[Flightgear-devel] No more software rendering?
I'm trying to catch up with recent developments, and I've pulled and compiled an up-to-date snapshot today. One thing I stumbled across by accident is that we seem to have lost the ability to do software rendering as a fallback. If I start today's Flightgear binary without access to the GPU device, then I get a segfault immediately rather than software rendering: NVIDIA: could not open the device file /dev/nvidiactl (Permission denied). NVIDIA: Direct rendering failed; attempting indirect rendering. Segmentation fault As of two months ago, this did not occur and I got to see the no-shaders version of Flightgear instead. I suppose this is of no dramatic consequence in practice as most of us will be using hardware rendering, but it might hint at some underlying problem during startup. * Thorsten -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Depth buffers, render bins and passes
I'm trying to understand why clouds can obscure hills and hills can obscure clouds properly. My individual bits of knowledge are: * clouds are drawn from outside in, because they are in a depth sorted bin, and this is why clouds obscure other clouds properly. * hills are not drawn from outside in but in some (unspecified) order, but they are drawn in two passes, and the second pass has depth functionlequal/function write-mask type=boolfalse/write-mask /depth declared which presumably does the trick of running a fragment only if its depth is lesser or equal to the buffered value but does not alter the depth buffer itself. There is no depth tag during the first pass, so the depth buffer seems to be doing something by default - at least write and perhaps also lequal testing? Unfortunately README.effects does not mention the depth buffer at all. Now, what I'm unsure about is the relative ordering of passes and rendering bins. Are the two passes of render bin 1 done before starting with render bin 2, or are first all passes 1 done for all render bins, then the passes 2? Clouds have a depth write-maskfalse/write-mask /depth tag in their single pass, so they don't modifiy the depth buffer, but there's also no lequal comparison specified - is this the default behaviour? Otherwise I simply don't see why a hill can possibly obscure clouds... Is it correct that if I want to insert any proxy for a cloud which is able to obscure terrain (i.e. does not require the terrain underneath to be rendered) this must go into pass 1 render bin 1 with no specific depth tag? What is the meaning of render bin -1 as specified for the first pass of terrain - should the cloud proxy rather go in there? Quite in general - how is the precise ordering of the default rendering, and what buffers are available when? Thanks for any light anyone can shed on this. Cheers, * Thorsten -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATIS bug (after sim reset)
Am 2012-10-01 12:33, schrieb James Turner: There's something odd happening with ATIS, after a sim-reset: you get reports for many stations, none of which are geographically close, continuously. Some observations: - After startup (c172p) I can not hear the ATIS but if debug output is enabled (--log-class=atc --log-level=debug) I can see the ATIS text shown in the terminal. - After a reset I can additionally to the text also hear the ATIS (If switching on the according switches). - There is no range filter applied at least for the NavDataCache::findXXXByFreq methods (A FGPositioned::Filter object is passed to all of them but the pass() method is never called) Tom -- Thomas Geymayer www.tomprogs.at / C-Forum und Tutorial: www.proggen.org Student of Computer Science @ Graz University of Technology --- Austria -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATIS bug (after sim reset)
On 1 Oct 2012, at 12:21, Thomas Geymayer wrote: Some observations: - There is no range filter applied at least for the NavDataCache::findXXXByFreq methods (A FGPositioned::Filter object is passed to all of them but the pass() method is never called) Right, the filter is generally passed in simply so the type-range can be extracted. But the layer above (navlist.cxx) was also missing a check on the filter - I've pushed fixes for this now. This makes the ATIS selection sane, based on quick testing. It turns out most filters we use, are only a type-range filter, which is how this fairly major bug managed to escape notice until now. - After startup (c172p) I can not hear the ATIS but if debug output is enabled (--log-class=atc --log-level=debug) I can see the ATIS text shown in the terminal. - After a reset I can additionally to the text also hear the ATIS (If switching on the according switches). There is still something weird happening here - assuming I select the correct comm-panel options, and adjust the default volume, and select an in-range ATIS frequency, all the code is run to send sound to the sound-manager - I've verified this in the debugger - but I don't hear any audio output until a restart. James -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATIS bug (after sim reset)
Am 2012-10-01 14:12, schrieb James Turner: There is still something weird happening here - assuming I select the correct comm-panel options, and adjust the default volume, and select an in-range ATIS frequency, all the code is run to send sound to the sound-manager - I've verified this in the debugger - but I don't hear any audio output until a restart. After a restart or reset? For me it works after a reset but also after pausing and resume again. Tom -- Thomas Geymayer www.tomprogs.at / C-Forum und Tutorial: www.proggen.org Student of Computer Science @ Graz University of Technology --- Austria -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] ATIS bug (after sim reset)
On 1 Oct 2012, at 14:28, Thomas Geymayer wrote: After a restart or reset? For me it works after a reset but also after pausing and resume again. I meant 'reset' - and you're correct that pause+resume also fixes it. I'm assuming this issue is unrelated to the Navcache, but also has occurred since 2.8.0 was released. H. James -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Engine sound and HSI problems with Lightning
On Sat, 29 Sep 2012 10:59:18 +0100 Alan Teeder wrote: Just a heads-up. A couple of faults with the current CVS have recently surfaced. The most irritating is a break-up of the engine sound once they have been started. There are also warnings about the use of a stereo file (Lightning/Sounds/avpin_combustion.wav, but I don´t think that this is related) I suspect this (startup sound sequence) might have been broken since the major changes to the FG sound system were made - or is it more recent? IMO it's a huge shame that stereo sounds are not supported any more, as the aural experience now just isn't as immersive (not to negate the real improvements that _were_ made of course). I'm not sure I understand why stereo can't be supported - couldn't the relative volumes / pitches of the two channels of the sound clip be adjusted fairly easily to provide positional cues? The second problem is that the HSI spins continuously until the “Push Source” button at the bottom of the instrument is pressed. Pressing this button twice results in rotation once again. Had no idea about this one, will try and look into it when I get a chance... Thanks for reporting these, a major shortage of spare time means I'm not able to be involved as I once was but would like to keep the stuff I have done working at least! AJ -- -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
[Flightgear-devel] Problem with the submodel life for FG version 2.0.0
I am using FlighGear version 2.0.0 in linux platform. Recently i added submodel Trajectory Marker to the aircraft f-14b The life of the model is set as life5/life through the .xml file. On triggering, the Trajectory Markers are displayed correctly but does not disappear after 5 sec ( as set in the .xml file) Is there any other setting that i have to enable for setting the life of the submodel. Regards raghav -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Engine sound and HSI problems with Lightning
AJ Thanks for the reply. I haven't looked at the Lightning for some time, but as my TSR2 (still in development) suddenly started producing funny glitches in the engine sound I went back to your Lightning, from which I had stolen this particular piece of code (many GPL thanks). Subsequently I have found the same problem, to various degrees, in other aircraft, including Sea Vixen. It hard to describe, but is a kind of background twittering. I hear the same effect in Linux and Windows. Off topic, whilst looking for further examples I found many aircraft that do not work. Concorde just crashes Flightgear, and several aircraft have translucent HUD and/or cockpits. This is with Rembrandt enabled. As Eric says stereo has been discontinued for some time, and he is the one to explain the benefits of this change. I think that there is a stereo effect still, as rotating the viewpoint causes significant volume changes, which must be based upon sound source position. This particular effect seems to me rather unrealistic, as when I turn my head in real life the noise of my surroundings does not change to such a great degree. Alan -Original Message- From: AJ MacLeod Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 2:02 PM To: FlightGear developers discussions Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Engine sound and HSI problems with Lightning On Sat, 29 Sep 2012 10:59:18 +0100 Alan Teeder wrote: Just a heads-up. A couple of faults with the current CVS have recently surfaced. The most irritating is a break-up of the engine sound once they have been started. There are also warnings about the use of a stereo file (Lightning/Sounds/avpin_combustion.wav, but I don´t think that this is related) I suspect this (startup sound sequence) might have been broken since the major changes to the FG sound system were made - or is it more recent? IMO it's a huge shame that stereo sounds are not supported any more, as the aural experience now just isn't as immersive (not to negate the real improvements that _were_ made of course). I'm not sure I understand why stereo can't be supported - couldn't the relative volumes / pitches of the two channels of the sound clip be adjusted fairly easily to provide positional cues? The second problem is that the HSI spins continuously until the “Push Source” button at the bottom of the instrument is pressed. Pressing this button twice results in rotation once again. Had no idea about this one, will try and look into it when I get a chance... Thanks for reporting these, a major shortage of spare time means I'm not able to be involved as I once was but would like to keep the stuff I have done working at least! AJ -- -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Engine sound and HSI problems with Lightning
On 1 Oct 2012, at 17:07, Alan Teeder wrote: Off topic, whilst looking for further examples I found many aircraft that do not work. Concorde just crashes Flightgear, and several aircraft have translucent HUD and/or cockpits. This is with Rembrandt enabled. Is the transparency issues Rembrandt specific? James -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Engine sound and HSI problems with Lightning
James I have just run a very quick check on a few aircraft. My apologies, but I should have used the word opaque and not translucent. F22 (jsbsim) has an opaque HUD, Mirage F1 has an opaque cockpit. They are both transparent when Rembrandt is disabled. The Saab Draken seems to have no cockpit. This is with or without Rembrandt enabled. Concorde crashes Flightgear at start-up. Again this is not affected by Rembrandt. As a general comment I find that the flying characteristics of most of the aircraft that I flipped through seem very unrealistic. They seem to be optimised for ease of use by non-pilots. This makes Flightgear appear to be a toy, or game, when it is capable of being an accurate flight simulator. IMHO this is a great pity. There are exceptions - e.g. the default Cessna 172, so it can be done. How can we encourage developers to pay as much attention to aerodynamics as they do to eye candy? Alan -Original Message- From: James Turner Sent: Monday, October 01, 2012 5:48 PM To: FlightGear developers discussions Subject: Re: [Flightgear-devel] Engine sound and HSI problems with Lightning On 1 Oct 2012, at 17:07, Alan Teeder wrote: Off topic, whilst looking for further examples I found many aircraft that do not work. Concorde just crashes Flightgear, and several aircraft have translucent HUD and/or cockpits. This is with Rembrandt enabled. Is the transparency issues Rembrandt specific? James -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
Re: [Flightgear-devel] Engine sound and HSI problems with Lightning
On Monday, October 01, 2012 19:16:09 Alan Teeder wrote: James I have just run a very quick check on a few aircraft. My apologies, but I should have used the word opaque and not translucent. F22 (jsbsim) has an opaque HUD, Mirage F1 has an opaque cockpit. They are both transparent when Rembrandt is disabled. The Saab Draken seems to have no cockpit. This is with or without Rembrandt enabled. Concorde crashes Flightgear at start-up. Again this is not affected by Rembrandt. As a general comment I find that the flying characteristics of most of the aircraft that I flipped through seem very unrealistic. They seem to be optimised for ease of use by non-pilots. This makes Flightgear appear to be a toy, or game, when it is capable of being an accurate flight simulator. IMHO this is a great pity. There are exceptions - e.g. the default Cessna 172, so it can be done. How can we encourage developers to pay as much attention to aerodynamics as they do to eye candy? Alan Hi Alan, Most aircraft need to be ported for Rembrandt. The amount of porting necesary is in most cases proportional with the complexity of the eyecandy used before by said aircraft. For some is as simple as assigning an effect for transparent surfaces, for others it might require more involved work (might even require remodelling of some parts). That said, there are quite a few aircraft that have been ported. By the symptoms you describe it's most likely the f22 the Mirage and the Draken weren't ported yet. However I'm concerned with the Concorde errors, since I've adapted that one to Rembrandt, and it uses the same effects/shaders as the C172p. Regards, Emilian -- Got visibility? Most devs has no idea what their production app looks like. Find out how fast your code is with AppDynamics Lite. http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;262219671;13503038;y? http://info.appdynamics.com/FreeJavaPerformanceDownload.html ___ Flightgear-devel mailing list Flightgear-devel@lists.sourceforge.net https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/flightgear-devel
