Re: Debian, rpm and corporate world (was: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?)
on Mon, May 17, 2004 at 11:07:01AM +0200, Dominique Dumont ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Proulx) writes: and I found that it can't find files it need in deb DB,I had been tried to install it on debian, #rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm the program will prompt: myproduct need perl 5.6, and the bash must be installed As other people have written doing this is not a good thing. Put yourself in the other position. I have a .deb file from Debian. I want to install it on a RH system. Should I insist that you must use dpkg to install it there? That would be just as silly as insisting the reverse. A native packaging is always best. Currently there is big chicken and egg problem with Debian in the corporate world. Corporate guys want to be able to install software from ISV (like Oracle). Oracle, and a small number of related enterprise systems, really sit in a class by themselves. Ideally, they're installed on stand-alone, dedicated hardware, with the OS tweaked to the application's specification. Had an interesting discussion a few weeks back with a friend now working at PeopleSoft, tracing kernel issues through the application. For applications of this complexity, scope, and corporate profile, you pretty much _do_ knuckle down. Doesn't mean you can't play around the edges, or investigate alternatives. And for a wide class of applications (again: SAS in my experience), the so-called distro-specificity is pretty much a red herring. Though your support contract may call for it. In practice, the truth is that the Unix share of such ISV's operations is falling drastically. SAS now splits revenues between MF and 'Doze, with 'Nix a rapidly declining share (another reason I find it far less interesting these days). ISVs only provide their proprietary software as rpm because not many corporation ask for Debian. Corporation do not ask for Debian because most ISVs don't provide Debian packages. Last time I installed Oracle, it was some gawdoffal Java-based GUI installation. Granted, 2000/2001. Is there an RPM yet? IMHO, the only way to break this circle is to provide a way to install rpm that doesn't look like a hack. It's not a hack, it's an alien ;-) Peace. -- Karsten M. Self [EMAIL PROTECTED]http://kmself.home.netcom.com/ What Part of Gestalt don't you understand? Save Bob Edwards! http://www.savebobedwards.com/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Debian, rpm and corporate world (was: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?)
On Mon, 17 May 2004, Dominique Dumont wrote: Sure. Be if one can easily install rpm packages on a Debian system, this would be a good message sent to the corporate world. I don't think so. The kind of corporate type who even know there is such a difference will understand why .debs are better. The ones who don't will never get the message. Currently there is big chicken and egg problem with Debian in the corporate world. Corporate guys want to be able to install software from ISV (like Oracle). Oracle is a bad example. Corporate DBAs pick whatever platform Oracle supports. Oracle will never support Debian not because there's no one there who knows how to make a .deb but because it is to chaotic for their tech support model. ISVs only provide their proprietary software as rpm because not many corporation ask for Debian. Corporation do not ask for Debian because most ISVs don't provide Debian packages. Corporations do not ask for Debian because it is not on Oracles (or other ISVs) supported platform list. The operating system is just a commodity. It's the apps that drive the platform not the other way around. So the trick is to convince the ISVs that apps are worth porting to Debian. Once they are convinced, they'll work out how to make .debs fast enough. IMHO, the only way to break this circle is to provide a way to install rpm that doesn't look like a hack. I disagree. IMO the number one thing we can do to drum up ISV support is to hurry up and release sarge. Woody is so out of date it's a maintainence nightmare. For example the latest stable versions of SUSE and Fedora are using perl 5.8.x. Woody still has 5.6. There are enough minor differences between the two to significantly complicate QA work. And lets not even talk about things like g++ or NPTL. Two, customers (as opposed to random zealots on mailing lists) need to be really vocal about wanting genuine Debian support. Everytime you get a survey, write about wanting Debian support. Everytime you meet a sales rep, ask him so hows the Debian support coming? When ISVs sense genuine demand, they will figure out how to fill it. Three, we need to increase the amount of documentation for developers and users. The more Debian is a known quantity, the easier it will be for ISVs to work with it and around it. So to sum up, don't worry about package format. It's really not important at all. -- Jaldhar H. Vyas [EMAIL PROTECTED] La Salle Debain - http://www.braincells.com/debian/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Debian, rpm and corporate world (was: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Proulx) writes: and I found that it can't find files it need in deb DB,I had been tried to install it on debian, #rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm the program will prompt: myproduct need perl 5.6, and the bash must be installed As other people have written doing this is not a good thing. Put yourself in the other position. I have a .deb file from Debian. I want to install it on a RH system. Should I insist that you must use dpkg to install it there? That would be just as silly as insisting the reverse. A native packaging is always best. Sure. Be if one can easily install rpm packages on a Debian system, this would be a good message sent to the corporate world. Currently there is big chicken and egg problem with Debian in the corporate world. Corporate guys want to be able to install software from ISV (like Oracle). ISVs only provide their proprietary software as rpm because not many corporation ask for Debian. Corporation do not ask for Debian because most ISVs don't provide Debian packages. IMHO, the only way to break this circle is to provide a way to install rpm that doesn't look like a hack. The example above rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm would be perfect. The trick is that rpm need not to be the genuine rpm. It could be a program that would call alien, check the dependencies and then call dpkg. Or Debian could provide a 'drpm' that would do the same thing. The name is close enough to genuine rpm to give the feeling that yes, it's supported (it is also indeed a matter of subjective feeling) The major difficulty is: the installation must check the dependencies expressed in the rpm package by using the data stored in the Debian package database. Without a dependency check, installing a big product like Oracle will not be easy. So the questions are now: - does the Debian community want Debian to be used in corporate world to run *proprietary* softwares ? - Can tool like 'drpm' be reliable enough ? Cheers -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Debian, rpm and corporate world (was: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?)
Dominique Dumont wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bob Proulx) writes: #rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm As other people have written doing this is not a good thing. Put yourself in the other position. I have a .deb file from Debian. I want to install it on a RH system. Should I insist that you must use dpkg to install it there? That would be just as silly as insisting the reverse. A native packaging is always best. Sure. Be if one can easily install rpm packages on a Debian system, this would be a good message sent to the corporate world. Ian Murdock [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote the following a while back. I am very interested in how it turns out. http://lists.progeny.com/archive/discover-workers/200310/msg0.html Summary snippet: We are also working with various parties to add/merge RPM support into the mainline APT, to allow Debian- and RPM-based distributions to be managed using a single APT codebase, and possibly even to allow Debian and RPM packages to coexist side by side. This work also aims to merge our various APT extensions (e.g., support for authenticated APT repos) into the mainline APT. It is our hope that a distribution-independent Anaconda and a distribution-independent APT (plus, eventually, a distribution- independent configuration framework) will, along with a stronger LSB, help unify further the various Linux distributions. So there is hope for your goal. But it is not here yet. A problem to be handled will be different distro policies. Look at the recent issues just discussed about installing and maintaining KNOPPIX on a hard drive. A fine system. Based on Debian. But still there are issues about interoperating packages. If something that close can't work transparently how well can packages crossing really different distros operate? I am skeptical. But cautiously hopeful. Currently there is big chicken and egg problem with Debian in the corporate world. Corporate guys want to be able to install software from ISV (like Oracle). I understand what you are saying. But they can install oracle and others today. My comment is that they want a vendor supported installation of the vendor application. Not an installation that a Debian expert made happen. ISVs only provide their proprietary software as rpm because not many corporation ask for Debian. Corporation do not ask for Debian because most ISVs don't provide Debian packages. We ask routinely. We get stone-walled routinely. But we do it anyway. However we have a lot of in house Debian expertise at my place of employment. Enough that vendor support was not the biggest lever. We do keep one RH machine (one vendor's supported platform, I am in the USA) so that when we need to bring a vendor in on a problem we recreate the problem there. Problems have always been identical in behavior on Debian systems too. But the vendor won't acknowledge it until we can get them a test case on their system. And by that I mean a system on the vendor's developer's machine. In the end I think we just need to wear down the folks supporting a particular distro instead of supporting GNU/Linux in general. And I am starting to see headway with our vendors. But it is slow going. IMHO, the only way to break this circle is to provide a way to install rpm that doesn't look like a hack. I previously gave one example of the MTA differences between distros. But let's take something simple which might seem reasonable to alien install like ncurses4, /usr/lib/libncurses.so.4. A common compatibility library needed for many RH programs to run on Debian. Woody does not have this. I think potato did and it was dropped and is now back in sarge. If you alien the RH package and try to install it on Debian it will install fine. Programs will work. But then eventually you will install a Debian package which requires not ncurses4 but libncurses4. The names won't match. If you try to install libncurses4 it will have file conflicts with ncurses4. If you try to remove ncurses4 first you will have dependencies problems. Anything built with ncurses4 installed won't know about libncurses4. Yes, this is all from personal experience. I created my own problems by not following the right policy. How do you propose to handle this type of case? Note that I am not disagreeing in principle to the fact that this would be beneficial. I agree with that. I am just asking how would this actually be done. I do not think it is possible. But I am very happy if I am proved wrong. So the questions are now: - does the Debian community want Debian to be used in corporate world to run *proprietary* softwares ? Personally, yes. I think many people have that ideal. It is written into the Social Contract. But the recent Debian Social Contract vote casts that as a majority opinion into doubt. So now I don't know. A contingent of vocal DDs would certainly say no. - Can tool like
Re: Debian, rpm and corporate world (was: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?)
On Mon, May 17, 2004 at 04:10:39PM -0600, Bob Proulx wrote: Dominique Dumont wrote: So the questions are now: - does the Debian community want Debian to be used in corporate world to run *proprietary* softwares ? Personally, yes. I think many people have that ideal. It is written into the Social Contract. But the recent Debian Social Contract vote casts that as a majority opinion into doubt. So now I don't know. A contingent of vocal DDs would certainly say no. I don't think the recent Social Contract vote affected that, really. The discussion has been almost entirely about what Debian should ship, not what our users should be able to do. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On Wed, May 12, 2004 at 05:40:51PM +0800, Rick wrote: Hello People: Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. At the start,I wanted to try install these rpm packages(from redhat) On debian,but I found that thers is a lot work to do,some rpm packages even can't be installed on it.(perhaps these rpms packages from redhat can't be used on debian at all).I think 2 ways to settle this problem,But I am not sure these ways is doable,and I wish to get some advices about it.these problem are: 1. Use a certain tool to translate these packages(glibc*.rpm..) from redhat to rpm packages that can be used on debian.Is there such tools exist on debian? 2. On Debian,after I install rpm,rpm DB and deb DB exist,Can I make some mapping bettwen betwwen rpm DB and deb DB? when I run rpm command,the OS will invoke debian DB.for example: # rpm -qv gcc package gcc is not installed #dpkg -l |grep gcc ii gcc-3.03.0.4-7The GNU C compiler. # this means gcc*rpm isn't installed but gcc*deb is installed on debian. after I make this mapping,I can use rpm to access deb DB. # rpm -qv gcc gcc-3.0 # if this way is feasible,How to do it? I am a new debian user,not too familiar with this OS, If above ways are impossible,is thers other ways to attain my purpose? As someone else mentioned, look at the alien Debian package for conversion from .rpm .deb. But that is hardly adequate for reliable, professional software. You should consider a more realistic option: 3. Genuinely *port* your software to the Debian platform. While glibc 2.3.2 and perl 5.8 are not available in the current Debian stable release (Woody), it's rather unlikely that your software *needs* those components in those versions - i.e. whether it is more or less a matter of recompiling. But then you know that. Or even if not this, somehow you're going to need to provide security updates for these libraries your software needs. These packages aren't going to reliably install with alien or rpm unmodified. So if you're going to officially support the port of your software to Debian (which seems to be part of the definition of port), you are going to need to distribute these packages to your users yourselves, and distribute security updates of these non-official packages yourselves. Since you will be doing this anyhow, why not simply maintain these packages as .deb packages in the versions your users will need, in the form of backports [1] for Debian stable (Woody)? [1] http://www.backports.org dircha -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On Sat, May 15, 2004 at 01:16:09AM -0400, Kevin Mark wrote: On Fri, May 14, 2004 at 09:50:00PM -0600, s. keeling wrote: I imagine there are cases in which this approach won't work, but we see the same thing from people everyday who are limiting themselves to only using debian tools. Just look at that stable vs. testing vs. unstable thread a month ago. And that's possibly the worst news the original poster wants to hear; he's got to make his stuff work on stable, testing, and unstable?!? Gah! Hi S, one doesnt make a product 'work' for stable, testing or unstable. every package start out it life as an unstable package. And if it proves its stability it will get moved to testing. And then if all goes well, it moves into stable. its stability and interaction with other packages are the criteria that the debian packager of an authors work uses to judge when it is moved to the next phase of readyness for 'stable'. That applies to Debian packages, but not to third-party products being ported to Debian. The usual approach for those is to build for stable and deal with other problems if and when they arise. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On Friday 14 May 2004 11:19 pm, Paul E Condon wrote: packages because the Debian community believes its deb packaging system is superior to the rpm system.* Debian also has a social commitment to free * Actually, it _is_ superior, but I'm trying to be nice. Vastly so. No need to be nice about it. The wRetched Package Manager just needs to go away. :) -- Michael McIntyre Silvan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621 http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On Saturday 15 May 2004 01:16 am, Kevin Mark wrote: its stability it will get moved to testing. And then if all goes well, it moves into stable. its stability and interaction with other packages are the criteria that the debian packager of an authors work uses to judge when it is moved to the next phase of readyness for 'stable'. Well, that's all rather misleading, I think. Nothing ever makes it into stable. When stable is stable, stable stays stable. When was the last time a package made it from Sid into Woody? The descriptions of the Debian Way make it sound like that happens, but it doesn't. Packages make it into stable all at once, and after they're there, they're frozen in time forever. Security and bug fixes, yes, but the version of libflummy is chiseled in stone pretty much for eternity thereafter. The way this is usually described just doesn't reflect the reality of it. -- Michael McIntyre Silvan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Linux fanatic, and certified Geek; registered Linux user #243621 http://www.geocities.com/Paris/Rue/5407/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
Incoming from Silvan: On Friday 14 May 2004 11:19 pm, Paul E Condon wrote: packages because the Debian community believes its deb packaging system is superior to the rpm system.* Debian also has a social commitment to free * Actually, it _is_ superior, but I'm trying to be nice. Vastly so. No need to be nice about it. The wRetched Package Manager just needs to go away. :) Could you do World Peace first? It might be easier. -- Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced. (*) http://www.spots.ab.ca/~keeling - - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
s. keeling wrote: Incoming from Silvan: On Friday 14 May 2004 11:19 pm, Paul E Condon wrote: packages because the Debian community believes its deb packaging system is superior to the rpm system.* Debian also has a social commitment to free * Actually, it _is_ superior, but I'm trying to be nice. Vastly so. No need to be nice about it. The wRetched Package Manager just needs to go away. :) Could you do World Peace first? It might be easier. There could be no World Peace while RPM exists freely and is so widely supported by fanatical users with no regard for ease of use or superior methods. We simply can not compromise! -- Damon L. Chesser [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
Rick wrote: Yes,I think so.but our procedure depend rpm format, I think you are confusing a packaging format with your program. You program undoubtedly depends upon shared libraries and other things. But it is packaged into a distribution format. It can be packaged into many different formats. and I found that it can't find files it need in deb DB,I had been tried to install it on debian, #rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm the program will prompt: myproduct need perl 5.6, and the bash must be installed As other people have written doing this is not a good thing. Put yourself in the other position. I have a .deb file from Debian. I want to install it on a RH system. Should I insist that you must use dpkg to install it there? That would be just as silly as insisting the reverse. A native packaging is always best. A real example might help. On Debian only one MTA (mail transport agents) can be installed at the same time. Installing a different one pushes out the previous one. This makes it easy to switch between MTAs. Just install a different one. Have sendmail installed? Install postfix. Sendmail is removed as Postfix is added leaving Postfix as the active MTA. Want to go back? Install the previous MTA of choice. Everything works. It is very nice. On later RH they use the alternatives for /usr/sbin/mta making it a symlink to the currently active MTA such as one of sendmail or postfix. It is possible to have multiple MTAs installed but only one of them active[1]. This is a completely different method of managing the current MTA. And after installation you must adjust the alternatives and other things or your desired selected MTA is not configured. On RH 7.3 (don't know about later versions) postfix has a lower priority than sendmail for example. Installing a package from a different system will not be written to handle the other system's management methods. This is completely outside the scope of just a package installation tool like dpkg or rpm or even a dependency aware tool like apt or yum but encompasses the larger problem of system policy. There are issues of naming conventions and other such things to be taken into consideration. I feel that the system policy which describes how packages interoperate is where Debian is clearly ahead of the competition. Bob [1] Why have multiple MTAs installed? Only one can really be active. It just causes problems. But this is legacy from RH usage. On RH at bare metal install time is the only time you can guarantee the dependencies are all resolvable. So RH users have been encouraged to install everything from the CD at installation time regardless of the sensibility of that because later they won't be able to do so. This required RH to facilitate this using the Debian alternatives as a way to have multiple MTAs installed at the same time but only one operating. I see that as a hack on a hack. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
Incoming from Damon L. Chesser: There could be no World Peace while RPM exists freely and is so widely supported by fanatical users with no regard for ease of use or superior methods. We simply can not compromise! Ah, geez. A day doesn't go by lately that someone isn't declaring war on somebody.:-P I have Applix on my machine. It installed off their CD in rpm format. It works fine in Woody. It worked fine on SuSE when I was running that. In other words, we can all just get along. Besides, we've already got enough top-posters to be consigned to Hell before we bite off more problems. -- Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced. (*) http://www.spots.ab.ca/~keeling - - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Thus spake Rick: # #rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm # the program will prompt: myproduct need perl 5.6, and the bash must be installed # In fact,the 2 debian packages has been installed,I think rpm command will read info from only rpm DB on debian. This is generally not recommended, but the easiest thing to do would be to simply add the --nodeps option on the command line: rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm --nodeps If all dependencies are installed in Debian, you will find that the newly installed RPM package will run flawlessly. The RPM dependency check is only done at install time, not at runtime. The package will also be uninstalled properly without complaining about dependencies: rpm -e myproduct HTH, PRINCE -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFApSOnAl2SNUPt1I8RAgilAJ95ku4xjb1QBgQg29xyMAhVuUmNjQCfdhkS 6jV/7y+kHNT1zpEttmkWKlE= =lbVA -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On Wed, May 12, 2004 at 05:40:51PM +0800, Rick wrote: Hello People: Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. At the start,I wanted to try install these rpm packages(from redhat) On debian,but I found that thers is a lot work to do,some rpm packages even can't be installed on it.(perhaps these rpms packages from redhat can't be used on debian at all).I think 2 ways to settle this problem,But I am not sure these ways is doable,and I wish to get some advices about it.these problem are: 1. Use a certain tool to translate these packages(glibc*.rpm..) from redhat to rpm packages that can be used on debian.Is there such tools exist on debian? 2. On Debian,after I install rpm,rpm DB and deb DB exist,Can I make some mapping bettwen betwwen rpm DB and deb DB? when I run rpm command,the OS will invoke debian DB.for example: # rpm -qv gcc package gcc is not installed #dpkg -l |grep gcc ii gcc-3.03.0.4-7The GNU C compiler. # this means gcc*rpm isn't installed but gcc*deb is installed on debian. after I make this mapping,I can use rpm to access deb DB. # rpm -qv gcc gcc-3.0 # if this way is feasible,How to do it? I am a new debian user,not too familiar with this OS, If above ways are impossible,is thers other ways to attain my purpose? Rick, Debian is a GNU/Linux distribution in its own right. It does not use rpm packages because the Debian community believes its deb packaging system is superior to the rpm system.* Debian also has a social commitment to free software, which may have some effect on the viability of your project to port a product to Debian. But if you are committed to the port, and if you want to present your product in a way that it has its best chance to be accepted in this market, you should create a Debian package for it. Rpm packages do not play well with Debian. Most Debian users would simply reject a product that is not properly packaged for Debian. Some might try to use it. Some might get it to work. Some might even like it. But then those few will ask you to package it as a deb before they buy. The rest will ignore your stuff. You might as well be a Czech asking a Frenchman to learn Czech just so he can use your software, which is written with all Czech prompts and documentation. Best of Luck -- Paul E Condon [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Actually, it _is_ superior, but I'm trying to be nice. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
Incoming from Paul E Condon: On Wed, May 12, 2004 at 05:40:51PM +0800, Rick wrote: Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. Some might try to use it. Some might get it to work. Some might even like it. But then those few will ask you to package it as a deb before they buy. The rest will And others will use rpm for rpms and Debian tools for .debs, including alien to convert one to the other, or simply installing whatever we've got to work with. I imagine there are cases in which this approach won't work, but we see the same thing from people everyday who are limiting themselves to only using debian tools. Just look at that stable vs. testing vs. unstable thread a month ago. And that's possibly the worst news the original poster wants to hear; he's got to make his stuff work on stable, testing, and unstable?!? Gah! -- Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced. (*) http://www.spots.ab.ca/~keeling - - -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On Fri, May 14, 2004 at 09:50:00PM -0600, s. keeling wrote: Incoming from Paul E Condon: On Wed, May 12, 2004 at 05:40:51PM +0800, Rick wrote: Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. Some might try to use it. Some might get it to work. Some might even like it. But then those few will ask you to package it as a deb before they buy. The rest will And others will use rpm for rpms and Debian tools for .debs, including alien to convert one to the other, or simply installing whatever we've got to work with. I imagine there are cases in which this approach won't work, but we see the same thing from people everyday who are limiting themselves to only using debian tools. Just look at that stable vs. testing vs. unstable thread a month ago. And that's possibly the worst news the original poster wants to hear; he's got to make his stuff work on stable, testing, and unstable?!? Gah! -- Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced. (*) http://www.spots.ab.ca/~keeling - - Hi S, one doesnt make a product 'work' for stable, testing or unstable. every package start out it life as an unstable package. And if it proves its stability it will get moved to testing. And then if all goes well, it moves into stable. its stability and interaction with other packages are the criteria that the debian packager of an authors work uses to judge when it is moved to the next phase of readyness for 'stable'. -Kev signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
Hello People: Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. At the start,I wanted to try install these rpm packages(from redhat) On debian,but I found that thers is a lot work to do,some rpm packages even can't be installed on it.(perhaps these rpms packages from redhat can't be used on debian at all).I think 2 ways to settle this problem,But I am not sure these ways is doable,and I wish to get some advices about it.these problem are: 1. Use a certain tool to translate these packages(glibc*.rpm..) from redhat to rpm packages that can be used on debian.Is there such tools exist on debian? 2. On Debian,after I install rpm,rpm DB and deb DB exist,Can I make some mapping bettwen betwwen rpm DB and deb DB? when I run rpm command,the OS will invoke debian DB.for example: # rpm -qv gcc package gcc is not installed #dpkg -l |grep gcc ii gcc-3.03.0.4-7The GNU C compiler. # this means gcc*rpm isn't installed but gcc*deb is installed on debian. after I make this mapping,I can use rpm to access deb DB. # rpm -qv gcc gcc-3.0 # if this way is feasible,How to do it? I am a new debian user,not too familiar with this OS, If above ways are impossible,is thers other ways to attain my purpose? Thanks! Rick --http://www.eyou.com --Îȶ¨¿É¿¿µÄµç×ÓÐÅÏä ÓïÒôÓʼþ Òƶ¯ÊéÇ© ÈÕÀú·þÎñ ÍøÂç´æ´¢...ÒÚÓÊδ¾¡ --http://vip.eyou.com --¿ì¿ìµÇ¼ÒÚÓÊVIPÐÅÏä ×¢²áÄúÖÐÒâµÄÓû§Ãû -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On (12/05/04 17:40), Rick wrote: Hello People: Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. At the start,I wanted to try install these rpm packages(from redhat) On debian,but I found that thers is a lot work to do,some rpm packages even can't be installed on it.(perhaps these rpms packages from redhat can't be used on debian at all).I think 2 ways to settle this problem,But I am not sure these ways is doable,and I wish to get some advices about it.these problem are: 1. Use a certain tool to translate these packages(glibc*.rpm..) from redhat to rpm packages that can be used on debian.Is there such tools exist on debian? Check out alien, a package specifically to convert rpms and you may want to look at: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/distribute-deb/distribute-deb.html 2. On Debian,after I install rpm,rpm DB and deb DB exist,Can I make some mapping bettwen betwwen rpm DB and deb DB? when I run rpm command,the OS will invoke debian DB.for example: # rpm -qv gcc package gcc is not installed #dpkg -l |grep gcc ii gcc-3.03.0.4-7The GNU C compiler. # this means gcc*rpm isn't installed but gcc*deb is installed on debian. after I make this mapping,I can use rpm to access deb DB. # rpm -qv gcc gcc-3.0 # if this way is feasible,How to do it? I am a new debian user,not too familiar with this OS, If above ways are impossible,is thers other ways to attain my purpose? Thanks! Rick -- http://www.clivemenzies.co.uk strategies for business -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
On Wed, May 12, 2004 at 05:40:51PM +0800, Rick wrote: Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. At the start,I wanted to try install these rpm packages(from redhat) Once you have done that, the system is no longer really Debian, so I don't see the point. Figure out what Debian packages it depends on instead. On debian,but I found that thers is a lot work to do,some rpm packages even can't be installed on it.(perhaps these rpms packages from redhat can't be used on debian at all). In general they shouldn't be. -- Colin Watson [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
Thank you for your help,I should check the alien manual in detail first.
Re: Re: Can rpm packages from other linux distribution be used on Debian?
Our product is base on redhat,I will porting it to Debian,but in this system,many procedure depend redhat rpms,for example: glibc-2.3.2-11.9.i386.rpm, perl-5.8.0-88.i386.rpm,etc.. At the start,I wanted to try install these rpm packages(from redhat) Once you have done that, the system is no longer really Debian, so I don't see the point. Figure out what Debian packages it depends on instead. Yes,I think so.but our procedure depend rpm format,and I found that it can't find files it need in deb DB,I had been tried to install it on debian, #rpm -ivh myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm the program will prompt: myproduct need perl 5.6, and the bash must be installed In fact,the 2 debian packages has been installed,I think rpm command will read info from only rpm DB on debian.(If make myproduct-xxx-xx.rpm to deb format,I think more codes need be fixed,this proccess is complex,but I hadn't tried this way yet,I should try it tomorrow.) On debian,but I found that thers is a lot work to do,some rpm packages even can't be installed on it.(perhaps these rpms packages from redhat can't be used on debian at all). In general they shouldn't be. Thank you! Rick
