Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[G4GNX]

I can’t find the original ad now, but I’m sure it doesn’t indicate that there 
are more than 3 toroids.

As you’ve bought a kit, I tend to believe you and agree with your comments.

73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700




> On 14 Mar 2024, at 14:51, Gregory Mitchell  wrote:
> 
> It's actually 24 pieces of ferrite, not 3, if you read the description. Good 
> quality ferrite is not cheap and I don't think the markup here is outlandish 
> at all. at $5/each on avg you'd still spend $120. I recently bought this kit 
> from them, with free shipping, so I think the cost per toroid/snap-on is 
> reasonable considering Palomar Engineers gets quality, known ferrite mixes vs 
> others who you don't know what you are getting.


__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[John Stengrevics]

Tie wraps work also.

John
WA1EAZ

> On Mar 14, 2024, at 10:59 AM, jerry  wrote:
> 
> On 2024-03-14 07:51, Gregory Mitchell wrote:
> 
>> think the cost per toroid/snap-on
> 
> Here's something I found out about snap-on ferrites:  Don't depend on the 
> plastic shell.  I had installed snap-ons
> on the power leads of my homebrew LDMOS linear.  When I transmitted, I could 
> hear my voice coming out of the box.
> It was the ferrites buzzing.  I popped them apart, reinstalled with a drop of 
> cyanoacrylate glue on each surface, and
> all was well.
> 
> - Jerry, KF6VB
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to jstengrev...@comcast.net

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[jerry]

On 2024-03-14 07:51, Gregory Mitchell wrote:


think the cost per toroid/snap-on


Here's something I found out about snap-on ferrites:  Don't depend on 
the plastic shell.  I had installed snap-ons
on the power leads of my homebrew LDMOS linear.  When I transmitted, I 
could hear my voice coming out of the box.
It was the ferrites buzzing.  I popped them apart, reinstalled with a 
drop of cyanoacrylate glue on each surface, and

all was well.

 - Jerry, KF6VB
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Gregory Mitchell]

It's actually 24 pieces of ferrite, not 3, if you read the description. Good 
quality ferrite is not cheap and I don't think the markup here is outlandish at 
all. at $5/each on avg you'd still spend $120. I recently bought this kit from 
them, with free shipping, so I think the cost per toroid/snap-on is reasonable 
considering Palomar Engineers gets quality, known ferrite mixes vs others who 
you don't know what you are getting.
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Edward Mccann]

Complete with ICOM drink coaster.
AG6CX


> On Mar 13, 2024, at 8:34 AM, Kurt Pawlikowski  wrote:
> 
> Petr,
> 
> Holy guacamole Bat Man!
> 
> kurtt WB9FMC
> 
>> On 3/12/24 12:05, Petr Ourednik wrote:
>> Here is what I am talking about:
>> 
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/116082357701?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D777008%26algo%3DPERSONAL.TOPIC%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20230811123856%26meid%3D829caffc5c83464ea264bd0e387c3fc4%26pid%3D101770%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D1%26itm%3D116082357701%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D4375194%26algv%3DRecentlyViewedItemsV2%26brand%3DElecraft&_trksid=p4375194.c101770.m146925&_trkparms=parentrq%3A339f2a7c18e0a550b8bef368437e%7Cpageci%3A8d03138e-e092-11ee-85ee-76eb76f9a600%7Ciid%3A1%7Cvlpname%3Avlp_homepage
>> 
>> 73 - Petr, OK1RP
>> http://ok1rp.blogspot.com
>> K3 #0778 | K2 # 4800 | K1 #1031 | KX3 # 0602
>> __
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to ku...@pinrod.com
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to edwmcc...@gmail.com
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Kurt Pawlikowski]

Petr,

    Holy guacamole Bat Man!

    kurtt WB9FMC

On 3/12/24 12:05, Petr Ourednik wrote:

Here is what I am talking about:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/116082357701?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D777008%26algo%3DPERSONAL.TOPIC%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20230811123856%26meid%3D829caffc5c83464ea264bd0e387c3fc4%26pid%3D101770%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D1%26itm%3D116082357701%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D4375194%26algv%3DRecentlyViewedItemsV2%26brand%3DElecraft&_trksid=p4375194.c101770.m146925&_trkparms=parentrq%3A339f2a7c18e0a550b8bef368437e%7Cpageci%3A8d03138e-e092-11ee-85ee-76eb76f9a600%7Ciid%3A1%7Cvlpname%3Avlp_homepage

73 - Petr, OK1RP
http://ok1rp.blogspot.com
K3 #0778 | K2 # 4800 | K1 #1031 | KX3 # 0602
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to ku...@pinrod.com

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Edward Mccann]


Not too worry fellas, the posting notes there are only ten kits available. That 
means the fools errand will have been run by at least ten gullible hams before 
the stock is exhausted.  

The vendor will be up $1500 less whatever he drew from his junk box to complete 
the order.

The Greater Fool Theory meets Maxwell.

Best from the West, 

Ed McCann
AG6CX

> On Mar 12, 2024, at 2:07 PM, Dave (NK7Z)  wrote:
> Alan,
> 
> You are correct, 100%!!  If you want to dupe that kit, buy three FT-240-31 
> cores, and wrap 12 turns of RG-400 around two core.
> 
> The cores are around 6 bucks each, and the RG-400 is around $1.25 a foot...
> 
> Put one core at the feedpoint of your antenna, one at the rig, (probably 
> won't need that one), and then take the third one and wrap 10 to 15 turns of 
> your 12 volt power around it and put it close to the K4.  That will end most 
> of the common mode issues...
> 
> 73, and thanks,
> Dave (NK7Z)
> https://www.nk7z.net
> ARRL Volunteer Examiner
> ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
> ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources
> 
> On 3/12/24 08:12, G4GNX wrote:
>> It’s a no-brainer. That ad is for an RFI kit only. My question is: Are 3 
>> toroids and some bits of wire worth $150?
>> Unless I was severely disabled, blind or exceptionally lazy, I’d be ashamed 
>> to buy that item!
>> 73,
>> Alan - G4GNX
>> South Coast UK
>> Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700
>> 73,
>> Alan - G4GNX
>> South Coast UK
>> Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700
>>> On 12 Mar 2024, at 13:42, Kurt Pawlikowski  wrote:
>>> Petr,
>>> Looking at the only listing for anything "K4," I found this 
>>> .
>>>  If that's what you're looking at, it's an "RFI Kit" for a K4, I don't 
>>> think it includes the K4 itself! {'-)
>>> kurtt WB9FMC
>> __
>> Elecraft mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to d...@nk7z.net
> __
> Elecraft mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to edwmcc...@gmail.com
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[John Oppenheimer]

So that there's no confusion, will you post one of the PDF file links
here. John KN5L

On 3/12/24 4:24 PM, Jim Brown wrote:
> On 3/12/2024 12:29 PM, John Oppenheimer wrote:
>> Did you measure a Choke Balun, or sometimes known as Common Code Choke
> 
> "The book" are in several pdf applications notes on my website. What I 
> measured is well documented there
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Jim Brown]

On 3/12/2024 12:29 PM, John Oppenheimer wrote:

Did you measure a Choke Balun, or sometimes known as Common Code Choke


"The book" are in several pdf applications notes on my website. What I 
measured is well documented there.


73, Jim K9YC
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Dave (NK7Z)]

Alan,

You are correct, 100%!!  If you want to dupe that kit, buy three 
FT-240-31 cores, and wrap 12 turns of RG-400 around two core.


The cores are around 6 bucks each, and the RG-400 is around $1.25 a foot...

Put one core at the feedpoint of your antenna, one at the rig, (probably 
won't need that one), and then take the third one and wrap 10 to 15 
turns of your 12 volt power around it and put it close to the K4.  That 
will end most of the common mode issues...


73, and thanks,
Dave (NK7Z)
https://www.nk7z.net
ARRL Volunteer Examiner
ARRL Technical Specialist, RFI
ARRL Asst. Director, NW Division, Technical Resources

On 3/12/24 08:12, G4GNX wrote:

It’s a no-brainer. That ad is for an RFI kit only. My question is: Are 3 
toroids and some bits of wire worth $150?

Unless I was severely disabled, blind or exceptionally lazy, I’d be ashamed to 
buy that item!

73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700


73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700





On 12 Mar 2024, at 13:42, Kurt Pawlikowski  wrote:

Petr,

 Looking at the only listing for anything "K4," I found this 
.
 If that's what you're looking at, it's an "RFI Kit" for a K4, I don't think it includes the K4 itself! 
{'-)

 kurtt WB9FMC



__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to d...@nk7z.net

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[John Oppenheimer]

On 3/12/24 1:31 PM, Jim Brown wrote:
> I wrote the book on this. k9yc.com/RFI-Ham.pdf

Hi Jim, there are a bunch of inductor measurements within the book.

Did you measure a Choke Balun, or sometimes known as Common Code Choke
(CMC)?

John KN5L
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Jim Brown]

On 3/12/2024 9:29 AM, jerry wrote:

On 2024-03-12 08:56, ev...@pa2kw.com wrote:

If someone could tell what manufacture/type/model these cores are, I'm
sure you can get this done for $20



*** Generally, it's well known what mix is required.  Here's a good 
article by Palomar Labs:


https://palomar-engineers.com/ferrite-products/ferrite-cores/ferrite-mix-selection


These people have NO CLUE about how ferrites work at HF. This piece is 
useless!


I wrote the book on this. k9yc.com/RFI-Ham.pdf

73, Jim K9YC





__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Petr Ourednik]

Here is what I am talking about:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/116082357701?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D777008%26algo%3DPERSONAL.TOPIC%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20230811123856%26meid%3D829caffc5c83464ea264bd0e387c3fc4%26pid%3D101770%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D1%26itm%3D116082357701%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D4375194%26algv%3DRecentlyViewedItemsV2%26brand%3DElecraft&_trksid=p4375194.c101770.m146925&_trkparms=parentrq%3A339f2a7c18e0a550b8bef368437e%7Cpageci%3A8d03138e-e092-11ee-85ee-76eb76f9a600%7Ciid%3A1%7Cvlpname%3Avlp_homepage

73 - Petr, OK1RP
http://ok1rp.blogspot.com
K3 #0778 | K2 # 4800 | K1 #1031 | KX3 # 0602
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[jerry]

On 2024-03-12 08:56, ev...@pa2kw.com wrote:

If someone could tell what manufacture/type/model these cores are, I'm
sure you can get this done for $20



*** Generally, it's well known what mix is required.  Here's a good 
article by Palomar Labs:


https://palomar-engineers.com/ferrite-products/ferrite-cores/ferrite-mix-selection


 - Jerry, KF6VB
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[evert]

If someone could tell what manufacture/type/model these cores are, I'm sure you 
can get this done for $20


73, Evert

PA2KW / 5T2KW / W8S 

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net  On 
Behalf Of G4GNX
Sent: Tuesday, 12 March 2024 16:13
To: Elecraft Reflector 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

It’s a no-brainer. That ad is for an RFI kit only. My question is: Are 3 
toroids and some bits of wire worth $150?

Unless I was severely disabled, blind or exceptionally lazy, I’d be ashamed to 
buy that item!

73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700


73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700




> On 12 Mar 2024, at 13:42, Kurt Pawlikowski  wrote:
> 
> Petr,
> 
> Looking at the only listing for anything "K4," I found this 
> <https://www.ebay.com/itm/204318009997?itmmeta=01HRSE265CV1YJX0XQ8K8HA
> GRW=item2f924d6a8d:g:bzEAAOSwiatkSVBn=enc%3AAQAI0JHSyy
> PQ1ljDZDKiIlX2UrjAtz%2BoiTfl74GzI6wJx0HUam1ARJ9Bwh9q7x0TfNhQeA1rBlInkr
> APU6E2bEy5%2BSblGHLv6flCWtN5k5hLWLjCkWWLRQHSJxN9SxPqwibj0a1qfu%2FDhguw
> za7YsjNhNg%2Bkwb077Dm%2BxB1bw0i0Yg07EneSyp3Ea5R8f%2FLltGGy0yxXcOP%2Bk5
> mL8MIlC3Y%2BhHUgH3mpQHc%2Fno6vxRgxpc5WCBkMrdBmxZnke5pMRsQjfYfnjJzJcjKM
> 9PR11H4uavs%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR-jiiK7GYw>. If that's what you're looking 
> at, it's an "RFI Kit" for a K4, I don't think it includes the K4 
> itself! {'-)
> 
> kurtt WB9FMC


__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message 
delivered to ev...@pa2kw.com 

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[G4GNX]

It’s a no-brainer. That ad is for an RFI kit only. My question is: Are 3 
toroids and some bits of wire worth $150?

Unless I was severely disabled, blind or exceptionally lazy, I’d be ashamed to 
buy that item!

73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700


73,
Alan - G4GNX
South Coast UK
Elecraft K4D / KPA500 / KAT500 / IC-9700




> On 12 Mar 2024, at 13:42, Kurt Pawlikowski  wrote:
> 
> Petr,
> 
> Looking at the only listing for anything "K4," I found this 
> .
>  If that's what you're looking at, it's an "RFI Kit" for a K4, I don't think 
> it includes the K4 itself! {'-)
> 
> kurtt WB9FMC


__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com 

Re: [Elecraft] K4D for bargain price on eBay

[Kurt Pawlikowski]

Petr,

    Looking at the only listing for anything "K4," I found this 
. 
If that's what you're looking at, it's an "RFI Kit" for a K4, I don't 
think it includes the K4 itself! {'-)


    kurtt WB9FMC

On 3/12/24 06:55, Petr Ourednik wrote:

Folks,

upon emails received ...my god, it's not mine of course. :)
It's some seller from Italy.

73 - Petr, OK1RP
http://ok1rp.blogspot.com
K3 #0778 | K2 # 4800 | K1 #1031 | KX3 # 0602
__
Elecraft mailing list
Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post:mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by:http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered toku...@pinrod.com  

__
Elecraft mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Elecraft@mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to arch...@mail-archive.com