Re: [Leaf-devel] Evolution as a project development model
Mike, Thank-you for the excellent reply and insight that explains much of the depth, experience, and respect that is rightfully deserved and displayed in this project :-) On Friday 01 March 2002 11:37, Mike Noyes wrote: At 2002-02-28 10:51 -0600, guitarlynn wrote: Gnome and KDE are single platforms that developers can write to. They use a monolithic development model for the base. Their base is then used as a resource to build things. Are different Gnome/KDE bases available to choose from? If not, they don't correlate well to our project. Yes, very observant, we all have our baseline to work from. I think all of our releases are showing that the baseline is not only being challenged now, but being lowered when compared to the limitations of the past. The only thing monolithic is the package repositories I can wait on seeing kde30.lrp for a while though :) snip of completely true statements that leave nothing to be said The acknowledgement and existance of LEAF affiliates assumes the position that you seem most concerned with, and the only seperation between release and affiliate here appears to be the opinion and process of the individual lead developer. Correct to some extent. However, most of our affiliates crate components (specifically firewalls) that our developers make use of when creating releases/branches. This means we don't have to create something from scratch, and allows for a faster development cycle. It also provides a synergy between the affiliated projects that is beneficial to both. It also benefits in vastness of scope that is unmatched in any other project or release/version/distro that I am aware of. Many others are very good products, but very limited in what you can do with them when compared. This is an extreme benefit to the project and releases. There are a couple of other levels of involvement. Pim van Riezen [1] decided not to join or affiliate with us, but he does participate on the mailing lists. Ken Frazier [2] decided he didn't want anything to do with us. That is disappointing to hear. I'm am in the process of attempting to use cish for some simulation in Cisco (hopefully). This shell could really add a compatibility layer to the project. I hope he wouldn't object to his shell being used with LEAF. David D has it packaged. If I remember right, Ken worked with Coyote for some time, his insight and different point of view would have also been nice! This sounds like healthy evolution to me. :-) You forgot one important thing that will prevent infinite release/branch creation. There are limited resources (developers/users) in our environment (LEAF). Mind share will prune the week eventually. Developer(s) will only work on a release/branch as long as they receive recognition of their effort. I see this every day on the SF support lists. Abandonment of unused projects is common. That is one reason I make an honest effort to try many different releases/products. Many of them fit a certain niche better than others. The sad part is that some of the more cutting-edge versions do not necessarily fit the most used niche, and end up not being used as often. This would be a good point to thank all the developers for their hard work and excellent products that I am happy to say are at the top of their niche's in respect to quality. snip of more sound reasoning 1. Use of evolution as a development model. 2. Tolerance for new ideas and differing opinions. 3. Full control by lead developers of release/branch direction and purpose. It appears to have promoted many excellent products and a very healthy, stable development community. As Charles admonished me earlier, I now do for you. Thank-you, Mike ;) All of our opinions/ideas matter. Whether you're a lead developer or project admin has nothing to do with the validity of your opinion/idea. Absolutely, however the effect of a project leader or lead developer having an issue would create far more effects to the community than myself. This does not mean that my opinion does not matter or should not be effective, but rather the people that primarily have made the larger contributions to the project should get the respect that they deserve for the time and effort that has made this possible. I intend this with exhaultion to these people, rather than any lack of self-esteem on my part or source of degrading demeanor towards anyone else. BTW, this reply took me almost two hours. Your post was very thought provoking. Thanks. :-) The reply was worth every minute you put into it, IMHO. Thank-you for extending your thoughts :-) -- ~Lynn Avants aka Guitarlynn guitarlynn at users.sourceforge.net http://leaf.sourceforge.net If linux isn't the answer, you've probably got the wrong question! ___ Leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [Leaf-devel] A few sshd and tinydns issues for JN
Sorry, the following post was sent to the leaf-user list instead of the leaf-devel list. Hi Matt I just got your mail today. I have been out of town for a week. I understand from what you say that the sshd/dnscache/tinydns documentation needs some clarification. Indeed if you have tinydns running you should not need to adjust /etc/hosts. If you could suggest direct changes to the documentation I'll happily include them. Writing doc takes time especially when you are not an English/US native. But I also think documentation is a real necessity that is why I have always tried to release one with my packages. Jacques ___ Leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [Leaf-devel] q regarding an ftp site for leaf-project.org
On Thursday 28 February 2002 21:26, David Douthitt wrote: On 2/28/02 at 1:52 AM, guitarlynn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PicoBSD might as well not even exist anymore. I HAD to reply to this :-) Hehe, I figured this might peek some interest ;-) PicoBSD is now an official part of the FreeBSD distribution, and is included in the source tree. The web pages haven't been updated in a LONG time. There also are very few, if any, floppy disk images to download. The expected thing to do is download the FreeBSD sources. However, there ARE the older PicoBSD images, plus at least two floppy images that I've found based on PicoBSD. One is a cluster director - that is, it handles the initial requests to a cluster and doles out the traffic to the appropriate web server or whatever. So they are still developing PicoBSD, but simply not posting any updates even in the way of information to the project page??? I knew it had been included in FreeBSD, but I haven't loaded a late version. I have used OpenBSD and been happy with it, so maybe I should take a go at a later version of FreeBSD. I just figured they would keep a current changelog or something to that effect on their homepage. :-(. Solaris sucks on an i86, but rules on a Sparc. I heard that 2.6 was alright, but 7 and 8 are slow because they expect SMP. I can verify that 7 and 8 run very slow on i86! At the time it came out, there was very limited NIC drivers too. It is a great version to learn Solaris on in any respect and definately worth the experience, but not for a production machine. On a different note, have anyone come across a open source RIP simulator??? -- ~Lynn Avants aka Guitarlynn guitarlynn at users.sourceforge.net http://leaf.sourceforge.net If linux isn't the answer, you've probably got the wrong question! ___ Leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [Leaf-devel] q regarding an ftp site for leaf-project.org
On 3/2/02 at 4:30 PM, guitarlynn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So they are still developing PicoBSD, but simply not posting any updates even in the way of information to the project page??? Apparently so. I knew it had been included in FreeBSD, but I haven't loaded a late version. I have used OpenBSD and been happy with it, so maybe I should take a go at a later version of FreeBSD. I just figured they would keep a current changelog or something to that effect on their homepage. :-(. I've used (somewhat) OpenBSD/mac68k - but since I've only got one keybd and one monitor I run MacOS System 8.1 most of the time... I wonder if the Quadras will work headless? I can verify that [Solaris] 7 and 8 run very slow on i86! At the time it came out, there was very limited NIC drivers too. It is a great version to learn Solaris on in any respect and definately worth the experience, but not for a production machine. I just received Solaris 8 for Intel a few days ago - the requirements are a little more strenuous than Linux (always are, I guess) and were more so than 2.6. 1G of disk?? ...hmmm ___ Leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
RE: [Leaf-devel] q regarding an ftp site for leaf-project.org
Lynn, I am not sure what you mean by RIP simulator but there is some great work being done with the GNU/Zebra dynamic routing protocol suite. You can reach them at... www.zebra.org ... also, David has already built a package from the zebra 0.92a release. Regards, -Eric -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of guitarlynn Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2002 5:30 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Leaf-devel] q regarding an ftp site for leaf-project.org On Thursday 28 February 2002 21:26, David Douthitt wrote: On 2/28/02 at 1:52 AM, guitarlynn [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PicoBSD might as well not even exist anymore. I HAD to reply to this :-) Hehe, I figured this might peek some interest ;-) PicoBSD is now an official part of the FreeBSD distribution, and is included in the source tree. The web pages haven't been updated in a LONG time. There also are very few, if any, floppy disk images to download. The expected thing to do is download the FreeBSD sources. However, there ARE the older PicoBSD images, plus at least two floppy images that I've found based on PicoBSD. One is a cluster director - that is, it handles the initial requests to a cluster and doles out the traffic to the appropriate web server or whatever. So they are still developing PicoBSD, but simply not posting any updates even in the way of information to the project page??? I knew it had been included in FreeBSD, but I haven't loaded a late version. I have used OpenBSD and been happy with it, so maybe I should take a go at a later version of FreeBSD. I just figured they would keep a current changelog or something to that effect on their homepage. :-(. Solaris sucks on an i86, but rules on a Sparc. I heard that 2.6 was alright, but 7 and 8 are slow because they expect SMP. I can verify that 7 and 8 run very slow on i86! At the time it came out, there was very limited NIC drivers too. It is a great version to learn Solaris on in any respect and definately worth the experience, but not for a production machine. On a different note, have anyone come across a open source RIP simulator??? -- ~Lynn Avants aka Guitarlynn guitarlynn at users.sourceforge.net http://leaf.sourceforge.net If linux isn't the answer, you've probably got the wrong question! ___ Leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel ___ Leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
Re: [Leaf-devel] Site Update (2002-02-27)
Hey, I just cleaned out my directory, saving 8M. Everything I do is now primarily on my site, secondarily in CVS. On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, Mike Noyes wrote: Everyone, I had hoped for some additional time, before we needed to address this issue, but the situation has changed. We are once again over our quota on the shell server (ref. forward from Jacob Moorman at the bottom of this message). I'm proposing the following changes to our Individual Developer Content FAQ to correct the problem. The new system I envision is this: developers commit alpha/beta content to their personal devel tree in cvs. Once it's ready for release, they commit it to the bin tree in cvs. The bin tree will have directories for each release, and packages. The bin/release trees will be controlled by the release lead developer. I'm still trying to figure out if we require kernel and image trees. Certain trees in our cvs repository will be exported daily to our pub directory on the shell server. I know I want the doc and bin/packages tree to export, but I don't think it's a good idea to export the bin/releases to the shell server. Instead, I want us to release them in the files area when they are updated. Also, note files that are 10MB should not reside on the shell server. I would greatly appreciate it if everyone started moving their files into their personal tree in cvs ASAP. Thanks. http://cvs.sourceforge.net/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/leaf/devel/ If you have questions about cvs usage/setup, please post them to the list. I'm sure the answers will help many of us. Suggestions and comments on the proposed change are welcome. snip -- Jack Coates Monkeynoodle: A Scientific Venture... ___ Leaf-devel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/leaf-devel
