Re: [osol-discuss] Start Using SX*E, Or Just Wait?
Robert Mazur wrote: Thank you for your detailed response! More in-line responses from me below. When you installed, did you explicitly choose Developer Edition? I think that you can choose between Developer Edition and Community Edition on the same image. If you don't have NetBeans, or SunStudio (Applications - Developer Tools -), it sounds like you installed Community Edition. Well, in truth, at this point I am not sure. When I was choosing the download from the website, I clearly chose Developer Edition. It then forwarded me to a page labeled Community Edition, which I thought was odd. But I carried on, nonetheless. From /etc/release I see Solaris Express Developer Edition 9/07, but under Developer Tools menu, I do not have NetBeans, etc. The Project Indiana distro is not yet available on SPARC, so you should continue with SX*E. OK. I am also hopeful to move to Solaris on a laptop with wireless capability. So that drove my interest also to Indiana. I will have to monitor both sparc and x86 releases. The LiveCD was my first experience with wireless working on a Solaris machinethat was/is very exciting. It is a preview for the community, not a first release, so if you consider youself an OpenSolaris newbie it might not suit you so well until a proper release. Saying that, feedback you have for the Indiana project on your expectations, what you liked and didn't like etc., will be greatly appreciated. You bet. I will try to help with as much useful and constructive comments as I can Well, for one thing, you won't have to download 6 cds. The idea of Project Indiana is to create a distro that is easier to user, to install, to manage, and, crucially, that is redistributable. That is not the case with SX*E, and it remains Sun's distribution rather than one which can be adopted by the community. So then (sorry, still trying to piece this together), is it fair to say that if we fast-forwarded one year to November 2008, then a release like SX*E could be an example of a distribution that used Project Indiana as its core (much like the Ubuntu model)? Other than SX*E being 6 discs, I don't know what prevents it from being distributable? SX*E contains code which Sun is not able to license other parties to distribute, Indiana will not. I think perhaps there is some background and licensing that I am not aware of or unclear about. Perhaps SX*E was not built by the community, but by Sun-paid employees? I thought as soon as OpenSolaris existed, the community controlled it, and therefore SX*E was a product of the community (I now believe I am wrong). Does the community want to be able to say they have a OpenSolaris version that they assembled (using Sun-released Solaris source code as a base) and that they completely control the track of, the future of, the content of, etc? And, have that be independant of Project Indiana, as Indiana is a Sun-backed project? So then if Indiana adopts the OpenSolaris name, that is stepping on the community's toes because they feel they are building OpenSolaris? If Sun backed the development of SX*E, and are now backing the develpoment of Project Indiana, what has the community (non-Sun-paid-people) been involved with? Again, I am just trying to understand the politics. Having only started reading the threads yesterday, it is difficult to sort through and understand everyone's stance and frustration. Well - the distro that Project Indiana is creating will hopefully answer that question. But right now, we are in flux. Ah, that explains it! Okthat is exactly what I was feeling but was surprised, frankly, that so much flux existed. From an outsider's poitn of view, the message I was getting by reading all of the posts was, Just come back in 6 months, and maybe we will have sorted out our identity and be able to describe to you what you can expect by adopting one of these releases. But careful to adopt anything here, because who knows if it'll exist tomorrow, or next month. I'm a fan of Sun (really, I am a Java developer who knows just enough about Solaris to get by) so I am not giving up. But I could see a potential LInux convert come here and thinkWow, what's going on, and leave for more solid ground. Personally, I have layed around with the Developer Preview but I am still using SX*E for my day-to-day as it's a complete OS, and the Developer Preview is just that, a preview for developers. Patrick Yes, that seems to be the answer. I am only concerned that the Update Manager does not work in SX*E. What I am not clear on is, is SX*E still going to be maintained and developed to fix things like this? Or is it what you see is what you get and if you want fixes and new development, then Project Indiana is what you have to wait for (or help build)? My understanding: update
Re: [osol-discuss] A proposal for ensuring sustained Community Growth and Success
Shawn Walker wrote: This proposal is intended to provoke productive discussion, surrounding our current governance structure, by highlighting some of the deficiencies that currently exist. While not exhaustive, it attempts to explain why the current governance structure is insufficient for the success and growth of the community, by comparing and contrasting our existing governance model with that of other organisations at a high level. It also suggests how our governance structure might be changed to address those deficiencies. It is the author's hope that all recipients of this proposal will take the time to reflect on and carefully consider the points made here before responding. This proposal is primarily directed at the OGB, as representatives of our current governing structure. However, all recipients are encouraged to respond. The inspiration for this proposal is a direct result of recent events which revealed that governance of the community is at the heart of issues facing the community today. The OpenSolaris community has existed as a self-governing entity since Friday February 10th, 2006 [1]. Since that time, individual parts of the community (and thus, the community as a whole) are continuing to make progress in many areas, including: technical, communication, and growth [2]. The community has grown slowly, but surely, into something that we can continue to be proud of. The Advocacy (User Group), Desktop, DTrace, and ZFS community groups are just a few examples of that growth and progress. However, the majority of this progress is a result of Sun's indirect leadership [3], involvement, and the contributions of many individuals within the community. Many of those individuals are paid by Sun to work on Solaris, OpenSolaris, and related community projects. It is important to note the distinction of paid by; as many individuals are not employees of Sun (contractors) or were not employed by Sun at the beginning but currently are. By observation, it is apparent that none of this progress would have been possible without Sun's initiative to provide the source code that served as the nucleus around which the OpenSolaris project formed, and without their ongoing, significant financial support (which the author estimates to be in the range of millions of dollars). Clearly, governance is one of the most important aspects of the community. However, governance alone is not sufficient to achieve sustained growth and success in a completely self-governing body, such as the one we currently have. The leadership hierarchy must be clear, and seen as inspirational [4], creative, shrewd, and fair. Upon reflection, it should become apparent that leadership and guidance is a necessary part of governance. To help us better understand our current governance model, it is helpful to compare and contrast our own governance model with that of others. Narrowing our focus, from the many governance models widely known, results in several which we will briefly examine. Commercially related projects include: Mac OS X [5], PostgreSQL [6], MySQL [7], and Ubuntu [8] (created and supported by Canonical [9]). Other projects are those such as Fedora [10], which are essentially alpha or beta representations of commercial products [11]. Finally, we have Apache [12] and OpenBSD [13]; which are organised around completely open source [14] products. All these projects or products share several common characteristics. However, some characteristics are common and clearly visible: sustained growth and success. Each project or product has a parent entity that continues to build a community providing sustained growth and success, whether they are primarily proprietary in nature [5], have taken a hybrid approach between open source and proprietary add-ons [7], or have the primary focus of the project completely as open source [6, 8, 10, 12, 13]. They may also be experimenting with pay-for-contribution models. In each case, clear leadership within well-defined areas of expertise is evident. There is a direct correlation between the quality of the leadership and the sustained growth and success of each project or product. The results are evident in a successfully delivered and widely-adopted end-product within their respective target markets. For a moment then, let us consider the leadership that is integral to these projects and products. In Apple's [15] case, few would dispute that Steve Jobs is clearly the primary source of leadership, and has been directly responsible for their current success [16]. Likewise, the OpenBSD project is well known for its leader, Theo De Raadt, who, while sometimes outspoken [17], has relentlessly driven the project towards an admirable level of fervour and success [18] as defined by its stated goals [19]. Investigating further, we see that each one of these projects has structured its leadership or governance
Re: [osol-discuss] Lines of Code
Jim Grisanzio wrote: Edward Pilatowicz wrote: On Sat, Sep 29, 2007 at 06:57:08AM +0530, Anil Gulecha wrote: On 9/29/07, Scott Rotondo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim Grisanzio wrote: hey ... anyone have an updated count of the number of lines of code in the OpenSolaris source? Jim (Ada) 33 files,18944 lines (Tcl) 6 files, 1028 lines (make) 5016 files, 101157 lines (other) 2520 files, 805011 lines (Pascal) 1 files, 27 lines (Lisp) 24 files, 6793 lines (Java)714 files, 102802 lines (Perl) 2440 files, 368705 lines (shell) 6197 files, 822722 lines (C++)902 files, 353252 lines (Awk) 18 files, 1374 lines (Assembly)686 files, 133825 lines (C) 21455 files, 6077726 lines Total 40012 files, 8793366 lines Thats funny, I remember seeing '11m' mentioned in some opensolaris slides. Marketing to blame? When we launched we said 10 million, but the media got it wrong in one article that was repeated all over the place. They said 5 million. It's ranged all over the place, actually, and I know it depends on what you actually count. I know Alan C said that JDS is 2x the size of ON. I find it of interest. Anyway, thanks for the count. :) i.e. marketing not to blame. Patrick ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Open Solaris Express Edition and Open Solaris Express Developper Edition.
Hi, As far as I know, Developer Edition contains NetBeans and Sun Studio (that is, they install immediately after Solaris Express) and, as you point out, the installation is slightly more graphical. Express gives you the whole GNOME environment. regards, Patrick Bruno wrote: Hello, When i try to install OpenSolaris from the latest Developper DVD release, i am prompted with different choices, featuring first : - Open Solaris Express Developper Edition and - Open Solaris Express Edition i have spent hours searching for the differences of those two versions but so far only understood the difference between the community and developper editions. my question is, does the community edition refer to that second choice Open Solaris Express Edition on the developper edition DVD ? if not, could someone confirm what the Express version lacks compared to the Developper Express version ? I have noticed that we get a more elaborated GUI during the installation of the OS on the Developper Express version, while the Express version is a textmode UI. I havent been prompted with a package choice one the Express version either. I will be finishing installation of the Express version tomorrow, and am expecting to lack the whole gnome windowing system. Would there be someone kind enough to let me know the basic steps to install this package manually ? Thanks for any info/clarification. This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] An Open Letter to the Solaris Community.
Kaiwai Gardiner wrote: On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 22:38 -0700, Korey Peters wrote: I think the 40% was a rectum pluck rather than it being a fixed number on which OpenSolaris should aim. I mean, if you look at Mac, their marketshare is below 10% and yet has a bigger selection of software than Solaris. One could argue that not only does Solaris need more users, but its quality rather than quantity. If the vast majority of the 40% are penny pinching, proprietary software hating, thick-rim-glasses wearing, hunch back coding geeks - it certainly won't attract vendors such as Adobe or MYOB who don't target that crowd. Matthew ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org The 40% certainly was a rectum-pluck. I was thinking about a goal for Solaris on the desktop, and 40% seemed so startling that I thought I'd better use it. 40% is definately achievable. Now, if Sun can get their marketing departments act together, things would improve even more. Care to elaborate on that, Matthew? Patrick ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] An Open Letter to the Solaris Community.
Kaiwai Gardiner wrote: On Tue, 2007-07-31 at 10:45 +0200, Patrick Finch wrote: Kaiwai Gardiner wrote: On Mon, 2007-07-30 at 22:38 -0700, Korey Peters wrote: I think the 40% was a rectum pluck rather than it being a fixed number on which OpenSolaris should aim. I mean, if you look at Mac, their marketshare is below 10% and yet has a bigger selection of software than Solaris. One could argue that not only does Solaris need more users, but its quality rather than quantity. If the vast majority of the 40% are penny pinching, proprietary software hating, thick-rim-glasses wearing, hunch back coding geeks - it certainly won't attract vendors such as Adobe or MYOB who don't target that crowd. Matthew ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org The 40% certainly was a rectum-pluck. I was thinking about a goal for Solaris on the desktop, and 40% seemed so startling that I thought I'd better use it. 40% is definately achievable. Now, if Sun can get their marketing departments act together, things would improve even more. Care to elaborate on that, Matthew? Ok, where are the Sun advertisements in magazines read by decision makers? I open up the NZ Management magazine (from the NZIM - most managers/excutives in NZ are members) - not a single advertisement, and yet, I see IBM splattered from cover to cover. I look through the business paper that comes out, again, no advertisements. I then click on slashdot.org and find advertisements for Sun - why advertise on slashdot.org? teeny bobby kiddies sitting around whinging and whining about the world who have absolutely NO influence over decisions made in large corporations. Its the equivilant of marketing dog food to the yapping dog when in reality you want to aim the marketing at the owner. I dislike argument by analogy, (something about apples and pears), but isn't a reasonable counter-argument that it is the equivalent of marketing toys or breakfast cereals to children even though their parents will be the ones paying for them? I think that you are addressing an important point for OpenSolaris. Who is more target for the project, IT executives or developers? I think it's the latter. Of course the executive is an important constituency, but wouldn't a wise executive listen to their developers? Lets not get started on the marketing outside of the print - advertisements on television, evagelising java as *the* technology to demand on mobile phones, where is the attempt to get developers but technical and artistic (aka Adobe people) excited about JavaFX? where are the easy to use tools that allow people to make rich content using JavaFX as easily as it is with Flash and Shockwave? It just goes on and on and on. Quite frankly I'm wasting my time even explaining it given that Sun employ's people based on whether they have a degree rather than whether thay have the know how to take Sun products, market their to buggery and evangelise technology in practical applications to those who make decisions. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Changing a host name
Boyd Adamson wrote: Carlton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: All I want to do is change the host name on my laptop. Numerous searches turn up to simply change the /etc/host file, but it is read only and won't accept the change. The man pages say not to use sysidconfig manually, so I don't know if it can be done. The *right* way is to use sys-unconfig to re-configure the net settings on your box. For some purposes that's a little over the top though. To change the hostname without sys-unconfig there are at least 3 files you need to edit: /etc/inet/hosts /etc/nodename /etc/hostname.* (where * is the name of your interface) If you're on Solaris (rather than an OpenSolaris build) then you need to add /etc/inet/ipnodes to that list. Note that some other apps use the name of the host for other things and may need updating. Some of those files are marked read-only by default. If you're root and using vi you can write to them with :w! otherwise use chmod. HTH Boyd What about the GUI from the GNOME menu (as root) Administration - Network, and then General Settings (second tab), and just change the hostname there and reboot (this is a 3 month old build). I didn't read this anywhere, but it *seemed* to work. Any reason why this wasn't a good idea? Patrick ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Re: RE: And that would break... what, exactly?
Funny isn't it? I with my Solaris/UNIX knowledge can easily figure out and use any Linux system, but the same does not hold true the other way around. At least not in most cases, as we can clearly see from comments and questions here on opensolaris.org. Hmmm, now why would that be the case? Why doesn't the opposite hold true in most cases? Presumably because Linux is easier to use. And you either are smarter than the average user or have learned a great deal from using Solaris, or both. If I understand correctly, you are saying that a Solaris user can become a Linux user with ease, but not vice versa. Do you consider this to be a strength or a weakness of Linux? Patrick UNIX admin wrote: Those places are Solaris heavy, in my experience. What does that tell you? But there are a lot of places that need a system that someone there knows how to use a lot more than they need a system that some sysadmin they don't have can keep running out to 5 nines. There are a lot of places that have developers for whom Linux is the best choice because that's where they know how to develop. Can one really call oneself a developer, if she/he doesn't know the underlying OS he/she is developing on/for? A nice new turbo diesel may be a lot better than an older gasoline engine, but so help me, I don't have any idea how to change the oil in one. Like this: you drain the oil, then unscrew the oil filter, and then screw the new one on. Ee, wait! That's *exactly* how one does it on a gasoline engine. Whaddya know? For users who come from a Linux background for whatever reason, system maintenance has a pretty steep learning curve on Solaris. Funny isn't it? I with my Solaris/UNIX knowledge can easily figure out and use any Linux system, but the same does not hold true the other way around. At least not in most cases, as we can clearly see from comments and questions here on opensolaris.org. Hmmm, now why would that be the case? Why doesn't the opposite hold true in most cases? My question, though, is that if Solaris continues to work for your 'real' sysadmins, what's wrong with it being accessible and usable by the 'hackers' too? Hacking something up in the PoC (Proof of Concept) phase is fine -- that's how some of the most ingenious things came to see the light of day. What's not fine, and definitely not OK, is when a hack is released as a finished product, and when quantity comes before quality. From what I can tell, both from experience and reading the responses here, Solaris folks want quality over anything else. It's most likely one of the biggest reasons they are just that - Solaris users, and not Linux ones. There's of course another lesson to be learned from that, only if people that this concerns were willing to learn. This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Re: RE: And that would break... what, exactly?
I think we risk confusing the strength of the admin with a strength of the platform. Latin scholars make great linguists, after all. Patrick Andre van Eyssen wrote: On Mon, 21 May 2007, Patrick Finch wrote: If I understand correctly, you are saying that a Solaris user can become a Linux user with ease, but not vice versa. Do you consider this to be a strength or a weakness of Linux? Neither. It's a strength of Solaris, in that Solaris breeds a mindset that is portable to HPUX, *BSD, Linux and many other platforms. You learn to work with a set of tools that are present on everything, as opposed to being dependant on particular features of a particular toolchain. A new Linux user would probably learn to use the more modern ip tool to manage interfaces, whereas as a Solaris admin would use ifconfig which will work on all of the above. ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Sun to make Solaris more Linux like
I checked http://docs.opensolaris.org/ and http://www.opensolaris.org/docs but there wasn't anything there. I think we really need a newbie portal. (and link to it from everywhere) I totally agree: this is no criticism of what OpenSolaris.org has become, but it resembles http://www.tux.org/ more than http://www.linux.org/ or http://www.ubuntu.com. There is lots of interest in OpenSolaris out there, and I think that we increasingly need to have a newbie portal or similar. Patrick Brian Gupta wrote: I have started an ongoing personal project to engage my local Linux UG, (which I am a member of) in an OpenSolaris discussion. So far it's mostly been Where do I get and how do I install OpenSolaris?? Quote from an anonymous Linux user: I wasn't even talking about installing/admin'ing Solaris - I was talking about the true noob basics - download this, install that, etc. etc. Compare what's happening around OpenSolaris distros to most Linux distros. Gentoo is amazing for docs and self-help; Ubuntu, Fedora, Debian and others are not that far behind. I have a rack of machines behind me, some Gentoo, some Ubuntu (all likely to be Debian soon). Diskless boxes, file servers, etc, and I was able to get them running almost entirely with Web-based resources (and some help from this list). Even stuff like RAID and ethernet bonding are well documented in how-to's, kernel documentation, etc. Likewise, the FreeBSD Handbooks and related docs are terrific and have been for a long time. OpenSolaris? No idea where to start. Putting up a file server on the right hardware, using NFS and ZFS? Totally no idea of where to start ;) This raises an interesting point. As a lot of comments regarding the lack of Linux documentation have been raised. The viewpoint of the Linux community is that OpenSolaris doesn't have enough documentation. Somehow we need to figure out what the disconnect is. I checked http://docs.opensolaris.org/ and http://www.opensolaris.org/docs but there wasn't anything there. I think we really need a newbie portal. (and link to it from everywhere) -Brian ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Sun to make Solaris more Linux like
I'd say the only marketing voice that counts for OpenSolaris is that of the Marketing Community here on OpenSolaris.org (of which Sun's marketing is but a member). The OpenSolaris marketing community has never done anything on the lines of product management to my knowledge, but rather, it has been about facilitating community building up to this point. Indeed, Jim just convened a lengthy discussion on those lines. Are you proposing that the OpenSolaris marketing community be reconstituted for the purpose of product management? (it seems like it) Patrick Rich Teer wrote: On Tue, 15 May 2007, Ian Murdock wrote: Why not? Isn't OpenSolaris a product that has a market, and don't we need to make sure we're addressing the right market? In my experience, To a degree you're right, but Alan specifically mentioned Sun marketing. IMHO, Sun's marketing dept does NOT have the only voice in this kind of decision for OpenSolaris (for Solaris[TM] yes, but not OpenSolaris). I'd say the only marketing voice that counts for OpenSolaris is that of the Marketing Community here on OpenSolaris.org (of which Sun's marketing is but a member). ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Sun to make Solaris more Linux like
Agreed. From the articles in question: As we make Solaris more familiar to Linux users, we don't (want to) lose what makes it more compelling and competitive, Murdock said MC wrote: I like to believe that Sun's aim is to make Solaris a better operating system. You must keep your head pointed in the right direction. Linux and Best OS are not the same direction. This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] News
It's my fault...I was updating it and I hadn't got round to for a while. I will try to fix that this week. thanks for your patience! Patrick Doug Scott wrote: Hey, Just looking on the front page of the Open Solaris site showed the latest news is dated 03/09/2007. Is this a case of there has been nothing happening in the last month, or is it a case of no news is good news? This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] What happened to free_open_licensing.pdf
Hi Jörg, It's here http://www.sun.com/software/opensource/whitepapers/Sun_Microsystems_OpenSource_Licensing.pdf Can I ask where that URL came from? I guess it should be updated. regards Patrick Joerg Schilling wrote: Hi all, it seems that Simon Phipps whitepaper http://www.sun.com/software/opensource/whitepapers/free_open_licensing.pdf did disappear. Is this by intention or by accident? Jörg ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-mktg] Re: [osol-discuss] You are Invited! Birthday Blog Party on June 14th!
Not preempting Laura or Sara, I'd offer that posting a blurb on your company's website would be excellent (Sun.com will be doing something similar), and you could possibly embelish it with a button: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/about/buttons/ Patrick Dan Price wrote: On Wed 07 Jun 2006 at 03:11PM, David J. Orman wrote: Add something to your proposal that doesn't involve blogging. To explain, some people (such as myself) generally thing blogs are a waste of space on the internet. Of course, that is completely my opinion, and quite obviously a lot of people disagree. To each their own! This isn't intended to start an argument, please don't. The point is, I am excluded from your grassroots b-day movement, because I don't blog/don't condone blogging. I would suggest instead of limiting it to blogging, you open it up to other areas. News sites, etc. I'd be glad David-- while I think this is a fair criticism, handling the media is something that I am not really personally able to do (but see below...). One other grass roots thing I am also looking at putting together is an IRC party on #opensolaris, and looking at ways of making entering the IRC channel for casual users easier, like a java applet or something. to put a little blurb about the birthday on my business's main page, something like: We run Solaris and wanted to point out how far things are progressing with the OpenSolaris community, it's been a year and OpenSolaris is still gaining momentum. The OpenSolaris community is full of innovation and technical capability, and our infrastructure benefits greatly! We want to take the time to thank all of the community members that make our a bsolutely amazingly reliable servers possible, and let all of our clients know that we will continue to interact and work with the OpenSolaris community to keep improving our systems. However, you want to write it, something like this. The key is not limiting the scope of the grassroots movement you suggest we start. That would be awesome-- the thing you wrote is great. I think that I was trying only to carve off the blogging part of the birthday effort-- there is more that hopefully will happen (I at least hope that we'll see some news articles and stuff). Over in the marketing community there has been a discussion about the birthday. I hope Sara and/or Laura will also respond to your point about non-blogging types of participation. -dp ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Re: Re: Re: Sun lost one of it's biggest and oldest x86
Hi, Of course there is interest! Thanks for all your thoughts and offers. Teresa and I will discuss and will be back in touch with you. To an extent, some marketing money is spent on education already, although not in the direct education credits manner that you suggest. It should be quite easy for us to figure out the cost and reach of the proposal. Please do bear in mind that North America and Europe will have very different cost structures to China, India, Brazil, Russia though! I'd also encourage you to share your thoughts, ideas and energy with the edu-discuss list. We'll be in touch - in the meantime, you have my email address too ;) thanks Patrick UNIX admin wrote: Many of your ideas above are excellent--and maybe Teresa or Patrick can give further updates on specifics --maybe some of these ideas are in planning already. If so, maybe there's an opportunity for community members who are affiliated with Universities to join Teresa's efforts and help get the word out!br br Well I am not affiliated with any organization or university, but I am willing to teach the Solaris 10 I and II course materials to students or pretty much anyone interested in Solaris and Solaris certification. I would be able to teach Mon-Sat in the evenings, so if there is interest from Sun, you have my e-mail address. This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] [Fwd: OpenSolaris attacked by Novell]
Hi, Just to tie up Eric's question, I contacted James Eagleton, the product manager for Sun in Australia. He confirmed that Hovespian's comments were made at LinuxWorld Australia, which was held in Sydney from March 28 to 30th. regards Patrick Eric Lowe wrote: Has anyone tracked down exactly where these statements eluded to came from? A quick search of Novell's website didn't turn them up and Google was quiet too. - Eric Laura Ramsey wrote: This is amazing on *several* levels: 1--We're on the radar ...but why? That's what's so amazing. 2--Ron H. is mistaken--he thinks OpenSolaris is a linux-based community...another amazing thing--he didn't even LOOK at the community, before he proclaimed it a fork TALK ABOUT A LOW HANGING PITCH! Oh dear god. Who's going to get to hit the grand slam? ;) LKR Subject: OpenSolaris attacked by Novell From: patrick finch [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2006 12:00:58 +0200 To: Laura Ramsey [EMAIL PROTECTED], Sara Dornsife [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Laura Ramsey [EMAIL PROTECTED], Sara Dornsife [EMAIL PROTECTED] fyi http://australianit.news.com.au/articles/0,7204,18841088%5E15344%5E%5Enbv%5E15306-15321,00.html ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
[osol-discuss] Fwd: OpenSolaris @ CeBIT2006
Hi, In case anyone missed this, there will be an OpenSolaris community day at CeBIT on the 12th March. The details are below. A couple of tips: The registration page is http://de.sun.com/company/events/2006/cebit/community/index.html, and is in German. Click Anmeldung to register. Accommodation is thin on the ground at CeBIT. If you don't have accommodation, you should look into travelling in and out on the same day. Hope to see some of you there. regards Patrick Original Message Subject:[ug-gosug] OpenSolaris @ CeBIT2006 Date: Tue, 21 Feb 2006 13:09:12 +0100 From: Detlef Drewanz [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi, the first German OpenSolaris User Group Meeting will be hosted by Sun Microsystems at the CeBIT 2006. Come, see, meet the specialists and have some discussion with other OpenSolaris enthusiasts. When: Sunday, March 12th, 2006, 14:00 - 20:00 What: 14:00 Intro to OpenSolaris 14:30 Solaris Containers for Linux Applications 15:30 Break/Pause/Diskussion 16:00 First Experiences with ZFS in Solaris 10 17:00 ZFS - Intro and technical details 18:00 Get Together / Networking / Snacks / Drinks Where: Germany, CeBIT Hannover, Sun booth Hall 1/A90+A91 Please register if you plan to attend because we have limited space there. Registration at: http://de.sun.com/company/events/2006/cebit/community/index.html Please see also: http://www.opensolaris.org/os/community/os_user_groups/gosug/ regards Detlef ___ ug-gosug mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
[osol-discuss] OpenSolaris at FOSDEM
All, OpenSolaris will be at FOSDEM in Brussels, Belgium on the weekend of the 25-26th February. The event site is here, http://www.fosdem.org/2006 and is free to attend, although donations are welcome for what is described as the best Free and Open Source Software Event in Europe. Sun is a FOSDEM sponsor. It all takes place at the Universite Libre de Bruxelles, Campus du Solbosch in Brussels, and promises to be very interesting. There will be a general session discussing GPL v3, (it's a shame Jonathan Schwartz won't be there), and as well as some notable speakers such as Richard Stallman and Jeff Waugh, there is considerable interest in OpenSolaris at the event. Jonathan Haslam will be giving an overview of DTrace, on Saturday, 25th February, in the Jansson Room, 2-3pm, and a tutorial on Sunday, 26th February, at 4pm in Room H2215 . There is also a talk by Jay Hobson planned on DTrace on the X.org Server, within the X.org track, further details to be confirmed. If you are planning to attend, please do get in touch. I'll be there :) regards Patrick ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
[osol-discuss] OpenSolaris feature on LugRadio
Hi, For those interested, Adam Leventhal was interviewed on the British podcasting Linux / open source radio show LugRadio this week. He discusses OpenSolaris, and how it contrasts with Linux. You can hear the interview here: http://www.lugradio.org/ regards Patrick ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] community proposal: Linux Immigrants
Understood. I'm thinking about people migrating from Linux, but rather, present Linux users. I think that an obvious starting place for a Linux user who visits OpenSolaris.org but does not consider themselves an immigrant might be a good idea. So I was not suggesting a hostile act, but a no-strings welcome mat for the agnostic and the interested Linux user. Saying that, it sounds like a different idea to the opportunity you see here, and it probabaly isn't a good idea to do both as it would cause a lot of confusion, so I am happy to retract. regards Patrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My fear in tragetting Linux explicitly for migration like this is the name is an enduring hostile act just towards Linux. I prefer immigrants - nothing to stop it focussing just on the Penguinistas under that banner for now. Exactly my argument; my +1 is conditional on not including linux on the name. Casper ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] community proposal: Linux Immigrants
In my opinion, a big part of the value of this community will be that it helps to explain the relevance of OpenSolaris to the wider Linux community. Extending the scope beyond Linux immigrants could threaten that. Patrick Stephen Hahn wrote: * [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [2005-11-03 08:46]: On Wed, 2 Nov 2005, Adam Leventhal wrote: There seems to be at least a loose concensus that this would be a useful community. Any +1 votes from the CAB? +1 +1 Absolutely agree. I think we should also be open for those in exile such as South Koreans who may seen be exiled from Windows :-) Now that the community creation process has been satisfied, we'll get this community established. Based on my reading of the thread, this is the immigrants community. Or is it linux-immigrants still? Adam? - Stephen ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] community proposal: Linux Immigrants
Just to clarify: I'm don't mean the value of OpenSolaris as a whole (!), but the value of a specific discussion group within OpenSolaris.org. When I talk about a wider audience, I mean that there are a lot of people who have little or no consciousness of OpenSolaris or any of its distributions, but are very interested in open source and very much alive Unix-like OSes. I don't intend to exclude the needy with my comment though, so maybe Linux-immigrant is too narrow a conception. Patrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In my opinion, a big part of the value of this community will be that it helps to explain the relevance of OpenSolaris to the wider Linux community. Extending the scope beyond Linux immigrants could threaten that. wider Linux comminity? I think the value of OpenSolaris does not derive from external factors but rather from inner strength; as such, I find linux immigrants too limiting and perhaps also can be seen to lend to those who see OpenSolaris as a purely defensive, window dressing, move. Let's not forget those users of HP-UX and AIX who do need to look for alternatives rather than just those of other, very much alive, Unix-like OSes, who want to broaden their horizons. Casper ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
Re: [osol-discuss] Re: New mailing list proposal
Hi, I think that Jim G is already working this based on Simon's input As I recall: -mailing list for announcements -moderated -moderator would also post most important announcements to opensolaris.org Patrick Bob Palowoda wrote: Hi all, With the traffic that's being generated by the lack of recent source announcements, I think an osol-announce list would be useful. Such a list would contain the announcements people find useful, with adding to the already-overburdened osol-discuss. Comments, thoughts?' Yes I think it is a good idea. Quick one line bullet announcements with a link. For instance I missed the bug database started to include X bugs. Now Alan thought it wasn't important but I think scanning a quick announcement would have been helpful. Disable replies. ---Bob This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org -- ___ NOTICE: This email message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message. ___ ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
[osol-discuss] OpenSolaris community activity - some volumes
All, For those interested, some measurements of the last 2 months' activity on OpenSolaris.org. Weeks are defined as follows (Opening Day was a Tuesday, hence weeks run Tuesday-Monday!) WeekStart-End 1 06/14/05-06/20/05 2 06/21/05-06/27/05 3 06/28/05-07/04/05 4 07/05/05-07/11/05 5 07/12/05-07/18/05 6 07/19/05-07/25/05 7 07/26/05-08/01/05 8 08/02/05-08/08/05 9 08/09/05-08/15/05 OpenSolaris.org page views -- WeekPage Views Cumulative 1 1,048,077 1,048,077 2 227,411 1,275,488 3 147,137 1,422,625 4 140,316 1,562,941 5 135,933 1,698,874 6 135,601 1,834,475 7 143,687 1,978,162 8 127,403 2,105,565 9 119,030 2,224,595 (Now over 2 and a quarter million page views) Non-Sun registrations to OpenSolaris.org WeekRegistrations Cum. 1 5,423 5,423 2 469 5,892 3 184 6,076 4 150 6,226 5 122 6,348 6 111 6,459 7 214 6,673 8 107 6,780 9 100 6,880 (8,357 total registered users, 964 are Sun employees, 7,393 are external to Sun, 1,477 users registered before opening) New postings to discussion groups - WeekPostingsCum. 1 1,145 1,145 2 674 1,819 3 520 2,339 4 494 2,833 5 756 3,589 6 511 4,100 7 491 4,591 8 444 5,035 9 476 5,511 OpenSolaris blogs - WeekEntries Cum.Bloggers 1 324 324 150 2 140 464 40 3 99 563 37 4 86 649 29 5 85 734 37 6 84 818 31 7 99 917 36 8 114 1,031 41 9 73 1,104 38 Google.com results for “OpenSolaris” WeekResults 1 1,400,000 2 1,600,000 3 978,000 4 872,000 5 855,000 6 817,000 7 804,000 8 1,140,000 9 779,000 (Results pre-launch: 69,000) Top referring domains to OpenSolaris.org Domain Traffic google (all domains)31.50% slashdot.org9.30% osnews.com 4.70% yahoo.com 3.20% distrowatch.com 2.40% com.com (CNet) 2.30% heise.de2.00% berlios.de 1.80% barrapunto.com 1.70% kde.org 0.90% (NB.nearly 40% of visits are bookmarked/typed URLs, so the above represents 60% of visitors) Site visitors by country --- Country Visitors United States 33.20% Germany 6.40% Japan 5.80% United Kingdom 5.30% Canada 4.00% France 2.80% India 2.80% Italy 2.60% Australia 2.40% Spain 2.40% China 2.20% Brazil 2.00% Poland 2.00% Netherlands 2.00% Russian Federation 1.70% Sweden 1.50% Finland 0.90% Switzerland 0.90% Korea - South 0.90% Czech Republic 0.90% Apologies for the non-technical nature of this posting. I shall post this to the marketing community and in future primarily post figures there. regards Patrick -- ___ NOTICE: This email message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message. ___ ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
[osol-discuss] OpenSolaris Metrics - looking for input
All, I wanted to flag to the community that I will be developing a metrics package to be published eventually somewhere on OpenSolaris.org. I already have a few key measures ready, such as volumes of page views, numbers of community members, number of discussion posts etc., but I really would also like to know what other people are interested in seeing. At the moment I'm open to any and all suggestions around content, presentation, frequency. I should also say that I don't think that measures need to be restricted to OpenSolaris.org, but could cover any quantative or qualitative aspect of the community. I hope to start posting some measures in around a month or so: however for the the next two weeks I shall be offline, so feel free to jam my inbox with ideas... Patrick This message posted from opensolaris.org ___ opensolaris-discuss mailing list opensolaris-discuss@opensolaris.org
