Re: Why Wheezy and Not Just Testing? (WAS: Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Lu, 22 apr 13, 01:03:41, Patrick Bartek wrote: I stayed with F12 almost 2 and a half years past its EOL. I didn't like F15, my next usual upgrade, or the following releases, or the direction Fedora was going. So, I opted against upgrading, but 12 was having problems. Time for a new OS. So, after some research, I decided on Debian mainly for its stability and 5+ year support life A Debian release has security support for approximately 3 years: 2 years as stable and one additional year as oldstable. You can extend that a bit if you switch to testing when it's frozen, but that requires an upgrade oldstable - stable - testing (skipping releases is not supported). Kind regards, Andrei -- http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser Offtopic discussions among Debian users and developers: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/mailman/listinfo/d-community-offtopic signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Why Wheezy and Not Just Testing? (WAS: Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Tue, 30 Apr 2013 10:52:38 +0300,Andrei POPESCU andreimpope...@gmail.com wrote: On Lu, 22 apr 13, 01:03:41, Patrick Bartek wrote: I stayed with F12 almost 2 and a half years past its EOL. I didn't like F15, my next usual upgrade, or the following releases, or the direction Fedora was going. So, I opted against upgrading, but 12 was having problems. Time for a new OS. So, after some research, I decided on Debian mainly for its stability and 5+ year support life A Debian release has security support for approximately 3 years: 2 years as stable and one additional year as oldstable. You can extend that a bit if you switch to testing when it's frozen, but that requires an upgrade oldstable - stable - testing (skipping releases is not supported). My research of past Debian releases showed a longer support life, but 3+ years will work, too. That will be about the time to decide whether this system needs replacing, and along with it a newer OS. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130430093852.5f200...@debian7.boseck208.net
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Thu, 25 Apr 2013 06:55:08 -0700 David Guntner dav...@akamail.net wrote: Patrick Bartek grabbed a keyboard and wrote: From: Dave Thayer debian1311420.dmtha...@recursor.net On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 07:44:29PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: How? What MUA did you use? When I initially set up my Yahoo Mail accounts (I have several)--this was years ago--there was no option with the free accounts for POP3 or IMAP. It was specifically said that if you wanted it, you could, [snip] Oddly enough, while Yahoo! charges for POP access, they enable IMAP access on the free accounts. I'm guessing that's for mobile device support. Icedove knows the right thing to do, or look up the instructions on the Yahoo! help pages. Yup. That's a nice loophole they created that works out well for those of us using Thunderbird or other MUAs. :-) Okay. I found the Yahoo IMAP help page. The POP help still states you need a for pay Yahoo Mail Plus account, but no mention of that for IMAP. I'll run a test. I already have Sylpheed on this system, and it is both POP or IMAP compatible. SSL, too. Yahoo supports SSL, so no worries there. I've got it set for imap.mail.yahoo.com on port 993 for SSL/TLS incoming and smtp.mail.yahoo.com on port 465 for SSL/TLS outgoing. Works like a champ. Wow - this works! Now I can finally go back to my long neglected Yahoo! account and try to clean it up. --Dave Celejar -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130426153924.788ae2aa.cele...@gmail.com
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
From: Dave Thayer debian1311420.dmtha...@recursor.net On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 07:44:29PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: How? What MUA did you use? When I initially set up my Yahoo Mail accounts (I have several)--this was years ago--there was no option with the free accounts for POP3 or IMAP. It was specifically said that if you wanted it, you could, [snip] Oddly enough, while Yahoo! charges for POP access, they enable IMAP access on the free accounts. I'm guessing that's for mobile device support. Icedove knows the right thing to do, or look up the instructions on the Yahoo! help pages. Okay. I found the Yahoo IMAP help page. The POP help still states you need a for pay Yahoo Mail Plus account, but no mention of that for IMAP. I'll run a test. I already have Sylpheed on this system, and it is both POP or IMAP compatible. SSL, too. Thanks. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366869768.58099.yahoomail...@web142302.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Wed 24 Apr 2013 at 23:02:48 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: Okay. I found the Yahoo IMAP help page. The POP help still states you need a for pay Yahoo Mail Plus account, but no mention of that for IMAP. I'll run a test. I already have Sylpheed on this system, and it is both POP or IMAP compatible. SSL, too. I've used my traditional MUA with a free account for years. Collecting: brian@desktop:~$ telnet pop.mail.yahoo.co.uk 110 Trying 188.125.69.223... Connected to pop1.mail.vip.ir2.yahoo.com. Escape character is '^]'. +OK hello from popgate-0.8.0.357900 pop010.mail.ir2.yahoo.com user debian-user +OK password required. pass FreeSoftware +OK maildrop ready, 25 messages (206988 octets) (267884) list +OK 25 messages (206988 octets) 1 10887 2 6730 3 5826 etc . Sending: brian@desktop:~$ telnet smtp.mail.yahoo.co.uk 25 Trying 46.228.39.190... Connected to smtp.mail.eu.am0.yahoodns.net. Escape character is '^]'. 220 smtp166.mail.ir2.yahoo.com ESMTP helo example.com 250 smtp166.mail.ir2.yahoo.com mail from: any...@example.com 530 authentication required - for help go to http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/pop/pop-11.html -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130425093945.GC3248@desktop
Re: alternative email clients (was ... Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Thu, 2013-04-25 at 03:27 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote: http://www.yorba.org/projects/geary/ On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 17:38 +0200, Luca Cappelletti wrote: http://trojita.flaska.net/ Thank you, I'll take a look, assumed they are available by the Debian, Ubuntu and Arch repositories. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366883235.707.66.camel@archlinux
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Thu, 2013-04-25 at 11:57 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: When I set up my Rocketmail accounts, Evolution automatically wanted to use IMAP, but I forced to use POP. This are my Rocketmail settings: Server: pop.mail.yahoo.com Port: 995 Security: SSL on a dedicated port Authentication: Password Server: smtp.mail.yahoo.com Port: 465 Security: SSL on a dedicated port Authentication: Login While I can use my Alice account with all MUAs I tested, I didn't get my Rocketmail accounts working with all MUAs. If you'll google, you'll find loads of websites, such as http://email.about.com/od/accessingyahoomail/f/What_Are_the_Yahoo_Mail_POP_Settings.htm At least Rocketmail in Germany is for free as in beer and Rocketmail is Yahoo. PS: IIRC I had to enable something for my accounts on the Rocketmail/Yahoo website. If Yahoo shouldn't be for free as in beer, why not switching to Rocketmail, the name anyway does sound hotter ;). -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366884193.707.80.camel@archlinux
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
When I set up my Rocketmail accounts, Evolution automatically wanted to use IMAP, but I forced to use POP. This are my Rocketmail settings: Server: pop.mail.yahoo.com Port: 995 Security: SSL on a dedicated port Authentication: Password Server: smtp.mail.yahoo.com Port: 465 Security: SSL on a dedicated port Authentication: Login While I can use my Alice account with all MUAs I tested, I didn't get my Rocketmail accounts working with all MUAs. If you'll google, you'll find loads of websites, such as http://email.about.com/od/accessingyahoomail/f/What_Are_the_Yahoo_Mail_POP_Settings.htm At least Rocketmail in Germany is for free as in beer and Rocketmail is Yahoo. Regards, Ralf -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366883851.707.77.camel@archlinux
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Wed, 24 Apr 2013 19:44:29 -0700 (PDT) Patrick Bartek bartek...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello Patrick, How? What MUA did you use? When I initially set up my Yahoo Mail accounts (I have I use Claws Mail which, as you may know, started out as a branch of Sylpheed. Others have listed the settings required and also said that you may well have to enable POP access via your yahoo account's settings pages. Hopefully, you'll be well on the way to sorting things out by the time you see this message. Good luck. -- Regards _ / ) The blindingly obvious is / _)radnever immediately apparent You only see me for the clothes that I wear Public Image - Public Image Ltd signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
Patrick Bartek grabbed a keyboard and wrote: From: Dave Thayer debian1311420.dmtha...@recursor.net On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 07:44:29PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: How? What MUA did you use? When I initially set up my Yahoo Mail accounts (I have several)--this was years ago--there was no option with the free accounts for POP3 or IMAP. It was specifically said that if you wanted it, you could, [snip] Oddly enough, while Yahoo! charges for POP access, they enable IMAP access on the free accounts. I'm guessing that's for mobile device support. Icedove knows the right thing to do, or look up the instructions on the Yahoo! help pages. Yup. That's a nice loophole they created that works out well for those of us using Thunderbird or other MUAs. :-) Okay. I found the Yahoo IMAP help page. The POP help still states you need a for pay Yahoo Mail Plus account, but no mention of that for IMAP. I'll run a test. I already have Sylpheed on this system, and it is both POP or IMAP compatible. SSL, too. Yahoo supports SSL, so no worries there. I've got it set for imap.mail.yahoo.com on port 993 for SSL/TLS incoming and smtp.mail.yahoo.com on port 465 for SSL/TLS outgoing. Works like a champ. --Dave signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Thu, 2013-04-25 at 11:57 +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: When I set up my Rocketmail accounts, Evolution automatically wanted to use IMAP, but I forced to use POP. This are my Rocketmail settings: Server: pop.mail.yahoo.com Port: 995 Security: SSL on a dedicated port Authentication: Password Server: smtp.mail.yahoo.com Port: 465 Security: SSL on a dedicated port Authentication: Login I'd just like to say thanks for all the information in this thread as it finally prompted me to set up my old talk21 email address in my MUA of choice - heirloom-mailx, (talk21 was a email service provided by British Telecom and is now farmed out to Yahoo). IMAP with SSL is working fine but much to my disappointment I could only get SMTP working without SSL (note: I have SSL working fine on other accounts so I think this is a talk21 thing (and a quick google search seems to back me up on this)). Peter -- (\___/) (='.'=) This is Bunny. Copy and paste Bunny into your ()_() signature to help him gain world domination. Alte Amplius et Sine Ratione gopher://sdf.lonestar.org/1/users/happy/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5179d3e4.fmwkbf8yq9s0plbw%ha...@sdf.lonestar.org
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Tue, 2013-04-23 at 21:43 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: If you have any suggestions, I'll consider them. I have no dying loyalty to Yahoo. Stay with Yahoo, but use an MUA. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366783498.699.67.camel@archlinux
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 23 Apr 2013, Robert Holtzman wrote: On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 07:57:11AM +0100, Anthony Campbell wrote: On 22 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. I'm using mutt also but I see no codes. I found out why this was happening; ironically, I had some lines in .muttrc which were supposed to eliminate the problem by translating various codes! I'd put them in about a year ago - don't remember where they came from. Anyway, after I deleted the lines the codes were no longer seen. -- Bob Holtzman If you think you're getting free lunch, check the price of the beer. Key ID: 8D549279 -- Anthony Campbell - a...@acampbell.org.uk http://www.acupuncturecourse.org.uk http://www.smashwords.com/profile.view/acampbell https://itunes.apple.com/ca/artist/anthony-campbell/id73235412 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130424070722.ga4...@acampbell.org.uk
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 23 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: [snip] Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Sorry 'bout that, but there's nothing much I can do about it from my end: It's Yahoo Mail that's the problem. I have my mail set to Plain Text but since this is Web browser-based e-mail I'm sure it's not 100% pure ASCII. I don't even think switching to a real e-mail account would solve the problem. With almost everything these days graphic and web-based, smartphone and tablet, the days of pure ASCII e-mail are gone for the most part. Also, if I reply to a message that is other than plain text, my reply inherits their formatting code. I can switch the reply to plain text, that is, Yahoo's version of plain text, but doing so screws up the formatting and quoting of the original message, and I'm left with the daunting task of manually reformatting it. With short messages, this is inconvenient, but not too much of a problem. However, with a long thread with multiple nested layers of quoting, it is almost impossible to manually correct the formatting. So, I just don't switch to plain text in those cases. Sorry. Hope the problem is solvable from your end. Yes; it wasn't entirely your (or Yahoo's) fault. I had some lines in .muttrc which were meant, ironically, to translate such codes! Deleting them has stopped your codes appearing. -- Anthony Campbell - a...@acampbell.org.uk http://www.acupuncturecourse.org.uk http://www.smashwords.com/profile.view/acampbell https://itunes.apple.com/ca/artist/anthony-campbell/id73235412 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130424071223.gb4...@acampbell.org.uk
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:37:13AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: From: Anthony Campbell a...@acampbell.org.uk On 22 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Sorry 'bout that, but there's nothing much I can do about it from my end: It's Yahoo Mail that's the problem. I have my mail set to Plain Text but since this is Web browser-based e-mail I'm sure it's not 100% pure ASCII. I don't even think switching to a real e-mail account would solve the problem. With almost everything these days graphic and web-based, smartphone and tablet, the days of pure ASCII e-mail are gone for the most part. Actually, you're fine. Your message is sent Quoted-Printable. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is a way to encode 8-bit data (in your case ISO-8859-1) into a 7-bit (ASCII) form. Where you have characters that aren't printable ASCII they're encoded as = followed by the hex code of the character (so =0D=0A is a new line). It's then up to the MUA to decode those characters and (if necessary) transcode the characters from ISO-8859-1 to the user's character set (in my case UTF-8). signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 4/24/13, Ralf Mardorf info.mard...@rocketmail.com wrote: Info: You're free to use Yahoo with a MUA. Take a look at the email address I'm using right now, it's Rocketmail, aka Yahoo, I'm only limited by the pain Evolution and Xfce4, IOW the GNOME crap does cause. What are the pain points/ problems, with evolution? I saw a kickstarter project to create a new alternative to Evolution (or progress some alternative to it), and then, as now, I'm wondering why they don't enhance Evolution, why start anew? TIA Zenaan -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/CAOsGNSSOXxn+x6A-Yg+8zWKMvtDkV8PuDp2=PWOjY=cghr4...@mail.gmail.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 22:59 +1000, Zenaan Harkness wrote: On 4/24/13, Ralf Mardorf info.mard...@rocketmail.com wrote: Info: You're free to use Yahoo with a MUA. Take a look at the email address I'm using right now, it's Rocketmail, aka Yahoo, I'm only limited by the pain Evolution and Xfce4, IOW the GNOME crap does cause. What are the pain points/ problems, with evolution? I saw a kickstarter project to create a new alternative to Evolution (or progress some alternative to it), and then, as now, I'm wondering why they don't enhance Evolution, why start anew? TIA Zenaan Copy and paste sometimes doesn't work correctly. It can crash, if a server isn't accessible. It does mark mails as read, if you switch between folders. The GUI often is disgusting broken. It has a very unique maildir, that can't be shared with other MUAs. Depending to the update, it could happen, that it doesn't transform correctly from ISO to UTF and vice versa. Etc. pp. OTOH, I didn't find another mailer that fit halfway to my needs and that does work with the provider settings I need. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366810361.31383.32.camel@archlinux
alternative email clients (was ... Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 03:32:41PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: OTOH, I didn't find another mailer that fit halfway to my needs and that does work with the provider settings I need. There is geary. http://www.yorba.org/projects/geary/ I've never used it, myself, but it is an alternative to consider. -- If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130424152708.GA11946@tal
Re: alternative email clients (was ... Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 5:27 PM, Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz wrote: On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 03:32:41PM +0200, Ralf Mardorf wrote: OTOH, I didn't find another mailer that fit halfway to my needs and that does work with the provider settings I need. There is geary. http://www.yorba.org/projects/geary/ I've never used it, myself, but it is an alternative to consider. have a try with: http://trojita.flaska.net/ minimalistic but it's working for me...fast and furious IMAP client Luca
MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
From: Ralf Mardorf info.mard...@rocketmail.com On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 10:28 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote: Are you *really* forced into using yahoo, it really is horrible (not sure which is worse hotmail or yahoo.) for communicating on mailing lists. Info: You're free to use Yahoo with a MUA. Take a look at the email address I'm using right now, it's Rocketmail, aka Yahoo, I'm only limited by the pain Evolution and Xfce4, IOW the GNOME crap does cause. As far as I understand, with the free Yahoo Mail that I use, you're not able to use a traditional MUA. It's browser-based only. However, if you use the pay version, which is IMAP or POP-based, you can use any MUA you want. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366824825.56116.yahoomail...@web142303.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
From: Ralf Mardorf ralf.mard...@alice-dsl.net On Tue, 2013-04-23 at 21:43 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: If you have any suggestions, I'll consider them. I have no dying loyalty to Yahoo. Stay with Yahoo, but use an MUA. Can't use an MUA with the free version of Yahoo Mail. Browser only. At least, that's what Yahoo said when I set up the account 6 or 7 years ago. Maybe, they've changed it. I'll check. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366825029.67895.yahoomail...@web142303.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
From: Anthony Campbell a...@acampbell.org.uk On 23 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: [snip] Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes [snip] Hope the problem is solvable from your end. Yes; it wasn't entirely your (or Yahoo's) fault. I had some lines in .muttrc which were meant, ironically, to translate such codes! Deleting them has stopped your codes appearing. Glad to hear you've solved your problem. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366825228.74060.yahoomail...@web142303.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Wed, 24 Apr 2013 10:33:45 -0700 (PDT) Patrick Bartek bartek...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello Patrick, As far as I understand, with the free Yahoo Mail that I use, you're not able to use a traditional MUA. It's browser-based only. However, if you use the pay version, which is IMAP or POP-based, you can use any MUA you want. I never paid yahoo a penny, and was able to use a real MUA without problem. -- Regards _ / ) The blindingly obvious is / _)radnever immediately apparent Now I found you out, I don't think you're so smart Who Are You - Black Sabbath signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
From: Brad Rogers b...@fineby.me.uk On Wed, 24 Apr 2013 10:33:45 -0700 (PDT) Patrick Bartek bartek...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello Patrick, As far as I understand, with the free Yahoo Mail that I use, you're not able to use a traditional MUA. It's browser-based only. However, if you use the pay version, which is IMAP or POP-based, you can use any MUA you want. I never paid yahoo a penny, and was able to use a real MUA without problem. How? What MUA did you use? When I initially set up my Yahoo Mail accounts (I have several)--this was years ago--there was no option with the free accounts for POP3 or IMAP. It was specifically said that if you wanted it, you could, for a small yearly fee--I think it was $20 or $25 US--get it. I've just been to one of my Yahoo accounts and I can't find any info on POP or SMTP server names, etc. Maybe, Yahoo is different in the UK. I'll continue to investigate. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366857869.67371.yahoomail...@web142304.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: MUA Yahoo Mail (WAS:Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 07:44:29PM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: How? What MUA did you use? When I initially set up my Yahoo Mail accounts (I have several)--this was years ago--there was no option with the free accounts for POP3 or IMAP. It was specifically said that if you wanted it, you could, for a small yearly fee--I think it was $20 or $25 US--get it. I've just been to one of my Yahoo accounts and I can't find any info on POP or SMTP server names, etc. Maybe, Yahoo is different in the UK. I'll continue to investigate. Oddly enough, while Yahoo! charges for POP access, they enable IMAP access on the free accounts. I'm guessing that's for mobile device support. Icedove knows the right thing to do, or look up the instructions on the Yahoo! help pages. dt -- Dave Thayer | Whenever you read a good book, it's like the Denver, Colorado USA | author is right there, in the room talking to d...@thayer-boyle.com | you, which is why I don't like to read | good books. - Jack Handey Deep Thoughts -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130425045230.ga26...@thayer-boyle.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 22 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Regards, Anthony -- Anthony Campbell - a...@acampbell.org.uk http://www.acampbell.org.uk http://www.reviewbooks.org.uk http://www.skepticviews.org.uk http://www.acupuncturecourse.org.uk http://www.smashwords.com/profile.view/acampbell https://itunes.apple.com/ca/artist/anthony-campbell/id73235412 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130423065711.ge...@acampbell.org.uk
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 2013-04-23 07:57:11 +0100, Anthony Campbell wrote: On 22 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Strange. I also use Mutt (with various patches) and I don't see any problem with Patrick's mail. -- Vincent Lefèvre vinc...@vinc17.net - Web: http://www.vinc17.net/ 100% accessible validated (X)HTML - Blog: http://www.vinc17.net/blog/ Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / AriC project (LIP, ENS-Lyon) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130423085830.gb22...@xvii.vinc17.org
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 23 Apr 2013, Vincent Lefevre wrote: Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Strange. I also use Mutt (with various patches) and I don't see any problem with Patrick's mail. Interesting. After some experimenting, it seems that there is something in my .muttrc that is causing this, since if I don't use the configuration file the codes disappear. I shall have to look into this. -- Anthony Campbell - a...@acampbell.org.uk http://www.acampbell.org.uk http://www.reviewbooks.org.uk http://www.skepticviews.org.uk http://www.acupuncturecourse.org.uk http://www.smashwords.com/profile.view/acampbell https://itunes.apple.com/ca/artist/anthony-campbell/id73235412 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130423101010.ga3...@acampbell.org.uk
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
From: Anthony Campbell a...@acampbell.org.uk On 22 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Sorry 'bout that, but there's nothing much I can do about it from my end: It's Yahoo Mail that's the problem. I have my mail set to Plain Text but since this is Web browser-based e-mail I'm sure it's not 100% pure ASCII. I don't even think switching to a real e-mail account would solve the problem. With almost everything these days graphic and web-based, smartphone and tablet, the days of pure ASCII e-mail are gone for the most part. Also, if I reply to a message that is other than plain text, my reply inherits their formatting code. I can switch the reply to plain text, that is, Yahoo's version of plain text, but doing so screws up the formatting and quoting of the original message, and I'm left with the daunting task of manually reformatting it. With short messages, this is inconvenient, but not too much of a problem. However, with a long thread with multiple nested layers of quoting, it is almost impossible to manually correct the formatting. So, I just don't switch to plain text in those cases. Sorry. Hope the problem is solvable from your end. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366742233.70023.yahoomail...@web142306.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Tue, 2013-04-23 at 11:37 -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: With almost everything these days graphic and web-based, smartphone and tablet, the days of pure ASCII e-mail are gone for the most part. No, the experiment HTML email miserably failed, that's why more and more people switch to plain text nowadays. Smileys from Windows users easily become cryptic text on other OS, since not everybody wishes to install Windows fonts. However, there are more serious issues with HTML emails. -- ASCII Ribbon Campaign http://www.asciiribbon.org/index.php -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366743024.699.8.camel@archlinux
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 07:57:11AM +0100, Anthony Campbell wrote: On 22 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. I'm using mutt also but I see no codes. -- Bob Holtzman If you think you're getting free lunch, check the price of the beer. Key ID: 8D549279 signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Tue, 23 Apr 2013 11:37:13 -0700 (PDT) Patrick Bartek bartek...@yahoo.com wrote: Snip Hope the problem is solvable from your end. Easy solution: Kill file. Bye. -- cmg -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130423151912.174735d6.cgrigs...@att.net
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 4/23/2013 15:19, Carroll Grigsby wrote: On Tue, 23 Apr 2013 11:37:13 -0700 (PDT) Patrick Bartek bartek...@yahoo.com wrote: Snip Hope the problem is solvable from your end. Easy solution: Kill file. Bye. -- cmg Seems like overkill. -- staticsafe O ascii ribbon campaign - stop html mail - www.asciiribbon.org Please don't top post - http://goo.gl/YrmAb Don't CC me! I'm subscribed to whatever list I just posted on. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/51770233.50...@staticsafe.ca
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:37:13AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: From: Anthony Campbell a...@acampbell.org.uk On 22 Apr 2013, Patrick Bartek wrote: It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Sorry 'bout that, but there's nothing much I can do about it from my end: It's Yahoo Mail that's the problem. If it hurts then stop doing it! :-) Are you *really* forced into using yahoo, it really is horrible (not sure which is worse hotmail or yahoo.) for communicating on mailing lists. -- If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130423222821.GE28529@tal
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
From: Chris Bannister cbannis...@slingshot.co.nz On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 11:37:13AM -0700, Patrick Bartek wrote: From: Anthony Campbell a...@acampbell.org.uk [snip] Another problem is that your posts are peppered with lots of codes which make them annoying to read on a text-based email reader like mutt. Sorry 'bout that, but there's nothing much I can do about it from my end: It's Yahoo Mail that's the problem. If it hurts then stop doing it! :-) Are you *really* forced into using yahoo, it really is horrible (not sure which is worse hotmail or yahoo.) for communicating on mailing lists. Forced? No. But circumstances do limit my choices of an e-mail provider to post to public forums. And Yahoo Mail is no worse than the others. If you have any suggestions, I'll consider them. I have no dying loyalty to Yahoo. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366778583.84859.yahoomail...@web142302.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Wed, 2013-04-24 at 10:28 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote: Are you *really* forced into using yahoo, it really is horrible (not sure which is worse hotmail or yahoo.) for communicating on mailing lists. Info: You're free to use Yahoo with a MUA. Take a look at the email address I'm using right now, it's Rocketmail, aka Yahoo, I'm only limited by the pain Evolution and Xfce4, IOW the GNOME crap does cause. I hope I find replacements for Evolution and Xfce4 ASAP, however, Yahoo doesn't cause issues. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366782098.699.60.camel@archlinux
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
- Original Message - From: Jochen Spieker m...@well-adjusted.de To: debian-user@lists.debian.org Cc: Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2013 2:25 AM Subject: Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which? Patrick Bartek: I've been using Wheezy 64-bit for several months now, and as recommended[1] having been using dist-upgrade for upgrading it. My sources-list[2] is set to Wheezy and not testing as per those same instructions. When Wheezy is promoted to Stable should I switch to apt-get upgrade instead? Or does it really matter all that much? The main difference to keep in mind is that apt-get's upgrade operation will never change the set of installed packages. Ever. It will only upgrade already installed packages. No removals, no new packages. Yes. I am aware of this. But it occurred to me: Once Wheezy becomes Stable, the only changes made to its code will be security and bug fixes. So, even a dist-upgrade should have the same effect as upgrade. At least, as far as the Main repository is concerned. Right? Contrib, nonfree or 3rd party repos might have a different effect. As the stable distribution mainly receives security updates, performing an upgrade is enough most of the time. (Point releases might be different.) [snip] To put it short: irrespective of Debian flavour, my advice is to habitually perform upgrades and only use dist-upgrade when you see it is actually necessary in order to upgrade certain packages. This is something I'd been thinking about. What overall affect would mixing upgrade and dist-upgrade, if even only for select packages, have on a Stable system? Could that possibly break it? It was one of the reasons for my initial inquiry. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366610886.88484.yahoomail...@web142303.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
Patrick Bartek: - Original Message - From: Jochen Spieker m...@well-adjusted.de To: debian-user@lists.debian.org Cc: Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2013 2:25 AM Subject: Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which? It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. The main difference to keep in mind is that apt-get's upgrade operation will never change the set of installed packages. Ever. It will only upgrade already installed packages. No removals, no new packages. Yes. I am aware of this. But it occurred to me: Once Wheezy becomes Stable, the only changes made to its code will be security and bug fixes. So, even a dist-upgrade should have the same effect as upgrade. At least, as far as the Main repository is concerned. Right? Contrib, nonfree or 3rd party repos might have a different effect. Yes. To put it short: irrespective of Debian flavour, my advice is to habitually perform upgrades and only use dist-upgrade when you see it is actually necessary in order to upgrade certain packages. This is something I'd been thinking about. What overall affect would mixing upgrade and dist-upgrade, if even only for select packages, have on a Stable system? Could that possibly break it? It was one of the reasons for my initial inquiry. I don't really understand the question. You can always mix upgrade and dist-upgrade, irrespective of the flavour in use. There is no magic involved here. Dist-upgrades are potentially harmful if you do not look closely what apt is about to do before confirming its actions. That's it. J. -- Nothing is as I planned it. [Agree] [Disagree] http://www.slowlydownward.com/NODATA/data_enter2.html signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Why Wheezy and Not Just Testing? (WAS: Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?)
- Original Message - From: Gary Dale garyd...@rogers.com To: debian-user@lists.debian.org Cc: debian-user@lists.debian.org debian-user@lists.debian.org Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2013 5:03 AM Subject: Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which? [snip] As for staying with Wheezy, why? I normally wait 3 - 6 months then switch to the new testing. This gives the developers time to fix the teething problems with all the new stuff that was held from Wheezy while it was being stabilized. By the time Wheezy becomes stable, the rest of the Linux world has moved on. Why go with Wheezy and not Testing? Already did that. Sort of. I used to use Fedora (beginning with Core 3 about 8 or 9 years ago), which is pretty much like Testing. I soon tired of Fedora's 6 month release-13 month End of Life cycles, BUT hardware and software were changing fast, and the rapid cycle was needed THEN. On every new version upgrade via clean install (Fedora's in situ upgrade procedure just didn't work--then), it took a couple months tweaking to get everything working well. I use computers in my work, but computers are not my work. I hated the waste of time. Finally, after putting up with this for a couple of years and to reduce the tweaking time, starting with FC6, I began upgrading only every 3rd release--6 to 9 to 12. This scenerio worked okay, except it lacked a support life longer than 13 months. I needed something with a longer life! I stayed with F12 almost 2 and a half years past its EOL. I didn't like F15, my next usual upgrade, or the following releases, or the direction Fedora was going. So, I opted against upgrading, but 12 was having problems. Time for a new OS. So, after some research, I decided on Debian mainly for its stability and 5+ year support life which is about the same interval I tend to build a new system. Squeeze, my initial choice, was about as old as F12, so it was out of the running: If I were going to keep the same OS for 5 years, I would need a much newer kernel among other things. I installed Wheezy Testing a few months ago as a dual boot with F12 to see if it would suit my needs. It has. And it is now my primary OS. Just waiting for it to become Stable. I'll enjoy having a system that just works, and doesn't need periodic tweaking to keep it so. Testing is what would be released with most other Linux distros. Unless you need the rock-solid stability of stable, i'd recommend spending most of your time with testing. Been there, done that with Fedora. Never again. On 21/04/13 12:29 AM, Patrick Bartek wrote: I've been using Wheezy 64-bit for several months now, and as recommended[1] having been using dist-upgrade for upgrading it. My sources-list[2] is set to Wheezy and not testing as per those same instructions. When Wheezy is promoted to Stable should I switch to apt-get upgrade instead? Or does it really matter all that much? This is my personal system, a desktop, and not a server. I intend to stay with Wheezy on this machine for the next 3 to 5 years. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366617821.99108.yahoomail...@web142304.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 04/21/2013 09:30 PM, Chris Bannister wrote: On Sun, Apr 21, 2013 at 06:41:43PM +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote: I always use dist-upgrade but there's not a lot a choose. Upgrade upgrades installed packages while dist-upgrade can make more significant changes. Once Wheezy becomes stable the two should do the same thing. However, I prefer to stay in the habit of using dist-upgrade (or full-upgrade for aptitude). The point is, you are *SAFER* using upgrade. Using dist-upgrade can remove half your sysytem before you can say OMG! I recommend that new users follow Jochen's advice. This might only apply to Ubuntu but I am sure I have had packages such as kernels with security related updates that needed dist-upgrade to install. I don't use Ubuntu, so wouldn't know. This may happen, sure. In that case it is obvious. But I think you are missing the point as to why it is better to do an upgrade first *THEN IF NECESSARY* do dist-upgrade. So perhaps safer isn't quite the right word. No. safer is the right word! where safe means idiot-proof, but not vandal-proof? -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/kl2s50$u5i$1...@ger.gmane.org
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
- Original Message - Patrick Bartek: - Original Message - From: Jochen Spieker m...@well-adjusted.de To: debian-user@lists.debian.org Cc: Sent: Sunday, April 21, 2013 2:25 AM Subject: Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which? It would be nice if you could trim that to one line. [snip] Yes, it would, but I use Yahoo mail for this list, and that is Yahoo's reply header. I cannot have my own custom reply header, nor can I opt not to have one at all. At least, not that I've been able to find in the Mail Settings. I can, however, edit or erase it from any reply as I did above, but sometimes I forget. B -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366647381.10866.yahoomail...@web142301.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
Patrick Bartek: I've been using Wheezy 64-bit for several months now, and as recommended[1] having been using dist-upgrade for upgrading it. My sources-list[2] is set to Wheezy and not testing as per those same instructions. When Wheezy is promoted to Stable should I switch to apt-get upgrade instead? Or does it really matter all that much? The main difference to keep in mind is that apt-get's upgrade operation will never change the set of installed packages. Ever. It will only upgrade already installed packages. No removals, no new packages. As the stable distribution mainly receives security updates, performing an upgrade is enough most of the time. (Point releases might be different.) I am running sid and habitually only run 'apt-get upgrade' because it is a quite safe thing to do. You can find many threads on debian-user from people who involuntarily removed half of their Gnome desktop because they didn't look closely what their dist-upgrade was about to do. This cannot happen when you only use the upgrade method. To put it short: irrespective of Debian flavour, my advice is to habitually perform upgrades and only use dist-upgrade when you see it is actually necessary in order to upgrade certain packages. J. -- I have been manipulated and permanently distorted. [Agree] [Disagree] http://www.slowlydownward.com/NODATA/data_enter2.html signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
I always use dist-upgrade but there's not a lot a choose. Upgrade upgrades installed packages while dist-upgrade can make more significant changes. Once Wheezy becomes stable the two should do the same thing. However, I prefer to stay in the habit of using dist-upgrade (or full-upgrade for aptitude). As for staying with Wheezy, why? I normally wait 3 - 6 months then switch to the new testing. This gives the developers time to fix the teething problems with all the new stuff that was held from Wheezy while it was being stabilized. By the time Wheezy becomes stable, the rest of the Linux world has moved on. Testing is what would be released with most other Linux distros. Unless you need the rock-solid stability of stable, i'd recommend spending most of your time with testing. On 21/04/13 12:29 AM, Patrick Bartek wrote: I've been using Wheezy 64-bit for several months now, and as recommended[1] having been using dist-upgrade for upgrading it. My sources-list[2] is set to Wheezy and not testing as per those same instructions. When Wheezy is promoted to Stable should I switch to apt-get upgrade instead? Or does it really matter all that much? This is my personal system, a desktop, and not a server. I intend to stay with Wheezy on this machine for the next 3 to 5 years. B [1] http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTesting [2] deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main contrib non-free deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy-updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy-updates main contrib non-free deb http://security.debian.org/ wheezy/updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://security.debian.org/ wheezy/updates main contrib non-free deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ wheezy-backports main contrib non-free deb http://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/debian wheezy contrib -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/5173d588.7050...@rogers.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Sun, Apr 21, 2013 at 08:03:20AM -0400, Gary Dale wrote: I always use dist-upgrade but there's not a lot a choose. Upgrade upgrades installed packages while dist-upgrade can make more significant changes. Once Wheezy becomes stable the two should do the same thing. However, I prefer to stay in the habit of using dist-upgrade (or full-upgrade for aptitude). The point is, you are *SAFER* using upgrade. Using dist-upgrade can remove half your sysytem before you can say OMG! I recommend that new users follow Jochen's advice. -- If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130421160318.GB1290@tal
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
I always use dist-upgrade but there's not a lot a choose. Upgrade upgrades installed packages while dist-upgrade can make more significant changes. Once Wheezy becomes stable the two should do the same thing. However, I prefer to stay in the habit of using dist-upgrade (or full-upgrade for aptitude). The point is, you are *SAFER* using upgrade. Using dist-upgrade can remove half your sysytem before you can say OMG! I recommend that new users follow Jochen's advice. This might only apply to Ubuntu but I am sure I have had packages such as kernels with security related updates that needed dist-upgrade to install. So perhaps safer isn't quite the right word. I usually use dist-upgrade and I wonder if using upgrade will allow me to install updates without pulling in jockey and so polkit for steam-launcher. Of course it is no fix but will allow me to stay secure and ignore the problem for now until I do need a dist-upgrade or use equiv. -- ___ 'Write programs that do one thing and do it well. Write programs to work together. Write programs to handle text streams, because that is a universal interface' (Doug McIlroy) ___ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130421184143.3fe98...@kc-sys.chadwicks.me.uk
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Sun, Apr 21, 2013 at 06:41:43PM +0100, Kevin Chadwick wrote: I always use dist-upgrade but there's not a lot a choose. Upgrade upgrades installed packages while dist-upgrade can make more significant changes. Once Wheezy becomes stable the two should do the same thing. However, I prefer to stay in the habit of using dist-upgrade (or full-upgrade for aptitude). The point is, you are *SAFER* using upgrade. Using dist-upgrade can remove half your sysytem before you can say OMG! I recommend that new users follow Jochen's advice. This might only apply to Ubuntu but I am sure I have had packages such as kernels with security related updates that needed dist-upgrade to install. I don't use Ubuntu, so wouldn't know. This may happen, sure. In that case it is obvious. But I think you are missing the point as to why it is better to do an upgrade first *THEN IF NECESSARY* do dist-upgrade. So perhaps safer isn't quite the right word. No. safer is the right word! -- If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing. --- Malcolm X -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130421193030.GA5971@tal
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On Sunday 21 April 2013 17:03:18 Chris Bannister wrote: Using dist-upgrade can remove half your sysytem before you can say OMG! I use aptitude not apt-get, so cannot comment on apt-get, but the aptitude full-upgrade command does nothing without asking first, so there is no question of it removing half your system before you can say OMG. I therefore only use safe upgrade when I want to do at least a partial upgrade but do not want something specific removed which full-upgrade is threatening to remove. Lisi -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/201304212252.39294.lisi.re...@gmail.com
Re: Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
On 2013-04-21 22:52:39 +0100, Lisi Reisz wrote: On Sunday 21 April 2013 17:03:18 Chris Bannister wrote: Using dist-upgrade can remove half your sysytem before you can say OMG! I use aptitude not apt-get, so cannot comment on apt-get, but the aptitude full-upgrade command does nothing without asking first, so there is no question of it removing half your system before you can say OMG. Ditto with apt-get when packages need to be installed or removed in addition to those listed on the command line. -- Vincent Lefèvre vinc...@vinc17.net - Web: http://www.vinc17.net/ 100% accessible validated (X)HTML - Blog: http://www.vinc17.net/blog/ Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / AriC project (LIP, ENS-Lyon) -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20130421223739.gh9...@xvii.vinc17.org
Dist-upgrade or upgrade. Which?
I've been using Wheezy 64-bit for several months now, and as recommended[1] having been using dist-upgrade for upgrading it. My sources-list[2] is set to Wheezy and not testing as per those same instructions. When Wheezy is promoted to Stable should I switch to apt-get upgrade instead? Or does it really matter all that much? This is my personal system, a desktop, and not a server. I intend to stay with Wheezy on this machine for the next 3 to 5 years. B [1] http://wiki.debian.org/DebianTesting [2] deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy main contrib non-free deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy-updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/ wheezy-updates main contrib non-free deb http://security.debian.org/ wheezy/updates main contrib non-free deb-src http://security.debian.org/ wheezy/updates main contrib non-free deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian/ wheezy-backports main contrib non-free deb http://download.virtualbox.org/virtualbox/debian wheezy contrib -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/1366518577.4.yahoomail...@web142301.mail.bf1.yahoo.com
