Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On 31/12/17 10:34, Neil Bothwick wrote: > On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 02:26:26 +, Peter Humphrey wrote: > >>> Actually it was the New York World. So actually imho it was originally >>> perfectly legit. >> >> I don't agree. In that case it should have been called the New York >> World Series. > > If they were paying for it, they could call it what they wanted. I assume > the paper was generally known as "The World" otherwise it would have been > a waste of marketing money. > > Actually, I believe it WAS originally known as The New York World Series. Then presumably some marketeer decided that was too much of a mouthful, and dropped the "New York" rather than "World" :-( Cheers, Wol
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 02:26:26 +, Peter Humphrey wrote: > > Actually it was the New York World. So actually imho it was originally > > perfectly legit. > > I don't agree. In that case it should have been called the New York > World Series. If they were paying for it, they could call it what they wanted. I assume the paper was generally known as "The World" otherwise it would have been a waste of marketing money. -- Neil Bothwick Few women admit their age. Few men act theirs. pgpgMY5W8yrN6.pgp Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On Saturday, 30 December 2017 14:32:32 GMT Wols Lists wrote: > On 30/12/17 12:55, Alan McKinnon wrote: > > [2nd random OT factoid] > > It's the "world series" because the first sponsor was a newspaper "News > > of the World" iirc (plus some typical US bravado) > > Actually it was the New York World. So actually imho it was originally > perfectly legit. I don't agree. In that case it should have been called the New York World Series. > As usual, however, things change, meanings change, and now it gives > completely the wrong impression. All true, alas. > [3rd random OT factoid] > The News Of The World was a British tabloid A Sunday "newspaper", popularly known as the Screws of the World - no hardship guessing why. I can't imagine how they managed to sell a single copy. > which shut down after the phone hacking scandal - a lot of their stories > were obtained by hacking into celebrities, politicians, royals voicemails, > and while it was very hard to prove it was also blatantly obvious that > journalists were acting under pressure, if not actual orders, from the > very top. They had it coming, didn't they? -- Regards, Peter.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 14:32:32 +, Wols Lists wrote: > [3rd random OT factoid] > The News Of The World was a British tabloid, which shut down after the > phone hacking scandal - a lot of their stories were obtained by hacking > into celebrities, politicians, royals voicemails, and while it was very > hard to prove it was also blatantly obvious that journalists were acting > under pressure, if not actual orders, from the very top. This had been going on for years, and not just the NotW, but even though the allegations were made no one really cared. Then they were accused of hacking the voicemail of a murdered teenager and suddenly it mattered. Of course, the paper didn't really close down, it was almost immediately relaunched under a different name. -- Neil Bothwick "Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth." (Albert Einstein) pgpU0j8ydkWR_.pgp Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On 30/12/17 12:55, Alan McKinnon wrote: > [2nd random OT factoid] > It's the "world series" because the first sponsor was a newspaper "News > of the World" iirc (plus some typical US bravado) Actually it was the New York World. So actually imho it was originally perfectly legit. As usual, however, things change, meanings change, and now it gives completely the wrong impression. [3rd random OT factoid] The News Of The World was a British tabloid, which shut down after the phone hacking scandal - a lot of their stories were obtained by hacking into celebrities, politicians, royals voicemails, and while it was very hard to prove it was also blatantly obvious that journalists were acting under pressure, if not actual orders, from the very top. Cheers, Wol
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On 30/12/2017 02:44, Peter Humphrey wrote: > On Friday, 29 December 2017 16:45:33 GMT Wols Lists wrote: > >> (Plus, of course, so much development is done for the American market, >> so they don't realise how hard it is to get a change like A4 to stick :-( > > Damned colonials. It's like the baseball "world series": no-one outside > north America plays it [random OT factoid] baseball is hugely popular in Japan. Rugby too :-) [2nd random OT factoid] It's the "world series" because the first sponsor was a newspaper "News of the World" iirc (plus some typical US bravado) -- Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On Friday, 29 December 2017 16:45:33 GMT Wols Lists wrote: > (Plus, of course, so much development is done for the American market, > so they don't realise how hard it is to get a change like A4 to stick :-( Damned colonials. It's like the baseball "world series": no-one outside north America plays it - in fact, in this country it's a girls' school game. No-one outside north America uses letter-size paper either. They're in a small minority. Anyone might think they were the only people on the planet. Sheesh (to coin a phrase). -- Regards, Peter.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On 29/12/17 16:13, Alan McKinnon wrote: > The only "correct" place for papersize nowadays is in whatever the user > is using to get something to print. And there are lots of those. > Something like CUPS ought to make it all so much easier but I find CUPS > just makes my life insanely difficult. So I mail my docs to my wife and > she prints them from Windows for me Exactly! I think the problem is all the layers of indirection and pipes. If you *pipe* a print job, it is very difficult to pass metadata such as papersize along. So the only place the printing back end can get this information from is the defaults. And if you've got something like a photo-printer when half the time the paper is different from the default, you're up a gum tree ... and of course you can't have the app change the defaults because you can't guarantee that by the time that job hits the printer some other app hasn't come along and changed them to something different ... It would be fine, of course, if all apps used the CUPS printer dialog, but my experience is that a lot of cross-platform apps use their own because CUPS isn't there for a lot of their target market ... on Windows they can guarantee the windows dialog, on Apple they can guarantee CUPS, but on linux? It's *usually* - but not always - there so they need to be able to cope if it's missing, so they just assume it isn't ... (Plus, of course, so much development is done for the American market, so they don't realise how hard it is to get a change like A4 to stick :-( Cheers, Wol
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On 29/12/2017 16:30, Peter Humphrey wrote: > On Friday, 29 December 2017 13:57:31 GMT Alan Mackenzie wrote: > >> I think the bug is that "A4" has to be set in so many places, where "so >> many" means more than one. In a well designed printing system, there >> would be just one place to set it. > > And that would have to be /etc/papersize, no? No, not really. IIRC that comes from ages back in time when lpd was all the rage and really refers to the computer *driving* the printer, not the computer *using* the printer Nowadays you can have as many printers as you want (even printers that are not physical objects, like pdf) and each printer can have as many different page sizes as it has trays. The only "correct" place for papersize nowadays is in whatever the user is using to get something to print. And there are lots of those. Something like CUPS ought to make it all so much easier but I find CUPS just makes my life insanely difficult. So I mail my docs to my wife and she prints them from Windows for me > >>> I'm posting this here to save others time, should they come across the >>> same problem. >> >> I've been luckier with printing, but thanks all the same. Who knows >> when I might no longer be so lucky. > > Indeed. > -- Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On Friday, 29 December 2017 14:30:43 GMT Peter Humphrey wrote: > > I think the bug is that "A4" has to be set in so many places, where "so > > many" means more than one. In a well designed printing system, there > > would be just one place to set it. > > And that would have to be /etc/papersize, no? Well, /etc/papersize should be sourced when seeking a default setting, unless $PAPERSIZE, or $PAPERCONF is set. In any case, cups should be able to change the printer's default setting to a different size. Also various applications should be able to select a different size when submitting individual print jobs, or we would have trouble printing labels, envelopes, photographs and what have you. What should not really happen is setting defaults for the OS, the printer and the application and then ALL OF THEM being ignored by Brother's lpdwrapper script. Or am I asking too much by companies who shy away from publishing openprinting code. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On Friday, 29 December 2017 13:57:31 GMT Alan Mackenzie wrote: > I think the bug is that "A4" has to be set in so many places, where "so > many" means more than one. In a well designed printing system, there > would be just one place to set it. And that would have to be /etc/papersize, no? > > I'm posting this here to save others time, should they come across the > > same problem. > > I've been luckier with printing, but thanks all the same. Who knows > when I might no longer be so lucky. Indeed. -- Regards, Peter.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
Hello, Mick. On Fri, Dec 29, 2017 at 13:51:01 +, Mick wrote: > On Thursday, 28 December 2017 06:14:23 GMT taii...@gmx.com wrote: > > For the record I would also like to add that using the duplexer on some > > poorly designed printers cuts off the bottom or top of the page without > > any type of notification. > Debugging cups and trying all conceivable combos of settings didn't get me > anywhere. Then I decided to start looking around the brother driver files > installed under /opt/brother/Printers/hl3140cw/, where I found ./inf/ > brhl3140cwrc and ./inf/brhl3140cwfunc both specifying Letter instead of A4 as > paper size. > So, I've set "PageSize=A4" in brhl3140cwrc and it now prints correctly > aligned > pages once more. > I'm not sure if this is the default path for these files across distros, or > if > some symlink from /usr/libexec/cups/filter/ or /usr/share/cups/model/ is not > working as it should. In any case, the bug seems to be that using the cups > GUI interface doesn't have any effect on the driver configuration files which > are by default set to PageSize=Letter and also messes up the created ppd file > used by cups. I think the bug is that "A4" has to be set in so many places, where "so many" means more than one. In a well designed printing system, there would be just one place to set it. > I'm posting this here to save others time, should they come across the same > problem. I've been luckier with printing, but thanks all the same. Who knows when I might no longer be so lucky. > -- > Regards, > Mick -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
On Thursday, 28 December 2017 06:14:23 GMT taii...@gmx.com wrote: > For the record I would also like to add that using the duplexer on some > poorly designed printers cuts off the bottom or top of the page without > any type of notification. Debugging cups and trying all conceivable combos of settings didn't get me anywhere. Then I decided to start looking around the brother driver files installed under /opt/brother/Printers/hl3140cw/, where I found ./inf/ brhl3140cwrc and ./inf/brhl3140cwfunc both specifying Letter instead of A4 as paper size. So, I've set "PageSize=A4" in brhl3140cwrc and it now prints correctly aligned pages once more. I'm not sure if this is the default path for these files across distros, or if some symlink from /usr/libexec/cups/filter/ or /usr/share/cups/model/ is not working as it should. In any case, the bug seems to be that using the cups GUI interface doesn't have any effect on the driver configuration files which are by default set to PageSize=Letter and also messes up the created ppd file used by cups. I'm posting this here to save others time, should they come across the same problem. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: [was: What can cause printer to crop top of page?] /etc/papersize is ignored
For the record I would also like to add that using the duplexer on some poorly designed printers cuts off the bottom or top of the page without any type of notification.
