APSW 3.6.17-r1 released
APSW 3.6.17-r1 is now available. The home page is at http://code.google.com/p/apsw/ which includes full documentation, source and binary distributions for Windows (Python 2.3 onwards including 3.0 3.1). The opensource license used is the zlib/png license. APSW is a wrapper around the SQLite embedded database that provides all SQLite API functionality in Python. It is not DBAPI compliant as it provides SQLite semantics. pysqlite provides DBAPI semantics. You can see the two approaches contrasted at http://apsw.googlecode.com/svn/publish/pysqlite.html Changelist is below and a clickable version at http://apsw.googlecode.com/svn/publish/changes.html APSW has migrated from Subversion to Mercurial for source code control. Hosting remains at Google Code Updated a test due to VFS xUnlock errors now being ignored sometimes by SQLite (SQLite ticket 3946). The downloads page in the help didn’t mention the Windows Python 3.1 installer. Running the test suite is now integrated into setup.py so you can do the building and testing all in one go. Sample command line: $ python setup.py install test The test suite will now check the functionality of the FTS3, RTree and ICU extensions if they were included. (The Windows binary distribution includes FTS3 and RTree by default.) Fixed issue 55 where FTS3 was unintentionally omitted from the Windows binary distribution. Various documentation updates. Roger -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-announce-list Support the Python Software Foundation: http://www.python.org/psf/donations/
SQLObject 0.11.0
Hello! I'm pleased to announce version 0.11.0, the first stable release of 0.11 branch of SQLObject. What is SQLObject = SQLObject is an object-relational mapper. Your database tables are described as classes, and rows are instances of those classes. SQLObject is meant to be easy to use and quick to get started with. SQLObject supports a number of backends: MySQL, PostgreSQL, SQLite, Firebird, Sybase, MSSQL and MaxDB (also known as SAPDB). Where is SQLObject == Site: http://sqlobject.org Development: http://sqlobject.org/devel/ Mailing list: https://lists.sourceforge.net/mailman/listinfo/sqlobject-discuss Archives: http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.python.sqlobject Download: http://cheeseshop.python.org/pypi/SQLObject/0.11.0 News and changes: http://sqlobject.org/News.html What's New == News since 0.10 - Features Interface * Dropped support for Python 2.3. The minimal version of Python for SQLObject is 2.4 now. * Dropped support for PostgreSQL 7.2. The minimal supported version of PostgreSQL is 7.3 now. * New magic attribute 'j' similar to 'q' was added that automagically does join with the other table in MultipleJoin or RelatedJoin. * SQLObject can now create and drop a database in MySQL, PostgreSQL, SQLite and Firebird/Interbase. * Added some support for schemas in PostgreSQL. * Added DecimalStringCol - similar to DecimalCol but stores data as strings to work around problems in some drivers and type affinity problem in SQLite. * Added sqlobject.include.hashcol.HashCol - a column type that automatically hashes anything going into it, and returns out an object that hashes anything being compared to itself. Basically, it's good for really simple one-way password fields, and it even supports the assignment of None to indicate no password set. By default, it uses the md5 library for hashing, but this can be changed in a HashCol definition. * RowDestroyedSignal and RowUpdatedSignal were added. Minor features ~~ * Use reversed() in manager/command.py instead of .__reversed__(). * Minor change in logging to console - logger no longer stores the output file, it gets the file from module sys every time by name; this means logging will use new sys.stdout (or stderr) in case the user changed them. * Changed the order of testing of SQLite modules - look for external PySQLite2 before sqlite3. For a more complete list, please see the news: http://sqlobject.org/News.html Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-announce-list Support the Python Software Foundation: http://www.python.org/psf/donations/
Re: Bug in format specification in Python 3?
Robert Dailey wrote:
I notice that the '0x' portion is counted in the width, which was
specified as 8. This seems wrong to me. Is this by design? If so, why?
Yes, it's the total field width. This is consistent with
the other formats, in which it includes decimal points,
signs, etc.
If you don't want that, then write the format string as
'This is a hex number: 0x{:08x}'
--
Greg
--
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Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
ru...@yahoo.com wrote: Such a reorg is not a simple matter of moving a file from here to there. It will require a lot moving about of sections and a lot of word-smithing to glue them back together again in a coherent way. Concerning this particular issue, not everyone would agree that the doc sections in question are misplaced. In Python the distinction between builtin and library types is fairly blurry. There are advantages to having them all documented in one place -- when looking for info about a type, you don't have to try to guess whether it's considered built-in or not to know which manual to look in. -- Greg -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Frustrated with scopes
James Stroud wrote: def stream_factory: class Line(object): __source = source __join = join # etc. return Line of course I meant def stream_factory(lines, source, join=''.join): James -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
On Aug 12, 3:32 pm, James Stroud nospamjstroudmap...@mbi.ucla.edu
wrote:
You should be more imaginative.
I'm by no means discounting that there might be some actual problem
you're trying to solve here, but I honestly can't see it.
There really is no need to get personal about this, so rather than
asking for a level of imagination from me, (which I apparently lack),
please just explain to me how {one_instance_of_a_hashable_class : val,
another_instance_of_a_hashable_class :val} is conceptually different
{one_instance_of_class_str: val, another_instance_of_class_str: val},
in terms of persistence.
If I am missing something here, I would actually like to know. If on
the other hand, I'm not, then rather at taking umbrage, you might want
instead to save yourself the effort of solving a non-existent problem?
Can you come give a class to my users?
No.
However, I think it's fairly central to the notion of a class that it
is a template for creating different instances which themselves have a
unique identity. And that subsequent calls to a class' constructor
ought to create unique instances of that class (subject perhaps to
implementation tricks such as interning). If it is not obvious that {C
():4}[C()] invovles subsequent calls to C's constructor, then that
very example is itself didactic.
--
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Re: hashability
2009/8/11 Asun Friere afri...@yahoo.co.uk:
On Aug 12, 12:15 pm, James Stroud jstr...@mbi.ucla.edu wrote:
I realize I left out my use. The intent of the function is to flag
objects that will make useful keys for a persistent dictionary. The
{C():4}[C()] example demonstrates why I want to avoid certain types of
keys--I don't want users to do things like {C():4, C():4}, which python
happily allows but falls apart at the level of persistence.
What am I missing here? How, in terms of persistence, is {C():4, C():
4} conceptually different from {'spam':4, 'ham':4}?
Consider the case of pickling the data twice to 2 separate files.
When loaded from both files into the same program, the spam-ham dicts
will work as expected.
The C()s will not. For cs1[cs2.keys()[0]] will raise KeyError.
Cheers,
Chris
--
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Re: hashability
On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 2:25 AM, Chris Rebertc...@rebertia.com wrote: 2009/8/11 Asun Friere afri...@yahoo.co.uk: On Aug 12, 12:15 pm, James Stroud jstr...@mbi.ucla.edu wrote: Apologies for the possible repeated post. Gmail failed to mark the draft as sent for some reason. - Chris -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
On Aug 12, 3:52 pm, Chris Rebert ch...@rebertia.com wrote: Thought Experiment: Consider, for each dict, the case of pickling it twice to 2 separate files. When loaded from both files into the same program, the spam-ham dicts will work as expected between each other. The dicts with C()s will not. For example, assuming the unpickled dicts are `cs1` and `cs2`, cs1[cs2.keys()[0]] will raise KeyError. Aha! cheers. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 2:18 AM, Asun Friereafri...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: On Aug 12, 3:32 pm, James Stroud nospamjstroudmap...@mbi.ucla.edu wrote: You should be more imaginative. I'm by no means discounting that there might be some actual problem you're trying to solve here, but I honestly can't see it. How about a cache? Hashing by id means nothing across machines or even process runs on the same machine. -- David blog: http://www.traceback.org twitter: http://twitter.com/dstanek -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
Asun Friere wrote:
On Aug 12, 3:32 pm, James Stroud nospamjstroudmap...@mbi.ucla.edu
wrote:
You should be more imaginative.
I'm by no means discounting that there might be some actual problem
you're trying to solve here, but I honestly can't see it.
There really is no need to get personal about this, so rather than
asking for a level of imagination from me, (which I apparently lack),
please just explain to me how {one_instance_of_a_hashable_class : val,
another_instance_of_a_hashable_class :val} is conceptually different
{one_instance_of_class_str: val, another_instance_of_class_str: val},
in terms of persistence.
Sorry for being a twit. This list used to be quite nice but some people
on this list got pretty abrasive. I couldn't tell you weren't one of
these abrasive people from your post. I stopped giving the benefit of
the doubt many moons ago and promptly enter attack mode at the slightest
hint of abrasiveness. My attitude probably exacerbates the problem--but
it sure does make me feel better.
Anyway, I think the problem has been described better than I'm able, but
once an object goes to the file system, one can not take its hash value
for granted. It is not possible to rely on the ability to recreate any
arbitrary object de-novo and use the recreation as a key in proxy for
the original object. I'm after this je ne sais pas que l'appeler
quality of objects to use as keys (or to generate keys) for persistent
dictionaries. Carl Banks suggested that this quality should not be
called hashable, so I'm calling it keyable.
--
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Re: create shell history with python
Diez B. Roggisch de...@nospam.web.de wrote: Joel Juvenal Rivera Rivera schrieb: I been thinking how to make a 'bash like history shell' in python, i don't know if with stdin and stdout i can accomplish this or do i need something like curses and stuff like that, anyway im start to figure this out. Does any body has try this? or have any interesting idea? Don't waste your time, use IPython :) http://ipython.scipy.org/moin/ for python 2.x only, unfortunately -- --- | Radovan Garabík http://kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk/~garabik/ | | __..--^^^--..__garabik @ kassiopeia.juls.savba.sk | --- Antivirus alert: file .signature infected by signature virus. Hi! I'm a signature virus! Copy me into your signature file to help me spread! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Unrecognized escape sequences in string literals
On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 14:48:24 -0700, Douglas Alan wrote: In any case, my argument has consistently been that Python should have treated undefined escape sequences consistently as fatal errors, A reasonable position to take. I disagree with it, but it is certainly reasonable. not as warnings. I don't know what language you're talking about here, because non-special escape sequences in Python aren't either errors or warnings: print ab\cd ab\cd No warning is made, because it's not considered an error that requires a warning. This matches the behaviour of other languages, including C and bash. -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
On Aug 12, 4:52 pm, James Stroud nospamjstroudmap...@mbi.ucla.edu wrote: Sorry for being a twit. Don't be ridiculous. You haven't been a twit, I have! I've just had a complete blonde moment here (with apologies to any real blondes out there. My only excuse is that I've been up to 02:30 for the last three nights running (or maybe it's the ageing process, a cerebrovascular accident or something). I just checked a class I recently wrote specifically for the purposes of hashing a dict (in case I had made this error IRL). Wouldn't you know it, it's subclassed to tuple, and defines both __eq__ and __cmp__. Luckily when I write production code the guy who knows what he's doing takes over. And this in an app which compares keys from different pickled files (representing DB holdings)?! Of all things. I can't believe how unfathomably stupid I've been. I'm extremely embarassed. I think I'll just go out and shoot myself now. Or get some sleep. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: ElementTree - Howto access text within XML tag element...
cmalmqui wrote:
tree = etree.parse('10_07_2009 16_48_00_history.tcx')
root = tree.getroot()
elem = root[0][0]
# iterate over all laps
for i in range(1, len(elem)-1):
Note that you can iterate over elements as in
for lap_element in elem:
# ...
Then use
record = lap.find(recordtagname)
to find things inside the subtree. You can also use XPath-like expressions
such as
all_intersting_elements =
lap.findall(sometag/somechild//somedescendant)
Stefan
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Re: hashability
On Aug 12, 5:14 pm, Dennis Lee Bieber wlfr...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
c1 = C()
c2 = C()
{c1:4}[c2]
to behave? That IS the equivalent of your statement -- two instances are
two distinctly different entities...
Thankyou, that is EXACTLY the mistake I made that sent me off into
lunacy.
At the risk of further embarassment, the answer is that one would
expect it to behave analogously to:
c1 = int(x)
c2 = int(x)
{c1:4}[c2]
Or is my brain still on vacation?
--
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Re: hashability
Dennis Lee Bieber wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 17:54:36 -0700, James Stroud jstr...@mbi.ucla.edu
declaimed the following in gmane.comp.python.general:
...
py {C():4}[C()]
Traceback (most recent call last):
File ipython console, line 1, in module
type 'exceptions.KeyError': __main__.C object at 0xe21610
The basis for the exception is that the two instances do not have the
same hash() although conceptually they might seem equal to the
unitiated. Were I to re-design python, I'd throw an exception in this
case because of the ill-defined behavior one might expect if a C()
serves as a key for a dict.
A C()... How would you expect
c1 = C()
c2 = C()
{c1:4}[c2]
to behave?
This seems like a subjective question. I think I demonstrated how it
*does* behave, which is purely objective--and I know I can't do anything
about that. But the subjective answer to the subjective question is that
I would like an exception to be raised when the dictionary is
constructed. I know an exception doesn't get thrown in the current
incarnation of the python language. That is the objective reality of the
situation which affronts my subjective notions of how reality should be.
That IS the equivalent of your statement -- two instances are
two distinctly different entities...
Tell that to two different machines on two different days. Then bet the
life of yourself and your nearest and dearest family on that fact and
see whether you really want to take a hash value for granted. If a
property of the python language fails the bet the lives of your nearest
and dearest on a consistent result test, I call it ill defined and,
subjectively speaking, I prefer exceptions to be thrown--And, by damned,
I'll throw them myself if I have to.
If it saves one life, it's worth it all.
James
--
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Re: hashability
On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 17:54:36 -0700, James Stroud wrote:
Hello All,
I wrote the function to test hashability of arbitrary objects. My reason
is that the built-in python (2.5) hashing is too permissive for some
uses. A symptom of this permissiveness comes from the ability to
successfully hash() arbitrary objects:
No it doesn't.
hash([])
Traceback (most recent call last):
File stdin, line 1, in module
TypeError: list objects are unhashable
Python successfully hashes *non*-arbitrary objects, including those that
inherit from object.
py class C(object): pass
...
py {C():4}[C()]
Traceback (most recent call last):
File ipython console, line 1, in module
type 'exceptions.KeyError': __main__.C object at 0xe21610
Why would you expect that to succeed? The object you are using as the key
is a different instance than the object you are looking up. Since your
instances don't even compare equal, why would you expect them to hash
equal?
C() == C()
False
The basis for the exception is that the two instances do not have the
same hash() although conceptually they might seem equal to the
unitiated.
Yes, well, the ignorant and uninitiated frequently make mistakes. I feel
your pain.
Were I to re-design python, I'd throw an exception in this
case because of the ill-defined behavior one might expect if a C()
serves as a key for a dict.
It's not ill-defined, it's a perfectly reasonable design you just don't
happen to like. It's quite useful for some.
To prevent users of one of my libraries from falling into this and
similar traps (which have potentially problematic consequences), I came
up with this test for hashability:
That's not a test for hashability. That's a test for hashability and
equality testing together.
def hashable(k):
try:
hash(k)
except TypeError:
good = False
else:
good = (hasattr(k, '__hash__') and
(hasattr(k, '__eq__') or hasattr(k, '__cmp__')))
return good
The test for __hash__ is redundant, given that hash() has already
succeeded.
It will wrongly reject classes that deliberately don't define equality,
for whatever reason, and that *expect* the behaviour you are treating as
an error.
It works as I would like for most of the cases I can invent:
py all(map(hashable, [1,1.0,,(1,2,3)])) True
py any(map(hashable, [None, [1,2], {}, C(), __import__('sys')]))
False
Well there you go -- why on earth would you prohibit None as a dictionary
key??? That's a serious failure.
--
Steven
--
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Re: Unrecognized escape sequences in string literals
On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 13:20:52 -0700, Douglas Alan wrote: On Aug 11, 2:00 pm, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this- cybersource.com.au wrote: test.cpp:1:1: warning: unknown escape sequence '\y' Isn't that a warning, not a fatal error? So what does temp contain? My Annotated C++ Reference Manual is packed, and surprisingly in Stroustrup's Third Edition, there is no mention of the issue in the entire 1,000 pages. But Microsoft to the rescue: If you want a backslash character to appear within a string, you must type two backslashes (\\) (From http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/69ze775t.aspx) Should I assume that Microsoft's C++ compiler treats it as an error, not a warning? Or is is this *still* undefined behaviour, and MS C++ compiler will happily compile ab\cd whatever it feels like? The question of what any specific C++ does if you ignore the warning is irrelevant, as such behavior in C++ is almost *always* undefined. Hence the warning. So a C++ compiler which follows Python's behaviour would be behaving within the language specifications. I note that the bash shell, which claims to follow C semantics, also does what Python does: $ echo $'a s\trin\g with escapes' a s rin\g with escapes Explain to me again why we're treating underspecified C++ semantics, which may or may not do *exactly* what Python does, as if it were the One True Way of treating escape sequences? -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: better way?
On 12 Aug., 09:14, Dennis Lee Bieber wlfr...@ix.netcom.com wrote: On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 11:45:50 -0700 (PDT), Pet petshm...@googlemail.com declaimed the following in gmane.comp.python.general: Oh, forgotten to mention. It's PostGres Really? There are still installations of an RDBMS that predates the commonalization of SQL? I suspect you mean PostgreSQL -- it IS a different beast from the older Postgres. O, yeah. Of course it is PostgreSQL In either event -- my old books don't show an all in one solution. Best answer is probably to create some stored procedures which you call instead of plain INSERT; the stored procedure could then do whatever is needed to check for a duplicate (actually the easiest, I'd think, would be: if primary key is supplied, it is an UPDATE; if primary key is NULL or not supplied, it is an insert and the primary key will be auto-generated). I don't really like the idea of stored procedure, because query would depend on existence of it then. On the other side, it looks like best option. -- Wulfraed Dennis Lee Bieber KD6MOG wlfr...@ix.netcom.com HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
Answering myself... Chris Withers wrote: In article mailman.4598.1250022343.8015.python-l...@python.org, Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.uk wrote: Does anyone know of an alternative library for creating http requests and getting their responses that's faster but hopefully has a similar interface? PyCurl This seems to be a wrapper around libcurl. Does it work on Windows? Not by my definition of work: - there are no windows binaries for libcurl - getting https support on windows seems pretty hit'n'miss: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/197444/building-libcurl-with-ssl-support-on-windows I'm still reeling from what seems to be such a huge problem with httplib that seem to be largely ignored :-( Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Batch Processing Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 14:50:51 -0700, rurpy wrote: The issue tracker is fine for many things, but the process it provides is equivalent to peep-hole optimization. How does one submit a tracker issue for something like the overall organization of the docs (for example, the mis-placement of things like data- types in the library manual rather than the language manual)? The same way you would submit a tracker issue for anything. Documentation bug: Data types are misplaced in the library manual instead of the language manual. Suggested alternative: move page docs.python.org/xyz.html to abc.html But that's the problem. Such a reorg is not a simple matter of moving a file from here to there. It will require a lot moving about of sections and a lot of word-smithing to glue them back together again in a coherent way. That's no different from *any* major refactoring. The exact same problem exists for code as well as documentation. It's a solved problem for code, and it's a solved problem for documentation. In some order: Consensus that there is a problem that needs solving; Volunteer(s) to do the work; Somebody to take responsibility to check the changes in. Sometimes, in the face of apathy or disagreement (which may very well be justified), you have to at least partly solve the problem *before* people will agree that it needed to be solved. Welcome to the real world. A tracker issue, even one that was fairly specific about how things should be reorganized but which did not provide all the needed changes (a large patch) would almost certainly be ignored or rejected. Yes it would. Most patches are ignored, because the dev team are overworked, and if they don't see the need for a patch, they won't approve it. But providing a large patch raises two questions. How likely is it to be be accepted? (Something anyone would want to know before investing the time.) And how to actually do the work needed to generate it (it could be a very large amount of work for an individual and I don't think it can be broken down into small independent issues.) How is one to test the waters as to acceptability, or solicit help, if one simply submits a tracker issue? No, submitting a tracker issue is a necessary but not sufficient step. Without a tracker issue, you're very unlikely to have people agree to replace the existing docs with your docs, although a PEP would probably do it. (A PEP is significantly more effort than raising a tracker issue.) You also have to get attention from those with check-in privileges. If they approve your patches, you're done. If they don't approve them, or fail to respond, you can try convincing them, or taking it to the Python- Dev list and request somebody review your patches. If you have no patches, perhaps because you're unwilling to invest the effort without a guarantee that it will be treated seriously, then you need to get some sort of consensus among the relevant people that the problem is worth solving. Guess what? Sometimes others will disagree with you. What you see as the Worst. Docs. EVAR. may be seen as perfectly adequate, even excellent, by others. If this is the case, remember, Python isn't your product, you don't have veto over what goes into it. Feel free to publish your alternatives. Write a book. Go home and cry into your beer over it. Whatever. Sometimes you win, and sometimes you don't. This is the same process whether dealing with code or documentation. - if people are keen on a Python wiki, then by all means publish one, just don't expect the Python dev team to build and manage it for you; As luminous a Pythoneer as Fredrik Lundh set up a documentation wiki to collect user contributions but it has faded away. If he couldn't pull it off then I'd say most other attempts without the backing of python.org are almost certainly doomed to failure. Perhaps that's a good indication that a Python wiki *doesn't* fulfill a need in the community, and that despite what a few squeaky wheels think, the docs *are* doing a good job? As long as every the docs sux complaint is met here with the standard responses that I've mentioned, But they aren't met with such a so-called standard response. rather than, yes, they do have some problems, what do you think we should do about them?, We know that there are problems. We've said repeatedly that corrections and patches are welcome. We've repeatedly told you how to communicate your answer to the question of what should be done. None of this is good enough for you. I don't know what else you expect. If you won't put in the effort, and you won't put in the money, then it won't happen. Moaning that other people aren't putting in the money to hire team of professional writers isn't productive, and moaning that other people aren't putting in the effort to improve the docs isn't either. Eh? I have a computer filled with software that I put no money or
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
2009/8/11 Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: There are gals too here. It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Give the attitudes still prevalent in our industry (cf http://tinyurl.com/c5nqju and many more), I'm sorry to say that I don't think this is funny. -- Cheers, Simon B. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Invitation to connect on LinkedIn
LinkedIn I'd like to add you to my professional network on LinkedIn. - Jey Learn more: https://www.linkedin.com/e/isd/682391381/2q9uIjvU/ -- (c) 2009, LinkedIn Corporation -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On Tuesday 11 August 2009 19:53:16 Steven D'Aprano wrote: You want community input into the docs, but you're not willing to give that input except to bitch and moan and sook that the tracker is no good. wtf does the verb sook mean? I find: sook /sʊk/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [sook] Show IPA Use sook in a Sentence –noun 1. Australia and New Zealand. a timid, cowardly person, esp. a young person; crybaby. –interjection 2. Midland U.S. (used to summon cows from the pasture). Origin: 1890–95; prob. from earlier sense “calf reared by hand,” perh. suck(-calf), with sp. repr. N England, Scots pron. of suck (but earliest cited pron. of sook is (so̅o̅k)) Sometimes English drives me crazy. - Hendrik -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Scraping Wikipedia with Python
* Dotan Cohen (Tue, 11 Aug 2009 21:29:40 +0300) Wikipedia has an API for computer access. See http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/API Yes, I am aware of this as well. Does anyone know of a python class for easily interacting with it, or do I need to roll my own. http://pypi.python.org/pypi?%3Aaction=searchterm=wikipedia ? Thorsten -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: looping through values in a dictionary and appending to a list
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 8:17 PM, Krishna Pacificipacifi...@warnell.uga.edu wrote: Nevermind, got it. Sorry. Krishna Pacifici 08/11/09 2:12 PM Hi, I want to append the values of a dictionary to a list. I have a dictionary sec_dict_clean and I want to append the values to a list, but am having a hard time looping through the values in the dictionary. I have tried something like this: lista=[] for i in sec_dict_clean.values(): for j in sec_dict_clean.values()[i]: lista.append(sec_dict_clean.values()[i]) But I keep on getting an error: TypeError: list indices must be integers Any ideas on how to loop through values in a dictionary? lista=[] for value in sec_dict_clean.values(): lista.append(value) but even simpler would be: lista = sec_dict_clean.values() -- André Engels, andreeng...@gmail.com -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
On Tuesday 11 August 2009 22:52:34 Robert Dailey wrote: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: Robert Dailey: This breaks the flow of scope. Would you guys solve this problem by moving failMsg into global scope? Perhaps through some other type of syntax? There are gals too here. This may help:http://docs.python.org/library/textwrap.html#textwrap.dedent Bye, bearophile It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Well it may come as a surprise to you, but it was a woman who wrote one of the first compilers. She became an Admiral in the US navy as a result. If I recall correctly, her name was Grace Hooper. How many compilers have you written from scratch, without a compiler to help you? :-) - Hendrik -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Unrecognized escape sequences in string literals
On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 14:29:43 -0700, Douglas Alan wrote:
I need to preface this entire post with the fact that I've already used
ALL of the arguments that you've provided on my friend before I ever
even came here with the topic, and my own arguments on why Python can be
considered to be doing the right thing on this issue didn't even
convince ME, much less him. When I can't even convince myself with an
argument I'm making, then you know there's a problem with it!
I hear all your arguments, and to play Devil's Advocate I repeat them,
and they don't convince me either. So by your logic, there's obviously a
problem with your arguments as well!
That problem basically boils down to a deep-seated philosophical
disagreement over which philosophy a language should follow in regard to
backslash escapes:
Anything not explicitly permitted is forbidden
versus
Anything not explicitly forbidden is permitted
Python explicitly permits all escape sequences, with well-defined
behaviour, with the only ones forbidden being those explicitly forbidden:
* hex escapes with invalid hex digits;
* oct escapes with invalid oct digits;
* Unicode named escapes with unknown names;
* 16- and 32-bit Unicode escapes with invalid hex digits.
C++ apparently forbids all escape sequences, with unspecified behaviour
if you use a forbidden sequence, except for a handful of explicitly
permitted sequences.
That's not better, it's merely different.
Actually, that's not true -- that the C++ standard forbids a thing, but
leaves the consequences of doing that thing unspecified, is clearly a Bad
Thing.
[...]
Apart from the lack of warning, what actually is the difference between
Python's behavior and C++'s behavior?
That question makes just about as much sense as, Apart from the lack of
a fatal error, what actually is the difference between Python's behavior
and C++'s?
This is what I get:
[steve ~]$ cat test.cc
#include iostream
int main(int argc, char* argv[])
{
std::cout x\yz std::endl;
return 0;
}
[steve ~]$ g++ test.cc -o test
test.cc:4:14: warning: unknown escape sequence '\y'
[st...@soy ~]$ ./test
xyz
So on at least one machine in the world, C++ simply strips out
backslashes that it doesn't recognise, leaving the suffix. Unfortunately,
we can't rely on that, because C++ is underspecified. Fortunately this is
not a problem with Python, which does completely specify the behaviour of
escape sequences so there are no surprises.
[...]
I disagree with your sense of aesthetics. I think that having to write
\\y when I want \y just to satisfy a bondage-and-discipline compiler is
ugly. That's not to deny that BD isn't useful on occasion, but in this
case I believe the benefit is negligible, and so even a tiny cost is
not worth the pain.
EXPLICIT IS BETTER THAN IMPLICIT.
Quoting the Zen without understanding (especially shouting) doesn't
impress anyone. There's nothing implicit about escape sequences. \y is
perfectly explicit. Look Ma, there's a backslash, and a y, it gives a
backslash and a y!
Implicit has an actual meaning. You shouldn't use it as a mere term of
opprobrium for anything you don't like.
(2) That argument disagrees with the Python reference manual, which
explicitly states that unrecognized escape sequences are left in the
string unchanged, and that the purpose for doing so is because it
is useful when debugging.
How does it disagree? \y in the source code mapping to \y in the string
object is the sequence being left unchanged. And the usefulness of
doing so is hardly a disagreement over the fact that it does so.
Because you've stated that \y is a legal escape sequence, while the
Python Reference Manual explicitly states that it is an unrecognized
escape sequence, and that such unrecognized escape sequences are
sources of bugs.
There's that reading comprehension problem again.
Unrecognised != illegal.
Useful for debugging != source of bugs. If they were equal, we could
fix an awful lot of bugs by throwing away our debugging tools.
Here's the URL to the relevant page:
http://www.python.org/doc/2.5.2/ref/strings.html
It seems to me that the behaviour the Python designers were looking to
avoid was the case where the coder accidentally inserted a backslash in
the wrong place, and the language stripped the backslash out, e.g.:
Wanted a\bcd but accidentally typed ab\cd instead, and got abcd.
(This is what Bash does by design, and at least some C/C++ compilers do,
perhaps by accident, perhaps by design.)
In that case, with no obvious backslash, the user may not even be aware
that there was a problem:
s = ab\cd # assume the backslash is silently discarded
assert len(s) == 4
assert s[3] == 'c'
assert '\\' not in s
All of these tests would wrongly pass, but with Python's behaviour of
leaving the backslash in, they would all fail, and the string is visually
distinctive (it has an obvious backslash in it).
Now, if you consider that \c should be
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
Hendrik van Rooyen wrote: On Tuesday 11 August 2009 22:52:34 Robert Dailey wrote: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: Robert Dailey: This breaks the flow of scope. Would you guys solve this problem by moving failMsg into global scope? Perhaps through some other type of syntax? There are gals too here. This may help:http://docs.python.org/library/textwrap.html#textwrap.dedent Bye, bearophile It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Well it may come as a surprise to you, but it was a woman who wrote one of the first compilers. She became an Admiral in the US navy as a result. If I recall correctly, her name was Grace Hooper. Grace Hopper. The saying It's easier to ask forgiveness than it is to get permission is attributed to her. How many compilers have you written from scratch, without a compiler to help you? :-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On 12 Aug, 09:58, Steven D'Aprano ste...@remove.this.cybersource.com.au wrote: We know that there are problems. We've said repeatedly that corrections and patches are welcome. We've repeatedly told you how to communicate your answer to the question of what should be done. None of this is good enough for you. I don't know what else you expect. Maybe the problem is that although everyone welcomes contributions and changes (or says that they do), the mechanisms remain largely beyond criticism. Consequently, one sees occasional laments about there not being enough people contributing to Python core development and soul- searching about the reasons this might be so. If it were insisted that changes to, say, Wikipedia were to be proposed by submitting a patch or report for perusal by the editors and for future inclusion in some version of the project, the whole project would most likely be a shadow of its current self, and ambitions of large-scale collaborative editing in general would still be ridiculed. A free-for-all isn't likely to be the best solution for more actively edited Python documentation, but Wiki solutions undeniably provide a superior fast path for edits by trusted users to be incorporated and published in accessible end-user documentation. Almost every analysis of the current (and previous) documentation mechanisms has identified the editorial workflow as a bottleneck and then proceeded to replicate such a bottleneck in any proposed solution. I'm starting to believe that there's a certain snobbery about Wiki solutions which lead many people to develop all sorts of short-term, arcane solutions under the illusion that something super-special and customised is necessary and that they have to start virtually from scratch in order to cater to the ultra-special needs of the target audience; by the time they're done, no-one's interested any more, except to propose the next legacy system in the making. [...] That some of us choose to invest it somewhere other than Python does not deprive of of our right to point out problems in Python when we note them. Of course not. But it does mean that you won't be taken seriously, and you have no right to be taken seriously. That's an absurd position that has soured the reputation of numerous projects. When someone spends the time to write a bug report, they are often investing as much time and effort in something that they are able to in any productive sense. I make a habit of submitting bug reports to software distributions, typically so that the people who are responsible for the components involved can investigate the problem effectively. When the maintainers just close such reports or mark them with a number of different labels which mostly indicate that they consider those reports not worth their time, it sends the message that they consider their time to be vastly more important than their users, even though their users might have set aside an hour of their potentially busy schedule which might have meant sacrificing something else that should have taken higher priority (like time for sleeping, in my own personal experience). Thus, I've had the impression with some projects that I should be maintaining all sorts of stuff - the bootloader, the kernel, various desktop applications, Mozilla - all so that stuff actually gets fixed and that I'm not perceived as just another user whose bug reports aren't welcome. I don't find this reasonable at all when in many cases there *are* people getting paid to do these jobs. The Python core developers seem more attentive than in various other projects, but please let us not establish the delicate genius mentality that has infested other projects to the point that any criticism is automatically labelled as ungrateful whining by people who supposedly don't use the software, have an axe to grind, and who are apparent simpletons who don't understand the revolutionary vision of the project leadership. If you think throwing away goodwill is an acceptable way of silencing complaints, please take a look at just about any article about KDE 4 that permits reader comments to see how much goodwill can be lost and what effect that has on a project's reputation. Paul -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 03:32:08 -0700, Paul Boddie wrote: On 12 Aug, 09:58, Steven D'Aprano ste...@remove.this.cybersource.com.au wrote: We know that there are problems. We've said repeatedly that corrections and patches are welcome. We've repeatedly told you how to communicate your answer to the question of what should be done. None of this is good enough for you. I don't know what else you expect. Maybe the problem is that although everyone welcomes contributions and changes (or says that they do), the mechanisms remain largely beyond criticism. Consequently, one sees occasional laments about there not being enough people contributing to Python core development and soul- searching about the reasons this might be so. If it were insisted that changes to, say, Wikipedia were to be proposed by submitting a patch or report for perusal by the editors and for future inclusion in some version of the project, the whole project would most likely be a shadow of its current self, and ambitions of large-scale collaborative editing in general would still be ridiculed. If Python had the tens of thousands of users, and hundreds of trusted (for some definition of trusted) editors, then Python could run using the same model as Wikipedia. The Wikipedia model is great, and I contribute to it myself. But Wikipedia gets its users from the entire population of web-users, because there's something of interest to everyone in Wikipedia. Interested in movies? There are Wikipedia pages for you to contribute to. Interested in medicine? There are pages you can help with. Interested in the history and development of the mechanical pencil? There's probably even a page for you. And if there isn't, you can create one. With tens of millions of web users, it's no surprise that Wikipedia can attract thousands of editors. But this does not apply to Python, which starts from a comparatively tiny population, primarily those interested in Python. Have a look at the Wikipedia page for Python. The Talk Page has comments from no more than *eight* people. The History stats suggest that, over seven years, only sixty-nine people have made more than a single edit to the page, most of them having made just two edits. Just 36 people have made more than two edits, and some of those are bots. Only one user, Lulu of the Lotus-Eaters (David Mertz), has made more than 100 edits. A free-for-all isn't likely to be the best solution for more actively edited Python documentation, but Wiki solutions undeniably provide a superior fast path for edits by trusted users to be incorporated and published in accessible end-user documentation. And the Python time-machine strikes again: http://wiki.python.org/moin/ That some of us choose to invest it somewhere other than Python does not deprive of of our right to point out problems in Python when we note them. Of course not. But it does mean that you won't be taken seriously, and you have no right to be taken seriously. That's an absurd position that has soured the reputation of numerous projects. When someone spends the time to write a bug report, they are often investing as much time and effort in something that they are able to in any productive sense. Firstly, in context, I wasn't talking to somebody who had made bug reports. I was talking to somebody whose only contribution, as near as I can tell, was to loudly complain that there are flaws in the Python documentation and insist that somebody else should fix them just the way he wants them fixed -- without being willing to even explain how he wants them fixed. Possibly the developers are expected to intuit from first principles what he wants. Secondly, the world is full of complainers who won't lift a finger to help but demand others help them. It may be unfair to tar everybody with the same brush, but life is to short and time to valuable to avoid making judgements as to who to pay attention to. Those who invest a lot of effort into providing patches get listened to closely; so do those who make good quality detailed bug reports. Those who just say It's broken, fix it don't. Sometimes that will mean that someone with genuinely good ideas will be ignored, but that's the price one pays for avoiding being drowned by a chorus of trivial, contradictory, vague and insubstantial complaints. If the Python Dev team paid attention to every post here claiming that Python has a bug when the bug was actually in the complainant's own code, we'd probably still be running Python 1.5. I make a habit of submitting bug reports to software distributions, typically so that the people who are responsible for the components involved can investigate the problem effectively. When the maintainers just close such reports or mark them with a number of different labels which mostly indicate that they consider those reports not worth their time, it sends the message that they consider their time to be
Re: Frustrated with scopes
andrew cooke wrote: On Aug 12, 7:49 am, andrew cooke and...@acooke.org wrote: On Aug 12, 1:51 am, James Stroud nospamjstroudmap...@mbi.ucla.edu wrote: andrew cooke wrote: Is there a way to make this work (currently scope and join are undefined at runtime when the inner class attributes are defined): class _StreamFactory(object): @staticmethod def __call__(lines, source, join=''.join): class Line(object): __source = source __join = join [...] It would be helpful if you were to describe the type of behavior you expect. Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. When run the code gives NameError: name 'source' is not defined because the class namespace blocks the function namespace (or something...). ie when the __call__ method is invoked on an instance of _StreamFactory. But you can refer to the arguments if you don't insist on setting them as class-attributes: def factory(foo, bar): class A(object): def do_something(self): print foo, bar return A() a = factory(10, 20) a.do_something() Diez -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: matching patterns after regex?
On Aug 12, 12:53 pm, Bernard bernard.ch...@gmail.com wrote: On 12 août, 06:15, Martin mdeka...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, I have a string (see below) and ideally I would like to pull out the decimal number which follows the bounding coordinate information. For example ideal from this string I would return... s = '\nGROUP = ARCHIVEDMETADATA\n GROUPTYPE= MASTERGROUP\n\n GROUP = BOUNDINGRECTANGLE\n\nOBJECT = NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n NUM_VAL = 1\n VALUE= 19.82039\nEND_OBJECT = NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n\nOBJECT = SOUTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n NUM_VAL = 1\n VALUE= 9.910197\nEND_OBJECT = SOUTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n\nOBJECT = EASTBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n NUM_VAL = 1\n VALUE= 10.6506458717851\nEND_OBJECT = EASTBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n\nOBJECT = WESTBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n NUM_VAL = 1\n VALUE= 4.3188348375893e-15\nEND_OBJECT = WESTBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n\n END_GROUP NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE = 19.82039 SOUTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE = 9.910197 EASTBOUNDINGCOORDINATE = 10.6506458717851 WESTBOUNDINGCOORDINATE = 4.3188348375893e-15 so far I have only managed to extract the numbers by doing re.findall ([\d.]*\d, s), which returns ['1', '19.82039', '1', '9.910197', '1', '10.6506458717851', '1', '4.3188348375893', '15', etc. Now the first problem that I can see is that my string match chops off the e-15 part and I am not sure how to incorporate the potential for that in my pattern match. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I could also match this? Ideally I would have a statement which printed the number between the two bounding coordinate strings for example NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n NUM_VAL = 1\n VALUE= 19.82039\nEND_OBJECT = NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE\n\n Something that matched NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE and printed the decimal number before it hit the next string NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE. But I am not sure how to do this. any suggestions would be appreciated. Many thanks Martin Hey Martin, here's a regex I've just tested : (\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\. \w-]+) the first match corresponds to the whateverBOUNDINGCOORDINATE and the second match is the value. please provide some more entries if you'd like me to test my regex some more :) cheers Bernard Thanks Bernard it doesn't seem to be working for me... I tried re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s) is that what you meant? Apologies if not, that results in a syntax error: In [557]: re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s) File ipython console, line 1 re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s) ^ SyntaxError: unexpected character after line continuation character Thanks -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Frustrated with scopes
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 04:49:06 -0700, andrew cooke wrote: It would be helpful if you were to describe the type of behavior you expect. Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. When run the code gives NameError: name 'source' is not defined because the class namespace blocks the function namespace (or something...). James asked you to describe the behaviour you expect. Please explain what you expect, and what you actually get. Post the ACTUAL error message, not a summary, not a paraphrase, but an actual copy and paste. In any case, your code snippet works for me: class _StreamFactory(object): ... @staticmethod ... def __call__(lines, source, join=''.join): ... class Line(object): ... __source = source ... __join = join ... obj = _StreamFactory() obj(['a', 'b'], ab) No errors. Of course it doesn't return anything, because your code snippet doesn't return anything either. Here's a modified version which returns the inner class: class _StreamFactory2(object): ... @staticmethod ... def __call__(lines, source, join=''.join): ... class Line(object): ... __source = source ... __join = join ... return Line ... obj = _StreamFactory2() K = obj(['a', 'b'], ab) K class '__main__.Line' K._Line__source 'ab' Works perfectly. I suspect your error is probably something like you have misspelled source somewhere. -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: matching patterns after regex?
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 05:12:22 -0700, Martin wrote: I tried re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s) You need to put quotes around strings. In this case, because you're using regular expressions, you should use a raw string: re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s) will probably work. -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
Paul Boddie paul at boddie.org.uk writes: A free-for-all isn't likely to be the best solution for more actively edited Python documentation, but Wiki solutions undeniably provide a superior fast path for edits by trusted users to be incorporated and published in accessible end-user documentation. Agreed. I'm starting to believe that there's a certain snobbery about Wiki solutions which lead many people to develop all sorts of short-term, arcane solutions under the illusion that something super-special and customised is necessary and that they have to start virtually from scratch in order to cater to the ultra-special needs of the target audience; by the time they're done, no-one's interested any more, except to propose the next legacy system in the making. Not sure why you think it's snobbery... There are certain tacit expectations regarding the docs: - that they are versioned with the source tree (because, often, changes in documentation will be synchronized with changes in behaviour / functionality, because we must maintain documentation for several versions at once, because you want to use the same kind of merging that is used between different branches) - that they can be used offline, rebuilt in different formats, etc. - that you don't need a Web server (even locally) to navigate through them - that proposed changes are to be reviewed by maintainers (core developers) before they get actually committed I'm not sure of any existing wiki system which fits the bill. So, while I agree that the current situation can present a high threshold for occasional doc-only contributions, there doesn't seem to be a simple solution to improve things. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: matching patterns after regex?
On Aug 12, 1:23 pm, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this-
cybersource.com.au wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 05:12:22 -0700, Martin wrote:
I tried
re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
You need to put quotes around strings.
In this case, because you're using regular expressions, you should use a
raw string:
re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
will probably work.
--
Steven
Thanks I see.
so I tried it and if I use it as it is, it matches the first instance:
I
n [594]: re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
Out[594]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
So I adjusted the first part of the regex, on the basis I could sub
NORTH for SOUTH etc.
In [595]: re.findall(r(NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.
\w-]+),s)
Out[595]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
But in both cases it doesn't return the decimal value rather the value
that comes after NUM_VAL = , rather than VALUE = ?
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Frustrated with scopes
andrew cooke wrote: Is there a way to make this work (currently scope and join are undefined at runtime when the inner class attributes are defined): class _StreamFactory(object): @staticmethod def __call__(lines, source, join=''.join): class Line(object): __source = source __join = join [...] I can get something working by bouncing through global values, but it looks awful and I think it's a source of a bug due too values being redefined. Thanks, Andrew Supply us with just enough source code to actually try it, give the full error message including traceback, and tell us what you expected to see. Also tell us Python version (sys.version) So far you've done none of these. When I try the following, I get no errors, using Python 2.6.2 class _StreamFactory(object): @staticmethod def __call__(lines, source, join=''.join): class Line(object): __source = source __join = join return Line() fact = _StreamFactory() obj = fact(43, name.txt) print obj -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On 12 Aug, 14:08, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this- cybersource.com.au wrote: With tens of millions of web users, it's no surprise that Wikipedia can attract thousands of editors. But this does not apply to Python, which starts from a comparatively tiny population, primarily those interested in Python. Have a look at the Wikipedia page for Python. What does the Python entry on Wikipedia have to do with editing the Python documentation in a Wiki? Once everyone has agreed that the description of Python on Wikipedia is reasonable, there's not much point in editing it, is there? In contrast, there's a continuous stream of people who don't think Python's documentation is that great. [...] A free-for-all isn't likely to be the best solution for more actively edited Python documentation, but Wiki solutions undeniably provide a superior fast path for edits by trusted users to be incorporated and published in accessible end-user documentation. And the Python time-machine strikes again: http://wiki.python.org/moin/ And I suggested that the complainants use it as a starting point. [...] Oh dear me. You mean that they don't agree that YOUR time is more important than theirs??? What horrible people they must be, to expect you to sacrifice some of your sleep time just so *they* can get some sleep themselves!!! Who do they think they are??? That's quite an attempt to make my position more extreme than it actually is. I get people asking me to improve my own software, you know, and even if I don't have the time or inclination to do what they ask, I do spend time discussing it with them. Such people, including myself when I'm on the other side of the fence, appreciate more than just a brush-off and no: they don't insist that their own time be valued above anyone else's (as you would have me misrepresented); they just ask that their own efforts aren't treated as having no value because they're not part of the elite development team. You get various projects doing soul-searching about embracing the efforts of non-programmers, and the first port of call on that particular voyage is to not treat them like idiot consumers whose remarks can only be considered as mere heckling while the visionaries act out their flawless production. Paul P.S. The mention of social problems ties in with other remarks made recently, and I've increasingly found it more trouble than has been worthwhile to pursue Python-related matters of late. When one tries to encourage people to participate in improving various things, which usually means the community having to accept a degree of criticism, people claim that it's encouraging undesirable influences to point such critics in the right direction instead of showing them the door. When one tries to pursue such improvement matters oneself, people always have something to say about the choice of technology or whether they like the particular background colour being used or indeed have an opinion, typically shallow and negative, about anything but the task at hand, and there'll always be someone queuing up to dismantle anything that does get done at the first opportunity. In contrast, I've found other groups of people to be grateful for even modest technical assistance, and I know that such people are much more likely to get my support and input in the future than those who think that it's some kind of advantage to have potential contributors run the gauntlet of denial (that there are structural problems in their project), skepticism (that newcomers can have anything to contribute), discouragement (because any solution which doesn't validate someone's technology preferences must be criticised) and, indeed, outright hostility. One can always spend one's time doing something which isn't 100% enjoyable or 100% rewarding if one feels that the time is still being spent on something worthwhile. I'm getting the feeling that lots of Python-related stuff doesn't quite satisfy such criteria any more. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
Simon Brunning wrote: 2009/8/11 Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: There are gals too here. It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Give the attitudes still prevalent in our industry (cf http://tinyurl.com/c5nqju and many more), I'm sorry to say that I don't think this is funny. Having someone present technical informations with porn content cannot be qualified as prevalent in our industry. I would even dare to say this is the opposite, it is almost unique. I would also add that Robert was very far from this attitude, I consider his joke as a friendly tickle, not a male chauvinist aggression. I'm no women, but I'm sure they are as capable as me, not to say more, of making the distinction. It has been said this list is not very friendly to newbies, let's not make it hostile to gentle jokes (even those not funny) when thanking helpers. JM -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Frustrated with scopes
On Aug 12, 8:52 am, Dave Angel da...@ieee.org wrote: Supply us with just enough source code to actually try it, give the full error message including traceback, and tell us what you expected to see. Also tell us Python version (sys.version) So far you've done none of these. When I try the following, I get no errors, using Python 2.6.2 class _StreamFactory(object): @staticmethod def __call__(lines, source, join=''.join): class Line(object): __source = source __join = join return Line() fact = _StreamFactory() obj = fact(43, name.txt) print obj Ah! OK, thanks for that. I need to look at this again. I'll post again if necessary, but if it works for you then I clearly don't understand what the issue is myself. Andrew -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
best practice for documenting a project? pydoc?
Hello, A project that I have been working on is getting larger and more complex, and I would like to unload some of the information from my memory/head to some other media (a set of web pages?). I am primarily interested in documenting the classes/methods. This documentation is primarily for my use only - as I can't continuously work on this project and have to come back to it after some time, it would be nice to have some documentation available to help jog my memory. What is the best way to do this in an automated way? I have been documenting my code as I've gone along. Is pydoc still the way to go, or should I use something else? Thanks, Esmail -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
On 01:27 pm, jeanmic...@sequans.com wrote: Simon Brunning wrote: 2009/8/11 Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: There are gals too here. It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Give the attitudes still prevalent in our industry (cf http://tinyurl.com/c5nqju and many more), I'm sorry to say that I don't think this is funny. Having someone present technical informations with porn content cannot be qualified as prevalent in our industry. I would even dare to say this is the opposite, it is almost unique. I would also add that Robert was very far from this attitude, I consider his joke as a friendly tickle, not a male chauvinist aggression. I'm no women, but I'm sure they are as capable as me, not to say more, of making the distinction. It has been said this list is not very friendly to newbies, let's not make it hostile to gentle jokes (even those not funny) when thanking helpers. It's lots of little things like this which combine to create an environment which is less friendly towards women than it is towards others. You might read it as a joke, others might not. Even if it is a joke, it's in poor taste and doesn't really belong on python-list. There's a difference between pointing out inappropriate behavior and being unfriendly. Hopefully Robert got help with his problem. That's what the list is here for. Having accomplished that, it is not unfriendly to ask him not to make disparaging comments, jokes or otherwise, about groups of people. Jean-Paul -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
Paul Boddie wrote: [snip] One can always spend one's time doing something which isn't 100% enjoyable or 100% rewarding if one feels that the time is still being spent on something worthwhile. I'm getting the feeling that lots of Python-related stuff doesn't quite satisfy such criteria any more. I've been strongly considering volunteering to do Python work but this thread has put me off completely. I've time to spare as I only work part time due to long term health problems. However I don't feel that the time would be well spent on Python work, as I get the impression that a lot of it would go on cleaning some people's snotty noses, and on wiping other people's bottoms. I'll just wait until my normal voluntary work starts again next month after the summer break. Working with an extremely pleasant bunch of people hacking foreigners to death, that's more like it. See the following links should anyone be interested. http://www.dorsetforyou.com/index.jsp?articleid=386553 http://www.dorsetforyou.com/index.jsp?articleid=386598 -- Kindest regards. Mark Lawrence. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.uk wrote: I'm still reeling from what seems to be such a huge problem with httplib that seem to be largely ignored :-( Chris There is an httplib2 (but I don't know anything further about it...): http://code.google.com/p/httplib2/ Calling wget or curl using a subprocess is probably as easy as it is ugly, I use the wget build from here: http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages/wget.htm max -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: better way?
Pet wrote: On 11 Aug., 22:19, Rami Chowdhury rami.chowdh...@gmail.com wrote: Ah, my apologies, I must have been getting it confused with ON UPDATE [things]. Thanks for correcting me. On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 13:10:03 -0700, Matthew Woodcraft matt...@woodcraft.me.uk wrote: Rami Chowdhury rami.chowdh...@gmail.com writes: IIRC Postgres has had ON DUPLICATE KEY UPDATE functionality longer than MySQL... PostgreSQL does not have ON DUPLICATE KEY UPDATE. The SQL standard way to do what the OP wants is MERGE. PostgreSQL doesn't have that either. So, I'm doing it in right way? What about building columns? map(lambda s: s + ' = %s', fields) Is that o.k.? Isn't t = [field + ' = %s' for field in fields] clearer than t = map(lambda s: s + ' = %s', fields) ? your call of course. I don't quite understand why you are building the SQL from data but constructing the arguments in source. I'd actually set the SQL up directly as a string, making both the SQL and Python more readable. To the original question, you could unconditionally perform a queries vaguely like: UPDATE_SQL = '''UPDATE table ... WHERE id = %s AND location = %s;''' INSERT_SQL = '''INSERT INTO table(... WHERE NOT EXISTS(SELECT * FROM table WHERE id = %s AND location = %s;);''' I'd put the NOW() and constant args (like the 1) in the SQL itself. then your code might become: row = (self.wl, name, location, id) self._execQuery(db, UPDATE_SQL, [row]) self._execQuery(db, INSERT_SQL, [row + (location, id)]) if _execQuery is like the standard Python DB interfaces. Having the SQL do the checking means you allows the DB to check its index and use that result to control the operation, simplifying the Python code without significantly affecting the the DB work needed. The SELECT * form in the EXIST test is something DB optimizers look for, so don't fret about wasted data movement. --Scott David Daniels scott.dani...@acm.org -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
On Aug 12, 9:09 am, exar...@twistedmatrix.com wrote: On 01:27 pm, jeanmic...@sequans.com wrote: Simon Brunning wrote: 2009/8/11 Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: There are gals too here. It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Give the attitudes still prevalent in our industry (cf http://tinyurl.com/c5nqju and many more), I'm sorry to say that I don't think this is funny. Having someone present technical informations with porn content cannot be qualified as prevalent in our industry. I would even dare to say this is the opposite, it is almost unique. I would also add that Robert was very far from this attitude, I consider his joke as a friendly tickle, not a male chauvinist aggression. I'm no women, but I'm sure they are as capable as me, not to say more, of making the distinction. It has been said this list is not very friendly to newbies, let's not make it hostile to gentle jokes (even those not funny) when thanking helpers. It's lots of little things like this which combine to create an environment which is less friendly towards women than it is towards others. You might read it as a joke, others might not. Even if it is a joke, it's in poor taste and doesn't really belong on python-list. There's a difference between pointing out inappropriate behavior and being unfriendly. Hopefully Robert got help with his problem. That's what the list is here for. Having accomplished that, it is not unfriendly to ask him not to make disparaging comments, jokes or otherwise, about groups of people. Jean-Paul Hey everyone, I was actually joking about my remark, I was making fun of the fact that Bearophile took my figure of speech literally. I have worked with a lot of women in the past and they even use guys to refer to everyone in a room (When there were obviously other females in that room as well). On a more serious note, I do apologize to those offended by my remark. I realize that these things can be a touchy subject for some people. I expected more of a laid-back attitude from everyone. No need to be so serious all the time. I cannot completely doubt that there are logical women out there. I just haven't seen one yet. But that doesn't mean I'm a sexist. With my apology presented, I would like to propose that we end the discussion here. As I said, this is a very sensitive subject and this thread could spin way out of control if we don't just ignore the issue. For those that took it as a friendly, harmless joke, hopefully you had a laugh. For those that took it seriously or as an offense, please take my apology to heart. Thanks once again to everyone for your help. I've long been a member of this community and I really appreciate the continuous support I've been receiving! Take care everyone! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
On Aug 12, 9:41 am, Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com wrote: On Aug 12, 9:09 am, exar...@twistedmatrix.com wrote: On 01:27 pm, jeanmic...@sequans.com wrote: Simon Brunning wrote: 2009/8/11 Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: There are gals too here. It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Give the attitudes still prevalent in our industry (cf http://tinyurl.com/c5nqju and many more), I'm sorry to say that I don't think this is funny. Having someone present technical informations with porn content cannot be qualified as prevalent in our industry. I would even dare to say this is the opposite, it is almost unique. I would also add that Robert was very far from this attitude, I consider his joke as a friendly tickle, not a male chauvinist aggression. I'm no women, but I'm sure they are as capable as me, not to say more, of making the distinction. It has been said this list is not very friendly to newbies, let's not make it hostile to gentle jokes (even those not funny) when thanking helpers. It's lots of little things like this which combine to create an environment which is less friendly towards women than it is towards others. You might read it as a joke, others might not. Even if it is a joke, it's in poor taste and doesn't really belong on python-list. There's a difference between pointing out inappropriate behavior and being unfriendly. Hopefully Robert got help with his problem. That's what the list is here for. Having accomplished that, it is not unfriendly to ask him not to make disparaging comments, jokes or otherwise, about groups of people. Jean-Paul Hey everyone, I was actually joking about my remark, I was making fun of the fact that Bearophile took my figure of speech literally. I have worked with a lot of women in the past and they even use guys to refer to everyone in a room (When there were obviously other females in that room as well). On a more serious note, I do apologize to those offended by my remark. I realize that these things can be a touchy subject for some people. I expected more of a laid-back attitude from everyone. No need to be so serious all the time. I cannot completely doubt that there are logical women out there. I just haven't seen one yet. But that doesn't mean I'm a sexist. With my apology presented, I would like to propose that we end the discussion here. As I said, this is a very sensitive subject and this thread could spin way out of control if we don't just ignore the issue. For those that took it as a friendly, harmless joke, hopefully you had a laugh. For those that took it seriously or as an offense, please take my apology to heart. Thanks once again to everyone for your help. I've long been a member of this community and I really appreciate the continuous support I've been receiving! Take care everyone! Oh, one last thing... So everyone knows, I chose the following formatting solution to multiline strings: def MyFunction(): multilineString = ( 'This is a string that spans ' 'multiple lines.' ) print( multilineString ) I think this is as good as it is going to get for my personal needs. However, I do not like having to put a space at the end of each string. I've also done this in the past, which is slightly more ugly: multilineString = ( 'This is a string that spans', 'multiple lines.' ) print( ' '.join( multilineString ) ) This will add the spaces between lines for you. However, in a production quality application I would always have strings external to the scripts and have an advanced localization system. However this is useful for quick little scripts that I want to keep tidy. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: best practice for documenting a project? pydoc?
Esmail wrote: Hello, A project that I have been working on is getting larger and more complex, and I would like to unload some of the information from my memory/head to some other media (a set of web pages?). I am primarily interested in documenting the classes/methods. This documentation is primarily for my use only - as I can't continuously work on this project and have to come back to it after some time, it would be nice to have some documentation available to help jog my memory. What is the best way to do this in an automated way? I have been documenting my code as I've gone along. Is pydoc still the way to go, or should I use something else? Thanks, Esmail The docs for the constraint package look good, see http://labix.org/python-constraint and http://labix.org/doc/constraint. I think they've been produced with epydoc see http://epydoc.sourceforge.net/ -- Kindest regards. Mark Lawrence. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 06:24:18 -0700, Paul Boddie wrote: On 12 Aug, 14:08, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this- cybersource.com.au wrote: With tens of millions of web users, it's no surprise that Wikipedia can attract thousands of editors. But this does not apply to Python, which starts from a comparatively tiny population, primarily those interested in Python. Have a look at the Wikipedia page for Python. What does the Python entry on Wikipedia have to do with editing the Python documentation in a Wiki? Good question. I was responding to you mentioning Wikipedia as a possible role model for the Python docs. Once everyone has agreed that the description of Python on Wikipedia is reasonable, there's not much point in editing it, is there? And once we're all fabulously wealthy, there won't be any point in anyone working any more either! The problem for your argument is, even if it were correct, not everyone agrees the Python article is reasonable -- there were three edits made since the 7th of this month. And before that, there was a stream of 22 edits on the 5th, and another 25 edits since the 8th of July. Obviously the Python article is still in active development. Some of those edits were, apparently, vandalism, which gives yet another reason why the Wikipedia model is not necessarily the right model to follow. In contrast, there's a continuous stream of people who don't think Python's documentation is that great. And a great flood of those who think it's pretty good and gets the job done adequately, and a trickle of those who think it's perfect just the way it is. It's not the people who suggest improvements to the docs that are the problem, but the ones who insist that the docs are terrible, but aren't willing to do anything but complain. Oh, and trolls like ... I hesitate to mention his name in case he has a bot monitoring the list ... first name starts with X followed by ah, second name sounds like Mee ... who even if they make a few good points, they're lost in a sea of insults to others, arrogance and self-aggrandisement. And the Python time-machine strikes again: http://wiki.python.org/moin/ And I suggested that the complainants use it as a starting point. Sorry, I seem to have missed that. [...] Oh dear me. You mean that they don't agree that YOUR time is more important than theirs??? What horrible people they must be, to expect you to sacrifice some of your sleep time just so *they* can get some sleep themselves!!! Who do they think they are??? That's quite an attempt to make my position more extreme than it actually is. Well, you did raise the issue of the sacrifices you were making to report these bugs. All I did was exaggerate the attitude a tad. I get people asking me to improve my own software, you know, and even if I don't have the time or inclination to do what they ask, I do spend time discussing it with them. Such people, including myself when I'm on the other side of the fence, appreciate more than just a brush-off and no: they don't insist that their own time be valued above anyone else's Then you're incredibly lucky to attract a better class of end-users. In my experience, most end-users won't even spend the effort to describe the problem they're having beyond it doesn't work. And they usually misspell that. (as you would have me misrepresented); they just ask that their own efforts aren't treated as having no value because they're not part of the elite development team. You get various projects doing soul-searching about embracing the efforts of non-programmers, and the first port of call on that particular voyage is to not treat them like idiot consumers whose remarks can only be considered as mere heckling while the visionaries act out their flawless production. A noble vision, but wait until the idiot heckling consumers discover your software, then we'll see how much time you're prepared to give them. Paul P.S. The mention of social problems ties in with other remarks made recently, and I've increasingly found it more trouble than has been worthwhile to pursue Python-related matters of late. When one tries to encourage people to participate in improving various things, which usually means the community having to accept a degree of criticism, people claim that it's encouraging undesirable influences to point such critics in the right direction instead of showing them the door. Can you point me to a discussion where this has happened? When one tries to pursue such improvement matters oneself, people always have something to say about the choice of technology or whether they like the particular background colour being used You've discovered bike-shedding. or indeed have an opinion, typically shallow and negative, about anything but the task at hand, When you're agitating for change, anyone defending the status quo has opinions which are shallow and negative. When
Re: better way?
On Aug 12, 4:29 pm, Scott David Daniels scott.dani...@acm.org wrote: Pet wrote: On 11 Aug., 22:19, Rami Chowdhury rami.chowdh...@gmail.com wrote: Ah, my apologies, I must have been getting it confused with ON UPDATE [things]. Thanks for correcting me. On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 13:10:03 -0700, Matthew Woodcraft matt...@woodcraft.me.uk wrote: Rami Chowdhury rami.chowdh...@gmail.com writes: IIRC Postgres has had ON DUPLICATE KEY UPDATE functionality longer than MySQL... PostgreSQL does not have ON DUPLICATE KEY UPDATE. The SQL standard way to do what the OP wants is MERGE. PostgreSQL doesn't have that either. So, I'm doing it in right way? What about building columns? map(lambda s: s + ' = %s', fields) Is that o.k.? Isn't t = [field + ' = %s' for field in fields] clearer than t = map(lambda s: s + ' = %s', fields) ? your call of course. Yes, I think so I don't quite understand why you are building the SQL from data but constructing the arguments in source. I'd actually set the SQL up directly as a string, making both the SQL and Python more Sometimes, column list could be long, besides I keep column list in sync for both update and insert query readable. To the original question, you could unconditionally perform a queries vaguely like: UPDATE_SQL = '''UPDATE table ... WHERE id = %s AND location = %s;''' INSERT_SQL = '''INSERT INTO table(... WHERE NOT EXISTS(SELECT * FROM table WHERE id = %s AND location = %s;);''' I'd put the NOW() and constant args (like the 1) in the SQL itself. yes, but I'm building both UPDATE in INSERT from same list of columns, so I didn't found better way as this one then your code might become: row = (self.wl, name, location, id) self._execQuery(db, UPDATE_SQL, [row]) self._execQuery(db, INSERT_SQL, [row + (location, id)]) I'm going to rebuild my queries like that. Thank you very much! if _execQuery is like the standard Python DB interfaces. Having the SQL do the checking means you allows the DB to check its index and use that result to control the operation, simplifying the Python code without significantly affecting the the DB work needed. The SELECT * form in the EXIST test is something DB optimizers look for, so don't fret about wasted data movement. --Scott David Daniels scott.dani...@acm.org -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
On Aug 12, 10:41 am, Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com wrote: On Aug 12, 9:09 am, exar...@twistedmatrix.com wrote: On 01:27 pm, jeanmic...@sequans.com wrote: Simon Brunning wrote: 2009/8/11 Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com: On Aug 11, 3:40 pm, Bearophile bearophileh...@lycos.com wrote: There are gals too here. It's a figure of speech. And besides, why would I want programming advice from a woman? lol. Thanks for the help. Give the attitudes still prevalent in our industry (cf http://tinyurl.com/c5nqju and many more), I'm sorry to say that I don't think this is funny. Having someone present technical informations with porn content cannot be qualified as prevalent in our industry. I would even dare to say this is the opposite, it is almost unique. I would also add that Robert was very far from this attitude, I consider his joke as a friendly tickle, not a male chauvinist aggression. I'm no women, but I'm sure they are as capable as me, not to say more, of making the distinction. It has been said this list is not very friendly to newbies, let's not make it hostile to gentle jokes (even those not funny) when thanking helpers. It's lots of little things like this which combine to create an environment which is less friendly towards women than it is towards others. You might read it as a joke, others might not. Even if it is a joke, it's in poor taste and doesn't really belong on python-list. There's a difference between pointing out inappropriate behavior and being unfriendly. Hopefully Robert got help with his problem. That's what the list is here for. Having accomplished that, it is not unfriendly to ask him not to make disparaging comments, jokes or otherwise, about groups of people. Jean-Paul Hey everyone, I was actually joking about my remark, I was making fun of the fact that Bearophile took my figure of speech literally. I have worked with a lot of women in the past and they even use guys to refer to everyone in a room (When there were obviously other females in that room as well). On a more serious note, I do apologize to those offended by my remark. I realize that these things can be a touchy subject for some people. I expected more of a laid-back attitude from everyone. No need to be so serious all the time. I cannot completely doubt that there are logical women out there. I just haven't seen one yet. But that doesn't mean I'm a sexist. Oh my. And you were doing so well. You haven't seen a logical woman? Perhaps you're blind because your eyes were torn out by a raging marmoset? Guess what? Thinking (or just saying) that /does/ mean you're a sexist. (Even if it was just another friendly, harmless joke.) With my apology presented, I would like to propose that we end the discussion here. As I said, this is a very sensitive subject and this thread could spin way out of control if we don't just ignore the issue. For those that took it as a friendly, harmless joke, hopefully you had a laugh. For those that took it seriously or as an offense, please take my apology to heart. Thanks once again to everyone for your help. I've long been a member of this community and I really appreciate the continuous support I've been receiving! Take care everyone! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:47:58 -0700, Robert Dailey wrote: On Aug 12, 9:41 am, Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com wrote: ... I was actually joking about my remark, I was making fun of the fact that Bearophile took my figure of speech literally. Keep in mind that the Internet is a global forum, and not everyone here speaks English as a first language. I believe Bearophile is one of those. Although his, or possibly her, English is excellent, it wouldn't surprise me that (s)he would misinterpret guys as just referring to men. I'm a native English speaker, and I would have done the same. I have worked with a lot of women in the past and they even use guys to refer to everyone in a room (When there were obviously other females in that room as well). Yes, I've seen this myself, but it's still uncommon enough to surprise me every time I see it. On a more serious note, I do apologize to those offended by my remark. I realize that these things can be a touchy subject for some people. I expected more of a laid-back attitude from everyone. No need to be so serious all the time. I cannot completely doubt that there are logical women out there. I just haven't seen one yet. That's okay, I haven't seen terribly many logical men out there either. Oh, one last thing... So everyone knows, I chose the following formatting solution to multiline strings: def MyFunction(): multilineString = ( 'This is a string that spans ' 'multiple lines.' ) print( multilineString ) I think this is as good as it is going to get for my personal needs. However, I do not like having to put a space at the end of each string. So put them at the beginning of the next line. It makes the space more obvious, so it's clearer what you have done. That's what I sometimes do. I've also done this in the past, which is slightly more ugly: multilineString = ( 'This is a string that spans', 'multiple lines.' ) print( ' '.join( multilineString ) ) It's also less efficient, as it does the concatenation at runtime instead of compile time. But for a small script, that's not likely to be a problem worth worrying about. -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: best practice for documenting a project? pydoc?
Hello, EPYDOC is very good for automatic generation of documentation from source code. You may also consider Sphinx http://sphinx.pocoo.org/ which is used for many projects including the official Python documentation, documentation of Zope (http://docs.zope.org/). See the full list of projects using Sphinx at http://sphinx.pocoo.org/examples.html - Shailesh On Aug 12, 7:49 pm, Mark Lawrence breamore...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: Esmail wrote: Hello, A project that I have been working on is getting larger and more complex, and I would like to unload some of the information from my memory/head to some other media (a set of web pages?). I am primarily interested in documenting the classes/methods. This documentation is primarily for my use only - as I can't continuously work on this project and have to come back to it after some time, it would be nice to have some documentation available to help jog my memory. What is the best way to do this in an automated way? I have been documenting my code as I've gone along. Is pydoc still the way to go, or should I use something else? Thanks, Esmail The docs for the constraint package look good, seehttp://labix.org/python-constraintandhttp://labix.org/doc/constraint. I think they've been produced with epydoc seehttp://epydoc.sourceforge.net/ -- Kindest regards. Mark Lawrence. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Programming by Contract
zope.interface provides extensive support for design by contract. http://pypi.python.org/pypi/zope.interface. This package can be used independently of zope in other projects. - Shailesh On Aug 12, 2:20 am, Ethan Furman et...@stoneleaf.us wrote: Charles Yeomans wrote: On Aug 11, 2009, at 3:30 PM, Ethan Furman wrote: Ethan Furman wrote: Greetings! I have seen posts about the assert statement and PbC (or maybe it was DbC), and I just took a very brief look at pycontract (http://www.wayforward.net/pycontract/) and now I have at least one question: Is this basically another way of thinking about unit testing, or is the idea of PbC more along the lines of *always* checking the input/output of functions to ensure they are correct? (*Contstant vigilance!* as Prof Moody would say ;) I know asserts can be turned off, so they obviously won't work for the latter case, and having seen the sample of pycontract it seems it only does its thing during debugging. So is Design (Programming) by Contract a fancy way of saying Document your inputs/outputs! or is there more to it? ~Ethan~ Hmmm... Well, from the (apparently) complete lack of interest, I shall take away the (better?) documentation ideas and unit testing ideas, and not worry about the rest. :) Design by contract is complementary to unit testing (I notice that the author of PEP 316 appears confused about this). DbC is, roughly speaking, about explicit allocation of responsibility. Consider this contrived example. def foo(s): require(s is not None) //code ensure(hasattr(returnValue, '__iter__')) The require condition tells you that it's the caller's responsibility to pass a non-nil argument to foo. The ensure condition is a guarantee that foo will return something suitable for iteration, if the precondition in the require condition is satisfied. These conditions can be enforced at runtime, but may not be, for reasons of performance. DbC is in fact about not *always* checking the input/output of functions; on the contrary, Bertrand Meyer, the inventor of DbC, claims that DbC allows one to eliminate such redundancy, and the resulting overhead. Charles Yeomans Many thanks! So if I understand -- Python's EAFP fits well with DbC, as DbC seems well suited to say, This is your responsibility, and this is mine, stated in programming terms (who needs comments? ;) Combined with unit testing (which should be easier to design correctly given the DbC code), healthy code seems more attainable. Interesting. Thank you for the information. ~Ethan~ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 08:11:43 -0700, Simon Forman wrote: [quoting Robert Dailey] I cannot completely doubt that there are logical women out there. I just haven't seen one yet. But that doesn't mean I'm a sexist. Oh my. And you were doing so well. You haven't seen a logical woman? Perhaps you're blind because your eyes were torn out by a raging marmoset? Guess what? Thinking (or just saying) that /does/ mean you're a sexist. (Even if it was just another friendly, harmless joke.) It was an incredibly insensitive thing for Robert to say, having just been slapped for a previous insensitive joke about women. But still, most people, male or female, *aren't* logical. I know I've never met somebody who is entirely logical, of either sex, and I'm pretty sure I've not met very many people who are even mostly logical. Vulcans we are not. Does this mean I'm equally sexist against men *and* women? (I'm not biased, I hate everyone equally! *wink*) Hell, here I am, at 2am, defending somebody I don't know, for saying something I don't approve of, against somebody who is saying something I agree with, out of some sort of misguided sense of fairness. Logic? Ha, what's logic got to do with it? -- Steven -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
We use PyCURL on Windows. http://pycurl.sourceforge.net/ provides pre- built versions for Windows and it works out of the box. - Shailesh On Aug 12, 7:14 pm, Max Erickson maxerick...@gmail.com wrote: Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.uk wrote: I'm still reeling from what seems to be such a huge problem with httplib that seem to be largely ignored :-( Chris There is an httplib2 (but I don't know anything further about it...): http://code.google.com/p/httplib2/ Calling wget or curl using a subprocess is probably as easy as it is ugly, I use the wget build from here: http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages/wget.htm max -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Need cleanup advice for multiline string
Robert Dailey rcdai...@gmail.com writes:
Hey guys. Being a C++ programmer, I like to keep variable definitions
close to the location in which they will be used. This improves
readability in many ways. However, when I have a multi-line string
definition at function level scope, things get tricky because of the
indents. In this case indents are serving two purposes: For syntax and
actual text output. The tabs for function scope should not be included
in the contents of the string. (...)
Personally I'm in the camp that something like this should be hoisted
out of the code path (whether to global scope, a dedicated message
module or configuration file is a design choice).
But if it's going to stay inline, one approach that can maintain some
of the attractive qualities of a triple quoted string is to make use
of the textwrap module:
import textwrap
def RunCommand( commandList ):
# ...
if returnCode:
failMsg = textwrap.dedent('''\
*
The following command returned exit code [{:#x}].
This represents failure of some form. Please review
the command output for more details on the issue.
{}
*
''')
which removes any common leading whitespace (must be identical in terms
of any tabs/spaces).
This is still additional run-time processing, and most likely less
efficient than the joining of individual strings, but it does permit a
clean triple-quoted string so IMO is easier to read/maintain in the
source - providing the code indentation level doesn't get in the way
of the desired line length of the string. You can also choose to
dedent the string a bit (say to the level of failMsg) if needed
without being forced all the way back to the left margin.
You can also combine textwrap.dedent with some of the other options if
where the strings are defined makes it nicer if they still have some
indentation (say in a global Python module). In that case, you'd most
likely just process them once when the module was imported, so any
inefficiency in textwrap.dedent is far less important.
-- David
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On 12 Aug, 17:08, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this- cybersource.com.au wrote: On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 06:24:18 -0700, Paul Boddie wrote: What does the Python entry on Wikipedia have to do with editing the Python documentation in a Wiki? Good question. I was responding to you mentioning Wikipedia as a possible role model for the Python docs. Yes, but claiming that only a few people want to edit a single entry on one site (admittedly a popular one) isn't the same as saying that few people would edit a documentation Wiki covering numerous different things. A bunch of people edit the existing Python Wiki now, although there's not that much direction behind it. [...] It's not the people who suggest improvements to the docs that are the problem, but the ones who insist that the docs are terrible, but aren't willing to do anything but complain. Oh, and trolls like ... I hesitate to mention his name in case he has a bot monitoring the list ... first name starts with X followed by ah, second name sounds like Mee ... who even if they make a few good points, they're lost in a sea of insults to others, arrogance and self-aggrandisement. Right, but those good points are still worth taking on board. There have been Xah Lee posts which have been relatively constructive, but when the only responses are from people who see the name and can't be bothered reading the message before issuing a stock he's a troll response, the tone is likely to remain vulgar from that point onwards. Xah Lee can be quite coherent and rational on comp.lang.lisp, which is more than can be said for a number of regulars on that group. [...] P.S. The mention of social problems ties in with other remarks made recently, and I've increasingly found it more trouble than has been worthwhile to pursue Python-related matters of late. When one tries to encourage people to participate in improving various things, which usually means the community having to accept a degree of criticism, people claim that it's encouraging undesirable influences to point such critics in the right direction instead of showing them the door. Can you point me to a discussion where this has happened? I won't name names as in some cases I've corresponded privately with various people who have been perceived to be trolls (as you put it above) and who have had the don't talk to them responses from various regulars. Some people criticise in apparently unacceptable ways for their own amusement, but most critics do so because they are unaware of any better way and aren't aware of the most effective methods to fix the issues that bother them, and this latter group is clearly invested in finding solutions because they could quite easily go and use something else. Certainly, I wouldn't spend my time repeatedly enumerating the problems with a piece of technology if no- one were interested in helping me do something about them. When one tries to pursue such improvement matters oneself, people always have something to say about the choice of technology or whether they like the particular background colour being used You've discovered bike-shedding. or indeed have an opinion, typically shallow and negative, about anything but the task at hand, When you're agitating for change, anyone defending the status quo has opinions which are shallow and negative. When you're happy with the status quo, possibly even for good, rational reasons and not just because you're a shallow-minded, ignorant, know-nothing nay-sayer, it's those agitating for change who have shallow and negative opinions. It's such a bother trying to determine who is right, so I prefer to just accuse the other guy of being shallow and negative rather than try to understand his point of view. I find it saves time in the long run. I can expand what I've written to just about any project, improvement or otherwise, where there may not be an existing solution that anyone actually supports or is willing to use. And still, if you give people something they could use (which is better than effectively nothing), my experience is that in some communities your work, however trivial, will be appreciated. But I get the impression that in Python-related communities, it's all Why didn't you use XYZ? or What a toy! instead. [...] There seems to be a hidden assumption in your sentence that there *are* structural problems in the project. Let me assume that maybe the barriers aren't really that bad for Python documentation; that anyone who is really going to care about submitting something will jump through the hoops and deliver something that can be merged by the core developers. Even then, there's going to be a whole class of improvements that won't get made by outsiders and will fall on the editors to make. Now, more often than not, the people who are already the most overworked are precisely those in the position of reviewing and merging changes (as well as making their own), and surely
Multithreaded library for Python?
Hey guys, I realize the python library has multithreading support in it, but not the kind I'm really looking for. I want something like Intel's TBB, but for Python 3.1. I need to be able to spawn off Tasks that operate until completed and then end by themselves. I could create my own framework for this, but why bother if a solution already exists? Anyone know of any libraries out there that would work? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Scraping Wikipedia with Python
maybe you want dbpedia. I did not know about this. Thanks! That is the reason why I ask. This list has an unbelievable collective knowledge and I am certain that asking how much is 2+2 would net an insightful answer that would teach me something. Thank you, Paul, and thank you to the entire Python list! -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Scraping Wikipedia with Python
http://pypi.python.org/pypi?%3Aaction=searchterm=wikipedia ? Thanks, Thorsten, I will go through those. I did not know about that resource, I am not a regular coder. One more resource to add to the toolbox! -- Dotan Cohen http://what-is-what.com http://gibberish.co.il -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 4:25 PM, Chris Withersch...@simplistix.co.uk wrote:
Hi All,
I'm using the following script to download a 150Mb file:
from base64 import encodestring
from httplib import HTTPConnection
from datetime import datetime
conn = HTTPSConnection('localhost')
headers = {}
auth = 'Basic '+encodestring('username:password').strip()
headers['Authorization']=auth
t = datetime.now()
print t
conn.request('GET','/somefile.zip',None,headers)
print 'request:',datetime.now()-t
response = conn.getresponse()
print 'response:',datetime.now()-t
data = response.read()
print 'read:',datetime.now()-t
The output shows it takes over 20 minutes to do this.
However, this is on a local network, and downloading the same file in IE
takes under 3 seconds!
I saw this issue:
http://bugs.python.org/issue2576
I tried changing the buffer size to 4096 in a subclass as the issue
suggested, but I didn't see the reported speed improvement.
I'm using Python 2.6.2.
Does anyone know of an alternative library for creating http requests and
getting their responses that's faster but hopefully has a similar interface?
I tried to reproduce this, but I could not. Could you paste in the
output of your script? Also on the same box where you run this script
can you test with curl or wget?
--
David
blog: http://www.traceback.org
twitter: http://twitter.com/dstanek
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Mimicing an HTML form
Hi all,
I'm having alot of trouble automating the submitting of form. I have an
HTML page that works and it looks like this:
form action='*script here*' enctype=multipart/form-data method=post
input name=txtTitle id=txtTitle value=Video Title maxlength=50
/BR /
input type=file id=FileUploadedVideo name=FileUploadedVideo /BR /
input name=txtDescription id=txtDescription value=Description
maxlength=50 /BR /
input id=hdnADCID name=hdnADCID value=*app ID here* type=hidden /
input type=submit value=Submit /
/form
When I put valid values for the handling script an app ID, this page works.
Now I'm trying to turn this same functionality into a script. Here's my
code:
import urllib
import os
import urllib2
appID = *value here*
video = os.path.normpath(os.getcwd() + '/news.wmv')
title = 'News'
desc = 'Here is a sample News video'
uploader = *script here*
print Encoding url...
data = urllib.urlencode({FileUploadedVideo: video,
hdnADCID : appID,
txtTitle : title,
txtDescription: desc})
user_agent = 'Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT)'
headers = { 'User-Agent' : user_agent }
print Calling url...
req = urllib2.Request(uploader, data, headers)
response = urllib2.urlopen(req)
s = response.read()
response.close()
print Writing results...
result = open('result.html','w')
result.write(s)
result.close()
Does anybody have any suggestions? I keep on getting bad request, so I'm
assuming that the html page is passing something that my script is not. Is
there some way to scrape the POST request from the html form?
Thanks,
Zach
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
Max Erickson wrote: There is an httplib2 (but I don't know anything further about it...): http://code.google.com/p/httplib2/ I had a look, it uses httplib, so will likely suffer from the same problems... Calling wget or curl using a subprocess is probably as easy as it is ugly, I use the wget build from here: http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages/wget.htm Yeah, no ;-) Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Batch Processing Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: matching patterns after regex?
On Aug 12, 1:42 pm, Martin mdeka...@gmail.com wrote:
On Aug 12, 1:23 pm, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this-
cybersource.com.au wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 05:12:22 -0700, Martin wrote:
I tried
re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
You need to put quotes around strings.
In this case, because you're using regular expressions, you should use a
raw string:
re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
will probably work.
--
Steven
Thanks I see.
so I tried it and if I use it as it is, it matches the first instance:
I
n [594]: re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
Out[594]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
So I adjusted the first part of the regex, on the basis I could sub
NORTH for SOUTH etc.
In [595]: re.findall(r(NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.
\w-]+),s)
Out[595]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
But in both cases it doesn't return the decimal value rather the value
that comes after NUM_VAL = , rather than VALUE = ?
I think I kind of got that to work...but I am clearly not quite
understanding how it works as I tried to use it again to match
something else.
In this case I want to print the values 0.00 and 2223901.039333
from a string like this...
YDim=1200\n\t\tUpperLeftPointMtrs=(0.00,2223901.039333)\n\t\t
I tried which I though was matching the statement and printing the
decimal number after the equals sign??
re.findall(r(\w+UpperLeftPointMtrs)*=\s([\d\.\w-]+), s)
where s is the string
Many thanks for the help
--
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Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
Yes it includes libcurl. I didn't have to install it separately. I still continue to use Python 2.4. So cannot say about Python 2.6. - Shailesh On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 10:23 PM, Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.ukwrote: shaileshkumar wrote: We use PyCURL on Windows. http://pycurl.sourceforge.net/ provides pre- built versions for Windows and it works out of the box. Does it include libcurl? Are these builds available for Python 2.6? Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Batch Processing Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
shaileshkumar wrote: We use PyCURL on Windows. http://pycurl.sourceforge.net/ provides pre- built versions for Windows and it works out of the box. Does it include libcurl? Are these builds available for Python 2.6? Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Batch Processing Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
How to find all possibly overlapping matches?
re.findall finds all non-overlapping matches, but what if one wants all (maximal) matches, even those that overlap? All the solutions I can come up involve calling re.search iteratively, each time giving it a pos parameter starting just after the start of the previous match. Is there a built-in solution to such a task? TIA! kynn -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: best practice for documenting a project? pydoc?
shaileshkumar wrote: Hello, EPYDOC is very good for automatic generation of documentation from source code. You may also consider Sphinx http://sphinx.pocoo.org/ which is used for many projects including the official Python documentation, documentation of Zope (http://docs.zope.org/). See the full list of projects using Sphinx at http://sphinx.pocoo.org/examples.html - Shailesh Hi, Thanks for the links. Have you heard of something called HappyDoc? I just came across it by looking for info on epydoc. Thanks, Esmail -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
Paul Boddie wrote: On 12 Aug, 17:08, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this- cybersource.com.au wrote: It's not the people who suggest improvements to the docs that are the problem, but the ones who insist that the docs are terrible, but aren't willing to do anything but complain. Oh, and trolls like ... I hesitate to mention his name in case he has a bot monitoring the list ... first name starts with X followed by ah, second name sounds like Mee ... who even if they make a few good points, they're lost in a sea of insults to others, arrogance and self-aggrandisement. Right, but those good points are still worth taking on board. The responsibility for communication is shared. How much to each party varies by circumstance (employer/employee, rank, volunteer, etc.). For myself, his posts are automatically deleted -- my time is precious to me. ~Ethan~ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: httplib incredibly slow :-(
David Stanek wrote: I tried to reproduce this, but I could not. Could you paste in the output of your script? Not sure how that'll help, but sure: 2009-08-11 21:27:59.153000 request: 0:00:00.109000 response: 0:00:00.109000 read: 0:24:31.266000 Also on the same box where you run this script can you test with curl or wget? It's a Windows box, so no :-( But it really does download in a few seconds with IE, and 20min+ using the script I included... Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Batch Processing Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: best practice for documenting a project? pydoc?
Mark Lawrence wrote: Hi Mark, The docs for the constraint package look good, see http://labix.org/python-constraint and http://labix.org/doc/constraint. I think they've been produced with epydoc see http://epydoc.sourceforge.net/ Thanks for the links, I'll take a look. Any experience with something called HappyDoc? Just came across it. Esmail -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: How to find all possibly overlapping matches?
kj wrote: re.findall finds all non-overlapping matches, but what if one wants all (maximal) matches, even those that overlap? All the solutions I can come up involve calling re.search iteratively, each time giving it a pos parameter starting just after the start of the previous match. Is there a built-in solution to such a task? Not in the re module. It has been requested and is in my regex implementation at http://bugs.python.org/issue2636 if you want to try that. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Unrecognized escape sequences in string literals
On Aug 12, 3:08 am, Steven D'Aprano ste...@remove.this.cybersource.com.au wrote: On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 14:48:24 -0700, Douglas Alan wrote: In any case, my argument has consistently been that Python should have treated undefined escape sequences consistently as fatal errors, A reasonable position to take. I disagree with it, but it is certainly reasonable. not as warnings. I don't know what language you're talking about here, because non-special escape sequences in Python aren't either errors or warnings: print ab\cd ab\cd I was talking about C++, whose compilers tend to generate warnings for this usage. I think that the C++ compilers I've used take the right approach, only ideally they should be *even* more emphatic, and elevate the problem from a warning to an error. I assume, however, that the warning is a middle ground between doing the completely right thing, and, I assume, maintaining backward compatibility with common C implementations. As Python never had to worry about backward compatibility with C, Python didn't have to walk such a middle ground. On the other hand, *now* it has to worry about backward compatibility with itself. |ouglas -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: best practice for documenting a project? pydoc?
Esmail wrote: Mark Lawrence wrote: Hi Mark, The docs for the constraint package look good, see http://labix.org/python-constraint and http://labix.org/doc/constraint. I think they've been produced with epydoc see http://epydoc.sourceforge.net/ Thanks for the links, I'll take a look. Any experience with something called HappyDoc? Just came across it. Esmail Sorry never heard of it, or if I had I've forgotten it. -- Kindest regards. Mark Lawrence. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: fileinput
naaman wrote: I'm writing my first Python script and I want to use fileinput to open a file in r+ mode. Tried fileinput.input(sys.argv[1:],r+) but that didn't work. ANy ideas? Need to find and overwrite a line in a file several times. I can do it using open and seek() etc. but was wondering if I can use fileinput. thanks; I haven't used it, but check out the 'inplace' keyword parameter. DaveA -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
Steven D'Aprano wrote: Well there you go -- why on earth would you prohibit None as a dictionary key??? That's a serious failure. roentgen 1% python Python 2.5 (r25:51908, Sep 20 2006, 17:36:21) [GCC 3.4.2] on linux2 Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. py hash(None) 135543872 mbi136-176 98% /usr/bin/python Python 2.5.1 (r251:54863, Feb 6 2009, 19:02:12) [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Inc. build 5465)] on darwin Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. py hash(None) 2030240 That's why. Read the whole thread. You are one of the abrasive ones. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Unrecognized escape sequences in string literals
On Aug 12, 3:36 am, Steven D'Aprano ste...@remove.this.cybersource.com.au wrote: On Tue, 11 Aug 2009 13:20:52 -0700, Douglas Alan wrote: My Annotated C++ Reference Manual is packed, and surprisingly in Stroustrup's Third Edition, there is no mention of the issue in the entire 1,000 pages. But Microsoft to the rescue: If you want a backslash character to appear within a string, you must type two backslashes (\\) (From http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/69ze775t.aspx) Should I assume that Microsoft's C++ compiler treats it as an error, not a warning? In my experience, C++ compilers generally generate warnings for such situations, where they can. (Clearly, they often can't generate warnings for running off the end of an array, which is also undefined, though a really smart C++ compiler might be able to generate a warning in certain such circumstances.) Or is is this *still* undefined behaviour, and MS C++ compiler will happily compile ab\cd whatever it feels like? If it's a decent compiler, it will generate a warning. Who can say with Microsoft, however. It's clearly documented as illegal code, however. The question of what any specific C++ does if you ignore the warning is irrelevant, as such behavior in C++ is almost *always* undefined. Hence the warning. So a C++ compiler which follows Python's behaviour would be behaving within the language specifications. It might be, but there are also *recommendations* in the C++ standard about what to do in such situations, and the recommendations say, I am pretty sure, not to do that, unless the particular compiler in question has to meet some very specific backward compatibility needs. I note that the bash shell, which claims to follow C semantics, also does what Python does: $ echo $'a s\trin\g with escapes' a s rin\g with escapes Really? Not on my computers. (One is a Mac, and the other is a Fedora Core Linux box.) On my computers, bash doesn't seem to have *any* escape sequences, other than \\, \, \$, and \`. It seems to treat unknown escape sequences the same as Python does, but as there are only four known escape sequences, and they are all meant merely to guard against string interpolation, and the like, it's pretty darn easy to keep straight. Explain to me again why we're treating underspecified C++ semantics, which may or may not do *exactly* what Python does, as if it were the One True Way of treating escape sequences? I'm not saying that C++ does it right for Python. The right thing for Python to do is to generate an error, as Python doesn't have to deal with all the crazy complexities that C++ has to. |ouglas -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
On Wed, Aug 12, 2009 at 1:37 PM, James Stroudjstr...@mbi.ucla.edu wrote: Steven D'Aprano wrote: Well there you go -- why on earth would you prohibit None as a dictionary key??? That's a serious failure. roentgen 1% python Python 2.5 (r25:51908, Sep 20 2006, 17:36:21) [GCC 3.4.2] on linux2 Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. py hash(None) 135543872 mbi136-176 98% /usr/bin/python Python 2.5.1 (r251:54863, Feb 6 2009, 19:02:12) [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Inc. build 5465)] on darwin Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. py hash(None) 2030240 Actually, None is a special-case as a built-in singleton value -- there's only ever *exactly one* instance of it in a given interpreter session. And I'm reasonably sure dict pickles don't store the hash code of items (the dict gets recreated from scratch), so there's no problem. Cheers, Chris -- http://blog.rebertia.com -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: How to find all possibly overlapping matches?
In mailman.7.1250097801.2903.python-l...@python.org MRAB pyt...@mrabarnett.plus.com writes: kj wrote: re.findall finds all non-overlapping matches, but what if one wants all (maximal) matches, even those that overlap? All the solutions I can come up involve calling re.search iteratively, each time giving it a pos parameter starting just after the start of the previous match. Is there a built-in solution to such a task? Not in the re module. It has been requested and is in my regex implementation at http://bugs.python.org/issue2636 if you want to try that. Cool. Thanks! kynn -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: SQLObject 0.11.0
I don't want to start a flame war and would just like some information before diving in-- What are some the advantages and disadvantages of SQLObject compared to SQLAlchemy? Thanks, William From: Oleg Broytmann p...@phd.pp.ru To: Python Mailing List python-list@python.org; Python Announce Mailing List python-announce-l...@python.org Sent: Wednesday, August 12, 2009 6:24:53 AM Subject: SQLObject 0.11.0 Hello! I'm pleased to announce version 0.11.0, the first stable release of 0.11 branch of SQLObject. What is SQLObject = SQLObject is an object-relational mapper. Your database tables are described as classes, and rows are instances of those classes. SQLObject is meant to be easy to use and quick to get started with. SQLObject supports a number of backends: MySQL, PostgreSQL, SQLite, Firebird, Sybase, MSSQL and MaxDB (also known as SAPDB). Where is SQLObject == Site: http://sqlobject.org Development: http://sqlobject.org/devel/ Mailing list: https://lists.sourceforge.net/mailman/listinfo/sqlobject-discuss Archives: http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.python.sqlobject Download: http://cheeseshop.python.org/pypi/SQLObject/0.11.0 News and changes: http://sqlobject.org/News.html What's New == News since 0.10 - Features Interface * Dropped support for Python 2.3. The minimal version of Python for SQLObject is 2.4 now. * Dropped support for PostgreSQL 7.2. The minimal supported version of PostgreSQL is 7.3 now. * New magic attribute 'j' similar to 'q' was added that automagically does join with the other table in MultipleJoin or RelatedJoin. * SQLObject can now create and drop a database in MySQL, PostgreSQL, SQLite and Firebird/Interbase. * Added some support for schemas in PostgreSQL. * Added DecimalStringCol - similar to DecimalCol but stores data as strings to work around problems in some drivers and type affinity problem in SQLite. * Added sqlobject.include.hashcol.HashCol - a column type that automatically hashes anything going into it, and returns out an object that hashes anything being compared to itself. Basically, it's good for really simple one-way password fields, and it even supports the assignment of None to indicate no password set. By default, it uses the md5 library for hashing, but this can be changed in a HashCol definition. * RowDestroyedSignal and RowUpdatedSignal were added. Minor features ~~ * Use reversed() in manager/command.py instead of .__reversed__(). * Minor change in logging to console - logger no longer stores the output file, it gets the file from module sys every time by name; this means logging will use new sys.stdout (or stderr) in case the user changed them. * Changed the order of testing of SQLite modules - look for external PySQLite2 before sqlite3. For a more complete list, please see the news: http://sqlobject.org/News.html Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmannhttp://phd.pp.ru/p...@phd.pp.ru Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 10:37:45 -0700, James Stroud wrote:
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
Well there you go -- why on earth would you prohibit None as a
dictionary key??? That's a serious failure.
roentgen 1% python
Python 2.5 (r25:51908, Sep 20 2006, 17:36:21) [GCC 3.4.2] on linux2
Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information.
py hash(None)
135543872
mbi136-176 98% /usr/bin/python
Python 2.5.1 (r251:54863, Feb 6 2009, 19:02:12) [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Inc.
build 5465)] on darwin Type help, copyright, credits or license
for more information. py hash(None)
2030240
That's why. Read the whole thread. You are one of the abrasive ones.
I've read the whole thread. Pay close attention:
[st...@ando ~]$ python
Python 2.4.3 (#1, Mar 14 2007, 18:51:08)
[GCC 4.1.1 20070105 (Red Hat 4.1.1-52)] on linux2
Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information.
import pickle
d = {None: 42}
f = open('pickled_dict', 'w')
pickle.dump(d, f)
f.close()
[st...@ando ~]$ ssh sylar
st...@sylar's password:
Last login: Wed Aug 12 21:44:47 2009
[st...@sylar ~]$ python2.6
Python 2.6.1 (r261:67515, Dec 24 2008, 00:33:13)
[GCC 4.1.2 20070502 (Red Hat 4.1.2-12)] on linux2
Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information.
import pickle
f = open('pickled_dict', 'r')
d = pickle.load(f)
d
{None: 42}
I have successfully pickled a dict using None as a key on one machine
using Python 2.4, and unpickled it on a completely different machine
running Python 2.6.
Still think that pickling None is a problem?
--
Steven
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Pulling arrays from database for plotting
Hi all,
What's the best way to pull arrays from a database for plotting?
Right now, this is what I do, but can it be done simpler / more
efficiently?
ipython -pylab
import sqlite3
cx = sqlite3.connect('20080407.decimated.db3')
a = array( [tuple(row) for row in cx.execute('SELECT cg_offset,
delta_t_sec FROM bs_time WHERE recvr=2;')] )
x = a[:,0]
y = a[:,1]
plot(x,y)
However, if I try to plot it directly using transpose, it hangs:
import sqlite3
cx = sqlite3.connect('20080407.decimated.db3')
plot(array( [tuple(row) for row in cx.execute('SELECT cg_offset,
delta_t_sec FROM bs_time WHERE recvr=2;')] ).transpose())
It is that plot just doesn't know what to do with a 2D array? Then I
tried this and it works, but is long and confusing to the uninitiated.
plot(*array( [tuple(row) for row in cx.execute('SELECT cg_offset,
delta_t_sec FROM bs_time WHERE recvr=2;')] ).T)
In [4]: a
Out[4]:
array([[ 2.4000e+01, 0.e+00],
[ 2.5000e+01, -1.e+00],
[ 3.4000e+01, 0.e+00],
...,
[ 8.6384e+04, 2.e+01],
[ 8.6394e+04, 2.e+01],
[ 8.6404e+04, 2.e+01]])
In [5]: a.transpose()
Out[5]:
array([[ 2.4000e+01, 2.5000e+01, 3.4000e+01, ...,
8.6384e+04, 8.6394e+04, 8.6404e+04],
[ 0.e+00, -1.e+00, 0.e+00, ...,
2.e+01, 2.e+01, 2.e+01]])
--
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Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On Aug 12, 3:32 am, Paul Boddie p...@boddie.org.uk wrote: Maybe the problem is that although everyone welcomes contributions and changes (or says that they do), the mechanisms remain largely beyond criticism. FWIW, I support the idea the regular docs incorporating links to freely editable wiki pages. That will at least make it easier for people to make changes or add notes. That being said, I would like to add a few thoughts about the current process. ISTM that important corrections (when the docs are clearly in error) tend to get made right away. What is more interesting are the doc requests that get rejected and why: * Many doc requests come from people just learning the language (that makes sense because the learning process involves reading the docs). Unfortunately, a fair number of those requests are flat-out wrong or represent a profound misunderstanding of the feature in question. That may be an indicator that the docs need to be improved, but the specific suggestion can be inane. * Some doc requests come from people who simply do not like the feature in question. It is natural for tastes, styles, and preferences to vary; however, we do have a firm rule that Guido's tastes, styles, and preferences are the ones that go into the language. So the doc writers need to try to channel Guido instead of fighting him. So, if you think eval() is evil (I don't but many do), we're not going to document that eval() should *never* be used. If you hate super(), that's too bad -- the docs need to describe what it does and how it was intended to be used -- the docs are no place for diatribes on why inheritance is over-used and why you think the world would be a better place without mixins or multiple inheritance. * Then, there is a matter of where to put a particular piece of documentation (how many times do you repeat a concept that pervades the language). Hashing is a good example. The docs can discuss how some objects hash to their object id and that object ids can change from run-to-run, but if someone gets tripped-up by the idea (hey, my set reprs changed between runs, wtf!), they want the docs updated in the specific place that tripped them up (i.e. you must put big red warnings in the set documentation, and the dict documentation, and everywhere else a hash gets used ...). The core problem is that the docs are interrelated -- the one place you're looking for documentation of a specific builtin or function can't contain every concept in the language. * Some behaviors are intentionally left unspecified. For the longest time, Tim did not want to guarantee sort stability. This left him free to continue to search for algorithmic improvements that did not have stability. Later, the property was deemed so important that it did become a guaranteed behavior. Also, some things are unspecified to make things easier for other implementations (IronPython, PyPy, Jython, etc.) We need to make sure that some one doesn't casually go through the docs making doc promises that are hard to keep. * Some things are just plain difficult to fully explain in English and not misrepresent that actual behavior. For example, the str.split () docs have been continuously tweaked over the years. Even now, I think there are corner cases that are not fully captured by the docs. Casual edits to str.split() docs are more likely than not to take them farther away from the truth. * Then, there is the problem of talking too much. A book could be written about super(), but that shouldn't all go into the docs for the super builtin. Beginners often want to master all the builtins and they try to read the doc page on builtin functions. It used to be that you could read through the builtin descriptions in a few minutes. Now, it takes a concerted effort to get through. It is hard to take a sip of water from a firehose. Too much information has make a function harder to understand. * My biggest pet peeve are requests to fill the docs with big red warnings. I do not want the docs to look like a mine field. The warnings should be reserved for a handful of security or data corruption risks. For the most part, the docs should be matter-of-fact, explaining what a function or method does and how it was intended to be used. Preferred: The value str.letters is locale dependent Not preferred: Caution, the str.letters value can be adversely affected by the locale setting (it could even change length!); use this only when you are certain the locale setting will not violate any of your program invariants; consider using a string literal instead; I hate string.letters and think Guido was smoking crack when it was introduced. * Another category of rejected doc requests come from people looking for absolution from one of their programming bugs. It typically takes the form of, I made an assumption that the language did X, but it did Y and my program didn't do what I wanted; therefore, the docs must be to blame and they must
Re: SQLObject 0.11.0
I don't want to start a flame war and would just like some information before diving in-- What are some the advantages and disadvantages of SQLObject compared to SQLAlchemy? In short: sqlobject is much simpler (to use, to understand, etc) than sqlalchemy and so I prefer it in small projects. This advantage is also a disadvantage when you have large and complex projects in mind. Cheers, Daniel -- Psss, psss, put it down! - http://www.cafepress.com/putitdown -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: hashability
On Aug 12, 10:37 am, James Stroud jstr...@mbi.ucla.edu wrote: Steven D'Aprano wrote: Well there you go -- why on earth would you prohibit None as a dictionary key??? That's a serious failure. roentgen 1% python Python 2.5 (r25:51908, Sep 20 2006, 17:36:21) [GCC 3.4.2] on linux2 Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. py hash(None) 135543872 mbi136-176 98% /usr/bin/python Python 2.5.1 (r251:54863, Feb 6 2009, 19:02:12) [GCC 4.0.1 (Apple Inc. build 5465)] on darwin Type help, copyright, credits or license for more information. py hash(None) 2030240 That's why. Read the whole thread. You are one of the abrasive ones. FYI: If you need the actual hash value to be consistent across versions of Python the built hash function won't suffice. The language doesn't guanrantee they will persist across versions. (IIRC, there was a change to the hash value of longs at one point related to int/long unification issues.) Now, when I saw your explanation I assumed that your persistence mechanism merely doesn't preserve identity (unlike, say, simple pickling, which does), meaning that objects that were once identical might be reconstituted as non-identical (or vice versa), which would be an issue if these objects are stored in dicts or sets. Equality must be preserved for dict keys and set members to continue to work property. However, the actual hash code doesn't need to be preserved. As was mentioned already, None is guaranteed by the language to be equal to itself, so equality is preserved and there should be no issue with it, even if the hash code changes across invocations. Now, if you are doing something weird with the hash value itself-- which I highly discourage--then all bets are off. Carl Banks -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
[Xah Lee] i've wrote several articles about this issue, total time spend on this is probably more than 2 months full-time work. See: • Python Documentation Problems http://xahlee.org/perl-python/python_doc_index.html I just read you post. You did devote a substantial amount of time to the project. Some of your criticisms are valid. Wish you had posted patches, I think many of them would have been accepted. Since you wrote this a few years ago, many examples have been added to the docs and more are forthcoming. I often receive thank you emails for 2 particular articles, which are most frequently google searched as indicated by my weblog: • Python Doc Problem Example: gzip http://xahlee.org/perl-python/python_doc_gzip.html • Python Doc Problem Example: sort() http://xahlee.org/perl-python/python_doc_sort.html • Sorting in Python and Perl http://xahlee.org/perl-python/sort_list.html Some are the criticisms are valid; others seem off-base. Here are a few thoughts on list.sort() for those who are interested: * The key= and reversed= parameters are not intended for special cases, leaving cmp= for the general case. They were intended to be full replacements. In Python3.x, the cmp function is gone. * The interaction of the key= and cmp= functions can be made to interact (the key function is first applied to every element and the cmp function then gets applied to the results of the key function). This isn't a normal or intended use case, so the docs don't delve into the subject. * The reversed parameter does more than list.sort() followed by list.reverse(). It also preserves stability in the event of equal keys: sorted([(1,2), (1,3)], key=itemgetter(0), reverse=True) [(1,2), (1,3)] So it was not correct to say that the following are equivalent: li.sort(lambda x, y: cmp(x[1],y[1]), reverse=True) li.sort(lambda x, y: cmp(y[1],x[1])) * We should link the sorted() and list.sort() docs to the sorting how-to (with a fuller discussion on the art of sorting including a discussion of operator.itemgetter() and operator.attrgetter() which were designed to work with the key= parameter. Raymond -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Extending embedded python-can extensions be local to a dictionary?
Hello all- I've got a multithreaded server-based application that I'd like to use python to provide plugin support for. At execution time I would like each call to the plugin/plugins to have their own implementation of these extension methods. Looking at http://docs.python.org/extending/embedding.html#extending-embedded-python, I see how to add functions, but it looks like they are added at a global scope-not in a particular environment. Is there any way to add an extension to a local environment but not pollute the global env? FYI, I'm embedding python 2.6, but I'm more than open to embedding something newer. thanks Mike Kohout -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
On Aug 12, 1:27 pm, Raymond Hettinger pyt...@rcn.com wrote: (snip) * Many doc requests come from people just learning the language (that makes sense because the learning process involves reading the docs). Unfortunately, a fair number of those requests are flat-out wrong or represent a profound misunderstanding of the feature in question. That may be an indicator that the docs need to be improved... Yes, if many people have problems with the docs then that must be a *clue* to some underling problem in the way the docs are presented. Whether its from misinfomation, misguidance, or just plain misunderstanding on the reader's part that does not matter. There are problems and we need the feedback from everybody noob-to-pro on how to fix this conundrum. One thing that some naysayers may forget is the fact that these noobs most likely have no idea *how*, *when*, or *where* to voice a complaint so they just move on to the next language or suffer with an incomplete understanding of the language and/or proper python idioms. I would say the complaints that this list has seen concerning docs only scratches the surface of the huge underling issues that face us here! So, if you think eval() is evil (I don't but many do), we're not going to document that eval() should *never* be used. If you hate super(), that's too bad -- the docs need to describe what it does and how it was intended to be used -- the docs are no place for diatribes on why inheritance is over-used and why you think the world would be a better place without mixins or multiple inheritance. Eloquent and beautiful a paragraph that was Raymond. Why, because common sense is just so damn beautiful. Keep the docs clean of personal opinions and just give us the facts people. Who cares about the history of OOP --Google it!-- i want to read about using Python. Give me the nitty-gritty-down-and-dirty-facts that relate to Python syntax and structure, and only the facts, in the most strait forward and common sense way so i can get on to actually writing some code! If you seek self gratification visit c.l.py and vent away, everyone else seems to. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Format Code Repeat Counts?
Are repeat counts supported Python's str.format() in some fashion?
In Fortran my format strings can have repeat counts.
pseudocode
write(*, fmt=3F8.3) [1, 2, 3]
1.000 2.000 3.000
/pseudocode
I don't think printf-style format codes, which is what'd I'd
previously used in Python, allow for repeat counts.
As a more concrete example, say I have several sets of letters in a
list of strings
letters = [aeiou, hnopty, egs, amsp]
and I wanted to build a regular expression string out of them like
re_str == [aeiou][hnopty][egs][amsp]
Right now, the best I've got that doesn't require an explicit string
like [{1}][{2}][{3}][{4}] is
re_str = .join(map(lambda x: [{0}].format(x), letters))
Is there a better way?
Thanks,
Josiah
--
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csv.DictWriter.write_header()
Given a csv.DictWriter instance `dw` I think it would be nice to be able to say dw.write_header() instead of dw.writer.writerow(dw.fieldnames) Good idea? Alan Isaac -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: matching patterns after regex?
On 12 août, 12:43, Martin mdeka...@gmail.com wrote:
On Aug 12, 1:42 pm, Martin mdeka...@gmail.com wrote:
On Aug 12, 1:23 pm, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this-
cybersource.com.au wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 05:12:22 -0700, Martin wrote:
I tried
re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
You need to put quotes around strings.
In this case, because you're using regular expressions, you should use a
raw string:
re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
will probably work.
--
Steven
Thanks I see.
so I tried it and if I use it as it is, it matches the first instance:
I
n [594]: re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
Out[594]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
So I adjusted the first part of the regex, on the basis I could sub
NORTH for SOUTH etc.
In [595]: re.findall(r(NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.
\w-]+),s)
Out[595]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
But in both cases it doesn't return the decimal value rather the value
that comes after NUM_VAL = , rather than VALUE = ?
I think I kind of got that to work...but I am clearly not quite
understanding how it works as I tried to use it again to match
something else.
In this case I want to print the values 0.00 and 2223901.039333
from a string like this...
YDim=1200\n\t\tUpperLeftPointMtrs=(0.00,2223901.039333)\n\t\t
I tried which I though was matching the statement and printing the
decimal number after the equals sign??
re.findall(r(\w+UpperLeftPointMtrs)*=\s([\d\.\w-]+), s)
where s is the string
Many thanks for the help
You have to do it with 2 matches in the same regex:
regex = rUpperLeftPointMtrs=\(([\d\.]+),([\d\.]+)
The first match is before the , and the second one is after the , :)
You should probably learn how to play with regexes.
I personnaly use a visual tool called RX Toolkit[1] that comes with
Komodo IDE.
[1] http://docs.activestate.com/komodo/4.4/regex.html
--
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Re: Extending embedded python-can extensions be local to a dictionary?
On Aug 12, 12:44 pm, Michael Kohout mwkoh...@gmail.com wrote: Hello all- I've got a multithreaded server-based application that I'd like to use python to provide plugin support for. At execution time I would like each call to the plugin/plugins to have their own implementation of these extension methods. I am guessing that what you really want is each call to have its own data. There isn't much reason for each call to have its own methods. If that's not correct you will have to elaborate. Looking athttp://docs.python.org/extending/embedding.html#extending-embedded-py..., I see how to add functions, but it looks like they are added at a global scope-not in a particular environment. Is there any way to add an extension to a local environment but not pollute the global env? A couple things. They're not in a global scope, globals in Python have a scope local to a module (global is a misnomer, at best it means globally accessible). So you don't have to worry about a function defined on one module clashing with a function defined in another modules. However, even if name-clashes aren't an issue there isn't much point to defining the same function mulitple times for multiple calls. What you probably want is to define a new type that contains all the data extension code would need. For each call to the plugin, you would create an object of this type, then pass it to the appropriate plugin function. I have given you a vague answer because your question was vague; if you want a better answer please rephrase to be more specific. Include details like what you would like the code of a Python plugin to look like. Carl Banks -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
How to launch a function at regular time intervals ?
Hi all, I'm trying to launch a function at regular time intervals but cannot find the way to do it. Here is the code I wrote (time_interval is a user defined variable in seconds): while(1) timestamp=datetime.now() timestamp_seconds=timestamp.hour*3600+timestamp.minute*60+timestamp.second if timestamp_seconds % time_interval == 0: Call Function This does not work because during the second at which the condition holds true, there is time to call the function several times. Since I want to have this function called only once every x seconds, I tried to add the following condition: if timestamp_seconds % time_interval ==0 timestamp.microsecond == 0 But it seems this second condition hardly ever happens (i.e. the timestamp variable is not updated every microsecond, therefore it can be 9998 then jump directly to 0003 for instance). Has anyone run into a similar problem (and solved it) ? Thanks for your help -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Unrecognized escape sequences in string literals
On Aug 12, 5:32 am, Steven D'Aprano ste...@remove.this.cybersource.com.au wrote: That problem basically boils down to a deep-seated philosophical disagreement over which philosophy a language should follow in regard to backslash escapes: Anything not explicitly permitted is forbidden versus Anything not explicitly forbidden is permitted No, it doesn't. It boils down to whether a language should: (1) Try it's best to detect errors as early as possible, especially when the cost of doing so is low. (2) Make code as readable as possible, in part by making code as self-evident as possible by mere inspection and by reducing the amount of stuff that you have to memorize. Perl fails miserably in this regard, for instance. (3) To quote Einstein, make everything as simple as possible, and no simpler. (4) Take innately ambiguous things and not force them to be unambiguous by mere fiat. Allowing a programmer to program using a completely arbitrary resolution of unrecognized escape sequences violates all of the above principles. The fact that the meanings of unrecognized escape sequences are ambiguous is proved by the fact that every language seems to treat them somewhat differently, demonstrating that there is no natural intuitive meaning for them. Furthermore, allowing programmers to use unrecognized escape sequences without raising an error violates: (1) Explicit is better than implicit: Python provides a way to explicitly specify that you want a backslash. Every programmer should be encouraged to use Python's explicit mechanism here. (2) Simple is better than complex: Python currently has two classes of ambiguously interpretable escape sequences: unrecognized ones, and illegal ones. Making a single class (i.e. just illegal ones) is simpler. Also, not having to memorize escape sequences that you rarely have need to use is simpler. (3) Readability counts: See above comments on readability. (4) Errors should never pass silently: Even the Python Reference Manual indicates that unrecognized escape sequences are a source of bugs. (See more comments on this below.) (5) In the face of ambiguity, refuse the temptation to guess. Every language, other than C++, is taking a guess at what the programmer would find to be most useful expansion for unrecognized escape sequences, and each of the languages is guessing differently. This temptation should be refused! You can argue that once it is in the Reference Manual it is no longer a guess, but that is patently specious, as Perl proves. For instance, the fact that Perl will quietly convert an array into a scalar for you, if you assign the array to a scalar variable is certainly a guess of the sort that this Python koan is referring to. Likewise for an arbitrary interpretation of unrecognized escape sequences. (6) There should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it. What is the one obvious way to express \\y? It is \\y or \y? Python can easily make one of these ways the one obvious way by making the other one raise an error. (7) Namespaces are one honking great idea -- let's do more of those! Allowing \y to self-expand is intruding into the namespace for special characters that require an escape sequence. C++ apparently forbids all escape sequences, with unspecified behaviour if you use a forbidden sequence, except for a handful of explicitly permitted sequences. That's not better, it's merely different. It *is* better, as it catches errors early on at little cost, and for all the other reasons listed above. Actually, that's not true -- that the C++ standard forbids a thing, but leaves the consequences of doing that thing unspecified, is clearly a Bad Thing. Indeed. But C++ has backward compatibly issues that make any that Python has to deal with, pale in comparison. The recommended behavior for a C++ compiler, however, is to flag the problem as an error or as a warning. So on at least one machine in the world, C++ simply strips out backslashes that it doesn't recognize, leaving the suffix. Unfortunately, we can't rely on that, because C++ is underspecified. No, *fortunately* you can't rely on it, forcing you to go fix your code. Fortunately this is not a problem with Python, which does completely specify the behaviour of escape sequences so there are no surprises. It's not a surprise when the C++ compiler issues a warning to you. If you ignore the warning, then you have no one to blame but yourself. Implicit has an actual meaning. You shouldn't use it as a mere term of opprobrium for anything you don't like. Pardon me, but I'm using implicit to mean implicit, and nothing more. Python's behavior here is implicit in the very same way that Perl implicitly converts an array into a scalar for you. (Though that particular Perl behavior is a far bigger wart than Python's behavior is here!) Because you've stated that \y is a legal escape sequence, while the Python Reference Manual explicitly states
Re: Social problems of Python doc [was Re: Python docs disappointing]
[Raymond Hettinger] Here are a few thoughts on list.sort() for those who are interested: After one more reading of Xah Lee's posts on the documentation for sort, here are couple more thoughts: * The reason that list.sort() allows None for the cmp parameter is not so that you can write list.sort(None). It was put there to make it easier for people writing function definitions where the cmp function is a possible argument: def sort_and_chop(seq, maxlen, cmp=None): s = seq[:] s.sort(cmp) # needs to accept None as a possible argument return s[:maxlen] * The reason for implementing the key= parameter had nothing to do with limitations of Python's compiler. Instead, it was inspired by the decorate-sort-undecorate pattern. Raymond -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: matching patterns after regex?
Bernard wrote:
On 12 août, 12:43, Martin mdeka...@gmail.com wrote:
On Aug 12, 1:42 pm, Martin mdeka...@gmail.com wrote:
On Aug 12, 1:23 pm, Steven D'Aprano st...@remove-this-
cybersource.com.au wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 05:12:22 -0700, Martin wrote:
I tried
re.findall((\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
You need to put quotes around strings.
In this case, because you're using regular expressions, you should use a
raw string:
re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
will probably work.
--
Steven
Thanks I see.
so I tried it and if I use it as it is, it matches the first instance:
I
n [594]: re.findall(r(\w+COORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.\w-]+),s)
Out[594]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
So I adjusted the first part of the regex, on the basis I could sub
NORTH for SOUTH etc.
In [595]: re.findall(r(NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE).*\s+VALUE\s+=\s([\d\.
\w-]+),s)
Out[595]: [('NORTHBOUNDINGCOORDINATE', '1')]
But in both cases it doesn't return the decimal value rather the value
that comes after NUM_VAL = , rather than VALUE = ?
I think I kind of got that to work...but I am clearly not quite
understanding how it works as I tried to use it again to match
something else.
In this case I want to print the values 0.00 and 2223901.039333
from a string like this...
YDim=1200\n\t\tUpperLeftPointMtrs=(0.00,2223901.039333)\n\t\t
I tried which I though was matching the statement and printing the
decimal number after the equals sign??
re.findall(r(\w+UpperLeftPointMtrs)*=\s([\d\.\w-]+), s)
where s is the string
Many thanks for the help
You have to do it with 2 matches in the same regex:
regex = rUpperLeftPointMtrs=\(([\d\.]+),([\d\.]+)
The first match is before the , and the second one is after the , :)
You should probably learn how to play with regexes.
I personnaly use a visual tool called RX Toolkit[1] that comes with
Komodo IDE.
[1] http://docs.activestate.com/komodo/4.4/regex.html
Haven't tried it myself but how about this?
http://re-try.appspot.com/
--
Kindest regards.
Mark Lawrence.
--
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Plotting Quadratic Functions, pygame
Hello, I'm a new guy to this group, my professor recommend this group
to me, because I was boring him with questions.I'm new to python, and
I have problem plotting Quadratic Functions. Using module pygame.
Here is the code:
#!/usr/bin/env python
import pygame
def main():
import sys
import math
from math import sqrt
#Input equation coefficients
screen=pygame.display.set_mode((400,400))
pygame.display.set_caption( ' Ploting ' )
screen.fill((255,255,255))
pen=((0,0,255))
dark=(0,0,0)
ox=200
oy=200
a= int(raw_input('Input coefficient a ' ))
b= int(raw_input('Input coefficient b ' ))
c= int(raw_input('Input coefficient c ' ))
pygame.draw.aaline(screen,((255,0,0)),((200,0)) ,((200,400)))
pygame.draw.aaline(screen,((255,0,0)),((0,200)), ((400,200)))
if a==0:
if b==0:
print 'No solutions'
else:
x= -c/b
print x
else:
d=b*b-4*a*c
if d0:
num=complex(-b/(2*a),sqrt(-d)/(2*a))
print num
else:
x1=(-b+sqrt(d))/(2*a)
x2=(-b-sqrt(d))/(2*a)
print 'x1= ' ,x1
print 'x2= ' ,x2
while 1:
for event in pygame.event.get():
if event ==pygame.QUIT:
print ' Quitting'
pygame.quit()
sys.exit(1)
x=-50;
while x=50:
y=(a*(x**2) + b*x + c) *(-1)
screen.set_at(((x+ox),(y+oy)),dark)
pygame.display.flip()
x=x+1;
return 0
if __name__ == '__main__': main()
For now I'm plotting function only when Determinant 0. Or in other
words, when equation has two solutions,
x1,x2 e R... Now if you start my program you will see where problem
is. It's with function, It so bad drawn.
When I try to increment x in loop by 0.1 for every pass, I get
problems because method set_at() Which sets pixel requires integer...
Also I see I have problems with event handling here:
while 1:
for event in pygame.event.get():
if event ==pygame.QUIT:
print ' Quitting'
pygame.quit()
sys.exit(1)
When I click X, or exit on windows it doesn't exit.
What do you suggest I do...?
I don't have in this year Computer Graphics on my faculty. So this are
my first steps in this area of CS.
Regards,
S.I
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