Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed
Germ wrote: its just for a flash file which will act as the banner for the top of the webpage thanks for links and help I will look forward to hear the long answer ;) I have found this method quite useful: http://ln.hixie.ch/?start=1081798064count=1 Kat ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] image border inside
On 7/9/06 9:52 PM Joshua Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] sent this out: On 7/10/06, Taco Fleur [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Got it (sort of) works in Firefox, not explorer.. - Kind regards, Taco Fleur Here's one I quickly cooked up: http://sandbox.server-logon.com/jstreet/bordertest/ It does weird things on Safari. Firefox on Mac = okay. Rick ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed
Personally I use a little bit of _javascript_ to handle the eolas patent in IE and the does not have flash alternative content issue, SWFobject is my personal choice. An equally good alternative is Unobtrusive Flash Objects-- Nick Cowiehttp://nickcowie.com **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
RE: [WSG] cursor: default; or something else
Taco For what its worth, I always use the default cursor (arrow) on my nav hrefs that are nulled (#) on a landing page. IMO its much better indication that the hover is not clickable. Cole From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Taco Fleur Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 1:11 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] cursor: default; or something else Out of interested, what would one consider the most user friendliest cursor to display on hover http://www.apartmentrealty.com.au/site/apartment/full-detail.cfm?apartmentIdentity=1? I have cursor: default; I don't want to display the hand as it makes people think it is clickable. Kind regards, Taco Fleur free call 1800 032 982 or mobile 0421 851 786 fax 07 3414 6464, international +61 7 3325 5103 www.pacificfox.com.au an industry leader with commercial experience since 1994 our services: online, print, marketing information technology website, branding, logo, business cards, letterheads accept online credit card payments www.commerceengine.com.au domain registrations, .com for as low as fifteen dollars a year, .com.au for fifty dollars two years! **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help** **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
Re: [WSG] List headings
Maybe: dl dtGroup title/dt ddGroup title/dd ddGroup title/dd ddGroup title/dd /dl Or dl dth3Group title/h3/dt ddGroup title/dd ddGroup title/dd ddGroup title/dd /dl Example with lih3.../h3/li li.../li not so good, because h3.../h3 isn't LIST ITEM, it is TITLE of LIST ITEMS group. -- Regards, pepelsbey. http://pepelsbey.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed
I know this may sound stupid and dumb but is there a tag or something that you would use instead of an embed Just asking as it comes up as a warning when I valiadate a page im coding at the moment. Try this: http://www.mauzon.com/?p=36 -- С уважением, pepelsbey. http://pepelsbey.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] cursor: default; or something else
Thanks! Not sure how you figured out what I was after, after reading my own cryptic email I would not have made sense out of it ;-) Yes, I think default out of the available is best to, I was thinking about the WAIT cursor, because when hovering over the null item we are really waiting for them to make a selection. Although that one did not feel right Kind regards,Taco Fleur free call 1800 032 982 or mobile 0421 851 786 fax 07 3414 6464, international +61 7 3325 5103www.pacificfox.com.au an industry leader with commercial experience since 1994 our services: online, print, marketing information technology website, branding, logo, business cards, letterheads accept online credit card payments www.commerceengine.com.au domain registrations, .com for as low as fifteen dollars a year, .com.au for fifty dollars two years! From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Cole KuryakinSent: Monday, 10 July 2006 4:38 PMTo: wsg@webstandardsgroup.orgSubject: RE: [WSG] cursor: default; or something else Taco For what its worth, I always use the default cursor (arrow) on my nav hrefs that are nulled (#) on a landing page. IMO its much better indication that the hover is not clickable. Cole **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
Re: [WSG] List headings
On Monday 10 July 2006 16:43, pepelsbey wrote:
Maybe:
dl
dth3Group title/h3/dt
ddGroup title/dd
ddGroup title/dd
ddGroup title/dd
/dl
I think the best option would be:
dl
dth1Group title/h1/dt
ddGroup item/dd
ddGroup item/dd
ddGroup item/dd
/dl
and style
dt h1 { font-family:
font-weight:
etc
}
would allow your definition terms to ranked by importance. Sub-listings could
use h2, h3, etc for the definition term.
--
Regards,
Steve
Bathurst Computer Solutions
URL: www.bathurstcomputers.com.au
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Mobile: 0407 224 251
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Re: [WSG] List headings
dl dth1Group title/h1/dt ddGroup item/dd ddGroup item/dd ddGroup item/dd /dl Unfortunately, this is invalid. You can also use block level elements in the definition description, such as the p and ul elements. But you cannot use block level elements inside a definition term. More here: http://www.maxdesign.com.au/presentation/definition/ http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40/struct/lists.html#h-10.3 Specifically: !ELEMENT DT - O (%inline;)* -- definition term -- Thanks Russ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] List headings
Specifically: !ELEMENT DT - O (%inline;)* -- definition term -- Pity : \ So... best two solutions, i think: h1Title/h1 ul liItem/li liItem/li /ul and dl dtTitle/dt ddItem/dd ddItem/dd /dl or with STRONG dl dtstrongTitle/strong/dt ddItem/dd ddItem/dd /dl -- С уважением, pepelsbey. http://pepelsbey.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed
Hi Germ its just for a flash file which will act as the banner for the top of the webpage You will need the object … /object tag. Check out this excellent article ... I work this way, and code is widley supported by browsers, and passes validation. http://www.alistapart.com/articles/flashsatay/ thanks for links and help As for your second question: Also when i tried putting the a href tags on either side so that it was a link, it didnt work. any special reason?? I would think that it is because embed … /embed is a block-level elements, and a … /a is an inline element; From the W3: Generally, block-level elements may contain inline elements and other block-level elements. Generally, inline elements may contain only data and other inline elements. Inherent in this structural distinction is the idea that block elements create larger structures than inline elements. [http://www.w3.org/TR/1998/REC-html40-19980424/struct/ global.html#h-7.5.3] Regards, Peter -- Peter Dominic Ryan | raycity* : new media solutions : proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://raycity.com | mb: 0419 229 738 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed
pepelsbey wrote: I know this may sound stupid and dumb but is there a tag or something that you would use instead of an embed Just asking as it comes up as a warning when I valiadate a page im coding at the moment. A method suggested to me by Bert Doorn seems excellent, and is very simple: object data=whatever.swf width=596 height=375 type=application/x-shockwave-flash param name=movie value=whatever.swf / param name=quality value=high / param name=bgcolor value=#fff / a href=http://download.macromedia.com/pub/shockwave/cabs/flash/swflash.cab#version=6,0,29,0; img src=whatever.gif alt= / /a /object The nice thing is that non-flash content is placed on lines 4-6, with or without the link to download. AND, it validates! -- Best Regards, Bob McClelland Cornwall (UK) www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] List headings
You shouldn't need a strong emphasis - the dt (definition title) implys that it has a relevance to the dd () below it and is indeed the title for it. If you just want it bold you can style it that way in the CSS - which I am sure you know already. - Original Message From: pepelsbey [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Monday, 10 July, 2006 9:40:53 AM Subject: Re: [WSG] List headings Specifically: !ELEMENT DT - O (%inline;)* -- definition term -- Pity : \ So... best two solutions, i think: h1Title/h1 ul liItem/li liItem/li /ul and dl dtTitle/dt ddItem/dd ddItem/dd /dl or with STRONG dl dtstrongTitle/strong/dt ddItem/dd ddItem/dd /dl -- С уважением, pepelsbey. http://pepelsbey.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] List headings
No, you would use a css ;0)On 10/07/06, Lea de Groot [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you just want it bold you can style it that way in the CSS which I am sure you know already.pepelsbey wrote: Yep. CSS, i know ;) STRONG just for visual emphasis of DT in unstyled content. Not so necessary, but looks nice.Hmmm, interesting - I think I would use hoary old b if all I wantedwas visual emphasis for unstyled content.:)Lea--Lea de Groot Brisbane, Australia**The discussion list forhttp://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help** **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
Re: Re: [WSG] image border inside
Why not simply add a span via DOM inside the anchor, position it abs. with h/w:100% and the addit. border. Simple, clean and crossbrowser...ish... -- e-mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] web www.devonstudio.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] image menu failing in safari
I have been told that this menu isall messed upin Safari... http://www.dbuchter.com/transfer/peapod/new/ anyone know why? looks fine in FF and IE on PC. I'm stumped thnx, Warren **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
Re: [WSG] image border inside
Oskar Krawczyk wrote: Ok, even better solution can be found in my test zone: http://blog.olicio.us/public/weblog/fake-inner-border/ No, non-semantic tags, simple CSS. Havent tested on IE, but should work. It works also under IE. :) -- Grzesiek ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed
I don't know if this will help, but I added hyper links to my object vs embed test page. As per different browser they all work differently. http://www.designbyatfb.com/test/swftest2.html I don't know what [an error occurred while processing this directive] this is doing there! lol - Original Message - From: pdr Lists [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 3:45 AM Subject: Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed Hi Germ its just for a flash file which will act as the banner for the top of the webpage You will need the object … /object tag. Check out this excellent article ... I work this way, and code is widley supported by browsers, and passes validation. http://www.alistapart.com/articles/flashsatay/ thanks for links and help As for your second question: Also when i tried putting the a href tags on either side so that it was a link, it didnt work. any special reason?? I would think that it is because embed … /embed is a block-level elements, and a … /a is an inline element; From the W3: Generally, block-level elements may contain inline elements and other block-level elements. Generally, inline elements may contain only data and other inline elements. Inherent in this structural distinction is the idea that block elements create larger structures than inline elements. [http://www.w3.org/TR/1998/REC-html40-19980424/struct/ global.html#h-7.5.3] Regards, Peter -- Peter Dominic Ryan | raycity* : new media solutions : proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://raycity.com | mb: 0419 229 738 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.0.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.10/383 - Release Date: 7/7/2006 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] image menu failing in safari
Title: Re: [WSG] image menu failing in safari On 7/10/06 1:11 PM, Warren Cardinal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been told that this menu is all messed up in Safari... http://www.dbuchter.com/transfer/peapod/new/ anyone know why? looks fine in FF and IE on PC. I'm stumped thnx, Warren I dont have time to make a local copy and test, but I did find an extra /div after the header. HTH -- Tom Livingston | Senior Multimedia Artist | Media Logic | ph: 518.456.3015x231 | fx: 518.456.4279 | mlinc.com **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
Re: [WSG] Re: what do you use instead of embed
ok I think I finally got the hyper links that I added tested in all the browsers I have available. http://www.designbyatfb.com/test/swftest2.html I do believe that they only work with the swf object file (SEE EXAMPLE 4)in FF, Mozilla, Opera. If you went awhile ago to have a look, I aplogize for making a mess of it. I tried to get the results listed under each example, so no one would have to guess. Sharron **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
RE: [WSG] image border inside
I've found it to pass under Firefox? And IE.
And in reply to Oskar Krawczyk, this method doesn't have any non-semantic tags
- just a class.
No, non-semantic tags, simple CSS. Havent tested on IE, but should work.
-Original Message-
From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of pdr
Lists
Sent: Tuesday, 11 July 2006 3:58 a.m.
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] image border inside
On 10/07/2006, at 3:42 PM, Adam Burmister ((DSL AK)) wrote:
Ok - I think i've nutted it out:
http://labs.flog.co.nz/css-help/inner-border/demo.htm
- Adam
Here's how it tests out on a Mac:
Firefox - fail
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-firefox-h264.mov
Opera - pass
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-opera-h264.mov
Safari - fail
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-safari-h264.mov
Shira - fail
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-shira-h264.mov
Camino - pass
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-camino-h264.mov
{NB: QUickTime 7 is required]
Regards,
Peter
--
Peter Dominic Ryan | raycity* : new media solutions : proven
[EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://raycity.com | mb: 0419 229 738
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/353 - Release Date: 31/05/2006
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The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
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Re: [WSG] access keys
On 10/07/2006, at 3:37 PM, Paul Bennett wrote: I guess the issue that I'd have would be Joe / Jolene User accidentally hitting tab and getting a mysterious chunk of content appear atop the screen. Very unlikely scenario. You can safely use :focus without it causing problems for sited users (or the management). They probably won't know about it, unless they are quite tech savvy (which is also unlikely). If they are committed to complying with GWG then making the site usable via keyboard is a requirement. There is the (mis)perception that passing WAI priority 1 is a enough for GWG, but fortunately it's not. Under GWG 'SHOULD' actually means 'MUST' unless exempted in writing from SSC. kind regards Terrence Wood. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] image border inside
Oh, beg your pardon. I was thinking FF on PC, I see the issue.
Thanks for the feedback
-Original Message-
From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam
Burmister (DSL AK)
Sent: Tuesday, 11 July 2006 7:50 a.m.
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] image border inside
I've found it to pass under Firefox? And IE.
And in reply to Oskar Krawczyk, this method doesn't have any non-semantic tags
- just a class.
No, non-semantic tags, simple CSS. Havent tested on IE, but should work.
-Original Message-
From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of pdr
Lists
Sent: Tuesday, 11 July 2006 3:58 a.m.
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG] image border inside
On 10/07/2006, at 3:42 PM, Adam Burmister ((DSL AK)) wrote:
Ok - I think i've nutted it out:
http://labs.flog.co.nz/css-help/inner-border/demo.htm
- Adam
Here's how it tests out on a Mac:
Firefox - fail
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-firefox-h264.mov
Opera - pass
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-opera-h264.mov
Safari - fail
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-safari-h264.mov
Shira - fail
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-shira-h264.mov
Camino - pass
http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-camino-h264.mov
{NB: QUickTime 7 is required]
Regards,
Peter
--
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[EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://raycity.com | mb: 0419 229 738
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RE: [WSG] image border inside
Hi Peter, I've updated the demo code on my sandbox site, would you mind testing again? I thin I've fixed the firefox and safari issues, but I don't have Shira or Camino installed on our test machine. http://labs.flog.co.nz/css-help/inner-border/demo.htm Here's how it tests out on a Mac: Firefox - fail http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-firefox-h264.mov Opera - pass http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-opera-h264.mov Safari - fail http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-safari-h264.mov Shira - fail http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-shira-h264.mov Camino - pass http://www.raycity.com/downloads/mac-camino-h264.mov -- Peter Dominic Ryan | raycity* : new media solutions : proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://raycity.com | mb: 0419 229 738 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/353 - Release Date: 31/05/2006 -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/353 - Release Date: 31/05/2006 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: Re: Re: [WSG] image border inside
Thanks everyone, especially Oskar and Adam, I will be using your solutions. Kind regards, Taco Fleur free call 1800 032 982 - fax 07 3414 6464, international +61 7 3325 5103 www.pacificfox.com.au an industry leader with commercial experience since 1994 . our services: - online, print, marketing information technology - website, branding, logo, business cards, letterheads - accept online credit card payments www.commerceengine.com.au - domain registrations, .com for as low as fifteen dollars a year, .com.au for fifty dollars two years! ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] image border inside
Hi Peter, I've updated the demo code on my sandbox site, would you mind testing again? I thin I've fixed the firefox and safari issues, but I don't have Shira or Camino installed on our test machine. Hi Adam Pass on all five browsers for the Mac! Nice work! Regards, Peter -- Peter Dominic Ryan | raycity* : new media solutions : proven [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://raycity.com | mb: 0419 229 738 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] The Web Accessibility Toolbar for Opera [WAT for Opera] now available.
The Web Accessibility Toolbar for Opera [WAT for Opera] now available. Web Accessibility Tools Consortium [http://www.wat-c.org] members; Cedric Trevison of The Paciello Group [http://www.paciellogroup.com] and Steve Faulkner of vision australia [ http://www.visionaustralia.org.au] have developed a version of the popular testing tool, the Web Accessibility Toolbar [http://www.visionaustralia/ais/toolbar], that can be installed on the Opera web browser. Read more and download the WAT for Opera [http://www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-about.html] with regards Steven Faulkner Web Accessibility Consultant vision australia - information library service 454 Glenferrie Road Kooyong Victoria 3144 Phone: (613) 9864 9281 Fax: (613) 9864 9210 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.accessibleinfo.org.au | www.wat-c.org Download the Web Accessibility Toolbar [http://www.visionaustralia.org.au/ais/toolbar/] ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] list items floating around a floated element
HI All I'm drawing a blank on this today. We have a blog post with some ugly tag soup, courtesy of an inpage editor. So, ignore the font tags. I've already stripped it down to the bare essence to check on the behavior and I've got a question about fundamental block/float performance. Here's the issue: http://tech.yahoo.com/blogs/null/870 We have a photograph that floats to the right. It sits in a paragraph. Following this paragraph is an unordered list. The first list item hits the image and constrains its width to the space between the left side of the main container and the edge of the image in Firefox. In IE6, the text of the list item continues to flow around the image. I'm sitting here thinking that firefox is doing it correctly, although frustratingly so. The list item is a block level element and contains all of the space it can. Upon hitting the image, it assumes that it can only be 250px wide instead of 450px. So, it renders all of the content in that list item as 250px. The next list item spans the entire container, as it doesn't have to worry about the image. I don't want to make a style for this particular post or list item. I need to set it to work with all possibilities. Has anyone come across this and figured out a way to force the list item text to flow around the image? For what it's worth, I'm going to re-code the post and manually update it. I'm going to switch to h4/paragraphs instead. Although I'm also tempted to go with a dl as well. But that is not the point of this email. I'm curious about any list item that needs to flow around a previously floated image. Thanks Ted Drake Front-end Engineer Yahoo! Tech ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] list items floating around a floated element
I think you're right. FF is rendering it correctly, as the LI and IMG block-elements are jutting up to each other. The easiest way I can think of solving it would be to place the image within the LI. - Adam -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ted Drake Sent: Tuesday, 11 July 2006 11:14 a.m. To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] list items floating around a floated element HI All I'm drawing a blank on this today. We have a blog post with some ugly tag soup, courtesy of an inpage editor. So, ignore the font tags. I've already stripped it down to the bare essence to check on the behavior and I've got a question about fundamental block/float performance. Here's the issue: http://tech.yahoo.com/blogs/null/870 We have a photograph that floats to the right. It sits in a paragraph. Following this paragraph is an unordered list. The first list item hits the image and constrains its width to the space between the left side of the main container and the edge of the image in Firefox. In IE6, the text of the list item continues to flow around the image. I'm sitting here thinking that firefox is doing it correctly, although frustratingly so. The list item is a block level element and contains all of the space it can. Upon hitting the image, it assumes that it can only be 250px wide instead of 450px. So, it renders all of the content in that list item as 250px. The next list item spans the entire container, as it doesn't have to worry about the image. I don't want to make a style for this particular post or list item. I need to set it to work with all possibilities. Has anyone come across this and figured out a way to force the list item text to flow around the image? For what it's worth, I'm going to re-code the post and manually update it. I'm going to switch to h4/paragraphs instead. Although I'm also tempted to go with a dl as well. But that is not the point of this email. I'm curious about any list item that needs to flow around a previously floated image. Thanks Ted Drake Front-end Engineer Yahoo! Tech ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/353 - Release Date: 31/05/2006 -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/353 - Release Date: 31/05/2006 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] list items floating around a floated element
Hi Adam. That's an idea. I tried adding display:inline to the list item, but that removes the bullet. I forgot to mention that earlier. Ted -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Adam Burmister (DSL AK) Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 4:33 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] list items floating around a floated element I think you're right. FF is rendering it correctly, as the LI and IMG block-elements are jutting up to each other. The easiest way I can think of solving it would be to place the image within the LI. - Adam -Original Message- From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ted Drake Sent: Tuesday, 11 July 2006 11:14 a.m. To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] list items floating around a floated element HI All I'm drawing a blank on this today. We have a blog post with some ugly tag soup, courtesy of an inpage editor. So, ignore the font tags. I've already stripped it down to the bare essence to check on the behavior and I've got a question about fundamental block/float performance. Here's the issue: http://tech.yahoo.com/blogs/null/870 We have a photograph that floats to the right. It sits in a paragraph. Following this paragraph is an unordered list. The first list item hits the image and constrains its width to the space between the left side of the main container and the edge of the image in Firefox. In IE6, the text of the list item continues to flow around the image. I'm sitting here thinking that firefox is doing it correctly, although frustratingly so. The list item is a block level element and contains all of the space it can. Upon hitting the image, it assumes that it can only be 250px wide instead of 450px. So, it renders all of the content in that list item as 250px. The next list item spans the entire container, as it doesn't have to worry about the image. I don't want to make a style for this particular post or list item. I need to set it to work with all possibilities. Has anyone come across this and figured out a way to force the list item text to flow around the image? For what it's worth, I'm going to re-code the post and manually update it. I'm going to switch to h4/paragraphs instead. Although I'm also tempted to go with a dl as well. But that is not the point of this email. I'm curious about any list item that needs to flow around a previously floated image. Thanks Ted Drake Front-end Engineer Yahoo! Tech ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/353 - Release Date: 31/05/2006 -- Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.8.0/353 - Release Date: 31/05/2006 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] access keys
On 11/7/06 5:50 PM, Terrence Wood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 10/07/2006, at 3:37 PM, Paul Bennett wrote: I guess the issue that I'd have would be Joe / Jolene User accidentally hitting tab and getting a mysterious chunk of content appear atop the screen. You can safely use :focus without it causing problems for sited users ... You mean people with their own web sites? -- Kevin Futter Webmaster, St. Bernard's College http://www.sbc.melb.catholic.edu.au/ -- This e-mail and any attachments may be confidential. You must not disclose or use the information in this e-mail if you are not the intended recipient. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us immediately and delete the e-mail and all copies. The College does not guarantee that this e-mail is virus or error free. The attached files are provided and may only be used on the basis that the user assumes all responsibility for any loss, damage or consequence resulting directly or indirectly from the use of the attached files, whether caused by the negligence of the sender or not. The content and opinions in this e-mail are not necessarily those of the College. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Alphabetical Listing Buttons
Hi All :o) Wondering if you can help me solve an issue: I'd like to have a list of alphabetical buttons at the top of the page (you've all seen this kind of navigation). What I'd like to do is have them with the following features: 1. Single pixel border 2. Some padding around the letter (to make them look nice) 3. A margin around each one that is statically sized 3. .. and this is the biggy ... I'd like their width the stretch dependent on screen resolution. Here's a screenshot: http://www.grafx.com.au/wip/alphabet.gif The pale pink of the inside of each button is the bit that stretches... The space between them is always the same. Effectively the whole alphabet should stretch across the top in one row. Can anyone help? Richard :o) **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
[WSG] PS: Alphabetical Listing Buttons
PS: I should qualify this - obviously the solution needs to work cross-browser (which is where I'm having the most difficulty)... Mainly FireFox and IE (as it's for an internal app) and they're moving office browsers over from IE to FireFox. R :o) - Original Message - From: Richard Czeiger To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 10:49 AM Subject: Alphabetical Listing Buttons Hi All :o) Wondering if you can help me solve an issue: I'd like to have a list of alphabetical buttons at the top of the page (you've all seen this kind of navigation). What I'd like to do is have them with the following features: 1. Single pixel border 2. Some padding around the letter (to make them look nice) 3. A margin around each one that is statically sized 3. .. and this is the biggy ... I'd like their width the stretch dependent on screen resolution. Here's a screenshot: http://www.grafx.com.au/wip/alphabet.gif The pale pink of the inside of each button is the bit that stretches... The space between them is always the same. Effectively the whole alphabet should stretch across the top in one row. Can anyone help? Richard :o) **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
RE: [WSG] PS: Alphabetical Listing Buttons
Richard Czeiger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi All :o)
Wondering if you can help me solve an issue:
I'd like to have a list of alphabetical buttons at the top of the
page (you've all seen this kind of navigation).
What I'd like to do is have them with the following features:
1. Single pixel border
2. Some padding around the letter (to make them look nice)
3. A margin around each one that is statically sized
3. .. and this is the biggy ... I'd like their width the stretch
dependent on screen resolution.
Playing around with percentage widths on the li's seems to do the trick,
along the lines of:
[css]
body {
font: 100.01% verdana, arial, sans-serif;
}
ul {
font-size: 0.76em;
font-weight: bold;
list-style-type: none;
}
ul li {
float: left;
margin: 0.2em;
width: 3%; /* adjust percentage to suit layout */
min-width: 1.5em;
text-align: center;
background-color: #cfc;
border: 1px solid #6c6;
}
a {
display: block;
padding: 0.4em;
text-decoration: none;
color: #666;
}
a:hover {
background: #fff;
}
[html]
ul
lia href=#A/a/li
lia href=#B/a/li
lia href=#C/a/li
lia href=#D/a/li
.etc
/ul
Regards
Scott Swabey
Design Development Director - Lafinboy Productions
www.lafinboy.com | www.thought-after.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] image menu failing in safari
On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:11 AM, Warren Cardinal wrote: I have been told that this menu is all messed up in Safari... http://www.dbuchter.com/transfer/peapod/new/ anyone know why? looks fine in FF and IE on PC. I'm stumped Step one: validate your mark-up. Step one one: validate your mark-up. Step two: may set a width on those floated li ? Currently, each li collapses in width to the width of the text node inside it. Philippe --- Philippe Wittenbergh http://emps.l-c-n.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] html validation: exactly what is it good for?
We Standards are good for SEO (Search Engine Optimzation) too! You might would like to check two threads running at WebProWorld Forums. One I started myself: http://www.webproworld.com/viewtopic.php?t=65123 and an another interesting one here: http://www.webproworld.com/viewtopic.php?t=64982 Side Note: I would also appreciate if any Web Standards Advocates would give me a hand there. They give me a hard time there. Best, John -- John S. Britsios Web Architect Marketing Consultant Webnauts Net (Main Office) Koblenzer Str. 37A D-33613 Bielefeld Webnauts Net (U.S. Office) 5 Ivanhoe Drive Urbana IL 61802 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web address: http://www.webnauts.net Richard Czeiger wrote: There are a number of reasons, but one basic simple one is that it's like Spell Check. Use it to make sure you are a good programmer (if nothing else) rather than a sloppy one. Forget the fact that if other developers both within your team and out of it ever come across your code and it's all over the shop, then you won't look too good. Forget about the fact that you want your sites to be future proof and perhaps work with more advanced technologies later. In the end, it's about being the best you can be. If the Validators picks up a little error that you overlooked then it's just more professional to go in and correct your 'spelling'. can you imagime what is fdould look like if i woryte copde thjat was messy? R :o) - Original Message - From: Shlomi Asaf To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2006 2:49 PM Subject: [WSG] html validation: exactly what is it good for? Hi I have a question that crossed my mind, and i wish to get help from you guys: HTML Validation- what is it good for? I try to find the disadvantages of a non validated site against one validated, and let me try to explain what i mean. If i build a website, according to his declaration - let say Strict XHTML, and its answering all the roles of Strict Xhtml, but its not valid cause, for example, i haven't used to surround values, or i haven't closed single tags using Slash ( /), but other wise i did everything by the scheme. What can be the damage? If i open the site and see that it works on my target browsers, why i need the validation for? what do i benefit from it? It says it helps me improve my SEO, but i see all the first results at Google, for lets say Forex keyword, and none of them are valid. I assume the main price is time rendering cost, but what can be else? Thank You. Shlomi.A ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- John S. Britsios Web Architect Marketing Consultant Webnauts Net (Main Office) Koblenzer Str. 37A D-33613 Bielefeld Webnauts Net (U.S. Office) 5 Ivanhoe Drive Urbana IL 61802 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web address: http://www.webnauts.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] PS: Alphabetical Listing Buttons
Thanks Scott, but it didn't work...
This is as far as I've gotten:
http://www.grafx.com.au/wip/alphabeticalList.html
Pretty ugly - lots of FF v IE hacks but if anyone can improve this, I'd love
it!
R :o)
- Original Message -
From: Scott Swabey [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 11:31 AM
Subject: RE: [WSG] PS: Alphabetical Listing Buttons
Richard Czeiger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi All :o)
Wondering if you can help me solve an issue:
I'd like to have a list of alphabetical buttons at the top of the
page (you've all seen this kind of navigation).
What I'd like to do is have them with the following features:
1. Single pixel border
2. Some padding around the letter (to make them look nice)
3. A margin around each one that is statically sized
3. .. and this is the biggy ... I'd like their width the stretch
dependent on screen resolution.
Playing around with percentage widths on the li's seems to do the trick,
along the lines of:
[css]
body {
font: 100.01% verdana, arial, sans-serif;
}
ul {
font-size: 0.76em;
font-weight: bold;
list-style-type: none;
}
ul li {
float: left;
margin: 0.2em;
width: 3%; /* adjust percentage to suit layout */
min-width: 1.5em;
text-align: center;
background-color: #cfc;
border: 1px solid #6c6;
}
a {
display: block;
padding: 0.4em;
text-decoration: none;
color: #666;
}
a:hover {
background: #fff;
}
[html]
ul
lia href=#A/a/li
lia href=#B/a/li
lia href=#C/a/li
lia href=#D/a/li
.etc
/ul
Regards
Scott Swabey
Design Development Director - Lafinboy Productions
www.lafinboy.com | www.thought-after.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
[WSG] help needed with position of text links
HiI dont know if the subject title is descripted properly as I couldnt really come up with a good namebut anyway the problem:http://www.blazedesigns.com the links are too close to the side of the border of the divs. I want the image sitting next to the right hand side and the text but not the text also sitting on the edge. I also wouldnt mind having the text middled (vertically) in the image as well. I have tried placing a NBSP; tag thingy on the right. but i was wondering if there was another better css way??? Thanks-- JP2 Designshttp://www.jp2designs.com **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
Re: [WSG] help needed with position of text links
On 11/07/06, Germ [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: but i was wondering if there was another better css way??? use padding, padding: top right bottom left;note : after padding, which is missing in your CSSpadding: 1px 10px 1px 1px; will get the text 10px from the right edge, (note box model problems with IE5/5.5) vertical centering text - one line only:line-height: 35px;line-height equal to the block size will put a single line of text in the middle of the block.Two lines is ugly -- Nick Cowiehttp://nickcowie.com **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
RE: [WSG] help needed with position of text links
Germ wrote
the links are too close to the side of the border of the divs.
I want the image sitting next to the right hand side and the
text but not the text also sitting on the edge. I also wouldn't
mind having the text middled (vertically) in the image as well.
Modify your #navigation a styles like:
#navigation a {
color: #FFF;
background-image: url(button.jpg);
font-size: 1.3em;
font-weight: normal;
font-family: Times New Roman;
text-decoration: none;
display: block;
margin: 1px;
padding 1px;
Padding-right: 10px /* add required padding to right side */
text-align: right;
height: 35px;
width: 140px; /* reduce width by width of padding-right */
border: 0px;
line-height: 2em; /* add a line height to center the text vertically */
}
Regards
Scott Swabey
Design Development Director - Lafinboy Productions
www.lafinboy.com | www.thought-after.com
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] help needed with position of text links
Hey thanks for thatThe problem was really bugging me On 7/11/06, Scott Swabey [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:Modify your #navigation a styles like:#navigation a {color: #FFF;
background-image: url(button.jpg);font-size: 1.3em;font-weight: normal;font-family: Times New Roman;text-decoration: none;display: block;margin: 1px;padding 1px;Padding-right: 10px /* add required padding to right side */
text-align: right;height: 35px;width: 140px; /* reduce width by width of padding-right */border: 0px;line-height: 2em; /* add a line height to center the text vertically */}RegardsScott Swabey
Design Development Director - Lafinboy Productionswww.lafinboy.com | www.thought-after.com**
The discussion list forhttp://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help**-- JP2 Designs
http://www.jp2designs.com
**The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
RE: [WSG] Alphabetical Listing Buttons
-Original Message-
From: listdad@webstandardsgroup.org
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard Czeiger
Sent: Tuesday, 11 July 2006 10:49 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] Alphabetical Listing Buttons
Hi All :o)
Wondering if you can help me solve an issue:
I'd like to have a list of alphabetical buttons at the top of
the page (you've all seen this kind of navigation).
What I'd like to do is have them with the following features:
1. Single pixel border
2. Some padding around the letter (to make them look nice)
3. A margin around each one that is statically sized
3. .. and this is the biggy ... I'd like their width the
stretch dependent on screen resolution.
Here's a screenshot:
http://www.grafx.com.au/wip/alphabet.gif
The pale pink of the inside of each button is the bit that
stretches...
The space between them is always the same.
Effectively the whole alphabet should stretch across the top
in one row.
Hi Richard,
Sorry, I don't have time to try this one out, but the obvious solution for
me would be to try this:
We have got 26 boxes next to each other. If we wanted to float them all next
to each other so that they take up 100% of the browser width, I would
presume each box would have a width of 3.84% (100% / 26 = 3.84).
Wouldn't that work? Something like:
li{margin:0; padding:0; float:left; width:3.84%; background:pink}
Then to get the white boxes to work I would probably play with
background-images (borders with 1px width would stuff up our percentage
calculation).
What do yoou think?
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
[WSG]
Shlomi Asaf wrote:HiI have a question that crossed my mind, and i wish to get help from youguys: HTML Validation- what is it good for?I try to find the disadvantages of a non validated site against onevalidated, and let me try to explain what i mean.If i build a website, according to his declaration - let say StrictXHTML,and its answering all the roles of Strict Xhtml, but its not valid cause,for example, i haven't used "" to surround values, or i haven't closedsingle tags using Slash ( /), but other wise i did everything by thescheme.What can be the damage?If i open the site and see that it works on my target browsers, why ineedthe validation for? what do i benefit from it?It says it helps me improve my SEO, but i see all the first results atGoogle, for lets say "Forex" keyword, and none of them are valid.I assume the main price is time rendering cost, but what can be else?Thank You.Shlomi.AHi Shlomi,I can definitely agree that you shouldn't take everything for granted and decide for yourself whether it is important for you to follow or not. But I think the question here is why would you choose xhtml strict? or even more why choose xhtml doctype at all? why not stay with good old html 4?If you choose xhtml because you believe that xml is the way of the future, than at least follow its rules such as enclose you attributes in "" and close all tags and so forth. Besides most editors will this automatically for you by selecting a preference of choice.And then validating just helps making sure your syntax is correct, which means if you do have problems with how your pages load if your target browsers, you can eliminate possibilities quicker and easier.If you wish to not follow the language rules, at least declare it as html and then you can leave your tags unclosed and all that other things you have to do when using xhtml strict as doctype.All the bestEllewaznelle.com **The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help**
Re: [WSG]
Dear Shlomi, Why to validate a code that not made for the validation. Make the website, follow the restrictions and then validate... This is still just a validation for as correct coding as possible, that does not mean it will work exactly perfect i all browsers anyway... To build the website in XHTML makes it much much easier to develop and make general changes... that is my reason, and validation is not as important as you think... Michael Elle Meredith wrote: Shlomi Asaf wrote: Hi I have a question that crossed my mind, and i wish to get help from you guys: HTML Validation- what is it good for? I try to find the disadvantages of a non validated site against one validated, and let me try to explain what i mean. If i build a website, according to his declaration - let say Strict XHTML, and its answering all the roles of Strict Xhtml, but its not valid cause, for example, i haven't used to surround values, or i haven't closed single tags using Slash ( /), but other wise i did everything by the scheme. What can be the damage? If i open the site and see that it works on my target browsers, why i need the validation for? what do i benefit from it? It says it helps me improve my SEO, but i see all the first results at Google, for lets say Forex keyword, and none of them are valid. I assume the main price is time rendering cost, but what can be else? Thank You. Shlomi.A Hi Shlomi, I can definitely agree that you shouldn't take everything for granted and decide for yourself whether it is important for you to follow or not. But I think the question here is why would you choose xhtml strict? or even more why choose xhtml doctype at all? why not stay with good old html 4? If you choose xhtml because you believe that xml is the way of the future, than at least follow its rules such as enclose you attributes in and close all tags and so forth. Besides most editors will this automatically for you by selecting a preference of choice. And then validating just helps making sure your syntax is correct, which means if you do have problems with how your pages load if your target browsers, you can eliminate possibilities quicker and easier. If you wish to not follow the language rules, at least declare it as html and then you can leave your tags unclosed and all that other things you have to do when using xhtml strict as doctype. All the best Elle waznelle.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Michael Persson [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Miaouli 19, 10554 Athens, Greece Tel: +30/210/3227400 Fax : +30/210/3227410 www.mozaik.com http://www.mozaik.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
