in my case, but I could have changed it awhile ago). Anyway edit .pinerc and change sendmail-path (originally blank) to the example that is commented out: # This names the path to an alternative program, and any necessary arguments, # to be used in posting mail messages. Example: #/usr/lib/sendmail -oem -t -oi # or, #/usr/local/bin/sendit.sh # The latter a script found in Pine distribution's contrib/util directory. # NOTE: The program MUST read the message to be posted on standard input, # AND operate in the style of sendmail's -t option. sendmail-path=/usr/lib/sendmail -oem -t -oi This made my pine lightning fast without the possible problems of using the background sending option. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Spam filtering and mailagent
I have a problem in that spammers who got busted are trying for revenge by posting in usenet as [EMAIL PROTECTED], etc. I am getting a lot of junk mail and complaints from people who can't read headers and see the obvious. I have 2 questions: 1) Where can I automatically redirect mail for Jena, Aleisha, etc.? I had thought of redirecting it all to a spamsite autoresponder since it all comes with reply-to addresses that are invalid or autoresponders. Does anyone have a favorite destination address? ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 2) Is there an easy way in pine to change the From and Reply-to headers for a message or two? I want to use [EMAIL PROTECTED] for the few times I post anything. It will help to get even more of these people disconnected when they mail to such an address. On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, George Bonser wrote: On 25 Jun 1997, Manoj Srivastava wrote: Hi, I have mailagent then configured to look at the adresses in that list and send an automated message to the sender asking to be removed from the list (I could just delete the mail, I guess), with a copy to the postmaster. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: 1.2 to 1.3 short cut?
On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, Bob Billson wrote: Another question related to installing Debian on my brother's machine tomorrow. Can we partially install 1.2 and upgrade to 1.3 over the net? By partially install, I mean install all the required and important packages from the 1.2 CD-ROM. Then get networking going. From there do a complete upgrade from 1.2 to 1.3. Anyone foresee any problems with doing this? Or should we do a complete installation of 1.2 before we upgrade? Install the 1.2 base and only the packages you need for networking. You will have fewer questions to answer when installing the packages from 1.3 if they are fresh installs. If you look at the version numbers on that CD and those in 1.3 you will see that not most packages from 1.2 that you install will be replaced by newer versions. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Why is pine so slow?
On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, Shaya Potter wrote: On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, Leandro Asnaghi-Nicastro wrote: I use Debian 1.2/Linux 2.0.29 and the Pine 3.96 package. But, when I send mail with it, it is very slow (it takes about 1 ou 2 minutes to send a message). Could it be that the connection with the mail server is slow? If you are on a dial-up and you are using POP3, depending on the speed of your connection, the mail server will take it's sweet time. I'm not so sure, I am using sendmail on my linux box, and pine is slow with it. I get the same with smail and I'm not using a smarthost. I think it could be an smail or pine config thing, because you would think that smail would accept the mail right away and pine would continue. Makes me think that it makes an initial delivery attempt at the time. I know that when I have mail in the retry spool, pine runs normally. If somebody already knows about this, please post it. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: scsi controllers, bsd file system
On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: a-hah! I've gotten somewhere--but it's not good. Once I connected the three scsi devices, I found that it finds all 3. But . . . The last device in the list does not get a /dev/srX entry. Thus with jus a cd and a zip in the chain, the cd gets one, but not the zip. With both cd's the zip, both cd's but not the zip. with just a cd, nothing gets one. e.g.: scsi0 fdomain: BIOS version 3.4 at 0xc8000 using scsi id 7 scsi0 fdomain: TMC-18C30 chip at 0x140 irq 11 scsi0 : Future Domain TMC-16x0 SCSI driver, version 5.44 scsi : 1 host. Vendor: SONY Model: CD-ROM CDU-8001 Rev: 3.2i Type: CD-ROM ANSI SCSI revision: 01 CCS Detected scsi CD-ROM sr0 at scsi0, channel 0, id 3, lun 0 Vendor: IOMEGAModel: ZIP 100 Rev: D.09 Type: Direct-Access ANSI SCSI revision: 02 and there should be, but isn't, a recognition that the zip is id5 and sr1. Is SCSI termination correct for all tested combinations? The fdomain card should have a jumper (w4 usually) for termination. Is it in or out? If the board is not labeled, I can look up the setting. Are all devices on one cable or do you have both internal and external cables in use? Also, i think the nec drive has a problem. I can mount my kids cds as iso devices in the apple drive (don't know how far i could read, but at least the beginnings), but not on the nec (which hangs). Maybe testing the nec as the only device with proper termination at each end would help. I can't mount these cd's that you've so generously sent, though. I've tried iso9660 and ext2. Are they possibly msdos? (i'm compiling more modules for this at the moment). They are iso9660 and if you mount them on a dos or windows system they should even be readable, but with 8.3 filenames. I have tested a lot of them on my funky 2x soundblaster, which often gets errors on silver CD-ROMs and they play well. If you can pop them into somebody's w95 or dos pc, it will assure that they are readable. It's possible that the kid's CDs appear OK because the directory is small, hence less transfer needed to mount it. What message do you get when you try to mount these CD's? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: [General Q] What is inetd?
On Fri, 27 Jun 1997, Sudhakar Chandrasekharan wrote: What is inetd? Where can I read up more on inetd and its advantages / disadvantages? I am currently running my apache off of /etc/init.d/apache . I was wondering whether there is any adavatage of using inetd to start apache. inetd is the 'internet daemon'. It listens on selected ports and starts services according to its config file(usually /etc/inetd.conf) If you only use apache for local docs(like dwww) and to develop/test web content, the inetd method may be better. I have used it this way before with ncsa httpd. My understanding is that using inetd to start most servers is better on a low memory machine, unless a service is often used or takes too long to start. If you look at your inetd config file you will see which services it starts and can then try them to get an idea of the performance. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: more on scsi controllers
Try making a 1.3 rescue disk and booting it with the fdomain parameters. If you watch the screen (fast) during boot, you should see whether it got the scsi controller OK or not. If that works, then it's just a matter of configuring the kernel and LILO on your system. On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: At the boot: prompt type linux fdomain=0x230,11 If I'm wrong about the 'linux' correct me. I can't reboot right now to verify that. OK, i sort of seem to be there. I compiled the fdomain module (among others). The autoprobe doesn't work: modprobe fdomain=0x140,11 yields no response. insmod fdomain 0x140,11 happily returns. But then mount /dev/scd0 /cdrom/ hung the system. no mouse, no kb, no three-fingered salute, no telnet, no nothin' . . . :( +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: more on scsi controllers
On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: Try making a 1.3 rescue disk and booting it with the fdomain parameters. If you watch the screen (fast) during boot, you should see whether it got the scsi controller OK or not. If that works, then it's just a matter of configuring the kernel and LILO on your system. I can't make the floppy at the moment; it seems not to work. However, I now have an appropriate kernel on the machine. Answering lilo with Linux fdomain=0x140,11 does not result in loading the module. This is for passing the parameters to fdomain that is compiled into the kernel. However, insmod fdomain gives me (roughly; from another screen) scsi0 fdomain: BIOS version 3.4 at 0xc8000 using scsi id 7 scsi0 fdomain: TMC-1830 chip at 0x140 irq 11 scsi0: Future Domain TMC-16x0 SCSI driver, version 5.44 scsi : 1 host Vendor NEC Model: CD-ROM DRIVE:83 Rev: 1.0 Type: CD-ROM ANSI SCSI Revision: 01 Detected CD-ROM sr0 at scsi0, chanel 0, id0, lun0 is /dev/sr0 the correct device, then? It's acceptable to my system. So I tried ./MAKEDEV sr0, which gave me the device. Then bash-2.00# mount /dev/sr0 /cdrom -t iso9660 mount: block device /dev/sr0 is write-protected, mounting read-only This is the expected behavior. which results in the cd making some noise, and the system hang. This is not. a couple of things: should it be /dev/scd0, or /dev/sdc0? it seems to be scd, but the howto referss consistently to sdc. /dev/scd0 is it possible that it simply needs several minute to load? There's another access a couple of minutes later. Seconds but not minutes. This always works for me: mount -t iso9660 /dev/scd0 /cdrom ls -lR /cdrom is a good test When I get CD errors the messages pop up on whatever virtual console I am using. Same for the retries. So if the system hangs, I know why. I think booting from the standard 1.3 kernel will tell us what direction to go in. If it works, it's only a software problem. If not, then maybe a bad CD drive. Make sure to try it with more than 1 CD. I have an old soundblaster 2x that is awfully fussy about the media. I think the rescue disk kernel will allow you to do something like this: Boot: Linux fdomain=0x230,11 root=/dev/hda1 in which case you can login and try mounting the CD. You might have to MAKEDEV scd0 first. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: scsi controllers, bsd file system
On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: grr. Still going :( I am about to connect more pieces here in the chain. Device 0 (i can't figure out how to change the id; the switches seem to do nothing) will be this troublesome NEC intersect drive. Device 3 is an ancient apple cdrom drive--it should be able to read the directory first few megs (if anyone understands how to recalibrate these ancient sony monstrosities with their timing slug, i'd be eternally grateful!). Device 5 is a zip, with my macbsd partitions. Which leads to the magic question: what type is a netbsd (but not their newfs) disk? is it still type 83? a5 (bsd386)? b7 (BSDI fs)? and is anyone out there using a trantor t160? The next step is to use the distribution kernel, but: how do i extract it from resc1440.bin? The file named 'linux' in /bo/disks-i386/current is a kernel. I think it's the same as the one in the rescue disk. It's the same size. You can mount the rescue image on loopback and copy files from it. mount resc1440.bin -r -t msdos -o loop /mnt/floppy1 +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Books on Debian
On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, H.C.Lai wrote: David Wright wrote: Two problem(s) with a book: (a) you're really only buying a few pages of Debian-specific stuff which (b) is almost out-of-date before it's published. I'd far rather have just a good annotated bibliography of all the Debianised documentation. As I think I've said before, one really needs to be able to track down and consult documentation in the order Debian-specific Linux-specific Unix-specific I agree with you entirely on these two points. To people who has installed and used Debian before, not having a book is no big deal. I also agree. Only a few pages of hardcopy are needed. Consider the candidate for a thick 'Complete Debian' type of book: 1) His hardware is too strange to get base and a few things installed. 2) He has no way to browse a CD. 3) He has no way to view web pages. 4) He can't send/receive email and use this list. 5) He can't print anything. He needs hardware, connectivity, or friends more than a book. A complete book would be a convenience to me, but I would rather spend the money on hardware. I have a lot of 'obsolete' hardware that is still productive. I can't say the same for most of the software and books that I purchased. If I had spent the money at a good restaurant, I would at least have some good memories for it. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: nec scsi controller
On Mon, 23 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: hmm: EATA0: address 0x1f0 in use, skipping probe. EATA0: address 0x170 in use, skipping probe. scsi : 0 hosts. scsi : detected total. something is already getting at it. The controller does make some kind of attempt to boot from the cd, at least sometimes--i get a reference when there is no hard disk partition bootable. 1f0 is the standard address for IDE0, 170 for IDE1 If you are not using any IDE drives, maybe you have the interfaces enabled on the motherboard( if they're builtins) or multi I/O card. Try disabling them or changing the nec card to another address. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: radius
I compiled Merit and actually got it to work last year on a non-Debian system. It involved a bit of study and doing things manually. I started at an ISP that had a Cisco 2516 router and tacacs+ on NT. I switched to 2 Linux systems on an isolated (coax) ethernet. I was able to get client and server working together this way. I had to use netwatch on each end just to get the basic communication going. I seem to remember wanting to switch to Livingston for some reason, but the project ended because the 'sysadmin' for the ISP would only work with NT and he was very affordable. He wouldn't configure the Cisco to set up a dialup test port. Unless things have improved a lot, you really need to unpack the source to get an idea of what radius needs/wants. I remember having the dictionary messages. Was it a line in passwd/groups and ownership? I wish I remembered exactly. On Wed, 25 Jun 1997, Adam Shand wrote: Is anyone actually using the debian radius package? It doesn't appear to work in any fashion. It seems like all the binaries are looking for /usr/private/etc/raddb/ as in: Are you using the Merit or Livingstone version? dict_init: Couldn't open dictionary: /usr/private/etc/raddb/dictionary Did I just miss some config parameter? I had a play with the Merit version and completely failed to get it to work. I wrote it off as my inexperience and haven't had a change to play with it properly yet. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Where is libc6 ????????
/hamm/hamm/binary/base I hope the 'new' menu package came from hamm if it requires libc6. On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Eddie Katz wrote: Hi, I am trying to find the LIBC6 package but with no luck. The new menu package r equires it and I cannot find it anywhere. Thanks == Eddie Katz == [EMAIL PROTECTED] +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: radius
On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Tim Sailer wrote: Well, I've made a bit more progress. The whole problem was that merit radiusd has been compiled without shadow support. Doing 'shadowconfig off' now allows radpwchk to authenticate properly. So.. has anyone played with the merit version and shadow? If you compile on a system with the proper include files in place for shadow will that take care of it? The Livingston 2.0 FAQ says this is necessary because of different Linux shadow methods. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: radius
I've got 2 'boxed' systems to develop. One for multiple balanced modems because the frame relay costs are ugly in Maine. The other for wireless microwave links. Both are intended to provide Internet to win/mac/schmuckware workstations. I am planning to use bootable CD's on these. A motherboard with builtin IDE and enough RAM to eliminate swapping should be affordable. The way to develop these is to use an IDE drive with a boot floppy. The filesystem normally stays read-only except for making configuration changes. When it's ready, move it to a CD-R with the boot floppy image added. I can always put in a flash card for non-volatile storage. The overall idea is to make it cheap, reliable, and low power so it will run a while on a UPS. Modular has a nice sound, too. This may seem like an imitation of Cisco et. al., but a spare ethernet interface for a Cisco router probably costs more than $18.00 (NE2000). I think that developing along these lines provides more flexibility in the long run. Ftp, http, etc. usage patterns change and you don't want to tear the router/gateway apart because the webmaster demands an upgrade. On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Tim Sailer wrote: In your email to me, Dave Cinege, you wrote: On Tue, 24 Jun 1997 11:23:14 -0400 (EDT), Tim Sailer wrote: I haven't played with the source yet. I was hoping not to. I'm trying to put together an 'instant ISP' type system, complete with a linux based term server. I use the SDL WAN cards, with the builtin csu, so I'm also building a 'pop-in-a-box' solution. Get your phone lines, your leased line, plug this all in and turn it on. This is what we will be working on Linux Router Project www.psychosis.com/linux-router/ I'm doing a little more that that on the remote end. With a 1 gig drive and 64mb ram, you can have DNS, and a web cache running on the box too. Using everything you can to reduce the traffic, you can get a lot of modems on a 56k line. Combining your data and terminal server is bad practice and a bad idea. True.. thats not what I'm doing though. Like I said, it's a pop.. everything goes back to the main network. If you also intend to do all routing from the box you are crazy. router/terminal server, ok but web/ftp/etc should be in a separate box. Right. But forwardonly DNS and a web *cache* (within limits of the cpu and memory) can run happily on the same box. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: more on scsi controllers
Looking at the kernel source, I would say try for the future domain first. It should be supported by a standard Debian kernel as a built-in (not modular) driver. Maybe if you're lucky it will autoprobe. On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Nathan E Norman wrote: On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: : :After the hints so far, it's clear that eata 's error messages have to :do with using the same adresses as the second ide card (which is :installed). However, those aren't the correct adressess. : :I actually have three scsi cards sitting here to choose from: : :1) the nec card, which, on closer look, claims to be a Trantor T160. I :find T1x8 refferences in the howto, but no T160. : :2) a future domaine 1610, with TMX18XX chip (it really says XX). Don't know about either of these :/ :3) an adaptec 1510, but it has a tiny external connector; we're still :trying to find the cable. I *do* know about these. Throw it very, very far. Adaptec makes great (IMHO) controolers these days, but this one sucks (as you can tell from the DB25 external connecter, I believe it is) I'd try 1) or 2) :) Somebody out there has to be using these things ... +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: more on scsi controllers
The first step is to see a host adaptor. dir /proc/scsi cat /proc/scsi/aha152x (in my case) give ioport, irq, and a whole bunch of cool techie words. If nothing is there, then we need to help it along a bit. The LILO argument is: fdomain=PORT_BASE,IRQ[,ADAPTER_ID] Does the card have jumpers? Somebody on this list might have docs. In the meantime I am looking for a spec on the www. On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: Looking at the kernel source, I would say try for the future domain first. It should be supported by a standard Debian kernel as a built-in (not modular) driver. Maybe if you're lucky it will autoprobe. no such luck :( bash-2.00# mount /dev/scd0 /cdrom/ -t iso9660 mount: the kernel does not recognize /dev/scd0 as a block device (maybe `insmod driver'?) bash-2.00# -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: more on scsi controllers
Use a standard kernel, like the rescue disk. At the boot: prompt type linux fdomain=0x230,11 If I'm wrong about the 'linux' correct me. I can't reboot right now to verify that. On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Rick Hawkins wrote: dir /proc/scsi cat /proc/scsi/aha152x (in my case) give ioport, irq, and a whole bunch of cool techie words. bash-2.00# dir /proc/scsi/ scsi bash-2.00# cat /proc/scsi/scsi Attached devices: none bash-2.00# dir /proc/scsi/ scsi bash-2.00# cat /proc/scsi/scsi Attached devices: none bash-2.00# If nothing is there, then we need to help it along a bit. The LILO argument is: fdomain=PORT_BASE,IRQ[,ADAPTER_ID] but what do i use for fdomain? or is fdomain literal? Does the card have jumpers? Somebody on this list might have docs. In the meantime I am looking for a spec on the www. I have port bases irq's; they're actually labeled by the jumpers (0x230,11) rick -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: /etc/securetty problem
Sean, Try following the instructions, like spelling 'unsubscribe' correctly and sending it to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I'm sure you and everybody on the list will be pleased with the results. Have a nice day. On Sat, 21 Jun 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: unsubsribe. take me off all these lists. please, fuckas? thanks. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Dear Mr. Sean.Seaman
The copy of my previous message to you bounced because your From: address is invalid. If you want to send an unsubscribe message you need to have the right address set up in your 'Pegasus for Windows' mailer. I have tried to make a good guess as to what address to send this to as you can see from the To: header. If you can't figure it out maybe we should forward copies of your correspondence to someone at rutgers.edu who has a better solution to this problem. Please have a wonderful day. On Sat, 21 Jun 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Sat, 21 Jun 1997 21:00:38 + From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: debian-user@lists.debian.org debian-user@lists.debian.org, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: /etc/securetty problem Resent-Date: 22 Jun 1997 02:17:26 - Resent-From: debian-user@lists.debian.org Resent-cc: recipient list not shown: ; I've done that a hundred times you fuck. It doesn't work I'm still on the damned list. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: NIS in Debian 1.3 broken?
On Fri, 20 Jun 1997, Scott Barker wrote: I upgraded a box from 1.2 to 1.3, and now my NIS doesn't work. A yppasswd reports the user as unknown, and a ypwhich results in a segfault. A ypcat reports that there is no server bound to the NIS domain. The yp server is a debian box still running 1.2. I tried upgrading a separate debian box piece by piece, and found that upgrading libc5 seems to be the culprit. Both the libc5 in 1.3, and the libc5 in bo-updates don't work. At another installation, I upgraded to 1.3 without a hitch. The yp server in that setup is a DEC machine running OSF/1 V3.2 Has anyone else noticed this problem? Is it somehow related to the old NIS server in debian 1.2? Is there a fix yet? A problem I had while testing 1.3 pre-release may be related. I have some nfs mounts as no_root_squash for mirroring and other purposes. I couldn't access them properly from the test machine with shadow passwords enabled. When I have time, I'm going to put a test partition on each machine and see what happens when all use shadow, when all don't, and when only some do. I guess shadowconfig on and shadowconfig off are supposed to let you bounce back and forth. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: How do I find the source of the spammers?
The problem of relaying can be solved by restricting access to the local subnet. However, that would irritate some good customers. Suppose I am traveling with my laptop and want to read and answer my email. I don't want to pay for a toll call to the dialup because I can hook up via ethernet or my brother says 'go ahead and use my local dialup account'. There is a way to fix this for the ISP who thinks it's worth the trouble. You could set up a web page that requires a password or have them login via telnet. This would validate the IP the customer is at and you could allow in.smtp because you know who to 'counsel' if you get a spam complaint. I suppose that you could require the telnet connect to stay active in order to accept mail for relaying. They would have to switch to the telnet and hit a key within n(60?) seconds before sending or the connect to smtp would be refused. Hopping between open telnet and mailer programs is easy for Windows or Linux users. The apache approach has several possibilities. Maybe a javascript (ugh) would be sufficient to tell the server you are still valid from the IP. If somebody does this, they should share it freely. Most of the spam comes from 'borrowed' mail servers. On Fri, 20 Jun 1997, John Foster wrote: Hi, This post is probably a bit off topic, but maybe one of you can give me a pointer in the right direction. I'm looking after the servers of an ISP, and someone is using us for bulk mailouts. I get a lot of mail in postmasters mailbox about it. I can't seem to find how it's getting in though! Here's a chunk from my logs: logfile.3.gz:06/17/1997 06:42:38: [m0wdNiA-000AM5C] Failed TO:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ERROR:(ERR101) unknown host logfile.3.gz:06/17/1997 07:03:12: [m0wdNiA-000AM5C] Failed TO:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ERROR:(ERR101) unknown host logfile.3.gz:06/17/1997 07:03:13: [m0wdNiA-000AM5C] Failed TO:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ERROR:(ERR101) unknown host logfile.3.gz:06/17/1997 07:03:13: [m0wdNiA-000AM5C] Failed TO:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ERROR:(ERR101) unknown host logfile.3.gz:06/17/1997 07:03:13: [m0wdNiA-000AM5C] Failed TO:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ERROR:(ERR101) unknown host logfile.4.gz:06/16/1997 08:23:55: [m0wdNiA-000AM5C] Received FROM:[EMAIL PROTECTED] HOST:203.20.112.1 [199.174.230.27] PROTOCOL:smtp PROGRAM:in.smtpd ORIG-ID:[EMAIL PROTECTED] SIZE:6337 The last entry is the first reference to this piece of mail in my logs! Is it possible for someone to use their compuserve account to send mail to my daemon that instructs it to run the bulk mailout? the host 203.20.112.1 is one of my servers. If so, how do I stop it? More importantly, how can I find if it's one of the 800 clients who has an account on this server, so I can close their account and send them elsewhere? And then how do I prevent it happening again? I guess that if there's a clueful person who knows the answer to this one then they'll probably want to email me personally, so that the solution is not advertised to the spammers. Then again I guess we'd all like to know how to do this. I'm using smail from the 1.3 distribution. Perhaps I should be using another mail-daeomn. Or is there a way that I can restrict things in smail? The documentation for smail is (or was anyway) pretty woeful! This is rather urgent as I see it! John Foster System Administrator (in training!?) Net-Trek/Cynergy -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: What would you do?
On Thu, 19 Jun 1997, Jim Michael wrote: Before I start loading a lot of packages on my new system I would like to describe my setup and see what my options are WRT internetworking my local network: 1 486-66 Linux box (Debian 1.2) 1 P133 Win95 box In addition to the other suggestions put samba on the Linux box. What I did was give 95 a different IP and machine name than Linux on the same box. This is helpful because when I boot the same machine into Linux, it has nfs exports that wouldn't be there under 95. Using samba, I started migrating files to the Linux box. I got to the point where all I needed for 95 is an old 233mb Maxtor. The primary reason I have any 95 capability at all is that I get free software for shipping, ordering, banking, etc. from vendors. One of them was offering free ground freight on electronic orders, so I would boot 95 and run the software which dials a toll-free number and order product. One of these days we'll have a windows emulator that works with these programs and just run them as a Linux task. See my LDP mirror at http://www.wtop.com/LDP for latest howto's, including samba. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: eth0: Too much work !!!!!!!!???????
On Fri, 20 Jun 1997, Eddie Katz wrote: I am getting in regular intervals on the tty console the message: eth0: Too much work on interrupt, 0x01 What is that ?? My network is working fine, no problems, maybe it comes out becaude my ethernet wd driver is set as module ??? Any ideas ?? 1) Could be the interrupt controller hardware. Try using another IRQ. 2) Could be from something on the network. Does it still happen if you are disconnected from the net? 3) Sometimes other devices, especially older ones have flaws which cause them to step on I/O addresses, DMA lines, and IRQ lines that they're really not using. Some of the jumperless ones do this. I have gone as far as taking a knife to them and permanently removing the connection to unused IRQ lines. 4) Make sure your network broadcast, mask, etc. values are correct. ifconfig will tell you this. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
OK. Here is a good summary of how to fight spam. I have several messages informing me that abuser accounts were suspended or terminated. Only one apologized. Others have foolishly tried revenge. I'll put my email address anywhere I want. I won't cede my rights or territory to the spammers. Look at my method. If enough people would use it, the spammers would leave the internet and go back to telemarketing. On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Christian Hudon wrote: On Jun 18, Bruce Perens wrote It looks as if someone is trolling the Debian mailing lists and spamming their subscribers. The spammer may be getting them via the news gateway. Hmm. But wasn't the news gateway taken down a few monts ago? All I have to do is subscribe to a bunch of lists with a name like [EMAIL PROTECTED] and use fetchmail/procmail to put them in one folder so I don't have to read them at all. Then run them through a simple perl script to add newly found addresses to a database and delete the messages when done. There are so many lists available that it could keep a machine very busy. Many list archives are also available via ftp. Someone could pick up addresses more efficiently by downloading an entire month of traffic in a gunzipped file. To fight spam, visit http://www.abuse.net and start using their system. It helps build their database of addresses to complain to. For domains which are actually spam providers or unresponsive/unreachable, they 'climb the traceroute ladder'. I have gotten acknowledgement from mci.net when I actually complained about another domain because of this strategy. They also have some sample scripts for decoding headers and such. When I get spam, I save it to folder spam.new in pine. I usually get up very early and while I drink my first cup of coffee, I go through this folder. I use another virtual console to traceroute and then file the complaints. I always complain to the access and mailserver providers. If mail servers are open to relaying, they should keep logs so that they can verify that a message was accepted from an IP(i.e. modem) and delivered to another system. Any network that delivers unwanted mail to me has an obligation to investigate and notify the dialup ISP that their customer is spamming and trying to hide behind another network's mail server. Any network that provides dedicated or dialup access has an obligation to maintain logs that will show which account used the IP at a particular time. These logs should be kept for enough time to investigate complaints (a month would be fine). Reporting is easy in pine: Make sure full headers is on and the pine option to include them in replies. Reply change the To: header to something like: ([EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED]) Read in a standard complaint file at the top of the body. Send it. This works. Tip - Whenever you get porno spam change the complaint to: 'This unsolicited email was received by several accounts in my domains, including minor schoolchildren.' The ISP's seem to be sensitive to this wording. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Long time to login prompt: telnet and ftp
On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Jim Michael wrote: I have a Win95 box networked to my Linux (Debian 1.2) box. The latter was booted while an ftp and telnet session were active (back when I had to rm my XF86Config file to kill the flashing screen). Now, when I telnet or ftp to the Linux box from the Win95 box, I get a connection but there are several minutes before I get a login prompt. w shows a load ca .3. Any idea what might cause this and possible cure. I have rebooted both machines. The fact that you eventually get a login prompt is a good start. I had about the same delay on my first linux box with all services telnet, ftp, http from a win box. It turned out that I had the IP of the linux box as it's gateway also. I set gateway to none, rebooted and it worked fine. Use ifconfig to see the current values and change them. Other notes on win TCP/IP - You don't need a hosts file on the win box for testing - just use the IP address. You don't need an entry in /etc/hosts on the linux box for the win box IP unless you get a connection refused message. This can be caused by services which use 'get host by name'. If you get this, check in /var/log (I forget which file) to get the machine name the win box is reporting itself as and fix /etc/hosts to reflect this. I remember that uncommenting only one of these 2 lines in /etc/hosts will fix the connection refused message if you get it. #192.168.1.2 w95sux.my.net #192.168.1.2 w95sux +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
Seems like the incoming spam has picked up, although I haven't been on usenet for weeks. Makes me wonder if we have a spammer subscribed to the lists just to collect email addresses. Anybody else with the same problem? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Leandro Asnaghi-Nicastro wrote: Seems like the incoming spam has picked up, although I haven't been on usenet for weeks. Makes me wonder if we have a spammer subscribed to the lists just to collect email addresses. Anybody else with the same problem? I've been spammed like crazy after going on Usenet on an unprotected account. By that I mean, that I had my e-mail address in the From: and Reply-to: fields. To go around this you can put a blank space (leandro @ifront.com for example). I don't like to do that. It makes it inconvenient for people to reply. Besides, name mangling (paulwadeATgreenbushDOTcom) is a form of surrender to the abusers. I use traceroute and then abuse.net to file complaints. Perhaps we could have that the mail program checks the domain from where the mail is coming from, and if the domain is invalid it rejects the mail. That gets complicated because many people are at the mercy of a technically challenged ISP. It would be great if everyone could get a static IP with DNS. Besides, anybody can subscribe to the list and never post a thing. Then they just extract addresses from the messages that pass through. A list server that requires a password somewhere in the message and removes it before remailing would be nice. Another spam generator is people using my domain names in false addresses on usenet. I would need a program that scans 19000 newsgroups for domain names in order to catch these people. They usually do this in the porno groups and the email volume is high as a result. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
On Thu, 19 Jun 1997, John Foster wrote: That gets complicated because many people are at the mercy of a technically challenged ISP. It would be great if everyone could get a static IP with DNS. OK, so I'm technically challenged! How do I put 1200 clients in 2 C class networks with static IPs? That doesn't make you dumb, but it is a handicap because the national providers don't want to give the numbers to the local ISP. I have configured Linux boxes with multiport cards to assign the IP when the user is logged in. The ISP that I did it for still had a problem with his original lines (Cisco router and NT Tacacs authentication). Goes to show that Linux systems are better than those ready-made boxes. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Sudhakar Chandrasekharan wrote: Talking of spam - Have you folks ever wondered how they never want to sell anything that is worth buying? All the spam that I have got seem to belong to one of the following categories - * Make money fast (rehash of the old pyramid scheme) * Advertise your site in a gazillion search engine for pennies * Scantily clad persons are waiting for me to visit their pages. * 10,000 fresh email addresses are available for 19.95 (this should be the spam equivalent of recursion ;-) Dear debian users, I am looking for a way to make money fast while advertising my website in all the search engines. Hopefully, scantily clad persons are waiting to sell me thousands of email addresses. Serious replies only. Please, no spam. Seriously, I think they are fishing in the wrong place for idiots. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Dale Scheetz wrote: On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Paul Wade wrote: Seriously, I think they are fishing in the wrong place for idiots. The snagg rate can be very low and still be very profitable when the cost of doing business is being paid by others. Doesn't matter how small that percentage is, given enough spam the return is sufficient to appear profitable. The easiest victims are those who partied hard the day before and aren't thinking clearly. Hope you had a happy birthday, Dale! +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
On 18 Jun 1997, Emilio Lopes wrote: PW == Paul Wade [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: PW A list server that requires a password somewhere in the message PW and removes it before remailing would be nice. Maybe a just header. Each reader of this list had to setup it just once in their mailreaders and forget it. That's easy for pine, but some of those who need help aren't running Debian yet. They could be using Netscape, Eudora, or whatever with another OS to do mail. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: The technically challenged WAS Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
On Thu, 19 Jun 1997, John Foster wrote: Ah so this is a new maening of technically challenged that I've never met before! When I originally used the term, I was referring to the ISP's who don't have DNS info for their IP's at all. If they could at least make sure that reverse lookup returns something like 'modem99.spamfactory.net' it would help. They should also let their accounts know that logs are kept and all posts and messages are traceable to the account. The people who hide behind anonymous remailers and such can be dealt with if most ISP's block all messages and traffic from those IP numbers. I do think that 'technically challenged' is appropriate for some ISP's here in Maine, USA. They don't know how to setup a nameserver or block traffic. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: How to deliver mail over the modem
On Wed, 18 Jun 1997, Johannes Martinez wrote: I'll try this again, i have as yet been unable to post to this list. I have smail delivering local mail, i have fetchmail getting mail from my pop account. How do i get outgoing mail to be delivered when i dial up? what is the best program to use? Do i have to change anything in pines config? runq (part of smail) might do it. If pine is giving the mail to smail, then configure smail to forward it to the smtp server provided by your dialup. smailconfig calls it a smarthost. As well what works best to sort mail? Is there also something that will rip stuff off the subject line? I subscribe to a list that has [header:10293] attached to every message so that messages don't get threaded. I use procmail to put the mail directly into pine folders. A lot of people use it, so it's easier to get help. Any info about the best newsfeed program for a slow link? Someone else can answer this one. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists?
The end of Debian. We all get rich stuffing envelopes at home and don't care about the project anymore. Do you think this is a Microsoft plot? On Wed, 18 Jun 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Wed, 18 Jun 1997 22:48:00 +0200 (CEST) From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: debian-user@lists.debian.org Subject: Re: Are spammers subscibing to the lists? Resent-Date: 18 Jun 1997 22:54:22 - Resent-From: debian-user@lists.debian.org Resent-cc: recipient list not shown: ; On 18 Jun, Paul Wade wrote: Seems like the incoming spam has picked up, although I haven't been on usenet for weeks. Makes me wonder if we have a spammer subscribed to the lists just to collect email addresses. Anybody else with the same problem? I didn't have time to install a anti-spam filter yet, so look at this spam (some headers). Quite a few recipients look quite familiar. 3* Joey, Heiko and [EMAIL PROTECTED] for example. The Message-Id Header also looks strange to me. Well lets see what [EMAIL PROTECTED] thinks about this. Ciao, Martin Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED],[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-Id: Mach10 1.1 fxpromo.com -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Is there a Debian 1.3 Unleashed available?
Re: Book I don't think there is enough demand to warrant publishing a Debian book on paper yet. If such a document existed on other media, I (and quite a few others) wouldn't mind using some supplies to print out, punch, and bind a copy. I prefer documentation that can be updated by easily replacing pages in a binder. Paperbacks are OK for Windows 95 because it doesn't get the (needed) changes very often. I think the book project people should make sure that everything can be easily printed on paper that will be punched and include the necessary programs/scripts to print it. You should be able to easily print pages or sections and toc/index as needed. The Debian organization should sell really cool looking binders to raise money. I want the first one for suggesting it. I also want a Debian mug to drink coffee from while I read from my official Debian binder. Re: stupid non-free restrictions Is there anything in non-free that can't be given away? If you buy a CD-R from me, I can put the non-free software on it. Why? Because I will put it on a CD-R that you don't buy from me at no charge. The CD-ROM vendors can't do that with their media. Of course, I expect a postpaid, preaddressed mailer with the blank CD-R, but I don't charge for labor, electricity and machine usage. If there is anything in non-free that can't be copied onto media at no charge, then it probably should be in a new directory called do_not_mirror at the ftp site. BTW - If I ever make enough money, I will press a bunch of CD-ROM's full of stuff with these 'you can't even make $1/hour' restrictions and just give them out. On Mon, 16 Jun 1997, Erv Walter wrote: Let me clairfy. non-free contains packages that have some sort of restriction either on use or on distribution or on modification. Not all of the packages in non-free can be put on the Official CD although some of them can. debian-cd leaves out non-free completely from the Official CD because it (aparently) was easier than manualloy deciding which packages to include and which packages not to include. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Is there a Debian 1.3 Unleashed available?
On Mon, 16 Jun 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: From: Paul Wade [EMAIL PROTECTED] Re: stupid non-free restrictions Is there anything in non-free that can't be given away? I'd suggest you read the licenses in there really carefully. We don't make any guarantees about the way we have interpreted the software licenses, _even_for_programs_in_the_main_distribution_. Someone could pop up after you burn 1000 CDs and say that a certain package is non-free. I understand that you can't make guarantees and put SPI in a position of potential liability. Is there anything excluded from bo or contrib on the Official Debian CD? Someone could pop up and claim that UNC, MIT, Georgia Tech, Debian, and Greenbush owe royalties plus damages for each copy we have given away. I try to read everything I can about the contents. I even have read about installing on machines I don't have (alpha, etc.) in case someone asks about them. Is everything in main and contrib under GPL? I hope so, because I use a lot of it for my (commercial) operations. I have included an advisory on the CD to check usage and redistribution restrictions on anything from non-free. I have avoided using some packages in my own business. The license said it was basically free for personal use, but didn't give any prices, email address, or website for commercial use. I decided it was easier to use an alternative package than to write and mail a letter. I suppose I could include commercial demos, but I think people would rather have the disk filled out with stuff from hamm and 2.1.x kernel source. Although I provide a free LDP mirror at wtop.com, I haven't included it on CD because I am not sure if I can. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Is there a Debian 1.3 Unleashed available?
( I took out all the extra cc's on this thread. You're welcome. ) On Mon, 16 Jun 1997, Dale Scheetz wrote: Be very careful here. You have made the common blunder when thinking about non-free. It has absolutely nothing to do with money! The fact that you are not intending to sell the CD does not mean that you are not liable for infringing a copyright. The reason these packages are in this directory is because they have distribution restrictions. These restrictions may include media restrictions, distribution with other types of software restrictions, etc... In fact the most dangerous packages in non-free are the ones without any copyright notice at all. Under copyright law these packages are assumed to have THE most restrictive copyright possible, and unless you have the expressed permission of the author you may be open to suit for copyright infringement if you include them on your cost free CD. I will look again. I can't seem to find the ones that are OK to put up for anonymous ftp at multiple mirrors, but can't be placed on other media for free. Some of the mirror sites are commercial organizations, so any license that is restricted to educational and non-profit organizations is violated by that. If you read the Netscape license, you will see that all you have to do is start a 'religious organization' and you can provide it to your 'members'. I think that rather than start a phony church or school, it is better to try to follow the intentions of the author. I am willing to actually lose money because some people were very concerned that Infomagic, Walnut Creek CD-ROM and others would get rich from the work of the poor. They have a valid point, especially when it comes to CD-ROM's included with magazines and books. Many of the publications are a total waste of paper. The 'free' software makes it sell and the authors want a small royalty for that. I suppose that if there really was a big problem here, there wouldn't be any complete mirrors of ftp.debian.org because you would need a lawyer to configure your mirror software. If that's the case, it would be better to delete anything from non-free that can't be freely mirrored now. Nobody wants to provide a mirror with such complications and nobody wants to use a partial mirror for upgrades/installs. Try advising mirror sites to check all the copyrights before mirroring and debian.org will need a T-3 because there won't be anymore mirrors. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Is there a Debian 1.3 Unleashed available?
On Mon, 16 Jun 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: Is there anything excluded from bo or contrib on the Official Debian CD? No. I hope so, because I use a lot of it for my (commercial) operations. We intend them to be OK for this. Good. That means things haven't changed since I first viewed the readme files and switched to Debian. I (and probably many of us) have likely used restricted software unwittingly in our work and thus violated the terms and conditions of usage. I noticed early on that whenever someone thought a Debian package should be moved to/from non-free it was discussed in this list. Another reason Debian is the best Linux. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the free SCO limited to personal use? I check the restrictions on anything in non-free before I use it. I don't want my equipment confiscated - something that could really happen to the business that runs on unlicensed software. Although I provide a free LDP mirror at wtop.com, I haven't included it on CD because I am not sure if I can. I don't know the LDP's licensing policy, but I think the HOWTOS and stuff are in a Debian package. They are. If they aren't in the dwww menu, they should be. I really mentioned LDP as an example. I mirror it because the maintainer made it clear I may do so and provided a username/password for the master ftp site. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: trilinux
In order to sell a really cheap Debian CD-ROM set, I need to sell a lot of them fast or Debian needs to stop improving so fast. This is because I need to run at least 1000 sets, it will be a week or more before I get them from the CD presser, and after a few weeks more the remaining copies are good for coasters or frisbees. For now I prefer to put it on CD-R's and keep it up to date. I tried Slackware. I tried Red Hat. I tried Debian and stayed with it. I made a new 1.3 CD today and tested it on a few machines. One of them supported bootable CD's and the install worked flawlessly. As far as cheap CD's go, I have a collection of them and they do leave things off. Some of the vendors have no real interest in Linux, so what do you expect? On Mon, 9 Jun 1997, Daniel J. Mashao wrote: On Fri, 6 Jun 1997, E.L. Meijer (Eric) wrote: I have a question about this tri-linux CD: How on earth do you fit three distributions on one CD? The official debian CD release will now be 2 CD's. Does leaving out the source distribution really makes such a difference? They leave out a lot of stuff. At least that is my experience with a Cheap*Bytes disc. I wish some one would sell the Debian Official 2-CD for less than $5.00. I don't like doing too many ftp's. After all they only need to copy it. ~~~ D.J. Mashao, [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: [META] Use of the list for non-Debian matters
On Tue, 10 Jun 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: Our menu package already adds menus to _many_ different window managers, and to character-oriented shells as well. Our dwww package need only register a menu entry Help with Linux, and it would appear. The biggest missing piece right now is that menu and dwww are not installed by default, and there should be an easy check box that gets the beginner a GUI-enabled system with them installed. Bruce, I agree except that a GUI should be 'icing on the cake' and not a default. What's nice about the dwww approach is that a local apache installs easily and so does lynx. I did a 1.3 install yesterday and didn't have a clue as to the mouse type and video card that would finally be in the system. The apache/dwww/lynx combo doesn't need X. We should really encourage the installation and use of these because the later transition from lynx to an X-based browser is easy on the user. Whereever it is safe to do so, this could be expanded on. A good example is the CGI/perl scripts for common commands like 'who'. Why not start a collection of these so the user can get some system information using the same interface? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: web documentation
On Tue, 10 Jun 1997, Bruce Perens wrote: From: Paul Wade [EMAIL PROTECTED] The apache/dwww/lynx combo doesn't need X. Try using boa instead of apache. It's _much_ smaller, and faster than apache. However, lynx itself can execute CGI scripts, and doesn't really need a server to run dwww. I'll give boa a try. Will it mess up anything on a system that has apache installed? I will also investigate the use of lynx directly with CGI. I hope that you are hinting at something I need: If I run lynx as root and execute an 'adduser' CGI script that cannot be executed by others, then I will start writing a whole buncha sysadmin CGI. Whereever it is safe to do so, this could be expanded on. A good example is the CGI/perl scripts for common commands like 'who'. Why not start a collection of these so the user can get some system information using the same interface? Sure. Want to work on that? Since I did a lot of work which was rendered obsolete by the features of dwww, it would be a good idea to apply my experience to something like this. We could call it 'cute CGI/perl tricks' or we could fit it into the dwww scheme :-) I will start gathering them up. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Two problems after upgrade to Debian 1.3
I don't have to check the headers to see that you're using Netscape 4 because I'm using Pine and HTML email doesn't look good here. There is something in the 'preferences' to disable it. I seem to remember that it defaults to HTML allowed when first installed. If they are serious about the new 'communicator' name, they should default to plain text composition so it would communicate with elm, pine, etc. To answer part of your question: Netscape does crash now and then, especially beta versions. I notice that some of the crashes occur when I go to a site that has lots of Java. Other crashes occur because Netscape just feels like crashing at random. I wouldn't judge irqtune on the basis of Netscape behaviour. On Mon, 2 Jun 1997, Curtis L. Daugaard wrote: HTML Can someone enlighten me on two problems?nbsp; I can'tnbsp; seem to solve them with the available documentation P1) Irqtune was working for me under v.1.2, but though my configured hardware is the same I now get an error message.nbsp; Here is the message at boot time: Pnbsp; irqtune: setting system IRQ priority to 3/14 BRnbsp;nbsp; irqtune: insmod failed on '/usr/lib/hwtools/irqtune_mod.o'nbsp; PShould I ignore the second message and assume the priority has been set?nbsp; (Netscape does crash now and then.) P2) On boot up when syslogd starts it hangs for about 8 to 10 seconds.nbsp; Not a problem I guess, but it didn'tused to do it. PMy thanks to anyone who can help. PCurt PC.L. Daugaard BR[EMAIL PROTECTED] BR___ BR UL BR/UL /HTML -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Networking Win95, Debian Linux and Cable Modem
1) If you don't have the IP masquerading howto, I mirror the Linux Documentation Project at http://www.wtop.com/LDP/ 2) I use the following setup to get around the above: a) I run apache on the Linux box that is connected to the Internet with cached proxy service enabled. This allows the other machines to be booted to Linux or win and access web documents with a common cache. Netscape seems to run better with a local cache, but now I can delete it at will since the reload is at ethernet(not internet) speed. This even works with secure(https) documents. b) For other services, I telnet to the connected box and run from there. If you need to get files for dos/win, run samba on the linux box and put the files into the 'shared' directory. If you do this with a local login, you can be transferring files to/from your 'X:' drive even while that crappy Microsoft OS is crashing and rebooting. I have set up a few commercial networks this way. The users typically run 95 workstations and it allows me to telnet into the Linux server from my home and install files without bothering them. On Sun, 1 Jun 1997, Ross D. Gardler wrote: I have two machines, one is a Win95 machine, one is a Linux machine. The Linux machine has a cable modem connection to the Internet. I would like to get the Win95 machine talking to the Linux Machine and to the Internet via the cable modem. How do I do this? The Linux machine has two Ethernet cards and I have managed to get it to recognise both but I can't seem to get it to talk to the Win95 machine. I only have one IP address for the two machines, so do not know what to do with the second. Any pointers? +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: PASCAL for Linux
On Wed, 28 May 1997, Leandro Asnaghi-Nicastro wrote: Sorry for my previous request which apparently was sent to the wrong distribution list (many apologies to Pete Templin who kindly pointed it out to me). I've been trying to download a PASCAL compiler for Linux and I've been unsuccesful. Every site I've gone to either has the wrong link on their html or I am denied the FTP transfer. I am assuming that this is a problem with our WinNT server. Anyone has ideas of where I could download this program? I've tried linux.org with their software map engine which failed, and I also went on sunsite. Thank you all for your patience and help. You want gpc and gpc-doc, about 1.5 mb total. If you can't get them by ftp from ftp.debian.org or a mirror site, tell me what does actually work on a WinNT server (http?) and I will see what I can do to help. I absolutely hate pascal, but I'm compassionate :) +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Special Linux CD offer + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: LINUX SUPPORT FOR CABLE-MODEMS?
On Thu, 15 May 1997, Harmon Sequoya Nine wrote: Hi all. A cable modem has just been installed on my computer, and I would like to use it under Linux: 1) The card that was installed on my computer is a 10base-T (twisted pair) ethernet card -- Intel 82557-based PCI Ethernet card. Does the Linux kernel currently have a driver for this card? On a fresh install of Debian, I did not see a driver for this card listed in the driver configuration portion of the install ... 2) The cable-modem hookup supports dynamic IP-address assignment (though I'm supposed to get the same IP address each time the modem powers on). Is there a way to get the Linux ethernet support to read its IP address, say, at boot time? The question is: Is the cable modem using standard ethernet. Sometimes Intel chipsets are used in nonstandard ways, such as reduced clock rates. This is what I can tell you about Ethernet compatibility. I can boot a given machine to Linux, win3.x, or w95 and use TCP/IP over Ethernet. With all 3 operating systems I can access the internet via another Linux box which has a modem and is configured to serve as a gateway/router or expensive Cisco routers with T-1 bandwidth. In both win3.x and win95 the standard Microsoft drivers are used. So if the cable modem is usable with standard Microsoft drivers, it will probably work with Linux. If there is no Linux driver for the card, try a card that is widely supported. I paid $18 for new ethernet cards last year. If you always get the same IP address, then it is static. Write it down and use it as your machine IP for Linux. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Linux CD's sent worldwide! + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: mouse
On Fri, 16 May 1997, Mark Bathie wrote: Just a simple question. How do i instally my mouse for use with debian X11. Please don't RTFM. Thanx. If it's a serial port mouse install the gpm package first. If that works then configure X11 for your system. Just a simple question. What does RTFM mean? I lost my code book. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Linux CD's sent worldwide! + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: Connecting terminals
On Thu, 15 May 1997, Pilon wrote: I need to connect two terminals to my Linux box, I have in my inittab file: s1:12345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 19200 ttyS0 vt100 s2:12345:respawn:/sbin/agetty 19200 ttyS1 vt100 The login prompt appears well in my terminals; but when I try to login I can't do it. Can someone help me? Looks like the cable or terminal options are not proper for hardware flow control. The following works for my HP 200LX palmtop with a wireless infrared link. This is necessary because the host does not get carrier detect from the port. s2:12345:respawn:/sbin/agetty -L 19200 ttyS1 vt100 If that works, then you may want to find an RS-232 breakout box and use the status lights and jumpers to nail down the proper cable pinout. In the olden days, I couldn't be caught without one. There were so many variations between serial devices and host ports. You may be able to run fine with the -L option if your terminal has adequate buffer memory or you drop the baud rate. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Linux CD's sent worldwide! + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: mouse
On Fri, 16 May 1997, E.L. Meijer (Eric) wrote:
Just a simple question. What does RTFM mean? I lost my code book.
File: jargon.info, Node: RTFM, Next: RTFS, Prev: RTFB, Up: = R =
:RTFM: /R-T-F-M/ /imp./ [Unix] Acronym for `Read The Fucking
Manual'. 1. Used by {guru}s to brush off questions they
consider trivial or annoying. Compare {Don't do that, then!}.
2. Used when reporting a problem to indicate that you aren't just
asking out of {randomness}. No, I can't figure out how to
interface Unix to my toaster, and yes, I have RTFM. Unlike
sense 1, this use is considered polite. See also {FM},
{RTFAQ}, {RTFB}, {RTFS}, {RTM}, all of which mutated
from RTFM, and compare {UTSL}.
More interesting hacker usage can be found in the jargon info file,
which is in its own debian package. Highly recommended. A lot of
FAQ-s are found on an ftp-site actually called rtfm.mit.edu. Also
worth a visit.
This helps, but leads me to wonder: I have an IBM keyboard and it has a
row of keys labeled F1F12?
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Re: samba whoes ...
I DON'T recommend playing with the --force option at all with these packages. Wait until it is fixed or a proven workaround is available. I got an experimental system in such a state that I couldn't login as any user. I had to mount the drive on another system to get the few files that I wanted and then reinstalled from scratch. I downgraded samba to get around this for now. On Wed, 14 May 1997, Karl Ferguson wrote: At 11:54 AM 14/05/97 +0200, Toens Bueker wrote: Hi, how do I install samba? It requires libpam0 which requires libpam-util. Installation of libpam0 will not work until libpam-util is configured, which will not work until libpam0 is configured :-) Hmmm, if that's the case, then you can override using dpkg with the --force* commands - however, I don't recommend it unless it's a last resort. +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Linux CD's sent worldwide! + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: samba whoes ...
I was just looking at bug report #9131 which suggested this approach for the libpam0/libpam-util circular dependency. I would recommend doing this in steps of dependency order and checking results along the way. On Wed, 14 May 1997, Craig Sanders wrote: On Wed, 14 May 1997, Toens Bueker wrote: how do I install samba? It requires libpam0 which requires libpam-util. Installation of libpam0 will not work until libpam-util is configured, which will not work until libpam0 is configured :-) install the libpam stuff with one command line: dpkg -i libpwddb0 libpam0 libpam-util then install samba: dpkg -i samba note: you'll have to complete the FILEnames above yourself, i've only typed the package names (of course you could install all packages including samba with one command, but it made my example less clear :-) craig -- craig sanders networking consultant Available for casual or contract temporary autonomous zone system administration tasks. -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Linux CD's sent worldwide! + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
CD organization (was Re: InfoMagic's new LDR)
RE: this product in general: What would be expected? The product contains multiple distributions and is not oriented towards Debian. The vendor has quite a range of products. Those who want Debian Linux should get it from vendors who use Debian, like Debian, advocate Debian, breathe Debian, eat Debian, and even dream Debian. I see that one vendor (not Debian-oriented) is now offering a weekly release for $35. My answer to this is to offer a fresh for much less. By fresh I mean that I will freeze the mirror as often as possible. Usually daily, but you can't always count on the ftp sites you mirror from. On Tue, 13 May 1997 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just looked at another tiny point: $ df /cdrom Filesystem 1024-blocks Used Available Capacity Mounted on /dev/hdd 663260 6632600100% /cdrom Does anyone know how much fits on one CD? I'd guess this one 681984000 bytes raw / 1024 = 666000 blocks there is some overhead used for the iso9660 filesystem (InfoMagic's Debian CD) is quite close to the limit. On the CD there is a project directory: I guess this could be done away with. If you want to use experimental stuff, you probably should get updates from the internet quite People who want source/experimental/developmental CD's want them in order to save space and bandwidth regularly. Imo, a CD should be a solid, working set of packages that you can rely upon. In the README.cds file in the root, it specifies which files to omit when making a one-CD distribution of the stable release. I think the project directory should be omitted. However, as it stands, it won't be possible anymore to put Debian on one CD within a short period of time. It should probably be suggested to put binary and source directories on separate CD-s. Also it appears possible that the current omissions are due to the fact that these packages simply didn't fit on the disk. In that case, Infomagic should have noticed it. Any thoughts on this one? Yes, it is better to have more available packages even if it requires a second CD. But dependencies have to be analyzed to organize a CD set. If people have problems installing packages because a depency is on the unmounted volume, this list will get busier. CD 1 boot/install/base - Put everything on this for installing a new system or upgrading the base packages of an existing one. Multiple releases and target architectures could probably fit on this. CD 2 binary packagemaster - Put the rest of the binaries here for a target platform. The idea is that after basics are taken care of, this one has all the stuff that dselect/dpkg looks for. Now fill in the remaining space on CD 1 and 2 with miscellaneous extras CD n.. Additional source, docs, etc. thought - Perhaps the new dselect will go through a collection/unpack phase which will allow a mix of CD's, already downloaded updates, and ftp access. I considered the symlink approach, but think that a database would work best. This would also help for the creation of customized package sets. I would like the idea of putting good skeletal package sets on a CD and ftp site for typical orientations (webserver, lanserver, workstation, router/gateway, etc). thought - I suppose that machines like the Alpha compile very fast. If we had a dselect install and build from source option, then fast platforms would need fewer precompiled target binaries. They would use the universal source CD for adding packages. Along this line, my 386 takes hours to build a kernel. I wouldn't be happy if this was the only machine I had and I received a distribution that was source oriented. I usually create Debian packages on faster machines and then install the binaries on the slower ones. afterthought - the previously mentioned collection/unpack phase would help in 2 other ways: binary-all might be on the other CD unstable contains symlinks to frozen and/or stable (other CD) +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.greenbush.com/cds.html Linux CD's sent worldwide! + +--+ -- TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM THIS MAILING LIST: e-mail the word unsubscribe to [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Trouble? e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] .
Re: How do you guys read news offline?
On 15 Apr 1997, Andy Spiegl wrote: Hi! I thought about using suck to download the news articles I am interested in as soon as a PPP is up. But how do I post my own articles back to the net? I would really be grateful if someone could post his/her working setup. Thanks a lot in advance! Andy. While you're at it, tell us how to post from pine but override the from header. I would like to mangle my address whenever it goes to newsgroups, but not on normal mail. I see a lot of people doing this and putting instructions in the signature to unmangle it. I know with netscape it is a PITA - you have to go to the options and change things back and forth. If I get any more of these get rich quick opportunities, I will have to buy a bank of my own :-) If you know of such an opportunity send it to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.wtop.com/What does W.T.O.P. mean? + +--+
Re: 'Frozen' boot disks
The reason I put this copy up was for testing. For the first round of testing, people were picking them up from sites that only had modem bandwidth. Yes, ftp.debian.org is the authoritative source. If you want to play with the new toys before the store opens, you can pick them up at my site. On Mon, 14 Apr 1997, Richard L Shepherd wrote: On Sat, 12 Apr 1997, Paul Wade wrote: 4/6/97 I put a copy at ftp.greenbush.com, look in /pub/bodisks. The files are dated by time of transfer, but they are the 4/4 set. I have the same problem. I had thought it may be because I mirror a mirror (which in turn may not directly mirror ftp.debian.org) and so my mirror was effectively a few days behind. However I just checked on ftp.debian.org and it really is empty so Where are they then? So my next question then is: is not ftp.debian.org the authoritative source for the Debian Distribution? i.e. I seek to maintain a mirror of ftp.debian.org thinking that this will ensure I have an up-to-date Debian Distribution for my linux fans. Am I doing the right thing? 8---8 Richard Shepherd ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 8---8 +--+ + Paul Wade Greenbush Technologies Corporation + + mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.greenbush.com/ + +--+ + http://www.wtop.com/What does W.T.O.P. mean? + +--+
