Re: [Marxism] Jeffery Webber and the "pink tide"
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * On 4/27/17 12:35 PM, Michael Yates via Marxism wrote: If it is true that Webber accuses Marta Harnecker of aiding and abetting a neoliberal con job in Latin America, then he has committed an unbelievable libel against a revolutionary writer and activist. We may disagree with Marta in one way or another. But, if true, this is beyond the pale. I am working on an article now about Webber's book. He IMPLICITLY views Michael Lebowitz, Marta and anybody else who wrote positively about Hugo Chavez as an abettor. He is smart enough to credit Lebowitz as someone who viewed the mass movement as fundamental to change in Venezuela but the overall purpose of the book is to liken Chavez et al to Alex Tsipras. _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Jeffery Webber and the "pink tide"
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * If it is true that Webber accuses Marta Harnecker of aiding and abetting a neoliberal con job in Latin America, then he has committed an unbelievable libel against a revolutionary writer and activist. We may disagree with Marta in one way or another. But, if true, this is beyond the pale. _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Jeffery Webber and the "pink tide"
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Haven't read it yet but I heard Jeff speak on the same themes at NYU a couple months back, and the Jacobin article is a good summary. I concur with Andrew's point - sorting out the gains and losses from the so-called Pink Tide experience is a valuable contribution. Will await Lou's in-depth article before I comment further. On Wed, Apr 26, 2017 at 1:46 PM, Louis Proyect via Marxism < marxism@lists.csbs.utah.edu> wrote: > POSTING RULES & NOTES > #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. > #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. > #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. > * > > On 4/26/17 1:32 PM, Andrew Pollack via Marxism wrote: > >> I've read about a third of the book and it's hardly the shrill told-you-so >> caricature of Leninism which Louis makes it out to be. >> > > As if the battle over control of Venezuela's state oil company in 2007 was > between two neoliberal factions. Anyhow, I will be going into more depth > tomorrow. > > _ > Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm > Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/opt > ions/marxism/fred.r.murphy%40gmail.com > _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Jeffery Webber and the "pink tide"
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * On 4/26/17 1:32 PM, Andrew Pollack via Marxism wrote: I've read about a third of the book and it's hardly the shrill told-you-so caricature of Leninism which Louis makes it out to be. As if the battle over control of Venezuela's state oil company in 2007 was between two neoliberal factions. Anyhow, I will be going into more depth tomorrow. _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Marxism] Jeffery Webber and the "pink tide"
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Comrades should read this article by Jeffery "adapted from the book," as Jacobin puts it. I've read about a third of the book and it's hardly the shrill told-you-so caricature of Leninism which Louis makes it out to be. Rather, it's a mature, detailed demolition of the myths around the Pink Tide, as well as an accurate assessment of the state of the various movement and political forces, all of which IMO is a precursor to united action. https://www.jacobinmag.com/2017/04/lula-correa-rousseff-left-pink-tide/ _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Marxism] Jeffery Webber and the "pink tide"
POSTING RULES & NOTES #1 YOU MUST clip all extraneous text when replying to a message. #2 This mail-list, like most, is publicly & permanently archived. #3 Subscribe and post under an alias if #2 is a concern. * Just finished Jeffery Webber's 300 page book on how the "pink tide" in Latin America was a neoliberal con job aided and abetted by Martha Harnecker. Will be writing something tomorrow for Counterpunch but will state at this point how sterile this exercise is. It reminds me of all those articles in the ISO press for the past 15 years based on interviews with Venezuelan "revolutionaries" who testified against the perfidy of the Chavistas. The problem is that pointing out the deficiencies of Morales, Chavez or Correa is relatively easy. The hard part is developing strategies that can lead to a socialist revolution and becoming part of an organized movement that can gain the allegiance of the masses. Whatever else you want to say about Morales, Chavez and Correa, they knew how to win people to their ideas. Unless the Marxist left can develop the same sort of abilities, it is next to useless. You should never forget that Lenin's polemics against the Mensheviks was only part of his legacy. For every article excoriating Martov, there were a dozen others with proposals on LEFT UNITY and STRATEGY. If you think that Leninism is the same thing as denouncing Morales for encouraging soybean farms in Bolivia, you really need to study Lenin more thoroughly. _ Full posting guidelines at: http://www.marxmail.org/sub.htm Set your options at: http://lists.csbs.utah.edu/options/marxism/archive%40mail-archive.com
