Re: [meteorite-list] Astronomers Suggest Comet To Blame for 6th-Century 'Nuclear Winter'
Hi Sterling and list It is interesting. The one thing you ommited about China though was that the prince (or emperor) also said that a yellow dust was falling and could be scooped up like snow (I think thats how it went). This suggested initially that a event at Krakatoa dated to about that time occured. One interesting thing to note is that there seems to be a correlation between impact events and volcanic activity. So, this could have been an event (the dark ages) fostered by an explosive meteoritc entry or impact. I like the fact that its effects can be seem in logs used for fortresses in Ireland and elsewhere around the world which verify that there was a long period of little growth in the trees. Mark Original Message - From: Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Bernhard Rendelius Rems [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 9:20 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astronomers Suggest Comet To Blame for 6th-Century 'Nuclear Winter' Hi, The comet theory is not new nor original with these researchers. There is a book published 4-5 years ago by Baille (title now forgotten by me) that advance the same explanation for the same phenomenon. The bad years of 536-540 AD are a world-wide event. In fact, it seems to have been at its very worst in SW China, where according to the chronicles, the sun was not seen for three years! Crops failed totally, and everything was covered with dust a foot deep. This description has given rise to the alternative theory of these events, which is that there was a volcanic eruption of tremendous size and world-wide effect. The culprit that is advanced is Krakatoa, which did have a massive early episode sometime between 500 BC and 1000 AD, one 10 times bigger than the 1883 episode. However strata from this earlier event are hard to find and none that have been found have been datable with any precision, so it remains only a possibility, but not a proven one. The greatest volcanic event of the last 500 years was Tambora on the island of Sumbawa in Indonesia in 1815, a 13,000-foot volcano that belched f1ame and ash from April 7 to 12, 1815; and rained stone fragments on surrounding villages. It has been estimated that Tambora's titanic explosion blew from 37 to 100 cubic miles of dust, ashes, and cinders into the atmosphere, generating a globe-girdling veil of volcanic dust. This produced The Year Without A Summer world-wide in 1816. For fascinating details, see: http://wchs.csc.noaa.gov/1816.htm. Of course, the effects described in this fascinating piece of history could just as easily have been produced by a insignificant little 150-200 meter comet. At the time (1816), the cause was complete mystery (except to Benj. Franklin, who hypothesized the cause to be volcanic dust). Tambora was not identified as the culprit for almost a century (1913). Sterling K. Webb -- -- Bernhard \Rendelius\ Rems wrote: I mean, do they offer some PROOF for their theory? A plume is nothing that would have gone unobserved by the eye (left alone a comet exploding in the sky) - and as much as I know, the mini ice age at that time wasn't a global occurence, but rather a european one - at least to my knowledge. There has been a second mini ice age around 1500 in Europe, and this is either attributed to the Maraunder solar minimum or the change of the gulf stream. Bernhard -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ron Baalke Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 5:39 PM To: Meteorite Mailing List Subject: [meteorite-list] Astronomers Suggest Comet To Blame for 6th-Century 'Nuclear Winter' Contact: Dr Derek Ward-Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 029-2087-5314 Cardiff University February 3, 2004 Astronomers unravel a mystery of the Dark Ages Undergraduates' work blames comet for 6th-century nuclear winter Scientists at Cardiff University, UK, believe they have discovered the cause of crop failures and summer frosts some 1,500 years ago - a comet colliding with Earth. The team has been studying evidence from tree rings, which suggests that the Earth underwent a series of very cold summers around 536-540 AD, indicating an effect rather like a nuclear winter. The scientists in the School of Physics and Astronomy believe this was caused by a comet hitting the earth and exploding in the upper atmosphere. The debris from this giant explosion was such that it enveloped the earth in soot and ash, blocking out the sunlight and causing the very cold weather. This effect is known as a plume and is similar to that which was seen when comet Shoemaker-Levy-9 hit Jupiter in 1995. Historical references from this period - known as the Dark Ages - are sparse, but what records there are, tell of crop failures and summer
RE: [meteorite-list] Astronomers Suggest Comet To Blame for 6th-Century 'Nuclear Winter'
I mean, do they offer some PROOF for their theory? A plume is nothing that would have gone unobserved by the eye (left alone a comet exploding in the sky) - and as much as I know, the mini ice age at that time wasn't a global occurence, but rather a european one - at least to my knowledge. There has been a second mini ice age around 1500 in Europe, and this is either attributed to the Maraunder solar minimum or the change of the gulf stream. Bernhard -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ron Baalke Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 5:39 PM To: Meteorite Mailing List Subject: [meteorite-list] Astronomers Suggest Comet To Blame for 6th-Century 'Nuclear Winter' Contact: Dr Derek Ward-Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 029-2087-5314 Cardiff University February 3, 2004 Astronomers unravel a mystery of the Dark Ages Undergraduates' work blames comet for 6th-century nuclear winter Scientists at Cardiff University, UK, believe they have discovered the cause of crop failures and summer frosts some 1,500 years ago - a comet colliding with Earth. The team has been studying evidence from tree rings, which suggests that the Earth underwent a series of very cold summers around 536-540 AD, indicating an effect rather like a nuclear winter. The scientists in the School of Physics and Astronomy believe this was caused by a comet hitting the earth and exploding in the upper atmosphere. The debris from this giant explosion was such that it enveloped the earth in soot and ash, blocking out the sunlight and causing the very cold weather. This effect is known as a plume and is similar to that which was seen when comet Shoemaker-Levy-9 hit Jupiter in 1995. Historical references from this period - known as the Dark Ages - are sparse, but what records there are, tell of crop failures and summer frosts. The work was carried out by two Cardiff undergraduate students, Emma Rigby and Mel Symonds, as part of their student project work under the supervision of Dr Derek Ward-Thompson. Their findings are reported in the February issue of Astronomy and Geophysics, the in-house magazine of the Royal Astronomical Society. The surprising result of the new work is just how small a comet is needed to cause such dramatic effects. The scientists calculate that a comet not much more than half a kilometre across could cause a global nuclear winter effect. This is significantly smaller than was previously thought. Dr. Ward-Thompson said: One of the exciting aspects of this work is that we have re-classified the size of comet that represents a global threat. This work shows that even a comet of only half a kilometre in size could have global consequences. Previously nothing less than a kilometre across was counted as a global threat. If such an event happened again today, then once again a large fraction of the earth's population could face starvation. The comet impact caused crop failures and wide-spread starvation among the sixth century population. The timing coincides with the Justinian Plague, widely believed to be the first appearance of the Black Death in Europe. It is possible that the plague was so rampant and took hold so quickly because the population was already weakened by starvation. ### __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Astronomers Suggest Comet To Blame for 6th-Century 'Nuclear Winter'
Hi, The comet theory is not new nor original with these researchers. There is a book published 4-5 years ago by Baille (title now forgotten by me) that advance the same explanation for the same phenomenon. The bad years of 536-540 AD are a world-wide event. In fact, it seems to have been at its very worst in SW China, where according to the chronicles, the sun was not seen for three years! Crops failed totally, and everything was covered with dust a foot deep. This description has given rise to the alternative theory of these events, which is that there was a volcanic eruption of tremendous size and world-wide effect. The culprit that is advanced is Krakatoa, which did have a massive early episode sometime between 500 BC and 1000 AD, one 10 times bigger than the 1883 episode. However strata from this earlier event are hard to find and none that have been found have been datable with any precision, so it remains only a possibility, but not a proven one. The greatest volcanic event of the last 500 years was Tambora on the island of Sumbawa in Indonesia in 1815, a 13,000-foot volcano that belched f1ame and ash from April 7 to 12, 1815; and rained stone fragments on surrounding villages. It has been estimated that Tambora's titanic explosion blew from 37 to 100 cubic miles of dust, ashes, and cinders into the atmosphere, generating a globe-girdling veil of volcanic dust. This produced The Year Without A Summer world-wide in 1816. For fascinating details, see: http://wchs.csc.noaa.gov/1816.htm. Of course, the effects described in this fascinating piece of history could just as easily have been produced by a insignificant little 150-200 meter comet. At the time (1816), the cause was complete mystery (except to Benj. Franklin, who hypothesized the cause to be volcanic dust). Tambora was not identified as the culprit for almost a century (1913). Sterling K. Webb Bernhard \Rendelius\ Rems wrote: I mean, do they offer some PROOF for their theory? A plume is nothing that would have gone unobserved by the eye (left alone a comet exploding in the sky) - and as much as I know, the mini ice age at that time wasn't a global occurence, but rather a european one - at least to my knowledge. There has been a second mini ice age around 1500 in Europe, and this is either attributed to the Maraunder solar minimum or the change of the gulf stream. Bernhard -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Ron Baalke Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 5:39 PM To: Meteorite Mailing List Subject: [meteorite-list] Astronomers Suggest Comet To Blame for 6th-Century 'Nuclear Winter' Contact: Dr Derek Ward-Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] 029-2087-5314 Cardiff University February 3, 2004 Astronomers unravel a mystery of the Dark Ages Undergraduates' work blames comet for 6th-century nuclear winter Scientists at Cardiff University, UK, believe they have discovered the cause of crop failures and summer frosts some 1,500 years ago - a comet colliding with Earth. The team has been studying evidence from tree rings, which suggests that the Earth underwent a series of very cold summers around 536-540 AD, indicating an effect rather like a nuclear winter. The scientists in the School of Physics and Astronomy believe this was caused by a comet hitting the earth and exploding in the upper atmosphere. The debris from this giant explosion was such that it enveloped the earth in soot and ash, blocking out the sunlight and causing the very cold weather. This effect is known as a plume and is similar to that which was seen when comet Shoemaker-Levy-9 hit Jupiter in 1995. Historical references from this period - known as the Dark Ages - are sparse, but what records there are, tell of crop failures and summer frosts. The work was carried out by two Cardiff undergraduate students, Emma Rigby and Mel Symonds, as part of their student project work under the supervision of Dr Derek Ward-Thompson. Their findings are reported in the February issue of Astronomy and Geophysics, the in-house magazine of the Royal Astronomical Society. The surprising result of the new work is just how small a comet is needed to cause such dramatic effects. The scientists calculate that a comet not much more than half a kilometre across could cause a global nuclear winter effect. This is significantly smaller than was previously thought. Dr. Ward-Thompson said: One of the exciting aspects of this work is that we have re-classified the size of comet that represents a global threat. This work shows that even a comet of only half a kilometre in size could have global consequences. Previously nothing less than a kilometre across was counted as a global threat. If such an event happened again today, then once again a large fraction of the earth's population could face
