Re: UPS electrical problem
The battery actually had a bulge in the case to the point where it cracked -- although it didn't appear to leak anywhere. Must have dried out. New battery through the intertubes for $16 with $12 shipping $40 at Staples. Greg Rundlett ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 06/30/10 09:09, quoth Tom Buskey: There's one called apcups that I've used also. You can run a server on one system with clients that will poll the server for status and shutdown. This is useful with several systems plugged into one UPS or other UPS that don't have monitoring. Here's mine. I get about 3.5 hours in a blackout, and the apcupsd process works very well. http://steveo.syslang.net/cgi-bin2/multimon.cgi Running a UPS without software is sort of as pointless as how long it runs. As far as whether the batteries are any good, that's the easy part. Pull the plug and see how long it lasts - -- Time flies like the wind. Fruit flies like a banana. Stranger things have .0. happened but none stranger than this. Does your driver's license say Organ ..0 Donor?Black holes are where God divided by zero. Listen to me! We are all- 000 individuals! What if this weren't a hypothetical question? steveo at syslang.net -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAkwtFSkACgkQRIVy4fC+NyTCqQCghLSnuoJdN7O3YEfP9XBOSjAS hA8AnjySjF/eiILXOKC8e56WadYUEiZm =mrlC -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
On Thu, Jul 1, 2010 at 6:22 PM, Steven W. Orr ste...@syslang.net wrote: Pull the plug and see how long it lasts It's best not to literally pull the plug out of the receptacle. Doing so disconnects the earth ground. That can cause problems. Some signal links can be perturbed by loss of ground, or change in potential. And if you've got a signal cable connecting you to equipment still grounded, you can get current following *that* path to ground and causing all manner of weird behavior, possibly even damage. Flipping a switch on a power strip, or a circuit breaker, will just disconnect the hot wire, leaving neutral and ground connected. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
Thanks for all the responses. I'm going to both check the status with apcupsd and likely replace the battery. Greg Rundlett ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
On 06/29/2010 09:33 PM, Greg Rundlett (freephile) wrote: I have my Linux Media Center, a Dell Studio Hybrid PC, 2 1TB Fantom external drives and a 25 lcd monitor plugged into an APC Backups Pro 500 UPS on the battery+surge protection side. Within the past week, when the household thermostat kicks on or off the central A/C system, the PC shuts off instantaneously. Other electronics do not seem to be affected, although they probably are. It's just harder to confirm since a flicker in the drive or monitor power would be hard to observe. I assume that a sag or surge gets through the UPS and affects my PC, but don't understand how that can happen when I thought that's what the UPS was supposed to prevent. And, short of replacing the UPS, I'm not sure what to do about it. Is there something I can do to prevent this sag/surge event -- since it's likely to affect something else? On the BLU list we were discussing online backlups, and Jack Coats sent me some email regarding both surge suppressors and UPS systems. Not only can the battery go bad, but the UPS itself can be toast. This is also true for surge suppressors. -- Jerry Feldman g...@blu.org Boston Linux and Unix PGP key id: 537C5846 PGP Key fingerprint: 3D1B 8377 A3C0 A5F2 ECBB CA3B 4607 4319 537C 5846 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 9:33 PM, Greg Rundlett (freephile) g...@freephile.com wrote: Within the past week, when the household thermostat kicks on or off the central A/C system, the PC shuts off instantaneously. What happens if the electrical power supply to the UPS is disconnected? (For example, flip the circuit breaker for the outlet. Don't test a UPS by unplugging it, that cuts the ground which can cause other problems.) Some possible causes, in roughly decreasing order of likelihood: As others have suggested, the battery is the most likely culprit. UPS batteries are generally only good for a few years at best. Heavy battery usage can shorten that further. For example, if your UPS has been kicking on and off battery every time your air conditioner stars or stops... It could be a UPS overload. Overloads usually trigger an alarm or trip a UPS's built-in circuit breaker, but not always. I've seen overloads manifest as the UPS drops the load. Note that a worn-out battery and an overload can have similar symptoms -- dropping a regular load, but a tiny load seems okay. (This is one reason I suggest a clean disconnect test: If the UPS is fine on a clean disconnect, then it's not an overload.) As others have said, it may be a question of the low-voltage threshold being set wrong, or simply not being sensitive enough in the design. Air conditioner causes a voltage sag, UPS thinks everything is okay, but PC disagrees. (Another reason for the clean disconnect test. The UPS can't argue about zero volts.) It's possible for the UPS's power or control electronics to fail. Like anything else. Another possibility is the UPS is allowing power transients through which your load doesn't like. Many UPSes are just a glorified surge suppressor when they're not on battery. When they sense trouble, they switch over. That switch takes time. That's long enough let some kinds of power transients through, which is enough to piss off some loads. Better UPSes include some kind of power conditioning/filtering/regulator/magic to address switching delays and line transients. APC calls their magic line interactive, which I've never seen a convincing technical explanation of. Also, cheaper UPSes will not output a true AC sine wave -- they'll use a square or stepped approximation. Some loads *really* hate that -- AC motors, for example. Computers are almost always okay, though. The best UPSes always run off the battery+inverter, so there's no AC switching or AC transient possible. Names for this include continuous or double conversion or on-line. They are expensive, both up-front and over time. -- Ben ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 10:01 PM, Ben Eisenbraun b...@klatsch.org wrote: Last I looked, APC had Windows/Mac clients for checking/changing their settings, and I think there are some 3rd party linux/UNIX tools that will allow you to do it as well. Network UPS Tools (NUT) is one I have used in the past. -ben There's one called apcups that I've used also. You can run a server on one system with clients that will poll the server for status and shutdown. This is useful with several systems plugged into one UPS or other UPS that don't have monitoring. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
UPS electrical problem
I have my Linux Media Center, a Dell Studio Hybrid PC, 2 1TB Fantom external drives and a 25 lcd monitor plugged into an APC Backups Pro 500 UPS on the battery+surge protection side. Within the past week, when the household thermostat kicks on or off the central A/C system, the PC shuts off instantaneously. Other electronics do not seem to be affected, although they probably are. It's just harder to confirm since a flicker in the drive or monitor power would be hard to observe. I assume that a sag or surge gets through the UPS and affects my PC, but don't understand how that can happen when I thought that's what the UPS was supposed to prevent. And, short of replacing the UPS, I'm not sure what to do about it. Is there something I can do to prevent this sag/surge event -- since it's likely to affect something else? Thanks, Greg Rundlett ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
On 6/29/2010 9:33 PM, Greg Rundlett (freephile) wrote: I have my Linux Media Center, a Dell Studio Hybrid PC, 2 1TB Fantom external drives and a 25 lcd monitor plugged into an APC Backups Pro 500 UPS on the battery+surge protection side. Within the past week, when the household thermostat kicks on or off the central A/C system, the PC shuts off instantaneously. Other electronics do not seem to be affected, although they probably are. It's just harder to confirm since a flicker in the drive or monitor power would be hard to observe. I assume that a sag or surge gets through the UPS and affects my PC, but don't understand how that can happen when I thought that's what the UPS was supposed to prevent. And, short of replacing the UPS, I'm not sure what to do about it. Is there something I can do to prevent this sag/surge event -- since it's likely to affect something else? In my experience, that is usually a sign that the UPS battery is shot. On any power twitch, the UPS switches over to the battery, which has no capacity, and shuts everything off. How old is the UPS' battery? The Backups Pro 500 is a fairly old model, as in Windows 98 era, if I recollect. -- Dan Jenkins, Rastech Inc., Bedford, NH, USA, 1-603-206-9951 *** Technical Support Excellence for four decades. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 09:54:52PM -0400, Dan Jenkins wrote: On 6/29/2010 9:33 PM, Greg Rundlett (freephile) wrote: Within the past week, when the household thermostat kicks on or off the central A/C system, the PC shuts off instantaneously. In my experience, that is usually a sign that the UPS battery is shot. On any power twitch, the UPS switches over to the battery, which has no capacity, and shuts everything off. How old is the UPS' battery? The Backups Pro 500 is a fairly old model, as in Windows 98 era, if I recollect. That would be my guess as well, but the other thing to check is that most of the APC models have user-settable voltage cutover points for over/under current events. It's possible that if the under-voltage setting is too low, then the UPS battery might still be good, and it's just that it's not cutting over soon enough and the PC power supply can't survive the dip, which causes the machine to reboot. Last I looked, APC had Windows/Mac clients for checking/changing their settings, and I think there are some 3rd party linux/UNIX tools that will allow you to do it as well. Network UPS Tools (NUT) is one I have used in the past. -ben -- when i read about the evils of drinking, i gave up reading. henry youngman ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
Re: UPS electrical problem
On 6/29/2010 10:01 PM, Ben Eisenbraun wrote: On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 09:54:52PM -0400, Dan Jenkins wrote: On 6/29/2010 9:33 PM, Greg Rundlett (freephile) wrote: Within the past week, when the household thermostat kicks on or off the central A/C system, the PC shuts off instantaneously. In my experience, that is usually a sign that the UPS battery is shot. On any power twitch, the UPS switches over to the battery, which has no capacity, and shuts everything off. How old is the UPS' battery? The Backups Pro 500 is a fairly old model, as in Windows 98 era, if I recollect. That would be my guess as well, but the other thing to check is that most of the APC models have user-settable voltage cutover points for over/under current events. It's possible that if the under-voltage setting is too low, then the UPS battery might still be good, and it's just that it's not cutting over soon enough and the PC power supply can't survive the dip, which causes the machine to reboot. Last I looked, APC had Windows/Mac clients for checking/changing their settings, and I think there are some 3rd party linux/UNIX tools that will allow you to do it as well. Network UPS Tools (NUT) is one I have used in the past. On some of the older UPS models, there were dip switches on the back for the cutover. That is a good point, if there is enough load and the PC power supply can't handle any dropout. I have an old IBM server which will survive the lights going off on (it doesn't have a UPS). Some of my newer units can't handle even a flicker of the power. Cheaper power supplies. -- Dan Jenkins, Rastech Inc., Bedford, NH, USA, 1-603-206-9951 *** Technical Support Excellence for four decades. ___ gnhlug-discuss mailing list gnhlug-discuss@mail.gnhlug.org http://mail.gnhlug.org/mailman/listinfo/gnhlug-discuss/
