Re: [Marxism] Misleading propaganda about "no fly zone" (was: This is what it’s come to: Letting Syria die watching Syrians drown)

[Clay Claiborne via Marxism]

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>
> The 10 year "no fly zone" war with "sanctions" against Iraq has killed
> 500'000 Iraqi children.

Luko, you are disgusting in your defense of Assad. Nobody supporting the
revolution is calling for sanctions, so why throuw those into the mix? But
since you did, could people give us a breakdown on how many of those
500,000 children were killed by the no-fly zone and how many by sanctions?

According Stahl, sanctions killed 500,000 children, so how many does that
leave killed by the no-fly zone?

About 1200 Libyans met with violent deaths in 2014, compare that to Syria
in 2014. Did the NATO no-fly zone save lives?


Clay Claiborne, Director
Vietnam: American Holocaust 
Linux Beach Productions
Venice, CA 90291
(310) 581-1536

Read my blogs at the Linux Beach 


On Sun, Sep 6, 2015 at 6:26 AM, Lüko Willms 
wrote:

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>
> on Freitag, 4. September 2015 at 10:01, Michael Karadjis via Marxism wrote:
>
> > A US imposed no-fly zone that instead targets the warplanes in the sky
>
> The right wing propaganda for a more vigorous imperialist aggression to
> put a subservient regime in place in Damascus does of course lie about the
> so called "no fly zone".
>
> No, a "no fly zone" does not really involve "targetting warplances in the
> sky", but heavy bombing of the ground.
>
> It means not only destroying airports, but first and foremost destroying
> all air defenses of the country of which the imperialist aggressor wants to
> take control of, and this needs massive bombing.
>
> > Oh no! Imperialist intervention!
>
> > The irony being that the US is vigorously opposed to any no-fly zone!
>
> One of your leaders, Ms. Hillary Clinton, had made clear when she was the
> US foreign minister, that bombing Syria is a not so easy as assinating some
> people in Asia or Africa by teleguided killing machines -- among several
> reasons -- the Syrian government has an effective air defense. While the
> Ghaddafi regime of Libya had given up their air defense on demand of the
> imperialist powers for being accepted as a good friend of imperialism.
> Libya has suffered corresondingly. Syria on the other hand could at least
> avoid such terror bombing as Iraq, Afghanistan or Libya suffered. And
> Vietnam, and Laos, and Korea, and and and
>
> > and saves lives of civilians?
>
> The 10 year "no fly zone" war with "sanctions" against Iraq has killed
> 500'000 Iraqi children. Another of your leaders, Ms. Madeleine Albright,
> who was US foreign minister back than, thought that this was worth it.
>
> No, imposing this so sweet sounding "no fly zone" is as murderous as any
> other imperialist aggression. It just saves some lives of the aggressor's
> canon fudder, who kill in Asia and return daily home from "work" to their
> family home in, say, Kansas.
>
> As a side note, there is another big error in the post by Mr. Karadjis:
>
> > So you want to oppose imperialist intervention - good, so when do you
> > think it began? As myself, Louis, Clay and others have shown
> > [...] in 2012.
>
>  Far off the mark. The imperialist intervention began in at least 1914.
>
>  And has never stopped since.
>
>
> Cheers,
> Lüko Willms
>
>
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[Marxism] Misleading propaganda about "no fly zone" (was: This is what it’s come to: Letting Syria die watching Syrians drown)

[Lüko Willms via Marxism]

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on Freitag, 4. September 2015 at 10:01, Michael Karadjis via Marxism wrote:

> A US imposed no-fly zone that instead targets the warplanes in the sky

The right wing propaganda for a more vigorous imperialist aggression to put a 
subservient regime in place in Damascus does of course lie about the so called 
"no fly zone". 

No, a "no fly zone" does not really involve "targetting warplances in the sky", 
but heavy bombing of the ground. 

It means not only destroying airports, but first and foremost destroying all 
air defenses of the country of which the imperialist aggressor wants to take 
control of, and this needs massive bombing. 

> Oh no! Imperialist intervention!

> The irony being that the US is vigorously opposed to any no-fly zone! 

One of your leaders, Ms. Hillary Clinton, had made clear when she was the US 
foreign minister, that bombing Syria is a not so easy as assinating some people 
in Asia or Africa by teleguided killing machines -- among several reasons -- 
the Syrian government has an effective air defense. While the Ghaddafi regime 
of Libya had given up their air defense on demand of the imperialist powers for 
being accepted as a good friend of imperialism. Libya has suffered 
corresondingly. Syria on the other hand could at least avoid such terror 
bombing as Iraq, Afghanistan or Libya suffered. And Vietnam, and Laos, and 
Korea, and and and 

> and saves lives of civilians? 

The 10 year "no fly zone" war with "sanctions" against Iraq has killed 500'000 
Iraqi children. Another of your leaders, Ms. Madeleine Albright, who was US 
foreign minister back than, thought that this was worth it. 

No, imposing this so sweet sounding "no fly zone" is as murderous as any other 
imperialist aggression. It just saves some lives of the aggressor's canon 
fudder, who kill in Asia and return daily home from "work" to their family home 
in, say, Kansas. 

As a side note, there is another big error in the post by Mr. Karadjis:

> So you want to oppose imperialist intervention - good, so when do you 
> think it began? As myself, Louis, Clay and others have shown 
> [...] in 2012. 

 Far off the mark. The imperialist intervention began in at least 1914. 

 And has never stopped since. 


Cheers, 
Lüko Willms

  
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Re: [Marxism] Misleading propaganda about "no fly zone"

[Louis Proyect via Marxism]

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On 9/6/15 9:26 AM, Lüko Willms via Marxism wrote:

  Far off the mark. The imperialist intervention began in at least 1914.

  And has never stopped since.


Except that Syria is not Iraq. The "anti-imperialist" left insists on 
seeing Syria as if Obama were George W. Bush but a better analogy would 
be with Chechnya, a country that was an experiment for the sort of 
scorched earth tactics now being employed in Syria against "takfiri". 
Just do a Google/Image search of "Grozny" followed by one of "Aleppo" 
and you'll see what I mean.


Grozny: 
http://cdn.c.photoshelter.com/img-get/Ivtgu2AgbWlw/s/900/russia-chechnya-grozny-war-ru102563.jpg


Aleppo: http://theloquitur.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Syria1.jpg
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