Re: [Marxism] ‘Provocative’ Bolshevik anti-Religious Caricatures.
POSTING RULES NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * I'd go a step further than Richard and say that Turkey has its own traditions of ethnic cleansing and/or genocide (depending on how you define your terms) with the precise logic of secularism. It's at least as likely as any other metaphysical belief system to be used for rotten ends. At this point in history, I don't see how anyone can claim, with a straight face, that it's intrinsically cleaner than the others. On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 8:56 AM, Lenin's Tomb via Marxism marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu wrote: Turkey does have its own traditions of secularism (often highly problematic, being linked to national chauvinism and autocracy) -- Hige sceal þe heardra, heorte þe cenre, mod sceal þe mare, þe ure mægen lytlað. _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] ‘Provocative’ Bolshevik anti-Religious Caricatures.
POSTING RULES NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Charlie: We Publish ‘Provocative’ Bolshevik anti-Religious Caricatures. In the light of the Charlie Hebdo controversy. Very British Bolsheviks Shocked by Soviet Islamophobia! We defend our beloved Charlie to the hilt. But there are those who do not – apparently from the very British Bolsheviks. As Seymour writes ” How dare you call this horseshit ‘satire’?” Some more ‘horseshit’, from the early Soviet Union. Pics of anti-religious, and specifically anti-Islamic, caricatures from the the early 1920s Soviet Union. Our oh so-British Bolsheviks should surely protest to Lenin! https://tendancecoatesy.wordpress.com/2015/01/16/charlie-we-publish-provocative-bolshevik-anti-religious-caricatures/ Andrew Coates _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] ‘Provocative’ Bolshevik anti-Religious Caricatures.
POSTING RULES NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Andrew Coates sends some Bolshevik posters to the list. https://tendancecoatesy.wordpress.com/2015/01/16/charlie-we-publish-provocative-bolshevik-anti-religious-caricatures/ He describes them as ‘Provocative’ Bolshevik anti-Religious Caricatures. I encourage others to have a look at these posters. I cannot read Russian or whatever language is used in the posters, so I would have to appeal to those who can to help us understand how the posters would have been received by workers and peasants in the Asian Soviet republics. Were these in fact anti-religious posters or were they intended to denounce the reactionary role of some religious leaders? Were the Bolsheviks hoping to separate some religious believers from reactionary religious figures? What impact did the posters have? And that leads me back to the questions I have asked previously on this list. Did the Charlie Hebdo cartoons have the effect of freeing some Muslim young people from religious belief? Did the cartoons have the effect of weakening the influence of the most reactionary currents within the Muslim community? ken h _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] ‘Provocative’ Bolshevik anti-Religious Caricatures.
POSTING RULES NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * On 16/01/2015 20:16, Ken Hiebert via Marxism wrote: And that leads me back to the questions I have asked previously on this list. Did the Charlie Hebdo cartoons have the effect of freeing some Muslim young people from religious belief? Did the cartoons have the effect of weakening the influence of the most reactionary currents within the Muslim community? I think so. It's a difficult question to answer definitively, but my impression is that such anticlerical views have been useful both in France and abroad for these purposes, and perhaps the republishing of one of them by a Turkish newspaper may be regarded as evidence towards this. --David. _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] ‘Provocative’ Bolshevik anti-Religious Caricatures.
POSTING RULES NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Actually nothing in these posters or, even the ones LINKED from within the article, are from EARLY 1920s but from the LATE 1920s. There appears to be in the page indicated the early 1920s one from that, which is not 'satire' but educational and addresses very specifically the subjection of women. In case anyone wanted to know Lenin's views on religion and the RSDLP's position toward those believers among the working class, here is an essay where he takes on the flaming atheists in the movement who want nothing more than to attack religion: https://www.marxists.org/archive/lenin/works/1909/may/13.htm It should be noted also that Bolshevik women cadre after 1918 wore the vale in Soviet Central Asia as to better talk with Muslim women about the problems of Islam and their oppression by it. At no point did they make fun or satire of Islam. At least I've not been able to find it. Obviously that would of been ... counter-productive. DW _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
