Re: untangling the remaining regressions

2013-08-14 Thread Keith OHara
David Kastrup dak at gnu.org writes:

  (1) The positioning of fingerings using the outline of the note-column
  (the last patch under issue 2527) is a user-visible improvement, so it
  would be nice to keep it.  I have posted patches to solve two issued
  (3465 and 3363) were caused by the fingering patch, so maybe we can go
  forward.
 
 I've tried a revert recently, and the number and nature of revert
 conflicts, probably partly because of related followup fixes, was rather
 ugly.  This is entangled rather badly in our code history.  

Presumably you first reverted the follow-up patches, for issues 3327 
3242 and 3109.  If it is that complicated to retreat, it seems wiser
to fix the remaining bugs and go forward.


  The fingering patch might also have made issue 601 worse, 

It did so.  I have separated the new part of the bug into issue 3497.

  and possibly re-broken issue 40. 

No, that was the patch to tighten accidental placement, issue 2811.
Studying the original fix for issue 40 and the patch for 2811, might
make the proper solution clear.


  (2) The expanded use of unpure-pure containers (issue 3199) is a
  reorganization of the code.  Overall, I think the patch makes things
  simpler, conceptually.
 
 The problem is that the patch in question does dozens of different
 things in a single commit, a number of which are not even related to the
 issue.

Oh.  Well if the regressions were caused by any of the unrelated things
we can just reverse that part of the patch.

We do have a patch posted under issue 3385 that reverts 3199 entirely,
with a clean `make check`.

  I think the remaining problems that it caused (issue 3385, issue 3359
  and blocking the patch for issue 3363) come from its removal of the
  test 'pure-relevant?', which ignored some objects for purposes of
  estimating the heights of staves for the planning of
  line/page-breaking (i.e., the pure-heights of VerticalAxisGroups).
 
 But they should have been replaced by pure-unpure-containers.  

Well, the function-pairs that calculate/estimate the heights or 
positions of these object have been linked together into 
pure-unpure-containers.
Formerly, only objects with an explicit 'pure' (estimating) function
were considered 'pure-relevant' but in the new design everything is
pure-relevant.

Mike posted three patches to issue 3385 that attempted to go halfway
backwards, partially restoring the pure-relevant? test, but these
ran into regressions.

Going forward would be to make the pure versions of these functions, 
actually work properly before line-breaking, without triggering other
calculations prematurely (i.e., make them acually 'pure').
That approach looks like it might do some untangling, by solving
issued 3385 and 3363 together.

The remaining regression would be the erroneous cross-staff tie, 
issue 3395, which has always been an error but now crashes LilyPond.
For that, we should ensure in the code that the pure-Y-common (a.k.a.
common_refpoint_of array) of a set of objects used to find the height
of a staff, is the staff in question, because other code assert()s that
condition.


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Re: untangling the remaining regressions

2013-08-14 Thread Mike Solomon
On 14 août 2013, at 09:58, Keith OHara k-ohara5...@oco.net wrote:

 
 
 Mike posted three patches to issue 3385 that attempted to go halfway
 backwards, partially restoring the pure-relevant? test, but these
 ran into regressions.
 
 Going forward would be to make the pure versions of these functions, 
 actually work properly before line-breaking, without triggering other
 calculations prematurely (i.e., make them acually 'pure').

I think my most recent patch set for 3385 does this.

Cheers,
MS
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PATCHES: Countdown for August 17th - 06:00 GMT

2013-08-14 Thread James
Hello

*Countdown – August 17th – 06:00 GMT* *
* *
* *
* *
*




 
3487http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3487q=label%3APatch-countdownsort=patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Summary%20Modified
Enhancement
David Kastrup push Patch: Make several special characters with or without
backslash non-special




 
3468http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3468q=label%3APatch-reviewsort=modified%20patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Needs%20Summary%20Modified
Other
David Kastrup Countdown lilypond-book and spaces in application name
3493http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3493q=label%3APatch-reviewsort=modified%20patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Needs%20Summary%20Modified
Enhancement
David Kastrup Countdown Patch: Let Skyline's copy constructor use
whole-sale copy construction of members
3408http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3408q=label%3APatch-reviewsort=modified%20patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Needs%20Summary%20Modified
Documentation
Phil Holmes Countdown Doc suggestion: include final double bar in some
Learning Manual examples
3494http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3494q=label%3APatch-reviewsort=modified%20patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Needs%20Summary%20Modified
Enhancement
Julien Rioux Countdown Patch: make website fails on platforms where python3
is the default.
3214http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3214q=label%3APatch-reviewsort=modified%20patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Needs%20Summary%20Modified
Ugly
Phil Holmes Countdown Insufficient spacing between footnote block and
tagline  
3465http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3465q=label%3APatch-reviewsort=modified%20patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Needs%20Summary%20Modified
Critical
Keith Ohara Countdown Pitched trill layout   Regression









 *Moved to 'Needs Work' this countdown*



 
3491http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3491q=label%3APatch-reviewsort=modified%20patchcolspec=ID%20Type%20Status%20Stars%20Owner%20Patch%20Needs%20Summary%20Modified
Enhancement
Mark Polesky Needs Work Add \displayMarkup command.

James
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Re: PATCHES: Countdown for August 17th - 06:00 GMT

2013-08-14 Thread Mark Polesky
James wrote:

Moved to 'Needs Work' this countdown 
3491 Enhancement  Mark Polesky Needs Work Add \displayMarkup command.  

...
Thomasmorely651 has some comments
James,

can you move my patch into the countdown for the 17th?
I incorporated Harm's suggestions a day ago.

Thanks,
Mark


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Re: PATCHES: Countdown for August 17th - 06:00 GMT

2013-08-14 Thread James
Mark,


On 14 August 2013 08:43, Mark Polesky markpole...@yahoo.com wrote:

 James wrote:

 Moved to 'Needs Work' this countdown
 3491 Enhancement  Mark Polesky Needs Work Add \displayMarkup command.

 ...
 Thomasmorely651 has some comments
 James,

 can you move my patch into the countdown for the 17th?
 I incorporated Harm's suggestions a day ago.

 Thanks,
 Mark


I can, but just so you know, I'm not the final say on this :) so  you can
just do this yourself as well.

That is if a 'real developer' sees that I have made a mistake or
misinterpreted something in the tracker or Rietveld (especially when
conversation between devs gets a bit convoluted) then by all means correct
my mistake - David et al, do this all the time.

Regards

James
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Re: PATCHES: Countdown for August 17th - 06:00 GMT

2013-08-14 Thread David Kastrup
James pkx1...@gmail.com writes:

 That is if a 'real developer' sees that I have made a mistake or
 misinterpreted something in the tracker or Rietveld (especially when
 conversation between devs gets a bit convoluted) then by all means
 correct my mistake - David et al, do this all the time.

Well, it seems like I am a stickler for authority: when I bypass
procedures then rarely by overriding a decision of yours but rather by
not giving you a chance to make one...

Partly that's just because potential reviewers also rely on your
decisions, so if you put back a patch from countdown or don't even place
it on one, people might just have postponed taking a look.  So I tend to
be rather careful about overriding review-focused decisions without a
good reason.  While I am rather reckless once I decide that a given
patch is not material asking for a second opinion _and_ has some
urgency.

So with non-urgent review-worthy patches that have been taken off from
countdown or review by clerical mistake, I often grit my teeth and
reenter the cycle, usually with a verbose explanation in order to avoid
cycling another time for the same reason.  It's not like it's causing
major damage or something.

-- 
David Kastrup


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Re: Make several special characters with or without backslash non-special (issue 12432043)

2013-08-14 Thread janek . lilypond

Hi,

i'm late with my comments but i'll publish them anyway.

A general question: what about using -' or -, for staccatissimo?  For me
they seem to be somewhat more intuitive.

Janek


https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/diff/23001/lily/parser.yy
File lily/parser.yy (right):

https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/diff/23001/lily/parser.yy#newcode2719
lily/parser.yy:2719: $$ = scm_from_locale_string (Bang);
Why is this Bang and not Exclaim?

https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/diff/23001/ly/script-init.ly
File ly/script-init.ly (right):

https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/diff/23001/ly/script-init.ly#newcode9
ly/script-init.ly:9: dashBang = staccatissimo
ditto

https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/

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Re: Make several special characters with or without backslash non-special (issue 12432043)

2013-08-14 Thread janek . lilypond

On 2013/08/14 11:41:43, janek wrote:

A general question: what about using -' or -, for staccatissimo?  For

me they

seem to be somewhat more intuitive.


Additional advantage would be that they don't require Shift to produce
on standard keyboard.

Janek

https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/

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Re: Adds bar line section to LM (Issue 3408) (issue 12724043)

2013-08-14 Thread janek . lilypond

The content LGTM.

https://codereview.appspot.com/12724043/

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make website fails on platforms where python3 is the default. (issue 12769043)

2013-08-14 Thread janek . lilypond

LGTM

https://codereview.appspot.com/12769043/

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Re: Increase tagline spacing (Issue 3214) (issue 12562050)

2013-08-14 Thread janek . lilypond

LGTM

https://codereview.appspot.com/12562050/

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trill-pitch-engraver: acknowledge stems and flags; issue 3465 (issue 12844043)

2013-08-14 Thread janek . lilypond

LGTM.

https://codereview.appspot.com/12844043/

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Re: Make several special characters with or without backslash non-special (issue 12432043)

2013-08-14 Thread dak

On 2013/08/14 11:43:08, janek wrote:

On 2013/08/14 11:41:43, janek wrote:
 A general question: what about using -' or -, for staccatissimo?

For me they

 seem to be somewhat more intuitive.



Additional advantage would be that they don't require Shift to produce

on

standard keyboard.



Janek


I don't really agree.  staccato is -. so it seems natural for me to have
staccatissimo as -! (I mean, it was -| before).  In addition, ' and ,
are slanted in most fonts and that does not really match the visuals of
staccatissimo.

I crosschecked with the parser and it would not object to either.  The
only argument _for_ such a change would be more visual similarity rather
than mnemonic value and that rules out -, pretty definitely.  One could
talk about -' at most.  It would be sort of a nuisance to change that
including all documentation again but there would be no technical
problem doing that.

https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/

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Re: trill-pitch-engraver: acknowledge stems and flags; issue 3465 (issue 12844043)

2013-08-14 Thread dak

I'm in a rush right now so can't test.  But would that even help with
whole notes and breves?

https://codereview.appspot.com/12844043/

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Re: How are stems created?

2013-08-14 Thread Janek Warchoł
Hi Phil,

2013/7/30 Phil Holmes em...@philholmes.net:
 I've been experimenting with alternative algorithms to create the flags used
 in mensural notation (see
 http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3105), and part of the
 problem appears to be that the stems aren't attached symmetrically to the
 notehead.  I'm not sure whether this is deliberate or not, but I would like
 to look at it.  Could someone who understands this part of LilyPond explain
 how and where stems are added to noteheads (and, for completeness, flags are
 attached to stems)?

Are you still working on this?  I was looking at this area of the code
with my alignment work
(http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3239 and others,
which are the foundation for actually merging some of my gsoc work).
I would be interested in collaborating on this.

Janek

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Re: Make several special characters with or without backslash non-special (issue 12432043)

2013-08-14 Thread Janek Warchoł
2013/8/14  d...@gnu.org:
 I don't really agree.  staccato is -. so it seems natural for me to have
 staccatissimo as -! (I mean, it was -| before).  In addition, ' and ,
 are slanted in most fonts and that does not really match the visuals of
 staccatissimo.

 I crosschecked with the parser and it would not object to either.  The
 only argument _for_ such a change would be more visual similarity rather
 than mnemonic value and that rules out -, pretty definitely.  One could
 talk about -' at most.  It would be sort of a nuisance to change that
 including all documentation again but there would be no technical
 problem doing that.

Hmm.
would there be a technical problem to have /both/ -! and -' as
shorthands for staccato?

Janek

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Re: trill-pitch-engraver: acknowledge stems and flags; issue 3465 (issue 12844043)

2013-08-14 Thread Janek Warchoł
2013/8/14  d...@gnu.org:
 I'm in a rush right now so can't test.  But would that even help with
 whole notes and breves?

Good point.  But i think that this can be added anyway, as it makes
sense in itself.

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maintaining advanced power-user Scheme functions

2013-08-14 Thread Janek Warchoł
Hi,

Harm and David N. (and some other people) write lots of very advanced
(and very helpful!) Scheme functions.  These funcitons are improved
over time, and there is a problem related to that: it's easy to get
lost in all the email threads about them, and it's not always obvious
where the most recent version is.

I think that such functions should be tracked by version control, and
i see two approaches:
- include them in official LilyPond source as soon as they are
created.  Upside: there's bigger chance that they will be updated when
there are some changes. Downside: one has to write documentation and
go through official patch submitting channels.
- use another repository.  What about OpenLilyLib? http://www.openlilylib.org/

At any rate, we better do something about it - at current state, all
these funcitons can easily become lost or forgotten, and that would be
a grave loss.

Thoughts?

Janek

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colorful make output! yum!

2013-08-14 Thread Janek Warchoł
Hi,

my cousin Franek changed the output of make from a heap of unreadable
gobbledygook to some delicious eye-candy!  Checkout branch
dev/frax/colorful-make and build lilypond.  How do you like it?

As for me, i can spend whole day just looking at lilypond being built.
 I think we should add this to master asap :D (of course, after
polishing some rough edges)

Janek

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Re: Make several special characters with or without backslash non-special (issue 12432043)

2013-08-14 Thread dak

On 2013/08/14 12:18:12, janek wrote:

2013/8/14  d...@gnu.org:



 I crosschecked with the parser and it would not object to either.

The

 only argument _for_ such a change would be more visual similarity

rather

 than mnemonic value and that rules out -, pretty definitely.  One

could

 talk about -' at most.  It would be sort of a nuisance to change

that

 including all documentation again but there would be no technical
 problem doing that.



Hmm.
would there be a technical problem to have /both/ -! and -' as
shorthands for staccato?


Technical?  Not really except that we'd have to make a choice of
convert-ly rule.  But I don't think we help anybody by providing two
shorthands for one particular articulation.  Anybody else with an
opinion regarding -! or -' (and of course the corresponding _! ^! _' ^'
too) as the shorthand for staccatissimo, replacing the previous -|
(which would not work due to technical reasons).

https://codereview.appspot.com/12432043/

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Re: colorful make output! yum!

2013-08-14 Thread David Kastrup
Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com writes:

 Hi,

 my cousin Franek changed the output of make from a heap of unreadable
 gobbledygook to some delicious eye-candy!  Checkout branch
 dev/frax/colorful-make and build lilypond.  How do you like it?

 As for me, i can spend whole day just looking at lilypond being built.
  I think we should add this to master asap :D (of course, after
 polishing some rough edges)

We have enough trouble maintaining our toolchain as it is.

-- 
David Kastrup


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Re: How are stems created?

2013-08-14 Thread Phil Holmes
- Original Message - 
From: Janek Warchol janek.lilyp...@gmail.com

To: Phil Holmes em...@philholmes.net
Cc: Devel lilypond-devel@gnu.org
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 1:09 PM
Subject: Re: How are stems created?



Hi Phil,

2013/7/30 Phil Holmes em...@philholmes.net:
I've been experimenting with alternative algorithms to create the flags 
used

in mensural notation (see
http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3105), and part of the
problem appears to be that the stems aren't attached symmetrically to the
notehead.  I'm not sure whether this is deliberate or not, but I would 
like
to look at it.  Could someone who understands this part of LilyPond 
explain
how and where stems are added to noteheads (and, for completeness, flags 
are

attached to stems)?


Are you still working on this?  I was looking at this area of the code
with my alignment work
(http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3239 and others,
which are the foundation for actually merging some of my gsoc work).
I would be interested in collaborating on this.

Janek



Actively working right now?  No.  Forgotten it?  No.  I can get perfectly 
aligned mensural flags on stems - there was really a bug in the way the old 
ones were reversed.  I need to work on the flags' shape - I have a few scans 
of music from 1500-1600 and the flags and will work on these.


Let me know what you're interested in.

--
Phil Holmes 



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Re: How are stems created?

2013-08-14 Thread Janek Warchoł
Hi Phil,

2013/8/14 Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net:
 - Original Message - From: Janek Warchol
 Are you still working on this?  I was looking at this area of the code
 with my alignment work
 (http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3239 and others,
 which are the foundation for actually merging some of my gsoc work).
 I would be interested in collaborating on this.

 Actively working right now?  No.  Forgotten it?  No.  I can get perfectly
 aligned mensural flags on stems - there was really a bug in the way the old
 ones were reversed.  I need to work on the flags' shape - I have a few scans
 of music from 1500-1600 and the flags and will work on these.

 Let me know what you're interested in.

I'd like to change stem and flag code so that stems, flags and
noteheads are attached to each other using generic functions from
Self_alignment_interface instead of their own funcitons (if that's
possible).

Fiddling with metafont code can be interesting as well.

cheers,
Janek

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Re: How are stems created?

2013-08-14 Thread Phil Holmes
- Original Message - 
From: Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com

To: Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net
Cc: Devel lilypond-devel@gnu.org
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2013 6:20 PM
Subject: Re: How are stems created?



Hi Phil,

2013/8/14 Phil Holmes m...@philholmes.net:

- Original Message - From: Janek Warchol

Are you still working on this?  I was looking at this area of the code
with my alignment work
(http://code.google.com/p/lilypond/issues/detail?id=3239 and others,
which are the foundation for actually merging some of my gsoc work).
I would be interested in collaborating on this.


Actively working right now?  No.  Forgotten it?  No.  I can get perfectly
aligned mensural flags on stems - there was really a bug in the way the 
old
ones were reversed.  I need to work on the flags' shape - I have a few 
scans

of music from 1500-1600 and the flags and will work on these.

Let me know what you're interested in.


I'd like to change stem and flag code so that stems, flags and
noteheads are attached to each other using generic functions from
Self_alignment_interface instead of their own funcitons (if that's
possible).

Fiddling with metafont code can be interesting as well.

cheers,
Janek



I'd concluded that they are attached because they have a common origin, so 
if this is wrong I probably won't be able to help.  Always willing to try, 
though.


--
Phil Holmes 



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Re: colorful make output! yum!

2013-08-14 Thread Jan Nieuwenhuizen
Janek Warchoł writes:

 my cousin Franek changed the output of make from a heap of unreadable
 gobbledygook to some delicious eye-candy!  Checkout branch
 dev/frax/colorful-make and build lilypond.  How do you like it?

The result looks nice but if you want any chance of putting this in, it
should be rewritten as a make post-processor (IMHO of course), think

make | build/aux/colorful.py

Greetings,
Jan

-- 
Jan Nieuwenhuizen jann...@gnu.org | GNU LilyPond http://lilypond.org
Freelance IT http://JoyofSource.com | Avatar®  http://AvatarAcademy.nl  

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Re: PATCHES: Countdown for August 17th - 06:00 GMT

2013-08-14 Thread Mark Polesky
David Kastrup wrote:
 Partly that's just because potential reviewers also rely
 on your decisions, so if you put back a patch from
 countdown or don't even place it on one, people might just
 have postponed taking a look.

With that in mind, developers should be sure to review my
patch, which is now back in the countdown:
http://codereview.appspot.com/12732043/

Thanks.
- Mark

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Re: Issue 3491: Add \displayMarkup command. (issue 12732043)

2013-08-14 Thread thomasmorley65

LGTM

https://codereview.appspot.com/12732043/

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Remove 'thickness from LedgerLineSpanner interface. (issue 12945044)

2013-08-14 Thread tdanielsmusic

LGTM, apart from a query


https://codereview.appspot.com/12945044/diff/1/lily/ledger-line-spanner.cc
File lily/ledger-line-spanner.cc (right):

https://codereview.appspot.com/12945044/diff/1/lily/ledger-line-spanner.cc#newcode331
lily/ledger-line-spanner.cc:331:  property of the
@rinternals{StaffSymbol} grob.,
Should this not be @ref{...}?

https://codereview.appspot.com/12945044/

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Re: maintaining advanced power-user Scheme functions

2013-08-14 Thread Thomas Morley
2013/8/14 Janek Warchoł janek.lilyp...@gmail.com:
 Hi,

 Harm and David N. (and some other people) write lots of very advanced
 (and very helpful!) Scheme functions.  These funcitons are improved
 over time, and there is a problem related to that: it's easy to get
 lost in all the email threads about them, and it's not always obvious
 where the most recent version is.

 I think that such functions should be tracked by version control, and
 i see two approaches:
 - include them in official LilyPond source as soon as they are
 created.  Upside: there's bigger chance that they will be updated when
 there are some changes. Downside: one has to write documentation and
 go through official patch submitting channels.
 - use another repository.  What about OpenLilyLib? http://www.openlilylib.org/

 At any rate, we better do something about it - at current state, all
 these funcitons can easily become lost or forgotten, and that would be
 a grave loss.

 Thoughts?

 Janek

Hi Janek,

well, if I think one of my functions, definitions etc is worth a
patch, I do so, but ofcourse there's the risk I'm distracted by other
tasks and forget about it or I've no time or ...

The idea of version-control for such functions might be nice. But
because I'm still not very familiar with git I'm feeling kind of
ambivalent.
Otoh, it might be an idea to do so for the LSR.

Though, a lot of my functions, definitions etc are too special-cased,
written to fit some users needs or they are workarounds not worth a
patch.
The right place for them would be the LSR, _if_ the LSR would be able
to compile them and not use a LilyPond-version far too old for many of
my ideas.

There were some insinuations on the list the last months (or was it a
year already?) to upgrade the LSR and yes, one should do so.
But I hesitate to volunteer again for this task.
I initiated the last ugrade and did perhaps the major work, supported
by several developers and the great David Nalesnik.
Though there was only one, I repeat _one_, other user who tried to help:
Philippe Hezaine

@Philippe
Thanks a lot for trying to help. And let me say: You didn't waste my time!

So I was annoyed by the lack of help/interest of others and I'm still
pissed off.

After my experience from doing it once, let me say: _Every_ user can
start the LSR-upgrade. The relevant CG-chapter is in far better state
than it was the last time. Ok, there will be snippets which need some
(perhaps advanced) scheme-knowledge and there may be some which need
advice from an experinced developer. Some tasks will need to be done
by people, who have the permission (from the LSR-maintainer) to do so.
But let me repeat:

_Every_ user can start the LSR-upgrade.

Volunteers?
Be sure that I'd grant support.

Cheers,
  Harm

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Re: maintaining advanced power-user Scheme functions

2013-08-14 Thread Pierre Perol-Schneider
Hi Janek, Hi Harm,

2013/8/14 Thomas Morley thomasmorle...@gmail.com


 So I was annoyed by the lack of help/interest of others and I'm still
 pissed off.


Sorry for that, I think I totaly missed this discussion.



 Volunteers?
 Be sure that I'd grant support.


Sure !
Maybe give me some links where I can find how to do it.
Cheers,
Pierre
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Re: Avoids calling pure calculations too far downstream and avoids triggering quanting too far upstream (issue 12951044)

2013-08-14 Thread Mike Solomon
On 15 août 2013, at 08:35, k-ohara5...@oco.net wrote:

 Of course this is two commits.
 

probably three (axis-group-interface.cc and two independent changes in 
side-position-interface.cc).

 I do not know of any reason to distinguish the concept of 'cross-staff'
 from your new
 height_depends_on_grobs_from_another_vertical_
  axis_group()
 In most cases, 'cross-staff' means exactly that the height (Y-extent)
 depends on staff-spacing.
 

cross-staff is a non-exhaustive subset of this.

your original fix to 3363 was the right way to go, but it would retrigger 3385, 
even with my fix.  i prefer to keep it and fix the bug that it reveals, which 
is what this patch does.

to fix 3385, we need for beam quanting not to be triggered by vertical axis 
group skyline calculations, which requires weeding out both cross-staff-grobs 
and all grobs whose heights depend on cross-staff grobs.  this includes the 
ottava bracket, which we agreed not to mark as cross-staff.

 Could you mark the relevant object as 'cross-staff' when the cross-staff
 item is added to it 'support', rather than search through its support
 later?
 

see above: this would mean that ottava brackets are marked as cross-staff, 
which we don't want.

 I am completely stumped how skipping some objects in computing skylines
 for staff-spacing has anything to do with quantizing.

skipping means that quanting is not triggered.

 

 https://codereview.appspot.com/12951044/diff/1/lily/side-position-interface.cc
 File lily/side-position-interface.cc (right):
 
 https://codereview.appspot.com/12951044/diff/1/lily/side-position-interface.cc#newcode274
 lily/side-position-interface.cc:274: // In the case of a stem, we will
 find a note head as well
 The comments are out of date

ok

 https://codereview.appspot.com/12951044/diff/1/lily/side-position-interface.cc#newcode284
 lily/side-position-interface.cc:284:  !is_direction
 (e-get_property_data (direction)
 Now you skip *all* stems whose direction is still uncertain, while
 before you skipped only cross-staff stems of uncertain direction.
 That seems fine, but makes a lot more sense if the decisions about stems
 are all together in the next if()continue down below.
 

I prefer to keep this as is, as they are two conceptually different things.  
The first if()continue tests to make sure that certain things don't happen in 
pure lookups.  The second excludes stems that aren't conceptually supports 
because they don't point in the same direction as the supported grob.  I've 
changed the comments a bit to better reflect this.

 https://codereview.appspot.com/12951044/


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