Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
On Mit, 2012-12-26 at 13:36 -0800, Miller Puckette wrote: OK... try from git again - maybe it'ws fixed Looks good to me. With -jack it's possible now to switch DSP off and on in zero logical time without causing a drop-out. Also, turning DSP off does not disconnect the Pd client. I'm really happy to get the old behavior back. Thanks a lot for dedicating time to address this issue. Roman On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 10:09:37PM +0100, IOhannes m zmölnig wrote: On 12/22/2012 02:48, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all, Pd version 0.44-0test1 is available on http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/software.htm or via git from sourceforge: git clone git://pure-data.git.sourceforge.net/gitroot/pure-data/pure-data cool, but... mostly audio, MIDI, scheduling, and OS compatibility bug fixes. ...i'm unsure what to think about the current jack situation. as it is (at least is in my cop of pd-0.44), taken from todays git), if i turn on/off audio, the Pd-jack client appears/disappears. roman reported this as a bug and i thought this was going to be fixed for 0.44, but it seems that it is still there. what are the plans for this? fgamsdr IOhannes PS: merry christmas! ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] pix_record continues to record, even with rendering turned off
On 12/27/2012 01:33, Antonio Roberts wrote: record is started it uses a bang to turn on the gemhead and to capture i'm talking abot [bang(ing [pix_record], which is something different than [bang(ing [gemhead]. one frame, and then turns it off again. However, the time between the two frame captures is still recorded even if the gemhead is turned off e.g. the 20 seconds between two bangs will still be recorded even if rendering is stopped i cannot check your example right now, but this can totally be desired behaviour. e.g. if your container supports variable framerates and you record two frames that are 20 seconds appart, you might end up with a 20sec video containing of 2 frames. (afair, you might be able to override the framerate (depending on the backend/container you are using). Also, stopping recording writes the movie file, and restarting recording will overwrite the previous file. yes. i was mainly pointing to the various ways to control [pix_record]. please check auto mode and manual frame progression in the help-patch. even more interesting would be the OS and Gem-version your are using. (but the above still is a valid answer) I'm using pd-extended 0.43.4~cvs20121225-1 on Ubuntu 12.04 thanks. since i'm not tracking PdX versions (and even less snapshot versions of PdX!), it is usually helpful to provide the Gem-version as well. (something like 0.93.3; it should be displayed at startup - when Gem is loaded - though you might have to raise the verbosity of the pd-console) fgmasdr IOhannes ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
On Die, 2012-12-25 at 13:00 -0800, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all - I'm afraid to 'fix' this riht now, but will look at it at least. Alternatively I could add a message to pd to restort DSP without stopping/starting the audio I/O, which I'm hoping will at least reduce the need to start/stop SDP all the time. The change that caused this problem is that I fixed Pd not to have the audio system open whern DSP isn't running so that, on APIs in which audio is exclusive (e.g., ALSA) you can turn DSP off in Pd and go off and use another device with Pd remining open. The problem arises when there is one message trying to control many different tasks: * switch DSP computing on/off (save CPU time) * free/occupy the audio back-end (save soundcard time) * mute/unmute Pd (save ears) * force recompilation of the DSP graph An alternative would be to have Pd automatically close audio devices on ALSA, OSS, and MMIO but always keep it open when using jack. But then what about portaudio? I somply don't know the correct way to deal with this. I'd say it's preferable if Pd's behavior is independent from the back-end currently in use. Rather, I suggest to use different messages for different tasks. IMHO, 'dsp 0' really should only turn computation of tilde-objects off as this is what it means and what one expects. What about a new message to pd 'card 0|1' to free devices which would work completely independently from 'dsp 0|1'? This would allow to record a signal to a soundfile without occupying the soundcard, for instance. Roman And merry Christmas too... On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 10:09:37PM +0100, IOhannes m zmölnig wrote: On 12/22/2012 02:48, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all, Pd version 0.44-0test1 is available on http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/software.htm or via git from sourceforge: git clone git://pure-data.git.sourceforge.net/gitroot/pure-data/pure-data cool, but... mostly audio, MIDI, scheduling, and OS compatibility bug fixes. ...i'm unsure what to think about the current jack situation. as it is (at least is in my cop of pd-0.44), taken from todays git), if i turn on/off audio, the Pd-jack client appears/disappears. roman reported this as a bug and i thought this was going to be fixed for 0.44, but it seems that it is still there. what are the plans for this? fgamsdr IOhannes PS: merry christmas! ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
[PD] Plugins-plugin bug
Hi, I have a weird plug-in list in the plug-ins management window. It looks like the content (list of items with check box and info button) is not centred properly. The content is centred on the top left hand corner of the window and not the centre of the actual window. I can just see a quarter of the content window. Using the plugins-plugin version alpha 0.1.20120518 on the latest version of Pd-ext 0.43.4 on Windows 7 (64bits) Cheers Pierre-Olivier ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] Plugins-plugin bug
i can confirm this bug for os x Am 27.12.2012 um 20:26 schrieb Pierre-Olivier Boulant po.boul...@free.fr: I have a weird plug-in list in the plug-ins management window. It looks like the content (list of items with check box and info button) is not centred properly. The content is centred on the top left hand corner of the window and not the centre of the actual window. I can just see a quarter of the content window. ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] more fun with translations
- Original Message - From: Hans-Christoph Steiner h...@at.or.at To: Jonathan Wilkes jancs...@yahoo.com Cc: pd-list@iem.at list pd-list@iem.at Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 8:54 PM Subject: Re: [PD] more fun with translations On Dec 26, 2012, at 3:27 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: - Original Message - From: Hans-Christoph Steiner h...@at.or.at To: pd-list@iem.at list pd-list@iem.at Cc: Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 2:05 PM Subject: [PD] more fun with translations [...] Is it possible to translate comments of the help patches in 5.reference in a similar manner? Not currently, but that is something I think we can do. I guess the trickiest part is the file format. I suppose there could be a .po file per-language-per-patch. I'd rather see all the translations embedded into the patch. Just made the search-plugin keywords translatable. There's a [_ name] for the keyword, then a keyword which is not translated. Seems to work fine. But again, notice that this just kicks the ball down the field for the non-English-speaking user. Sure, they can get a list of included bandlimited objects, but they all have english descriptions, patches, and readmes (if they have them at all). -Jonathan ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
On Dec 27, 2012, at 2:14 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: On Die, 2012-12-25 at 13:00 -0800, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all - I'm afraid to 'fix' this riht now, but will look at it at least. Alternatively I could add a message to pd to restort DSP without stopping/starting the audio I/O, which I'm hoping will at least reduce the need to start/stop SDP all the time. The change that caused this problem is that I fixed Pd not to have the audio system open whern DSP isn't running so that, on APIs in which audio is exclusive (e.g., ALSA) you can turn DSP off in Pd and go off and use another device with Pd remining open. The problem arises when there is one message trying to control many different tasks: * switch DSP computing on/off (save CPU time) * free/occupy the audio back-end (save soundcard time) * mute/unmute Pd (save ears) * force recompilation of the DSP graph An alternative would be to have Pd automatically close audio devices on ALSA, OSS, and MMIO but always keep it open when using jack. But then what about portaudio? I somply don't know the correct way to deal with this. I'd say it's preferable if Pd's behavior is independent from the back-end currently in use. Rather, I suggest to use different messages for different tasks. IMHO, 'dsp 0' really should only turn computation of tilde-objects off as this is what it means and what one expects. What about a new message to pd 'card 0|1' to free devices which would work completely independently from 'dsp 0|1'? This would allow to record a signal to a soundfile without occupying the soundcard, for instance. I think that having a pulseaudio backend for Pd as the default on GNU/Linux would be the best way to solve this problem. Pulse will then handle the multiple apps playing at the same time. Then for people who want to skip Pulse, then can use the ALSA blocking implementation. An Audio API can be quite different than another, so I don't think it makes sense to treat them all the same in terms of things like whether DSP disconnects the audio API. For example Mac OS X CoreAudio, even through PortAudio, always has handled multiple apps playing back. And the audio stuck workaround actually only causes problems with CoreAudio. .hc Roman And merry Christmas too... On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 10:09:37PM +0100, IOhannes m zmölnig wrote: On 12/22/2012 02:48, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all, Pd version 0.44-0test1 is available on http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/software.htm or via git from sourceforge: git clone git://pure-data.git.sourceforge.net/gitroot/pure-data/pure-data cool, but... mostly audio, MIDI, scheduling, and OS compatibility bug fixes. ...i'm unsure what to think about the current jack situation. as it is (at least is in my cop of pd-0.44), taken from todays git), if i turn on/off audio, the Pd-jack client appears/disappears. roman reported this as a bug and i thought this was going to be fixed for 0.44, but it seems that it is still there. what are the plans for this? fgamsdr IOhannes PS: merry christmas! ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
On Dec 27, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: On Dec 27, 2012, at 2:14 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: On Die, 2012-12-25 at 13:00 -0800, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all - I'm afraid to 'fix' this riht now, but will look at it at least. Alternatively I could add a message to pd to restort DSP without stopping/starting the audio I/O, which I'm hoping will at least reduce the need to start/stop SDP all the time. The change that caused this problem is that I fixed Pd not to have the audio system open whern DSP isn't running so that, on APIs in which audio is exclusive (e.g., ALSA) you can turn DSP off in Pd and go off and use another device with Pd remining open. The problem arises when there is one message trying to control many different tasks: * switch DSP computing on/off (save CPU time) * free/occupy the audio back-end (save soundcard time) * mute/unmute Pd (save ears) * force recompilation of the DSP graph An alternative would be to have Pd automatically close audio devices on ALSA, OSS, and MMIO but always keep it open when using jack. But then what about portaudio? I somply don't know the correct way to deal with this. I'd say it's preferable if Pd's behavior is independent from the back-end currently in use. Rather, I suggest to use different messages for different tasks. IMHO, 'dsp 0' really should only turn computation of tilde-objects off as this is what it means and what one expects. What about a new message to pd 'card 0|1' to free devices which would work completely independently from 'dsp 0|1'? This would allow to record a signal to a soundfile without occupying the soundcard, for instance. I think that having a pulseaudio backend for Pd as the default on GNU/Linux would be the best way to solve this problem. Pulse will then handle the multiple apps playing at the same time. Then for people who want to skip Pulse, then can use the ALSA blocking implementation. An Audio API can be quite different than another, so I don't think it makes sense to treat them all the same in terms of things like whether DSP disconnects the audio API. For example Mac OS X CoreAudio, even through PortAudio, always has handled multiple apps playing back. And the audio stuck workaround actually only causes problems with CoreAudio. Here's a pulseaudio implementation for libpd, I'm sure Patrick would be fine for that code to be included in Pd. http://www.workinprogress.ca/libpd/ .hc .hc Roman And merry Christmas too... On Mon, Dec 24, 2012 at 10:09:37PM +0100, IOhannes m zmölnig wrote: On 12/22/2012 02:48, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all, Pd version 0.44-0test1 is available on http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/software.htm or via git from sourceforge: git clone git://pure-data.git.sourceforge.net/gitroot/pure-data/pure-data cool, but... mostly audio, MIDI, scheduling, and OS compatibility bug fixes. ...i'm unsure what to think about the current jack situation. as it is (at least is in my cop of pd-0.44), taken from todays git), if i turn on/off audio, the Pd-jack client appears/disappears. roman reported this as a bug and i thought this was going to be fixed for 0.44, but it seems that it is still there. what are the plans for this? fgamsdr IOhannes PS: merry christmas! ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] more fun with translations
On Dec 27, 2012, at 3:17 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: - Original Message - From: Hans-Christoph Steiner h...@at.or.at To: Jonathan Wilkes jancs...@yahoo.com Cc: pd-list@iem.at list pd-list@iem.at Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 8:54 PM Subject: Re: [PD] more fun with translations On Dec 26, 2012, at 3:27 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: - Original Message - From: Hans-Christoph Steiner h...@at.or.at To: pd-list@iem.at list pd-list@iem.at Cc: Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 2:05 PM Subject: [PD] more fun with translations [...] Is it possible to translate comments of the help patches in 5.reference in a similar manner? Not currently, but that is something I think we can do. I guess the trickiest part is the file format. I suppose there could be a .po file per-language-per-patch. I'd rather see all the translations embedded into the patch. Just made the search-plugin keywords translatable. There's a [_ name] for the keyword, then a keyword which is not translated. Seems to work fine. But again, notice that this just kicks the ball down the field for the non-English-speaking user. Sure, they can get a list of included bandlimited objects, but they all have english descriptions, patches, and readmes (if they have them at all). -Jonathan Definitely true. But this is one step that needs to happen, so its definitely not wasted effort at all. Plus someone now can put [pd META] tags into their tutorials in whatever language, like Porres' portuguese tutorials, and they would be searchable. .hc ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
On Dec 27, 2012, at 3:36 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: On Don, 2012-12-27 at 15:29 -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: On Dec 27, 2012, at 2:14 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: On Die, 2012-12-25 at 13:00 -0800, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all - I'm afraid to 'fix' this riht now, but will look at it at least. Alternatively I could add a message to pd to restort DSP without stopping/starting the audio I/O, which I'm hoping will at least reduce the need to start/stop SDP all the time. The change that caused this problem is that I fixed Pd not to have the audio system open whern DSP isn't running so that, on APIs in which audio is exclusive (e.g., ALSA) you can turn DSP off in Pd and go off and use another device with Pd remining open. The problem arises when there is one message trying to control many different tasks: * switch DSP computing on/off (save CPU time) * free/occupy the audio back-end (save soundcard time) * mute/unmute Pd (save ears) * force recompilation of the DSP graph An alternative would be to have Pd automatically close audio devices on ALSA, OSS, and MMIO but always keep it open when using jack. But then what about portaudio? I somply don't know the correct way to deal with this. I'd say it's preferable if Pd's behavior is independent from the back-end currently in use. Rather, I suggest to use different messages for different tasks. IMHO, 'dsp 0' really should only turn computation of tilde-objects off as this is what it means and what one expects. What about a new message to pd 'card 0|1' to free devices which would work completely independently from 'dsp 0|1'? This would allow to record a signal to a soundfile without occupying the soundcard, for instance. I think that having a pulseaudio backend for Pd as the default on GNU/Linux would be the best way to solve this problem. Pulse will then handle the multiple apps playing at the same time. Then for people who want to skip Pulse, then can use the ALSA blocking implementation. An Audio API can be quite different than another, so I don't think it makes sense to treat them all the same in terms of things like whether DSP disconnects the audio API. For example Mac OS X CoreAudio, even through PortAudio, always has handled multiple apps playing back. And the audio stuck workaround actually only causes problems with CoreAudio. So you agree that 'dsp 0|1' should not automatically disconnect|connect the audio API, regardless of what API is in use? I don't know enough about the various audio APIs to say whether that's a good idea or not. Perhaps it makes sense with some audio APIs. .hc ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] Plugins-plugin bug
On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 8:26 PM, Pierre-Olivier Boulant po.boul...@free.frwrote: Hi, I have a weird plug-in list in the plug-ins management window. It looks like the content (list of items with check box and info button) is not centred properly. The content is centred on the top left hand corner of the window and not the centre of the actual window. I can just see a quarter of the content window. Using the plugins-plugin version alpha 0.1.20120518 on the latest version of Pd-ext 0.43.4 on Windows 7 (64bits) Cheers Pierre-Olivier Hello Pierre-Olivier, and thanks for the report. I cannot reproduce this so I'd like to ask you to attach a screenshot, maybe it helps to find out what's going on. András ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] more fun with translations
- Original Message - From: Hans-Christoph Steiner h...@at.or.at To: Jonathan Wilkes jancs...@yahoo.com Cc: pd-list@iem.at list pd-list@iem.at Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2012 3:33 PM Subject: Re: [PD] more fun with translations On Dec 27, 2012, at 3:17 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: - Original Message - From: Hans-Christoph Steiner h...@at.or.at To: Jonathan Wilkes jancs...@yahoo.com Cc: pd-list@iem.at list pd-list@iem.at Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 8:54 PM Subject: Re: [PD] more fun with translations On Dec 26, 2012, at 3:27 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: - Original Message - From: Hans-Christoph Steiner h...@at.or.at To: pd-list@iem.at list pd-list@iem.at Cc: Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 2:05 PM Subject: [PD] more fun with translations [...] Is it possible to translate comments of the help patches in 5.reference in a similar manner? Not currently, but that is something I think we can do. I guess the trickiest part is the file format. I suppose there could be a .po file per-language-per-patch. I'd rather see all the translations embedded into the patch. Just made the search-plugin keywords translatable. There's a [_ name] for the keyword, then a keyword which is not translated. Seems to work fine. But again, notice that this just kicks the ball down the field for the non-English-speaking user. Sure, they can get a list of included bandlimited objects, but they all have english descriptions, patches, and readmes (if they have them at all). -Jonathan Definitely true. But this is one step that needs to happen, so its definitely not wasted effort at all. Plus someone now can put [pd META] tags into their tutorials in whatever language, like Porres' portuguese tutorials, and they would be searchable. Just to reiterate: all the symbols that come after KEYWORDS inside [pd META] must remain in English. If you translate those keywords you will be _extremely_ confused because a properly translated search homepage will display translated_foo, and the [pd META] of the patch will have KEYWORDS translated_foo, but the search-plugin will be searching under the hood for foo and you won't get results. Upshot: if you want your Portuguese tutorial to work with the Search by Category links in the search-plugin, write the [pd META] KEYWORDS in English. This puts slightly more work on the developer for the benefit of users reading categories in their native language, and I think that's a fair trade-off. (Of course what would be ideal is for devs to write keywords in their native language, users to see them, and patch translation to just work, but it sounds like it's more complicated than that.) -Jonathan .hc ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] Plugins-plugin bug
On 27/12/2012 22:13, András Murányi wrote: On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 8:26 PM, Pierre-Olivier Boulant po.boul...@free.fr mailto:po.boul...@free.fr wrote: Hi, I have a weird plug-in list in the plug-ins management window. It looks like the content (list of items with check box and info button) is not centred properly. The content is centred on the top left hand corner of the window and not the centre of the actual window. I can just see a quarter of the content window. Using the plugins-plugin version alpha 0.1.20120518 on the latest version of Pd-ext 0.43.4 on Windows 7 (64bits) Cheers Pierre-Olivier Hello Pierre-Olivier, and thanks for the report. I cannot reproduce this so I'd like to ask you to attach a screenshot, maybe it helps to find out what's going on. András Hi András Sorry I can't send you a screen shot any more! It works once again. I had checked multiple times before sending the email this is what I did concerning the plug-in. Maybe there's a clue to be found there. I had overwritten a previous version of the plug-in after updating Pd extended to the latest version. I started Pd and when I went to the plug-in manager I had that bug. I checked several times after restarting Pd several times as well. Eventually I trashed the plug-in from the C:\program files (x86)\common files\Pd\ I have restated Pd in the meantime. When I got your email I copied the plugins-plugin.tcl back in that folder and I just restarted Pd. I went to the plug-in manager and this time it worked fine. I suppose restarting without the plug-in must have fixed things. Basically the bug was that the plug-in window was the regular size with the close button in the right place, but the content, that is the list of plug-ins with the check boxes and info button, was cut off. I had only the top left hand side quarter of the plug-in window box filled with the bottom right hand quarter of the list display. As if the list was centred on the top left hand corner of the window. This is the best I can say. If it should come back I'll send you an update. Cheers Pierre-Olivier ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
On Don, 2012-12-27 at 15:31 -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: On Dec 27, 2012, at 3:29 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: On Dec 27, 2012, at 2:14 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: On Die, 2012-12-25 at 13:00 -0800, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all - I'm afraid to 'fix' this riht now, but will look at it at least. Alternatively I could add a message to pd to restort DSP without stopping/starting the audio I/O, which I'm hoping will at least reduce the need to start/stop SDP all the time. The change that caused this problem is that I fixed Pd not to have the audio system open whern DSP isn't running so that, on APIs in which audio is exclusive (e.g., ALSA) you can turn DSP off in Pd and go off and use another device with Pd remining open. The problem arises when there is one message trying to control many different tasks: * switch DSP computing on/off (save CPU time) * free/occupy the audio back-end (save soundcard time) * mute/unmute Pd (save ears) * force recompilation of the DSP graph An alternative would be to have Pd automatically close audio devices on ALSA, OSS, and MMIO but always keep it open when using jack. But then what about portaudio? I somply don't know the correct way to deal with this. I'd say it's preferable if Pd's behavior is independent from the back-end currently in use. Rather, I suggest to use different messages for different tasks. IMHO, 'dsp 0' really should only turn computation of tilde-objects off as this is what it means and what one expects. What about a new message to pd 'card 0|1' to free devices which would work completely independently from 'dsp 0|1'? This would allow to record a signal to a soundfile without occupying the soundcard, for instance. I think that having a pulseaudio backend for Pd as the default on GNU/Linux would be the best way to solve this problem. Pulse will then handle the multiple apps playing at the same time. Then for people who want to skip Pulse, then can use the ALSA blocking implementation. An Audio API can be quite different than another, so I don't think it makes sense to treat them all the same in terms of things like whether DSP disconnects the audio API. For example Mac OS X CoreAudio, even through PortAudio, always has handled multiple apps playing back. And the audio stuck workaround actually only causes problems with CoreAudio. Here's a pulseaudio implementation for libpd, I'm sure Patrick would be fine for that code to be included in Pd. http://www.workinprogress.ca/libpd/ Pd 0.44 with -pa already supports pulseaudio. -pa is even the default, so it's only a matter of making pulse the default for -pa to get your desired behavior. Roman ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
On Don, 2012-12-27 at 16:06 -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: On Dec 27, 2012, at 3:36 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: On Don, 2012-12-27 at 15:29 -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: On Dec 27, 2012, at 2:14 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: On Die, 2012-12-25 at 13:00 -0800, Miller Puckette wrote: Hi all - I'm afraid to 'fix' this riht now, but will look at it at least. Alternatively I could add a message to pd to restort DSP without stopping/starting the audio I/O, which I'm hoping will at least reduce the need to start/stop SDP all the time. The change that caused this problem is that I fixed Pd not to have the audio system open whern DSP isn't running so that, on APIs in which audio is exclusive (e.g., ALSA) you can turn DSP off in Pd and go off and use another device with Pd remining open. The problem arises when there is one message trying to control many different tasks: * switch DSP computing on/off (save CPU time) * free/occupy the audio back-end (save soundcard time) * mute/unmute Pd (save ears) * force recompilation of the DSP graph An alternative would be to have Pd automatically close audio devices on ALSA, OSS, and MMIO but always keep it open when using jack. But then what about portaudio? I somply don't know the correct way to deal with this. I'd say it's preferable if Pd's behavior is independent from the back-end currently in use. Rather, I suggest to use different messages for different tasks. IMHO, 'dsp 0' really should only turn computation of tilde-objects off as this is what it means and what one expects. What about a new message to pd 'card 0|1' to free devices which would work completely independently from 'dsp 0|1'? This would allow to record a signal to a soundfile without occupying the soundcard, for instance. I think that having a pulseaudio backend for Pd as the default on GNU/Linux would be the best way to solve this problem. Pulse will then handle the multiple apps playing at the same time. Then for people who want to skip Pulse, then can use the ALSA blocking implementation. An Audio API can be quite different than another, so I don't think it makes sense to treat them all the same in terms of things like whether DSP disconnects the audio API. For example Mac OS X CoreAudio, even through PortAudio, always has handled multiple apps playing back. And the audio stuck workaround actually only causes problems with CoreAudio. So you agree that 'dsp 0|1' should not automatically disconnect|connect the audio API, regardless of what API is in use? I don't know enough about the various audio APIs to say whether that's a good idea or not. Perhaps it makes sense with some audio APIs. I'm not sure you understood my proposal. Exactly _because_ it might not make sense for all APIs, I suggested to use a separate message for API on|off, so that 'dsp 0|1' can behave exactly the same with all APIs (as it used to do anyway before 0.43). Does that make sense? Example: I often use an idiom [dsp 0, dynamically create stuff, dsp 1] in my patches. I wouldn't want this to work nicely only with -jack while causing ugly clicks with -alsa or -oss. The patchs behaviour shouldn't be affected by the audio API currently in use. Roman ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] [PD-announce] pd 0.44-0 test 1 released
one thing that locks up pd that comes with ubuntustudio12.10 is switching to jack from alsa. i havent tried to turn dsp off yet i think with older versions i could turn off dsp and change audio settings without pd stopping. i think it also depended on whether i disconnected from qjack connections ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] Can't see comments with ç ã characters
On Dec 21, 2012, at 2:29 PM, IOhannes m zmölnig wrote: On 12/21/2012 20:27, IOhannes m zmölnig wrote: hope this helps with hunting down the problem. i _guess_ that the problem is somehow related to doubly encoding an UTF8 string. anyhow, the way i solved the problem in pdgst, was to set the current locale to C before initializing gstreamer, and then restoring the original locale. it's a bit hacky though. The same thing worked for tclpd. This leads me to believe that perhaps the issue is in Pd itself, that it is not somehow registering its locale properly. But I don't really know where to look. .hc ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] GUI overload
Hey Ed, I just committed a couple more fixes for [tgl] and [mknob] that make them only send the GUI updates when something actually has changed. This can greatly reduce the amount of traffic to the GUI. Can you try your patch with the 2012-12-28 build of Pd-extended and see if you still get freezes? http://autobuild.puredata.info/auto-build/2012-12-28/ .hc On 12/16/2012 08:47 AM, Ed Kelly wrote: Hi List, I'm not going to say whether this is a recurrent problem as it's hard to say whether the rewrite of the GUI has affected it... I'm using a lot of abstractions with larger GOP or non-GOP GUIs, and I find the following problem occurs. There comes a point where the GUI objects stop responding in a patch when it is reloaded. I am wondering if there is a specific limit to GUI objects that could be changed. I think Pd is making some kind of decision that there's too much of this stuff - I'm gonna prioritize the audio and not worry about it and I'd like to know how or if it is possible to control this process from within Pd, or by setting flags on the command line. I'm also making less GUI intensive versions for performance time, since the really big GUI patches are often pattern-sequencers which I will not want to program when I am performing. Example patch enclosed to give you an idea. The really GUI-intensive objects are the trackers, especially quadtracker (which I think has pushed the GUI of Pd patches about as far as I can go now). System: quad core i5 PC running Ubuntu (10.04 Lucid), Pd-0.43-4, lots of externals compiled and loaded. Warm wishes, Ed Gemnotes-0.2: Live music notation for Pure Data, now with dynamics! http://sharktracks.co.uk/ ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
