Re: [gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
Stroller schreef: On 26 Dec 2005, at 20:27, Neil Bothwick wrote: On Mon, 26 Dec 2005 20:46:55 +0100, Peper wrote: Yes, I do know that and that's why i proposed a new solution for this - emerge would handle showing license and user will accept or decline it. If user accepts fetching starts... Which would almost certainly break Sun's licence, they want to see you agree to the licence. The best emerge could do would be to load the relevant page in your browser, where you could jump through whatever hoops the licence requires. I thought emerge did something like this for some of the games packages... I thought it displayed the whole text of the license and requires the reader to accept before continuing. Yes, it does; but those I have encountered (Quake 4, for example) require you to have already bought the game to even install it (insofar as you're unlikely to install a game you can't run, because the game data files must be transferred from the CD, and the serial number from the game box must be entered before you can play). Since you have already bought the game the license is displayed via the install script, just as it would be displayed by the Windows installer before installation proceeded. But afaik, the displayed license is a part of the install script (which in the case of Quake 4, is provided by id, not by gentoo), not a part of emerge /per se/. The same thing happens, iirc, with the Flash installer, which is why you have to install it via the command line when installing manually or under another distro-- the developer-provided install script (which is what's contained in the *.rpm, basically an rpm install just unpacks the script then runs it) requires that the license be accepted before the script will proceed with the install, and if for whatever reason you're not installing from the command line (for example, SuSE users using the YAST/Konqueror integration and clicking the install with YAST button with the *.rpm selected in a Konq window) the app will not install, because you cannot accept the licence (because you can't see it, not having a term window open), and therefore the install script does not run. But as Neil said, this is not the same situation as with Sun and IBM (or Transgaming), who require you to specifically, personally, authenticate yourself *to /their/ servers* prior to downloading the binary /from/ their servers. Which emerge cannot do (authenticate each individual user to the relevant server and then download the binary on the basis of that authentication). Holly -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
You see that little f there next to the ebuild? It has a fetch restriction. If you look a little ways up it will give you the URL to go to to accept the license and download it. After you download the java thing, move it to /usr/portage/distfiles/ then emerge it. I do this all the time and it is a PITA. I wish some other java would work as good so I didn't have to put up with the manual crap. It's all about reading software license, which noone reads anyway :] Oh, as far as I know, this is the only program that has this restriction. I haven't seen any other at least. If you use http-replicator and run repcacheman, it won't even download it from the cache. It's there but you have to get it manually. Sucks huh? Sun did it, not Gentoo. ibm java packages have the same restriction or even worse beacause you must register to dowload the packages. And there are also some packages like cedega, which you must even dowload by torrent :P -- Best Regards Peper -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
Peper wrote: You see that little f there next to the ebuild? It has a fetch restriction. If you look a little ways up it will give you the URL to go to to accept the license and download it. After you download the java thing, move it to /usr/portage/distfiles/ then emerge it. I do this all the time and it is a PITA. I wish some other java would work as good so I didn't have to put up with the manual crap. It's all about reading software license, which noone reads anyway :] I didn't read it on their site either. I don't see what difference it makes really. Oh, as far as I know, this is the only program that has this restriction. I haven't seen any other at least. If you use http-replicator and run repcacheman, it won't even download it from the cache. It's there but you have to get it manually. Sucks huh? Sun did it, not Gentoo. ibm java packages have the same restriction or even worse beacause you must register to dowload the packages. And there are also some packages like cedega, which you must even dowload by torrent :P Glad I don't know what cedega is. I have heard of toorent before though. Dale :-) -- To err is human, I'm most certainly human. I have four rigs: 1: Home built; Abit NF7 ver 2.0 w/ AMD 2500+ CPU, 1GB of ram and right now two 80GB hard drives. Named Smoker 2: Home built; Iwill KK266-R w/ AMD 1GHz CPU, 256MBs of ram and a 4GB drive. Named Swifty 3: Home built; Gigabyte GA-71XE4 w/ 800MHz CPU, 224MBs of ram and a 2.5GB drive. Named Pokey 4: Compaq Proliant 6000 Server w/ Quad 200MHz CPUs, 128MBs of ram and a 4.3GB SCSI drive. Named Putput All run Gentoo Linux, all run folding. #1 is my desktop, 2, 3, and 4 are set up as servers. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
On Mon, 26 Dec 2005 05:41:10 -0600, Dale wrote: It's all about reading software license, which noone reads anyway :] I didn't read it on their site either. I don't see what difference it makes really. The difference is that you acknowledged that you had read it, even if you didn't. That's a world away from Gentoo completely bypassing the step where you are supposed to read the licence, and breaking the licence themselves by mirroring the file. -- Neil Bothwick I am NOT Paranoid! And why are you always watching me?? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
Peper schreef: And there are also some packages like cedega, which you must even dowload by torrent :P After you have subscribed (which is the real reason for the fetch restriction)? It's only a 10MB rpm/deb/tgz, why would you have to download it by torrent? In that particular case, Cedega is a commercial application, and only subscribers (paying customers) may access the download link. Therefore you are required to manually download the binary to /usr/portage/distfiles, where Gentoo can then install it. It's really just a super-set of the same issue, you have to in some way authenticate yourself before you may have the program; in sun and ibm's case, that authentication involves accepting the license, in the case of Transgaming, it involves paying money to subscribe. But it's the same thing; the developer wants to know/specify who has access to their work, and they enforce that. Gentoo respects that enforcement. Holly -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
And there are also some packages like cedega, which you must even dowload by torrent :P After you have subscribed (which is the real reason for the fetch restriction)? It's only a 10MB rpm/deb/tgz, why would you have to download it by torrent? In that particular case, Cedega is a commercial application, and only subscribers (paying customers) may access the download link. Therefore you are required to manually download the binary to /usr/portage/distfiles, where Gentoo can then install it. It's really just a super-set of the same issue, you have to in some way authenticate yourself before you may have the program; in sun and ibm's case, that authentication involves accepting the license, in the case of Transgaming, it involves paying money to subscribe. But it's the same thing; the developer wants to know/specify who has access to their work, and they enforce that. Gentoo respects that enforcement. Yeah i know that. It was rather a joke about how 'hard' is to install apps in gentoo :] And torrent part was about how 'hard' is to install cedega without subscription :] While writing this i thought about smth: cannot displaying licenses be implemented in emerge? If you want to progress(fetch the file) you must accept displayed license. Maybe sun will be happy with that... -- Best Regards, Peper -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
On Mon, 26 Dec 2005 15:48:25 +0100 Peper [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While writing this i thought about smth: cannot displaying licenses be implemented in emerge? If you want to progress(fetch the file) you must accept displayed license. Maybe sun will be happy with that... Licenses are displayed for those that have CDs - like UT2004. The license comes up during the install and must be accepted or not (and the install exits). But Sun requires a person to accept the license before the download can occur. Click on the SDK and it takes you to a separate page with a long legal license with an accept or decline. Then it triggers the download. Sun's website handles all that, not the target system. Bob - -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
Click on the SDK and it takes you to a separate page with a long legal license with an accept or decline. Then it triggers the download. Sun's website handles all that, not the target system. Yes, I do know that and that's why i proposed a new solution for this - emerge would handle showing license and user will accept or decline it. If user accepts fetching starts... -- Best Regards, Peper -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
On Mon, 26 Dec 2005 20:46:55 +0100, Peper wrote: Yes, I do know that and that's why i proposed a new solution for this - emerge would handle showing license and user will accept or decline it. If user accepts fetching starts... Which would almost certainly break Sun's licence, they want to see you agree to the licence. The best emerge could do would be to load the relevant page in your browser, where you could jump through whatever hoops the licence requires. -- Neil Bothwick Hi, I'm not a signature virus. Why don't you just copy me into your signature? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: ebuild for dev-java/sun-j2sdk?
On 26 Dec 2005, at 20:27, Neil Bothwick wrote: On Mon, 26 Dec 2005 20:46:55 +0100, Peper wrote: Yes, I do know that and that's why i proposed a new solution for this - emerge would handle showing license and user will accept or decline it. If user accepts fetching starts... Which would almost certainly break Sun's licence, they want to see you agree to the licence. The best emerge could do would be to load the relevant page in your browser, where you could jump through whatever hoops the licence requires. I thought emerge did something like this for some of the games packages... I thought it displayed the whole text of the license and requires the reader to accept before continuing. Stroller. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
