RE: Rights of clergy regarding same-sex marriage?

2005-03-15 Thread Robert K. Vischer
Certainly social reform is coming, but it's already taking a certain form.  The 
movement toward same-sex unions is pretty clearly proceeding down the track of 
expanding our conception of government marriage, rather than removing the 
government from marriage.  Such a dramatic shift in the object of reform 
efforts at this stage would require reorienting the entire movement, and the 
impetus for the reorientation is not obvious.  Further, pushing marriage back 
to religious (and non-religious) mediating communities is not going to erase 
the culture war tension surrounding the issue.  As we see in a variety of 
contexts, suggesting that the state retreat from contests over religiously 
shaped conceptions of the good can prove immensely unpopular.  Especially in 
the post-Roe environment, many religious voices (most prominently, but of 
course not exclusively, evangelicals) are not going to retreat into their 
respective corners, content to maintain marriage as a religiously pure, but 
legally marginalized, subculture practice.  (In theological terms, the work of 
Richard John Neuhaus has a much wider following than the work of Stanley 
Hauerwas.)
 
To be clear, I think it's an attractive idea.  I just don't see how it's going 
to happen.
 
Rob Vischer

-Original Message- 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Steven Jamar 
Sent: Tue 3/15/2005 5:57 PM 
To: Law  Religion issues for Law Academics 
Cc: 
Subject: Re: Rights of clergy regarding same-sex marriage?



On Tuesday, March 15, 2005, at 04:44  PM, James Maule wrote:

 What major social reform effectuated through legal change was NOT a
 political non-starter when it first was proposed?

Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it s the only thing that ever
has.

Margaret Meade


 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 3/15/2005 3:12:30 PM 

  The idea of cleanly separating religious
 marriage from state-recognized relationship is appealing, but a
 political non-starter, in my view.

 Rob Vischer

--
Prof. Steven D. Jamar vox:  202-806-8017
Howard University School of Law   fax:  202-806-8428
2900 Van Ness Street NW mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Washington, DC  20008  http://www.law.howard.edu/faculty/pages/jamar

God, give us grace to accept with serenity the things that cannot be
changed, courage to change the things which should be changed, and the
wisdom to distinguish the one from the other.

Reinhold Neibuhr 1943

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RE: Steven Williams Case .:.

2004-12-06 Thread Robert K. Vischer









Believe it or not: http://www.churchofbodmod.com/ 



Rob Vischer



-Original Message-
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Menard, Richard H.
Sent: Monday, December 06, 2004
9:30 AM
To: 'Law  Religion issues for
Law Academics'
Subject: RE: Steven Williams Case
.:.





I haven't read the
opinion yet, but it sounds like a tacit judgment on the sincerity of the
belief. Church of Body Modification, please.





-Original
Message-
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Marc Stern
Sent: Monday, December 06, 2004
9:25 AM
To: Law  Religion issues for
Law Academics
Subject: RE: Steven Williams Case
.:.







The First Circuit last week decided Cloutier v. Costco
Wholesale Corp, 04-1475 a Tile VII religious accommodation case. The plaintiff
claimed to be a member of the Church of Body Modification which required
members to wear facial jewelry. Such jewelry violated Costco's no facial
jewelry policy. The Court found that an accommodation of the faith would have
constituted undue hardship to Costco because customers would be offended by the
appearance of facial jewelry. Courtshave also upheld dress code
policies thatare designed to appeal to customer preference or to promote a
professional public image.

I find this astonishing. No court would uphold a
whites only hiring policy on ground of customer preference. Airlines long ago
lost the argument about customer preferences for sexy stewardesses. Why is
religious garb different?

The judicial evisceration of Title VII's religious
accommodation provisions continues apace.

Marc Stern
















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