Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
Hello Darren, All, By right-clicking the photos, clicking properties, and going directly to the picture URL, I was able to get these: http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01306.JPG http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01291.JPG http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01288.JPG http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01308.JPG http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01293.JPG http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01307.JPG http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01310.JPG http://www.njfossils.net/meteorite/DVC01311.JPG Hope this helpsI'm still of the opinion that it's a wrong in any case. Regards, Jason On 1/31/07, Darren Garrison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:27:34 + (GMT), you wrote: >For anybody intersted in seeing the pictures that I took of the NJO, I created a short webpage of the images. >They are raw from the camera, so they might take a little time to load. Thanks, Derek. > >www.njfossils.net/newjerseyobject.html Thanks for poting them, but unless you only took 269x202 pictures, these are just small thumbnail images. Do you have full sized ones? And do you have an opinion on meteorite or not? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
Hi, All > if it is something thrown by some sort of explosion... Of course, it could be thrown by many other means than explosive ones. A nine second fall in the Earth's gravitational field will yield a 200 mph velocity after falling from 1300 feet. And, frankly, a six-second fall (570 feet, 130 mph) is enough to puncture that roof and ceiling. It is reported to be an 11-ounce object. Shall we have a contest to see how many ways we can think of to lob an 11-ounce chunk 600 feet high? Or maybe just turn the job over to some bored teen-agers? (I have an otherwise sane friend fascinated by potato cannons; he can lob a near-kilogram Idaho more than a kilometer! By some miracle, he has never entuberated a living target...) And yes, the FAA said it isn't one of theirs, but... Couldn't that merely mean it isn't recognizably one of theirs? They're not going to take responsibility unless you can prove it's aircraft related (obvious shape, or maybe a part number). > Are the owners forbidding the object cut and > tested or etched? They have yet to be persuaded to do so. So, we are speculating. Speculation is what happens when you don't know anything at all or not enough or not anything conclusive. The only definitive element is the object itself; it's the sole piece of actual evidence of anything. The NJO will either be a worthless conversation piece, or it will be a meteorite. It won't BE a meteorite until you hack off twenty grams and send it to a certified lab. (Or, in the case of an iron, have it done.) That's the price of existence... for a meteorite. Opinion has no place in it. It's a physical determination. That's all that counts. > How was the nickel presence confirmed? Delaney of Rutgers, who has published on meteoritic topics, was allow to test for nickel; it was positive. As I understand it, he has not been allowed to cut, slice, window or etch. He also measured the density, which was in the range for an iron. (Knowing the dimensions, shape, and weight from early articles you could calculate the density, which I did and posted here, at 7.0 to 8.0 gm/cm^2). > seeing bigger pictures makes it look odder and odder... Very odd. If the NJO is real, it has a lot of 'splaining to do. > I wholly agree with tabling this topic for a month or so... Oh, Pish! Darryl; we're talking about meteorites. Isn't that what the List is for? Or is it reserved exclusively for Sale Announcements and Dealer Braggadocio? We know that you like only pretty meteorites, so this one is not really your provence, being, as it is, Butt Ugly. It may not be tested in a month, a year, or ever, given the owner's reluctance. I like the exercise of Observation, Deduction, Calculation, and Hypothesis, while waiting for actual testing and some real data, if that ever happens. (Isn't there a name for that process?) > ...if it is outright fraud The neighborhood is a well-to-do, somewhat cloistered one, according to local papers; the owners of the meteorite are the owners of the property where it fell. They seem to be puzzled and uncertain about what to do, it appears, and not overjoyed by the attention they're getting. Darryl says: > I'm informed the object will undergo appropriate analysis. If that is the True Skinny, the Inside Dope, wonderful! But until that event emerges from the vast darkness and deep womb of Futurity, we'll probably keep testing our powers of observation against the as-yet unspoken definitive word. Or, maybe, we're just grumpy because we can't in Tucson looking at REAL metorites. Sterling K. Webb ---- - Original Message ----- From: "Darren Garrison" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 5:13 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 18:08:51 -0500, you wrote: > >It would be cool if it were genuine, but personally, I see much to be >skeptical about. > I agree, seeing bigger pictures makes it look odder and odder. But the question is, if it is something thrown by some sort of explosion, shouldn't there be more debris other places, and reports of the explosion? Or if it is outright fraud, could they really be determined enough to drill a hole through their roof, their ceiling, and puch a hole in the wall? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
i'm informed the object will undergo appropriate analysis. as previously expressed, i highly doubt this is a new meteorite---and i wholly agree with the tabling this topic for a month or so or until such time there is news. as it regards the media's turn with this event, consider the dictum "reality ultimately doesn't matterit's only how things are perceived." have fun in tucson---or wherever you are. /d __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 18:08:51 -0500, you wrote: > >It would be cool if it were genuine, but personally, I see much to be >skeptical about. > I agree, seeing bigger pictures makes it look odder and odder. But the question is, if it is something thrown by some sort of explosion, shouldn't there be more debris other places, and reports of the explosion? Or if it is outright fraud, could they really be determined enough to drill a hole through their roof, their ceiling, and puch a hole in the wall? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
Yes, I recall that discussion, too - the parallel lines were attributed to the metallic crystal composition...or something like that. Are the owners forbidding the object cut and tested or etched? They seem to be proponents of the object furthering education and understanding of meteorites, and this procedure would be an obvious boost. I don't understand why they don't say, "go for it!" There has been mention of a "nickel/iron" composition. How was the nickel presence confirmed? A "field test" kit? (The Shirokovsky non-meteorite has a nickel presence, right?) There has also been mention of the object meeting the proper expected density of an iron meteorite. Are there specifics available from these findings? Has this "confirmation" been strictly by Rutgers' personnel? Does anyone on the List have knowledge of their crediblility regarding meteoritics? I've tried to keep up with the news for this object, but there seems to be few facts repeated often, and I may have missed some of this information. One further question: has trajectory from the holes in the roof and ceiling been considered for possible calculation of searching for additional associated objects to this "fall/find"? Forensics can do it with fired bullets (Back, and to the left) (Apologies) - you'd think it would be pertinent for such a touted rare occasion. It would be cool if it were genuine, but personally, I see much to be skeptical about. Cheers, Pete From: Darren Garrison <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2007 10:58:44 -0500 On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 10:10:51 -0500, you wrote: >Here's another observation pertaining to the unusual surface marks of this >unidentified fallen? object. >I'm seeing sets of parallel lines that appear to have been gouged into this >thing. They are inset horizontally and vertically, Perpendicular to each >other. Could this have happened while crashing through the roof, ceiling, >floor,tile, sheetrock, etc ..., or perhaps up in space? I'm trying to >imagine how a freshly falling iron meteorite could have managed to obtain >these ="= damage signatures. > This makes me think of a thread on the list a year or two back discussing some Sikhote-Alin individuals with parallel grooves in the surface. Anyone remember that subject/those meteorites? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list _ Your Space. Your Friends. Your Stories. Share your world with Windows Live Spaces. http://discoverspaces.live.com/?loc=en-CA __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
Hi, Jeff, > drag the image to the URL address bar... Thanks for what is, to me, a new trick. Works fine and makes the pictures big enough and clear enough to see the surface features, which makes it clear that the chances this is a meteorite very small indeed. For example, it seems that the edges of those depressions that might be regmaglypts are very sharp. Atmospheric ablation never produces a sharp edge anywhere and never around a depression it's ablating out. There are "parallel" grooves, but they're oriented in patches which show no general orientation to each other. Some adjacent sets of grooves met at right angles to each other. There's one double groove that makes an angled turn! The Universe is surprising, but for this to be a real meteorite is too much of a surprise to ask for. Sterling K. Webb - Original Message - From: "Jeff Kuyken" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 6:45 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object Hey Darren, The pics are larger but just shrunk to fit on the page. You can either save the image and view it normally on your computer as you might any other pic or even drag the image to the URL address bar which will enlarge it. Cheers, Jeff P.S. I remain unconvinced at this stage until someone "meteoritically qualified" says different! ;-) - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 3:52 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:27:34 + (GMT), you wrote: >For anybody intersted in seeing the pictures that I took of the NJO, I created a short webpage of the images. >They are raw from the camera, so they might take a little time to load. Thanks, Derek. > >www.njfossils.net/newjerseyobject.html Thanks for poting them, but unless you only took 269x202 pictures, these are just small thumbnail images. Do you have full sized ones? And do you have an opinion on meteorite or not? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
On Thu, 01 Feb 2007 10:10:51 -0500, you wrote: >Here's another observation pertaining to the unusual surface marks of this >unidentified fallen? object. >I'm seeing sets of parallel lines that appear to have been gouged into this >thing. They are inset horizontally and vertically, Perpendicular to each >other. Could this have happened while crashing through the roof, ceiling, >floor,tile, sheetrock, etc ..., or perhaps up in space? I'm trying to >imagine how a freshly falling iron meteorite could have managed to obtain >these ="= damage signatures. > This makes me think of a thread on the list a year or two back discussing some Sikhote-Alin individuals with parallel grooves in the surface. Anyone remember that subject/those meteorites? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
On Thu, 1 Feb 2007 23:45:58 +1100, you wrote: >Hey Darren, > >The pics are larger but just shrunk to fit on the page. You can either save >the image and view it normally on your computer as you might any other pic >or even drag the image to the URL address bar which will enlarge it. Okay, that's weird. Why can't IE expand them when you hover over them, like with most browser resized images? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
Mike, I observed the same thing and was struck by the way this chunk of metal looks more like it passed through some kind of grinder or other machinery. That kind of damage just doesn't seem consistent with falling iron. It looks more like slag that got caught up in some machinery than a meteoreite to me. 'Course I'm no expert, so my comments are worth just that - comments. I'll be interested to read the results when/if this object is finally tested properly. I feel strongly that displaying it as it is now, with all kinds of info about meteorites is very misleading and if any $$$ are being made it could come back on those involved as fraud. Gary http://www.meteorite-dealers.com On 1 Feb 2007 at 10:10, Mike Reynolds wrote: > Here's another observation pertaining to the unusual surface marks of this > unidentified fallen? object. > I'm seeing sets of parallel lines that appear to have been gouged into this > thing. They are inset horizontally and vertically, Perpendicular to each > other. Could this have happened while crashing through the roof, ceiling, > floor,tile, sheetrock, etc ..., or perhaps up in space? I'm trying to > imagine how a freshly falling iron meteorite could have managed to obtain > these ="= damage signatures. > > Mike __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
Hey Darren, The pics are larger but just shrunk to fit on the page. You can either save the image and view it normally on your computer as you might any other pic or even drag the image to the URL address bar which will enlarge it. Cheers, Jeff P.S. I remain unconvinced at this stage until someone "meteoritically qualified" says different! ;-) - Original Message - From: Darren Garrison To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 3:52 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:27:34 + (GMT), you wrote: >For anybody intersted in seeing the pictures that I took of the NJO, I created a short webpage of the images. >They are raw from the camera, so they might take a little time to load. Thanks, Derek. > >www.njfossils.net/newjerseyobject.html Thanks for poting them, but unless you only took 269x202 pictures, these are just small thumbnail images. Do you have full sized ones? And do you have an opinion on meteorite or not? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] The New Jersey Object
On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 23:27:34 + (GMT), you wrote: >For anybody intersted in seeing the pictures that I took of the NJO, I created >a short webpage of the images. >They are raw from the camera, so they might take a little time to load. >Thanks, Derek. > >www.njfossils.net/newjerseyobject.html Thanks for poting them, but unless you only took 269x202 pictures, these are just small thumbnail images. Do you have full sized ones? And do you have an opinion on meteorite or not? __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
