Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
Hi, Am 14.04.2011 21:39, schrieb Michael Riess: what about calling it Kreuztabelle in Ooowiki it is used as synonym http://www.ooowiki.de/PivotTabelle http://www.ooowiki.de/KreuzTabelle Well this would replace one Workaround by another. Not my favourite. i also could imagine to create simply a simple better word e.g. in ORACLE PL/SQL the keyword GROUP BY is used to achive a data aggregation Ouch - Group by is a completely different functionality (Oracle 11g now can also do a PIVOT in SQL - MS SQL Server can do this for about 10 years) André -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
Hi, Am 14.04.2011 22:19, schrieb Andrea Pescetti: Alexander Thurgood wrote: http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=docstate=4009:rmqegm.2.1 PIVOTTABLE is a registered federal US trademark, assigned to Microsoft Corp. And so far we all agree, and this is the premise of the old issue I mentioned: http://openoffice.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=116757 But does this mean that, like Stefan wrote in http://www.mail-archive.com/l10n@libreoffice.org/msg02401.html all possible derivatives including Pivot Table must be avoided? As Stefan wrote, this might be true for several local juristications. (E.G. In Germany you should not use a uppercase magenta T to name your IT-related services, unless you want to be sued by German Telekom. Even using magenta color is a risc.) I understand the point of view of those who believe it's better being safe than sorry, but this change would have some positive effects for users who look for the Pivot Table functionality and fail to recognize that Data Pilot is what they are looking for. Of course they get accustomed, but still this sounds like a ripoff of Pivot Tables... Hmm .. ok, seems there are different opinions in the localization teams. So let's deal each localization team with this. André -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
Hi Em 14-04-2011 10:27, Andre Schnabel escreveu: Hi, in OOo 3.4 Datapilot was renamed to Pivot Table. This change was merged to LibO and is now in localization. While we discussed if we will change the name in GErman translations, Stefan Weigel found something interesting: Von: Stefan Weigelstefan.wei...@bildungskreis.org Es gibt übrigens eine Patentschrift United States Patent Nr. US6,411,313 B1, in der das User-Interface der microsoftschen Pivot-Tabelle als Erfindung geschützt wird. In dieser Schrift heißt es unter anderem wörtlich: PivotTable is a trademark of Microsoft Corporation. http://ip.com/patent/US6411313 (Seite 10, 2. Absatz) Short translation is that there is a patent claim which references to PivotTable as trademark of Microsoft Corporation. Within the last years this was always named as reason why OOo needs to use the term Datapilot - I have no idea if (and how) this situation did change recently. In fact there might be an agreement between Oracle and MS which covers OOo .. but surely not LibO. Any ideas on this? Woah seems we live in a mad, mad world... In Brazil it is known as dynamic table. I wonder one here can trademark such common words. Besides, a quick reading of the link above seems to deal more on the pivot table user interface than on the name... -- Olivier Hallot Founder, Steering Commitee Member - The Document Foundation Voicing the enterprise needs LibreOffice translation leader for Brazilian Portuguese -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
Hi *, On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 3:27 PM, Andre Schnabel andre.schna...@gmx.net wrote: [PivotTable is trademark] http://ip.com/patent/US6411313 (Seite 10, 2. Absatz) trademark status itself: http://tarr.uspto.gov/tarr?regser=serialentry=74472929 ciao Christian -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
Hi Olivier, Am 14.04.2011 15:42, schrieb Olivier Hallot: Besides, a quick reading of the link above seems to deal more on the pivot table user interface than on the name... Sure, but on page 10 it clearly reads: PivotTable (TM) is a trademark of Microsoft Corporation. Meanwhile I also found the USPTO record: http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=docstate=4009:kv5n4s.2.1 Stefan -- LibreOffice - Die Freiheit nehm' ich mir! -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
On 14/04/2011 Andre Schnabel wrote: PivotTable as trademark of Microsoft Corporation. Within the last years this was always named as reason why OOo needs to use the term Datapilot - I have no idea if (and how) this situation did change recently. The text only concerns PivotTable written this way, not the concept of Pivot Tables or their name. I filed this bug back in February http://openoffice.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=116757 and OpenOffice.org should have renamed all instances of PivotTable to Pivot and kept Pivot Table (with space) as replacement of DataPilot. In fact there might be an agreement between Oracle and MS which covers OOo This seems really far-fetched... With the same likelihood, Novell could have negotiated an indemnity for its commercial version of LibreOffice or for all versions. I'm sure it's better to leave our imagination out of the issue, and check the facts in the above issue page; and, if in doubt, indeed act conservatively as you suggest. But to the best of my knowledge, the wording as it is in OpenOffice.org should be OK now. Regards, Andrea. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
Am 14.04.2011 15:49, schrieb Stefan Weigel: Meanwhile I also found the USPTO record: http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=docstate=4009:kv5n4s.2.1 Since, the link above has expired, see here: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/cgi_img_auth.php/a/a5/PivotTableTrademark.pdf Stefan -- LibreOffice - Die Freiheit nehm' ich mir! -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
On Thu, Apr 14, 2011 at 4:11 PM, Stefan Weigel stefan.wei...@bildungskreis.org wrote: Am 14.04.2011 15:49, schrieb Stefan Weigel: Meanwhile I also found the USPTO record: http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=docstate=4009:kv5n4s.2.1 Since, the link above has expired, see here: Just use the link I posted - all infrom available from that one. http://tarr.uspto.gov/tarr?regser=serialentry=74472929 And doesn't consume a slot on their servers that expires ciao Christian -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
Am 14.04.2011 16:45, schrieb Alexander Thurgood: Hi all, Short translation is that there is a patent claim which references to PivotTable as trademark of Microsoft Corporation. Within the last years this was always named as reason why OOo needs to use the term Datapilot - I have no idea if (and how) this situation did change recently. In fact there might be an agreement between Oracle and MS which covers OOo .. but surely not LibO. Any ideas on this? Well, the people at Sun were right. http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=docstate=4009:rmqegm.2.1 PIVOTTABLE is a registered federal US trademark, assigned to Microsoft Corp. It is also registered at least in France. At the European Community Trademark Office : http://esearch.oami.europa.eu/copla/trademark/data/000943019 and no doubt elsewhere in the world. what about calling it Kreuztabelle in Ooowiki it is used as synonym http://www.ooowiki.de/PivotTabelle http://www.ooowiki.de/KreuzTabelle i also could imagine to create simply a simple better word e.g. in ORACLE PL/SQL the keyword GROUP BY is used to achive a data aggregation even in MS Excel most people dont like Pivot Tables cause Pivot sounds complicated so lets call it Mapping, Datamining, grouping, dynamic linking, data relation mining, data relation grouping something understandable with positiv vibrations ;-) -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Rename datapilot to Pivot Table?
I guess Oracle OOo dev team was not aware of it or forgot about it (or many people do not work there anymore). What now? I doubt it is a problem in translations. I guess only in English it has to be changed to something else. I doubte M$ copyrighted this word in translated form in all other countries of the world. Lp, m. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to l10n+h...@libreoffice.org Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
