from:"Avraham Schneider"

Your logic is flawed:

On the one hand you claim it is bad to serve in the Israeli military
On the other you claim that it is bad that I didn't serve in the Israeli
military

Why don't you make up your mind, or at least spread contradicting claims
over multiple posts or under different handles as you are accustomed to

Besides, I am not 'showing my support' - I am responding to propaganda
distributed here by people like you.

As for cowardliness, it seems you are the one who posts using a nickname.

Finally, You are the one being pathetic for doing that much research on me
online to get to the conclusion I did not serve in the military (which is
true BTW, and not like js-sentier's conclusion that I'm the soldier who was
filmed throwing rocks at Palestinians.)



On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 8:07 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 Advice - don't live in a bubble believing everything your zionist scum
 brothers spout. While you acted like the coward that you are and never
 fought for your country, something you zionist scum force on each
 other, you can show your support for your dying devils from the
 comfort of your keyboard. Very very very pathetic.


 On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 7:33 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  Advice - Call your doctor asap and tell him/her you need new pills.
 

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Jesus was jew !

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:36 PM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 4:15 AM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  Your logic is flawed:
 
  On the one hand you claim it is bad to serve in the Israeli military
  On the other you claim that it is bad that I didn't serve in the Israeli
  military
 

 You're a complete and utter moron if you can't comprehend what I
 wrote. Chicken hawk.

blablabla... that's all you do.




 
  Why don't you make up your mind, or at least spread contradicting claims
  over multiple posts or under different handles as you are accustomed to
 
  Besides, I am not 'showing my support' - I am responding to propaganda
  distributed here by people like you.
 

 Typical zionist jew, if they don't like your opinion they call it
 propaganda... and then respond with reports from some quasi-government
 agency that specializes in propaganda. Now that's funny.

What's funny is that you are avoiding the question.




 
  As for cowardliness, it seems you are the one who posts using a nickname.
 

 Would you like to meet and find out who I am Avraham? I've lived in
 the bay my entire life and just recently moved out of state. My entire
 family is still there and I will be returning to visit sooner rather
 than later. This isn't G4TV Special Report, you can't hide behind
 the keyboard in the real world.

Sure. And you are still hiding behind a psuedoname.




 Sideline cheerleaders deserve the same war at there doorstep as the
 scum that commit it. You preach death, you're no better than nazi
 scum.

I preach death? When?




 
  Finally, You are the one being pathetic for doing that much research on
 me
  online to get to the conclusion I did not serve in the military (which is
  true BTW, and not like js-sentier's conclusion that I'm the soldier who
 was
  filmed throwing rocks at Palestinians.)
 

 Doing research on someone who supports the death of innocent civilians
 is far from pathetic.

You are claiming I support the death of innocent civilians - prove that.


 In fact, if I am the only one who has done
 research on you I would be quite ashamed of the human race.

Who cares who you're ashamed of?




 and this coming from the man who wants my real name so he could do his
 research on me

No, just showing that you are the one who is a coward, I don't really care
who you are.

... typical zionist scum, nothing but double standards
 if you're not one of them.

Yes, and we also drink the blood of Christian babies on Passover.



 :-)

Why are you smiling?




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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

 and terrorism. In fact, the roadmap toward the resolution of the
Arab-Israeli conflict does not go through Ramallah or Gaza, but rather
through Cairo, Amman and other Arab capitals, as evidenced by Israel's peace
treaties with Egypt and Jordan, which have withstood Palestinian opposition
and an on-going Israeli war against Palestinian terrorism.



A policy which is based on an erroneous assumption – that the Palestinian
issue is supposedly the crown jewel of Arab policy – constitutes an
erroneous policy. It exacerbates regional instability, fuels terrorism,
promotes war and diminishes the prospects for peace.



Israel should base its policy, toward the Palestinians, on the track record
of the last 100 years, and especially the last 15 years, which have featured
the failure of Land-for-Peace on the Palestinian track.

Lessons of recent history, Israel's minimal security requirements and the
need to minimize motivation for Arab terrorism, highlight the necessity to
solidify Israel's control of Judea and Samaria.




On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 8:10 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 Most prefer Bayer :-)

 On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  Advil?
 

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Jesus was jew !

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 3:09 PM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.com wrote:

 Stop replying

Make me.


 and shoot yourself in the head.

Coward talking nonsense.


 You know that you are
 just a little dirty brainwashed jew.

Bla bla bla.



 Zionist killed and lied to prophets

When?


 , so you think that with Schneider
 name we will believe you.

Did not ask you to believe me, just to stop your propaganda on a comsec
mailing list.


 99.99% of the world know that zionist love to make propaganda as you know.

Bla bla bla.

And the 0.01% are just the brainwashed
 ppl or the zionist themself.

Bla bla bla.



 And the blabla it you who do it. by posting lie from your other
 zionist and calling them Fact.

Facts by definition are verifyiable - unlike your opinions/propaganda.


 You know that your end is near.

 You lost .  That it.

What makes you think you know what I know? You have trouble with basic
logic.





 2009/1/23 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com:
 
 
  On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:36 PM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 4:15 AM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
   Your logic is flawed:
  
   On the one hand you claim it is bad to serve in the Israeli military
   On the other you claim that it is bad that I didn't serve in the
 Israeli
   military
  
 
  You're a complete and utter moron if you can't comprehend what I
  wrote. Chicken hawk.
 
  blablabla... that's all you do.
 
 
 
  
   Why don't you make up your mind, or at least spread contradicting
 claims
   over multiple posts or under different handles as you are accustomed
 to
  
   Besides, I am not 'showing my support' - I am responding to propaganda
   distributed here by people like you.
  
 
  Typical zionist jew, if they don't like your opinion they call it
  propaganda... and then respond with reports from some quasi-government
  agency that specializes in propaganda. Now that's funny.
 
  What's funny is that you are avoiding the question.
 
 
 
  
   As for cowardliness, it seems you are the one who posts using a
   nickname.
  
 
  Would you like to meet and find out who I am Avraham? I've lived in
  the bay my entire life and just recently moved out of state. My entire
  family is still there and I will be returning to visit sooner rather
  than later. This isn't G4TV Special Report, you can't hide behind
  the keyboard in the real world.
 
  Sure. And you are still hiding behind a psuedoname.
 
 
 
  Sideline cheerleaders deserve the same war at there doorstep as the
  scum that commit it. You preach death, you're no better than nazi
  scum.
 
  I preach death? When?
 
 
 
  
   Finally, You are the one being pathetic for doing that much research
 on
   me
   online to get to the conclusion I did not serve in the military (which
   is
   true BTW, and not like js-sentier's conclusion that I'm the soldier
 who
   was
   filmed throwing rocks at Palestinians.)
  
 
  Doing research on someone who supports the death of innocent civilians
  is far from pathetic.
 
  You are claiming I support the death of innocent civilians - prove that.
 
 
  In fact, if I am the only one who has done
  research on you I would be quite ashamed of the human race.
 
  Who cares who you're ashamed of?
 
 
 
  and this coming from the man who wants my real name so he could do his
  research on me
 
  No, just showing that you are the one who is a coward, I don't really
 care
  who you are.
 
  ... typical zionist scum, nothing but double standards
  if you're not one of them.
 
  Yes, and we also drink the blood of Christian babies on Passover.
 
 
 
  :-)
 
  Why are you smiling?
 
 
 
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Re: [Full-disclosure] Barack Obama -- Not Appropriate

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 9:35 PM, a.l.m.bu...@lboro.ac.uk wrote:

 Hi,
  I called for John Cartwright to setup a non-technical cyber security
  political full-disclosure mailing list some time ago, nothing was
  setup.

 because he didnt want to - and theres no demand?

  What are the solutions for splitting up full-disclosure into technical
  and non-technical conversation unless two seperate mailing lists are
  created?

 go off and create a yahoo or google mailing list for such drivel

I second that. If he wants to have a list for different types of
discussions, the best choice is to just open one yourself.

As for getting 'traffic' there, I doubt people would stop posting here and
start posting there (as nothing would stop them from posting it here).



 and let FD go back to what it was a few years back - readable and useful!

FD is un-moderated and as such people can post whatever they want (security
related or not).

Usually, people would avoid annoying others with non-security related topics
- but in the case of js-sentiner and co., one can expect some spam.

Sometimes, when they decide to attack others (either with propaganda, or
just because they are bored) , those attacked have two options - either a)
ignore it or b) respond with non-security related posts and defend
themselves (or oppose their propaganda).

As far as readibility is concerned, that can easily be accomplished by
either white or black list filters - i.e. if you only care about a certain
vendor's patch notifications, put a filter to get them and blacklist the
rest; if you care not to get any andrew wallase/avraham schneider/js
sentier/whatever/whoever conversations - set a filter for that - and you are
back with a readable FD.

Just keep in mind that your posts requesting FD to go back to being
readable, are not computer security related either (at least without
wickedly twisting the meaning of the phrase 'computer security').

So for the same reason you find it OK to post your request (and it is),
andrew finds it OK to posts his (and it is).

Not trying to defend n3td3v or anything - but there's some hypocricy here.



 ala

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Barack Obama -- Not Appropriate

The fact that he bears the same name as me, does not mean it's me.

I don't spam propaganda - I invalidate yours.

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 12:16 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 which propaganda ?

 you're spamming propaganda everytime you post.

 But i understand why now :

 http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1049327.html

 The footage also shows an Israeli soldier, believed by the military police
 to be Corporal Avraham Schneider, picking up stones and participating in the
 disturbance, instead of preventing it. 

 Everything is clearer than ever.
 2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 9:35 PM, a.l.m.bu...@lboro.ac.uk wrote:

 Hi,
  I called for John Cartwright to setup a non-technical cyber security
  political full-disclosure mailing list some time ago, nothing was
  setup.

 because he didnt want to - and theres no demand?

  What are the solutions for splitting up full-disclosure into technical
  and non-technical conversation unless two seperate mailing lists are
  created?

 go off and create a yahoo or google mailing list for such drivel

 I second that. If he wants to have a list for different types of
 discussions, the best choice is to just open one yourself.

 As for getting 'traffic' there, I doubt people would stop posting here and
 start posting there (as nothing would stop them from posting it here).



 and let FD go back to what it was a few years back - readable and useful!

 FD is un-moderated and as such people can post whatever they want
 (security related or not).

 Usually, people would avoid annoying others with non-security related
 topics - but in the case of js-sentiner and co., one can expect some spam.

 Sometimes, when they decide to attack others (either with propaganda, or
 just because they are bored) , those attacked have two options - either a)
 ignore it or b) respond with non-security related posts and defend
 themselves (or oppose their propaganda).

 As far as readibility is concerned, that can easily be accomplished by
 either white or black list filters - i.e. if you only care about a certain
 vendor's patch notifications, put a filter to get them and blacklist the
 rest; if you care not to get any andrew wallase/avraham schneider/js
 sentier/whatever/whoever conversations - set a filter for that - and you are
 back with a readable FD.

 Just keep in mind that your posts requesting FD to go back to being
 readable, are not computer security related either (at least without
 wickedly twisting the meaning of the phrase 'computer security').

 So for the same reason you find it OK to post your request (and it is),
 andrew finds it OK to posts his (and it is).

 Not trying to defend n3td3v or anything - but there's some hypocricy here.



 ala

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Barack Obama

Considering they haven't banned the Palestinian propaganda that has been
going around here, everything is allowed.

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 9:06 PM, andrew.wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 I'm the only one who thinks cyber security politics are allowed on
 full-disclosure?

 Andrew

 On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 6:57 PM, Peter Bruderer peter.brude...@brg.ch
 wrote:
  You are the only one with this opinion.
 
  So shut up now and leave.
 
  Peter
 
 
  On 22.01.2009, at 19:50, andrew.wallace wrote:
  Cyber security politics are allowed.
 
  Andrew

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Advil?

On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 8:58 PM, Miller Grey vigilantgregor...@gmail.comwrote:

...my head hurts...

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:51 PM, Avraham Schneider
avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 6:42 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

while playing at war with them neighbors.

Yes, 'playing' in a war that the Arabs started. And winning that war.

If i was forced to have a redneck neighbor zionist integrist like
you, i would too.

What? Be a loser?

I would start a war too. understand now ?

You could have just answered yes to my question.

, which is totally understandable

It was not up to them.

Well they are the first concerned.

Concerned about what?

Arabians are the first concerned about having a new hostil neighbor

Israel was never hostile to the Arab countries - on the contrary, the Arab
countries were hostile to Israel, started a war and shamefully lost, against
all odds.

israel also made a nuclear bomb illegaly

Prove that.

It's allready proven.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_with_nuclear_weapons#Undeclared_nuclear_states
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction
http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Israel/index.html

No - http://www.letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=define%3Aproof

You really need to start discerning facts from opinion

They have the bomb and everyone know that.

There's a clear distinction between beleifs and knowledge.
Everyone beleives Israel have nukes. Nobody (other than those who need
to), knows for certain.

So yes it's a FACT

Recheck the definition in the dictionary.

Not an opinion, there's proof

Show it.

, and israel didn't said yes, and didn't said no, which confirm that
they have it.

Why would Israel say no, when it scares the crap out of you and your
buddies?

Or maybe it's once again a conspiracy against israel :(.

The bigger problems with zionist, is they control most of the medias
around the world,

most of the banks, them community are pretty strong around.
Making/doing propaganda is an easy game for them, you cant touch
jews, because as avraham do, everytime you hit them,

Sure... It's all just 1 huge big conspiracy against you.

Nop, no conspiracy, just a FACT.

Read above.

Still a FACT .

Read above.

they play the holocaust card.

I didn't bring up the holocaust - you did by comparing Israel to the
Nazis.

First i never compared israel to the nazis (or prove it), secondly you
did bring up holocaust:
- http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2009/Jan/0736.html

It is apparent that you, handrix and all the other gmail pseudo-names
you use are the same individual - so it does not matter under which handle
you have chosen to make this claim.

But if you would not like to be held responsible for that statement
under this handle, I'm fine with it - consider it as proof against the
claims you made under the other handle you were using.

Omagad, that's a good one, do you really believe that only one person
here hate you or the zionist ?
Anyways just look at the writing style, spelling, grammar, and opinion
you would notice if you're mentaly stable that it's different persons.

I took your advice, looked at the writing style, spelling, grammer and
opinion - and I came to the conclusion that you are a sick and retarded
individual.

As you got to understand that a lots of people do not like the US, for
what they've done in central ameriqua for exemple
Use a spell checker or something...

Go fuck yourself, is that well spelled ?

Yes, but completely irrelevant.

Nop it's pertinant.

Read above.

, dont you remember, talibans was good terrorists when they was
fighting agains communists, now that they fight against US, they are
bad
terrorists.

You agree that they are terrorists then?

I agree on the fact that you're pathetic.

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

just reading your posts

Great. Had enough?

stifles yourself with your propaganda.

Your English sucks for someone trying to do propaganda on a ComSec
mailing list.

It's well written, open up your english to hebrew translator, and once
again go fuck yourself.

I can read and write in English just fine without the help of a
translator - you on the other hand need to work on your grammar and
spelling, as well as wash you mouth and fingers with plenty of soap.

Well if you cant understand the phrase :

stifles yourself with your propaganda.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/stifle

v. sti·fled, sti·fling, sti·fles v.tr.
1. To interrupt or cut off (the voice, for example).
2. To keep in or hold back; repress: stifled my indignation.
3. To kill by preventing respiration; smother or suffocate.--
this is the one (suffocate) :)
See you should open up your translator sometimes

You are a retard - go check your grammar.

btw what's that fixation thing

Re: [Full-disclosure] Barack Obama -- Not Appropriate

the fact that you express your opinions on a political manner in a comsec
mailing list and they happen to be copied from terrorist propaganda (i.e.
baseless, ignores reality, full of lies and distortions)

And when you are presented with facts that contradict what you said, you
shift the argument to baseless character attacks (with your pathetic
English).

That basically proves you are here to do propaganda - either voluntarily
(because you are EVIL) - or because you are paid to do it by evil
people/governments (like Iran, who is known to support terrorists).

But it does not explain why you expect n3td3v to stop his computer security
related discussions (that are not technical, but computer security related),
when you don't stop your propaganda that is _completely unrelated to
computer security_?



On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:38 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 yeah totally, i work for fucking IRAN punk, if i'm agains free israeli
 bull-shit, and n3tcr4p , then i'm ureleet or Iran propaganda or something
 EVIL.

 this prove your closed-mind side which in this case turns in a fucking
 brown noze.


 2009/1/22 andrew.wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com

 Remember in the Palestine war thread he accused you for working for
 Mossad and being paid to post on full-disclosure. Though he
 propagandas against n3td3v constantly to turn the world against me or
 something. Maybe its j-f sentier who is paid to be here and propaganda
 against things. He may not be a terrorist but he uses terrorist like
 tactics to turn hatred on. j-f sentier's defence will be, 'but
 'Ureleet' done it so it must be ok to join in'. If 'Ureleet' told you
 to jump off a bridge would you do it?

 Andrew
 Intelligencer 
 Founder of n3td3v

 On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 11:05 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  The fact that he bears the same name as me, does not mean it's me.
 
  I don't spam propaganda - I invalidate yours.
 
  On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 12:16 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  which propaganda ?
 
  you're spamming propaganda everytime you post.
 
  But i understand why now :
 
  http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1049327.html
 
  The footage also shows an Israeli soldier, believed by the military
  police to be Corporal Avraham Schneider, picking up stones and
 participating
  in the disturbance, instead of preventing it. 
 
  Everything is clearer than ever.
 
  2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com
 
 
  On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 9:35 PM, a.l.m.bu...@lboro.ac.uk wrote:
 
  Hi,
   I called for John Cartwright to setup a non-technical cyber
 security
   political full-disclosure mailing list some time ago, nothing was
   setup.
 
  because he didnt want to - and theres no demand?
 
   What are the solutions for splitting up full-disclosure into
 technical
   and non-technical conversation unless two seperate mailing lists
 are
   created?
 
  go off and create a yahoo or google mailing list for such drivel
 
  I second that. If he wants to have a list for different types of
  discussions, the best choice is to just open one yourself.
 
  As for getting 'traffic' there, I doubt people would stop posting here
  and start posting there (as nothing would stop them from posting it
 here).
 
 
  and let FD go back to what it was a few years back - readable and
  useful!
 
  FD is un-moderated and as such people can post whatever they want
  (security related or not).
 
  Usually, people would avoid annoying others with non-security related
  topics - but in the case of js-sentiner and co., one can expect some
 spam.
 
  Sometimes, when they decide to attack others (either with propaganda,
 or
  just because they are bored) , those attacked have two options -
 either a)
  ignore it or b) respond with non-security related posts and defend
  themselves (or oppose their propaganda).
 
  As far as readibility is concerned, that can easily be accomplished by
  either white or black list filters - i.e. if you only care about a
 certain
  vendor's patch notifications, put a filter to get them and blacklist
 the
  rest; if you care not to get any andrew wallase/avraham schneider/js
  sentier/whatever/whoever conversations - set a filter for that - and
 you are
  back with a readable FD.
 
  Just keep in mind that your posts requesting FD to go back to being
  readable, are not computer security related either (at least without
  wickedly twisting the meaning of the phrase 'computer security').
 
  So for the same reason you find it OK to post your request (and it
 is),
  andrew finds it OK to posts his (and it is).
 
  Not trying to defend n3td3v or anything - but there's some hypocricy
  here.
 
 
 
  ala
 
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  Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
 
 
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  Full-Disclosure

Re: [Full-disclosure] Jesus was jew !

How old are you kid? Really?

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:59 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 Well there's 4 points that prove Jesus was a jew:

 -  he live 33 years with his mom

 -  he believed for 33 years since his mother was a virgin

 -  she tell everyone that is son was God

 -  and he  mounted a multi-national business

 OhOhOh




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Re: [Full-disclosure] Barack Obama -- Not Appropriate

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:34 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:



 2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:16 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 Nop you spread yours.

 Yes, if that's what you call answering your propaganda with facts that
 disprove it.

 You're making your fact up via your propaganda, fucker.

if it's fact, it can not be 'made up'.
If it is coming as response to your claims - it is not propaganda.
And your dirty language does not add to your credibility.



 Anyways 

 you got pwned, no doubt it's you, you have the same profile mofo, and in
 the same situation you'll do the same.

 I guess I can't prove to you that it's not me - but then again, I don't
 need to either.

 Besides, what's your point? (not that I care)

 My point is that it explain most of your free propaganda, aka palestinian
 =evil, israel  = Good.

free propaganda? what's that? how does it compare to expensive propaganda?
And how does it _explain my propaganda_, when all I do is respond to your
claims (i.e. there's no propaganda)?

And why do you think anyone on this list cares about it? Is it computer
security related? Why don't you answer this question?

Any conflict have two side, i guess you've misse one while throwing rocks.

Yes, and in this case - a Good Israel, and an Evil Palestinians.

If throwing rocks at them would make them stop their terror attacks on
Israel, I'd do that.

It obviously won't help, so why should I do it?

Besides, the IDF can take care of those terrorists with better tools, so I
will let them do their job while I do mine (computer security - what's
your's btw?).





 Die in the same grave than n3td3v.

 Fix your damn English kid.

 OMG you should read your conversations on this mailing-list, you've made
 some mistake too bitch.

Yes, true - I admit to making a few mistakes - but at least I'm readable.
Why do you have to use curse words in every sentence? Grow up already.


 Anyways if your last defense is to critizice my english it's because i'm
 right, and then you're wrong.

Your assumption is wrong. I did not use it as last, or any defense - simply
as a constructive critisism.
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Re: [Full-disclosure] Barack Obama -- Not Appropriate

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:03 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 hey bitch, you're the first to spread propaganda here, then STFU.

this mailing list is archived online - it's not difficult to prove you
wrong, but you ignore reality so I'm not going to bother (it's too easy for
others to do if they really cared)


You've got no creditbility here.

Why, because you say so?

What did you do for computer security lately?




 2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 the fact that you express your opinions on a political manner in a comsec
 mailing list and they happen to be copied from terrorist propaganda (i.e.
 baseless, ignores reality, full of lies and distortions)

 And when you are presented with facts that contradict what you said, you
 shift the argument to baseless character attacks (with your pathetic
 English).

 That basically proves you are here to do propaganda - either voluntarily
 (because you are EVIL) - or because you are paid to do it by evil
 people/governments (like Iran, who is known to support terrorists).

 But it does not explain why you expect n3td3v to stop his computer
 security related discussions (that are not technical, but computer security
 related), when you don't stop your propaganda that is _completely unrelated
 to computer security_?



 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:38 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 yeah totally, i work for fucking IRAN punk, if i'm agains free israeli
 bull-shit, and n3tcr4p , then i'm ureleet or Iran propaganda or something
 EVIL.

 this prove your closed-mind side which in this case turns in a fucking
 brown noze.

 2009/1/22 andrew.wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com

 Remember in the Palestine war thread he accused you for working for
 Mossad and being paid to post on full-disclosure. Though he
 propagandas against n3td3v constantly to turn the world against me or
 something. Maybe its j-f sentier who is paid to be here and propaganda
 against things. He may not be a terrorist but he uses terrorist like
 tactics to turn hatred on. j-f sentier's defence will be, 'but
 'Ureleet' done it so it must be ok to join in'. If 'Ureleet' told you
 to jump off a bridge would you do it?

 Andrew
 Intelligencer 
 Founder of n3td3v

 On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 11:05 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  The fact that he bears the same name as me, does not mean it's me.
 
  I don't spam propaganda - I invalidate yours.
 
  On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 12:16 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  which propaganda ?
 
  you're spamming propaganda everytime you post.
 
  But i understand why now :
 
  http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1049327.html
 
  The footage also shows an Israeli soldier, believed by the military
  police to be Corporal Avraham Schneider, picking up stones and
 participating
  in the disturbance, instead of preventing it. 
 
  Everything is clearer than ever.
 
  2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com
 
 
  On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 9:35 PM, a.l.m.bu...@lboro.ac.uk wrote:
 
  Hi,
   I called for John Cartwright to setup a non-technical cyber
 security
   political full-disclosure mailing list some time ago, nothing was
   setup.
 
  because he didnt want to - and theres no demand?
 
   What are the solutions for splitting up full-disclosure into
 technical
   and non-technical conversation unless two seperate mailing lists
 are
   created?
 
  go off and create a yahoo or google mailing list for such drivel
 
  I second that. If he wants to have a list for different types of
  discussions, the best choice is to just open one yourself.
 
  As for getting 'traffic' there, I doubt people would stop posting
 here
  and start posting there (as nothing would stop them from posting it
 here).
 
 
  and let FD go back to what it was a few years back - readable and
  useful!
 
  FD is un-moderated and as such people can post whatever they want
  (security related or not).
 
  Usually, people would avoid annoying others with non-security
 related
  topics - but in the case of js-sentiner and co., one can expect some
 spam.
 
  Sometimes, when they decide to attack others (either with
 propaganda, or
  just because they are bored) , those attacked have two options -
 either a)
  ignore it or b) respond with non-security related posts and defend
  themselves (or oppose their propaganda).
 
  As far as readibility is concerned, that can easily be accomplished
 by
  either white or black list filters - i.e. if you only care about a
 certain
  vendor's patch notifications, put a filter to get them and blacklist
 the
  rest; if you care not to get any andrew wallase/avraham schneider/js
  sentier/whatever/whoever conversations - set a filter for that - and
 you are
  back with a readable FD.
 
  Just keep in mind that your posts requesting FD to go back to being
  readable, are not computer security related either (at least without
  wickedly twisting the meaning of the phrase 'computer

Re: [Full-disclosure] Jesus was jew !

Advice - Call your doctor asap and tell him/her you need new pills.

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:27 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 Did i need to say again that i still believe that Avraham is pay to say so
 ?

 Even if i know that some integrist ziononist like Avraham are themself
 proud to say so ?

 Well look some stuff is  defensible, but the fact we've throw at him are
 not ...and he stills.

 Make your conclusion by yourself.





 2009/1/22 j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com

 Ah you understand now, how easy is to make propaganda ?

 Then read up your message send on this mailing list, it's all about that.

 Die  corporal

 2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 How old are you kid? Really?

 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:59 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

 Well there's 4 points that prove Jesus was a jew:

 -  he live 33 years with his mom

 -  he believed for 33 years since his mother was a virgin

 -  she tell everyone that is son was God

 -  and he  mounted a multi-national business

 OhOhOh




 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/






 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

___
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Re: [Full-disclosure] Barack Obama -- Not Appropriate

You make less and less sense with every post you make. You are delusional.
Ask for help (not online).

On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:34 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 And you ?

 Please tell me god, i know i'm an inferior human being regarding you, but
 please tell me

 2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com




 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 2:03 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 hey bitch, you're the first to spread propaganda here, then STFU.

 this mailing list is archived online - it's not difficult to prove you
 wrong, but you ignore reality so I'm not going to bother (it's too easy for
 others to do if they really cared)


 You've got no creditbility here.

 Why, because you say so?

 What did you do for computer security lately?




 2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 the fact that you express your opinions on a political manner in a
 comsec mailing list and they happen to be copied from terrorist propaganda
 (i.e. baseless, ignores reality, full of lies and distortions)

 And when you are presented with facts that contradict what you said, you
 shift the argument to baseless character attacks (with your pathetic
 English).

 That basically proves you are here to do propaganda - either voluntarily
 (because you are EVIL) - or because you are paid to do it by evil
 people/governments (like Iran, who is known to support terrorists).

 But it does not explain why you expect n3td3v to stop his computer
 security related discussions (that are not technical, but computer security
 related), when you don't stop your propaganda that is _completely unrelated
 to computer security_?



 On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 1:38 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

 yeah totally, i work for fucking IRAN punk, if i'm agains free israeli
 bull-shit, and n3tcr4p , then i'm ureleet or Iran propaganda or something
 EVIL.

 this prove your closed-mind side which in this case turns in a fucking
 brown noze.

 2009/1/22 andrew.wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com

 Remember in the Palestine war thread he accused you for working for
 Mossad and being paid to post on full-disclosure. Though he
 propagandas against n3td3v constantly to turn the world against me or
 something. Maybe its j-f sentier who is paid to be here and propaganda
 against things. He may not be a terrorist but he uses terrorist like
 tactics to turn hatred on. j-f sentier's defence will be, 'but
 'Ureleet' done it so it must be ok to join in'. If 'Ureleet' told you
 to jump off a bridge would you do it?

 Andrew
 Intelligencer 
 Founder of n3td3v

 On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 11:05 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  The fact that he bears the same name as me, does not mean it's me.
 
  I don't spam propaganda - I invalidate yours.
 
  On Fri, Jan 23, 2009 at 12:16 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  which propaganda ?
 
  you're spamming propaganda everytime you post.
 
  But i understand why now :
 
  http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1049327.html
 
  The footage also shows an Israeli soldier, believed by the
 military
  police to be Corporal Avraham Schneider, picking up stones and
 participating
  in the disturbance, instead of preventing it. 
 
  Everything is clearer than ever.
 
  2009/1/22 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com
 
 
  On Thu, Jan 22, 2009 at 9:35 PM, a.l.m.bu...@lboro.ac.uk wrote:
 
  Hi,
   I called for John Cartwright to setup a non-technical cyber
 security
   political full-disclosure mailing list some time ago, nothing
 was
   setup.
 
  because he didnt want to - and theres no demand?
 
   What are the solutions for splitting up full-disclosure into
 technical
   and non-technical conversation unless two seperate mailing
 lists are
   created?
 
  go off and create a yahoo or google mailing list for such drivel
 
  I second that. If he wants to have a list for different types of
  discussions, the best choice is to just open one yourself.
 
  As for getting 'traffic' there, I doubt people would stop posting
 here
  and start posting there (as nothing would stop them from posting
 it here).
 
 
  and let FD go back to what it was a few years back - readable and
  useful!
 
  FD is un-moderated and as such people can post whatever they want
  (security related or not).
 
  Usually, people would avoid annoying others with non-security
 related
  topics - but in the case of js-sentiner and co., one can expect
 some spam.
 
  Sometimes, when they decide to attack others (either with
 propaganda, or
  just because they are bored) , those attacked have two options -
 either a)
  ignore it or b) respond with non-security related posts and defend
  themselves (or oppose their propaganda).
 
  As far as readibility is concerned, that can easily be
 accomplished by
  either white or black list filters - i.e. if you only care about a
 certain
  vendor's patch notifications, put a filter to get them and
 blacklist the
  rest; if you care not to get any

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 9:36 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:01 AM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
 
  I think the person who is delibitrary ignoring facts and spreading
  propaganda and lies, is you.
  Until you and your friends get off this list, and/or stop spreading your
  offtopic propaganda full of lies and hate here on a comsec list - I will
  repeat correcting your false claims, basing mine on facts, as many times
  needed,
 
 

 If it isnt from zionist scum you don't believe it. That's a pathetic
 way to live and I feel sorry for you.

Thanks for the sympathy.




 oh yes! You aren't deliberately spreading false claims right? You're
 basing yours on what israel says and anyone else is wrong. That isn't
 fact. You aren't able to think for yourself, that's a sad life.

 
  So zionists are now redefining words to favor themselves huh?
  No - http://tinyurl.com/8q6xjd
 

 Again, wasn't from zionist scum so you don't believe it.


 
  You are over confident with your propaganda, it does not seem to be
 helping.
  Unless you are referring to Bolivia cutting ties with Israel (the only
 ties
  Israel had with them are drug related).
 

 zionist scum all hopped up on drugs, label me not surprised,  patheticx2.




  As far as we see, against all expectations, Obama is pro-Israel - so I
 guess
  you have to come up with better backup plans than these...
 

 as far as we see

Yes, 'us' == 'the rest of the world'.




 Shill, proof.

http://tinyurl.com/8q6xjd



 patheticx3.

I agree. Are you done?





 
  I do not recall you mentioned it - hence I did not respond.
  Now that you do - who is 'us'?
 

 See, thats the problem with zionist scum. It's always zionists... then
 the rest of the world. Us is the USA.

I guess you should have capitalized it and not use it as the objective case
of we.


 The country that you've lived in your entire life too scared to fight along
 your scum brothers in
 israel.

I grew up in Israel.




  and you support them 100%.
  Yes I do.
 

 Yet too much of a coward to murder innocent civilians

 Not sure exactly what you want me to do? murder innocent civilians? I don't
do that

in the name of your scum brothers.

and neither do my brothers.


 Hm... pathetic.

Yes, you are.




  You're a terrorist
  http://tinyurl.com/74ct4g
 
 and deserve to be in guantanamo bay.
  But Obama is closing it down..,

 Yes, and hopefully he opens up camps for you and your scum brothers.
 That will solve 90% of our problems.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Not trying to change anything and I am very tollerant.

Why don't you take your advice and get back to computer security?

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 9:27 AM, Peter Bruderer peter.brude...@brg.chwrote:

 We heard it now many times. Please stop it now.
 None of you is going to change anything. Specially not with your intolerant
 attitude.
 So please shut up and get back to computer security.



 Peter Bruderer




 On 19.01.2009, at 08:01, Avraham Schneider wrote:



 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 8:44 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 1:12 AM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
 
  Again I'll ask - what facts?
 

 You read the facts, and you responded with zionist propaganda. No
 matter how many times you repeat yourself, the IDF is still a
 propaganda machine.

 I think the person who is delibitrary ignoring facts and spreading
 propaganda and lies, is you.
 Until you and your friends get off this list, and/or stop spreading your
 offtopic propaganda full of lies and hate here on a comsec list - I will
 repeat correcting your false claims, basing mine on facts, as many times
 needed,


 
  You need to recheck the definition of 'proof' in the dictionary, along
 with
  the definition of many other words you have been missusing lately...
 

 So zionists are now redefining words to favor themselves huh?
 No - http://tinyurl.com/8q6xjd



 
  Do you have any backup plans? Because this one does not seem to be going
  real well...
 
 

 The plans are going quite well, the zionists in israel are doing a
 great job in destroying any decent reputation they have had with other
 countries.

 You are over confident with your propaganda, it does not seem to be
 helping.
 Unless you are referring to Bolivia cutting ties with Israel (the only ties
 Israel had with them are drug related).

 Not to mention the fact that Obama is going into office, and you
 zionist scum have tons of conspiracy about that. Lets hope they all
 come true :)
 As far as we see, against all expectations, Obama is pro-Israel - so I
 guess you have to come up with better backup plans than these...


 It's funny how you never responded to the FACT that israel spys on us
 more then any other country
 I do not recall you mentioned it - hence I did not respond.
 Now that you do - who is 'us'?

  and you support them 100%.
 Yes I do.

  You're a terrorist
 http://tinyurl.com/74ct4g

 and deserve to be in guantanamo bay.
 But Obama is closing it down..,


 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/



___
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 10:41 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 Typical zionist trying to tell people what to do...

Was just suggesting he follows his own advise.




 It's ingrained in them to talk down to others at birth

I guess you have not followed your own thread, ehmmm... Propaganda, the ones
who are talking down on others here are you and your buddies.


 , sorry for the
 mismanners of the typical zionist jew everyone.

You do not need to apologize in my name, I am pretty capable of doing so
myself if I choose to.
 And talking about manners, you should wash your mouth and fingers with a
lot of soap.





 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 3:24 AM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  Not trying to change anything and I am very tollerant.
 
  Why don't you take your advice and get back to computer security?
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 9:27 AM, Peter Bruderer peter.brude...@brg.ch
  wrote:
 
  We heard it now many times. Please stop it now.
  None of you is going to change anything. Specially not with your
  intolerant attitude.
  So please shut up and get back to computer security.
 
 
  Peter Bruderer
 
 
 
  On 19.01.2009, at 08:01, Avraham Schneider wrote:
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 8:44 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 1:12 AM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  
  
  
   Again I'll ask - what facts?
  
 
  You read the facts, and you responded with zionist propaganda. No
  matter how many times you repeat yourself, the IDF is still a
  propaganda machine.
 
  I think the person who is delibitrary ignoring facts and spreading
  propaganda and lies, is you.
  Until you and your friends get off this list, and/or stop spreading your
  offtopic propaganda full of lies and hate here on a comsec list - I will
  repeat correcting your false claims, basing mine on facts, as many times
  needed,
 
 
  
   You need to recheck the definition of 'proof' in the dictionary, along
   with
   the definition of many other words you have been missusing lately...
  
 
  So zionists are now redefining words to favor themselves huh?
  No - http://tinyurl.com/8q6xjd
 
 
 
  
   Do you have any backup plans? Because this one does not seem to be
   going
   real well...
  
  
 
  The plans are going quite well, the zionists in israel are doing a
  great job in destroying any decent reputation they have had with other
  countries.
 
  You are over confident with your propaganda, it does not seem to be
  helping.
  Unless you are referring to Bolivia cutting ties with Israel (the only
  ties Israel had with them are drug related).
 
  Not to mention the fact that Obama is going into office, and you
  zionist scum have tons of conspiracy about that. Lets hope they all
  come true :)
  As far as we see, against all expectations, Obama is pro-Israel - so I
  guess you have to come up with better backup plans than these...
 
 
  It's funny how you never responded to the FACT that israel spys on us
  more then any other country
  I do not recall you mentioned it - hence I did not respond.
  Now that you do - who is 'us'?
 
   and you support them 100%.
  Yes I do.
 
   You're a terrorist
  http://tinyurl.com/74ct4g
 
  and deserve to be in guantanamo bay.
  But Obama is closing it down..,
 
 
  ___
  Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
  Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
  Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
 
 

___
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

Wow internet threats - really scary... What's your name kid?

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.comwrote:

 Nazis knew the real value of zionist , no wonder they wanted to burn
 them all. Everytime Zionist think they become stronger , they do
 something to deserve to get killed , then later complain that others
 hate them.  They destroyed the Soviet union and now they want to
 destroy the Arab world. Next is Europe  USA. They want us to live the
 miserable live they used to live. Because god have punished them to
 never give them a permanant land ever. Israel is just temporary. We
 will see soon Schneider in a refugee camp speaking to media and
 telling how scared he is from the bad people of the world.

 2009/1/18 Nicolae cyt...@yahoo.com:
  It's funny to see jews acting in the same way as nazi did.
 
  If during ww you had these rockets that palestinians is firing you now,
  wouldn't you fire on nazi too ?
 
  So now you are killing those poor people on their lands in the same way
 nazi
  did with you, you are the same evil as nazi and you do genocide on
  palestinians on their lands, shame on you cowards, without the new
 weapons
  and USA money, you could never beat palestinians.
 
  In the same time you destabilize the world peace as all the musulman
  countries could send all the army they have and drop the bombs on your
  cities, in the same way you did on palestenians, that could cause ww3.
 
  There was 400 children killed during these days, I fail to see how any
 human
  can argue about killing a child, if you isralens still supporting your
  government, then you are animals not humans.
 
  It's a shame for entire world that it could not prevent this, it seem
 like
  israel/jews are controlling the world and they don't really care about
 other
  humans...
  Evryone normal should be againts the war and killing of civilians,
 everyone
  is against the israel, so far I don't see a problem to hate you in the
 same
  way we hate nazi.
 
  ___
  Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
  Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
  Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
 

 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

___
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:09 PM, Nicolae cyt...@yahoo.com wrote:

 It's funny to see jews acting in the same way as nazi did.

Considering you are amused by seeing things that don't exist, I suggest you
visit your doctor and have him change your persciptions.




 If during ww you had these rockets that palestinians is firing you now,
 wouldn't you fire on nazi too ?

Jews in Germany were law abiding citizens, not terrorists, that were being
sent to concentration camps based on their race - and were murdered
systematically. 6 million Jews were murdered in the Holocaust - half of the
Jewish population.



 So now you are killing those poor people

We already established that it is fact that Israel is not targeting
civilians, and that Hamas is using them as human shields.
We already established that Israel is sorry for any civilian injured or hurt
in battle - but Hamas, the elected terrorist government is the one to blame
for civilian deaths - both on the Israeli and the Palestinian side.




 on their lands

We already established it was never their land.


 in the same way nazi did with you

Jews in Germany were law abiding citizens, not terrorists, that were being
sent to concentration camps based on their race - and were murdered
systematically. 6 million Jews were murdered in the Holocaust - half of the
Jewish population.

, you are the same evil as nazi

I think who is evil is you - evident by your hate speech.

and you do genocide

We already established that self-defense is not genocide - it's
self-defense.


 on palestinians on their lands

We already established it was never their land.


 , shame on you cowards

We are not hiding behind civilians.


 , without the new weapons and USA money, you could never beat palestinians.

We did.




 In the same time you destabilize the world peace

It is evident that Hamas, Al-Qaeda, Hezbollah, and the rest of the
radical-Islam terror groups are the ones that destabilize world peace.
Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists seem to be Muslim - what
does it say about your religion?

as all the musulman countries could send all the army they have and drop the
 bombs on your cities, in the same way you did on palestenians, that could
 cause ww3.

They tried, and they lost.




 There was 400 children killed during these days

Blame Hamas for using them as human shields as they fire at IDF soldiers.


 , I fail to see how any human can argue about killing a child, if you
 isralens still supporting your government, then you are animals not humans.

You are partly right, even animals have the instinct of self defense. But if
we were animals like Hamas, we would have targeted civilians and would have
ended this story long ago.

Hence we are humans, Hamas are animals - and we have to keep defending
ourselves from Hamas terrorits.




 It's a shame for entire world that it could not prevent this

Yes, it's a shame that Hamas was not stopped before Israel had to step up
and defend itself.


 , it seem like israel/jews are controlling the world and they don't really
 care about other humans...

Yes, it's all just one huge big conspiracy against you...


 Evryone normal should be againts the war and killing of civilians

Israel is against the war - it always wanted peace and always wants peace -
but it can not negotiate peace with terrorists who do not stop targetting
Israeli civilians.


 , everyone is against the israel

Judging by your typos and bad grammer it seems that you are one (very bored)
person.



 , so far I don't see a problem to hate you in the same way we hate nazi.

I'm not worried as you don't seem to hate the Nazis that much.

Then again, if it makes you happy - I give you permission to hate me.


 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

___
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:15 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists seem to be Muslim
 This is pure propaganda .

You are right.



















 2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 Wow internet threats - really scary... What's your name kid?

 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.comwrote:

 Nazis knew the real value of zionist , no wonder they wanted to burn
 them all. Everytime Zionist think they become stronger , they do
 something to deserve to get killed , then later complain that others
 hate them.  They destroyed the Soviet union and now they want to
 destroy the Arab world. Next is Europe  USA. They want us to live the
 miserable live they used to live. Because god have punished them to
 never give them a permanant land ever. Israel is just temporary. We
 will see soon Schneider in a refugee camp speaking to media and
 telling how scared he is from the bad people of the world.

 2009/1/18 Nicolae cyt...@yahoo.com:
  It's funny to see jews acting in the same way as nazi did.
 
  If during ww you had these rockets that palestinians is firing you now,
  wouldn't you fire on nazi too ?
 
  So now you are killing those poor people on their lands in the same way
 nazi
  did with you, you are the same evil as nazi and you do genocide on
  palestinians on their lands, shame on you cowards, without the new
 weapons
  and USA money, you could never beat palestinians.
 
  In the same time you destabilize the world peace as all the musulman
  countries could send all the army they have and drop the bombs on your
  cities, in the same way you did on palestenians, that could cause ww3.
 
  There was 400 children killed during these days, I fail to see how any
 human
  can argue about killing a child, if you isralens still supporting your
  government, then you are animals not humans.
 
  It's a shame for entire world that it could not prevent this, it seem
 like
  israel/jews are controlling the world and they don't really care about
 other
  humans...
  Evryone normal should be againts the war and killing of civilians,
 everyone
  is against the israel, so far I don't see a problem to hate you in the
 same
  way we hate nazi.
 
  ___
  Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
  Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
  Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
 

 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/



 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/




___
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:53 PM, None None keep.the.secret.sec...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Is Irish Republican Army Muslim?

AFAIK, and I might be wrong here, the IRA was not targeting civilians,
besides - I used the word 'seem' - hence I did not state it as fact just as
an anecdote.


 Is Informal Anarchist Federation Muslim?
 Is Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia Muslim?
 ... ... ...

The list is very small, regardless see my  answer above.


 but all terrorists seem to be Muslim
 Some terrorsits seem to be catholic

Very few.


 Some terrorists seem to be jew

Even fewer.



 and so on...

Please keep going...



 These people are not Muslims, Catholics, Jews,..., they are JUST
 terrorists. Nothing more.

Agree.




 Terrorists are dangerous extremists.

Agree.

Here's a list of designated terrorist organizations - pulled out of
wikipedia:
Abu Nidal Organization
Abu Sayyaf Group
Achik National Volunteer Council
Akhil Bharat Nepali Ekta Samaj
Al-Aqsa e.V.
Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade
Al-Badr
Al Ghurabaa
Al Ittihad Al Islamia
al-Qa'ida
al-Qa'ida in Iraq
al-Qaeda Organization in the Islamic Maghreb
Al-Umar-Mujahideen
All Tripura Tiger Force
Ansar al-Islam
Ansar us-Sunna
Armed Islamic Group
Asbat al-Ansar
Aum Shinrikyo
Babbar Khalsa
Babbar Khalsa International
Baluchistan Liberation Army
Communist Party of India (Maoist)
Communist Party of the Philippines/
New People's Army
Continuity Irish Republican Army
Cumann na mBan
Deendar Anjuman
Dukhtaran-E-Millat
Egyptian Islamic Jihad
Euskadi ta Askatasuna
Fatah al-Islam
Fianna na hEireann
Gama'a al-Islamiyya
GRAPO
Great Eastern Islamic Raiders' Front
Hamas
Harakat-ul-Jihad-ul-Islami
Harakat-ul-Jihad-ul-Islami (Bangladesh)
Harakat ul-Mujahidin
Harakat-Ul-Mujahideen/Alami
Hezb-e Islami Gulbuddin
Hezbollah
Hizbul Mujahideen
Holy Land Foundation
for Relief and Development
Hynniewtrep National Liberation Council
Informal Anarchist Federation[5]
International Sikh Youth Federation
Islamic Army of Aden
Islamic Jihad Union
Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan
Irish National Liberation Army
Irish People's Liberation Organisation
Irish Republican Army
Jaish-e-Mohammed
Jamaat ul-Furquan
Jamaat-ul-Mujahideen
Jamaat-ul-Mujahideen Bangladesh
Jamiat ul-Ansar
Jammu and Kashmir Islamic Front
Jemaah Islamiya
Kach/Kahane Chai
Kanglei Yaol Kanba Lup
Kangleipak Communist Party
Khalistan Commando Force
Khuddam ul-Islam
Kurdistan Freedom Falcons
Kurdistan Workers' Party
Lashkar-e-Toiba
Lashkar-e-Jhangvi
Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam
Libyan Islamic Fighting Group
Loyalist Volunteer Force
Manipur People's Liberation Front
Moroccan Islamic Combatant Group
Mujahedin-e Khalq
National Democratic Front of Bodoland
National Liberation Army
National Liberation Front of Tripura
Nuclei Armati per il Comunismo
Nuclei di Iniziativa Proletaria
Nuclei Territoriali Antimperialisti
Nucleo di Iniziativa Proletaria Rivoluzionaria
Orange Volunteers
Palestine Liberation Front
Palestinian Islamic Jihad
People's Liberation Army
People's Revolutionary Party of Kangleipak
Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine
Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine-
General Command
Real IRA
Red Brigades for the construction
of the Combative Communist Party
Red Hand Commando
Red Hand Defenders
Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia
Revolutionary Nuclei
Revolutionary Organization 17 November
Revolutionary People's Front
Revolutionary People's Liberation Party/Front
Revolutionary Struggle
Saor Éire
Saviour Sect
Shining Path[6]
Sipah-e-Sahaba Pakistan
Stichting Al Aqsa
Students Islamic Movement of India
Takfir wal-Hijra
Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi
Tamil Nadu Liberation Army
Tamil National Retrieval Troops
Ulster Defence Association
Ulster Freedom Fighters
Ulster Volunteer Force
United Liberation Front of Asom
United National Liberation Front
United Self-Defense Forces of Colombia
Vanguards of Conquest
World Tamil Movement


Without checking, I bet the vast majority of these are Muslim. I would be
glad to be proven wrong.



 That's all.

 C.

 2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com:
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:15 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists seem to be Muslim
  This is pure propaganda .
 
  You are right.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com
 
  Wow internet threats - really scary... What's your name kid?
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
  Nazis knew the real value of zionist , no wonder they wanted to burn
  them all. Everytime Zionist think they become stronger , they do
  something to deserve to get killed , then later complain that others
  hate them.  They destroyed the Soviet union and now they want to
  destroy the Arab world. Next is Europe  USA. They want us to live the
  miserable live they used to live. Because god have punished them to
  never give them a permanant land ever. Israel is just temporary. We

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 4:01 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:


 Hamas is also designated as a terrorist organization by the US state
 department.
  What a nice reference 

 Do you dispute it?

 Yes i do, a problem with that ?

Yes, you have a problem.







 I said Hamas was, and that the Palestinians elected Hamas as
 governement.
 Hamas resist against your invasion.

 How? By firing at _civilians_? Sending suicide bombers to attack
 _civilians_? And doing everything it possibly can to attack _civilians_?

 Yes it's a war, Palestine has never been in peace with you guys, and i
 understand why.
 You guys are armed by US ... Palestinian do not have equivalent weapons
 Btw did you forgot Sabra  shatilla ? just in case :
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila_massacre
 Your argument is pointless once again, but i guess amnesia 101 is your
 bedside book.

I have already commented on that - why do you keep repeating yourself like a
broken record?
Go talk to your brothers in Lebanon who did the massacre.


 If Israel really wanted to kill Palestinians in general, it could do it
 much cheaper and with no Israeli casualties.

 They did remember now ?

No, I was referring to Israel being able to wipe Gaza with 0 casualties on
the Israeli side, and in less than 10 minutes. Israel did not do that.






 Israel pulled out of Gazaa and let the Palestinians have their own
 govornment,

 Oh you guys are so nice.. shall they say thanks ?

Yes.




 they basically gave them everything they wanted on a silver plate, in
 return Hamas and other Palestinian terrorist groups, sent terrorist suicide
 bombers accross the border - to kill as many Israeli _civilians_ as
 possible.


 Yep that's war remember ?

So trying to kill as many Israeli _civilians_ is OK in your book,
but Israel attempting to kill those terrorists _without_  harming
_civilians_ on the Palestinian side (a mission impossible task) is wrong?





 Israel is _avoiding civilian casualties_, it is _sorry_ for any
 _civilians_ wounded or killed during fighting - but this is a _war_, and
 _civilians die_ - especially since Hamas is using Palestinian civilians as
 human shields - http://tinyurl.com/6v45l5

 Bull-shit

You had that for lunch?





 the same as they were happy at 9/11 - when 3000 innocent civilians dies in
 the WTC - spreading candy in the streets.


 Lots of people hate USA, but i guess they're terrorists then .
 So  many european country = terrorists.
 See i'm kind i save you some words :)

No, you can hate as many people as you want - as long as you don't put your
hate into action - i.e. blow yourself up in a bus, etc... You are not a
terrorist (just a sick person).





 No other country does what Israel does - i.e. make over 250 thousand
 phonecalls to warn enemy's civilians to leave an area about to be bombed -
 during war.

 Do you guys want a nobel price or something ?

Both.




 Now quoting party is over, let's also talk about fact:
 Israel are illegal since 1948.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1929_Hebron_massacre



 They have stolen lots of land in jordany, egypt,

I guess they should have not opened war on Israel...


 palestine

There was no such country - there were no Palestinians back then. It's a new
invention.


 , liban

You mean Lebanon?


 while playing at war with them neighbors.

Yes, 'playing' in a war that the Arabs started. And winning that war.


 Btw no one of theses neighbors wanted  the creation of the state of israel

But the UN disagreed.


 , which is totally understandable

It was not up to them.


 ,  but US and British got the last word.

No, Israel did.



 Israel also made a nuclear bomb illegaly

Prove that.


 , they shouldn't have that one.

Why? Are you scared?



 Also about the elected people by god stuff, i forgot to said that  the man
 who wrote the torah was jew ;)

Yes, Mosses was a Jew.


 The bigger problems with zionist, is they control most of the medias around
 the world,

 most of the banks, them community are pretty strong around.
 Making/doing propaganda is an easy game for them, you cant touch jews,
 because as avraham do, everytime you hit them,

Sure... It's all just 1 huge big conspiracy against you.


 they play the holocaust card.

 I didn't bring up the holocaust - you did by comparing Israel to the Nazis.


 If someone in europe throw some coktails molotov on a  mosque, nothing
 happens

When did that happen?


 , but if you do the same on a synagogue,  all the politics will be
 condaming the authors of this attak, kind of frustrating eh ?

No. You are.




 You have to understand something Avraham

I don't.


 , a lots of people (not muslims) hate zionist, there's a reason for this

Yes - evil exists.


 , you've asked for it.

No - it's just a fact of life.




 As you got to understand that a lots of people do not like the US, for what
 they've done in central ameriqua for exemple

Use a spell checker or something...


 , or for playing the world

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 4:39 PM, Mainbox Notif rokade...@gmail.com wrote:


 Looks to me as a list of charities.
 Do you know a website where I can join them all?

Yes - http://www.hell.com/



 :)



 2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 Abu Nidal Organization
 Abu Sayyaf Group
 Achik National Volunteer Council
 Akhil Bharat Nepali Ekta Samaj
 Al-Aqsa e.V.
 Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade
 Al-Badr
 Al Ghurabaa
 Al Ittihad Al Islamia
 al-Qa'ida
 al-Qa'ida in Iraq
 al-Qaeda Organization in the Islamic Maghreb
 Al-Umar-Mujahideen
 All Tripura Tiger Force
 Ansar al-Islam
 Ansar us-Sunna
 Armed Islamic Group
 Asbat al-Ansar
 Aum Shinrikyo
 Babbar Khalsa
 Babbar Khalsa International
 Baluchistan Liberation Army
 Communist Party of India (Maoist)
 Communist Party of the Philippines/
 New People's Army
 Continuity Irish Republican Army
 Cumann na mBan
 Deendar Anjuman
 Dukhtaran-E-Millat
 Egyptian Islamic Jihad
 Euskadi ta Askatasuna
 Fatah al-Islam
 Fianna na hEireann
 Gama'a al-Islamiyya
 GRAPO
 Great Eastern Islamic Raiders' Front
 Hamas
 Harakat-ul-Jihad-ul-Islami
 Harakat-ul-Jihad-ul-Islami (Bangladesh)
 Harakat ul-Mujahidin
 Harakat-Ul-Mujahideen/Alami
 Hezb-e Islami Gulbuddin
 Hezbollah
 Hizbul Mujahideen
 Holy Land Foundation
 for Relief and Development
 Hynniewtrep National Liberation Council
 Informal Anarchist Federation[5]
 International Sikh Youth Federation
 Islamic Army of Aden
 Islamic Jihad Union
 Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan
 Irish National Liberation Army
 Irish People's Liberation Organisation
 Irish Republican Army
 Jaish-e-Mohammed
 Jamaat ul-Furquan
 Jamaat-ul-Mujahideen
 Jamaat-ul-Mujahideen Bangladesh
 Jamiat ul-Ansar
 Jammu and Kashmir Islamic Front
 Jemaah Islamiya
 Kach/Kahane Chai
 Kanglei Yaol Kanba Lup
 Kangleipak Communist Party
 Khalistan Commando Force
 Khuddam ul-Islam
 Kurdistan Freedom Falcons
 Kurdistan Workers' Party
 Lashkar-e-Toiba
 Lashkar-e-Jhangvi
 Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam
 Libyan Islamic Fighting Group
 Loyalist Volunteer Force
 Manipur People's Liberation Front
 Moroccan Islamic Combatant Group
 Mujahedin-e Khalq
 National Democratic Front of Bodoland
 National Liberation Army
 National Liberation Front of Tripura
 Nuclei Armati per il Comunismo
 Nuclei di Iniziativa Proletaria
 Nuclei Territoriali Antimperialisti
 Nucleo di Iniziativa Proletaria Rivoluzionaria
 Orange Volunteers
 Palestine Liberation Front
 Palestinian Islamic Jihad
 People's Liberation Army
 People's Revolutionary Party of Kangleipak
 Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine
 Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine-
 General Command
 Real IRA
 Red Brigades for the construction
 of the Combative Communist Party
 Red Hand Commando
 Red Hand Defenders
 Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia
 Revolutionary Nuclei
 Revolutionary Organization 17 November
 Revolutionary People's Front
 Revolutionary People's Liberation Party/Front
 Revolutionary Struggle
 Saor Éire
 Saviour Sect
 Shining Path[6]
 Sipah-e-Sahaba Pakistan
 Stichting Al Aqsa
 Students Islamic Movement of India
 Takfir wal-Hijra
 Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi
 Tamil Nadu Liberation Army
 Tamil National Retrieval Troops
 Ulster Defence Association
 Ulster Freedom Fighters
 Ulster Volunteer Force
 United Liberation Front of Asom
 United National Liberation Front
 United Self-Defense Forces of Colombia
 Vanguards of Conquest
 World Tamil Movement


 Without checking, I bet the vast majority of these are Muslim. I would be
 glad to be proven wrong.



 That's all.

 C.

 2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com:
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:15 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists seem to be
 Muslim
  This is pure propaganda .
 
  You are right.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com
 
  Wow internet threats - really scary... What's your name kid?
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Prototype This 
 termin...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
  Nazis knew the real value of zionist , no wonder they wanted to burn
  them all. Everytime Zionist think they become stronger , they do
  something to deserve to get killed , then later complain that others
  hate them.  They destroyed the Soviet union and now they want to
  destroy the Arab world. Next is Europe  USA. They want us to live
 the
  miserable live they used to live. Because god have punished them to
  never give them a permanant land ever. Israel is just temporary. We
  will see soon Schneider in a refugee camp speaking to media and
  telling how scared he is from the bad people of the world.
 
  2009/1/18 Nicolae cyt...@yahoo.com:
   It's funny to see jews acting in the same way as nazi did.
  
   If during ww you had these rockets that palestinians is firing you
   now,
   wouldn't you fire on nazi too ?
  
   So now you are killing those poor people on their lands in the
 same
   way nazi
   did with you, you are the same evil

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 4:46 PM, Alaa Abdelwahab alaa.abdelwa...@free.frwrote:

  Without checking, I bet the vast majority of these are Muslim. I would
 be glad to be proven wrong.



 Guess what, Islam is for more than 1400 Years, Israel is there since 60
 years. Now how old is any of the list you motioned ? do you know that none
 of them even exist before The evil Israel exists ?

Before the Arab conquest

In 586 BCE King Nebuchadnezzar II of Babylon conquered the Kingdom of Judah
and exiled the population to Babylon.

The Bible recounts how, in 538 BCE Cyrus the Great of Persia conquered
Babylon and issued a proclamation granting the people of Judah their
freedom. 50,000 Judeans, led by Zerubabel returned. A second group of 5000,
led by Ezra and Nehemiah, returned to Judea in 456 BCE.

In 332 BCE Alexander the Great conquered Judea and ordered the first
translation of the bible (the Septuagint). In the second century, Antiochus
IV Epiphanes tried to eradicate Judaism leading to the 174 - 135 BCE
Maccabean Revolt. The success of this revolt is celebrated in the Jewish
festival of Chanukka.

In 64 BCE the Roman General, Pompey conquered Judea.

See also: Jewish-Roman wars

In 66 CE the Jews broke free of Rome , naming their new kingdom, Israel (to
distinguish it from Roman-controlled Judea). The revolt was defeated and
Jerusalem destroyed by Titus in the year 70 CE. A second Jewish revolt in
135 CE also renamed the country Israel, and its defeat led the emperor
Hadrian to rename Jerusalem to Aelia Capitolina.[3] Jews were barred from
living there and the Roman province, until then known as Iudaea Province,
was renamed to Palaestina; no other revolt led to a province being renamed.
The names Palestine (in English) and Filistin (in Arabic) derive from
this Latin name.[4]

See also: Development of the Jewish Bible canon

Despite persecution, key Jewish religious texts were compiled in Israel
between 200 CE and 1000 CE. In the second century Israeli Rabbis decided
which books could be regarded as part of the Hebrew Bible. The Jewish
apocrypha were left out (including the Books of the Maccabees). Sacred
Jewish texts written in Israel in this period include the Mishnah (200 CE),
the Gemara (400 CE) and the Talmud (500 CE).

In 614 a Jewish revolt against Byzantine Emperor Heraclius with Persian
support failed, leading to an edict expelling the Jews from Palestine.
Twenty years later, in 631, the Arabs defeated Heraclius and conquered the
area. Over the next few centuries, Islam became the dominant religion in the
area.

[edit] After the Arab Conquest

Between the 7th and 11th centuries, Jewish scribes, called the Masoretes and
located in the Galilee and Jerusalem, established the Masoretic Text, the
final text of the Hebrew Bible.

The name Palestine fell out of use under the Crusaders, who called the
kingdoms they established there Outremer (overseas). During the Crusades,
Jews in Israel were massacred, burnt alive or sold into slavery.[5] The
murder of Jews began during the Crusaders' travels across Europe and
continued in the Holy Land.[6] Ashkenazi orthodox Jews still recite a prayer
in memory of the destruction caused by the Crusades.

From 1260 to 1300 Israel became the frontier between Mongol invaders (who
were Crusader allies) and the Mamluks of Egypt. The conflict impoverished
the area and severely reduced its population. Sultan Baybars of Egypt
eventually expelled the Crusaders and Mongols.

The collapse of the Crusades was followed by the expulsion of Jews from
England (1290) and later France (1391). Muslim defeats led to expulsions of
Jews from Spain (the Alhambra decree 1492) and Portugal (1497). Each
expulsion and wave of religious persecution led to movement of Jews to
Israel.

Under the Ottomans (1517—1917) the area was part of the province of Syria.

During the 1648—1654 Khmelnytsky Uprising in the Ukraine over 100,000 Jews
were massacred in Eastern Europe, leading to further migration. The Jewish
population of Israel was concentrated in the Four Holy Cities.

In 1799 Napoleon briefly occupied the coast and offered to create a Jewish
state there but the offer was rejected by the Jews.

By the 19th century, the Land of Israel was populated mostly by Muslim and
Christian Arabs, as well as Jews, Greeks, Druze, Bedouins and other
minorities. In 1844, Jews constituted the largest population group in
Jerusalem and by 1890 an absolute majority in the city, although as a whole
the Jewish population made up far less than 10% of the region.[7][8]

When the British conquered the area in 1917, they named it Palestine and
defined the boundaries to include modern Israel and Jordan.



 So should we call them Muslim terrorists?

 Sure, if that makes you happy.



 You are the evil and as long you exist the world will suffer.

And you are a rabbit wearing a pink shirt.



 Years before any of the resistance groups exist who did sabra and chatila
 massacre?

Go talk to your brothers in Lebanon who did

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 5:26 PM, Handrix hand...@gmail.com wrote:



 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:45 PM, Avraham Schneider 
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:



 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 4:39 PM, Mainbox Notif rokade...@gmail.comwrote:


 Looks to me as a list of charities.
 Do you know a website where I can join them all?

 Yes - http://www.hell.com/

 Yes, with its big eight doors, it's for people like you.

I'm not that fat. Besides, I am not planning on joining them...






 :)



 2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 Abu Nidal Organization
 Abu Sayyaf Group
 Achik National Volunteer Council
 Akhil Bharat Nepali Ekta Samaj
 Al-Aqsa e.V.
 Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade
 Al-Badr
 Al Ghurabaa
 Al Ittihad Al Islamia
 al-Qa'ida
 al-Qa'ida in Iraq
 al-Qaeda Organization in the Islamic Maghreb
 Al-Umar-Mujahideen
 All Tripura Tiger Force
 Ansar al-Islam
 Ansar us-Sunna
 Armed Islamic Group
 Asbat al-Ansar
 Aum Shinrikyo
 Babbar Khalsa
 Babbar Khalsa International
 Baluchistan Liberation Army
 Communist Party of India (Maoist)
 Communist Party of the Philippines/
 New People's Army
 Continuity Irish Republican Army
 Cumann na mBan
 Deendar Anjuman
 Dukhtaran-E-Millat
 Egyptian Islamic Jihad
 Euskadi ta Askatasuna
 Fatah al-Islam
 Fianna na hEireann
 Gama'a al-Islamiyya
 GRAPO
 Great Eastern Islamic Raiders' Front
 Hamas
 Harakat-ul-Jihad-ul-Islami
 Harakat-ul-Jihad-ul-Islami (Bangladesh)
 Harakat ul-Mujahidin
 Harakat-Ul-Mujahideen/Alami
 Hezb-e Islami Gulbuddin
 Hezbollah
 Hizbul Mujahideen
 Holy Land Foundation
 for Relief and Development
 Hynniewtrep National Liberation Council
 Informal Anarchist Federation[5]
 International Sikh Youth Federation
 Islamic Army of Aden
 Islamic Jihad Union
 Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan
 Irish National Liberation Army
 Irish People's Liberation Organisation
 Irish Republican Army
 Jaish-e-Mohammed
 Jamaat ul-Furquan
 Jamaat-ul-Mujahideen
 Jamaat-ul-Mujahideen Bangladesh
 Jamiat ul-Ansar
 Jammu and Kashmir Islamic Front
 Jemaah Islamiya
 Kach/Kahane Chai
 Kanglei Yaol Kanba Lup
 Kangleipak Communist Party
 Khalistan Commando Force
 Khuddam ul-Islam
 Kurdistan Freedom Falcons
 Kurdistan Workers' Party
 Lashkar-e-Toiba
 Lashkar-e-Jhangvi
 Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam
 Libyan Islamic Fighting Group
 Loyalist Volunteer Force
 Manipur People's Liberation Front
 Moroccan Islamic Combatant Group
 Mujahedin-e Khalq
 National Democratic Front of Bodoland
 National Liberation Army
 National Liberation Front of Tripura
 Nuclei Armati per il Comunismo
 Nuclei di Iniziativa Proletaria
 Nuclei Territoriali Antimperialisti
 Nucleo di Iniziativa Proletaria Rivoluzionaria
 Orange Volunteers
 Palestine Liberation Front
 Palestinian Islamic Jihad
 People's Liberation Army
 People's Revolutionary Party of Kangleipak
 Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine
 Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine-
 General Command
 Real IRA
 Red Brigades for the construction
 of the Combative Communist Party
 Red Hand Commando
 Red Hand Defenders
 Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia
 Revolutionary Nuclei
 Revolutionary Organization 17 November
 Revolutionary People's Front
 Revolutionary People's Liberation Party/Front
 Revolutionary Struggle
 Saor Éire
 Saviour Sect
 Shining Path[6]
 Sipah-e-Sahaba Pakistan
 Stichting Al Aqsa
 Students Islamic Movement of India
 Takfir wal-Hijra
 Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi
 Tamil Nadu Liberation Army
 Tamil National Retrieval Troops
 Ulster Defence Association
 Ulster Freedom Fighters
 Ulster Volunteer Force
 United Liberation Front of Asom
 United National Liberation Front
 United Self-Defense Forces of Colombia
 Vanguards of Conquest
 World Tamil Movement


 Without checking, I bet the vast majority of these are Muslim. I would
 be glad to be proven wrong.



 That's all.

 C.

 2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com:
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:15 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  Not all Muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists seem to be
 Muslim
  This is pure propaganda .
 
  You are right.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  2009/1/19 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com
 
  Wow internet threats - really scary... What's your name kid?
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:06 PM, Prototype This 
 termin...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
  Nazis knew the real value of zionist , no wonder they wanted to
 burn
  them all. Everytime Zionist think they become stronger , they do
  something to deserve to get killed , then later complain that
 others
  hate them.  They destroyed the Soviet union and now they want to
  destroy the Arab world. Next is Europe  USA. They want us to live
 the
  miserable live they used to live. Because god have punished them
 to
  never give them a permanant land ever. Israel is just temporary.
 We
  will see soon Schneider in a refugee camp speaking to media and
  telling how scared he is from the bad people of the world.
 
  2009/1/18 Nicolae cyt...@yahoo.com:
   It's funny

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 5:38 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

Hamas is also designated as a terrorist organization by the US
state department.

What a nice reference

Do you dispute it?

Yes i do, a problem with that ?

Yes, you have a problem.

So because i dont agree i have a problem ?
Go fuck yourself

I said Hamas was, and that the Palestinians elected Hamas as
governement.
Hamas resist against your invasion.

How? By firing at _civilians_? Sending suicide bombers to attack
_civilians_? And doing everything it possibly can to attack _civilians_?

Yes it's a war, Palestine has never been in peace with you guys, and i
understand why.
You guys are armed by US ... Palestinian do not have equivalent
weapons
Btw did you forgot Sabra shatilla ? just in case :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila_massacre
Your argument is pointless once again, but i guess amnesia 101 is your
bedside book.

I have already commented on that - why do you keep repeating yourself like
a broken record?
Go talk to your brothers in Lebanon who did the massacre.

First of all lebanon are not my brothers, i'm not an arabian or muslim.
I'm an european atheist.
Go fuck yourself (2)

they basically gave them everything they wanted on a silver plate, in
return Hamas and other Palestinian terrorist groups, sent terrorist suicide
bombers accross the border - to kill as many Israeli _civilians_ as
possible.

Yep that's war remember ?

So trying to kill as many Israeli _civilians_ is OK in your book,

Yes it's war, RTFM

No, it's terrorism, RTFM

while playing at war with them neighbors.

Yes, 'playing' in a war that the Arabs started. And winning that war.

If i was forced to have a redneck neighbor zionist integrist like you, i
would too.

What? Be a loser?

Btw no one of theses neighbors wanted the creation of the state of
israel

But the UN disagreed.

Yeah, and who has the last word at UN ?

The UN?

, which is totally understandable

It was not up to them.

Well they are the first concerned.

Concerned about what?

, but US and British got the last word.

No, Israel did.

Via the british and US support.

The Arabs had Russia's support - regardless - they lost - game over.

Israel also made a nuclear bomb illegaly

Prove that.

It's allready proven.

No - http://www.letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=define%3Aproof

You really need to start discerning facts from opinion, you should ask your
school teacher for help if you have trouble with that (You're already in 3rd
grade right?)

http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Israel/index.html

The bigger problems with zionist, is they control most of the medias
around the world,

most of the banks, them community are pretty strong around.
Making/doing propaganda is an easy game for them, you cant touch jews,
because as avraham do, everytime you hit them,

Sure... It's all just 1 huge big conspiracy against you.

Nop, no conspiracy, just a FACT.

Read above.

they play the holocaust card.

I didn't bring up the holocaust - you did by comparing Israel to the
Nazis.

First i never compared israel to the nazis (or prove it), secondly you did
bring up holocaust:
- http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2009/Jan/0736.html

It is apparent that you, handrix and all the other gmail pseudo-names you
use are the same individual - so it does not matter under which handle you
have chosen to make this claim.

But if you would not like to be held responsible for that statement under
this handle, I'm fine with it - consider it as proof against the claims you
made under the other handle you were using.

http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2009/Jan/0736.html

If someone in europe throw some coktails molotov on a mosque, nothing
happens

When did that happen?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=enq=cocktail+molotov+mosque

OK - whoever did that was stupid, and would be classified as a terrorist.
I have no idea who did it, and I have no association with him whatsoever.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=enq=cocktail+molotov+mosque

You have to understand something Avraham

I don't.

I know.

Great.

, a lots of people (not muslims) hate zionist, there's a reason for this

Yes - evil exists.

So the one who doesn't like you guys, are evil

Yes.

This is once again propaganda.

True.

As you got to understand that a lots of people do not like the US, for
what they've done in central ameriqua for exemple
Use a spell checker or something...

Go fuck yourself, is that well spelled ?

Yes, but completely irrelevant.

, dont you remember, talibans was good terrorists when they was fighting
agains communists, now that they fight against US,

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 6:42 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

while playing at war with them neighbors.

Yes, 'playing' in a war that the Arabs started. And winning that war.

If i was forced to have a redneck neighbor zionist integrist like you,
i would too.

What? Be a loser?

I would start a war too. understand now ?

You could have just answered yes to my question.

, which is totally understandable

It was not up to them.

Well they are the first concerned.

Concerned about what?

Arabians are the first concerned about having a new hostil neighbor

Israel was never hostile to the Arab countries - on the contrary, the Arab
countries were hostile to Israel, started a war and shamefully lost, against
all odds.

israel also made a nuclear bomb illegaly

Prove that.

It's allready proven.

No - http://www.letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=define%3Aproof

You really need to start discerning facts from opinion

They have the bomb and everyone know that.

There's a clear distinction between beleifs and knowledge.
Everyone beleives Israel have nukes. Nobody (other than those who need to),
knows for certain.

So yes it's a FACT

Recheck the definition in the dictionary.

Not an opinion, there's proof

Show it.

, and israel didn't said yes, and didn't said no, which confirm that they
have it.

Why would Israel say no, when it scares the crap out of you and your
buddies?

Or maybe it's once again a conspiracy against israel :(.

The bigger problems with zionist, is they control most of the medias
around the world,

most of the banks, them community are pretty strong around.
Making/doing propaganda is an easy game for them, you cant touch jews,
because as avraham do, everytime you hit them,

Sure... It's all just 1 huge big conspiracy against you.

Nop, no conspiracy, just a FACT.

Read above.

Still a FACT .

Read above.

they play the holocaust card.

I didn't bring up the holocaust - you did by comparing Israel to the
Nazis.

First i never compared israel to the nazis (or prove it), secondly you
did bring up holocaust:
- http://seclists.org/fulldisclosure/2009/Jan/0736.html

It is apparent that you, handrix and all the other gmail pseudo-names you
use are the same individual - so it does not matter under which handle you
have chosen to make this claim.

But if you would not like to be held responsible for that statement under
this handle, I'm fine with it - consider it as proof against the claims you
made under the other handle you were using.

Omagad, that's a good one, do you really believe that only one person here
hate you or the zionist ?
Anyways just look at the writing style, spelling, grammar, and opinion you
would notice if you're mentaly stable that it's different persons.

I took your advice, looked at the writing style, spelling, grammer and
opinion - and I came to the conclusion that you are a sick and retarded
individual.

As you got to understand that a lots of people do not like the US, for
what they've done in central ameriqua for exemple
Use a spell checker or something...

Go fuck yourself, is that well spelled ?

Yes, but completely irrelevant.

Nop it's pertinant.

Read above.

, dont you remember, talibans was good terrorists when they was
fighting agains communists, now that they fight against US, they are bad
terrorists.

You agree that they are terrorists then?

I agree on the fact that you're pathetic.

How did you arrive at that conclusion?

just reading your posts

Great. Had enough?

stifles yourself with your propaganda.

Your English sucks for someone trying to do propaganda on a ComSec
mailing list.

It's well written, open up your english to hebrew translator, and once
again go fuck yourself.

I can read and write in English just fine without the help of a translator
- you on the other hand need to work on your grammar and spelling, as well
as wash you mouth and fingers with plenty of soap.

Well if you cant understand the phrase :

stifles yourself with your propaganda.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/stifle

v. sti·fled, sti·fling, sti·fles v.tr.
1. To interrupt or cut off (the voice, for example).
2. To keep in or hold back; repress: stifled my indignation.
3. To kill by preventing respiration; smother or suffocate.-- this
is the one (suffocate) :)
See you should open up your translator sometimes

You are a retard - go check your grammar.

btw what's that fixation thing with soap ?

No fixation, just after all the BS you have been typing you fingers are
probably full of cow manure.
You think that cursing on an Internet forum does you any good and/or help
your credibility?
You are probably also

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

This mailing list, and any other un-moderated list for that matter, work
asynchronously - i.e. you can always post a security related message on this
thread, or open a new thread by composing an e-mail with a different
subject.

We are not blocking and you don't need our permission to do so.

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 10:18 AM, James Matthews nytrok...@gmail.comwrote:

 Now that the conflict is over can we get back to security?


 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 9:16 AM, Avraham Schneider 
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:

 s/neiboring/neighboring/g


 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 9:09 AM, Avraham Schneider 
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 8:18 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

 You can go to the Kneset website and find out.
 Oh so there's  a website dedicated to the one who didn't get corrupted ?
 Oh come on , you know what i'm talking about your country is driven
 by that .

 There is corruption everywere - you think there is no corruption in any
 of the surrounding arab countries?
 Israel has a legal system and when one is found corrupt, he pays his time
 - even if he was a minister, or a president.
 This is something that can only happen in a democracy - something the
 neiboring arab countries should adopt.




 Oh Oh Oh, you dont like to play the propaganda game with me ?
 No I don't.

 i understand that :)

 Die slowly with lots of pain.

 I plan to live on for many more years... If you have a problem with that,
 you can try and change that but I don't think that would be good for your
 health...






  2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 8:01 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

 haha, how much time this took you to say that ?
 You're paied to make propaganda on FD this more than clear.
 you dont answer on any real questions

 You obviously ignore everything I write


 , you say always the same stuff

 No - I answer your questions, and I correct false claims made by you.


 , aka yeah but hamas was elected by palestinian so palestinian should
 die

 When did I say that?


 , but know what , not talking about war anymore here,

 Great!


 just  your polititian.
 Give me just one name of an isreali president or first minister who
 didn't end up his mandate with corruption charges.

 You can go to the Kneset website and find out.



 and what you still  promoting them ?

 Not promoting any of them - just responding to your false claims and
 propaganda.



 Oh Oh Oh, you dont like to play the propaganda game with me ?

 No I don't.







 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 I guess I can't prove that I don't, so what can I say...

 Do you have anything you find incorrect in what I have responded to
 you, or you are done with your nonsense and the list can go back to 
 being a
 Computer Security Mailing List?

 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 7:32 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

  You are paid to say that Avraham, and it's a shame.2009/1/18
 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 2:00 AM, andrew. wallace 
 andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the
 Israeli's have.

 During war, when you are fired at, you shoot back without asking
 questions.




 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

 Then they should make sure that no terrorists fire at IDF soldiers
 from there.


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 --
 http://www.astorandblack.com/

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

Then I guess he shouldn't complain...

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 5:22 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:

 On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 15:03:24 +0200, Avraham Schneider said:

  If I'm a troll, why do you feed me then?

 He probably has a 50 pound bag of Purina Troll Chow that he's trying to get
 rid of.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 5:47 PM, Mainbox Notif rokade...@gmail.com wrote:

 Israel has one of the most powerful and advanced armies.
 But they cannot find their enemy.

Sure they can - Hamas is hiding in civilian homes, firing rockets from the
rooftops and use civilian homes for weapon storage.



 When there is maybe one hamas-soldier, the israeli can't shoot him when hey
 is in a building, the israeli bomb the whole building.

You wrongly assume it is one hamas-soldier -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_OGhj43GAE watch this video, it will explain
a bit...




 In modern world we use intelligence and we have snipers.

True.


 In modern world we do not blow up a whole building when there are probably
 weapons from the enemy in that building.

You need to prove that claim.



 And we do not blow up a building when there are civilians inside.

Israel calls up the civilians inside and gives them 20 minutes to evacuate,
they also drop flyers from above alerting civilians to evacuate - this is
something that is unuique in the modern world - no country is known to be
this humane at times of war.

Israel has a top priority of protecting it's own citizens - if Hamas uses
the civilians as human shields - Hamas is the one to blame for their deaths.



 In modern world we do not shoot at the enemy when he is among civilians.

You need to prive that claim.



 And we never bomb the UN or Red Cross. And then say 'sorry,  it was a
 mistake

In the medern world your enemy does not fire anti-tank misiles from a UN
or Red Cross compound at you.



 And the next day bomb another hospital. and say 'sorry' again.

We are always sorry for innocent civilian deaths - should we remind you of
the cheering that was done in the streets of Gaza, with candies being
distributed to everyone for the death of 3000 innocent American civilians at
9/11? Why didn't we see them upset for civilian casualties?




 Why do the israeli not use their army.

Not sure I understand your question? Don't you think Israel could easily
wipe out Gaza with all it's inhibitents in exactly 10 minutes? Why do you
think Israel is risking it's soldier's lives for? Exactly for the reason you
are claiming Israel is ignoring - for protecting civilian lives.




 I agree that their army is one of the most powerful, but why not use this?

Do you want them to just Nuke Gaza?




 And apologize for my english.
 I'm not native english. I'm dutch.
 And I am sure that my english is better then your dutch.

Yes, but you are comparing Apples to Oranges. I am a native Hebrew speaker.
I don't go on Dutch forums and start mumbling nonsense in a lunguage I am
not fluent with.



 So please do not attack people because of their english.

I didn't attack you - just mentioned you need to get professional help with
your English.








 2009/1/16 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Handrix hand...@gmail.com wrote:



 On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 8:21 PM, Avraham Schneider 
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:

 Israel is fighting terrorists - those terrorists decide to attack
 websites (since they wrongly believe it will help their cause)[1] - Israel
 cares less.


 It is  Cyber-War because those terrorists are fighting a war against
 Israel - and the 'Cyber' is just an additional front for this war - not an
 important one, hence ignored by Israel, but it still is.

 If you call blowing yourself up in a bus, trying to kill as many
 passengers as possible - 'protest' - than by your definition one may call
 this 'Cyber-Protest' - but since normal people call those who practice
 suicide bombings 'terrorists', by their definition it is called either
 'Cyber-Terrorism' - or since there is a war on terror - 'Cyber-War'.

 I hope this explains it for you.



  wich terrorisme you'are talking about ?
  You do not understand the concept of terrorisme, the real terrorist is
 israel that kills children and women.
  I hope that you will learn more about terrorisme.

 First, I'd recommend you get some professional help with your English
 before you post your opinions in English for everyone to read - it doesn't
 help your credibility at all.

 Israel does not target civilians, the terrorists who Israel is fighting
 against, are.
 Those terrorists that Israelis are fighting, are using those women and
 children as human shields and use their homes as a hiding place and for
 weapon storage.

 Israel does everything it can to prevent civilian casualties, but it is
 impossible under these conditions.

 Israel has as a top priority the life and security of it's own citizens
 (Muslim, Christian or Jew), and has to defend it's borders from the evil
 attacks of those terrorists.

 The fact that those terrorists fail to acheive high numbers of casualties
 on the Israeli side and Israel is acheiving high numbers of casualties on
 the Palestinian side is attributed to the fact that Israel is stronger - not
 that Israel is wrong.

 I hope that explains it for you

Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

Do you call Valdis a troll too?

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 5:56 PM, Mainbox Notif rokade...@gmail.com wrote:


 2009/1/16 valdis.kletni...@vt.edu

 On Fri, 16 Jan 2009 15:03:24 +0200,
 He probably has a 50 pound bag of Purina Troll Chow that he's trying to
 get
 rid of.


 LOL,
 50 pound bag?
 Wrong: it was 80 pound!

 Do you want some?
 :)

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

The IDF released footage from a remote controlled spy aircarft, showing
terrorists shooting from a UN building - experts have inspected the footage
and none have contested it.

It's not that difficult to find out if it was fake or not - and considering
the IDF released it, they would not risk releasing anything fake, as it
would be shooting itself in the foot.

In general I agree, unless you can easily detect if the footage was fake or
not, videos on youtube are not reliable sources.

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Georgi Guninski gunin...@guninski.comwrote:

 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 07:42:33AM +0200, Avraham Schneider wrote:
   You're doctrinated, man!
  
  You can find videos on youtube if you don't beieve me.
 

 lolz, if videos on youtube are reliable sources you must trust me...

 btw, are you the new id of n3td3v ?



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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Georgi Guninski gunin...@guninski.comwrote:

 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 07:42:33AM +0200, Avraham Schneider wrote:
   You're doctrinated, man!
  
  You can find videos on youtube if you don't beieve me.
 

 lolz, if videos on youtube are reliable sources you must trust me...

 btw, are you the new id of n3td3v ?

nope. I am not hiding behind any ID - it's my real name.
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

yes, and Santa Claus really exists.



On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:45 PM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.comwrote:

 HAHAHA. Even the pentagon faked the 9/11 . So dont tell us that a
 little group of stupid zionists will not follow the same mistake their
 daddy did .
 Israel took down the WTC and has the weakest army in the whole
 universe. IF you didnt had planes. Israel will be just like monaco.

 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com:
  The IDF released footage from a remote controlled spy aircarft, showing
  terrorists shooting from a UN building - experts have inspected the
 footage
  and none have contested it.
 
  It's not that difficult to find out if it was fake or not - and
 considering
  the IDF released it, they would not risk releasing anything fake, as it
  would be shooting itself in the foot.
 
  In general I agree, unless you can easily detect if the footage was fake
 or
  not, videos on youtube are not reliable sources.
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Georgi Guninski gunin...@guninski.com
  wrote:
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 07:42:33AM +0200, Avraham Schneider wrote:
You're doctrinated, man!
   
   You can find videos on youtube if you don't beieve me.
  
 
  lolz, if videos on youtube are reliable sources you must trust me...
 
  btw, are you the new id of n3td3v ?
 
 
 
 
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

If you really think the IDF needs to produce fake footage, you should visit
your doctor and ask for reevaluation of your prescription medications.



On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:39 PM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 The IDF would not release anything fake? LMAO! That takes the cake.
 You're a propoganda shill.


 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:31 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  The IDF released footage from a remote controlled spy aircarft, showing
  terrorists shooting from a UN building - experts have inspected the
 footage
  and none have contested it.
 
  It's not that difficult to find out if it was fake or not - and
 considering
  the IDF released it, they would not risk releasing anything fake, as it
  would be shooting itself in the foot.
 
  In general I agree, unless you can easily detect if the footage was fake
 or
  not, videos on youtube are not reliable sources.
 

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

The topic does not change much on this discussion, so if you really cared
that much for the signal to noise ratio, you would have filtered the topic
out - especially since you use gmail...

It seems that you are enjoying this thread since you have been following it
so far, and even bothered responding to the thread.

I myself am not enjoying the thread, I respond for a totally different
reason - to disprove false claims made as part of a propaganda campain going
on here.

I hope you understand - if not - you are welcome to take the filtering
advice, and if even that does not make you happy - I guess you will have to
continue being unhappy.

Cheers.

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:49 PM, them.r...@gmail.com wrote:

 Innovative solution to all your problems, on both sides:  stop discussing
 politics on FD.  I was under the impression this was supposed to be about
 compsec, not alt.politics.middleeast.  Doesn't matter who -is- right, from
 here it looks like a bunch of kids using slightly more sophisticated
 arguments.

 Understand?  Someone is wrong on the internet, shocker, that one.  You guys
 aren't going to change each other's minds, so what you're doing is a waste
 of time and lowering the noise to signal ratio.

 Grow up.

 Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel

 -Original Message-
 From: ghost gho...@gmail.com

 Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:39:01
 To: Full Disclosurefull-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk
 Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine


 The IDF would not release anything fake? LMAO! That takes the cake.
 You're a propoganda shill.


 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:31 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  The IDF released footage from a remote controlled spy aircarft, showing
  terrorists shooting from a UN building - experts have inspected the
 footage
  and none have contested it.
 
  It's not that difficult to find out if it was fake or not - and
 considering
  the IDF released it, they would not risk releasing anything fake, as it
  would be shooting itself in the foot.
 
  In general I agree, unless you can easily detect if the footage was fake
 or
  not, videos on youtube are not reliable sources.
 

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

sure - take btselem's word for it... a bunch of Palestinians and a British
jurnalist that says:
I would stress that I looked only at the Israeli side because of the new
factor - Israel setting up a special unit to improve the projection of its
arguments around the world.
*paul.reynolds-inter...@bbc.co.uk*paul.reynolds-inter...@bbc.co.uk

Basically a jurnalist that admits to being biased and a group of
Palestinians - really credible...


On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:30 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7809371.stm

 http://www.btselem.org/English/Gaza_Strip/20081231_Army_bombs_metal_workshop_in_Gaza.asp

 Yes, see, its just a huge mass conspiracy, the whole world is against
 israel and makes this stuff up. They would never release lies and
 propaganda video. NEVER! It's not in the Zionist scum blood to lie! NO
 SIR! NEVER! The BBC is ran by Palestine!

 Label me not surprised, if someone disagrees with zionist scum they
 are labeled as either self hating if they are Jewish, or mentally
 unstable.

 Your mothers a whore and your father holds the money.


 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:09 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  The topic does not change much on this discussion, so if you really cared
  that much for the signal to noise ratio, you would have filtered the
 topic
  out - especially since you use gmail...
 
  It seems that you are enjoying this thread since you have been following
 it
  so far, and even bothered responding to the thread.
 
  I myself am not enjoying the thread, I respond for a totally different
  reason - to disprove false claims made as part of a propaganda campain
 going
  on here.
 
  I hope you understand - if not - you are welcome to take the filtering
  advice, and if even that does not make you happy - I guess you will have
 to
  continue being unhappy.
 
  Cheers.
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:49 PM, them.r...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Innovative solution to all your problems, on both sides:  stop
 discussing
  politics on FD.  I was under the impression this was supposed to be
 about
  compsec, not alt.politics.middleeast.  Doesn't matter who -is- right,
 from
  here it looks like a bunch of kids using slightly more sophisticated
  arguments.
 
  Understand?  Someone is wrong on the internet, shocker, that one.  You
  guys aren't going to change each other's minds, so what you're doing is
 a
  waste of time and lowering the noise to signal ratio.
 
  Grow up.
 
  Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
 
  -Original Message-
  From: ghost gho...@gmail.com
 
  Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:39:01
  To: Full Disclosurefull-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk
  Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine
 
 
  The IDF would not release anything fake? LMAO! That takes the cake.
  You're a propoganda shill.
 
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:31 PM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
   The IDF released footage from a remote controlled spy aircarft,
 showing
   terrorists shooting from a UN building - experts have inspected the
   footage
   and none have contested it.
  
   It's not that difficult to find out if it was fake or not - and
   considering
   the IDF released it, they would not risk releasing anything fake, as
 it
   would be shooting itself in the foot.
  
   In general I agree, unless you can easily detect if the footage was
 fake
   or
   not, videos on youtube are not reliable sources.
  
 
  ___
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  Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
  Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
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  Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Here you go -
http://tinyurl.com/6v45l5
http://tinyurl.com/lu4et*

*
Have fun reading facts...


On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:41 AM, Avraham Schneider 
avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:

 sure - take btselem's word for it... a bunch of Palestinians and a British
 jurnalist that says:
 I would stress that I looked only at the Israeli side because of the new
 factor - Israel setting up a special unit to improve the projection of its
 arguments around the world. 
 *paul.reynolds-inter...@bbc.co.uk*paul.reynolds-inter...@bbc.co.uk

 Basically a jurnalist that admits to being biased and a group of
 Palestinians - really credible...



 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:30 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7809371.stm

 http://www.btselem.org/English/Gaza_Strip/20081231_Army_bombs_metal_workshop_in_Gaza.asp

 Yes, see, its just a huge mass conspiracy, the whole world is against
 israel and makes this stuff up. They would never release lies and
 propaganda video. NEVER! It's not in the Zionist scum blood to lie! NO
 SIR! NEVER! The BBC is ran by Palestine!

 Label me not surprised, if someone disagrees with zionist scum they
 are labeled as either self hating if they are Jewish, or mentally
 unstable.

 Your mothers a whore and your father holds the money.


 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:09 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  The topic does not change much on this discussion, so if you really
 cared
  that much for the signal to noise ratio, you would have filtered the
 topic
  out - especially since you use gmail...
 
  It seems that you are enjoying this thread since you have been following
 it
  so far, and even bothered responding to the thread.
 
  I myself am not enjoying the thread, I respond for a totally different
  reason - to disprove false claims made as part of a propaganda campain
 going
  on here.
 
  I hope you understand - if not - you are welcome to take the filtering
  advice, and if even that does not make you happy - I guess you will have
 to
  continue being unhappy.
 
  Cheers.
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:49 PM, them.r...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Innovative solution to all your problems, on both sides:  stop
 discussing
  politics on FD.  I was under the impression this was supposed to be
 about
  compsec, not alt.politics.middleeast.  Doesn't matter who -is- right,
 from
  here it looks like a bunch of kids using slightly more sophisticated
  arguments.
 
  Understand?  Someone is wrong on the internet, shocker, that one.  You
  guys aren't going to change each other's minds, so what you're doing is
 a
  waste of time and lowering the noise to signal ratio.
 
  Grow up.
 
  Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
 
  -Original Message-
  From: ghost gho...@gmail.com
 
  Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:39:01
  To: Full Disclosurefull-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk
  Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine
 
 
  The IDF would not release anything fake? LMAO! That takes the cake.
  You're a propoganda shill.
 
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:31 PM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
   The IDF released footage from a remote controlled spy aircarft,
 showing
   terrorists shooting from a UN building - experts have inspected the
   footage
   and none have contested it.
  
   It's not that difficult to find out if it was fake or not - and
   considering
   the IDF released it, they would not risk releasing anything fake, as
 it
   would be shooting itself in the foot.
  
   In general I agree, unless you can easily detect if the footage was
 fake
   or
   not, videos on youtube are not reliable sources.
  
 
  ___
  Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
  Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
  Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
  ___
  Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
  Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
  Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
 
 

 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/



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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 1:43 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 I 'm was not an antisemitist, but now I become one.

 there's difference between jews and sionist, as i said before jews !=
 sionist

Your point is?



 and i'm trully antisionist, and this get enforced when i listen free
 propaganda like Avraham does

Good for you. You should add that to your linked-in profile... I'm sure it
adds a lot to your credibility.

 Also Mr schneider, you forgot an important fact :
 Palestinian are resistants, not terrorists there's a true difference on
 that one,

I didn't say all Palestinians are terrorists, I said Hamas was, and that the
Palestinians elected Hamas as governement.
I also mentioned that the Palestinians in general give cover to those
terrorists and allow them to store and smuggle weapons.

Hamas is also designated as a terrorist organization by the US state
department.


but i see you comming no no they're terrorist, they throw rockets around
the border and kill innocent israelis
Well in this case, the resistants in world war 2 should be also called
terrorist.

Nope - a world of a difference - the resistnence groups in WWII were
fighting military targets, as opposed to Hamas, who blantly aims at civilian
targets (in addition to using civilians for cover).
Also for your information, the true meaning of the word terrorist is very
close to mercenary.
Thanks for the 'information'.
I suggest, just in general, that you use a dictionary once in a while...

A protester is not a terrorist, or shall i call you a terrorist because you
protest with weapons agains palestinian ?
If that makes you happy, I can care less...

See propaganda starts right here :)
I wish I didn't.








 2009/1/18 ghost gho...@gmail.com

 lmao! OH I GET IT!

 See, it's fact when the zionist scum say it.

 BUT IF YOU ARENT A ZIONIST JEW

 then everything you say is a complete lie and made up.

 You're really winning your argument and changing peoples mind about
 israel.


 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  Here you go -
  http://tinyurl.com/6v45l5
  http://tinyurl.com/lu4et
 
 
  Have fun reading facts...
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:41 AM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  sure - take btselem's word for it... a bunch of Palestinians and a
 British
  jurnalist that says:
  I would stress that I looked only at the Israeli side because of the
 new
  factor - Israel setting up a special unit to improve the projection of
 its
  arguments around the world. paul.reynolds-inter...@bbc.co.uk 
 
  Basically a jurnalist that admits to being biased and a group of
  Palestinians - really credible...
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:30 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7809371.stm
 
 
 http://www.btselem.org/English/Gaza_Strip/20081231_Army_bombs_metal_workshop_in_Gaza.asp
 
  Yes, see, its just a huge mass conspiracy, the whole world is against
  israel and makes this stuff up. They would never release lies and
  propaganda video. NEVER! It's not in the Zionist scum blood to lie! NO
  SIR! NEVER! The BBC is ran by Palestine!
 
  Label me not surprised, if someone disagrees with zionist scum they
  are labeled as either self hating if they are Jewish, or mentally
  unstable.
 
  Your mothers a whore and your father holds the money.
 
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:09 PM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
   The topic does not change much on this discussion, so if you really
   cared
   that much for the signal to noise ratio, you would have filtered the
   topic
   out - especially since you use gmail...
  
   It seems that you are enjoying this thread since you have been
   following it
   so far, and even bothered responding to the thread.
  
   I myself am not enjoying the thread, I respond for a totally
 different
   reason - to disprove false claims made as part of a propaganda
 campain
   going
   on here.
  
   I hope you understand - if not - you are welcome to take the
 filtering
   advice, and if even that does not make you happy - I guess you will
   have to
   continue being unhappy.
  
   Cheers.
  
   On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:49 PM, them.r...@gmail.com wrote:
  
   Innovative solution to all your problems, on both sides:  stop
   discussing
   politics on FD.  I was under the impression this was supposed to be
   about
   compsec, not alt.politics.middleeast.  Doesn't matter who -is-
 right,
   from
   here it looks like a bunch of kids using slightly more
 sophisticated
   arguments.
  
   Understand?  Someone is wrong on the internet, shocker, that one.
  You
   guys aren't going to change each other's minds, so what you're
 doing
   is a
   waste of time and lowering the noise to signal ratio.
  
   Grow up.
  
   Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
  
   -Original Message-
   From: ghost gho...@gmail.com
  
   Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:39:01

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:55 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 Typical zionist scum response, when faced with facts he can't handle
 he claims its all made up.

What facts?




 You're nothing but a shill, which is proven by the company you work
 for, i'm sure you didn't get that job because you were a jew either...
 right?

Yes, it's all just 1 big conspiracy...




 Pathetic.

Agree.




 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  sure - take btselem's word for it... a bunch of Palestinians and a
 British
  jurnalist that says:
  I would stress that I looked only at the Israeli side because of the new
  factor - Israel setting up a special unit to improve the projection of
 its
  arguments around the world. paul.reynolds-inter...@bbc.co.uk 
 
  Basically a jurnalist that admits to being biased and a group of
  Palestinians - really credible...
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 12:30 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7809371.stm
 
 
 http://www.btselem.org/English/Gaza_Strip/20081231_Army_bombs_metal_workshop_in_Gaza.asp
 
  Yes, see, its just a huge mass conspiracy, the whole world is against
  israel and makes this stuff up. They would never release lies and
  propaganda video. NEVER! It's not in the Zionist scum blood to lie! NO
  SIR! NEVER! The BBC is ran by Palestine!
 
  Label me not surprised, if someone disagrees with zionist scum they
  are labeled as either self hating if they are Jewish, or mentally
  unstable.
 
  Your mothers a whore and your father holds the money.
 
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:09 PM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
   The topic does not change much on this discussion, so if you really
   cared
   that much for the signal to noise ratio, you would have filtered the
   topic
   out - especially since you use gmail...
  
   It seems that you are enjoying this thread since you have been
 following
   it
   so far, and even bothered responding to the thread.
  
   I myself am not enjoying the thread, I respond for a totally different
   reason - to disprove false claims made as part of a propaganda campain
   going
   on here.
  
   I hope you understand - if not - you are welcome to take the filtering
   advice, and if even that does not make you happy - I guess you will
 have
   to
   continue being unhappy.
  
   Cheers.
  
   On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 11:49 PM, them.r...@gmail.com wrote:
  
   Innovative solution to all your problems, on both sides:  stop
   discussing
   politics on FD.  I was under the impression this was supposed to be
   about
   compsec, not alt.politics.middleeast.  Doesn't matter who -is- right,
   from
   here it looks like a bunch of kids using slightly more sophisticated
   arguments.
  
   Understand?  Someone is wrong on the internet, shocker, that one.
  You
   guys aren't going to change each other's minds, so what you're doing
 is
   a
   waste of time and lowering the noise to signal ratio.
  
   Grow up.
  
   Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel
  
   -Original Message-
   From: ghost gho...@gmail.com
  
   Date: Sun, 18 Jan 2009 16:39:01
   To: Full Disclosurefull-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk
   Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine
  
  
   The IDF would not release anything fake? LMAO! That takes the cake.
   You're a propoganda shill.
  
  
   On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:31 PM, Avraham Schneider
   avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
The IDF released footage from a remote controlled spy aircarft,
showing
terrorists shooting from a UN building - experts have inspected the
footage
and none have contested it.
   
It's not that difficult to find out if it was fake or not - and
considering
the IDF released it, they would not risk releasing anything fake,
 as
it
would be shooting itself in the foot.
   
In general I agree, unless you can easily detect if the footage was
fake
or
not, videos on youtube are not reliable sources.
   
  
   ___
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   Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
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 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 3:42 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 7:23 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
  What facts?
 


 Point proven. If it isn't from zionist then it isn't a fact, typical
 zionist scum.

Again I'll ask - what facts?




 You work for an israeli based company, that proves your a shill.

You need to recheck the definition of 'proof' in the dictionary, along with
the definition of many other words you have been missusing lately...




 I will rejoice once israel is wiped off the face of earth once and for all.

Do you have any backup plans? Because this one does not seem to be going
real well...
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:40 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 How come you never sleep ?

I just woke up.



 There's some relay going on, on your propaganda nickname ?

I think the one who is using a propaganda nickname is you 'j-f sentier' - My
real name is Avraham Schneider - you can find my profile on Linked In, and I
don't hide by a propaganda nickname, something so prevalent here lately...

Anyways :

 Hamas is also designated as a terrorist organization by the US state
 department.
 What a nice reference 

Do you dispute it?


 I said Hamas was, and that the Palestinians elected Hamas as governement.
 Hamas resist against your invasion.

How? By firing at _civilians_? Sending suicide bombers to attack
_civilians_? And doing everything it possibly can to attack _civilians_?

How do they resist? by hiding behind their own _civilians_? Then claiming
victory when Israel pulls out after killing hundreds of them?

Thanks for the 'information'.
 I suggest, just in general, that you use a dictionary once in a while...
 I do, and i suggest you to look at the use of this word in the medias or by
 govs, before 9/11/2001.

It is clear you don't.



 I didn't say all Palestinians are terrorists

 Oh let me guess:

 see all your familly killed by israeli, and do nothing = good Palestinian
 see all your familly killed by israelis and then kill some israelis with
 old school rockets = bad Palestinian

If Israel really wanted to kill Palestinians in general, it could do it much
cheaper and with no Israeli casualties.

Israel pulled out of Gazaa and let the Palestinians have their own
govornment, they basically gave them everything they wanted on a silver
plate, in return Hamas and other Palestinian terrorist groups, sent
terrorist suicide bombers accross the border - to kill as many Israeli
_civilians_ as possible.

Israel is _avoiding civilian casualties_, it is _sorry_ for any _civilians_
wounded or killed during fighting - but this is a _war_, and _civilians die_
- especially since Hamas is using Palestinian civilians as human shields -
http://tinyurl.com/6v45l5

Hamas on the other hand, _target civilians_ - Palestinians are _happy_ when
Israeli civilians die, the same as they were happy at 9/11 - when 3000
innocent civilians dies in the WTC - spreading candy in the streets.

Sure it's always more funny when you can fire at them when they dont fight
 back.

We don't fire at them - we don't target civilians, we target the militant
terrorist organizations that hide among the supporting Palestinian
population.
Any civilian who stores weapons in his house should not complain that his
house is bombed.
any civilian who has a smuggling tunnel underground, should not complain
that his house is bombed.

No other country does what Israel does - i.e. make over 250 thousand
phonecalls to warn enemy's civilians to leave an area about to be bombed -
during war.
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 8:44 AM, ghost gho...@gmail.com wrote:

 On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 1:12 AM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
 
  Again I'll ask - what facts?
 

 You read the facts, and you responded with zionist propaganda. No
 matter how many times you repeat yourself, the IDF is still a
 propaganda machine.

I think the person who is delibitrary ignoring facts and spreading
propaganda and lies, is you.
Until you and your friends get off this list, and/or stop spreading your
offtopic propaganda full of lies and hate here on a comsec list - I will
repeat correcting your false claims, basing mine on facts, as many times
needed,



 You need to recheck the definition of 'proof' in the dictionary, along
with
 the definition of many other words you have been missusing lately...


So zionists are now redefining words to favor themselves huh?
No - http://tinyurl.com/8q6xjd




 Do you have any backup plans? Because this one does not seem to be going
 real well...



The plans are going quite well, the zionists in israel are doing a
great job in destroying any decent reputation they have had with other
countries.

You are over confident with your propaganda, it does not seem to be helping.
Unless you are referring to Bolivia cutting ties with Israel (the only ties
Israel had with them are drug related).

Not to mention the fact that Obama is going into office, and you
zionist scum have tons of conspiracy about that. Lets hope they all
come true :)
As far as we see, against all expectations, Obama is pro-Israel - so I guess
you have to come up with better backup plans than these...


It's funny how you never responded to the FACT that israel spys on us
more then any other country
I do not recall you mentioned it - hence I did not respond.
Now that you do - who is 'us'?

 and you support them 100%.
Yes I do.

 You're a terrorist
http://tinyurl.com/74ct4g

and deserve to be in guantanamo bay.
But Obama is closing it down..,
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

more than 60% of them armed terrorists hiding in a dense civilian area -
some of them dressed up as doctors and shooting from UN and red-cross
buildings.

I think Israel is doing good so far, they should keep up the good work.

On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:29 PM, Handrix hand...@gmail.com wrote:

 Yes, as you say Mainbox.

 Today Ehud Olmert said that he loved gaza's children,.
 after 22 days of war and deaths of more than 1,200 Palestinians.


 On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 11:39 PM, Mainbox Notif rokade...@gmail.comwrote:

 Goodmorning everybody!
 I dont know the time at yours, but here it is morning.
 And it is a beautifull day!
 A beautifull day for killing some israelian monkeys!



 (Oh please Schmehl and Schneider (Whats in a name...),
 do reply.
 :)
 ]

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 Network Engineering/Security
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 12:53 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 I think Israel is doing good so far, they should keep up the good work.


 Yeah sure, 1 hospital, 1 school, and the UN building.
 I guess the terrorists was hidden in the UN building, or the UN are
 terrorist too ?

The UN are not terrorists, the terrorists were firing from the UN building,
expecting Israel not to fire back.
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

until Hamas decides to fire at Israeli civilians again...

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:03 AM, andrew. wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 10:32 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  I think Israel is doing good so far, they should keep up the good work.

 Israel has achieved its aims and a unilateral ceasefire will start at
 0200 (2400 GMT). - BBC

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

you don't seem to care for Hamas being charged for war crimes, do you? I
guess firing rockets for 8 years at civilian targets (actively trying to
kill civilians) does not count as a war crime for you.

What do you consider as war crimes? Protecting your own civilians from
terrorists hiding behind civilians and killing civilians by mistake?


On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:15 AM, andrew. wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:01 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
  the UN building.
  What was the excuse this time ?

 Hopefully Israel will get charged with war crimes.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

considering this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmXXUOs27lI

I find the IDF much more credible than the UN.

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:01 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 Yeah sure from the UN building.
 What was the excuse this time ?
 The palestinian janitor working in the building was hidding some weapon
 under his rag or what ?

 it's an UN building not a market place.

 Wake up dude you got brainwashed by tsahal once again

 2009/1/17 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 12:53 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

 I think Israel is doing good so far, they should keep up the good work.


 Yeah sure, 1 hospital, 1 school, and the UN building.
 I guess the terrorists was hidden in the UN building, or the UN are
 terrorist too ?

 The UN are not terrorists, the terrorists were firing from the UN
 building, expecting Israel not to fire back.




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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Just hours after the cease-fire announcement Hamas fired 7 rockets into
Israel - I find it hard to believe Israel will pull out of Gaza any time
soon...

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:27 AM, andrew. wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 I've heard analysts say the ceasefire was always planned for tonight
 ahead of Barack Obama's inauguration on Tuesday.

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:14 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  until Hamas decides to fire at Israeli civilians again...
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:03 AM, andrew. wallace
  andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:
 
  On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 10:32 PM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
   I think Israel is doing good so far, they should keep up the good
 work.
 
  Israel has achieved its aims and a unilateral ceasefire will start at
  0200 (2400 GMT). - BBC

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Show me 1 country that would act differently.

The soldiers who returned fire did not know there were civilians in the
building. They were responding to fire being shot at them during a war from
a building - they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building or
not and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

Civilians who decide to stay in a war zone after being warned to leave
and/or stay next to terrorists firing rockets at Israelis are at risk of
being killed.

It is one of the sad facts of war - people die.

If the Palestinian terrorist groups cared so much for their fellows, they
would not use them as human shields.

If these civilians were smarter, they would not have elected Hamas, a
terrorist organization, for government - and they would not climb to
rooftops expecting Israeli fighter jets to not bomb the building as they see
civilians, trying to prevent the building from being bombed (and save the
weapons stored at the building).



On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:41 AM, andrew. wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 If the enemy creates a human shield, you don't fire into the human
 shield. Israel did.

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:27 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  What do you consider as war crimes?
 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:15 AM, andrew. wallace
  andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:
  Hopefully Israel will get charged with war crimes.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:58 AM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.com wrote:

 2009/1/17 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com:
  Show me 1 country that would act differently.
 
  The soldiers who returned fire did not know there were civilians in the
  building. They were responding to fire being shot at them during a war
 from
  a building - they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building
 or
  not and/or if there are civilians inside or not.
 
  Civilians who decide to stay in a war zone after being warned to leave
  and/or stay next to terrorists firing rockets at Israelis are at risk of
  being killed.
 They cannot leave in normal time , so how could they leave in war time

Why don't they leave to Egypt or any other Arab country for that matter...?
Regardless, they can and should leave the area that is being bombed, and
flee to a different area that is not (yet) being bombed.
That's the smart thing to do...


 ?? Israel did a holocaust and i pray the next missile hamas fire it
 will land on you and let you disabled for the rest of your life. you
 are stupid brainwashed person.

You are not helping your credibility with these sort of statements.




  It is one of the sad facts of war - people die.
 
  If the Palestinian terrorist groups cared so much for their fellows, they
  would not use them as human shields.

  If these civilians were smarter, they would not have elected Hamas, a
  terrorist organization, for government - and they would not climb to
  rooftops expecting Israeli fighter jets to not bomb the building as they
 see
  civilians, trying to prevent the building from being bombed (and save the
  weapons stored at the building).

 Israel is the terrorist state , since the beginning it had no 1 year
 of peace. So dont tell me all the others are bad. It Israel who is a
 pest to this world

Why do make empty statements and place them as a reply to facts I have
stated  - do you contest what I have written just above your response?

How does the fact that Israel want peace since before it's establishment and
the Arabs chose war every time they thought they could win (and lost) - make
Israel a terrorist state?
I think you should look up the word 'terror' in the dictionary - read up
other words while you are at it, your English needs improvement in general.


 
  On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:41 AM, andrew. wallace
  andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:
 
  If the enemy creates a human shield, you don't fire into the human
  shield. Israel did.
 
  On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:27 PM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
   What do you consider as war crimes?
  
   On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 1:15 AM, andrew. wallace
   andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:
   Hopefully Israel will get charged with war crimes.
 
 
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 2:00 AM, andrew. wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the Israeli's
 have.

During war, when you are fired at, you shoot back without asking questions.




 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

Then they should make sure that no terrorists fire at IDF soldiers from
there.
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:10 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:

 Just hours after the cease-fire announcement Hamas fired 7 rockets into
 Israel

 Sure it's always more fun when you can fire at them like rabbits.

 Hamas are really bad terrorists, after tsahal killed 1000 civilians with
 phosphore bombs, it's sure that 7 home made rocket fired with some old
 school pipe and a cheap compas, makes the difference.

The IDF didn't kill 1000 civilians - some civilians have died, many
civilians have died, but that is only because of Hamas.
Israel has the right to defend itself, and that includes firing at it's
enemy -even if they use civilians as shields-.

No other country in the world makes a qaurter of a milion phone calls to
warn civilians to leave an area that is going to be bombed before they bomb
it during battle. Especially when those civilians store weapons in their
homes and/or have weapon smugling tunnels underground.

Anyways more you bombs them, more they want  revenge, even the ones who
 wasn't pro war/revenge.

They could instead choose they want peace, stop firing rockets at us, I
think that would be a good start.


 So what's make the difference between a palestinian and a terrorist to you
 ?
 not much eh ?

If the Palestinian is a terrorist, there is no difference.


 Well, thats why we can call that again a genocide.

Look up the definition in the dictionary.



 And know what ? your argument about poor innocent israeli people who got
 killed by rockets throwed near the border by bad palestinian terrorists got
 segfaulted :
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila
 This remind you something ?

How does this have anything to do with rockets being fired at Israel?
Besides - it was carried out between 16 and 18 September 1982 by the Lebanese
Forces http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanese_Forces militia group - i.e.
-not by Israel-.

You should blame them for it - and I don't see Hamas firing rockets at them
- so your whole argument is pointless.



 Oh i guess it's because they've throw 5 rockets near the border  so it's
 legit to killed anyone ?

It's not 5 rockets - it's a daily bombardment of rockets fired at Israeli
cities with people that need to run to the shelters whenever the alarm goes
on.

And yes, even 1 rocket fired across your borders from an enemy entity
justifies killing those that fire at you.


 And you expect them to shut the fuck up ?

They can talk as much as they want, but if they fire at Israeli civilians,
the IDF will fire back at them.









 2009/1/17 andrew. wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the Israeli's
 have.

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:14 AM, Mainbox Notif rokade...@gmail.com wrote:



 2009/1/17 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com:


  Civilians who decide to stay in a war zone after being warned to leave
  and/or stay next to terrorists firing rockets at Israelis are at risk of
  being killed.


 Do you really believe that civilians go to an area they being warned that
 the israeli going to attack?
 Should you do that?
 Saying to your children: Oh, it's almost 8 PM, we have to go to the
 mainstreet: look at the fireworks from the israeli soldiers. 
 You believe that? Stupid asshole

You can find videos on youtube if you don't beieve me.





  If the Palestinian terrorist groups cared so much for their fellows, they
  would not use them as human shields


 Yep, thats right! They don't do that. Thats israeli news. Not independent.
 You're doctrinated, man!

You can find videos on youtube if you don't beieve me.




   If these civilians were smarter, they would not have elected Hamas, a
  terrorist organization, for government


 No, they HAVE to elect Hamas. Thats the only way to do something against
 the occupiers: fight back!

Hamas was designated as a terrorist organization for a reason.
Fight back? Israel has left Gaza 8 years ago, what reason do they have to
'fight back'?
And how, by firing at civilian targets?





  and they would not climb to
  rooftops expecting Israeli fighter jets to not bomb the building as they
 see
  civilians, trying to prevent the building from being bombed (and save
 the
  weapons stored at the building).


 Yes, they would not. And they do not! Read independent papers, or watch
 independent news. Not the israeli propaganda. You should known better!

You can find videos on youtube.




 It's not possible to discuss with indoctrinated people.
 But I will do my best.

Why on a computer security mailing list?


 But in the list, mr Schneider, stop annoying me private!

When you send me private e-mails, I reply in private.











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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyC-z0b6L5Y


On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 6:21 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 Okay so hamas are totally the bad guys.But let's reverse this out.
 Who have stolen them land via some warsss around ?
 We do not talk about british land taken from the otoman or so , just
 palestine how it was in 1948 and how it is now

 Please wake up dude.


 2009/1/17 Paul Schmehl pschmehl_li...@tx.rr.com

 --On January 17, 2009 5:41:15 PM -0600 andrew.wallace
 andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 
  If the enemy creates a human shield, you don't fire into the human
  shield. Israel did.

 Yes, you do.  The civilians have become legal combatants if you are being
 fired upon.

 Hamas is guilty of so many war crimes it would be impossible to catalog
 them all.

 Now please take this scrum off list.

 Paul Schmehl, If it isn't already
 obvious, my opinions are my own
 and not those of my employer.
 **
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

I guess I can't prove that I don't, so what can I say...

Do you have anything you find incorrect in what I have responded to you, or
you are done with your nonsense and the list can go back to being a Computer
Security Mailing List?

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 7:32 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

  You are paid to say that Avraham, and it's a shame.

 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 2:00 AM, andrew. wallace 
 andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the Israeli's
 have.

 During war, when you are fired at, you shoot back without asking
 questions.




 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

 Then they should make sure that no terrorists fire at IDF soldiers from
 there.


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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 7:36 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 You're fake dude.

 You're defending blindly what's not defendable, and you're not dumb enought
 for that, so you're paid by someone.

If blindly is defined giving you clear facts - and not defendable is defined
as self defense...

Regarding the being paid statement, it is something that would be very
difficult for me to disprove, and since it has nothing to do with the facts
- I won't bother. Besides, if anyone wants to send me money for this - I
will take it gladly, I accept paypal/cash/money order, you name it... :-)

2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:10 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:

 Just hours after the cease-fire announcement Hamas fired 7 rockets into
 Israel

 Sure it's always more fun when you can fire at them like rabbits.

 Hamas are really bad terrorists, after tsahal killed 1000 civilians with
 phosphore bombs, it's sure that 7 home made rocket fired with some old
 school pipe and a cheap compas, makes the difference.

 The IDF didn't kill 1000 civilians - some civilians have died, many
 civilians have died, but that is only because of Hamas.
 Israel has the right to defend itself, and that includes firing at it's
 enemy -even if they use civilians as shields-.

 No other country in the world makes a qaurter of a milion phone calls to
 warn civilians to leave an area that is going to be bombed before they bomb
 it during battle. Especially when those civilians store weapons in their
 homes and/or have weapon smugling tunnels underground.

 Anyways more you bombs them, more they want  revenge, even the ones who
 wasn't pro war/revenge.

 They could instead choose they want peace, stop firing rockets at us, I
 think that would be a good start.


 So what's make the difference between a palestinian and a terrorist to
 you ?
 not much eh ?

 If the Palestinian is a terrorist, there is no difference.


 Well, thats why we can call that again a genocide.

 Look up the definition in the dictionary.



 And know what ? your argument about poor innocent israeli people who got
 killed by rockets throwed near the border by bad palestinian terrorists got
 segfaulted :
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila
 This remind you something ?

 How does this have anything to do with rockets being fired at Israel?
 Besides - it was carried out between 16 and 18 September 1982 by the 
 Lebanese
 Forces http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanese_Forces militia group -
 i.e. -not by Israel-.

 You should blame them for it - and I don't see Hamas firing rockets at
 them - so your whole argument is pointless.



 Oh i guess it's because they've throw 5 rockets near the border  so it's
 legit to killed anyone ?

 It's not 5 rockets - it's a daily bombardment of rockets fired at Israeli
 cities with people that need to run to the shelters whenever the alarm goes
 on.

 And yes, even 1 rocket fired across your borders from an enemy entity
 justifies killing those that fire at you.


 And you expect them to shut the fuck up ?

 They can talk as much as they want, but if they fire at Israeli civilians,
 the IDF will fire back at them.









 2009/1/17 andrew. wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the
 Israeli's have.

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 8:01 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 haha, how much time this took you to say that ?
 You're paied to make propaganda on FD this more than clear.
 you dont answer on any real questions

You obviously ignore everything I write


 , you say always the same stuff

No - I answer your questions, and I correct false claims made by you.


 , aka yeah but hamas was elected by palestinian so palestinian should die

When did I say that?


 , but know what , not talking about war anymore here,

Great!


 just  your polititian.
 Give me just one name of an isreali president or first minister who didn't
 end up his mandate with corruption charges.

You can go to the Kneset website and find out.



 and what you still  promoting them ?

Not promoting any of them - just responding to your false claims and
propaganda.



 Oh Oh Oh, you dont like to play the propaganda game with me ?

No I don't.







 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 I guess I can't prove that I don't, so what can I say...

 Do you have anything you find incorrect in what I have responded to you,
 or you are done with your nonsense and the list can go back to being a
 Computer Security Mailing List?

 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 7:32 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

  You are paid to say that Avraham, and it's a shame.2009/1/18 Avraham
 Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 2:00 AM, andrew. wallace 
 andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the
 Israeli's have.

 During war, when you are fired at, you shoot back without asking
 questions.




 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

 Then they should make sure that no terrorists fire at IDF soldiers from
 there.


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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 8:18 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 You can go to the Kneset website and find out.
 Oh so there's  a website dedicated to the one who didn't get corrupted ?
 Oh come on , you know what i'm talking about your country is driven by
 that .

There is corruption everywere - you think there is no corruption in any of
the surrounding arab countries?
Israel has a legal system and when one is found corrupt, he pays his time -
even if he was a minister, or a president.
This is something that can only happen in a democracy - something the
neiboring arab countries should adopt.




 Oh Oh Oh, you dont like to play the propaganda game with me ?
 No I don't.

 i understand that :)

 Die slowly with lots of pain.

I plan to live on for many more years... If you have a problem with that,
you can try and change that but I don't think that would be good for your
health...






 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 8:01 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 haha, how much time this took you to say that ?
 You're paied to make propaganda on FD this more than clear.
 you dont answer on any real questions

 You obviously ignore everything I write


 , you say always the same stuff

 No - I answer your questions, and I correct false claims made by you.


 , aka yeah but hamas was elected by palestinian so palestinian should die

 When did I say that?


 , but know what , not talking about war anymore here,

 Great!


 just  your polititian.
 Give me just one name of an isreali president or first minister who
 didn't end up his mandate with corruption charges.

 You can go to the Kneset website and find out.



 and what you still  promoting them ?

 Not promoting any of them - just responding to your false claims and
 propaganda.



 Oh Oh Oh, you dont like to play the propaganda game with me ?

 No I don't.







 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 I guess I can't prove that I don't, so what can I say...

 Do you have anything you find incorrect in what I have responded to you,
 or you are done with your nonsense and the list can go back to being a
 Computer Security Mailing List?

 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 7:32 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

  You are paid to say that Avraham, and it's a shame.2009/1/18 Avraham
 Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 2:00 AM, andrew. wallace 
 andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the
 Israeli's have.

 During war, when you are fired at, you shoot back without asking
 questions.




 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

 Then they should make sure that no terrorists fire at IDF soldiers
 from there.


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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

s/neiboring/neighboring/g

On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 9:09 AM, Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com
 wrote:



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 8:18 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:

 You can go to the Kneset website and find out.
 Oh so there's  a website dedicated to the one who didn't get corrupted ?
 Oh come on , you know what i'm talking about your country is driven by
 that .

 There is corruption everywere - you think there is no corruption in any of
 the surrounding arab countries?
 Israel has a legal system and when one is found corrupt, he pays his time -
 even if he was a minister, or a president.
 This is something that can only happen in a democracy - something the
 neiboring arab countries should adopt.




 Oh Oh Oh, you dont like to play the propaganda game with me ?
 No I don't.

 i understand that :)

 Die slowly with lots of pain.

 I plan to live on for many more years... If you have a problem with that,
 you can try and change that but I don't think that would be good for your
 health...






 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 8:01 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

 haha, how much time this took you to say that ?
 You're paied to make propaganda on FD this more than clear.
 you dont answer on any real questions

 You obviously ignore everything I write


 , you say always the same stuff

 No - I answer your questions, and I correct false claims made by you.


 , aka yeah but hamas was elected by palestinian so palestinian should
 die

 When did I say that?


 , but know what , not talking about war anymore here,

 Great!


 just  your polititian.
 Give me just one name of an isreali president or first minister who
 didn't end up his mandate with corruption charges.

 You can go to the Kneset website and find out.



 and what you still  promoting them ?

 Not promoting any of them - just responding to your false claims and
 propaganda.



 Oh Oh Oh, you dont like to play the propaganda game with me ?

 No I don't.







 2009/1/18 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 I guess I can't prove that I don't, so what can I say...

 Do you have anything you find incorrect in what I have responded to
 you, or you are done with your nonsense and the list can go back to being 
 a
 Computer Security Mailing List?

 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 7:32 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.comwrote:

  You are paid to say that Avraham, and it's a shame.2009/1/18 Avraham
 Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com



 On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 2:00 AM, andrew. wallace 
 andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  they don't have the time to find out if it is a UN building

 I find that hard to believe with the amount of intelligence the
 Israeli's have.

 During war, when you are fired at, you shoot back without asking
 questions.




 On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:48 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  and/or if there are civilians inside or not.

 Of course there are civilians inside its a UN building.

 Then they should make sure that no terrorists fire at IDF soldiers
 from there.


 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
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Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

2009-01-16 Thread Avraham Schneider

Israel is fighting terrorists - those terrorists decide to attack websites
(since they wrongly believe it will help their cause)[1] - Israel cares
less.

It is Cyber-War because those terrorists are fighting a war against Israel
- and the 'Cyber' is just an additional front for this war - not an
important one, hence ignored by Israel, but it still is.

If you call blowing yourself up in a bus, trying to kill as many passengers
as possible - 'protest' - than by your definition one may call this
'Cyber-Protest' - but since normal people call those who practice suicide
bombings 'terrorists', by their definition it is called either
'Cyber-Terrorism' - or since there is a war on terror - 'Cyber-War'.

I hope this explains it for you.

[1]
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hl=iwu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ynet.co.il%2Farticles%2F0%2C7340%2CL-3656862%2C00.htmlsl=iwtl=enswap=1

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM, andrew. wallace
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

2009/1/14 andrew. wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com:
Two sides fighting, a government and some other entity

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 3:54 PM, Jan G.B. ro0ot.w...@googlemail.com
wrote:
It's a term that describes an asynchronous warfare between sides

*No two sides are fighting each other in Cyber*

Conclusion: No Cyber War

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

2009-01-16 Thread Avraham Schneider

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 1:58 PM, Handrix hand...@gmail.com wrote:

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 8:21 PM, Avraham Schneider
avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:

Israel is fighting terrorists - those terrorists decide to attack websites
(since they wrongly believe it will help their cause)[1] - Israel cares
less.

It is Cyber-War because those terrorists are fighting a war against
Israel - and the 'Cyber' is just an additional front for this war - not an
important one, hence ignored by Israel, but it still is.

If you call blowing yourself up in a bus, trying to kill as many
passengers as possible - 'protest' - than by your definition one may call
this 'Cyber-Protest' - but since normal people call those who practice
suicide bombings 'terrorists', by their definition it is called either
'Cyber-Terrorism' - or since there is a war on terror - 'Cyber-War'.

I hope this explains it for you.

wich terrorisme you'are talking about ?
You do not understand the concept of terrorisme, the real terrorist is
israel that kills children and women.
I hope that you will learn more about terrorisme.

First, I'd recommend you get some professional help with your English before
you post your opinions in English for everyone to read - it doesn't help
your credibility at all.

Israel does not target civilians, the terrorists who Israel is fighting
against, are.
Those terrorists that Israelis are fighting, are using those women and
children as human shields and use their homes as a hiding place and for
weapon storage.

Israel does everything it can to prevent civilian casualties, but it is
impossible under these conditions.

Israel has as a top priority the life and security of it's own citizens
(Muslim, Christian or Jew), and has to defend it's borders from the evil
attacks of those terrorists.

The fact that those terrorists fail to acheive high numbers of casualties on
the Israeli side and Israel is acheiving high numbers of casualties on the
Palestinian side is attributed to the fact that Israel is stronger - not
that Israel is wrong.

I hope that explains it for you.

[1]
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hl=iwu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ynet.co.il%2Farticles%2F0%2C7340%2CL-3656862%2C00.htmlsl=iwtl=enswap=1

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM, andrew. wallace
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

2009/1/14 andrew. wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com:
Two sides fighting, a government and some other entity

On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 3:54 PM, Jan G.B. ro0ot.w...@googlemail.com
wrote:
It's a term that describes an asynchronous warfare between sides

*No two sides are fighting each other in Cyber*

Conclusion: No Cyber War

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--
Handrix
Network Engineering/Security
http://securynix.co.cc/

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Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

2009-01-16 Thread Avraham Schneider

On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 2:14 PM, Mainbox Notif rokade...@gmail.com wrote:


 And a new 'trol' is born: Schneider.

If I'm a troll, why do you feed me then?



 This is completely off topic.


 This thread is not about the war Israel vs Palestina!
 This is about Cyber-War in general.

I was responding to a false claim that was made here - I think the person
that is off-topic is you.




 Mr. Schneider,
 Please do not always response with your opinion.

Request denied.






 2009/1/15 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

  If you call blowing yourself up in a bus, trying to kill as many
 passengers as possible - 'protest' - than by your definition one may call
 this 'Cyber-Protest' - but since normal people call those who practice
 suicide bombings 'terrorists', by their definition it is called either
 'Cyber-Terrorism' - or since there is a war on terror - 'Cyber-War'.




 On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 8:19 PM, andrew. wallace 
 andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

  2009/1/14 andrew. wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com:
  Two sides fighting, a government and some other entity

 On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 3:54 PM, Jan G.B. ro0ot.w...@googlemail.com
 wrote:
  It's a term that describes an asynchronous warfare between sides

 *No two sides are fighting each other in Cyber*

 Conclusion: No Cyber War

 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
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 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/



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Re: [Full-disclosure] Cyber War or just Cyber Protest?

2009-01-15 Thread Avraham Schneider

http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hl=enu=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ynet.co.il%2Farticles%2F0%2C7340%2CL-3656862%2C00.htmlsl=iwtl=en

On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 9:14 PM, andrew. wallace
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

If cyber war is just web site defacement then I don't think we ever
need to take cyber war too seriously.

It seems to me that cyber war just means protesters protesting and
no actual cyber war is there, as a cyber war would mean two sides
fighting, although two sides aren't fighting in cyber its all
one-way script kid web defacement, not real war in any sense.

Two sides fighting, a government and some other entity and the
internet stuck in the middle, now that would mean cyber war, there
has been no cyber war and is unlikely to be one.

If people are marching in London today in the streets against the
Israel-Gaza conflict is that called war? Of course not, so why are
the media so quick to call protesting on-line, a war? [1]

What it really is, is folks protesting... a cyber protest, not a war.

Why are we using the wrong words to describe stuff? It's not even the
media, it was Gary Warner on a web log. [2]

[1] http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7809656.stm

[2]
http://garwarner.blogspot.com/2008/12/muslim-hackers-declare-cyberwar-on.html

We as a community should be cautious about using the wrong words to
describe stuff, because the media take influence from us guys on
mailing lists and blogs and at security conferences, so its important
we use cyber protest when script kids deface some web sites.

To put the right angle on this, it's unlikely to be new people doing
the defacements, its likely to be script kids who were defacers
anyway, and just change their political message to go with *whatever
the current climate is*.

Tomorrow the same folks will be defacing with a new message, they
don't care *really* about the message, defacers will find any reason
to deface.

It's unlikely the Israel-Gaza conflict defacers were only sprung into
action because of what is going on in the world, they would be
defacing anyway and looking for any excuse to do so.

Let's be careful from now on I don't like to see the wrong buzzwords
used and i'm sure Gadi doesn't either.

If Hamas cyber attacked Israel and Israel had a cyber response, then
that would be cyber war. This is not cyber war folks, this is a cyber
protest those kids are doing, they are unlikely to be connected with
anything thats going on and were web defacers anyway with a different
defacement message the day before.

Please I hope we as security experts know the difference.

I wrote this Email just incase because i'm sick of certain buzzwords
like cyber war when there isn't a cyber war.

When the day comes that a government and another entity is two-way
cyber fighting and say for instance critical national infrastructure
is affected then you can talk about cyber war, until then please
describe web site defacers as cyber protest.

A cyber war is two-way fighting, one-way fighting is not a war!

And to clarify, a bunch of kids defacing a web site and you applying a
patch afterwards is not classed as two-way fighting and cannot be
considered cyber war either.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] mr wallace must be stopped and i know how

That would be child pornography...

On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 11:44 AM, sexyazngr...@mac.hush.com wrote:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 i'll trade you my nude photos if you can demonstrate any
 contribution you have made to the computer security community

 On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 01:17:03 -0500 Jubei Trippataka
 vpn.1.fana...@gmail.com wrote:
 Anyone that can cop that much abuse and prosper has to be
 extremely
 sadomasochistic. The delusion that a blogger such as Mr Wallace
 somehow
 contributes to the security community is hilarious at first and
 when the
 comical side clears you have that pathetic little failed abortion
 asking why
 he's the target of abuse. To be honest, I'd rather have my
 children babysat
 by Josef Fritzel than take security advice from this schizo.
 
 --
 ciao
 
 JT
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
 Charset: UTF8
 Version: Hush 3.0
 Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify

 wpwEAQMCAAYFAklsYm8ACgkQynWwk3/AtyMnEAP/fvQZCdLaomFt9q4cyJR+FggOcr9b
 PcpszDsqaKS05KmgR16KjDDIRN9T2tTOhfqhN3Am1SOv0V9KISTkvuODcNMcIpIuu9Jg
 PIUb62p80egiaBHmNdfrZfFuRPp7fKzzWQyOqpHD+Yq3q7kF2B02qqvt1TLUnUg1ikfZ
 xNkJAWU=
 =I6gd
 -END PGP SIGNATURE-

 --
 Need cash? Click here to get a payday loan.

 http://tagline.hushmail.com/fc/PnY6qxtVaLJablbbAMh69AaxiQDIXGAemVvk2VFZs21sUl2eTyHw8/

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Re: [Full-disclosure] mr wallace must be stopped and i know how

I am quite sure even 30 years ago there were laws against child pornography
- but than again, 30 years ago I doubt even his parents were born.


On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 1:44 PM, Peter Bruderer peter.brude...@brg.chwrote:

 maybe you could have impressed somebody with that offer 30 years ago.
 Today with all the great looking pornstars on the net it is probably a
 great relief we don't have to look at your nude pictures.

 On 13.01.2009, at 10:44, sexyazngr...@mac.hush.com wrote:
 
  i'll trade you my nude photos if you can demonstrate any
  contribution you have made to the computer security community


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Re: [Full-disclosure] mr wallace must be stopped and i know how

What makes you believe that there is any criteria that qualifies him as an
adult?

On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 6:13 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote:

 On Tue, 13 Jan 2009 11:54:25 +0200, Avraham Schneider said:
  That would be child pornography...

 The statutes in most places specify *calendar* age, not intellectual age.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] e-Holocaust

you had the wrong assumption that he is used to thinking or at least knows
how to do that.

In order to answer your email in any intelligent manner, he will first have
to think. He does not have that skill.


On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 8:06 PM, Some Guy Posting To Full Disclosure 
fd.le...@googlemail.com wrote:

 Okay e.hitler you mention you're attacking Israeli servers*, lets
 ignore the impact of that for a second. e.Hitler I want you to tell
 me, in more than a sentence, why you did that. Yeh, you failed to
 mention it in your original post. Tell me exactly how your cause makes
 you feel, and why.

 Now tell me how what you're doing makes a difference, that is: 'In
 what way does what you did help solve the problem that was bothering
 you?' (read it!: HOW does it make a difference, don't just tell me
 THAT it makes a difference, I want you to describe out a sequence of
 events.

 One more question. Do you think you're a good hacker (in terms of
 skill). I'm not saying you're good or bad, I've no idea. Further more
 I couldn't tell you what makes a good hacker, I don't know enough
 (any) of them. Do you think that this event here proves that, or at
 least aids proving it?

 *Btw defacements happen all the time - wanna do some research on
 pathetic skiddies? search the 'google dorks' included in web app
 exploits when they're published on milw0rm. They're actually competing
 for the servers (re-owning them, etc). Those 21 sites are a drop in
 the ocean compared to how many (even ant-Israeli, and the other side)
 defacements have happened.
 As for the paypal accounts and (so called) 'ownage' of individuals and
 their personal data, really this is another drop in the ocean for
 Israel (what its economy). Compare the well-being of these individuals
 with the number of people being killed in a WAR! Hell! Compare it to
 the holocaust, now argue with a WWII vet or holocaust survivor (are
 there any still living?) that you are e.Hitler, righteous internet
 warrior. Not only that, most CC companies give you the money you lost
 scams or stolen paypals. You can even cancel it before transactions
 are payed. Then there's insurance companies.

 Cheers.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] e-Holocaust

You sound a lot like pinky and the brain... have not watched that for
years but thanks for the memory LOL

On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 3:37 PM,  e.hit...@hush.ai wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 Can you please explain the 'un-patched' part, have you actually
 found anything on those servers that is un-patched?

 and lol at moved to apache.

 Again, we will repeat the main idea out of this, which is... small
 or big damage, it is damage against Israeli servers and people,
 those sites were used to send a message, and believe it or not, the
 message was sent...

 Our next message-host will be larger, on a world scale... You will
 just have to wait and see, while we crack, organize and use the
 info we found so far... then we will send another message,a bigger
 one, on a larger scale.

 On Mon, 12 Jan 2009 16:13:25 +0300 Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
Of the 21 websites 19 were hosted on 1 un-patched server...

http://israelcivillaw.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://israelcommerciallaw.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://ada-art.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://harambam.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://sigalit-studio.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://sgms.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://two.org.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://magia-li.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://plastikim.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://maasik.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://vision-art.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://man-go.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://drabba.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://gal-alpron.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://djgazala.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://eseknet.biz/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://michlala.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://yd-albert.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
http://refaeli-art.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]

I'd bet these last two simply moved since then to Apache...
http://www.israel-forum.co.il/ = [ 64.131.69.76 ]
http://mynotebook.co.il/ = [ 71.18.148.1 ]


On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 2:14 PM,  e.hit...@hush.ai wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 First of all, the 21 websites were just used to distribute the
 message we had, the real damage was done on the servers holding
the
 websites, files deleted, databases wiped, etc...

 The .com domains were actually Israeli, on Israeli servers... so
 please do your research before making a complete idiot out of
 yourself.

 The media involvement will only be to our side, making a bigger
 deal of a small website defacement will only help in the bigger
 picture here, more damage for Israelis.

 On Mon, 12 Jan 2009 00:26:43 +0300 bert renalds
 bert9191rena...@googlemail.com wrote:
Ohhh amazing. After seeing this I've definitely made my mind up
about
who's side is right in the whole Israel-Palestine thing. Your
influence is certainly great.

Hey while you're at it you should edit
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust to mention what you did.

Hitler killed aprox. six million European Jews during World War
II.
eHitler (hitlers consciousness that was saved to disk just
before
he
died and haunts the internet to this day) hacked 21 websites, 3
of
which where .com domains!

Seriously though you make your entire 'side' look like the bad
guys,
but dumbnesses too. What annoys me is that the media will take
things
like this, overblow them and then say that there's a big deal

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wpwEAQMCAAYFAklrNBYACgkQiG0lprPxISo6aQP/VYKRgp3oQBlXjV2vXJb8MSVClsG
L

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 =CGrZ
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 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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 S6Og8GM=
 =mlyu
 -END PGP SIGNATURE-

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Re: [Full-disclosure] e-Holocaust

roflol

On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 3:57 PM,  e.hit...@hush.ai wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 Right, your attempts at ranting, making a very obvious comment, or
 whatever that is you are doing is pretty stupid..

 We decided to put this in a little diagram for people like you to
 understand better:

 [ PHASE 1 ]
 |
 |
 -- Gain access on Israeli webservers / websites / databases (
 yes, that means that if the website / database / webserver contains
 any israeli content on it, it is a potential target, so spair us
 the 'omg this is a US box' 'omg this is a .com' )

 [ PHASE 2 ]
|
|
-- Use access to collect information ( Includes databases,
 source code, emails, etc.. ), and use the access eventually to send
 a message, if we need to... if not, we will just delete all the
 information on the server..

 [ PHASE 3 ]
 |
 |
 --  Use information collected to make more damage...

 and repeat...

 So now unless you have something to add about this, don't waste
 your time and ours...

 P.S: that pinky and brain comment, wow... you just destroyed us
 with that, it was totally demolishing to our goals... good job... -
 _-\\

 On Mon, 12 Jan 2009 16:33:27 +0300 quispiam lepidus
 quispiam.lepi...@gmail.com wrote:
Those last two are also located in the USA. Oops.

On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 12:13 AM, Avraham Schneider
avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
 Of the 21 websites 19 were hosted on 1 un-patched server...

 http://israelcivillaw.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://israelcommerciallaw.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://ada-art.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://harambam.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://sigalit-studio.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://sgms.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://two.org.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://magia-li.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://plastikim.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://maasik.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://vision-art.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://man-go.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://drabba.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://gal-alpron.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://djgazala.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://eseknet.biz/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://michlala.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://yd-albert.co.il/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]
 http://refaeli-art.com/ = [ 62.219.19.193 ]

 I'd bet these last two simply moved since then to Apache...
 http://www.israel-forum.co.il/ = [ 64.131.69.76 ]
 http://mynotebook.co.il/ = [ 71.18.148.1 ]


 On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 2:14 PM,  e.hit...@hush.ai wrote:
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA1

 First of all, the 21 websites were just used to distribute the
 message we had, the real damage was done on the servers holding
the
 websites, files deleted, databases wiped, etc...

 The .com domains were actually Israeli, on Israeli servers...
so
 please do your research before making a complete idiot out of
 yourself.

 The media involvement will only be to our side, making a bigger
 deal of a small website defacement will only help in the bigger
 picture here, more damage for Israelis.

 On Mon, 12 Jan 2009 00:26:43 +0300 bert renalds
 bert9191rena...@googlemail.com wrote:
Ohhh amazing. After seeing this I've definitely made my mind up
about
who's side is right in the whole Israel-Palestine thing. Your
influence is certainly great.

Hey while you're at it you should edit
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust to mention what you did.

Hitler killed aprox. six million European Jews during World War
II.
eHitler (hitlers consciousness that was saved to disk just
before
he
died and haunts the internet to this day) hacked 21 websites, 3
of
which where .com domains!

Seriously though you make your entire 'side' look like the bad
guys,
but dumbnesses too. What annoys me is that the media will take
things
like this, overblow them and then say that there's a big deal

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 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
 Charset: UTF8
 Version: Hush 3.0
 Note: This signature can be verified at
https://www.hushtools.com/verify


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L

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T
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vTBb4j3mOyzplCfe4/

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Re: [Full-disclosure] e-Holocaust

can't stop laughing... lol...

2009/1/12 Pete Licoln pete.lic...@gmail.com:
 [ PHASE 1 ]
 |
 |
 --

 [ PHASE 2 ]
|
|
--

 [ PHASE 3 ]
 |
 |

 --

 It's Mini-me !
 http://weblog.site5.com/images/photos/minime.jpg



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Re: [Full-disclosure] e-Holocaust

1st of all, his cause and views are summed up as terrorism - worthless
terrorism, but still terrorism - therefore he gets no sympathy.

The fact that it is worthless, and he is presenting it as valuable and
in a way that resembles the brain in 'Pinky and the Brain' cartoon -
and/or Mini-me of Austin Powers - makes us laugh.

It was clear to anyone with an IQ level greater than that of a mosquito...

Now could you please buzz off?

On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 9:50 PM, Meshinkah Meshinkah
meshin...@gmail.com wrote:

 wow...u people are pathetic..
 Ok, enough with all the bullshit.
 Everyone in here is talking acting like a smartass who actually tried doing 
 any better.
 I dont know if the so called e.hitler can live up to any of his global 
 scale message claims, nor do i know if he his actions will speak louder than 
 words as he says.
 All i know is the guy is utilising what he's got, tryina fight for his cause 
 and views, while you guys are making fun of the name :S.
 Now whether he does that or not, at least he actually tried to make a real 
 difference, instead of posting a i support gaza as a fb status, or as an 
 msn pm.
 Now if anyone here sees himself capable of doin a better change, i suggest he 
 show us.  Anyone arguing he has no skin in this doesnt have to interfere 
 making fun of the people who tried with all the effort and resources they 
 got, no matter how small, to fight for their cause.  You either contribute to 
 your side, or stay just stay away and let the people who are interested in 
 the issue serve their side.
 I respect the guy, whether he succeeds or fails.
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Re: [Full-disclosure] e-Holocaust

If he were to have posted that he hacked this 1 Israeli server - and shown
that he was exploiting some new unknown vulnerability and Fully Disclosed
the methods he used - it would have fit the Full Disclosure character.

The fact that he is 'threatning', does not make it 'newsworthy' - it makes
it 'funny'

As it is - he fits the scrip-kiddy type that everyone has fun laughing at.



On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 12:09 AM, andrew. wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 9:18 PM, Avraham Schneider
 avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
  1st of all, his cause and views are summed up as terrorism - worthless
  terrorism, but still terrorism - therefore he gets no sympathy.

 You don't get it do you, this is supposedly a mailing list about 'the
 threats'.
 Should we not be encouraging terrorists to post to the list not discourage?
 Think about it.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] I'm not the troll i've been trolled

what 'threats'? e.hitler's? pfff...

On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 12:49 AM, andrew. wallace 
andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com wrote:

 Can we wrap this thread up now and get back to business about 'the
 threats'.

 On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 10:33 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
  You wasn't supposed to leave this list before MI5 throw your body in the
 sea
  ?
 
  2009/1/12 andrew. wallace andrew.wall...@rocketmail.com
 
  On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 6:36 PM, Ureleet urel...@gmail.com wrote:
   im a well known troll against 1 thing.  u.  nothing else.
 
  Let us know if you ever feel angry about anything else apart from me
  now or in the future.
 
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Re: [Full-disclosure] e-Holocaust

On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 12:57 AM, Meshinka7 meshin...@gmail.com wrote:

 Right..
 ok, sure, throwing toilet paper is no damage, wont hurt.  Publicisng your
 paypal
 account and other info, now that would hurt dont ya think?

Defacing a bunch of websites that almost nobody looks at - all hosted on one
un-patched server is akin to throwing toilet paper on your neighbor's house
at night - read: no damage.



 As for what he's doing being worthless, i never said it was, please read my
 posts
 before u reply, instead of just makin me repeat myself.

oh... we are all so sorry for troubling you. not.


   All i said was he is trying,

with all his knowledge, capabilities, etc to support the people he sees
 right, and go
 against those he sees wrong.

and that has what to do with FD?

  And again, whether the news talk about him or not,
 whether all this he's tryina do does any effect, they had enough self
 confidence to have a goal and attempt it, i am petty sure if they had the
 power and capabilities
 to do more they would..

he does not - since he is a script kiddy.



 and lol..., go donate? that just made me laugh..

yeah, it was probably a joke - like you and like e.hitler.



 Once again, i support his thought and determination

good for you.


 , i dont know about his recources and/or skills to judge him being a skid
 or not and neither does anyone in here.

Other than you and e.hitler (a bored kid with too many pimples to have any
friends) - we all know.


  All of that is irrelevant to him failing/succeeding, or whether he's goin
 up against the side u think are terrorists or not.

yes - he is irrelevant. Funny, but irrelevant.





 On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 11:06 PM, Rants nRaves rantsnr...@gmail.comwrote:

 I think we'd all have a lot more respect if e.hitler (I still laugh every
 time I say that!)  and his buddies did something actually worthwhile that
 would make a real difference.  Like volunteering for a charity which is
 collecting for the innocent Palestinians who are loosing their homes,
 schools, etc for example.  Or how about writing his elected officials to put
 pressure on the Israeli's to let the Red Cross and other aid agencies in?
 Instead he's done the internet equivalent of throwing toilet paper on the
 neighbors house in the middle of the night.  Yes, someone is pissed off now
 and had to clean it up, but it's just a sophomoric prank which doesn't mean
 anything in the world.  It makes him and his buddies feel good like they're
 doing something, but the adults on this forum know better.

 Notice nobody in the news is reporting that e.hitler and his merry men are
 wreaking havoc.  Even so-called news sites like slashdot are ignoring it...
 why?  because it's not news and nobody gives a shit.  When they hack into
 the Mossad or IDF let me know.  But they're just lame script kiddies who
 don't have the skills or balls to pull that off.

 And yes, people like myself without any skin in the game do have a role-
 to point out to the rest of the world when the emperor has no clothes.  If
 e.hitler doesn't like it, he can always crawl back into his hole and stop
 posting.

 -Rants


   On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Meshinkah Meshinkah 
 meshin...@gmail.com wrote:

   wow...u people are pathetic..
 Ok, enough with all the bullshit.
 Everyone in here is talking acting like a smartass who actually tried
 doing any better.
 I dont know if the so called e.hitler can live up to any of his global
 scale message claims, nor do i know if he his actions will speak louder
 than words as he says.
 All i know is the guy is utilising what he's got, tryina fight for his
 cause and views, while you guys are making fun of the name :S.
 Now whether he does that or not, at least he actually tried to make a
 real difference, instead of posting a i support gaza as a fb status, or as
 an msn pm.
 Now if anyone here sees himself capable of doin a better change, i
 suggest he show us.  Anyone arguing he has no skin in this doesnt have to
 interfere making fun of the people who tried with all the effort and
 resources they got, no matter how small, to fight for their cause.  You
 either contribute to your side, or stay just stay away and let the people
 who are interested in the issue serve their side.
 I respect the guy, whether he succeeds or fails.

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Re: [Full-disclosure] mr wallace must be stopped and i know how

He WILL eventually go away if not a single person replies to him.

as 'he does not process rational thought' - I find that hard to believe.


On Tue, Jan 13, 2009 at 2:17 AM, Biz Marqee biz.mar...@gmail.com wrote:

 OK - so in the interest of attempting to rid this list of the person we all
 hate I will now cease posting any replies to the n3t d3viate. Since I am now
 pretty sure he is a just mentally unstable person only seeking attention for
 his childlike behavior, I will deal with him in the same fashion as a child
 - ignoring him completely. I have tried to reason with him in private, as
 well outright public abuse. Nothing works because he does not process
 rational thought.

 I implore each of you who reply to his fishing expeditions (yes I am
 guilty!) to consider this as an alternate way to express your hate for him.
 He WILL eventually go away if not a single person replies to him.

 Please, in the interest of this list which was once GREAT, don't feed
 andrew wallace's fragmented ego. Just dont hit that reply button. It will
 only work if everyone does it, but will fail if one person does not. If
 people do it, it will happen. Not over night but it will.

 Anyway I will no longer be baited by this maniac, so I bid you farewell FD!
 I hope the list can partially recover from the irreparable damage caused by
 this one person, and I hope everyone follows suit and lets this guy drown in
 his own thoughts.



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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

2009-01-07 Thread Avraham Schneider

You are welcome.

On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 4:25 PM, Marcello Barnaba (void) v...@openssl.it wrote:

 On 6 Jan 2009, at 3:43 PM, Avraham Schneider wrote:

 Just one last thing - for those upset by this long completely off topic
 thread:

 http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=enanswer=6579


 rant useless=true
 You should take this crap off list, rather than saying I'll be here no
 matter what, filter me if you don't want to read me: the usual fscking
 cliche` attitude of you damn religious people, always trying to make others
 swallow your blind theories, even in the WRONG place, whent there's NO ONE
 interested.

 You should better live and make others live, instead of blindly trusting a
 novel book wrote only to control you and your fellow believers. Please read
 http://www.stupidwish.net/religion.html to have some insights, and get a
 life.
 /rant

 Thanks,
 ~Marcello (quite disappointed to waste bits on this useless thread)
 --
 pub 1024D/8D2787EF  723C 7CA3 3C19 2ACE  6E20 9CC1 9956 EB3C 8D27 87EF





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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

The basic facts:

* Israel has always tried to prevent injuring civilians.  The
number of innocent Palestinian civilians intentionally targeted by
Israel is precisely zero.  The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) has been
trying to pinpoint the terrorists themselves, many of whom
unfortunately hide behind civilians as shields, in their houses and in
their mosques.
* Despite the recent violence, Israel continues to facilitate
humanitarian assistance to Gaza. In just the past few days, while
Hamas has continued to fire rockets into Israel, more than 60
truckloads of humanitarian supplies and 105,000 gallons of fuel were
transferred to Gaza. Israel also continues to provide 70 percent of
Gaza's electricity.
* Since Israel's 2005 full withdrawal from Gaza, Hamas has
indiscriminately fired more than 6,500 rockets at Israeli population
centers; more than 3000 were fired in 2008 alone.
* Hamas, backed by Iran, has turned Gaza into a daily launching
pad of terror against thousands Israeli civilians for years.
* Hamas stores its large cache of illegally smuggled arms in, and
launches its daily barrage of missiles from, large civilian population
centers placing innocent Palestinian civilians directly in the line of
fire.
* No country in the world would tolerate a situation where its
civilians are terrorized daily by rockets fired from across the
border.
* If American civilians would have become targets to such terror
attacks from across the border, does anyone doubt the US would respond
very forcefully? Viewed from this perspective, Israel has shown
restraint to date.


On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 7:49 AM, Ed Carp e...@pobox.com wrote:
 On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Larry Seltzer la...@larryseltzer.com wrote:

 Also stolen from the Palestinian people: their domain name.

 Larry Seltzer
 eWEEK.com Security Center Editor

 When someone in the press starts regurgitating lies, I've got to step
 in and say something.

 Lie #1: There was such a country named Palestine, for the Palestinian people.
 Fact #1: There never was such a country until 1920 - what is today
 referred to as the Palestinian people were nomadic tribes that made
 their homes in encampments in the deserts of Jordan and Egypt.
 Palestine was only enacted as a separate protectorate in 1920 by the
 British Mandate in 1920.  The region referred to as Palestine in
 historical terms encompassed a much wider area, comprising Jrodan,
 Egypt, and many other Middle Eastern countries.  Until 1920, there
 never were any formal boundaries or a formal country.
 Lie #2: Israel stole Palestine from the Palestinians.
 Fact #2: In 1920, the British Mandate formed Palestine for the intent
 of creating a national home for the Jewish prople (note this doesn't
 say anything about Arabs or Palestinians).  In 1947, the UN approved
 splitting Palestine into two parts - one Jewish, one Arab.  In 1948,
 the Jewish part of Palestine declared its independence, calling itself
 Israel.  From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel:

 After 1945 the United Kingdom became embroiled in an increasingly
 violent conflict with the Jews.[50] In 1947, the British government
 withdrew from commitment to the Mandate of Palestine, stating it was
 unable to arrive at a solution acceptable to both Arabs and Jews.[51]
 The newly created United Nations approved the UN Partition Plan
 (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181) on November 29, 1947,
 dividing the country into two states, one Arab and one Jewish.
 Jerusalem was to be designated an international city – a corpus
 separatum – administered by the UN to avoid conflict over its
 status.[52] The Jewish community accepted the plan,[53] but the Arab
 League and Arab Higher Committee rejected it.[54] On December 1, 1947
 the Arab Higher Committee proclaimed a 3-day strike, and Arab
 guerrilla attacks began against Jewish targets. Convinced that these
 attacks were merely a prelude to full-scale military confrontations
 with the regular armies of the Arab states, Ben-Gurion elected to
 escalate the military conflict. As such, Haganah embarked on a policy
 of aggressive defense. This strategy was accompanied by economic
 subversion and psychological warfare.[55]

 On May 14, 1948, the day before the end of the British Mandate, the
 Jewish Agency proclaimed independence, naming the country Israel. The
 following day five Arab countries – Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and
 Iraq –invaded Israel, launching the 1948 Arab-Israeli War.[56]
 Morocco, Sudan, Yemen and Saudi Arabia also sent troops to assist the
 invaders. After a year of fighting, a ceasefire was declared and
 temporary borders, known as the Green Line, were established. Jordan
 annexed what became known as the West Bank and East Jerusalem, and
 Egypt took control of the Gaza Strip. Israel was admitted as a member
 of the United Nations on May 11, 1949.[57] During the war 711,000
 Arabs, according to UN estimates, or about 80% of the previous Arab
 population, fled the

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

if the facts I show you are porpaganda, what would you call your lies?

On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 11:36 AM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
 Avraham, dude  you 're doing the wrong job, you should sell some thermo-pump
 or something
 you've big skill in selling/propaganda :)

 2009/1/6 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 The basic facts:

* Israel has always tried to prevent injuring civilians.  The
 number of innocent Palestinian civilians intentionally targeted by
 Israel is precisely zero.  The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) has been
 trying to pinpoint the terrorists themselves, many of whom
 unfortunately hide behind civilians as shields, in their houses and in
 their mosques.
* Despite the recent violence, Israel continues to facilitate
 humanitarian assistance to Gaza. In just the past few days, while
 Hamas has continued to fire rockets into Israel, more than 60
 truckloads of humanitarian supplies and 105,000 gallons of fuel were
 transferred to Gaza. Israel also continues to provide 70 percent of
 Gaza's electricity.
* Since Israel's 2005 full withdrawal from Gaza, Hamas has
 indiscriminately fired more than 6,500 rockets at Israeli population
 centers; more than 3000 were fired in 2008 alone.
* Hamas, backed by Iran, has turned Gaza into a daily launching
 pad of terror against thousands Israeli civilians for years.
* Hamas stores its large cache of illegally smuggled arms in, and
 launches its daily barrage of missiles from, large civilian population
 centers placing innocent Palestinian civilians directly in the line of
 fire.
* No country in the world would tolerate a situation where its
 civilians are terrorized daily by rockets fired from across the
 border.
* If American civilians would have become targets to such terror
 attacks from across the border, does anyone doubt the US would respond
 very forcefully? Viewed from this perspective, Israel has shown
 restraint to date.


 On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 7:49 AM, Ed Carp e...@pobox.com wrote:
  On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 8:49 PM, Larry Seltzer la...@larryseltzer.com
  wrote:
 
  Also stolen from the Palestinian people: their domain name.
 
  Larry Seltzer
  eWEEK.com Security Center Editor
 
  When someone in the press starts regurgitating lies, I've got to step
  in and say something.
 
  Lie #1: There was such a country named Palestine, for the Palestinian
  people.
  Fact #1: There never was such a country until 1920 - what is today
  referred to as the Palestinian people were nomadic tribes that made
  their homes in encampments in the deserts of Jordan and Egypt.
  Palestine was only enacted as a separate protectorate in 1920 by the
  British Mandate in 1920.  The region referred to as Palestine in
  historical terms encompassed a much wider area, comprising Jrodan,
  Egypt, and many other Middle Eastern countries.  Until 1920, there
  never were any formal boundaries or a formal country.
  Lie #2: Israel stole Palestine from the Palestinians.
  Fact #2: In 1920, the British Mandate formed Palestine for the intent
  of creating a national home for the Jewish prople (note this doesn't
  say anything about Arabs or Palestinians).  In 1947, the UN approved
  splitting Palestine into two parts - one Jewish, one Arab.  In 1948,
  the Jewish part of Palestine declared its independence, calling itself
  Israel.  From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel:
 
  After 1945 the United Kingdom became embroiled in an increasingly
  violent conflict with the Jews.[50] In 1947, the British government
  withdrew from commitment to the Mandate of Palestine, stating it was
  unable to arrive at a solution acceptable to both Arabs and Jews.[51]
  The newly created United Nations approved the UN Partition Plan
  (United Nations General Assembly Resolution 181) on November 29, 1947,
  dividing the country into two states, one Arab and one Jewish.
  Jerusalem was to be designated an international city – a corpus
  separatum – administered by the UN to avoid conflict over its
  status.[52] The Jewish community accepted the plan,[53] but the Arab
  League and Arab Higher Committee rejected it.[54] On December 1, 1947
  the Arab Higher Committee proclaimed a 3-day strike, and Arab
  guerrilla attacks began against Jewish targets. Convinced that these
  attacks were merely a prelude to full-scale military confrontations
  with the regular armies of the Arab states, Ben-Gurion elected to
  escalate the military conflict. As such, Haganah embarked on a policy
  of aggressive defense. This strategy was accompanied by economic
  subversion and psychological warfare.[55]
 
  On May 14, 1948, the day before the end of the British Mandate, the
  Jewish Agency proclaimed independence, naming the country Israel. The
  following day five Arab countries – Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and
  Iraq –invaded Israel, launching the 1948 Arab-Israeli War.[56]
  Morocco, Sudan, Yemen and Saudi Arabia also sent troops to assist the
  invaders. After

Re: [Full-disclosure] Fwd: The war in Palestine

Thanks for the compliment. No I am not G-d, but I understand your
excitement to words of truth after you've been so long in the dark.

On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 12:37 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
 Here's God !  :)


 2009/1/6 Avraham Schneider avri.schnei...@gmail.com

 On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 12:14 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
  what would you call your lies
  Which lies ?
 Every single one of your points. Read the facts I presented you with,
 they deal with most if not all of them.

  You're tunnel-focused on your point, with no relativisation at all,
  which
 Forgive me for being right.

  brings your argument not valuable for a penny, when i read your post i
  feel
  like reading/listening a tsahal interview/report.
 Forgive the Israeli Defense Forces for being right.

  There's two side on a medial, dont forget that, that's why i say you're
  doing propaganda, while criticizing the other propaganda.
 No - the media is composed of whatever anyone presents on it - some of
 it is propaganda lies - like the ones you are distributing and some of
 them are based on true facts, like those that I and others are
 presenting.

 
 
 
 
 



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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 12:14 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
 what would you call your lies
 Which lies ?
Every single one of your points. Read the facts I presented you with,
they deal with most if not all of them.

 You're tunnel-focused on your point, with no relativisation at all, which
Forgive me for being right.

 brings your argument not valuable for a penny, when i read your post i feel
 like reading/listening a tsahal interview/report.
Forgive the Israeli Defense Forces for being right.

 There's two side on a medial, dont forget that, that's why i say you're
 doing propaganda, while criticizing the other propaganda.
No - the media is composed of whatever anyone presents on it - some of
it is propaganda lies - like the ones you are distributing and some of
them are based on true facts, like those that I and others are
presenting.







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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 2:06 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
 Relativisation in this case is neccessary, because the UK took this land
 from arabians,
 and gived it to jews mostly because it was
 supposedly them promised land.
 Before that maybe not much arabians was living there, but still it was them
 land.
 The not legit attribution in 1948 of the land to israel was the conflict
 starter and still today, now excuses have changed, palestinian are throwing
 rocks and old school rockets around the border in israel.
 What have changed so far ? as i sayed in my first post on this topic, israel
 is very young 61 years old, and have been in war with all of them neighbors,
 also while fighting with them, israel once again has taken more land during
 theses wars.

History time-line (facts)
17th-6th C. BCE

c.17th century (BCE) - Abraham, Isaac, Jacob - patriarchs of the
Jewish people and bearers of a belief in one God - settle in the Land
of Israel. Famine forces Israelites to migrate to Egypt.
c.13th century (BCE) - Exodus from Egypt: Moses leads Israelites from
Egypt, followed by 40 years of wandering in the desert.
Torah, including the Ten Commandments, received at Mount Sinai.
13th-12th centuries (BCE) - Israelites settle in the Land of Israel
c.1020 (BCE) -  Jewish monarchy established; Saul, first king.
c.1000 (BCE) -  Jerusalem made capital of David's kingdom.
c.960 (BCE) -   First Temple, the national and spiritual center of the
Jewish people, built in Jerusalem by King Solomon.
c. 930 (BCE) -  Divided kingdom: Judah and Israel
722-720 (BCE) - Israel crushed by Assyrians; 10 tribes exiled (Ten Lost Tribes).
586 (BCE)   - Judah conquered by Babylonia; Jerusalem and First Temple
destroyed; most Jews exiled.
538 - 142 (BCE) - Persian and Hellenistic periods
538 - 515 (BCE) - Many Jews return from Babylonia; Temple rebuilt.
332 (BCE) - Land conquered by Alexander the Great; Hellenistic rule.
166-160 (BCE) - Maccabean (Hasmonean) revolt against restrictions on
practice of Judaism and desecration of the Temple
142-129 (BCE) - Jewish autonomy under Hasmoneans.
129-63 (BCE) - Jewish independence under Hasmonean monarchy.
63 (BCE) - Jerusalem captured by Roman general, Pompey.
63-4 BCE - Herod, Roman vassal king, rules the Land of Israel; Temple
in Jerusalem refurbished
c. 20-33 (CE) - Ministry of Jesus of Nazareth
66 (CE) - Jewish revolt against the Romans
70 (CE) - Destruction of Jerusalem and Second Temple.
73 (CE) - Last stand of Jews at Masada.
132-135 (CE) - Bar Kokhba uprising against Rome.
614 (CE) - Persian invasion
636-1099 (CE) - Arab rule
691 (CE) - On site of First and Second Temples in Jerusalem, Dome of
the Rock built by Caliph Abd el-Malik.
1099-1291 (CE) - Crusader domination (Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem)
1291-1516 (CE) - Mamluk rule
1517-1917 (CE) - Ottoman rule
1882-1903 (CE) - First Aliya (large-scale immigration), mainly from Russia.
1897 (CE) - First Zionist Congress convened by Theodor Herzl in Basel,
Switzerland; Zionist Organization founded.
1904-14 (CE) - Second Aliya, mainly from Russia and Poland.
1909 (CE) - First kibbutz, Degania, and first modern all-Jewish city,
Tel Aviv, founded.
1917 (CE) - 400 years of Ottoman rule ended by British
conquest;British Foreign Minister Balfour pledges support for
establishment of a Jewish national home in Palestine
1918-48 (CE) - British rule


As you can see, it was not taken from Arabs but was given by the
British, who took it from the Ottomans.


 I can understand why palestinian mothers are telling to theirs sons to wear
 a bomb, and blow themself to kill some israelians, i totally do not approve
 this, but as a mather of fact, i understand the despair for this people
 (open-mind is a crime ?).
teaching your kid to strap a bomb against their chest and commit
suicide while murdering innocent people is much more like child abuse
than being open-minded if you ask me. I think others here would
concur.


 Also as i sayed in my first post, another problem of  Israelites is that
 they think they are elected  by god... and then are superior to any other
 race/religion, i'm not inventing nothing here.. it's written in the Thora.

 Just this fact  is a fundamental communication problem, for any discution
 because persons such as Avraham will always overlook the others point of
 view.
I think a bigger communication problem is being blind (on purpose) to facts.


 I'm not pro-palestinian
Could have fooled me.

 or pro-israel, the only thing i know is
 relativisation in such conflict should be always the first thing to do
 before dumping any crap from your brain.
Why don't you start then?


 A correction for Avraham:
 Jews != Israel
A Jew is a decendent of Avraham, Isac and Jacob on the father side,
having a Jewish mother.
Conversion to Judaism is also possible, bud discouraged for reasons I
will not get into here.

Jacob's name was changed by G-d to Israel - you can find it in the
Torah - not that I expect or want you to read it.

 Sionists !=

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

You started this thread with propaganda lies.

You bring no facts to support your claims.

This thread is going nowhere.

Plus your typos have turned from funny to annoying.

Therefore I am done with this thread.

I am sure many subscribers to this list will be delighted.

I am sure they would be even more delighted if you stopped as well.



On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 3:59 PM, j-f sentier j.sent...@gmail.com wrote:
 w00t quoting party :)

 It is obvious that you are also against the war in Iraq and Afghanistan.
 The reason the US is fighting there is close to the reason why
 Israelis are fighting in Gaza - to ensure peace to their citizens.
 Should I remind you of 9-11?

 haha i was waiting that one, this is another conflict that i wont get in,
 but propaganda style is the same.

 As you can see, it was not taken from Arabs but was given by the
 British, who took it from the Ottomans.
 Do you need glasses ?  - the UK took this land from arabians, and gived it
 to jews mostly because it was
 supposedly them promised land.

 teaching your kid to strap a bomb against their chest and commit

 suicide while murdering innocent people is much more like child abuse
 than being open-minded if you ask me. I think others here would
 concur.

 I sayed that i understand why, but i do not approve,(this fact is open-mind)
 i guess you do need glasses.

 Jews != Israel
 A Jew is a decendent of Avraham, Isac and Jacob on the father side,
 having a Jewish mother.
 Conversion to Judaism is also possible, bud discouraged for reasons I
 will not get into here.
 Let me clarify this too :
 israel = lots of rednecks like you
 Jews = good people in general, as others religionsatheist.
 So for god sake dont insult them saying that Jews =israel
 A lots of jews doesn't approve at all israel politics/vision and this
 doesn't make them bad jews.

 Jacob's name was changed by G-d to Israel - you can find it in the
 Torah - not that I expect or want you to read it.
 You totally need glasses, i sayed that i readed the bible and the thora
 once, and also as i see that you have some reading problem  i dont believe
 in none of them or any, yes im an atheist :)





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Re: [Full-disclosure] FD / lists.grok.org - bad SSL cert

On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 12:04 PM, Gary Wilson dra...@dragons.org.uk wrote:

 On Mon, January 5, 2009 19:01, James Matthews wrote:
 SSL certs cost money. This one works the same. etc..


 Well whilst I agree the self generated ones or whatever work well, I find
 it amusing that a _security_ based list is using one, and then expects
 people in the security industry to blindly accept or add exceptions for it
 - my irony alarm is going overtime at that one.  I certainly wouldn't add
 an exception, as it's not a trusted website to me.  I'm sure others would
 see it the same.
What's the worst case? Someone sniffing your unsub request?
It's not like an e-commerce website. I don't see why FD should even
have SSL in the first place.

I would guess the webmaster simply added SSL to allow those who have
port 80 to full-disclosure (containing malicious code) filtered...

I think you are over-dramatizing 'the irony'.


 Doesn't matter now, as I'm unsubbed via the mail method, because FD just
 has too much noise-signal these days.



 --
   /   Gary Wilson, aka dragon/dragonlord/dragonv480\
  .'(_.--.  e: dra...@northernscum.org.uk MSN: dragonv480   .--._)`.
_   | FB: http://profile.to/gary_wilson_horse_dentist/ |   _   
  `.( `--' w: http://volvo480.northernscum.org.uk   `--' ).'
   \w: http://www.northernscum.org.uk   /


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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Just one last thing - for those upset by this long completely off topic thread:

http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=enanswer=6579


On Tue, Jan 6, 2009 at 4:34 PM, Rob Thompson
my.security.li...@gmail.com wrote:
 Avraham Schneider wrote:
 I am sure many subscribers to this list will be delighted.

 I am sure they would be even more delighted if you stopped as well.

 We would have been delighted if you f'ing tools would have stopped a few
 DAYS ago.

 Too little, too late, jackass.

 --
 Rob

 +-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-+
 | _   |
 |  ASCII ribbon campaign ( )  |
 |   - against HTML email  X   |
 |/ \  |
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 +-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-+


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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

2009-01-05 Thread Avraham Schneider

On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 9:25 AM, - o z - o...@hotmail.com wrote:

 On Jan 4, 2009, at 10:31 PM, Avraham Schneider wrote:

  When there is no choice, there is no choice - Israel has to defend it's
 own
 civilian population as a first priority.

 Let me tell you a little of the latest events -

 1) IDF calls a family in Gaza, to let them know they are about to bomb the
 house from the air - demanding that the family members leave immediately.
 (the IDF had inteligence that weapons were stored in that family's house)
 2) Family members climb to the roof of the house as they know the IDF
 pilots
 would not want to harm civilians
 3) The IDF pilot fires a rocket to the corner of the roof, making it clear
 that if they don't leave, they will die,
 4) The family get the point and run away
 5) House is fired at
 6) Explosions ocur due to ammunition and rockets stored there.


 Correction #3:  The MC actually dispatched MIGCAP to fire 20mm cannon,
 not 'rocket' -- at the next building over.   The kill ratio from a rocket's
 shrapnel
 would have killed anyone on the roof, hence, 20mm fire to ward off the
 family
 and scare the dickens out of them so they would bail from the structure.

http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1052034.html
 The IDF Spokesman said that Ghayan's house had served as a weapons silo and
a war room for Hamas. Under the house, according to the IDF, was a tunnel
which was meant to serve as an escape route in case of an Israeli attack.
.
.
.
The IDF has code named such operations roof knocking, in which the army
informs the residents of s suspected building that they have 10 minutes to
leave the premises. In some cases, residents of suspected houses have been
able to prevent bombing by climbing up to the roof to show that they will
not leave, prompting IDF commanders to call off the strike. In these cases,
Channel 10 reported Thursday, the IAF sometimes launches a relatively
harmless missile at the corner of the roof, avoiding casualties but
successfully dispersing the crowd.
.
.
.
It appears that the roof knocking technique was used in the assassination,
but Ghayan decided to stay indoors with his family, and the army opted to
bomb the house anyway.
A lecturer at Gaza's Islamic University, Ghayan, 49, had mentored suicide
bombers and would sometimes go on patrol with Hamas fighters. He was known
for his close ties to the group's military wing and was respected in Gaza
for donning combat fatigues and personally participating in clashes against
Israeli forces. He sent one of his sons on an October 2001 suicide mission
that killed two Israeli settlers in Gaza.




 #4:  Family found Jesus right away, no, Common Sense...and bailed from the
 roof.

 #5:  Cool fireworks display courtesy of your local IDF

 #6:  Kudos to family for making a media moment of defiance, but it was
 really time
 to leave before someone was killed.


 2009/1/4  valdis.kletni...@vt.edu:


 You people can't even agree to stop a flame war.


  It's not a flame war - it's an off-topic propaganda started by a Muslim
 and
 defended by a Jew.
 Just add the subject to a filter rule in Outlook/gmail/whatever client you
 use, and forget about it.


 Defended by two Jews now, Mazel tov

Thanks for the help.


 --




 Condoleezza Rice is a very cruel, offended woman who lacks men's
 attention. She needs to be taken to a company of man-soldiers and it would
 be just fine. Releasing such stupid remarks gives her the feeling of being
 fulfilled. This is the only way for her to attract men's attention.  Show me
 that Rice is a woman? The only thing she attracts is reindeer. The States
 needs to practice the old Soviet tradition when both single women and single
 men were not allowed to take responsible state positions...

 --Vladimir Zhirinovsky,  Russian politician, rabid leader of the Liberal
 and Democratic Party of Russia (LDPR)




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Re: [Full-disclosure] FD / lists.grok.org - bad SSL cert

2009-01-05 Thread Avraham Schneider

just add an exception...

On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 2:35 PM, Gary Wilson dra...@dragons.org.uk wrote:

 Having had enough of the non-topic junk this list has become recently, I
 went to unsub, but it seems the SSL cert is not valid/trusted.

 For the mods, I guess:

 Secure Connection Failed

 lists.grok.org.uk uses an invalid security certificate.

 The certificate is not trusted because the issuer certificate is not trusted.

 (Error code: sec_error_untrusted_issuer)


* This could be a problem with the server's configuration, or it could
 be someone trying to impersonate the server.

* If you have connected to this server successfully in the past, the
 error may be temporary, and you can try again later.

 --
 GW

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

2009-01-05 Thread Avraham Schneider

Me and others disproved every single one of the claims you and the other
Muslim (assuming you are not the same) person posted here.

The fact that nobody forced him to answer or even read the topic might be
true but his frustration is understandable for this mailing list is aimed
for IT-Security related discussions and you started a completely off-topic
thread full of propaganda lies.

It is therefore understandable why subscribers to this list who know the
facts and know that you are spreading propaganda full of lies respond in
order to clear their (and their country's, etc...) name - but it does not
explain why you started this thread on an IT-Security mailing list.

As for the 21 (not 20) year old 'boy' - 'demonstrating'

Moral of the story- if you don't throw flaming tires at armed soldiers
during a riot, you won't get shot.


On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 2:06 PM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.com wrote:

 Nobody force you to answer or even read this topic. You can still
 answer and read other topic.

 And what a liar you are.Yesterday a 20 year old boy got shoot dead by
 israel in Westbank in a demonstration. So dont speak like the soldiers
 are little angels. In fact Satan himself , take special course from
 sionist ppl.

 2009/1/5 Yudi Rosen yr42.li...@gmail.com:
  It's interesting to note how the PA Palestinians in the West Bank are
 living
  peacefully - they're not launching attacks on Israeli citizens, and
 therefor
  aren't being attacked back by Israel. In fact, many of them have jobs
 within
  Israeli areas and receive benefits from the Israeli government (my
 source?
  I'm there right now, I've asked to both Jews and Arabs about this).
 
  Yet in Gaza, the ruling party (Hamas) has vowed not just to establish a
  Palestinian country, but also to destroy Israel and kill every last Jew.
 And
  they attempt to make good on their words by deliberately and specificly
  targeting civillians, even killing other Palestinians in the proccess. In
  order to defend it's own people (both Jews and Arabs), Israel launches
 this
  latest battle.
 
  THEN, (hoping to garner some sympathy for the Hamas cause, it seems?),
  several people start a flamefight on a IT-security mailing list.
 
  ...anyone see what doesn't make sense here?
 
  There are places to flame about this, FD doesn't seem like one of them.
  Please let's get back on topic?
 
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 10:17 AM, Avraham Schneider
  avri.schnei...@gmail.com wrote:
 
 
  On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 9:25 AM, - o z - o...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
  On Jan 4, 2009, at 10:31 PM, Avraham Schneider wrote:
 
  When there is no choice, there is no choice - Israel has to defend
 it's
  own
  civilian population as a first priority.
 
  Let me tell you a little of the latest events -
 
  1) IDF calls a family in Gaza, to let them know they are about to bomb
  the
  house from the air - demanding that the family members leave
  immediately.
  (the IDF had inteligence that weapons were stored in that family's
  house)
  2) Family members climb to the roof of the house as they know the IDF
  pilots
  would not want to harm civilians
  3) The IDF pilot fires a rocket to the corner of the roof, making it
  clear
  that if they don't leave, they will die,
  4) The family get the point and run away
  5) House is fired at
  6) Explosions ocur due to ammunition and rockets stored there.
 
  Correction #3:  The MC actually dispatched MIGCAP to fire 20mm cannon,
  not 'rocket' -- at the next building over.   The kill ratio from a
  rocket's shrapnel
  would have killed anyone on the roof, hence, 20mm fire to ward off the
  family
  and scare the dickens out of them so they would bail from the
 structure.
 
  http://haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1052034.html
   The IDF Spokesman said that Ghayan's house had served as a weapons silo
  and a war room for Hamas. Under the house, according to the IDF, was a
  tunnel which was meant to serve as an escape route in case of an Israeli
  attack.
  .
  .
  .
  The IDF has code named such operations roof knocking, in which the
 army
  informs the residents of s suspected building that they have 10 minutes
 to
  leave the premises. In some cases, residents of suspected houses have
 been
  able to prevent bombing by climbing up to the roof to show that they
 will
  not leave, prompting IDF commanders to call off the strike. In these
 cases,
  Channel 10 reported Thursday, the IAF sometimes launches a relatively
  harmless missile at the corner of the roof, avoiding casualties but
  successfully dispersing the crowd.
  .
  .
  .
  It appears that the roof knocking technique was used in the
  assassination, but Ghayan decided to stay indoors with his family, and
 the
  army opted to bomb the house anyway.
  A lecturer at Gaza's Islamic University, Ghayan, 49, had mentored
 suicide
  bombers and would sometimes go on patrol with Hamas fighters. He was
 known
  for his close ties to the group's military wing and was respected in
 Gaza

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

I do recommend every one to read the history to know why rockets are
lunched from Gaza toward the Israeli lands, and what the Israeli
troops are really doing.

We will go right ahead -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Israel#Jewish_History_in_Israel



You do not have time ? yes even sometime I don't have enough time to
read my own mails.



I will try to help, have a look on this map

Thanks but we have time to do our own research and we don't need your
cheap propaganda – thanks anyway…

Here's a better picture –



How about some historic facts?

http://www.mideastweb.org/briefhistory.htm#From%20Roman%20to%20Ottoman%20Rule

About 61 B.C., Roman troops under Pompei invaded Judea and sacked
Jerusalem in support of King Herod. Judea had become a client state of
Rome.  Initially it was ruled by the client Herodian dynasty. The land
was divided into districts of Judea, Galilee, Peraea and a small
trans-Jordanian section, each of which eventually came under direct
Roman control. The Romans called the large central area of the land,
which included Jerusalem, Judea. According to Christian belief, Jesus
Christ was born in Bethlehem, Judea, in the early years of Roman rule.
Roman rulers put down Jewish revolts in about A.D. 70 and A.D. 132. In
A.D. 135, the Romans drove the Jews out of Jerusalem, following the
failed Bar Kochba revolt. The Romans named the area Palaestina, at
about this time. The name Palaestina, which  became Palestine in
English, is derived from Herodotus, who used the term Palaistine Syria
to refer to the entire southern part of Syria, meaning Philistine
Syria. Most of the Jews who continued to practice their religion fled
or were forcibly exiled from Palestine, eventually forming a second
Jewish Diaspora. However, Jewish communities continued to exist,
primarily in the Galilee, the northernmost part of Palestine.
Palestine was governed by the Roman Empire until the fourth century
A.D. (300's) and then by the Byzantine Empire. In time, Christianity
spread to most of Palestine. The population consisted of Jewish
converts to Christianity and paganism, peoples imported by the Romans,
and others who had probably inhabited Palestine continuously.

During the seventh century (A.D. 600's), Muslim  Arab armies moved
north from Arabia to conquer most of the Middle East, including
Palestine. Jerusalem was conquered about 638 by the Caliph Umar (Omar)
who gave his protection to its inhabitants. Muslim powers controlled
the region until the early 1900's. The rulers allowed Christians and
Jews to keep their religions. However, most of the local population
gradually accepted Islam and the Arab-Islamic culture of their rulers.
Jerusalem (Al-Quds)  became holy to Muslims as the site where,
according to tradition, Muhammad ascended to heaven after a miraculous
overnight ride from Mecca on his horse Al-Buraq. The al-Aqsa mosque
was built on the site generally regarded as the area of the Jewish
temples.



But don't let the facts bother you…



Do you understand why the small green areas are attacking the white ones ??

Yes, because of Iran's support and radical Islam leader's quest for
power and control over this region in particular and the world in
general.



If you don't like to think about it and maybe we are all technical
ppl who really only understand numbers? I will help as well

In the last 8 years there were 5000 rockets (if we can really call it
rockets) launched from the green areas killed 5 and wounded 15
and captured 1 ppl who lives in the white lands.



So the ppl from the white areas answer by killing 5000 and wounded
15 and capture more than 2 ppl from the green areas (7% of
these number are only in the last 7 days).



Maybe I will try to help more after 10 years from now by sending
another Map, and lets discuss then why the Palestinians didn't resist
to exist, if we will remember if there was a country called Palestine,
which used to own the whole green and white lands only 70 years ago 



Your point is?



This is war, not a gentleman's duel.



The fact that the weak side uses low-grade rockets means that the
strong side must match their arsenal to be fair?



I hope that I didn't take much time from you all.

You did.





From: full-disclosure-boun...@lists.grok.org.uk
[mailto:full-disclosure-boun...@lists.grok.org.uk] On Behalf Of Alaa
Abdelwahab
Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 13:10
To: full-disclosure@lists.grok.org.uk
Subject: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine



Dear All



While I believe this is not the best place to discuss this subject,
and it will be my first post ever, but you really gave me a very good
reason to send this mail.



I do recommend every one to read the history to know why rockets are
lunched from Gaza toward the Israeli lands, and what the Israeli
troops are really doing.



You do not have time ? yes even sometime I don't have enough time to
read my own mails.



I will try to help, have a look on this map





Do you understand why the

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Alaa Abdelwahab alaa.abdelwa...@free.frwrote:

 Avraham,

 With all respect to your point, thanks to use a better language

 I did not deny that the Jewish ppl exist since what ever many years, but
 does that mean they have to own the whole land now?

They owned the land - it was conquered from them - they got it back - so
yes, they have the right for the whole land now.


 I think this just give them the right to live and own their lands, without
 denying the same right
 for Christians and Muslims who used to live there as well for thousands of
 years even before the existence of the idea of the states.

The Arabs did not live there for thousands of years.
Israel never denied Christians or Muslims from living in Israel, proof is in
the large number of Israeli-Arabs (including Arab Knesset members).
The Palestinians in the occupied territories were not born there - they were
refugees from Arab countries that either fled there during the war(s) with
the Arab countries (that were defeated) or Arabs that entered the land after
the Arab leaders promised that Israel would be defeated - something that did
not happen.
When Israel signed peace agreements with Egypt and Jordan - the later made
it clear they do not want those Arabs back - did you ever wonder why? Don't
they care for their fellow Arabs?



 There might be a wrong popular idea that Arabs have a problem with Jewish,
 they only have a problem with Israel, and as you said when Muslims control
 the area, they didn't kick the Jewish out of it, in contrary to what Europe
 did before with Jewish and what Israel is doing now with Palestinians.

The following is the text of the Hamas spokesman's call for genocide of
Jews, the Hamas spokesman, Dr. Ismail Radwan, on Palestinian Authority TV,
on March 30, 2007:

The Hour [Resurrection] will not take place until the Muslims fight the
Jews and the Muslims kill them, and the rock and the tree will say: Oh,
Muslim, servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, kill him!'

I think that proves you wrong.



 The Idea is to live and let others live as well.

Didn't we try that? What about the Oslo agreement? 100% of the land the
Palestinians wanted was given to them - for peace.
The 'favor' we got in return was daily rocket attacks from civilian
population that support the terrorists firing them.



 Regarding the War idea you are talking about, you mean that you agree with
 aggressive force usage. So we live in a jungle, who ever own the power
 should kill every one before they have the same power.
 I'm surprised from your idea.

In reality (call it a jungle if you like) - no country would accept the
daily firing of rockets on it's civilian population.
Imagine Mexico's drug cartels being voted in as elect government by 90% of
Mexican people - and them deciding to get California back from the U.S. -
then starting to shoot low-grade rockets at San-Diego.
How do you think the U.S. would react?
How do you expect the U.S. to react?



 So you want to say that it was a big mistake that Muslims didn't kill all
 Christians and Jewish when they were much more powerful and they had the
 chance? No that is not acceptable we are civilized ppl and we believe that
 we all should live in peace and equally treat ppl regardless their
 religion,
 color, origin ...etc

They converted many by the sword and killed those who would not convert -
they didn't succeed but they tried.



 The history is saying that no one keep the power for long, so don't built
 the hate or you are going to pay for it.

History shows the Jews are victorious at the end. Large empires rise and
fall - but at the end of the day, the Jews are right and justice prevails.




 Hope that you will not change your idea when positions will be changed.

You assume 'positions' will change - I don't see that happening...
regardless I have G-d on my side so I have nothing to be afraid.



 But we will never change our idea.

I know - story has it's Mr. Evil - in the story of reality today Mr. Evil is
played by radical Islam. I hope it is the last Mr. Evil the world has to
deal with.




 Brgds...Alaa


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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 5:53 PM, Arturo 'Buanzo' Busleiman 
bua...@buanzo.com.ar wrote:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA512

 Oh come on, who gives a real fuck... god doesn't exist anyway. Religion is
 an excuse to dominate
 simple minds.

At least 178 Jews and persons of half- or three-quarters-Jewish ancestry
have been awarded the Nobel Prize,1 accounting for 23% of all individual
recipients worldwide between 1901 and 2008, and constituting 37% of all US
recipients2 during the same period.  In the scientific research fields of
Chemistry, Economics, Medicine, and Physics, the corresponding world and US
percentages are 27% and 40%, respectively.  (Jews currently make up
approximately 0.25% of the world's population and 2% of the US population.)

Considering Jews are testifying to the existence of G-d - I would say it is
hard to make your claim under these results...



 Avraham Schneider wrote:
 
 
  On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 4:36 PM, Alaa Abdelwahab alaa.abdelwa...@free.fr
  mailto:alaa.abdelwa...@free.fr wrote:
 
  Avraham,
 
  With all respect to your point, thanks to use a better language
 
  I did not deny that the Jewish ppl exist since what ever many years,
 but
  does that mean they have to own the whole land now?
 
  They owned the land - it was conquered from them - they got it back - so
  yes, they have the right for the whole land now.
 
 
  I think this just give them the right to live and own their lands,
  without denying the same right
  for Christians and Muslims who used to live there as well for
  thousands of years even before the existence of the idea of the
 states.
 
  The Arabs did not live there for thousands of years.
  Israel never denied Christians or Muslims from living in Israel, proof
  is in the large number of Israeli-Arabs (including Arab Knesset members).
  The Palestinians in the occupied territories were not born there - they
  were refugees from Arab countries that either fled there during the
  war(s) with the Arab countries (that were defeated) or Arabs that
  entered the land after the Arab leaders promised that Israel would be
  defeated - something that did not happen.
  When Israel signed peace agreements with Egypt and Jordan - the later
  made it clear they do not want those Arabs back - did you ever wonder
  why? Don't they care for their fellow Arabs?
 
 
 
  There might be a wrong popular idea that Arabs have a problem with
  Jewish,
  they only have a problem with Israel, and as you said when Muslims
  control
  the area, they didn't kick the Jewish out of it, in contrary to what
  Europe
  did before with Jewish and what Israel is doing now with
 Palestinians.
 
  The following is the text of the Hamas spokesman's call for genocide of
  Jews, the Hamas spokesman, Dr. Ismail Radwan, on Palestinian Authority
  TV, on March 30, 2007:
 
  The Hour [Resurrection] will not take place until the Muslims fight the
  Jews and the Muslims kill them, and the rock and the tree will say: Oh,
  Muslim, servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, kill him!'
 
  I think that proves you wrong.
 
 
 
  The Idea is to live and let others live as well.
 
  Didn't we try that? What about the Oslo agreement? 100% of the land the
  Palestinians wanted was given to them - for peace.
  The 'favor' we got in return was daily rocket attacks from civilian
  population that support the terrorists firing them.
 
 
 
  Regarding the War idea you are talking about, you mean that you
  agree with
  aggressive force usage. So we live in a jungle, who ever own the
 power
  should kill every one before they have the same power.
  I'm surprised from your idea.
 
  In reality (call it a jungle if you like) - no country would accept the
  daily firing of rockets on it's civilian population.
  Imagine Mexico's drug cartels being voted in as elect government by 90%
  of Mexican people - and them deciding to get California back from the
  U.S. - then starting to shoot low-grade rockets at San-Diego.
  How do you think the U.S. would react?
  How do you expect the U.S. to react?
 
 
 
  So you want to say that it was a big mistake that Muslims didn't
  kill all
  Christians and Jewish when they were much more powerful and they had
 the
  chance? No that is not acceptable we are civilized ppl and we
  believe that
  we all should live in peace and equally treat ppl regardless their
  religion,
  color, origin ...etc
 
  They converted many by the sword and killed those who would not convert
  - they didn't succeed but they tried.
 
 
 
  The history is saying that no one keep the power for long, so don't
  built
  the hate or you are going to pay for it.
 
  History shows the Jews are victorious at the end. Large empires rise and
  fall - but at the end of the day, the Jews are right and justice
 prevails.
 
 
 
 
  Hope that you will not change your idea

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Alaa Abdelwahab alaa.abdelwa...@free.frwrote:

Avraham,

I see you are telling so many mistakes here and I don't believe we all have
time to follow.

Heh. funny - I was responding to your propaganda that was completely
off-topic to this list - if you don't have time to follow up on your own
propaganda, then do us all a favor and keep it to yourself.

If you really care to continue this discussion, thanks to only send to my
address, and I will be more than happy to go through this argue as long as
it takes,.

Nope - not interested.

Just one comment, who ever does not believe that things are changing and
positions are always exchanged is doing a big mistake and he will be only
blaming himself

I already mentioned I am willing to live with it - what value are you adding
to the discussion with this statement?

I will not remind you who accept the Jewish when they were kicked out of
Europe maybe 100 years ago, who give them homes and land to live in. if you
believe that things are not changing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands

While violence and discrimination against Jews in Arab countries started to
increase several years before 1948, it escalated significantly starting in
1948 despite the fact that Jews were indigenous and for the most part held
Arab citizenship. Sometimes the process was state sanctioned; at other times
it was the consequence of anti-Jewish resentment by non-Jews. Harassment,
persecution and the confiscation of property followed. Secondly and in
response to mistreatment of Jews in these countries, a
Zionisthttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionismdrive for Jewish
immigration from Arab lands to Israel intensified. The
great majority of Jews in Arab lands eventually emigrated to the modern State
of Israel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel.[4]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands#cite_note-Stillmanxxi-3Activist
groups such as
JJAC http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=JJACaction=editredlink=1and
JIMENA http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JIMENA claim that there was a
collusion among Arab states to persecute Jews as part of their struggle
against
Israel.[5]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands#cite_note-JJAC_Press_release-4

The process grew apace as Arab nations under French, British and
Italian colonial
rule http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colony or
protectionhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protectorategained
independence. Further, anti-Jewish sentiment within the Arab-majority
states was exacerbated by the Arab-Israeli wars. Within a few years after
the Six Day War http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Day_War (1967) there were
only remnants of Jewish communities left in most Arab lands. Jews in Arab
lands were reduced from more than 800,000 in 1948 to perhaps 16,000 in 1991.
[4]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_lands#cite_note-Stillmanxxi-3
Some claim that the Jewish exodus from Arab lands is a historical parallel
to the Palestinian exodus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_exodusduring the 1948
Arab-Israeli War, while others reject this comparison as
simplistic.

Again I'm not talking about Jewish, I have nothing against them they are my
friends, neighbors, and even co-workers and I do really love them.

Keep in mind - Israel == Jews.

I'm talking about Israel state actions.

Israel is not the land for all Jewish, if this is true why we see many
Jewish against Israel, and sometime they go beyond that and talking the same
like most radical ppl are saying that Israel should never even exist. Do u
have an explanation for that ?

Yes I do. There are many non religious Jews - that's a sad truth and a
direct result of the holocaust. The good side is that it's about to change
(non religious Jews have less children than religious, plus the fact that
many are becoming religious again.)
Among the non-religious Jews, there are many that are blind to the facts as
you are, but unlike you they are blind due to Jewish compassionate nature -
The time will come when they will realize that by being compassionate to the
wicked they become cruel to the just. Don't worry, I don't expect you to
understand this.

Thanks for your time and I wish you have a peaceful life we all deserve.

I agree. Stop shooting rockets at us and stop with the suicide bombs, you
will have a peaceful life.

Brgds…Alaa

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Be careful of what you wish for.

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 6:05 PM, Arturo 'Buanzo' Busleiman 
bua...@buanzo.com.ar wrote:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA512

 The bloodshed is caused by idiot people, motherfuckers and things like
 that. Stop the damn religion
 of bein g an excuse for your country's desires, ok? Ig god existed, he'd
 probably be thinking about
 nuking the hell out of Earth.

 Alaa Abdelwahab wrote:
  Mikael
 
  This opinion is causing the majority of the bloodshed in the world
 today.
 
  What is causing the bloodshed is the unjust arrangements that are tying
 to
  be forced somewhere, the same like your example after the WW I.
 
 
  The argument can be made that Israel also tried peace, but it was
 responded
  with my bombings etc. Atrocities have been commited by both sides, this
 is
  an never ending argument. Both sides need to decide that they want
 peace,
  make sure they have representatives that also believe in this, and then
  they need to sit down and decide what to do, execute it and at the same
  time curb extremism in their own midst.
 
  What peace they have tried? Did they agree on the tens of UN resolutions:
 
  - Palestinian Refugees have the right to return to their homes in Israel.
  (General Assembly Resolution 194, Dec. 11, 1948 )
  - Israel's occupation of Palestine is Illegal. (Security Council
 Resolution
  242, Nov. 22, 1967 )
  - Israel's settlements in Palestine are Illegal. (Security Council
  Resolution 446, March 22, 1979)
  - Palestinian have the right to Self-Determination. (General Assembly
  Resolution 3236, November 22, 1974)
  - Reaffirmation of a Palestinian State. (Security Council Resolution
 1397,
  March 12, 2002)
  - The 1947 Partition plan of Palestine and the creation of Israel. (UN
  General Assembly Resolution 181)
  - Recommends Israel suspend its no-man's zone' in Jerusalem. (Resolution
  127)
 
  All above UN resolutions and other tens of other resolutions to deplores
 the
  Israeli terror attacks against Lebanon/Jordan/Syria/Palestine/ were
 just
  been ignored by Israel and instead they are just trying to force their
 own
  view of peace, I don't call this peace.
 
  Maybe you have a different definition of the terror acts.
 
  When a man bomb himself and kills tens of civil ppl this is a terror act,
  but also when a powerful country sends its troupes inside another country
  and kills a thousands civil ppl this is a terror act as well.
 
  Don't tell me it is doing that to protect itself.
 
  To protect itself it should respect the UN resolutions. That should only
  bring peace to the whole area and we all live in peace.
 
  What I believe is that the UN should force Israel to respect its
  resolutions, the same way they did in Iraq and Yugoslavia.
 
 
  This is the current situation, it wasn't like this historically. Trying
 to
  argue that one side is evil by looking at latest developments is always
 a
  slippery road. You just before said that there were 5000 rockets
 launched
  in the past 8 years into Israel? Isn't that evil?
  This leads nowhere.
 
  As per the UN resolution which defined Israel as an occupation forces,
  that gives the right to the Palestinian to resist. Any way they see, and
 we
  all should support them.
  And as per the International Humanitarian Law the Geneva Conventions,
 the
  safety and securing a good life for the Palestinian ppl is the
  responsibility of Israel.
 
 
  Force? As opposed to the parties involved here, I am writing/talking,
  instead of promoting bloodshed.
 
 
  When I said force YOUR didn't mean you, sorry for the misunderstanding
 it
  is my bad.
 
  Brgds...Alaa
 
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 Arturo Buanzo Busleiman
 Independent Linux and Security Consultant - SANS - OISSG - OWASP
 http://www.buanzo.com.ar/pro/eng.html
 Mailing List Archives at http://archiver.mailfighter.net
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

Should I remind you that the biggest murderers of all times: Stalin, Hitler,
Mao where motivated by non-religious agendas and were Atheists?

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 6:05 PM, Arturo 'Buanzo' Busleiman 
bua...@buanzo.com.ar wrote:

 -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
 Hash: SHA512

 The bloodshed is caused by idiot people, motherfuckers and things like
 that. Stop the damn religion
 of bein g an excuse for your country's desires, ok? Ig god existed, he'd
 probably be thinking about
 nuking the hell out of Earth.

 Alaa Abdelwahab wrote:
  Mikael
 
  This opinion is causing the majority of the bloodshed in the world
 today.
 
  What is causing the bloodshed is the unjust arrangements that are tying
 to
  be forced somewhere, the same like your example after the WW I.
 
 
  The argument can be made that Israel also tried peace, but it was
 responded
  with my bombings etc. Atrocities have been commited by both sides, this
 is
  an never ending argument. Both sides need to decide that they want
 peace,
  make sure they have representatives that also believe in this, and then
  they need to sit down and decide what to do, execute it and at the same
  time curb extremism in their own midst.
 
  What peace they have tried? Did they agree on the tens of UN resolutions:
 
  - Palestinian Refugees have the right to return to their homes in Israel.
  (General Assembly Resolution 194, Dec. 11, 1948 )
  - Israel's occupation of Palestine is Illegal. (Security Council
 Resolution
  242, Nov. 22, 1967 )
  - Israel's settlements in Palestine are Illegal. (Security Council
  Resolution 446, March 22, 1979)
  - Palestinian have the right to Self-Determination. (General Assembly
  Resolution 3236, November 22, 1974)
  - Reaffirmation of a Palestinian State. (Security Council Resolution
 1397,
  March 12, 2002)
  - The 1947 Partition plan of Palestine and the creation of Israel. (UN
  General Assembly Resolution 181)
  - Recommends Israel suspend its no-man's zone' in Jerusalem. (Resolution
  127)
 
  All above UN resolutions and other tens of other resolutions to deplores
 the
  Israeli terror attacks against Lebanon/Jordan/Syria/Palestine/ were
 just
  been ignored by Israel and instead they are just trying to force their
 own
  view of peace, I don't call this peace.
 
  Maybe you have a different definition of the terror acts.
 
  When a man bomb himself and kills tens of civil ppl this is a terror act,
  but also when a powerful country sends its troupes inside another country
  and kills a thousands civil ppl this is a terror act as well.
 
  Don't tell me it is doing that to protect itself.
 
  To protect itself it should respect the UN resolutions. That should only
  bring peace to the whole area and we all live in peace.
 
  What I believe is that the UN should force Israel to respect its
  resolutions, the same way they did in Iraq and Yugoslavia.
 
 
  This is the current situation, it wasn't like this historically. Trying
 to
  argue that one side is evil by looking at latest developments is always
 a
  slippery road. You just before said that there were 5000 rockets
 launched
  in the past 8 years into Israel? Isn't that evil?
  This leads nowhere.
 
  As per the UN resolution which defined Israel as an occupation forces,
  that gives the right to the Palestinian to resist. Any way they see, and
 we
  all should support them.
  And as per the International Humanitarian Law the Geneva Conventions,
 the
  safety and securing a good life for the Palestinian ppl is the
  responsibility of Israel.
 
 
  Force? As opposed to the parties involved here, I am writing/talking,
  instead of promoting bloodshed.
 
 
  When I said force YOUR didn't mean you, sorry for the misunderstanding
 it
  is my bad.
 
  Brgds...Alaa
 
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 - --
 Arturo Buanzo Busleiman
 Independent Linux and Security Consultant - SANS - OISSG - OWASP
 http://www.buanzo.com.ar/pro/eng.html
 Mailing List Archives at http://archiver.mailfighter.net
 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
 Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux)
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 iD8DBQFJYN47AlpOsGhXcE0RCjRSAJ9uBp/St53ks+lIc2BJcZgS4EJP2ACfUxXS
 yGSd0ghuLT8+4YvIF8A/vAE=
 =j9Pc
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Re: [Full-disclosure] The (net)war in Palestine

Talking of which... Hamas lately spammed Israelis with SMS's (with broken
funny Hebrew) in their pathetic attempt at scaring Israelis - was the joke
of the day for a while.

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 6:27 PM, Fabio Pietrosanti (naif)
li...@infosecurity.ch wrote:

 Arturo 'Buanzo' Busleiman wrote:
  Yeah, take all these crap out of a full-disclousure, IT security
  mailing list, please...
 To keep the discussion on topic, what do you think about the israel
 ability to professionaly arrange national-wide SMS spamming to border
 countries?


 http://fergdawg.blogspot.com/2008/12/israeli-telephone-commandos-strike.html

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

You have the wrong idea that I am trying to agree with you on something.

Let me break it to you - I am not.

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 6:56 PM, Alaa Abdelwahab alaa.abdelwa...@free.frwrote:

  Avraham,



 Be careful of what you wish for.

 You see, we have agreed on something finally J

 Brgds…Alaa

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Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine

On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 2:30 PM, Prototype This termin...@gmail.com wrote:
 Most palestinians are born in Palestine and have their ancestors from there.
prove it.

 While 99% of israelis, come from countries such as Ukraine , Russia ,
 Morocco, Germany..
So what makes them Israeli in the first place? Oh... their ancestors
where Jews from the land of guess what... 'Israel'.

 That dont give them the right to claim anything in Palestine land.
I think I proved you wrong.

 They want war so now they die all. Israelis are suicidal people , they
 set fire in themself and wonder later why they are burning.
Palestinian terrorists are suicidal (hint: suicide bombers, shooting
handmade rockets on a country with the strongest military in the
region that defeated all Arab armies times again, etc...) - but don't
let the facts confuse you.




 2009/1/4  valdis.kletni...@vt.edu:
 On Sun, 04 Jan 2009 10:44:57 GMT, Mainbox Notif said:

 In History there where made some appointments which part belongs to the
 Israeli and which to the Palestinian.
 But it seems that the Israeli want more. Thats are not very thankful, he?
 Please stay between your own borders!

 The basic problem is that your own borders is a fuzzy concept, and 
 conflicts
 start because two countries claim the same physical territory is inside
 their own borders.

 In this case, if somebody was actually able to draw a line and everybody
 agreed everything this side of the line is Israeli, everything on that side
 is Palestinian, there would be no problem.  However, nobody has been able
 to find where to draw that line.

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 ___
 Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
 Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
 Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/


___
Full-Disclosure - We believe in it.
Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html
Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/

Re: [Full-disclosure] The war in Palestine