[meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

[Tommy via Meteorite-list]

http://bit.ly/1SRLDK1

Regards!

Tom

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[meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[Tommy via Meteorite-list]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-15/lake-eyre-meteorite-'crown-property'/7091562

Regards!

Tom
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Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

[Gmail via Meteorite-list]

There is no conspiracy except the one you have created to bring some misguided 
legitimacy to your story and your rocks.

You also do an immense disservice to our dedicated scientist and 
meteoriticists. They have no malicious intent to prejudicially reject your 
rocks. Their motive is furthering science not protecting the financial 
interests of dealers and collectors. You are accusing the same group of 
scientists who in recent years identified new Martian meteorites like Black 
Beauty. My point is that a new and exciting discovery would not be suppressed 
because it would benefit the scientist personally and the community at large.

If you actually looked at market trends, you would soon discover that prices 
for Martian Shergottites are falling because of an oversupply. Once you get 
past the 1 or 2kg the scientific community would EVER need, the rest would only 
be of concern for the collector community and the price would be set by any 
number of factors such as but not limited to supply. 

Finally, I am offended that you refer to Tikkun Olam (repairing or doing good 
for the benefit of the world). You are doing quite the opposite and what is 
worse doing so for ego and personal benefit. When Yom Kippur comes, I can only 
hope that you will be honest with yourself, atone for lashon hara (derogatory 
speech) and move on.

Respectfully,

Mendy Ouzillou

On Jan 15, 2016, at 1:59 AM, Ann Cain via Meteorite-list 
 wrote:


Meteorite List,


Recall: 
Both my sister Ann Cain (who opened the email account) and I, Glyn Howard, use 
the same email account:

Ann Cain, Glyn Howard
gfndit(at)hotmail.com



This has been a long time coming ... for many years now I have been a reader of 
the Meteorite List.

I know this discovery sounds Wow! Unbelievable. Surreal. Pick your adjective. 
But it is what is is. All the physical empirical evidences prove it. I'm not in 
fear of re-confirmation. I welcome it. I know what it is. It's all repeatable 
(empirical). 

I appreciate well-known PhD members from the Meteorite List who have contacted 
me off-line. I will respond. Please give me time.


The evidence for the typical Mars meteorite key type specimens for this 
discovery:

GSA and GSB

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidence.html

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSA.html

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSB.html


The Gallery of US World Record Mars Meteorite specimens:

http://gfoundit-mars.com/GalleryOfImages.html


I will be putting-up/finishing the gallery of World Record Mars meteorite 
specimens by this Passover.



I do not want to hurt anyone's professional reputation. I'm not a mean or 
vengeful person. The full complete back story and certain people's identities 
will remain private. Just know there is a private history in the background of 
this incredible discovery and full story. Several very well known PhDs at 
Universities in the meteoritics community, who are meteorite analysts, members 
of the Meteoritcal Society, and perhaps at times over the years have even 
posted here on the Meteorite List, have held some of these specimens in their 
hands, have done tests. They know. I knew they were meteorites before I came to 
them. I knew that they were achondrites. However, at the time I couldn't prove 
the parent body. I didn't know how.

The moment I wasn't willing to share or reveal the discovery site is the moment 
the road-blocks, the walls, the disinformation began toward me. (Extrusive 
igneous Dacite, an evolved lava, is not a sedimentary rock! Lol.) We've seen 
this kind of behavior in the meteoritcs community before. It's nothing new, 
sadly. This is a dark history of the meteoritics world unfortunately. How many 
very rare important discoveries have been lost to the world of science and to 
mankind because those in research and academia  have played unethical games of 
gate-keeping and have refused to just do their job and just do pure science and 
do the analysis honestly and ethically without games, without gate-keeping, 
without attempting to wrestle from the discoverer the original discovery site? 
The discoverer has a right to withhold the discovery site to guard their 
discovery and its full value, and to protect it. How many people over the many 
years couldn't persevere against this wall, this unethical gate-kee
 ping because they didn't have the prerequisite  skills or knowledge and they 
weren't able to realize that they were lied to or purposefully fed 
disinformation, and as a result had to walk away and give up, with an 
incredible treasure of scientific knowledge and wealth in their hand? It could 
of been very different. It could have been a very cooperative process of 
discovery for everyone.

The original discoverer has rights. I've said it before , and I'll keep saying 
it ... 

It takes discoverers to make scientific discoveries. Doing science and making 
scientific discoveries is not a crime. There is a right to protect discoveries 
and 

Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

[Count Deiro via Meteorite-list]

Mendy and All,

I have a queasy feeling in the pit of my stomach. My nose is twitching and I 
smell an unpleasant odor. Like I'm standing near an outhouse in Colorado.

Count Deiro
IMCA 3536 MetSoc 


 Message-
>From: Gmail via Meteorite-list 
>Sent: Jan 15, 2016 5:26 AM
>To: Ann Cain , Met-List 
>
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery
>
>There is no conspiracy except the one you have created to bring some misguided 
>legitimacy to your story and your rocks.
>
>You also do an immense disservice to our dedicated scientist and 
>meteoriticists. They have no malicious intent to prejudicially reject your 
>rocks. Their motive is furthering science not protecting the financial 
>interests of dealers and collectors. You are accusing the same group of 
>scientists who in recent years identified new Martian meteorites like Black 
>Beauty. My point is that a new and exciting discovery would not be suppressed 
>because it would benefit the scientist personally and the community at large.
>
>If you actually looked at market trends, you would soon discover that prices 
>for Martian Shergottites are falling because of an oversupply. Once you get 
>past the 1 or 2kg the scientific community would EVER need, the rest would 
>only be of concern for the collector community and the price would be set by 
>any number of factors such as but not limited to supply. 
>
>Finally, I am offended that you refer to Tikkun Olam (repairing or doing good 
>for the benefit of the world). You are doing quite the opposite and what is 
>worse doing so for ego and personal benefit. When Yom Kippur comes, I can only 
>hope that you will be honest with yourself, atone for lashon hara (derogatory 
>speech) and move on.
>
>Respectfully,
>
>Mendy Ouzillou
>
>On Jan 15, 2016, at 1:59 AM, Ann Cain via Meteorite-list 
> wrote:
>
>
>Meteorite List,
>
>
>Recall: 
>Both my sister Ann Cain (who opened the email account) and I, Glyn Howard, use 
>the same email account:
>
>Ann Cain, Glyn Howard
>gfndit(at)hotmail.com
>
>
>
>This has been a long time coming ... for many years now I have been a reader 
>of the Meteorite List.
>
>I know this discovery sounds Wow! Unbelievable. Surreal. Pick your adjective. 
>But it is what is is. All the physical empirical evidences prove it. I'm not 
>in fear of re-confirmation. I welcome it. I know what it is. It's all 
>repeatable (empirical). 
>
>I appreciate well-known PhD members from the Meteorite List who have contacted 
>me off-line. I will respond. Please give me time.
>
>
>The evidence for the typical Mars meteorite key type specimens for this 
>discovery:
>
>GSA and GSB
>
>http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidence.html
>
>http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSA.html
>
>http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSB.html
>
>
>The Gallery of US World Record Mars Meteorite specimens:
>
>http://gfoundit-mars.com/GalleryOfImages.html
>
>
>I will be putting-up/finishing the gallery of World Record Mars meteorite 
>specimens by this Passover.
>
>
>
>I do not want to hurt anyone's professional reputation. I'm not a mean or 
>vengeful person. The full complete back story and certain people's identities 
>will remain private. Just know there is a private history in the background of 
>this incredible discovery and full story. Several very well known PhDs at 
>Universities in the meteoritics community, who are meteorite analysts, members 
>of the Meteoritcal Society, and perhaps at times over the years have even 
>posted here on the Meteorite List, have held some of these specimens in their 
>hands, have done tests. They know. I knew they were meteorites before I came 
>to them. I knew that they were achondrites. However, at the time I couldn't 
>prove the parent body. I didn't know how.
>
>The moment I wasn't willing to share or reveal the discovery site is the 
>moment the road-blocks, the walls, the disinformation began toward me. 
>(Extrusive igneous Dacite, an evolved lava, is not a sedimentary rock! Lol.) 
>We've seen this kind of behavior in the meteoritcs community before. It's 
>nothing new, sadly. This is a dark history of the meteoritics world 
>unfortunately. How many very rare important discoveries have been lost to the 
>world of science and to mankind because those in research and academia  have 
>played unethical games of gate-keeping and have refused to just do their job 
>and just do pure science and do the analysis honestly and ethically without 
>games, without gate-keeping, without attempting to wrestle from the discoverer 
>the original discovery site? The discoverer has a right to withhold the 
>discovery site to guard their discovery and its full value, and to protect it. 
>How many people over the many years couldn't persevere against this wall, this 
>unethical gate-ke
 e
> ping because they didn't have the prerequisite  skills or 

Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[Robert Verish via Meteorite-list]

Hey Galactic Stone, why don't you tell us how you REALLY feel?  ;-)
Did this line in that article hit you too close to home:

"Professor Bland said he suspects there are amateur astronomers who are 
frustrated by legislation requiring them to hand back their discoveries from 
outer space."

I find the phrase "hand back" interesting.  If you accept that this meteorite 
was "stolen from the Queen", then 
the only legal recourse for Professor Bland is for him to take that meteorite 
back out to the Queen's Outback and 
shove it back into that muddy hole from which it was purloined.  If you want it 
so bad, you know where it is?  

I think this would be a great opportunity for a group discussion comparing the 
Queen's "policies" relating to how 
meteorite finds are handled in Australia vs. Canada vs. England vs. U.S. public 
lands. 
Personally, I vote that the U.S. adopt the "policy" version that the Canadian's 
enforce.  It's proven that it works! 

Galactic Stone is right.  It's time to refute the insane rhetoric that a 
recently fallen meteorite is an "artifact".  Insanity! 
   


On Fri, 1/15/16, Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list 
 wrote:

 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', 
researchers required to hand findings over
 To: "Tommy" 
 Cc: "Meteorite List" 
 Date: Friday, January 15, 2016, 7:50 AM
 
 More hogwash.  The inbox is full of it this morning.
 
 "Scientific value" - "sitting on the mantlepiece" - "black market"
 
 This kind of piece belongs in the National Enquirer.
 
 Dr. Grguric should get together and drink kool-aid with Lindfors
 and
 the new World Record Martian Loon. 
 They all have the same level of intelligence apparently.
 
 
 
 On 1/15/16, Tommy via
 Meteorite-list
 
 wrote:
 > http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-15/lake-eyre-meteorite-'crown-property'/7091562
 >
 > Regards!
 >
 > Tom
 >
 __
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Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

[Peter Davidson via Meteorite-list]

Dear Tommy and All

I will be interested to see the reaction of listees to this article. A few 
years ago I posted a small "flyer" for the work of an artist who had taken a 
piece of Campo, made a mould of it, melted the meteorite then cast it in the 
mould she had made earlier and put it on display in an exhibition of her work. 
This piece of news generated a great deal of, mainly negative, comment on the 
list. Can someone point out to me how this use of a meteorite, to make a 
weapon, is different (for better or worse) to the artwork my friend created?

Cheers

Peter Davidson
Senior Curator of Mineralogy

Natural Sciences Department
National Museums Collection Centre
242 West Granton Road
Edinburgh
EH5 1JA
TEL: 0131 247 4283
E-mail: p.david...@nms.ac.uk

-Original Message-
From: Meteorite-list [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On 
Behalf Of Tommy via Meteorite-list
Sent: 15 January 2016 13:16
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million


http://bit.ly/1SRLDK1

Regards!

Tom

__

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Join us for BUILD IT! Adventures with LEGO(R) Bricks. A free display and family 
activities from 29 January–17 April 2016. www.nms.ac.uk/buildit 
(http://www.nms.ac.uk/buildit)

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This communication is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the 
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Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

[Michael Farmer via Meteorite-list]

Someone boot this spammer, we don't need any more Steve Curry scammers around. 
This reads like it was written in an insane asylum. 

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 15, 2016, at 12:59 AM, Ann Cain via Meteorite-list 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> Meteorite List,
> 
> 
> Recall: 
> Both my sister Ann Cain (who opened the email account) and I, Glyn Howard, 
> use the same email account:
> 
> Ann Cain, Glyn Howard
> gfndit(at)hotmail.com
> 
> 
> 
> This has been a long time coming ... for many years now I have been a reader 
> of the Meteorite List.
> 
> I know this discovery sounds Wow! Unbelievable. Surreal. Pick your adjective. 
> But it is what is is. All the physical empirical evidences prove it. I'm not 
> in fear of re-confirmation. I welcome it. I know what it is. It's all 
> repeatable (empirical). 
> 
> I appreciate well-known PhD members from the Meteorite List who have 
> contacted me off-line. I will respond. Please give me time.
> 
> 
> The evidence for the typical Mars meteorite key type specimens for this 
> discovery:
> 
> GSA and GSB
> 
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidence.html
> 
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSA.html
> 
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSB.html
> 
> 
> The Gallery of US World Record Mars Meteorite specimens:
> 
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/GalleryOfImages.html
> 
> 
> I will be putting-up/finishing the gallery of World Record Mars meteorite 
> specimens by this Passover.
> 
> 
> 
> I do not want to hurt anyone's professional reputation. I'm not a mean or 
> vengeful person. The full complete back story and certain people's identities 
> will remain private. Just know there is a private history in the background 
> of this incredible discovery and full story. Several very well known PhDs at 
> Universities in the meteoritics community, who are meteorite analysts, 
> members of the Meteoritcal Society, and perhaps at times over the years have 
> even posted here on the Meteorite List, have held some of these specimens in 
> their hands, have done tests. They know. I knew they were meteorites before I 
> came to them. I knew that they were achondrites. However, at the time I 
> couldn't prove the parent body. I didn't know how.
> 
> The moment I wasn't willing to share or reveal the discovery site is the 
> moment the road-blocks, the walls, the disinformation began toward me. 
> (Extrusive igneous Dacite, an evolved lava, is not a sedimentary rock! Lol.) 
> We've seen this kind of behavior in the meteoritcs community before. It's 
> nothing new, sadly. This is a dark history of the meteoritics world 
> unfortunately. How many very rare important discoveries have been lost to the 
> world of science and to mankind because those in research and academia  have 
> played unethical games of gate-keeping and have refused to just do their job 
> and just do pure science and do the analysis honestly and ethically without 
> games, without gate-keeping, without attempting to wrestle from the 
> discoverer the original discovery site? The discoverer has a right to 
> withhold the discovery site to guard their discovery and its full value, and 
> to protect it. How many people over the many years couldn't persevere against 
> this wall, this unethical gate-k
 eeping because they didn't have the prerequisite  skills or knowledge and they 
weren't able to realize that they were lied to or purposefully fed 
disinformation, and as a result had to walk away and give up, with an 
incredible treasure of scientific knowledge and wealth in their hand? It could 
of been very different. It could have been a very cooperative process of 
discovery for everyone.
> 
> The original discoverer has rights. I've said it before , and I'll keep 
> saying it ... 
> 
> It takes discoverers to make scientific discoveries. Doing science and making 
> scientific discoveries is not a crime. There is a right to protect 
> discoveries and intellectual property. 
> 
> 
> "Contrary to their public image, scientists are normal, flawed human beings. 
> They are as capable of prejudice, covetousness, pride, deceitfulness, etc., 
> as anyone."
> -- David Weatherall, "Conduct Unbecoming," American Scientist (Vol.93, 
> January-February 2005), p.73
> http://www.americanscientist.org/bookshelf/pub/conduct-unbecoming
> 
> 
> As it turns out I'm rather glad it happened the way it did. Nothing like 
> purposeful road-blocks, gate-keeping, and disinformation thrown at me to 
> motivate me to learn to how to do it myself. As the old adage goes, if you 
> want something done right you have to  do it yourself. The Earth Sciences are 
> my background. I have the prerequisite skills. It took time but I did it. I'm 
> still learning. I never stop learning. I didn't do it in a vacuum. I had much 
> help and assistance along the way, from very good, professional scientists 
> and technicians who were very ethical and very knowledgeable and very 
> helpful, and then they did their assigned jobs very 

Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list]

This is absolute hogwash.

I have no background in academia, no academic credentials, and before
meteorites, I cut trees for a living.

I did not know anyone, I did not know the rules, I was a total
newcomer back in 2007.

I was embraced with open arms, despite the fact that I came across as
abrasive and cocky.

Multiple scientists have been very nice and accommodating to me.  They
have looked at some of my specimens that I submitted, and one of them
was classified as an LL3.6 - at no cost to me other than postage.

There are no conspiracies to keep newcomers out or to silence their
discoveries.  If that was true, then I wouldn't be here right now.

Shut your foolish mouth before and take this load of tin-foil-hat
conspiracy shit to Alex Jones - where bullshit is appreciated and
spread widely.

Or, get together with Goran Lindfors and Steve Curry and have a circle
jerk - you are wasting your time here.

Yes, I know, I just went on your conspiracy list.  I am a lizard man
from the Pleiades and I eat babies in the name of Satan.



On 1/15/16, Ann Cain via Meteorite-list
 wrote:
>
> Meteorite List,
>
>
> Recall:
> Both my sister Ann Cain (who opened the email account) and I, Glyn Howard,
> use the same email account:
>
> Ann Cain, Glyn Howard
> gfndit(at)hotmail.com
>
>
>
> This has been a long time coming ... for many years now I have been a reader
> of the Meteorite List.
>
> I know this discovery sounds Wow! Unbelievable. Surreal. Pick your
> adjective. But it is what is is. All the physical empirical evidences prove
> it. I'm not in fear of re-confirmation. I welcome it. I know what it is.
> It's all repeatable (empirical).
>
> I appreciate well-known PhD members from the Meteorite List who have
> contacted me off-line. I will respond. Please give me time.
>
>
> The evidence for the typical Mars meteorite key type specimens for this
> discovery:
>
> GSA and GSB
>
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidence.html
>
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSA.html
>
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSB.html
>
>
> The Gallery of US World Record Mars Meteorite specimens:
>
> http://gfoundit-mars.com/GalleryOfImages.html
>
>
> I will be putting-up/finishing the gallery of World Record Mars meteorite
> specimens by this Passover.
>
>
>
> I do not want to hurt anyone's professional reputation. I'm not a mean or
> vengeful person. The full complete back story and certain people's
> identities will remain private. Just know there is a private history in the
> background of this incredible discovery and full story. Several very well
> known PhDs at Universities in the meteoritics community, who are meteorite
> analysts, members of the Meteoritcal Society, and perhaps at times over the
> years have even posted here on the Meteorite List, have held some of these
> specimens in their hands, have done tests. They know. I knew they were
> meteorites before I came to them. I knew that they were achondrites.
> However, at the time I couldn't prove the parent body. I didn't know how.
>
> The moment I wasn't willing to share or reveal the discovery site is the
> moment the road-blocks, the walls, the disinformation began toward me.
> (Extrusive igneous Dacite, an evolved lava, is not a sedimentary rock! Lol.)
> We've seen this kind of behavior in the meteoritcs community before. It's
> nothing new, sadly. This is a dark history of the meteoritics world
> unfortunately. How many very rare important discoveries have been lost to
> the world of science and to mankind because those in research and academia
> have played unethical games of gate-keeping and have refused to just do
> their job and just do pure science and do the analysis honestly and
> ethically without games, without gate-keeping, without attempting to wrestle
> from the discoverer the original discovery site? The discoverer has a right
> to withhold the discovery site to guard their discovery and its full value,
> and to protect it. How many people over the many years couldn't persevere
> against this wall, this unethical gate-keeping because they didn't have the
> prerequisite  skills or knowledge and they weren't able to realize that they
> were lied to or purposefully fed disinformation, and as a result had to walk
> away and give up, with an incredible treasure of scientific knowledge and
> wealth in their hand? It could of been very different. It could have been a
> very cooperative process of discovery for everyone.
>
> The original discoverer has rights. I've said it before , and I'll keep
> saying it ...
>
> It takes discoverers to make scientific discoveries. Doing science and
> making scientific discoveries is not a crime. There is a right to protect
> discoveries and intellectual property.
>
>
> "Contrary to their public image, scientists are normal, flawed human beings.
> They are as capable of prejudice, covetousness, pride, deceitfulness, etc.,
> as anyone."
> -- David Weatherall, "Conduct Unbecoming," American 

Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list]

More hogwash.  The inbox is full of it this morning.

"Scientific value" - "sitting on the mantlepiece" - "black market"

This kind of piece belongs in the National Enquirer.

Dr. Grguric should get together and drink kool-aid with Lindfors and
the new World Record Martian Loon.  They all have the same level of
intelligence apparently.



On 1/15/16, Tommy via Meteorite-list
 wrote:
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-15/lake-eyre-meteorite-'crown-property'/7091562
>
> Regards!
>
> Tom
> __
>
> Visit our Facebook page https://www.facebook.com/meteoritecentral and the
> Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> https://pairlist3.pair.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>


-- 
-
Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com
Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
Pinterest - http://pinterest.com/galacticstone
-
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Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[Raremeteorites via Meteorite-list]

The only difference between the U.S. and Australia's restrictive meteorite 
laws is that meteorites belong to the Crown in one country and the federal 
and now state governments in another.  It will not be long before finds on 
private land here in the U.S. are affected.   Public lands are being put off 
limits at an alarming rate.  The more press, the more interest there is in 
overregulated every aspect of our lives.  The old timer, treasure hunters 
had it correct about keeping your mouth shut about such things.  Shameless 
self-promotion of a few will only lead to more restrictions for everybody 
else.


Adam




- Original Message - 
From: "Tommy via Meteorite-list" 

To: 
Sent: Friday, January 15, 2016 5:12 AM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers 
required to hand findings over




http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-15/lake-eyre-meteorite-'crown-property'/7091562

Regards!

Tom
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Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[Raremeteorites via Meteorite-list]

I think there should be no regulations whatsoever on meteorite recoveries 
from public land.  The old system of 20% or 20 grams has worked fine for 
decades and it is not a law.  Australia used to be the number one producer 
of meteorites during the 80's.  Now look where they are.


The U.S. government was required by our forefathers to issue land patents to 
mining claims for over a century.  They no longer honor this use of public 
land and have not issued patents since the 1990s.  Now meteorite recoveries 
are being regulated too.  They are even placing restrictions on private land 
owners when it comes to recovering gold and other minerals.  It will not be 
long that meteorites "fall" into this bureaucratic trap.I am only 
allowed to use 1,800 gallons of water a day to process gold or else to go to 
the dry wash system that prospectors hate and are only allowed to use on 
public claims in the area.  As a private land owner, I am not even allowed 
to use pond water to process gold without a class B permit and file water 
use reports even though this water would simply evaporate.  I will be forced 
to use a recirculation type system limiting gold production to less than 20 
ounces a day unless I am fortunate enough to find some big nuggets with a 
Minelab metal detector like some old timers are using these days.  The only 
thing that makes it worth while is that my property is located in the middle 
of the hottest placer nugget producing area in the state, just meters away 
from the famous Poker Brown gold mine.  Placer nuggets weighing several 
pounds have been found nearby and were only discovered since the 1980s. 
These large nuggets are rarely reported since it could result in more 
restrictions.  A straw buyer for the Chinese wants to survey my property. 
They claimed my property is not fenced therefore they can take samples due 
to open range laws.  I told them to stay the hell off my property.   I have 
some old-timers keeping any eye out to make sure somebody doesn't mistake my 
property for public land which is all claimed up in the area.   I may have 
to install an electric fence since the government is doing nothing to 
protect private landowners rights.  They are too busy wasting time 
regulating public lands.


Good luck hunting while you still can,





- Original Message - 
From: "Robert Verish via Meteorite-list" 


To: "Galactic Stone & Ironworks" 
Cc: "Meteorite List" 
Sent: Friday, January 15, 2016 9:36 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', 
researchers required to hand findings over




Hey Galactic Stone, why don't you tell us how you REALLY feel? ;-)
Did this line in that article hit you too close to home:

"Professor Bland said he suspects there are amateur astronomers who are
frustrated by legislation requiring them to hand back their discoveries 
from outer space."


I find the phrase "hand back" interesting. If you accept that this 
meteorite was "stolen from the Queen", then
the only legal recourse for Professor Bland is for him to take that 
meteorite back out to the Queen's Outback and
shove it back into that muddy hole from which it was purloined. If you 
want it so bad, you know where it is?


I think this would be a great opportunity for a group discussion comparing 
the Queen's "policies" relating to how
meteorite finds are handled in Australia vs. Canada vs. England vs. U.S. 
public lands.
Personally, I vote that the U.S. adopt the "policy" version that the 
Canadian's enforce. It's proven that it works!


Galactic Stone is right. It's time to refute the insane rhetoric that a 
recently fallen meteorite is an "artifact". Insanity!




On Fri, 1/15/16, Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list 
 wrote:


Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', 
researchers required to hand findings over

To: "Tommy" 
Cc: "Meteorite List" 
Date: Friday, January 15, 2016, 7:50 AM

More hogwash. The inbox is full of it this morning.

"Scientific value" - "sitting on the mantlepiece" - "black market"

This kind of piece belongs in the National Enquirer.

Dr. Grguric should get together and drink kool-aid with Lindfors
and
the new World Record Martian Loon.
They all have the same level of intelligence apparently.



On 1/15/16, Tommy via
Meteorite-list

wrote:
> 
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-15/lake-eyre-meteorite-'crown-property'/7091562
>
> Regards!
>
> Tom
>
__
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Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list]

Hi Bob and List,

Bingo!  (or should I say, Bingol!) - Look, I have the utmost respect
for meteorite hunters who go out into the field under harsh conditions
(at best) and recover these space treasures. Whether they work for
ANSMET, the Crown, or the Meteorite List - it takes determination,
money, knowledge, and skill to hunt for meteorites. Governments rarely
have those attributes, and that is why the vast majority of meteorites
would rot away in the field unrecovered, if not for private hunters.
And, we all know that many private hunters are very generous with
their finds and donate large amounts of material to science - beyond
the 20/20 classification requirement.

But, take a look at the numbers in the Bulletin. How many important
finds have come out of Australia since their stranglehold laws
starting being enforced?  The numbers have plummeted.  Look at how
many scientifically-important finds have come out of Morocco!  Those
weren't found by ANSMET, the Crown, or the Moroccan government.

Dr. Grguric is apparently another example of academic elitism. He
looks down his nose at the great unwashed Men of No Letters. In his
world, every weathered H5 chondrite should be the exclusive property
of a museum or institution. He fails to see the difference between
those meteorites that have been almost exhausted of scientific value,
and truly important finds like Black Beauty, ungrouped, and anomalous
meteorites. Such attitudes are self-defeating and myopic to the
extreme.

One cannot blame the media for garbage like this. Your average
"journalist" nowadays is an intern working for free while trying to
finish their communications degree. When a Man of Letters gives them a
juicy (click-bait) soundbite, they make no attempt to fact-check it or
seek the other point of view. They just print whatever falls out of
the source's mouth, and if they don't get that soundbite, they will
invent one by twisting the quote out of context.  The real problem is
intellectual snobbery. Maybe the good doctor has some letters behind
his name, but my dog has more common sense.

Best regards and Happy Huntings,

MikeG


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-




On 1/15/16, Robert Verish  wrote:
> Hey Galactic Stone, why don't you tell us how you REALLY feel?  ;-)
> Did this line in that article hit you too close to home:
>
> "Professor Bland said he suspects there are amateur astronomers who are
> frustrated by legislation requiring them to hand back their discoveries from
> outer space."
>
> I find the phrase "hand back" interesting.  If you accept that this
> meteorite was "stolen from the Queen", then
> the only legal recourse for Professor Bland is for him to take that
> meteorite back out to the Queen's Outback and
> shove it back into that muddy hole from which it was purloined.  If you want
> it so bad, you know where it is?
>
> I think this would be a great opportunity for a group discussion comparing
> the Queen's "policies" relating to how
> meteorite finds are handled in Australia vs. Canada vs. England vs. U.S.
> public lands.
> Personally, I vote that the U.S. adopt the "policy" version that the
> Canadian's enforce.  It's proven that it works!
>
> Galactic Stone is right.  It's time to refute the insane rhetoric that a
> recently fallen meteorite is an "artifact".  Insanity!
>
>
> 
> On Fri, 1/15/16, Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list
>  wrote:
>
>  Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property',
> researchers required to hand findings over
>  To: "Tommy" 
>  Cc: "Meteorite List" 
>  Date: Friday, January 15, 2016, 7:50 AM
>
>  More hogwash.  The inbox is full of it this morning.
>
>  "Scientific value" - "sitting on the mantlepiece" - "black market"
>
>  This kind of piece belongs in the National Enquirer.
>
>  Dr. Grguric should get together and drink kool-aid with Lindfors
>  and
>  the new World Record Martian Loon.
>  They all have the same level of intelligence apparently.
>
>
>
>  On 1/15/16, Tommy via
>  Meteorite-list
>  
>  wrote:
>  >
> http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-01-15/lake-eyre-meteorite-'crown-property'/7091562
>  >
>  > Regards!
>  >
>  > Tom
>  >
>  __
>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

[Anne Black via Meteorite-list]

Hello Peter,

Since you asked

I am sorry if I upset your friend or yourself, but destroying a meteorite just 
so you can redo it was simply idiotic. Why break something just so you can glue 
it back together? and losing in the process the Widmanstatten pattern, the very 
identity of the meteorite that simply cannot be re-created. 
As for this latest idea... Using a meteorite that came down in peace, that 
helped early men learn the value of iron, and then turn it into a gun, this 
might be the ultimate insult.

See you soon in Tucson. 

Anne M. Black
www.IMPACTIKA.com
impact...@aol.com


-Original Message-
From: Peter Davidson via Meteorite-list 
To: 'Tommy' ; Meteorite List 
(meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com) 
Sent: Fri, Jan 15, 2016 8:40 am
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

Dear Tommy and All

I will be interested to see the reaction of listees to this article. A few 
years ago I posted a small "flyer" for the work of an artist who had taken a 
piece of Campo, made a mould of it, melted the meteorite then cast it in the 
mould she had made earlier and put it on display in an exhibition of her work. 
This piece of news generated a great deal of, mainly negative, comment on the 
list. Can someone point out to me how this use of a meteorite, to make a 
weapon, is different (for better or worse) to the artwork my friend created?

Cheers

Peter Davidson
Senior Curator of Mineralogy

Natural Sciences Department
National Museums Collection Centre
242 West Granton Road
Edinburgh
EH5 1JA
TEL: 0131 247 4283
E-mail: p.david...@nms.ac.uk

-Original Message-
From: Meteorite-list [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On 
Behalf Of Tommy via Meteorite-list
Sent: 15 January 2016 13:16
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million


http://bit.ly/1SRLDK1

Regards!

Tom

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This communication is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the 
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statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the author and 
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Act 2002. No liability is accepted for any harm that may be caused to your 
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[meteorite-list] New Details on Ceres Seen in Dawn Images

[Ron Baalke via Meteorite-list]

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?feature=4817

New Details on Ceres Seen in Dawn Images
Jet Propulsion Laboratory
January 12, 2016

Features on dwarf planet Ceres that piqued the interest of scientists 
throughout 2015 stand out in exquisite detail in the latest images from 
NASA's Dawn spacecraft, which recently reached its lowest-ever altitude 
at Ceres.

Dawn took these images near its current altitude of 240 miles (385 kilometers) 
from Ceres, between Dec. 19 and 23, 2015.

Kupalo Crater, one of the youngest craters on Ceres, shows off many fascinating 
attributes at the high image resolution of 120 feet (35 meters) per pixel. 
The crater has bright material exposed on its rim, which could be salts, 
and its flat floor likely formed from impact melt and debris. Researchers 
will be looking closely at whether this material is related to the "bright 
spots" of Occator Crater. Kupalo, which measures 16 miles (26 kilometers) 
across and is located at southern mid-latitudes, is named for the Slavic 
god of vegetation and harvest.

"This crater and its recently-formed deposits will be a prime target of 
study for the team as Dawn continues to explore Ceres in its final mapping 
phase," said Paul Schenk, a Dawn science team member at the Lunar and 
Planetary Institute, Houston.

Dawn's low vantage point also captured the dense network of fractures 
on the floor of 78-mile-wide (126-kilometer-wide) Dantu Crater. One of 
the youngest large craters on Earth's moon, called Tycho, has similar 
fractures. This cracking may have resulted from the cooling of impact 
melt, or when the crater floor was uplifted after the crater formed.

A 20-mile (32-kilometer) crater west of Dantu is covered in steep slopes, 
called scarps, and ridges. These features likely formed when the crater 
partly collapsed during the formation process. The curvilinear nature 
of the scarps resembles those on the floor of Rheasilvia, the giant impact 
crater on protoplanet Vesta, which Dawn orbited from 2011 to 2012.

Dawn's other instruments also began studying Ceres intensively in mid-December. 
The visible and infrared mapping spectrometer is examining how various 
wavelengths of light are reflected by Ceres, which will help identify 
minerals present on its surface.

Dawn's gamma ray and neutron detector (GRaND) is also keeping scientists 
busy. Data from GRaND help researchers understand the abundances of elements 
in Ceres' surface, along with details of the dwarf planet's composition 
that hold important clues about how it evolved.

The spacecraft will remain at its current altitude for the rest of its 
mission, and indefinitely afterward. The end of the prime mission will 
be June 30, 2016.

"When we set sail for Ceres upon completing our Vesta exploration, we 
expected to be surprised by what we found on our next stop. Ceres did 
not disappoint," said Chris Russell, principal investigator for the Dawn 
mission, based at the University of California, Los Angeles. "Everywhere 
we look in these new low- altitude observations, we see amazing landforms 
that speak to the unique character of this most amazing world."

Dawn is the first mission to visit a dwarf planet, and the first mission 
outside the Earth-moon system to orbit two distinct solar system targets. 
After orbiting Vesta for 14 months in 2011 and 2012, it arrived at Ceres 
on March 6, 2015.

Dawn's mission is managed by the Jet Propulsion Laboratory for NASA's 
Science Mission Directorate in Washington. Dawn is a project of the 
directorate's 
Discovery Program, managed by NASA's Marshall Space Flight Center in 
Huntsville, 
Alabama. UCLA is responsible for overall Dawn mission science. Orbital 
ATK Inc., in Dulles, Virginia, designed and built the spacecraft. The 
German Aerospace Center, Max Planck Institute for Solar System Research, 
Italian Space Agency and Italian National Astrophysical Institute are 
international partners on the mission team. For a complete list of mission 
participants, visit:

http://dawn.jpl.nasa.gov/mission

More information about Dawn is available at the following sites:

http://dawn.jpl.nasa.gov

http://www.nasa.gov/dawn


Media Contact

Elizabeth Landau
Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif.
818-354-6425
elizabeth.lan...@jpl.nasa.gov 

2016-008

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Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list]

Hi List,

I have to agree with Anne on this one. It's sad to see a beautiful
regmaglypted Gibeon sliced down, smelted, and turned into a tool.  I'd
feel the same way if the tool was a wrench or a gun.

Besides, meteoritic iron is not homogeneous and may fracture under
pressure.  It is a poor choice for making gun parts.  This is a
gimmick and nothing more. I own guns, I am knowledgeable about guns,
and I would touch this gun with a ten-foot pole, even if I had a
million dollars. It's a bomb waiting to explode in the shooter's hand.

Best regards,

MikeG



On 1/15/16, Anne Black via Meteorite-list
 wrote:
> Hello Peter,
>
> Since you asked
>
> I am sorry if I upset your friend or yourself, but destroying a meteorite
> just so you can redo it was simply idiotic. Why break something just so you
> can glue it back together? and losing in the process the Widmanstatten
> pattern, the very identity of the meteorite that simply cannot be
> re-created.
> As for this latest idea... Using a meteorite that came down in peace,
> that helped early men learn the value of iron, and then turn it into a gun,
> this might be the ultimate insult.
>
> See you soon in Tucson.
>
> Anne M. Black
> www.IMPACTIKA.com
> impact...@aol.com
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Peter Davidson via Meteorite-list
> 
> To: 'Tommy' ; Meteorite List
> (meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com) 
> Sent: Fri, Jan 15, 2016 8:40 am
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million
>
> Dear Tommy and All
>
> I will be interested to see the reaction of listees to this article. A few
> years ago I posted a small "flyer" for the work of an artist who had taken a
> piece of Campo, made a mould of it, melted the meteorite then cast it in the
> mould she had made earlier and put it on display in an exhibition of her
> work. This piece of news generated a great deal of, mainly negative, comment
> on the list. Can someone point out to me how this use of a meteorite, to
> make a weapon, is different (for better or worse) to the artwork my friend
> created?
>
> Cheers
>
> Peter Davidson
> Senior Curator of Mineralogy
>
> Natural Sciences Department
> National Museums Collection Centre
> 242 West Granton Road
> Edinburgh
> EH5 1JA
> TEL: 0131 247 4283
> E-mail: p.david...@nms.ac.uk
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Meteorite-list [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On
> Behalf Of Tommy via Meteorite-list
> Sent: 15 January 2016 13:16
> To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million
>
>
> http://bit.ly/1SRLDK1
>
> Regards!
>
> Tom
>
> __
>
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> Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com
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> Join us for BUILD IT! Adventures with LEGO(R) Bricks. A free display and
> family activities from 29 January�17 April 2016. www.nms.ac.uk/buildit
> (http://www.nms.ac.uk/buildit)
>
> National Museums Scotland, Scottish Charity, No. SC 011130
> This communication is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not the
> addressee please inform the sender and delete the email from your system.
> The statements and opinions expressed in this message are those of the
> author and do not necessarily reflect those of National Museums Scotland.
> This message is subject to the Data Protection Act 1998 and Freedom of
> Information (Scotland) Act 2002. No liability is accepted for any harm that
> may be caused to your systems or data by this message.
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>
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Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

[GREG LINDH via Meteorite-list]

 There is *nothing* wrong with crafting the handle of a sidearm using a 
meteorite.  There is *nothing* wrong with pistols or rifles.  Period.  It's no 
different than using meteorites to make the face of a watch.  No difference.  




From: Meteorite-list  on behalf of 
Peter Davidson via Meteorite-list 
Sent: Friday, January 15, 2016 8:40 AM
To: 'Tommy'; Meteorite List (meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com)
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

Dear Tommy and All

I will be interested to see the reaction of listees to this article. A few 
years ago I posted a small "flyer" for the work of an artist who had taken a 
piece of Campo, made a mould of it, melted the meteorite then cast it in the 
mould she had made earlier and put it on display in an exhibition of her work. 
This piece of news generated a great deal of, mainly negative, comment on the 
list. Can someone point out to me how this use of a meteorite, to make a 
weapon, is different (for better or worse) to the artwork my friend created?

Cheers

Peter Davidson
Senior Curator of Mineralogy

Natural Sciences Department
National Museums Collection Centre
242 West Granton Road
Edinburgh
EH5 1JA
TEL: 0131 247 4283
E-mail: p.david...@nms.ac.uk

-Original Message-
From: Meteorite-list [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On 
Behalf Of Tommy via Meteorite-list
Sent: 15 January 2016 13:16
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million


http://bit.ly/1SRLDK1

Regards!

Tom

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Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

[Raremeteorites via Meteorite-list]

It would be interesting if they made a Colt Peacemaker .45 pistol from a 
meteorite.  This is the gun that help keep peace in the West starting in 
1873.


http://guns.wikia.com/wiki/Colt_Peacemaker

I went to a cash land auction held by Pershing County here in Nevada and was 
concerned about security since I saw no guards or policemen on duty and the 
back door was left wide open at the community center where the auction was 
being held.  The room was filled with cowboy and rancher type investors with 
suitcases full of cash and yet nobody seemed concerned.  I inquired and the 
auctioneer stated, "If somebody was ever stupid enough to try and rob one of 
my auctions, he would have fifty bullets in his head before hitting the 
ground since most of my auction patrons are heavily armed."  I looked around 
and could see cowgirls with Ladysmith 9 mms and derringers stuffed into 
their boots and purses and men checking in on their Colt 45s laying in the 
same suitcases along with their cash.


Needless to say, I witnessed peace through strength at this auction right 
here in the Wild West.










- Original Message - 
From: "Anne Black via Meteorite-list" 
To: ; ; 


Sent: Friday, January 15, 2016 11:02 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million



Hello Peter,

Since you asked

I am sorry if I upset your friend or yourself, but destroying a meteorite 
just so you can redo it was simply idiotic. Why break something just so 
you can glue it back together? and losing in the process the Widmanstatten 
pattern, the very identity of the meteorite that simply cannot be 
re-created.
As for this latest idea... Using a meteorite that came down in peace, 
that helped early men learn the value of iron, and then turn it into a 
gun, this might be the ultimate insult.


See you soon in Tucson.

Anne M. Black
www.IMPACTIKA.com
impact...@aol.com


-Original Message-
From: Peter Davidson via Meteorite-list 

To: 'Tommy' ; Meteorite List 
(meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com) 


Sent: Fri, Jan 15, 2016 8:40 am
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million

Dear Tommy and All

I will be interested to see the reaction of listees to this article. A few 
years ago I posted a small "flyer" for the work of an artist who had taken 
a piece of Campo, made a mould of it, melted the meteorite then cast it in 
the mould she had made earlier and put it on display in an exhibition of 
her work. This piece of news generated a great deal of, mainly negative, 
comment on the list. Can someone point out to me how this use of a 
meteorite, to make a weapon, is different (for better or worse) to the 
artwork my friend created?


Cheers

Peter Davidson
Senior Curator of Mineralogy

Natural Sciences Department
National Museums Collection Centre
242 West Granton Road
Edinburgh
EH5 1JA
TEL: 0131 247 4283
E-mail: p.david...@nms.ac.uk

-Original Message-
From: Meteorite-list [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] 
On Behalf Of Tommy via Meteorite-list

Sent: 15 January 2016 13:16
To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
Subject: [meteorite-list] Guns made of meteorite: Price tag $1 million


http://bit.ly/1SRLDK1

Regards!

Tom

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This communication is intended for the addressee(s) only. If you are not 
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Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[ian macleod via Meteorite-list]

Hi List, we can bang on about laws all day (which actually vary here in 
Australia between states) and also point fingers at scientists and museum staff 
we don't know. At the end of the day the law is the law...Deal with it


There is no elitism going on, these guys are nice enough they just have to make 
a point and warning in respect to laws. 


Bob is right the Canadian model is a better system. The USA has too much 
freedom that is abused, Australia the opposite occurs


The idea meteorites are not found or reported in Australia is far from 
accurate. 


See the USA enjoys a 'few' remaining labs that processing many kilograms of 
potentially stolen property out of NWA, this has given the appearance of very 
active work, and that something new is happening..respectfully I beg to 
differ

We now have 50,000 meteorites and only 6 or so that we have orbit data for. The 
orbit ones were all found by camera networks NOT guys all over Africa


So when it comes to collecting the next find like baseball cards or wanting to 
see meteoritics evolve.I chose evolution


I constantly see deception, fraud, ridiculous pricing, items stolen out of 
countries, governments and scientists disrespected, incorrectly described 
items, dubious provenance, destroyed samples, tiny fragments, endless 
provenance hand balling etc etc


and this is coming from many IMCA and non IMCA sellers and hunters


So sorry lads Im sticking with the scientists on this one and the with few 
people in the private collecting meteorite community I trust


Ian
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[meteorite-list] NASA's Stardust Sample Return was 10 Years Ago Today

[Ron Baalke via Meteorite-list]

http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?feature=4821

NASA's Stardust Sample Return was 10 Years Ago Today
Jet Propulsion Laboratory
January 15, 2016

It was less than an hour into the new day of January 15, 2006 (EST), when 
tens of thousands of miles above our planet, two cable cutters and two 
retention bolts fired, releasing a spring which pushed a 101-pound 
(46-kilogram) 
sample return capsule away from its mother ship. Later, during its final 
plunge Earthward, the capsule would become the fastest human-made object 
to enter our atmosphere, achieving a velocity of about 28,600 mph (12.8 
kilometers per second).

Then, at 5:10 a.m. EST (3:10 a.m. MST), for the first time in seven years, 
the sample return capsule finally stopped moving. By the time it landed, 
under parachute in the desert salt flats of the U.S. Air Force's Utah 
Test and Training Range in Dugway, the capsule had travelled 2.88 billion 
miles (4.5 billion kilometers) -- a journey that carried it around the 
sun three times and as far out as halfway to Jupiter. Inside the Stardust 
mission's graphite-epoxy covered capsule was the objective of its prime 
mission -- humanity's first samples collected from a celestial body in 
deep space (beyond the Earth-moon system).

"The Stardust sample return capsule carried inside cometary material it 
gathered from comet Wild-2 during a flyby in January of 2004," said Don 
Brownlee, Stardust principal investigator from the University of Washington, 
Seattle. "The spacecraft deployed a tennis racket-like, aerogel-lined 
collector, and we flew the spacecraft within 150 miles (241 kilometers), 
capturing particles from the coma as we went."

Two days after the return, the sample return capsule's science canister 
and its cargo of comet and interstellar dust particles was stowed inside 
a special aluminum carrying case and transported to a curatorial facility 
at NASA's Johnson Space Center in Houston. Eileen Stansbery -- now Chief 
Scientist at Johnson -- worked on Stardust as the deputy director of 
Astromaterials 
Research and Exploration Science at the time. "We were investigating big 
questions with the smallest samples -- how did our solar system form? 
What are we made of? This comet is representative of one of the most primitive 
bodies in the solar system, preserving the earliest record of material 
from the nebula during the 'planetesimal' forming stage in its evolution."

Brownlee notes, "The science team couldn't wait to get their hands on 
the samples. It had been 10 years of planning and then seven more years 
for the actual mission, so everyone was raring to go."

The Stardust mission's international team of scientists -- 200 strong 
-- helped re-write the book on comets and the evolution of the solar system. 
The Stardust mission samples indicated that some comets may have included 
materials ejected from the early sun and may have formed very differently 
than scientists had theorized.

"What we found was remarkable," said Brownlee. "Instead of rocky materials 
that formed around previous generations of stars, we found that most of 
the comet's rocky matter formed inside our solar system at extremely high 
temperature. In great contrast to its ice, our comet's rocky material 
had formed under white-hot conditions."

Comet ice formed in cold regions beyond the planet Neptune, but the rocks, 
probably the bulk of any comet's mass, formed much closer to the sun in 
regions hot enough to evaporate bricks. The materials that Stardust collected 
from comet Wild-2 contain pre-solar "stardust" grains, identified on the 
basis of their unusual isotopic composition, but these grains are very 
rare.

"Even though we confirmed comets are ancient bodies with an abundance 
of ice -- some which formed a few tens of degrees above absolute zero 
at the edge of the solar system -- we now know that comets are really 
a mix of materials made by conditions of both 'fire and ice,'" said Brownlee.

While Stardust was the first deep-space sample-return mission, it was 
by no means the last. The Japanese Space Agency (JAXA's) Hayabusa mission 
collected samples from an asteroid and returned them to Earth in 2010, 
and the Hayabusa 2 mission to return material from asteroid Ryugu is currently 
underway. Still to come is NASA's OSIRIS-Rex mission. Scheduled to launch 
in September of this year, OSIRIS-REx will travel to the near-Earth asteroid 
Bennu and retrieve at least 2.1 ounces (60 grams) of surface material 
and return it to Earth for study.

"The ways to explore space are probably as big as space itself," said 
Brownlee. "But for my money, you can't beat sample return. Having samples 
there in front of you, available for laboratory analysis when you want 
-- that's tough to beat."

Another thing about Stardust that was tough to beat was the spacecraft 
itself. Launched on Feb. 7, 1999, Stardust flew past an asteroid known 
as Annefrank, flew past and collected particle samples from comet Wild-2, 
and 

[meteorite-list] Mars Rover Opportunity Update: December 16, 2015 - January 3, 2016

[Ron Baalke via Meteorite-list]

OPPORTUNITY UPDATE:  Opportunity Welcomes Winter Solstice -
sols 4229-4246, December 16, 2015-January 03, 2016

Opportunity is inside 'Marathon Valley' on the west rim of Endeavour Crater. 
The rover is positioned on steep, north-facing slopes for improved solar 
array energy production.

The winter solstice occurred on Sol 4246 (Jan. 3, 2016), although solar 
insolation already started to improve. The near-term objective is to position 
the rover to be able to grind a high-value surface target with the Rock 
Abrasion Tool (RAT). This target may hold some of the clues as to the 
origin of the clay spectral signature detected in Marathon Valley.

On Sol 4229 (Dec. 16, 2015), Opportunity bumped about 14 inches (35 
centimeters) 
to set up for an extended in-situ (contact) science campaign through the 
holiday season. Over the holiday period, Opportunity proceeded to use 
the robotic arm to collect Microscopic Imager (MI) mosaics of the surface 
targets as well as place the Alpha Particle X-ray Spectrometer (APXS) 
for surface elemental analysis. Winter power levels and late Odyssey passes 
made planning difficult with some sols being used as recharge days.

On Sol 4234 (Dec. 22, 2015), Opportunity was able to use the RAT to brush 
the surface target 'Pvt. John Potts.' This was followed with more MI mosaics 
and APXS measurements. On Sol 4244 (Jan. 1, 2016), the RAT was used again, 
this time to grind (1 millimeter) into the surface target. More MI mosaics 
and APXS elemental analysis of the ground target followed.

As of Sol 4246 (Jan. 3, 2016), the solar array energy production was 449 
watt-hours with an atmospheric opacity (Tau) of 0.414 and an improved 
solar array dust factor of 0.658.

Total odometry is 26.50 miles (42.65 kilometers), more than a marathon.

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[meteorite-list] The Tale of the Huron Meteorite Collector

[E.P. Grondine via Meteorite-list]

THE TALE OF THE HURON METEORITE COLLECTOR


To understand this story, you have to know the Huron (Wendat, Wyandot) word for 
bollides and meteorites, which are White Panther and "ya' gg'^cra'" 
respectively.

"Allen Johnson gave the following explanation as to the nature of the White 
Panther being: these beings, for there are several of them, are supposed to 
have originated in the northern polar regions and to travel in the air from 
north to south. From time to time, they alight here and there, making a kind of 
light when they come down. They are said to drop a round magical stone {ya' 
gg'^cra') when they want to break the solid ice and get into the water. 
Whenever this magical stone hits the earth, a thundering clash may be heard. In 
former days some men whose ears were keen and experienced could detect the 
presence of these panthers. 


XLII. The Ground-Squirrel and the Flying Panther. 

(Related in English by Allen Johnson, in May, 1912, at Wyandotte, Oklahoma. 
Johnson stated that he had heard this myth often recited by late James 
Armstrong,"Hariwa'kyg^de' —, Smith Nichols, and his mother. A briefer version 
of the same myth has been recorded in text, Mrs. Catherine Johnson acting as 
informant. Allen Johnson's version was recorded before that of Mrs. Johnson. 
That the monster [uki] was the Ground-squirrel was not remembered by Allen 
Johnson, but is inferred here from the explicit statement in Mrs. Catherine 
Johnson's telling of the same tale.) 

"On their way home twelve men traveled many days in the woods. They were tired. 
As they had to rest and gather provisions for the rest of the journey, their 
leader selected a place where they might pitch camp. When they returned from 
their hunt that night, each of them related his experiences as to what he had 
seen and killed while in the woods. 

One of the hunters, however, remained silent and would not say anything. The 
leader requested him to speak out and relate his adventures, as he was the only 
one left who had not spoken. So he replied that he had really found something, 
a tree that had been claw-marked, and wherein, no doubt, an animal was 
dwelling. But, to his mind, the animal was not a bear. When pressed by the 
chief to explain his thoughts, he added that, in all likelihood, it was an uki 
(Uki': it-is with "power"; that is: a being gifted with 'mana' or 'power.'), 
and that they had much better go away without disturbing it. {This tale likely 
goes back to the Pleistocene, when short faced bears and giant beaver lived. 
The uns and bullets are likely much later substitutions for iron spear points.] 

The leader held a kind of council at which it was decided to investigate the 
matter. The fellow advising them not to tease the animal having thus been 
overruled by the majority, showed the others to the spot. The tree in which the 
giant squirrel being had his abode was hollow from top to bottom. A 
neighbouring tree was felled against it, and used as a ladder to climb upon. As 
was the custom, the fellow who had first made the find was appointed to climb 
the leaning tree and look down into the hollow one. So he did, and having 
dropped something into the hole in order to drive the animal out, he gave the 
alarm, exclaiming, "Run for your lives! It isn't a bear; its eyes are fiery!" 
All the men began to run homewards. 

Coming out of his den, the monster chased them. The other man did not move from 
the tree on which he had climbed; and he heard the gun reports of each of his 
friends when they were just about to be killed by the giant squirrel. He knew 
that they were all dead when the last gun report came to his ears. 

He felt that he had better run away in the opposite direction. After having run 
for some time, he came to a steep cliff by a pool. There he saw a man standing 
upon the ledge of the rock, who told him not to be afraid. "I came here to help 
you," said he, "and I will fight the monster." He also gave him instructions 
regarding the animal that was on his trail, adding, "When you see that my body 
is covered with blood and that I am losing ground in the fight, dip some water 
[from the pool], pour it on me, and I shall thus be enabled to win the battle." 
For this purpose he gave him a bark cup. 

As the battle was about to begin, the protector of the man who had run away 
transformed himself into an animal. The man grew so intensely excited over the 
fight between his protector and the ground squirrel that although he saw the 
friendly animal dragged around by the other and almost overcome, he forgot for 
a while all about the instructions he had received. Suddenly they came back to 
his mind; and no sooner had he poured some water on his friend, than he saw him 
refreshed and regaining strength. 

When the battle was won, the man thanked his protector, who told him what he 
really was. "I am the White Panther, flying in the air like a blaze." 

And he added, "Now go home and bring the best and swiftest 

[meteorite-list] Mars Rover Opportunity Update: January 4-12, 2016

[Ron Baalke via Meteorite-list]

http://mars.nasa.gov/mer/mission/status.html#opportunity

OPPORTUNITY UPDATE:  Rover Uses Rock Abrasion Tool to Grind Rocks  -
sols 4247-4255, January 04, 2016-January 12, 2016:

Opportunity is inside 'Marathon Valley' on north-facing slopes for
improved solar array energy production.

The rover is engaged in an in-situ (contact) science campaign
investigating the surface target 'Pvt. John Potts' (informally named for
members of the Lewis and Clark expedition).

Opportunity is performing successive grinds into the target to prepare a
clean surface for elemental analysis by the Alpha Particle X-ray
Spectrometer (APXS). An initial grid by the Rock Abrasion Tool (RAT) had
been previously completed, so a survey of the grind was performed on Sol
4248 (Jan. 5, 2016), with the Microscopic Imager (MI) with an initial
analysis with the APXS. Color Pancam panoramas of various targets were
collected on Sols 4249 and 4250 (Jan. 6 and 7, 2016). On Sol 4253 (Jan.
10, 2016), a seek scan with the RAT bit was performed in setup to
another RAT grind on a subsequent sol. On Sol 4255 (Jan. 12, 2016), two
steps of a deeper grind were performed on the target. The RAT was left
in place so even deeper grinding could be performed later.

As of Sol 4255 (Jan. 12, 2016), the solar array energy production was
452 watt-hours with an atmospheric opacity (Tau) of 0.446 and an
improved solar array dust factor of 0.666.

Total odometry is 26.50 miles (42.65 kilometers), more than a marathon.
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Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

[MexicoDoug via Meteorite-list]

Why when making the discovery of meteorites in the field, why then give 
away the scientific analysis and identification process to another? Why not 
learn how to do it for yourself so that your knowledge of the science of 
meteoritics increases? Why give away that joy of this discovery process? Sure I 
understand that many can't do it or perhaps they aren't interested in the whole 
scientific process, but I am.

+++
Interesting questions if you are so inclined to do the 
mineralogy/classification and have or can develop the skills and resources to 
do it which are capable of withstanding peer review.  The angle I have to 
answer your questions...you are welcomed to claim anything you want if it is 
your rock, or for that matter someone else's rock.  The reason an independent 
party is brought in is to prevent a conflict of interests in "layperson's 
terms".

If it is a learning process for you, congratulations on your enthusiasm to 
learn more on the subject using your unknown specimen as a self-teaching aid 
and more.  Like learning to dance with what may turn out to be a broom instead 
of an authentic partner ;)

I have a concern with your self-promotion of your rock before it has met any 
formal scientific peer review, or at least publication in an accredited 
scientific journal with a responsible policy of editorial review covering 
whatever appears in their publications and bulletins.  Until this happens, your 
conclusions or interpretations are not validated and subject to a wide variety 
if biases, including but not limited to self-serving bias, confirmation bias, 
and optimism bias.

I wish you the greatest luck with your specimen and your studies, and like all 
other criticism you are likely to receive, that is a healthy part of the 
scientific process to be appreciated, which eventually will invalidate or 
support your budding studies.  Meteorite and meteor-wrong classification is 
based on the ability of a sample to be distributed to independent researchers 
with a stellar reputation in the meteoritical community for this reason.

Best of luck!



-Original Message-
From: Ann Cain via Meteorite-list 
To: meteorite-list 
Sent: Fri, Jan 15, 2016 2:59 am
Subject: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery


Meteorite List,


Recall: 
Both my sister Ann Cain (who opened the email account) and I, Glyn Howard, use 
the same email account:

Ann Cain, Glyn Howard
gfndit(at)hotmail.com



This has been a long time coming ... for many years now I have been a reader of 
the Meteorite List.

I know this discovery sounds Wow! Unbelievable. Surreal. Pick your adjective. 
But it is what is is. All the physical empirical evidences prove it. I'm not in 
fear of re-confirmation. I welcome it. I know what it is. It's all repeatable 
(empirical). 

I appreciate well-known PhD members from the Meteorite List who have contacted 
me off-line. I will respond. Please give me time.


The evidence for the typical Mars meteorite key type specimens for this 
discovery:

GSA and GSB

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidence.html

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSA.html

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSB.html


The Gallery of US World Record Mars Meteorite specimens:

http://gfoundit-mars.com/GalleryOfImages.html


I will be putting-up/finishing the gallery of World Record Mars meteorite 
specimens by this Passover.



I do not want to hurt anyone's professional reputation. I'm not a mean or 
vengeful person. The full complete back story and certain people's identities 
will remain private. Just know there is a private history in the background of 
this incredible discovery and full story. Several very well known PhDs at 
Universities in the meteoritics community, who are meteorite analysts, members 
of the Meteoritcal Society, and perhaps at times over the years have even 
posted here on the Meteorite List, have held some of these specimens in their 
hands, have done tests. They know. I knew they were meteorites before I came to 
them. I knew that they were achondrites. However, at the time I couldn't prove 
the parent body. I didn't know how.

The moment I wasn't willing to share or reveal the discovery site is the moment 
the road-blocks, the walls, the disinformation began toward me. (Extrusive 
igneous Dacite, an evolved lava, is not a sedimentary rock! Lol.) We've seen 
this kind of behavior in the meteoritcs community before. It's nothing new, 
sadly. This is a dark history of the meteoritics world unfortunately. How many 
very rare important discoveries have been lost to the world of science and to 
mankind because those in research and academia  have played unethical games of 
gate-keeping and have refused to just do their job and just do pure science and 
do the analysis honestly and ethically without games, without gate-keeping, 
without attempting to wrestle 

[meteorite-list] Mars Odyssey THEMIS Images: January 11-15, 2016

[Ron Baalke via Meteorite-list]

MARS ODYSSEY THEMIS IMAGES
January 11-15, 2016

o Rim Complexities (11 January 2016)
  http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20160111a

o Hebrus Valles (12 January 2016)
  http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20160112a

o Labeatis Fossae (13 January 2016)
  http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20160113a

o Elysium Fossae (14 January 2016)
  http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20160114a

o Hyperboreae Undae (15 January 2016)
  http://themis.asu.edu/zoom-20160115a


All of the THEMIS images are archive here:

http://themis.asu.edu/latest.html

NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory manages the 2001 Mars Odyssey mission 
for NASA's Office of Space Science, Washington, D.C. The Thermal Emission 
Imaging System (THEMIS) was developed by Arizona State University,
Tempe, in co.oration with Raytheon Santa Barbara Remote Sensing. 
The THEMIS investigation is led by Dr. Philip Christensen at Arizona State 
University. Lockheed Martin Astronautics, Denver, is the prime contractor 
for the Odyssey project, and developed and built the orbiter. Mission 
operations are conducted jointly from Lockheed Martin and from JPL, a 
division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena. 



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Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

[Ann Cain via Meteorite-list]

Met List,


I appreciate honest debate. I appreciate respect. The personal attacks need to 
stop. I will never respond in kind.

Do you all not know the Met List policies?

General List Policies (i.e. The Rules)

1. Posts need to relate in some way to meteorites.
2. Be courteous and professional at all times.
3. No Personal Attacks.

...

I have not attacked the scientific community in anyway. I'm a part of it. I'm 
just exposing that unethical behavior can happen behind the scenes at times. 
I'm talking about a few individuals only. The greater amount of scientists and 
technicians I worked with were very professional and are wonderful people to 
work with.

First I would like to respond to Elton who emailed me off-list. Elton you are 
incorrect. It is possible to have a mass impact eject/launch off of Mars to a 
diameter of approx. 22.0m, perhaps melted, but with oblique impacts they can 
launch off the surface solid. The TKW of my discovery is greater than the mass 
of Moon rocks we brought back during the all the Apollo missions, which is 
approx. 382.0kg of mass. My discovery isn't a single mass but many fragments 
from a heterogeneous igneous rock mass that was impact ejected/launched off the 
surface of Mars, or just below the surface of Mars. The largest masses of the 
fragments are larger than Zugami. It is mostly extrusive igneous rock from Mars.

See pg.337

Impact and Explosion Crater Ejecta, Fragment Size, and Velocity
http://web.gps.caltech.edu/~sue/TJA_LindhurstLabWebsite/ListPublications/Papers_pdf/Seismo_1314.pdf


You all need to educate yourself regarding a very dark historical event within 
our Meteorite community here in the USA, The Old Woman Meteorite. It is very 
true that even one of the most esteemed institutions of science in our nation 
The Smithsonian Institute can get it really really wrong. The Golden Rule is to 
treat others as you would like to be treated. Geologist Joe De Kehoe gets the 
whole story very right. I would recommend buying his book, The Silence of the 
Sun. Unfair and unjust laws are simply no law at all. It's lawlessness. There 
is a higher law of fairness and justice. You can not ignore the original 
discoverer. This World Record Mars Discovery will benefit the People. It's the 
People's National treasure. The People are to benefit.  I've said that all 
along and will continue to do so. I'm doing the right thing.

I know a greater law ...

Psalm 24:1 NLT
"A psalm of David. The earth is the LORD's, and everything in it. The world and 
all its people belong to him."


Geologist Joe De Kehoe writes the entire story:...
Chapter One, The Old Woman Meteorite, The story and the controversy that 
resulted from the discovery and removal of the second largest meteorite ever 
found in the U.S.
http://gfoundit-mars.com/owm3word.docx



Glyn Howard




From: Count Deiro 
Sent: Friday, January 15, 2016 9:59 AM
To: Gmail; Ann Cain; Met-List
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

Mendy and All,

I have a queasy feeling in the pit of my stomach. My nose is twitching and I 
smell an unpleasant odor. Like I'm standing near an outhouse in Colorado.

Count Deiro
IMCA 3536 MetSoc


 Message-
>From: Gmail via Meteorite-list 
>Sent: Jan 15, 2016 5:26 AM
>To: Ann Cain , Met-List 
>
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery
>
>There is no conspiracy except the one you have created to bring some misguided 
>legitimacy to your story and your rocks.
>
>You also do an immense disservice to our dedicated scientist and 
>meteoriticists. They have no malicious intent to prejudicially reject your 
>rocks. Their motive is furthering science not protecting the financial 
>interests of dealers and collectors. You are accusing the same group of 
>scientists who in recent years identified new Martian meteorites like Black 
>Beauty. My point is that a new and exciting discovery would not be suppressed 
>because it would benefit the scientist personally and the community at large.
>
>If you actually looked at market trends, you would soon discover that prices 
>for Martian Shergottites are falling because of an oversupply. Once you get 
>past the 1 or 2kg the scientific community would EVER need, the rest would 
>only be of concern for the collector community and the price would be set by 
>any number of factors such as but not limited to supply.
>
>Finally, I am offended that you refer to Tikkun Olam (repairing or doing good 
>for the benefit of the world). You are doing quite the opposite and what is 
>worse doing so for ego and personal benefit. When Yom Kippur comes, I can only 
>hope that you will be honest with yourself, atone for lashon hara (derogatory 
>speech) and move on.
>
>Respectfully,
>
>Mendy Ouzillou
>
>On Jan 15, 2016, at 1:59 AM, Ann 

Re: [meteorite-list] Lake Eyre meteorite 'Crown property', researchers required to hand findings over

[Galactic Stone & Ironworks via Meteorite-list]

Hi Ian and List,

Yes, we can all play keyboard king and tell the governments and the
world how we think things should be done. There will never be an ideal
world and compromises must be made to keep everyone relatively happy
(or at least content or apathetic). I agree that nobody's system is
perfect, regardless of national boundaries.

Comparing meteorites to collecting baseball cards is disingenuous.
Rock and mineral collecting is one of the oldest expressions of
geology. Amateur participation in that field has a long established
history that has benefited museums and science over the years. For
some people, meteorites are another rock to collect. For some they are
research material. For some they are national treasures. Ultimately,
who "owns" a meteorite? Do we really want some bureaucrat deciding
that? Isn't this a case where common sense (ha!) should apply?  Or,
call the lawyers and give them a pile of money to figure it out.

I do not see the kind of rampant fraud and chicanery that Ian is
talking about. Sure, any marketplace has crooks (some vendors, some
buyers) and one has to only look at other collectible markets like
autographs or Tiffany glass to see that fraud is "rampant" there was
well. It all comes down to trust. If you don't trust the vendor's
honesty and expertise, then avoid their sales pitches.

"> I constantly see deception, fraud, ridiculous pricing, items stolen out of
> countries, governments and scientists disrespected, incorrectly described
> items, dubious provenance, destroyed samples, tiny fragments, endless
> provenance hand balling etc etc"

Where are you looking exactly?  eBay?  Craigslist?  Boot sales?  You
can also buy a million types of snake oil at those same venues. It
doesn't mean it's a problem that is endemic in any given field that
sells or buys at that venue. Most known members of this mailing list
are trustworthy. We all know who is and who isn't.  And the people who
are crooks get run out of town pretty quick. There are a few of us who
might be eccentrics, anti-socials, egotists, blowhards, or some other
species of the common jerk, but you know who to trust when it comes to
authenticity. The field sorts itself out and the informed buyer
chooses from well-established and reputable sources.

Nobody likes thieves or scammers and the only issue I have with the
list of negative attributes on your list is "tiny fragments".  As
someone who has owned, traded, and sold his share of tiny fragments,
that is not a negative thing that should be lumped in with thievery.

As I am sure you are aware, most scientific analysis doesn't require
large volumes of material, especially redundant materials for
diminishing/no scientific gain. Even a 3mg Bessey Speck is big enough
for the microprobe and then some.  It's scientific value might be
extremely limited if that speck represents yet another unremarkable H5
W4 from the NWA DCA.

What about the samples from scientifically-interesting material like
NWA 7038?  How much science could be done with a "tiny fragment" of
that?  Speaking of remarkable meteorites with scientific value, the
recent Martian NWA 7038 was found by someone who never saw the inside
of a classroom, traded to another person with no degrees, and sold to
another guy with no letters after his name. Middle level dealers
bought and sold some pieces after it trickled down into the market,
and now people are paying $20-$50 for a crumb weighing less than 20mg.
If we had waited on a juried collection of bureaucrat-approved dandies
to make that recovery, "Black Beauty" would be buried in the desert
until all of it's value to science was eroded to nothing.

Now, not much of that particular meteorite (or it's pairings) is on
the collector market waiting to be bought like a baseball card. But, a
"tiny fragment" can cost a day's work for some people, and does that
make it less valuable or less ethical? Should only well-heeled (or
connected) people of letters be allowed to collect meteorites? Should
I buy a tiny fragment of something for my collection (or research), or
should we budget-limited souls take our unwashed minds back to the
fleamarket and rummage for Beanie Babies and old postcards?

If somebody is breaking the law to hunt (or buy,trade,sell,collect)
meteorites, then there are obviously laws already in place against
fraud and theft that need to be enforced. If somebody in the IMCA is
crooked, call them out and report them to the board. If somebody on
this List is crooked, call them out and let them answer for their
shady dealings.

But, let's not act like some government or board of academics should
be the judge and jury of who gets to keep a meteorite found on private
property, or to decide who the owner of said meteorite should be able
to give/sell/trade it to for everyone's mutual satisfaction.

I didn't mean to offend the hard working and ethical hunters in
Australia who abide by the rules and make recoveries that are
available to science. When I called out 

[meteorite-list] Meteorite Picture of the Day

[Paul Swartz via Meteorite-list]

Today's Meteorite Picture of the Day: Windimurra

Contributed by: Graham Macleod

http://www.tucsonmeteorites.com/mpodmain.asp?DD=01/16/2016
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[meteorite-list] The US World Record Mars Meteorite Discovery

[Ann Cain via Meteorite-list]

Meteorite List,


Recall: 
Both my sister Ann Cain (who opened the email account) and I, Glyn Howard, use 
the same email account:

Ann Cain, Glyn Howard
gfndit(at)hotmail.com



This has been a long time coming ... for many years now I have been a reader of 
the Meteorite List.

I know this discovery sounds Wow! Unbelievable. Surreal. Pick your adjective. 
But it is what is is. All the physical empirical evidences prove it. I'm not in 
fear of re-confirmation. I welcome it. I know what it is. It's all repeatable 
(empirical). 

I appreciate well-known PhD members from the Meteorite List who have contacted 
me off-line. I will respond. Please give me time.


The evidence for the typical Mars meteorite key type specimens for this 
discovery:

GSA and GSB

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidence.html

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSA.html

http://gfoundit-mars.com/TheEvidenceGSB.html


The Gallery of US World Record Mars Meteorite specimens:

http://gfoundit-mars.com/GalleryOfImages.html


I will be putting-up/finishing the gallery of World Record Mars meteorite 
specimens by this Passover.



I do not want to hurt anyone's professional reputation. I'm not a mean or 
vengeful person. The full complete back story and certain people's identities 
will remain private. Just know there is a private history in the background of 
this incredible discovery and full story. Several very well known PhDs at 
Universities in the meteoritics community, who are meteorite analysts, members 
of the Meteoritcal Society, and perhaps at times over the years have even 
posted here on the Meteorite List, have held some of these specimens in their 
hands, have done tests. They know. I knew they were meteorites before I came to 
them. I knew that they were achondrites. However, at the time I couldn't prove 
the parent body. I didn't know how.

The moment I wasn't willing to share or reveal the discovery site is the moment 
the road-blocks, the walls, the disinformation began toward me. (Extrusive 
igneous Dacite, an evolved lava, is not a sedimentary rock! Lol.) We've seen 
this kind of behavior in the meteoritcs community before. It's nothing new, 
sadly. This is a dark history of the meteoritics world unfortunately. How many 
very rare important discoveries have been lost to the world of science and to 
mankind because those in research and academia  have played unethical games of 
gate-keeping and have refused to just do their job and just do pure science and 
do the analysis honestly and ethically without games, without gate-keeping, 
without attempting to wrestle from the discoverer the original discovery site? 
The discoverer has a right to withhold the discovery site to guard their 
discovery and its full value, and to protect it. How many people over the many 
years couldn't persevere against this wall, this unethical gate-keeping because 
they didn't have the prerequisite  skills or knowledge and they weren't able to 
realize that they were lied to or purposefully fed disinformation, and as a 
result had to walk away and give up, with an incredible treasure of scientific 
knowledge and wealth in their hand? It could of been very different. It could 
have been a very cooperative process of discovery for everyone.

The original discoverer has rights. I've said it before , and I'll keep saying 
it ... 

It takes discoverers to make scientific discoveries. Doing science and making 
scientific discoveries is not a crime. There is a right to protect discoveries 
and intellectual property. 


"Contrary to their public image, scientists are normal, flawed human beings. 
They are as capable of prejudice, covetousness, pride, deceitfulness, etc., as 
anyone."
-- David Weatherall, "Conduct Unbecoming," American Scientist (Vol.93, 
January-February 2005), p.73
http://www.americanscientist.org/bookshelf/pub/conduct-unbecoming


 As it turns out I'm rather glad it happened the way it did. Nothing like 
purposeful road-blocks, gate-keeping, and disinformation thrown at me to 
motivate me to learn to how to do it myself. As the old adage goes, if you want 
something done right you have to  do it yourself. The Earth Sciences are my 
background. I have the prerequisite skills. It took time but I did it. I'm 
still learning. I never stop learning. I didn't do it in a vacuum. I had much 
help and assistance along the way, from very good, professional scientists and 
technicians who were very ethical and very knowledgeable and very helpful, and 
then they did their assigned jobs very professionally and willingly. One day 
when the story can be told completely in detail I will certainly call out 
personally all those who helped me. The others who didn't, I will anonymously 
thank for motivating me to learn meteoritics  and to learn to do it on my own. 
I have enjoyed the scientific process immensely. Much more to come. And I can 
prove what I know.

Why when making the discovery of meteorites in the field, why then give away 
the