Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
Hi Garulfo, I uploaded a version that has some of the tranmslations merged in. I'll now check some more, but I also saw some issues. A criterium is that translations of variables and constants only are for those that internally are used as v! and c! while for instance the s! are untranslated (they often are so very 'system' that translation does more harm than good. So, we don't translate some font related keys simply because in many cases the styles etc are not guaranteed coded neutral (most are)). It doesn't harm to have non-used entries in the table but best play clean. Special cases are for instance metapost things, so we don't translate an instance name 'lessfun'. Again, it does no harm to have the entries but there is no such 'moinsfun' defined because this is a system key. A general rule can be: - things we do in styles that are very unlikely to be done by users of an interface don't need a translation. - very basic system things neither (\startluacode for instance; we can of course provide a translated variant but current we don't yet) - commands like \AfterPar ... debatable, as we might actually have better alternatives for that ; the same for NormalizeFontHeight (not that many such camelcase names btw, often old macros that come from modules we made first) - Logos like MetaFont: no need for translation - beware of defining primitives (notr sure why kern was in the translated table) Anyway, I assume wolfgang will check changes too. We just stepwise add what was missing (indeed there were commands not in the list yet; some are generated commands, so maybe I also need to make sure the english variant keeps available just in case it's used deep down for some reason, often that is already the case so not that much danger). More later, I assume you put the latest files on the gardne (your zip), Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
On 7/20/2020 12:04 AM, Garulfo wrote: And, if it makes sense for ConTeXt's community to use it as a "new" or an "updated" french interface, I may try to produce a 40~50 pages documentation for the basics commands (during 2020 S2): or even better, I will try to use Paul + Taco + Wolfgang documentation framework through the wiki. fwiw: the topline of a document can have % interface=fr which will trigger the right run Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
I guess pdp is "Pied de page". I don't speak French, but it is close enough
to Spanish. Maybe we should do a translation to Spanish too.
Congratulations for your colossal effort, Garulfo.
Jairo :)
El dom., 19 de jul. de 2020 11:49 p. m., Aditya Mahajan
escribió:
> On Sun, 19 Jul 2020, Garulfo wrote:
>
> > Thanks a lot !!
> >
> > I'm beginning to be able to typeset some simple example without any
> struggle.
> >
> > https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:modele_bonjour_le_monde.pdf
> >
> > The input file is attached in this mail.
>
> Thanks for all the hard work. Some minor comments on the sample file (some
> of them also apply to the English version).
>
> 1. You don't need
>
>\configurercouleurs[état=activé]
>
> That is the default in MkIV and LMTX.
>
> 2. Also:
>
> \utiliserURL[wiki] [http://wiki.contextgarden.net][][wiki
> \ConTeXt\ ]
>
> It may be better to use `\ConTeXT{}` with no space afterwards.
>
> 3. Why use abbreviated names:
>
> \configurerpdp[style=\italique]
> \configurertextespdp[\date \hfill Modèle \ConTeXt]
>
> I am guessing `pdp` is somehow an abbreviation of `footer`. One of the
> things that I really like about ConTeXt compared to LaTeX is that there are
> no funny abbreviations.
>
> It might be better to use
>
> \configurertextespdp[\date][Modèle \ConTeXt]
>
> 4. It may be better to reword \citer. That might create confusion with the
> bibliography commands which use \cite.
>
> 5. I am not sure why you include an example of buffers in this document.
> If it was just to have some filler text, I think that after all this work
> you can persuade Hans to include a sample file from a French author in the
> distribution :-)
>
> Aditya
>
>
> ___
> If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to
> the Wiki!
>
> maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl /
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>
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>
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Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
On Sun, 19 Jul 2020, Garulfo wrote:
Thanks a lot !!
I'm beginning to be able to typeset some simple example without any struggle.
https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:modele_bonjour_le_monde.pdf
The input file is attached in this mail.
Thanks for all the hard work. Some minor comments on the sample file (some of
them also apply to the English version).
1. You don't need
\configurercouleurs[état=activé]
That is the default in MkIV and LMTX.
2. Also:
\utiliserURL[wiki] [http://wiki.contextgarden.net][][wiki
\ConTeXt\ ]
It may be better to use `\ConTeXT{}` with no space afterwards.
3. Why use abbreviated names:
\configurerpdp[style=\italique]
\configurertextespdp[\date \hfill Modèle \ConTeXt]
I am guessing `pdp` is somehow an abbreviation of `footer`. One of the things
that I really like about ConTeXt compared to LaTeX is that there are no funny
abbreviations.
It might be better to use
\configurertextespdp[\date][Modèle \ConTeXt]
4. It may be better to reword \citer. That might create confusion with the
bibliography commands which use \cite.
5. I am not sure why you include an example of buffers in this document. If it
was just to have some filler text, I think that after all this work you can
persuade Hans to include a sample file from a French author in the distribution
:-)
Aditya
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Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
And, if it makes sense for ConTeXt's community to use it as a "new" or an "updated" french interface, I may try to produce a 40~50 pages documentation for the basics commands (during 2020 S2): or even better, I will try to use Paul + Taco + Wolfgang documentation framework through the wiki. ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
file name can be confusing, it's not yet complete TypeNames TranslationsAchievement commands3962954 24% constants 841 708 84% elements26 25 DONE setupstrings135 56 41% variables 1330680 51% 6294242339% Following your feedbacks, I will update it and improve its consistency. As you advised, I will try first to complete constants and variables (keys/values) during July and August. And, if it makes sense for ConTeXt's community to use it as a "new" or an "updated" french interface, I may try to produce a 40~50 pages documentation for the basics commands (during 2020 S2): • \starttext • \startchapter, \startsection, \starttitle, \startsubject, \setuphead, \completecontent • \em, \bf, \cap, • \startitemize, \startitem, \starthead, • \placefigure, \externalfigure, • \placetable, \starttable,\starttabulate, \setupTABLE, \bTABLE • \index, \completeindex • \setuplayout, \setupfootertexts et \setupheadertexts • \definedescription, \defineenumeration • \at, \in Anyway, thanks again for your support. Le 19/07/2020 à 22:55, Hans Hagen a écrit : On 7/19/2020 8:27 PM, Garulfo wrote: file: mult-def.lua.complet i'll have a look at it Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___ ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
Garulfo schrieb am 19.07.2020 um 20:27: Thanks a lot !! I'm beginning to be able to typeset some simple example without any struggle. https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:modele_bonjour_le_monde.pdf The input file is attached in this mail. I have only one remaining issue with this example: the indentation. Despite \setupindenting[medium, yes], the paragraphs are not systematically indented, and I don't really understand the pattern behind it. The point is also visible on the original english version https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:Hello-world.pdf Nice work but a few changes are needed: - You change the english text for the endsetup element which should be empty - A few commands should remain english, e.g. \AfterPar or \newsystemmode because they are only used in the core or in modules which should work independent of the interface language - A few of the setupstring entries are broken, e.g. cd:font appear twice and the second entry is wrong - It would be nice to have a consistent language order, in the existing entries you moved french to the bottom but in new entries you move french to the top Wolfgang ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
@Pablo Rodriguez Thanks, and indeed behavior changes with the following commands: \configurertête[section,chapitre,sujet] [couleur=couleurtitre, indenterensuite=oui] \configurerflottant[indenterensuite=oui] \configurerformule[indenterensuite=oui] ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
On 7/19/2020 8:27 PM, Garulfo wrote: file: mult-def.lua.complet i'll have a look at it Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
On 7/19/20 8:27 PM, Garulfo wrote:
> Thanks a lot !!
>
> I'm beginning to be able to typeset some simple example without any
> struggle.
>
> https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:modele_bonjour_le_monde.pdf
>
> The input file is attached in this mail.
Congratulation for your excellent work, Garulfo.
Your translation is really amazing.
> I have only one remaining issue with this example: the indentation.
> Despite \setupindenting[medium, yes], the paragraphs are not
> systematically indented, and I don't really understand the pattern
> behind it.
The default is "indentnext=no" for \setupheads and \setupfloats.
The pattern is clear: see what comes before the unindented paragraph.
BTW, I don’t understand this:
\langueprincipale[fr]
\langue[fr]
Is \mainlanguage not enough? (This would also set \language.)
\mainlanguage[fr]
\starttext
\startTEXpage[offset=2em]
mainlanguage:
{\tt\currentmainlanguage}
language:
{\tt\currentlanguage}
\stopTEXpage
\stoptext
I hope it helps,
Pablo
--
http://www.ousia.tk
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Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
Thanks a lot !!
I'm beginning to be able to typeset some simple example without any
struggle.
https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:modele_bonjour_le_monde.pdf
The input file is attached in this mail.
I have only one remaining issue with this example: the indentation.
Despite \setupindenting[medium, yes], the paragraphs are not
systematically indented, and I don't really understand the pattern
behind it.
The point is also visible on the original english version
https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:Hello-world.pdf
Le 19/07/2020 à 15:13, Wolfgang Schuster a écrit :
Garulfo schrieb am 19.07.2020 um 13:23:
Hi Wolfgang,
still working on the translation... (Hans pointed out the
possibilities due to the support of UTF-8, which are just great for
french language)
zip: https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:MWE_test_itemize_french.zip
I have difficulties with a simple example
file: MWE_test_itemize_french.tex
% interface=fr
\configurerdétailler[style=gras]
\débuttexte
\débutdétailler[a]
\élément Texte premiere
\élément Texte second
\findétailler
\fintexte
It works properly with "minimal" modifications of mult-def.lua
file: mult-def.lua.initial+diffminimalsetupitemize
https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:MWE_test_itemize_french.zip
but with a more complete mult-def.lua
file: mult-def.lua.complet
I get "The control sequence at the end of the top line of your error
message was never \def'ed. You can just continue as I'll forget about
whatever was undefined."
Could you please help me find my way around: what do I need to pay
attention to so that my other modifications don't break the whole
mechanism?
Everything works as expected but you have set a string for the endsetup
element which has become part of your \setupitemize command.
Setup commands are created in the following way:
+ +
this creates in your case the command
\configurerdétaillerfinconfigurer
As you don't want this leave the value of endsetup empty.
Wolfgang
% interface=fr
% Document "Bonjour tout le monde!" pour le système de composition ConTeXt
%
% === Histoire ===
% 2020-07-18 Garulfo
% * Passage en français
% 2006-12-29 Sanjoy Mahajan
% * Création
%
% Ce document est du domaine public (pas de droits d'auteur).
%===
\configurercouleurs[état=activé] % sinon le document est en liveau de gris
\définircouleur[couleurtitre][r=0.80,b=0.1,g=0.1]
% Métadata du document
\configurerinteraction[état=activé,% rendre les liens hypertextes actifs
titre={Bonjour le monde!},
soustitre={Un modèle ConTeXt},
auteur={Garulfo},
motclé={modèle ConTeXt}]
% urls utiles
\utiliserURL[courriel-auteur][mailto:a.u.t...@quelque.part][][a.u.t...@quelque.part]
\utiliserURL[wiki] [http://wiki.contextgarden.net][][wiki \ConTeXt\ ]
\utiliserURL[garulfo][mailto:garu...@azules.eu] [][garu...@azules.eu]
% Composition format A4, impression format A4
\configurertaillepapier[A4][A4]
\configurermiseenpage
[ espacehaut=2cm,
espacearrière=2.5cm,
entête=24pt,
pdp=36pt,
hauteur=milieu,
largeur=milieu]
% Décommenté ma migne suivant pour visualier la mise en page
% \montrercadre
% en-tête et pied de page
\configurerpdp[style=\italique]
\configurertextespdp[\date \hfill Modèle \ConTeXt]
\configurernumérotationpage[emplacement={entête,droite}, style=gras]
\configurerpolicedecorps[11pt] % 12pt par défaut
\configurertête[section,chapitre,sujet][couleur=couleurtitre]
\configurertête[section,sujet][style={\ss\bfa},
avant={\grandespace\grandespace}, après={}]
\configurertête[chapitre][style={\ss\bfd}]
\configurertête[titre][style={\ss\bfd},
avant={\begingroup\configurerpolicedecorps[14pt]},
après={\lignegauche{\ss\tfa A. U. Teur $\langle$\de[courriel-auteur]$\rangle$}
\grandespace\grandespace\endgroup}]
\configurerdétailler[entre={}, style=gras]
% configurer l'espacement inter-paragraphes
\configurerespaceblanc[moyen]
% Commenter la ligne suivante pour ne pas indenter les paragraphes
\configurerindentation[oui, moyen, toujours]
\langueprincipale[fr]
\langue[fr]
\configureraligner[tolerant]
\débuttampon[tuftefr]
Nous nous épanouissons dans les mondes de l'information - des mondes épais -
grâce à notre merveilleuse et quotidienne capacité à sélectionner, éditer,
isoler, structurer, mettre en évidence, regrouper, jumeler, fusionner,
harmoniser, synthétiser, concentrer, organiser, condenser, réduire, réduire,
choisir, catégoriser, cataloguer, classer, énumérer, résumer, scanner, examiner,
idéaliser, isoler, discriminer, distinguer, cribler, mettre en boîte,
sélectionner, trier, intégrer, mélanger, Inspecter, filtrer, regrouper, sauter,
lisser, en morceaux, moyenner, approximer, regrouper, agréger, délimiter,
résumer, détailler, passer en revue, plonger, feuilleter, parcourir, jeter un
coup d'œil, feuilleter,
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
Garulfo schrieb am 19.07.2020 um 13:23: Hi Wolfgang, still working on the translation... (Hans pointed out the possibilities due to the support of UTF-8, which are just great for french language) zip: https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:MWE_test_itemize_french.zip I have difficulties with a simple example file: MWE_test_itemize_french.tex % interface=fr \configurerdétailler[style=gras] \débuttexte \débutdétailler[a] \élément Texte premiere \élément Texte second \findétailler \fintexte It works properly with "minimal" modifications of mult-def.lua file: mult-def.lua.initial+diffminimalsetupitemize https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:MWE_test_itemize_french.zip but with a more complete mult-def.lua file: mult-def.lua.complet I get "The control sequence at the end of the top line of your error message was never \def'ed. You can just continue as I'll forget about whatever was undefined." Could you please help me find my way around: what do I need to pay attention to so that my other modifications don't break the whole mechanism? Everything works as expected but you have set a string for the endsetup element which has become part of your \setupitemize command. Setup commands are created in the following way: + + this creates in your case the command \configurerdétaillerfinconfigurer As you don't want this leave the value of endsetup empty. Wolfgang ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
Hi Wolfgang, still working on the translation... (Hans pointed out the possibilities due to the support of UTF-8, which are just great for french language) zip: https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:MWE_test_itemize_french.zip I have difficulties with a simple example file: MWE_test_itemize_french.tex % interface=fr \configurerdétailler[style=gras] \débuttexte \débutdétailler[a] \élément Texte premiere \élément Texte second \findétailler \fintexte It works properly with "minimal" modifications of mult-def.lua file: mult-def.lua.initial+diffminimalsetupitemize https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:MWE_test_itemize_french.zip but with a more complete mult-def.lua file: mult-def.lua.complet I get "The control sequence at the end of the top line of your error message was never \def'ed. You can just continue as I'll forget about whatever was undefined." Could you please help me find my way around: what do I need to pay attention to so that my other modifications don't break the whole mechanism? Thank you again for your patience ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
On 7/18/2020 8:56 PM, Garulfo wrote: > @Garulfo: Do you have a special use case in mind, or do you do this > for fun? "for fun" isn't quite right, although there's probably some truth to it. Actually, translating 6,300 keywords isn't fun, and it's even worst when you don't really master the material behind... but i guess you learn a lot in the process The point is that I am sad to not be able to offer the use of ConTeXt (such a great piece of software) to friends and childrens. And ConTeXt complexity or ConTeXt documentation are not the first hurdles. indeed (which is why for instance we use the dutch for e.g. family members) most users actually can do with a limited set of commands to start with ... and writing a tutorial for that is doable ... it's still on my agenda to come up with something for kids and translated interfaces are needed for that (unless we ditch all languages for english .. but if that happens, we can actually do without tex because a large portion, at least in context, is dedicated to dealing with scripts and languages) When you start with a new software, a new methodology, having first to struggle with vocabulary in a foreign language is definitively a (BIG) thorn in your side (in fact, usually you just don't start). Many popular softwares offer multi-language early in their development (netscape / firefox, scratch, wordpress, krita...). ConTeXt did it, the infrastructure is ready, the translations exist, at least partially or at an early stage. indeed, it was there right from the start ... as a historic note: the reason what that we had a subsystem for chemistry which could be configured usinng key values (we're talking early nineties) and in order to be used in german we made the multi lingual interface (after that the english and others lists were added) .. the german was done with Tobias Burnus who also helped with the early multi language support) context goes along way back ... And when I started to use it, I thought that it could easily be improved and updated without requiring any Tex / Lua skills. One remark : I was wrong, I spend hours to put all the content (from mult-def and context-en.xml) in a simple csv table and building quick scripts to put it back in mult-def. (normally i then put up some music or a movies i already saw before in the background or some podcast or ...) > With our small developer and user base we struggle enough with keeping > documentation current. Struggle likely appears about not-so-trivial needs. It's a shame not to use it in Italian / Russian / Chinese / French etc... for a letter, for a 10 to 20 pages report, for an internal note. exactly ... (btw, tex promotion is often tight to scientific publishing but the interesting fact there is that as soon as you drop the formulas it often doesn't look that pretty any more .. another property of context is that users should be able to make a nice layout) All the more so as the software allows it. The point is that the interface just deserves a minimal update and documentation, and that, as you point it, the small developer and user base doesn't have time to do it. indeed, and sorry for not keeping it up to date Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
> @Garulfo: Do you have a special use case in mind, or do you do this > for fun? "for fun" isn't quite right, although there's probably some truth to it. Actually, translating 6,300 keywords isn't fun, and it's even worst when you don't really master the material behind... The point is that I am sad to not be able to offer the use of ConTeXt (such a great piece of software) to friends and childrens. And ConTeXt complexity or ConTeXt documentation are not the first hurdles. When you start with a new software, a new methodology, having first to struggle with vocabulary in a foreign language is definitively a (BIG) thorn in your side (in fact, usually you just don't start). Many popular softwares offer multi-language early in their development (netscape / firefox, scratch, wordpress, krita...). ConTeXt did it, the infrastructure is ready, the translations exist, at least partially or at an early stage. And when I started to use it, I thought that it could easily be improved and updated without requiring any Tex / Lua skills. One remark : I was wrong, I spend hours to put all the content (from mult-def and context-en.xml) in a simple csv table and building quick scripts to put it back in mult-def. > With our small developer and user base we struggle enough with keeping > documentation current. Struggle likely appears about not-so-trivial needs. It's a shame not to use it in Italian / Russian / Chinese / French etc... for a letter, for a 10 to 20 pages report, for an internal note. All the more so as the software allows it. The point is that the interface just deserves a minimal update and documentation, and that, as you point it, the small developer and user base doesn't have time to do it. ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
> Am 15.07.2020 um 14:28 schrieb Hans Hagen : > > On 7/15/2020 2:14 PM, Henning Hraban Ramm wrote: >>> Am 15.07.2020 um 10:31 schrieb Hans Hagen : >>> you can leave the commands for last ... in an french user interface the >>> english commands will work ok, but keys/values/elements have to be >>> translated >> Are the other interfaces (Dutch, German, Czech...) actually still working? > are germans still lipsyncing movies (or even foreign news), translating > computerbooks in german (large secxtions in bookshops), translating thrillers > and novels ... or has that all stopped working I don’t understand the comparison. It’s a difference if I can enjoy movies or books, if I can understand textbooks or manuals in a foreign language or if and why I’d use translated programming or markup commands. For me, lip syncing can make movies confusing, since the sound doesn’t match the lip movements – I prefer original language with subtitles (for German and English, that is). > anyway, it is supposed to work and whenever kids have to use context doing it > in dutch is more fun (one just learns them the handfull of commands they need) I’m not against these interfaces, but without translated documentation a translated interface doesn’t make a lot of sense (to me). E.g. LilyPond docs have several translations (it’s a huge effort!), but besides note names there’s no interface translation. (I’m glad I can use c d e notes, while others prefer do re mi etc. I could even use German h/b instead of b/bes, but I got used to the Dutch default – for input only; in my songbooks I stick to German chord names.) Translated documentation is important, it lowers the threshold for many users. That’s why I’m writing my book in German. But once you grow out of the basics, you need to be able to find your way in manuals and wiki or ask questions here, where everything’s in English. With our small developer and user base we struggle enough with keeping documentation current. – I’m very happy with and thankful for the big effort that goes into the wiki at the moment! – Maybe we (i.e. Taco, Paul etc.) can extend the automatisms so far, that we also can document the translated interfaces that way, even if the manually added content would stay in English. I never heard that kids would use ConTeXt at all, but perhaps I just missed you talking about it. Sorry, Garulfo, didn’t want to hijack your thread. Best regards, Hraban ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
On 7/15/2020 2:14 PM, Henning Hraban Ramm wrote: Am 15.07.2020 um 10:31 schrieb Hans Hagen : you can leave the commands for last ... in an french user interface the english commands will work ok, but keys/values/elements have to be translated Are the other interfaces (Dutch, German, Czech...) actually still working? are germans still lipsyncing movies (or even foreign news), translating computerbooks in german (large secxtions in bookshops), translating thrillers and novels ... or has that all stopped working anyway, it is supposed to work and whenever kids have to use context doing it in dutch is more fun (one just learns them the handfull of commands they need) Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
> Am 15.07.2020 um 10:31 schrieb Hans Hagen : > you can leave the commands for last ... in an french user interface the > english commands will work ok, but keys/values/elements have to be translated Are the other interfaces (Dutch, German, Czech...) actually still working? AFAIR I tried the German one in the beginning (MkII) but gave up since all the documentation is in English, and nobody could help you with anything but English and Dutch. WRT your musings (“What’s in a name“): translated interfaces look funny, and I guess they make only sense in a very limited environment. E.g. Marei’s LaTeX3 system I’m working with uses German commands, but it’s focused on technical documentation for one company, and we’re not supposed to use general LaTeX commands. In my German book I’ll only show the English interface, otherwise I’d need to write even more... @Garulfo: Do you have a special use case in mind, or do you do this for fun? Best, Hraban ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] french translation of ConTeXt interface - progress (v3)
On 7/14/2020 11:39 PM, Garulfo wrote:
Hi,
a "early-alpha-version" of updated setup-fr.pdf
https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:setup-fr.pdf
with the associated mult-def.lua.
https://wiki.contextgarden.net/File:20_output_mult-def_garulfo.zip
Any feedback will be welcome.
To developers : what priorities, in terms of categories,
would you advise for the translation ?
%-
Progress:
TYPE TOTAL DONE
commands 3962 943 24%
constants 841 708 84%
elements 26 26 100%
setupstrings 135 57 42% = 100% other are { ( |...
variables 1329 632 48%
6293 2366 38%
you can leave the commands for last ... in an french user interface the
english commands will work ok, but keys/values/elements have to be
translated
Hans
-
Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.nl | www.pragma-pod.nl
-
___
If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the
Wiki!
maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://context.aanhet.net
archive : https://bitbucket.org/phg/context-mirror/commits/
wiki : http://contextgarden.net
___
