{S-Scale List} Trains (in general) Making A Comeback?!? [3 Attachments]
Based on my findings at a variety of retail stores over the last few weeks... these (see attachments) being found yesterday at Target... trains, in some form or another, appear to be making, or trying to make a comeback. I can remember, as far back as the late '70s and very early '80s, seeing a variety of brands of train sets from manufacturers such as AHM, LifeLike and Bachmann on the shelves at nearly every store I ventured into... and even a fair assortment of accessories for them (bridges, telephone poles, styrofoam tunnels, structures, etc), but I haven't seen much of such for many years... haven't even seen many of these no-particular-scale type trains on the shelves. But over the past year I have started noticing more stuff like this AND even a resurgence in the HO scale train stuff... am even seeing some Woodland Scenics stuff on the shelves at some stores. Could it be that our hobby is NOT as doomed as it may appear to some, including me from time to time? John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Trains (in general) Making A Comeback?!?
Thanks, Rich. It is clear to me that our moderator did not take time to THINK
about what I wrote...
And just think... Obama hasn't even started his next term, yet...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: richgajnak
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2012 11:53 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Trains (in general) Making A Comeback?!?
Funny, I didn't read anything negative in John's post, more a sense that
model railroading is alive and well inspite of the odds thrown at the hobby by
the modern world.
John and I don't see eye to eye about various aspects of our hobby and S, but
I didn't see anything negative or controversial in his posting about seeing
more trains in the stores.
However, we cannot just sit on the sidelines and pretend everything is all
bunnies and puppies in S or the hobby in general.
If we cannot have a reasonable discussion regarding both the good and bad of
the various aspects of the hobby, it is my perception that this is not
moderation, but blatant censorship.
Read this post fast guys, I expect both it and myself will be gone soon.
Rich G(ajnak)
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: NORTHBOUND : Somewhat Off-Topic
Ok, you asked for it...
North Caroline candidates, so far, are Hendersonville, Asheville, Mars Hill,
Greensboro and Raleigh. GA candidates are Kennesaw (Big Shanty), Rome and
somewhere near, but not in, the Atlanta area. The TN candidate is Chattanooga.
The SC candidate is Greenville. And the VA candidates are Lynchburg and
Roanoke.
I am partial, so far, to Hendersonville, Asheville, Kennesaw and the
closer-to-Atlanta towns/cities... but still looking... and thinking... and
trying to determine if these areas have good, well-established hobby shops...
and, of course, there is the cost of living and job market issues to consider
as well... LOL.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: wpscaler
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2012 08:05 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: NORTHBOUND : Somewhat Off-Topic
John: I for one would be curious to lean of your finds.
Art Ferguson
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Radius Roll Call
What about turnouts, Dick? What size are yours and, since you can't have
easements on turnouts, how do these cars handle them?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Richard Karnes
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2012 01:57 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Radius Roll Call
... my only curves smaller than 48 are in my hidden staging-yard loop, and
they are as tight as 33 inches. There are... ...no operational problems on my
33-inch curves because I have spiral easements entering and leaving these sharp
curves. (Note: No special coupler mounts are needed on my long cars -- Just
standard Kadee 802/808 boxes rigidly attached to carbodies.)
Dick Karnes
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Raduis Roll Call [6 Attachments]
Of course, there was the ever famous Orange Blossom Special...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: raisinone
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2012 06:22 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Raduis Roll Call
My personal favorite, a train I'm modeling, is Rock Island's Choctaw Rocket
- daily Memphis to Amarillo - E6a, RPO and three passenger cars. The Nancy
Hanks and Ann Rutledge are two others that come to mind as short name
trains. A quick look at some actual 1940's consists yielded Pennsy's Liberty
Limited - 4-6-2 and 5 cars in December 1948. Two others that comprise a
single locomotive and 4 or fewer cars were The Gulf Coast Rebel (GMO) and
the Lookout (NCStL), again both in the 1940's.
Jim Kindraka
Plymouth, WI
{S-Scale List} For the record / I'm just sayin'...
Just to make my recent off-road wanderings make sense to those who were wondering... My recent interest in the UP Big Boy and Challenger is due to two things... the first, and main reason is that I have a local friend who swears he would convert to S if, and only if, he could get these two locomotives in S... and he (like me) doesn't care if they are brass or plastic! The other, less relevant reason, is that I, personally, am a HUGE fan of articulated steam locos! SAL had a few examples of articulated steam, but was not a big user of it. So I have to go off-road to get what I want/like in this category of interest. So... I'm just sayin'... if ever the Big Boy and Challenger are re-done in S, S will gain another supporter (at least one), and I will be buying a few, myself... brass or plastic... ... as long as a much better job is done on them than was done on the originals, 25 YEARS ago on the Challenger and 31 YEARS ago on the Big Boy. Given the amount of time that has passed, I don't see why there wouldn't be enough interest in these locos to see the models done. John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: For the record / I'm just sayin'...
Welcome to the party, Rich! :)
Lucif... um, I mean John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: richgajnak
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 07:15 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: For the record / I'm just sayin'...
Good grief, it's another sign of the apocolypse, I agree with John on
something else! ;-)
That's been one of the mentalities holding S Scale back, the fact that
something's been done before.
It seems like every time a USRA light Mike is brought up, the response is
usually But, Overland's already done them.
Yep, nothing helps to recruit new folks into S like having to tell them to
search the secondary market for things (relatively) common in the other scales.
Rich G(ajnak)
Re: {S-Scale List} Raduis Roll Call
Sign me up for that work session...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: gftolhu...@aol.com
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 07:38 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Raduis Roll Call
George, you old hound dawg. You and your buddies are welcome in Maryville any
time--might be more of a work session than a layout tour, though...
Fred T in Tennessee
Re: {S-Scale List} For the record / I'm just sayin'...
Yeah... seems like I remember hearing something about this quite some time
back... can't remember all the details. Interesting, to say the least.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Baker
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 07:02 AM
Subject: RE: {S-Scale List} For the record / I'm just sayin'...
John,
You probably already know this little bit of history: During WWII, the MStL
went shopping for new steam locomotives and tried out an SAL 2-6-6-4. I do not
know exactly where it ran on the system, but the company tried it, liked it,
and wanted to order several copies.
The War Production Board, however, would not allow it, and the MStL instead
ordered two A-B-A sets of FTs. What might have been! If the Board had allowed
the order, those articulateds would have been stomping through western
Illinois, into Iowa, and Minnesota with steam identical to what the SAL had.
Tom
Re: {S-Scale List} Walthers Coupler Brackets
The correct Walthers part # is 933-997... and I posted about these on one of
the groups a few years back.
The bad thing about this item is... well, just install a few of them on some
models then try backing them through turnouts and S curves... and I think
you'll get the picture.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: David Engle
To: S-Scale Group ; ri_mod...@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2012 11:12 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Walthers Coupler Brackets
Has anyone tried to use the (HO) Walthers Swinging Coupler Adapter Kit, part
933-977, on any long cars in S? It was originally designed for Athearn 86'
high cube boxcars and flat cars. The instruction sheet has a copyright date of
1994, seems strange we had not heard of the item before now. DJE-KCMO
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: radius roll call
This is true... but the 33 minimum radius will probably depend on the width of
the gearbox which limits the swing of the coupler. Such as will be the case
with my narrower gear boxes due out next year... wider radii will be necessary.
This will only apply to cars and locos that have a longer distance between the
truck centers and the ends of the model. The shorter the distance the tighter
the curve can be. Taking the SHS Ore Cars for instance... I'm sure they will
easily handle much tighter curves than 33 and would probably require little to
no easement.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Richard Karnes
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2012 10:56 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: radius roll call
The easement is everything. No easement, and you will have trouble with any
pair of long cars entering or leaving a curve that's less than 48-inch radius.
If you introduce a spiral easement between the tangent and the curve, your
problem will disappear and you can use radii down to about 33 inches.
Dick Karnes
Re: {S-Scale List} Walthers Coupler Brackets
The heavier the model is the more this problem will occur. And since S models
are naturally heavier than HO, this problem will be more pronounced in S using
something like the Walthers 933-997. I don't believe this product is suitable
for S models for this very reason. The dual pivot-points can allow the
attachmentto pivot to the left and the coupler (installed in the attachment) to
pivot to the left, leading to dual-buckling which could lead (during backing)
to the ends of the car bumping into each other AND/OR derailments... or worse...
Instead, I would opt for a drawbar or something similar.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: David Engle
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2012 09:22 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Walthers Coupler Brackets
We are dealing with the same thing--the misstated part number is my fault.
Dave Engle - KCMO
- Original Message -
From: John Degnan
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com ; ri_mod...@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2012 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Walthers Coupler Brackets
The correct Walthers part # is 933-997... and I posted about these on one
of the groups a few years back.
The bad thing about this item is... well, just install a few of them on
some models then try backing them through turnouts and S curves... and I think
you'll get the picture.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: David Engle
To: S-Scale Group ; ri_mod...@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2012 11:12 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Walthers Coupler Brackets
Has anyone tried to use the (HO) Walthers Swinging Coupler Adapter Kit,
part 933-977, on any long cars in S? It was originally designed for Athearn
86' high cube boxcars and flat cars. The instruction sheet has a copyright
date of 1994, seems strange we had not heard of the item before now. DJE-KCMO
Re: {S-Scale List} Posting
Don't depend on anything from Yahoo but problems. Even Yahoo knows this, so
they installed the 'BOUNCING' feature to deal with some of the problems. G
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: David Engle
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2012 03:19 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Posting
I thought it was automatic with my preference settings.
David J. Engle
Kansas City, MO
- Original Message -
From: s-scale-ow...@yahoogroups.com
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2012 9:49 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Posting
All;
When posting to this group PLEASE sign your posts with your first and last
name.
Regardless if you are world famous in the S world.
Thank you
Jeff Sankus Co-moderator
{S-Scale List} NORTHBOUND : Somewhat Off-Topic
Advance apologies for cross-posting between groups, but maybe we'll have some fun with this... As silly as this may sound, I told my wife that if we ever decided to move again, I was going to make darn sure that we picked a place where there were a large number of other model railroaders at work in at least one of the scales that I dabble in (S, HO and O (2-rail)) to fellowship with. So, if such a thing exists, where might one find information dealing with the greatest concentrations, per region/state/city.etc, of model railroaders in the southeast? I've already determined that I do not want to go any farther south, so FLA, AL and MS are out. I'm leaning toward north GA, TN or NC, but not discounting other possibilities such as VA... and maybe KY (technically not part of the southeast, but close enough). So let's hear it, guys... Where y'all hangin' yer hats?!? Direct, private replies welcome. John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net
{S-Scale List} Sunset's UP Challenger Big Boy
Looking for photos of and info about Sunset Models' (brass) Big Boy and Challenger. How well were these models done and how well did they operate? I might also be interested in any that might be for sale. John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net
Re: {S-Scale List} a froggy day
Are these frogs cast or layered like the P:87 frogs from the Proto87 Stores?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2012 07:21 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} a froggy day [1 Attachment]
I finally got the rest of the new Protocraft frogs installed in my mainline
crossovers today. If you are using the SHS rail and have #8 it is the only way
to go. Protocraft does not make a #6 in code 138 rail and unfortunately is not
going to. Anyway, the 0-4-0 Docksider crawls through the turnouts now when it
used to stall, along with a surprisingly number of other locomotives. It is
just flawless now.
Bill Lane
IMG_3727.JPG
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: A new Deputy Sheriff in this small town
Along those same lines... or along this same mainline to to put it in railroad
terminology...
... Even though this is not a democracy and the Constitution does not apply
here, it is kinda similar in the sense that, although the Constitution may
cover person one's RIGHT to run their mouth, it does not cover person one's @$$
when person two decides to plant person two's foot up person one's @$$ because
person two didn't like what person one said.
In layman terms - having a RIGHT does not eliminate one's accountability.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: clipper...@att.net
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, November 02, 2012 12:45 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: A new Deputy Sheriff in this small town
since bill pieter pay the freight, i believe we have to live by their
rules, if you choose to make a financial contribution to their cause, they may
entitle you to your opinion, but since this is not
a democracy, we have to live b the rules, free speech is not free, it is a
privilege, which has more
than been abused lately, i for one am glad that they has decided to clean it
up, maybe the
discussions can turn back to their original intent, MODELING
mel perry
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Admin Moderating new S parts
OOPH! Heh heh... been nice knowing you, Ed. G
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, November 02, 2012 02:11 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Admin Moderating new S parts
I thought personal attacks were against the rules and were cause for
moderation. Ed L.
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, Bill Lane bill@... wrote:
Dave,
It is ignorant posts like yours that really annoy me. You can easily tell
the level of complete annoyance by the length of the following. We are
taking OUR time to clean up a bit and reset out priorities and this is what
we get. YOU have not spent 1 second of your life in managing this group.
Pieter I have spent LOTS of time. It is time you don't see with us
replying to members direct emails about their complaints. It is time taken
away from me that I could be modeling or doing anything else really.
People like YOU do not volunteer because it requires WORK. Why bother
volunteering because you have other people to do that whether you like how
it is done or not. I have heard it said that in volunteer organizations 5%
of the people do 95% of the work. In the case here it is about .75% manage
the group. While by far NOT a slight at Pieter, because I am home most of
the time I do most of what needs to get done. That is why I was so glad Jeff
volunteered to help out.
It also is **extremely** annoying to have helpful suggestions sent which
really mean full list moderation without ANY offer to help in the approval
process. There was over 1300 posts last month alone. Why should I sift
though and approve that hot mess? That is over 40 posts a day. I don't
work for you! It is not a paying job! I forever will believe in self
moderation by a group of 50+ year old allegedly mature men (mostly) that
know the rules and what the content is supposed to be!
So Dave - this part is JUST FOR YOU. I have tried finesse with moderate
success. Here comes the baseball bat with your name on it. Maybe you will
get IT now. You are on this list frequently posting whatever. But I don't
recall when you have possibly ever or recently posted an S Scale look what
I just finished. If I am wrong - so sorry. While posting your finished
models is by far not a requirement for list membership it would be nice to
see that you work where you live because you are so actively posting, and
antagonistic. ***Yes - you are about to become the first S Scale list poster
child.*** You want tons of emails freely sent without any moderation
whatsoever but your membership was set to NO EMAIL just in case you did not
want to read the babble you helped create. So you don't eat what you want
cooked. I have just changed your membership to cannot post. Email me
directly that you have accomplished some form of real S Scale modeling in
the next week. Take a photo of a PRS kit not assembled sitting on a
newspaper showing the date and again in the same way when it is completed. I
promise I will switch you back - business as usual. If you cannot or do not
want to do that - Buh Bye. I will give you more time to do real S Scale
modeling by not posting here.
For all here - you want clean up - you got it. But more no posts changes
can be done. Now with some help there is a new Sherriff in this small town.
**NOTE THIS*** If you post something and don't see it in a day or so you can
now assume the possibility that you are on moderation and it has been
deleted without notice. I cannot ask Jeff to **reply to everyone** and
explain why their post cannot be released. Clean up your content - don't get
put on moderation - and your posts will fly freely as usual.
My new S Modeling content.
I spent some of yesterday designing 2 new parts for my PRSL AS16. Because
they are so very custom to a specific locomotive I am going in a different
direction for the first time. Previously all RP parts I have made for master
patterns were for master casting purposes. Because my AS16 is mixed
materials there is not advantage to getting them cast in brass. So for the
first time I am using the real RP parts on a model. I have been assured they
are suitable for painting and use like a regular plastic part.
My PRSL AS16 6015 has split vertical headlights. (See photo) BTS has a
wonderful casting (Alco back up light I think) for this that worked
perfectly but that whole area is then covered by an overall lens. I did not
have a suitable bezel or headlight ring for that. I am waiting for some LEDs
for the headlight from Richmond Controls. I tried some really small Richmond
LEDs for the class lights but they are still too big so I am unfortunately
keeping
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: A new Deputy Sheriff in this small town
I am no nut, pal... I happen to be a pissy-stachio! G John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net --- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, Bill Lane bill@... wrote: For the first time since Pieter I took over the group someone actually volunteered to help run this nut shop.
Re: {S-Scale List} Admin Sandy Other off topic posts
Re: {S-Scale List} Admin Sandy Other off topic postsMaybe he meant an S
scale foxhole...?!?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Roy Inman
To: S-Scale
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2012 10:47 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Admin Sandy Other off topic posts
Foxhole?
And this has to do with S scale how?
Roy Inman
Re: {S-Scale List} Off topic posts
STRONG advice(s) to EVERYONE from one who knows (and builds) computer systems...
1. NEVER, EVER store or install ANYTHING on your master (main) (C:) drive
where your operating system is installed!!! For storage purposes, use...
2 - USB Flash Drives!!! Use them to store EVERYTHING!!!
... and for programs that you install, install them on...
3 - SECONDARY HARD DRIVES (internal or external)!!!
Both of the above are cheap enough and affordable.
Otherwise... plan to eventually lose something... and maybe everything!
Not using either (or both) of these devices is like driving a train without a
caboose. Just ask some of those MODERN modelers.
For what it's worth...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: cnr3304
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2012 01:09 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Off topic posts
Here is an off-topic warning.
I purchased the update to Windows 8 without thinking, actually because it was
cheap. I installed it from XP and it wiped out all my programs including my
design software I use for producing etchings, pattern making and layout design.
(model RR content). I brought it back and got a refund where I learned I
should not have tried to update from XP. Nice after the fact. Unfortunately,
Windows 8 will not save your programs if you upgrade from anything other than
Windows 7. It will save your photos though so my Railway pics were okay except
my snowplow photos. All my data files (except my #$#X$!%# showplow photos) are
on a different drive so that was fine.
However, no one warned me about this and it could have been worse. It has
taken me the better part of 2 days to restore my computer to XP with SP2
because XP is not really supported that much any more.
So if you wish to upgrade to the latest and greatest from Microsoft, back
everything up, especially any of your Train files.
cheers,
Andy Malette
Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: {S-Scale List} Off topic posts
So far I have never had a single flash drive failure, but I have heard that
they do, occasionally fail. But the type of flash drive I'm referring to is
the ADAPTER type (similar to the MAUSB500 from Olympus) where a flash disk
plugs into the drive/adapter so that you can have multiple disks with one
adapter. And I always keep two of everything - two disks with the same info.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: ken garber
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2012 09:43 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Off topic posts
We tell our users to save in TWO places.
And we tell them NOT to store data solely on a flashdrive - they DO fail.
External USB harddrives are okay for backup.
Yes, I miss cabooses too.
Ken
Re: {S-Scale List} Off topic posts
I actually am talking about trains... in that I use the computer technology
we're referring to for storage of my train photos and other info... S scale or
other.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: richgajnak
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2012 10:09 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Off topic posts
The next thing you know, we'll be talking about S Scale trains!
Oh, the humanity...
Rich G(ajnak)
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
... not a descendant [or a remnant].
Otherwise, well said.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2012 04:48 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
To have a strong future S must stand as a scale size not a descendant of toy
train line
DaveBranum
Re: {S-Scale List} The Y-3 IS for me
I might even want one of those Y-6 models, myself. Not sure why... but maybe!
I might could even use a Y-3 since the SAL... I think... temporarily had
something similar to them. Hmmm... lemme research this a bit...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2012 07:10 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} The Y-3 IS for me
I would want it in NW though. My best choice would be a RRM Y-6b. I have
been campaigning to Dan for that one for years. I would then have my 2 favorite
non-PRR steam locos.
Re: {S-Scale List} The Y-3 IS for me
Yes, they were only very briefly used on the SAL as they proved to be too heavy
for SAL's lightweight rail... if I remember correctly.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Jack Wyatt
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2012 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} The Y-3 IS for me
I might could even use a Y-3 since the SAL... I think... temporarily had
something similar to them. Hmmm... lemme research this a bit...
Temporary is right. SAL Nos. 500-515, built in 1917, were sold to the BO
during November 1920.
Jack Wyatt
Re: {S-Scale List} NW Caboose
Just for shoots and googles...
Assuming we're talking about the Lionel 2-8-8-2...
What about the REST of the model? How does it actually scale out as compared
to the prototype? Anyone know?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2012 12:06 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} NW Caboose
Just dreaming out loud - if somehow the AF Y-3 ever miraculously got scale
wheels...
Re: {S-Scale List} The Y-3 IS for me
Doesn't really matter anyway... the Lionel model has the wrong tender for what
I MIGHT could have used it (with a bad excuse) for... and there is no known
source in S for the correct (shorty Vanderbilt) tender. Sad...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Jack Wyatt
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2012 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} The Y-3 IS for me
I might could even use a Y-3 since the SAL... I think... temporarily had
something similar to them. Hmmm... lemme research this a bit...
Temporary is right. SAL Nos. 500-515, built in 1917, were sold to the BO
during November 1920.
Jack Wyatt
Re: {S-Scale List} Des Plaines Hobbies SD-45
My thoughts as well. I saw the samples, myself, and was VERY impressed!
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Tom Hawley
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2012 02:58 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Des Plaines Hobbies SD-45
Mr Sebastian was at the NASG convention in Chattanooga, showed parts, and
said he was making good progress. I can't imagine him investing as much as
he has into this loco and then giving up.
Tom Hawley -- Lansing Mich
Re: {S-Scale List} Promises.......
Yeah... but what concerns me the most is what SEX those virgins will be. There
is, after all, only so much I can (and will) work with...
Does this paint laying TRACK on a roadBED in a whole new light?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 12:32 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Promises...
Sooner or later Heaven with 77 virgins will land in my lap and then I can
really have fun. No need to even pray.
Cheers...Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Well said, Jim, Alan Lambert needs to realize that you (and us scale
modelers) don't care about HiRail standards... and never will. We're all doing
just fine without a single thought about it or for it.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: SMMW
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 10:18 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
To Alan Lambert:
I don't need to realize anything re: hi-rail wheelsets. I've always
focused my kits toward the scale modeler, which includes detailed draft gear
and underframe. If the purchaser wants to add hi-rail wheels and oversize
couplers, that's his choice but one that will likely result in some of that
detail being removed to make room. I'm not getting into the debate of scale
vs. hi-rail operators; it is what it is. All I can say is that my past,
present and future offerings will cater to the detail-conscious modeler because
that's my target market and compromising that level of detail is not an option
for me.
Jim King
President, Smoky Mountain Model Works, Inc.
Ph. (828) 777-5619
www.smokymountainmodelworks.com
Trainmaster, Craggy Mountain Line RR
www.craggymountainline.com
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
The only question I have, Allen, is What is your big question?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 10:35 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
From: Alan Lambert
That will work for me, just add more modern rolling stock to your list and
add more quanity. There are more than 100 people that like your kits and Making
only 100 of a certain car sends out a big ? mark to some people. Me included.
I'm more like Brooks Stover, Ihave highrail wheels and Scale couplers.
Alan Lambert
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Addendum : I have another question for you, Allen... why can't you seem to
grasp that increasing sales is NOT Jim's primary focus? Quality and fidelity
are Jim's fame... not mass mediocrity.
And now that I think of it, yet another question I could ask you is this - Why
aren't you equally critical of the BRASS manufacturers who also produce their
SCALE, non-AF-compatable models in short runs based in the amount of
reservations? Jim's production philosophy isn't much removed from theirs, so
why aren't you nagging them?
Well?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 10:35 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
That will work for me, just add more modern rolling stock to your list and
add more quanity. There are more than 100 people that like your kits and Making
only 100 of a certain car sends out a big ? mark to some people. Me included.
I'm more like Brooks Stover, Ihave highrail wheels and Scale couplers.
Alan Lambert
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Butch,
A great big pat on the back AND your membership badge (in the scalers society)
are on their way to you!
Just because you get it!
LOL
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: up148
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 12:19 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Good for you Jim. I'm tired of seeing compromised details for the sake of
Hi-Rail operation in both O and S gauge. The scalers come up on the short end
of the stick too much of the time anyway. Let them remove details instead of us
have to add details. VBG.
Butch
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Alan,
Like Jim said - There is no need (as you surmise) when the orders
(reservations) don't materialize.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:18 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
From: Alan Lambert
John,
The need for more modern cars like the auto racs that haul long trains of
automobils today for one. Thee are more but I'm not going to list them. Just go
by a train yard and you will get the picture.
Alan Lambert
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Wrong. PRICE dictates sales. ORDERS dictate production.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:27 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
From: Alan Lambert
John,
Brass is a whole different ballgame. How many $2000.00 alligainy steamers do
you have. Price dictates production and not everyone is going to shell out that
much for one locomotive. Produce one in plastic and see where sales go. If it
were available I would grab one in a heartbeat.
Alan Lambert
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Tom,
1. Although I model 1959, I grew up in the 70s and 80s, so I occasionally buy
a model of a prototype from that era because it reminds me of what I saw as a
kid. I will be buying some SD-45 when SSA releases them. I also like
intermodal cars, so I will buy them as well if any are ever produced...
especially Gunderson Twin Stack cars! YEAH BUDDY! Some SD-7s, SD-9s, SD-35s
(and SDP-35 variant) and SD-40s would be great, too! And some GE C-trucked
diesels and some U-36-Cs and some C-30-7s and... and... and... ... ...
2. I LOVE building kits. But I have to admit that it is getting much harder
for me to do so as my eyesight is fast deteriorating.
3. Do I, of all people, really need to answer #3? LOL!
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Tom Hawley
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:27 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
- Original Message -
From: John Degnan
. . . . . . . Alan Lambert needs to realize that you (and us scale
modelers) don't care about HiRail . . . . . . . .
Another question has been bugging me, maybe others -- How many S gaugers
are there who are -
1. Modern modellers
2. Inclined to build kits
3. Still using over-size flanges maybe over-sze couplers too.
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
How is he to know what people want, Alan, if people don't tell him?
YOU go risk YOUR money that way... don't ask Jim to.
And for the record... this is EXACTLY what I'll be doing next year with my
coupler draft gear boxes... risking MY money.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:48 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
From: Alan Lambert
John,
Jim needs to offer more then the request's will come in He does not know what
we want him to produce. What he has on his website is a small offering.
Alan
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
I have no ALLEGHENYS because I don't want or need any. I also have no brass of
any kind because none of it suits my needs.
So what does this prove for you? I fail to see the relevance of your question
since it actually proves my point and not yours - that brass, like Jim's
urethane models, are produced based on ORDERS.
What part of this are you not getting?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:44 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
From: Alan Lambert
Fort Worth, Texas
John,
Still did not answer my question. How manybrass allegainies do you have from
River Rasins.
Alan
From: John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 4:31 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Wrong. PRICE dictates sales. ORDERS dictate production.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:27 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
From: Alan Lambert
John,
Brass is a whole different ballgame. How many $2000.00 alligainy steamers
do you have. Price dictates production and not everyone is going to shell out
that much for one locomotive. Produce one in plastic and see where sales go.
If it were available I would grab one in a heartbeat.
Alan Lambert
Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
I don't remember those being TWIN Stack cars... thought they were DOUBLE stack
cars... ?!? There IS a difference.
How many of these were produced and in what schemes and road numbers?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Alan Lambert
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:59 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
From: Alan Lambert
John,
Remember the Gunderson Twin Stack cars SHS offered through SSA. I have 3 of
them with Highrail Wheelsets. Yes the Scale coupler pads had to be compromizes
but I got them anyway. That would be a good car for Jim to produce.
Alan Lambert
SSA does not produce them anymore.
From: John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 4:50 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
Tom,
1. Although I model 1959, I grew up in the 70s and 80s, so I occasionally
buy a model of a prototype from that era because it reminds me of what I saw as
a kid. I will be buying some SD-45 when SSA releases them. I also like
intermodal cars, so I will buy them as well if any are ever produced...
especially Gunderson Twin Stack cars! YEAH BUDDY! Some SD-7s, SD-9s, SD-35s
(and SDP-35 variant) and SD-40s would be great, too! And some GE C-trucked
diesels and some U-36-Cs and some C-30-7s and... and... and... ... ...
2. I LOVE building kits. But I have to admit that it is getting much harder
for me to do so as my eyesight is fast deteriorating.
3. Do I, of all people, really need to answer #3? LOL!
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Tom Hawley
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 05:27 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Scale wheels on SMMW kits
- Original Message -
From: John Degnan
. . . . . . . Alan Lambert needs to realize that you (and us scale
modelers) don't care about HiRail . . . . . . . .
Another question has been bugging me, maybe others -- How many S gaugers
are there who are -
1. Modern modellers
2. Inclined to build kits
3. Still using over-size flanges maybe over-sze couplers too.
Re: {S-Scale List} Des Plaines Hobbies SD-45
Disappointing, but not deadly since I don't really model the era it fits into.
Oh well...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2012 10:46 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Des Plaines Hobbies SD-45
I will be buying some SD-45 when SSA releases them.
John Degnan
John Old Buddy..
I hate to bring this to your attention, but at the O SCALE WEST convention in
January 2011, DPH told us the SD-45 was essentially finished except for a
handful of small detail parts for which the tooling was being worked on by PBL.
The impression was that things would be culiminating in a very short time.
Now, over 20 months later, I have seen no evidence of any progress on those
parts and Ron is no longer active on this Yahoo Group.
I would hate to start any false rumors, but does anyone know the status of
the last few detail parts and/or the loco as a whole? I fear for the worst,
but would like to learn some facts if possible. Things like when will it be
release? RTR or kit? Paint schemes? Etc.
Fingers are crossedEd L.
Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Lionel S scale wheels [1 Attachment]
Does ANYONE actually pay attention to what is printed in these online catalogs? (See attachment) With OBVIOUS things like this little plug about scale wheels in the Lionel catalog, I find myself wondering why the availability of scale wheels from Lionel is even being discussed... John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Confused, really really confused...
I only heard this through the grapevine, so I can't say for sure... maybe Don
can expound on it... but I heard that the shells of the SHS rebuilt box cars
are too narrow. By how much I don't know...
SIGH In a perfect world...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: rhettgraves
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:13 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Confused, really really confused...
I don't mean to pick on AM with this list...I just don't know where the
problems are with SHS's stuff.
Rhett Graves
Re: {S-Scale List} Discussing NWSL P-64 wheel sets
Bill,
Trains were admittedly short, but the wheels on my models are P:64 wheels...
and they had no trouble going or coming on the NASG switching layout. Code 88
wheels qualify as FINE-scale whereas P:64 are PROTO-scale.
There was a problem... but it turned out to be with the point rail of a
turnout, not the wheels.
Longer trains WILL be tested ASAP.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: scale S only
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:51 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Discussing NWSL P-64 wheel sets
Did you push it around the layout backwards in the middle of a train?
Were these wheelsets truly P64 (FINEscale) or the old P64 designated
wheelsets which are a version of the standard wheelsets, or even code 88?
Bill Winans
Re: {S-Scale List} Prototype Version of a Clearance Gage [3 Attachments]
You talking about one of these? (See attachment)
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Pete
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 12:34 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Prototype Version of a Clearance Gage
The attach picture to this topic is a clearance measuring car for acurately
measuring fixed objects along the track,ie tunnels, through bridges narrow rock
cuts. It has arms that are attached to a fixed frame mounted on the centerline
of the car, they are extended out to the standard width of that particluar
section or route of the RR. Then as the train moves along slowly and the arms
strike a fixed object they would fold back till they cleared the obstruction.
At the end of each object,ie tunnel or bridge each arm that has moved is
measured and recorded, then in the office a diagram could be made showing the
cross section clearances for the route. Today we use a laser mounted on the
geometry car that measures clearances, track centers and track conditions.
Pete Silcox, retired civil engineer from CSX Engineering Dept.
Re: {S-Scale List} Quality Choices.....
What... not American made?
But seriously, I completely understand this concept. Getting my wife on board
this train of thought is a whole 'nother story.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 02:06 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Quality Choices.
John...The solution is to buy things made in Germany, Switzerland, Austria
and a few other places. Pay the price and get quality that lasts for 20 years.
Cheaper in the long run. Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} Small Places!
This same thing is going on at this time down here in Georgia... check out the
following link :
http://vanishingsouthgeorgia.com
Some AWESOME structure photos on this site! Great modeling fodder.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bob Werre
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com ; Bob Barnett at Work ; Daryl Rebrovich ; DAVID
CURREY ; Don Bozman ; Fred Paulus ; Jim Lemmond ; Joe Sindelar ; Joe Dale
Morris ; Steve Sandifer
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2012 01:36 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Small Places!
Friends,
My better half came across a project that a photographer has started.
He made it a mission to photograph every little town, former town and
larger town in the state of North Dakota. Look through the site for
ideas for scenery, small buildings, or maybe just to see some
interesting places you'll likely never visit. I don't know this
photographer but I do admire his courage in trying to pull off the
project--he is accepting donations to help pay for his expenses with the
idea of a published book.
http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2012/10/all-the-small-places-in-north-dakota/100390/
Bob Werre
PhotoTraxx
Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: {S-Scale List} Confused, really really confused...
The models from neither of these companies are perfect representations of their
supposed prototypes. They are, however, as is the case with with most
mass-produced models from most mass-production manufacturers in most scales,
as close as you're gonna get to fidelity in S scale. If you want near
perfection, you have to look to the small-time, short-run manufacturers such as
Smoky Mountain Model Works (for plastic/urethane/similar) models or the brass
manufacturers who focus on specific prototypes for specific roads with a
little-to-no-compromise approach to accuracy.
This is NOT to say that SHS and AM do not offer some very nice models. But
unless you're a freelance or 'generic' modeler who does not model a sprcific
prototype, be prepared to do some upgrading and modification to just about
anything you buy... in ANY scale. I have even had to modify some HO scale
models from Proto 2000 in the past (the SD-45 loco to be specific) to get them
to correctly represent the prototype, so having to do so with anything
available in S should be no surprise.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
www.trainweb.org/seaboard/s-scale.htm
- Original Message -
From: Scott
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2012 01:42 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Confused, really really confused...
Rather than hijack someones thread I am starting a new one concerning AM and
SHS models that people are always modifying. I was under the impression that
these two companies produced accurate scale models. However all I see are
postings modifying, changing and or bashing the offering from these two
companies that seem to be the current backbone of S scale. What is going on? I
am new to the scale and it just keeps getting more and more confusing. Are
their offerings scale and just missing a great deal of detail? Are they
inaccurate and have to be changed? Are they just semi-representational and have
to be reworked to provide an accurate model? Can someone please offer some
illumination to this this endless confusion and frustration???
Scott Huston Las Vegas Nevada
Re: {S-Scale List} Confused, really really confused...
O-hi-o. Konichi-wa. Kon-ban-wa.
And Sayonara.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Don Thompson
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2012 05:51 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Confused, really really confused...
Don who is now in Japan
Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
I had my SHS SW-1 and two SHS Rebuilt Box Cars at the Chattanooga convention...
all of which were fitted with P:64 wheels... and they operated near flawlessly
on the NASG switching layout, and even better on the other small layout right
behond the NASG layout (I forget the name of the group that had that other
layout). The ONLY noticable difference in operation between the two layouts
was when the wheels passed over the frogs on the NASG layout - the wheels would
drop into the frog then back up. There was no drop on the other layout which
had turnouts built with Fast Tracks jigs.
So it can be done... and apparently much easier than some would like to believe.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2012 01:42 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
Code 88 wheels would work as fine in S scale as they do in HO scale and
P64 wheels would work as fine in S scale as P87 and P48 wheels do in HO and O
scales. It's not a matter of physics it's a matter of availability and pricing.
If P64 trucks were as easy to get and cost the same as SHS trucks I'd have
standardized on them long ago.
N scalers have proved that small flanges are just as reliable as big flanges
so use the wheels that appeal to you and don't worry about the physics as they
work.DaveBranum
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: NMRA Standards...
The real bottom line here is that standardization is THE WAY to go... even if only to make the hobby that much easier to enjoy (by making swap outs a snap). John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: NMRA Standards and axle length (and the Truck Tuner)
Well... almost. I have found that the couplers (Kadee and Sergent both) on my
SHS SW-1 are a tad bit high when installed directly (without a spacer) to the
model in a Kadee gear box. And I also remember that one of the intermodal cars
(was it the AM spine cars? Or the SSA well car?) was too high as well and
required a good bit of work to correct.
So, almost... but not quite.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: tpm1ca
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2012 03:21 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: NMRA Standards and axle length (and the Truck
Tuner)
As someone who is relatively new to S but who has worked extensively in HO,
I'm actually pretty impressed by how consistent S scale equipment is, in terms
of axle length, coupler height, etc. I found HO products to be all over the map
in this regard. Perhaps it's because there are fewer manufacturers in S, but
everything - even brass - seems to have the correct coupler height...
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Standaridzation....
Darn shame, too... especially when you consider that it probably would not have
cost them a dime to go with the flow. But considering the PATHETIC quality of
things coming from China (in other markets) now-a-days, I can't say this
surprises me. My first VCR (a RCA model) laster nearly 17 years. The last one
I bought (an Samsung model) lasted about 3 years. Then there was my 4 year old
dishwasher... and my... well, you get the picture.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Don Thompson
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2012 06:46 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Standaridzation
Dear John,
No arguments here. I tried in vain to lobby Sanda Kan's V.P. of
electronics to make all model mfgs. follow the NMRA DCC color code for wiring.
But, to no avail. I am not sure if anyone else follows this simple code other
than DCC chip mfgsand us...
Don
On Oct 24, 2012, at 6:38 PM, John Degnan wrote:
The real bottom line here is that standardization is THE WAY to go... even
if only to make the hobby that much easier to enjoy (by making swap outs a
snap).
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: NMRA Standards and axle length (and the Truck Tuner)
Thanks, Don. I'll be using the Kadee 802 gear boxes until my new line of draft
gear boxes comes out (starting next year). With this slight height issue with
the SW-1 in mind, I'll have to figure in offering a small shim or alternate,
thicker lid for some of my braft gear boxes to correct the height where
necessary. What (if any) other SHS models require a shim of some
kind/thickness?
Good to know the trick with the AF box... hadn't thought of that... but not
sure I still have the AF boxes since I either toss out or sell the AF stuff.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Don Thompson
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2012 06:51 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: NMRA Standards and axle length (and the Truck
Tuner)
Dear John,
Our 01295 coupler works just fine in the switcher, if you want to use the
KD802, take the AF coupler box lid, remove the front flange and use as a spacer
for a perfect height...
Don
On Oct 24, 2012, at 6:43 PM, John Degnan wrote:
Well... almost. I have found that the couplers (Kadee and Sergent both) on
my SHS SW-1 are a tad bit high when installed directly (without a spacer) to
the model in a Kadee gear box. And I also remember that one of the intermodal
cars (was it the AM spine cars? Or the SSA well car?) was too high as well and
required a good bit of work to correct.
So, almost... but not quite.
Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
As I stated in the past, I've been working on (and with) Dave Rygmyr at NWSL
for about a year now to get them to re-start production of the code 88 S scale
wheels. Have even sent him some samples of the original code 88 wheels to
measure. I am not sure if the original wheels qualify as NMRA RP-25 wheels in
code 88 since I, like Fred, still posess amateur-level understandings of the
physics of these standards, but I believe they do. Maybe someone else can
expound on this more?
Regardless... once NWSL solves their SUPPLY issue (if they haven't yet done
so), all it will take to get these wheels back on the market is for us to show
a demand for them. NWSL already has my first order for 30 freight car sets AND
one geared set for the SHS SW-1 on the books...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: gftolhu...@aol.com
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2012 09:12 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
I strongly agree with John D. NMRA RP-25 wheels in code 88 have been shown to
work well in HO. Based on my amateur-level understanding of physics, the same
tread profile should work even better in S, due to greater weight of the
equipment. To the naked eye, code 88 would be indistinguishable from true scale
wheels on a layout. That's the holy grail of model railroad wheels in my
opinion!
Fred T in Tennessee
-Original Message-
From: John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net
To: S-Scale S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, Oct 23, 2012 5:20 pm
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
The size of the FLANGE is not as big of an issue for me as is the width of
the TREAD (or tire) of the wheel. A wheel with a slightly, but noticeably
smaller flange (larger than the flange on a P:64 wheel but smaller than a code
110 flange) and a narrower tread (wider than the tread on a P:64 wheel and
narrower than a code 110 tread) would suit me just fine. If that scales out to
be what most of us refer to as code 88, then I'm good with that.
And may the above go to show that I am NOT the perfectionist that so many
think me to be.
John Degnan
Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
Really? The last I heard from Dave Rygmyr at NWSL was that they were not
producing code 88 wheels... only code 110 and code 87 (Proto64). NWSL used to
produce code 88 many years ago, but they stopped producing them long before the
new owners took over. I have been working with them (and on them) to restart
production of the code 88 wheels, but it was my understanding that they were
not doing so yet.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: David Engle
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2012 09:10 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
NWSL is carrying code 88 wheels; who else in HO, well, that is them, we is
us. DJE
Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
HEAR HEAR!!!
Finally, Ed... something you and I agree on! Imagine that.
G
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2012 01:47 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
Why oh why could not the small community of S scale guys work out a standard
size/shape to make things easier for everyone? Maybe use the NMRA specs as a
starting point.??
Now we will probably have to deal with the Lionel wheelsets and MTH wheelsets
in the near future. Nothing like a bit more variety.
Praying for standardization(but not holding my breath)Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
The size of the FLANGE is not as big of an issue for me as is the width of the
TREAD (or tire) of the wheel. A wheel with a slightly, but noticeably smaller
flange (larger than the flange on a P:64 wheel but smaller than a code 110
flange) and a narrower tread (wider than the tread on a P:64 wheel and narrower
than a code 110 tread) would suit me just fine. If that scales out to be what
most of us refer to as code 88, then I'm good with that.
And may the above go to show that I am NOT the perfectionist that so many think
me to be.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: LBR Photo Cards, Dave
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2012 05:07 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
All,
If you will give us the specs our machine shop will probably be
interested in making wheels.
Please contact us off list.
LBR
--- On Tue, 10/23/12, John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net wrote:
From: John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel
wheels
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tuesday, October 23, 2012, 4:39 PM
HEAR HEAR!!!
Finally, Ed... something you and I agree on! Imagine that.
G
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2012 01:47 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless
steel wheels
Why oh why could not the small community of S scale guys work out a
standard size/shape to make things easier for everyone? Maybe use the NMRA
specs as a starting point.??
Now we will probably have to deal with the Lionel wheelsets and MTH
wheelsets in the near future. Nothing like a bit more variety.
Praying for standardization(but not holding my breath)Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
Code 110 or code 88 tread? Can't tell for sure from the photos... looks like
110 to me.
Would be REALLY nice if they were code 88 with the profiled back. One of the
HO companies is now making such wheels... can't remember who right now...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 22, 2012 07:10 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} S Scale Loco Supply new stainless steel wheels
All,
I have just revised the website http://www.sscaleloco.com to include a new
page devoted to the new SSLS all stainless steel non-magnetic wheels. These
will be available shortly, but give it a look now to see how nice they are.
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: AM Baldwin S12 - Trucks by ???
Well that's good news since I need at least TWO Baldwin RS-12s. But I'm not
holding my breath until those come along in S scale.
Or... were you referring to the ALCo RS-12 instead of the Baldwin RS-12?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Talmadge C 'TC' Carr
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2012 06:17 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: AM Baldwin S12 - Trucks by ???
:))
But they are correct for an RS12 just need more hood
Re: {S-Scale List} ratings are overrated
Tsk, tsk... come now, Bill... audio editing is not a single bit harder than
video editing... which we all know you do quite often (referencing all your
YouTube videos). So why the reservations?
I do audio editing in my sleep... make my own cell phone ring tones/sounds, mix
my own CD compilations of LIVE concert recordings to have only the songs I want
on the CD... you name it. Simple stuff. And all I use is a simple little
piece of software called Creative Wave Studio (v.5.00.11), which came FREE with
one of the sound cards I bought years ago.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S Scale List
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 05:11 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} ratings are overrated
The minute decoders are sold as blank only is the day I buy my last sound
unit. NOT interested in becoming a sound engineer too..
Bill Lane
Re: {S-Scale List} sound upload - not for me
WHOA, NELLIE... let's clear up the first part of this obvious
misunderstanding...
... this man NEVER said Kadee couplers are not reliable... let's get that
cleared up once and for all. What I DID say was that they are not AS
RELIABLE as some would make them out to be... but that is a far cry from
completele unreliability. My ONLY contention is with those who would dare to
say Kadee couplers are so much more reliable than a coupler... AN Y coupler...
with which they have NEVER compared them to FIRST HAND.
As for LokSound... I have no knowledge of or experience with it at all in ANY
scale. And I have no desire to know or experience it because I'm satisfied
with SoundTraxx... be that lazy, or not.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 04:23 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} sound upload - not for me
John All,
We all have our quirks of what we do well and like to do. I just don't have
any interest to add a sound engineer hat to my stack of hats already
balancing on my balding bucket head.
With tongue firmly planted in cheek, since you have called out a
one-upmanship I challenge you back. Take your LokSound decoder and make these
customized uploads and then send the decoder to me. I will put it in the SAL
boxcar whenever it arrives as a monument to John's complete tenacity. Whenever
I hit horn I want to hear in YOUR voice Sergent couplers are the best. When I
hit bell I will hear Kadee couplers are not reliable. THEN you will have
outdone me by far!
That sir will be a dish well served!
Bill Lane
Re: {S-Scale List} RED GREEN and F unit steps
Rusty (and all),
High tech? You want high tech? Try this GUARANTEED method of getting the
holes drilled with the right spacing - use a drafting screw-type DIVIDER such
as http://www.draftingsteals.com/20007.html. Align the divider's points with
the pins on the model part and then place the tips of the divider on the model
and gently press until the tips make enough of an impression on the model to
serve as a drill guide.
One question about these parts, though... concerning the mounting pins that go
into the holes you drill on the model... I noted in some of the photos that
these pins are bent. Understanding a little about the soft nature of brass,
I'm wondering if this is this going to be a problem? When I go to straighten
these pins to install them, are the pins going to break off? And are they
going to be strong / durable enough to hold the steps on the model once
installed? I don't see this being the case considering the small size of the
pins, and I'm afraid I'm gonna end up having to replace them as well, although
for a different reason than from the factory steps...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: rusty rustermier
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 02:02 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} RED GREEN and F unit steps [3 Attachments]
The second photo is of my high tech method of hole location, push and twist.
Re: {S-Scale List} Rusty's Magical Replacement F Unit Steps
But you're still left with brass glued to plastic. The steps, themselves, as
an individual entity, might be less fragile than the stock plastic steps, but
you're still left with a weak connection between the brass steps and the
plastic shell (nevermind the fact that brass can also be bent and broken under
the SAME abnormal handling methods as plastic can) (brass is NOT bulletproof
(or clumsy proof or stupid proof)). So what do you do to ensure the brass
doesn't separate from the shell? Is there some special glue that does this
trick well?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2012 01:13 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Rusty's Magical Replacement F Unit Steps
One way to make sure they all match perfectly is to cut off all of the
plastic steps and replace them all with Rusty's brass steps. Call it
preventative maintenance since the plastic steps are pretty fragile anyway.
Bill Lane
Re: {S-Scale List} finding shorts - demolition style
I love my PLASTIC (non-shorting) models...
:)
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com ; brasscollect...@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2012 10:15 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} finding shorts - demolition style
I started to have sporadic shorts in my M1 which otherwise runs very well.
Sometimes you can get lucky as it will throw a spark at the offending area. Of
course I was not that lucky. After a few different 10 minute spurts of trying
to find the short I got frustrated and ripped off the tender brake shoes SURE
that was it. HAH! Nope not it. A piece of heat shrink tubing on the drawbar
moved allowing it to intermittently short at the rear of the loco. UGH!
Patience is what is needed!
Thank You,
Bill Lane
Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
Fair enough.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 01:53 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
I have my doubts that the 802 and 808 would even exist it it weren't for
the O narrow gauge market
John Degnan
That would be consistent with my understanding from some of the On3 guys in
this area. The On3 fellas told Kadee to make something for them or else they
would make something for themselves. Kadee made it for the On3 guys and also
put the S trip pin on the same molded parts. But even if that is true, it
appears to me that Kadee has enabled the S guys to have quite an assortment of
workable couplers regardless if the package says HO, S or On3. Who cares what
the label on the box states?
Not sure if I'd call Kadee cold toward S. Barely-better-than-neutral
would be my choice of words. Each to his own..
Cheers...Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
For the record... I have already offered to help Frank fund this project... as
had yet another modeler who is no longer in S scale at this point. But as I
keep trying to tell everyone, it is not about money... and I'm so tired of
saying this that I refuse to repeat it again as it has become a waste of time
for me.
You're welcome.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: rhettgraves
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 11:18 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, John Degnan Scaler164@... wrote:
Oh I feel quite sure that Kadee did not have S in mind at all when they
designed any their HO line of couplers...
And it was not even intended just for the S market in the first place... it
was intended for S AND the O narrow gauge market. And I have my doubts that
the 802 and 808 would even exist it it weren't for the O narrow gauge market,
as O feel sure that they just saw an opportunity to kill two birds with one
stone.
John,
I think you already understand this, so I'm not trying to tell you anything
new. I'm just trying to clarify the discussion because it seems like we go
around and around about once a year on this subject and everyone seems to have
forgotten the fundamental idea that underlies the discussion: market share.
You say that the #802 wouldn't exist without the O narrow gauge market.
Would the #802 exist without the S scale market? Maybe the negative feelings
are just a matter of perspective?
I'm pretty sure Kadee doesn't have Z, N, HO, S, O or G scale in mind when
they make any of their products. What they have in mind is profit. If making
something a certain size will yield that profit, then they make it that size.
If one of those scale markets is big enough to support a profitable product
made to scale size, then they go for it. If they can make a product to a
certain size that will appeal to a majority of modelers in multiple scales
(e.g. the 802), then they go for that. They have to make things they can sell
at a profit to stay in business.
If I'm disappointed with what Kadee or any other company makes, then I need
to endeavor to be a big enough part of the market to dictate what they make.
As Dad used to say, Money talks and BS walks. If I showed up at Kadee's
doorstep with $500K in cash, they'd likely consider tooling up to do a 100K
piece run of an S scale version of the #58. The reason I say a #58 is that
they already have most of the design done, they can probably re-use parts
(springs, draft gear boxes, etc.), and it'd work with the #802s that their
existing customers already use (all part of the sales pitch). If I show up
with enough money to cover their risk and a good marketing plan, they'll likely
do what I want and make more as the market supports it.
Now I know the #58 doesn't meet all of your criteria for the perfect coupler,
but that's really a different discussion. If you showed up at Frank Sergent's
place with $500K in cash, I'm sure the S scale version of his coupler would
show up in short order. Shucks, at that price, you might get some of the other
S scale manufacturers interested enough to go into the coupler business! The
point is that you (and as many committed friends as you can muster) have to be
a big enough part of the coupler market to dictate what you want.
Now folks say I don't have $500K to do this! There's a few options:
1. Get pre-orders (with payment) for 100K couplers at $5 each.
2. Figure out how you're going to market and sell the couplers for $12 a
pair and get a loan from the bank. This will probably involve your house,
too...
3. Take your hobby money and buy Lotto tickets!
I'd go for option 1 myself...
Best Regards,
Rhett Graves
Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
Cushion draft gear boxes do not require extended couplers... just movable draft
gear parts. And a cushion draft gear is third in line on my list of draft gear
boxes to be produced. An animated drawing of this is already on my web site.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
www.trainweb.org/seaboard/s-scale.htm
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 01:01 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
... the only coupler I miss is an extended draft gear for cushion cars like
Weaver makes for their O scale PFE reefers because the mounting surface on
802's is a bit short to extend them sufficiently.DaveBranum
{S-Scale List} Re: Protocraft working coupler in O TRANSPLANT
Let's move this conversation over to my S-Scale-Progressive group where the
members understand that they do not have to read and/or respond to posts that
deal with topics and issues that don't interest them...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Michael Eldridge
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 01:29 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Protocraft working coupler in O
The fact that Protocraft has a working coupler in O scale:
http://www.protocraft.com/category.cfm?ItemID=146Categoryid=15
makes me wonder why this is so impossible in S Scale.
You can get it with a draft box, with magnetic operation, price is not bad.
Is it that hard to get a 3/4 size cast in brass?
-Michael Eldridge
Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
That actually depends on how much travel your cushion gear needs. A cushion
gear for the SHS cabooses needs only 10.5 scale inches of travel.
A longer box is no design challenge... just lengthen the front of the gear box
and add a second 'post' for the coupler's shank inside the gear box ahead of
the normal post. Simple.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 01:17 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, John Degnan Scaler164@... wrote:
Cushion draft gear boxes do not require extended couplers... just movable
draft gear parts.
They might not need extended draft gear but lots of cushion cars use draft
gear that extends beyond the length of a KD 802 box so it requires added work
to mount them. Weaver makes an O draft gear part that would be perfect for
modern S stuff if it was re-sized and re-cored for the 802 couplers. A small
part like this would be a great entry point for a new part time
manufacturerDaveBranum
Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...?? [1 Attachment]
See attachment for some HO scale samples of cushion draft gear from Details
West. Would something like these be of interest to any S scalers?
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 15, 2012 06:21 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, John Degnan Scaler164@... wrote:
A longer box is no design challenge... just lengthen the front of the gear
box and add a second 'post' for the coupler's shank inside the gear box ahead
of the normal post. Simple.
Actually it's even simpler than that. Des Planes provides extended draft
gear with their Evans boxcars and they just lengthen the coupler body on the
rear to get the extension. I don't think they offer them as a separate coupler
product though? If Kadee came up with a similar box made of metal and stocked
it as an 802 extended version it would be handy.DaveBranum
Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
Yup, thar be... and for the sake of time and apparent fatigue (because I just
woke up at 3:20pm from a 'face-plant' in front of my PC)... I'll just give you
just one of the reasons I say so...
... and this should be obvious to everyone who has ever used a Kadee coupler in
ANY scale...
... how many times have we all had to replace a nuckle spring on one that had
suddenly lost it's spring for no apparent reason?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 01:59 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
the Kadee coupler is NOT as reliable as it is made out to be...
John Degnan
Are there some facts to support this contention? Just asking. Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
Thanks God for DESK, or I would have been on the floor.
Couch not necessary as I'm on good standings with wife... ... for the time
being...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Talmadge C 'TC' Carr
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 03:38 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
Go To Bed, or couch, or floor, ...
On Sep 14, 2012, at 2:31 AM, John Degnan wrote:
(because I just woke up at 3:20pm from a 'face-plant' in front of my PC)
Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
Congrats on your good luck with Kadee couplers, Ed.
But now that I'm awake and can think a bit more, other reasons I personally
know of that drops the reliability rating of Kadee couplers for me is that,
like any coupler, (1) they do not always couple on the first try when coupling
on curves or too close to turnouts or changes in radius, and (2) the
often-discussed issue with their magnematic operation where they often fail to
DISconnect as they should over magnets... just to name two other
off-the-top-of-my-head issues. I have also heard of Kadee couplers in HO and S
occasionally and unwantedly UNcoupling at random over fixed magnets when the
trains pass over them (due to the excessive play in the nuckles on the HO side
and the excessive play in the nuckle AND the shank spring on the S side).
Then there is the obvious problem where they fail to look and operate like a
real 1:1 coupler... which I also consider to be a failure. G
But of course, these are only MY experiences and persepctives, and may not be
that of others...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 11:33 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
... how many times have we all had to replace a nuckle spring on one that
had suddenly lost it's spring for no apparent reason?
John Degnan
Three times in 28 years. That is far too many times for Kadee to be
considered reliable. Yep! You bet. How many times does the prototype bust a
knuckle? Just wondering. Smiles...Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.....
I agree that this is getting to be a bit monotonous... but what really gets old
for me is having to tell the same people the same things over and over and they
still don't get it or remember it. So with that in mind, I don't really mind
rehashing it a bit more from time to time... especially when you believe and
put a lot of stock into the two following quotes :
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it. - George
Santayana
Those that fail to learn from history, are doomed to repeat it - Winston
Churchill
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Brian Jackson
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 12:18 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.
I submit that we make this a sticky post (as many blogs do), so that we
avoid redundant discussions on perennial topics such as this in the future.
That way, those new to S Scale could read them, and we can go on to more
promising topics that haven't been discussed before.
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, Ed Loizeaux@... wrote:
GentlemenHere is a message from way back in December 2011. Ed L.
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, Edward Loizeaux Loizeaux@ wrote:
As I see it...
1. KD#802 has a wider gathering range, fits most recent brass imports,
costs what it costs, has too much sprung slack action for some, and is a
tad
oversized for S. Many folks dislike the herky-jerky motion that is common
with these couplers. One fellow solved that
problem by inserting a small cylindrical object into the middle of the
centering spring which greatly restricts the slack action he found
objectionable. The small cylindrical object is from a Kadee coupler set
(#4?) and is available as a separate piece (I think). Another solution
popularized by Dick Karnes is to use a knuckle spring as a replacement for the
centering spring. The weaker knuckle spring becomes fully compressed under load
and the slack action disappears. The KD#802 is too
large to fit the popular ACE adaptors which were created long before the
#802 coupler was born. This is probably the most commonly used coupler
in S
scale today.
2. KD#5 (and #3, the RTR version) is the HO standard and works very well
if
you install them correctly and take care to eliminate the side slop
between
axles and sideframes. Many S models have excessive side slop which
enables
the couplers to be off center way too much for reliable coupling. Side
slop can be eliminated
with small washers on the axle ends. These couplers fit the ACE AF
adaptors, older wooden kits, and nearly all narrow gauge models. The
all-metal KD#5
easily permits exact 36 spacing between cars and comes with all sorts of
variations such as long shank, short shank, upper mount knuckles, lower
mounted knuckles, different size/shaped draft gear boxes, etc. One of the
many variations can be made to work with darn near any S model ever made.
I
have some in the front pilots of brass steam engines. These couplers are
less expensive than the Kadee S couplers and mate with them well. This
used to be the most commonly used coupler in S scale in yesteryear and is
still liked and used by many.
3. Modified KD#5 (longer glad hand) couplers have a problem with the glad
hand working loose from the knuckle casting itself. It swivels when it
shouldn't and then the magnetic uncoupling system does not work well since
the glad hand swings outward, but the knuckle does not. UNmodified
Kadee's
do not have this problem. Modified KD#5 couplers are no longer made
commercially.
4. Walther's new plastic HO couplers are a tad larger than KD#5 and work
well when new. One
noticeable difference, however, is that the Walther's coupler has more
slack
action between closed/coupled knuckles than does the Kadee product. While
the Walter's couplers are not springy like the KD#802s, the large slack
action between closed knuckles creates a similar effect. One fellow
claims the trip pin tends to work loose from the plastic knuckle casting after
a while.
5. American Models makes a reasonable appearing dummy plastic coupler
that is good
for unit trains and the like. I use them between A and B diesel units for
positive coupling unaffected by magnets and the like.
6. SHS makes a Kadee-compatible coupler that is about the same size as
the
KD#802. It was created to enable close coupling between diesel units, but
can be used on freight and passenger cars. Works well as far as I know.
Hope all this helps.
Cheers..Ed L.
Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 01:10 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
(1) they do not always couple on the first try when coupling on curves or
too close to turnouts or changes in radius,
With the broad curves on my layout, coupling on curves is not an issue.
Unfortunately not everyone has the luxury of having enough room to
incorporate broad curves into their layouts.
Normally I do not couple or uncouple over turnouts, so that is not an issue
either
Same here... but there are situations where it be necessary.
(2) the often-discussed issue with their magnematic operation where they
often fail to DISconnect as they should over magnets.
This has never been a problem for me. Although, to be honest, I use
stronger-than-normal magnets. Simply not a problem. Without proper
lubrication and with a weak magnet, wimpy disconnecting could be an issue. But
it can be solved.
Not a common thing with me either... but still a trait of the coupler.
I have also heard of Kadee couplers in HO and S occasionally and unwantedly
UNcoupling at random over fixed magnets when the trains pass over them
If your locos tend to herky-jerk (aka hiccup) at slow speeds, it is possible
to create slack between couplers and if they happen to be over a magnet then
uncoupling will happen. With good smooth-running locos and clean track, this
is not a problem. Even if it does happen, simply backing up and recoupling is
possible and nothing serious has happened anyway.
I have found that it can also happen in the areas of slightly changing grades
or when merely slowing a train down.
Then there is the obvious problem where they fail to look and operate like
a real 1:1 coupler...
Actually, they operate better than the real 1:1 coupler. No need to
manually inspect/position the couplers before coupling. Automatic centering is
a good feature and it would be most annoying to live without it in the model
railroad realm.
I wholehearterly agree... and this is the reason I developed the centering
method for use (in my draft gear boxes) with Sergent couplers. This may cause
cardiac arrest amongst those who think I strive for complete, prototypical
perfection, but I do believe that there are SOME areas where protptypical
perfection is not a good thing... and this is one of them - I would MUCH rather
have a coupler that centers itself than one that acts like prototypes.
Another way of looking at this is there is nothing any better currently
commercially available.
No... not YET. :)
Perhaps Kadees are not quite perfect at all times, but being darn good with
nothing better available makes for a good reason to use them.
And that was all I was saying from the start. So I believe we actually agree.
How many of us have OPERATING couplers that are not Kadee?
I have three... not counting the few OLD Sergent couplers I still have lying
around.
Cheers...Ed L.
A toast to common ground.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability [7 Attachments]
Pretty much all of the HO couplers are undersized for S scale unless you happen
to model a prototype that used what is referred to as a 3/4 scale coupler...
which is what the Walthers ProtoMax coupler SEEMS to be about right for (based
only on photos I have seen of the ProtoMax). Central of Georgia early
passenger car #2 (presently preserved at the CofG Roundhouse Complex in
Savannah, GA) has a 1:1 example of one of these couplers. (See photo
attachments)
Strangely, the ProtoMax seems to resemble this smaller coupler in some ways...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Daniel McConnachie
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 06:29 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Kadee reliability
Ay thoughts on the other HO couplers out there and there adaptability to S. I
seem to remember some discussion about a Walters coupler. I've also seen some
people use the #5 instead of the S Scale one. Any particular reason for this
beyond availability?
Accurail make two sizes of HO couplers, has anyone tried to use the larger
one in S? I've seen them used in On3 and they looked great, plus there is no
spring.
Any thoughts on this, John?
Cheers.
Daniel McConnachie
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.....
You know... with this in mind, then IDEALLY speaking, using HO scale draft gear
boxes for S scale equipment would be THE way to go. But that means the SHANKS
of all future S couplers would have to be made to match the shape and size of
Kadee's couplers (whisker design or pre-whisker type). The reason this would
be ideal is because of how narrow Kadee HO boxes are; I typically use the #234
gear box with a whisker coupler now-a-days on my HO models, and the #234 box is
.306 wide, which is probably much closer to the scale width of the underframe
on most S cars than the width of a Kadee 808 gear box (which is .37 wide).
So... all I gotta do is convince Kadee and Sergent to produce all future S
couplers with a shank that matches the shape and size of Kadee's HO couplers,
and we're set. Unfortunately, Kadee is NOT gonna do that... but... Frank
Sergent has already told me that he is open to suggestions. Earl Tuson and I
talked about the width of gear boxes about a year or so back - how they should
be as narrow as possible to look as realistic as possible. This would make
that entirely possible...
... in a perfect world...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: David Heine
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 04:00 PM
Subject: RE: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.
Ed and others. Actually these days, most Sn3 rolling stock is set up for a
Kadee #26 rather than a #5. This coupler looks like a #5 but with a longer
shank. Most of the kits from PBL and others include the coupler box as part
of the under frame and are set up for the longer shank. The post is further
from the end sill.
Dave Heine
Re: {S-Scale List} Couplers Part II
Wrong, Ed... that is not what I said. What I said was, (and I quote) the
Kadee coupler is NOT as reliable as it is made out to be. So as you see, I
did not say they were unreliable... just that they were not as reliable as many
people falsely make them out to be... and I gave many reasons why.
And I am entitled to my opinion about how Kadee couplers look to me.
Lastly... I am not trying to convince anyone to get their wallets ready for
anything... all I am doing is catering to the numerous (more than you might
think) other modelers on this list whom I already know are interested in them.
But if you (and some others) are not interested, then why are you bothering to
debate with me at every turn? Just ignore and delete my posting about this
topic. Considering how Sergent produces his products to fill his orders, he is
not going to need much more than my orders, alone, to make this new S coupler
worth his time and effort, so trust me when I tell you that I feel the need to
pander to nobody. But I have been asked by numerous interested modelers on
this and a few other lists (one of them not even being an S scale list but an O
scale narrow gauge list) to keep them posted, so that is all I am doing... and
plan to continue to do... for them, and definitely not to rub your fur the
wrong way. So with your approval (or not), I will continue to spend my time
the way I choose to. After all... it is my time that I (in your eyes) am
wasting... is it not, Ed?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Edward Loizeaux
To: List, S scale
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 04:16 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Couplers Part II
Perhaps Kadee's are not quite perfect at all times, but being darn good
with nothing better available makes for a good reason to use them.
And that was all I was saying from the start. So I believe we actually agree.
Your comments, simply stated, are that Kadee couplers are unrealistic and
unreliable. It appears this is an attempt to make the Kadee brand look as poor
as humanly possible. That is quite something to say about the industry leader
and the most popular coupler for at least the last half century.
My thoughts, on the other hand, are that Kadee couplers are realistic enough
for the vast majority of users, are sufficiently reliable and simply work
better than anything else commercially available. As Bill Lane says about
Scalecoat paint: It simply works!
I am not so sure we really agree on much.
I believe too much time is being spent trying to convince potential buyers to
get their wallets ready for the great unveiling. Instead, I think it be more
productive to spend the same amount of time trying to fix the production
problems that are allegedly keeping the new coupler from reaching the end user.
Does he need money? Go raise some money. Does he need help in the shop? Go
spend Saturdays down there helping. Does he need a consultant to fix the
problem? Raise money to pay for a consultant. Helping fix the basic problem
is a much better use of time and energy than extolling the virtues of something
that nobody can obtain.
Just an opinion - controversial, perhaps - but would you want it any other
way?
Cheers..Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Couplers Part II
Send me your address... I'll send you a couple hundred of the things...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: richgajnak
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 05:27 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Couplers Part II
I think I'm goin' back to the X2f...
:-)
Rich G(ajnak)
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.....
Dave, that is true and I understand it... but my focus would be on those who
have layouts with wider radius curves... definitely not for the average market.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 05:46 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, John Degnan Scaler164@... wrote:
with this in mind, then IDEALLY speaking, using HO scale draft gear boxes
for S scale equipment would be THE way to go.
The reason this would be ideal is because of how narrow Kadee HO boxes
are;
The problem with that is most model railroads have curves much sharper than
prototype so they need a wider draft gear box for coupler side swing.Otherwise
the pivot pin has to be moved up too far to the front and backing up qualities
deteriorate.The reason Kadee's slide is to allow sharper curves and to maintain
the centered position when backing up. The design gives a variable pivot
effect, forward for sharp curves and back on the stop when pushing long cuts of
carsDaveBranum
Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: coupler swagger and sway
I honestly wonder how many S modelers actually DO need the wide boxes because
they actually DO have really, really, really tight curves? I'd wager to be
that MOST people in this debate (if not the majority of people on this group)
really would NOT need it and don't have such curves that require it.
This is not Tom York's S-Trains group, after all... although the dividing lines
do seem to be a bit blurry...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 06:31 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: coupler swagger and sway
I agree and don't need the wide boxes for my curves but these things are
designed for the worst case scenario like a 24 inch radius with reverse curve,
so they have a built in safety cushion. I tried some O KD's on Lionel track
once and they could work on 13.5 inch radius with no problems.Don't know what
the minimum operating radius is for the S scale KD's but about 17 inches would
be prototypical for the tightest normal tracks I recall seeingDaveBranum
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.....For the record.....
Exactly right, Bob... which is why I have never once tried to talk a single one
of you folks into converting to Sergent Couplers. This has NEVER been about
y'all and it never will be... it is about me and those who want the same thing
I do in this case. And that is the main reason I don't understand why you
folks who have no interest in the Sergent coupler feel so uncontrollably
compelled to get involved with posts about it... that just beats the ever
lovin' #$%* out of me...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: shabbona_rr
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 07:10 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: The Great Coupler Debate.For the record.
John:
Same here, we all spends our money as we see fit. If you're not careful, the
guy from your old wireless company will show up to talk to you ;)
boB Nicholson
Re: {S-Scale List} Uncontrollably Compelled...??
I can respect that, Ed. But please note that the only time I have anything to
say about the Kadee coupler is when I'm making a comparison about them to some
other coupler. I don't mean my comments to be critical, just comparative (to
other couplers) and analytical (of their features and/or operation). However,
I do still have personal feelings about them... that they are just plum
butt-ugly... but even that is a comparative comment because I am just stating
how I feel about their appearance AS COMPARED TO the look of either real, 1:1
scale couplers or some other model coupler. If anyone is getting the
impression that I despise Kadee, then you are getting the wrong impression... I
merely like Sergent couplers better than I like Kadee couplers, and for all the
reasons taht I have to so frequently rehash, which (again) is also just
comparative to the thoughts and feelings of those of you who stand so
unmovingly on the Kadee side of the fence.
My only real criticism goes out to all the anti-Sergent modelers who are so
convinced that Kadee couplers are so superior to everything else that moves
HAVING NEVER EVEN SEEN AND/OR USED a Sergent coupler (old or new).
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Edward Loizeaux
To: List, S scale
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 08:37 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Uncontrollably Compelled...??
I don't understand why you folks who have no interest in the Sergent
coupler feel so uncontrollably compelled to get involved with posts about it...
John Degnan
Hi John..
I cannot speak for others, but I strongly object to the near-constant bashing
of Kadee products. So I'd like to point out their good reliable operation and
acceptable (though not outstanding) appearance for the benefit of others who
might not have tried them. Simply trying to frame Kadee in the positive light
which it deserves.
Talking about a potential upcoming new product does not bother me in the
least. Bashing a fine existing product is annoying to put it mildly.
CheersEd L.
Re: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
Oh I feel quite sure that Kadee did not have S in mind at all when they
designed any their HO line of couplers... if that is what you're trying to say.
And as for their two different S couplers... not so... 'cause it is the same
one made from the same molds just in different colors... and a different color
does not a dofferent coupler make. And it was not even intended just for the S
market in the first place... it was intended for S AND the O narrow gauge
market. And I have my doubts that the 802 and 808 would even exist it it
weren't for the O narrow gauge market, as O feel sure that they just saw an
opportunity to kill two birds with one stone.
Maybe I'm wrong... but it is what I suspect.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 08:51 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Cold or Understandable...??
I am not convinced this is a fair characterization of Kadee. After all Kadee
has many different HO couplers that work fine in S and S-narrow. They also
have two different S couplers (brown and black) that seem to be quite popular.
And they also have some On3 couplers that are very adaptable to S in seconds
(bend the trip pin).
Re: {S-Scale List} Uncontrollably Compelled...??
Working to get something done instead of simply sit[ting] in front of a
keyboard, with no life to speak of is EXACTLY what I am doing with my efforts
to get the Sergent coupler brought into reality. If you folks had even half a
clue how many man hours I have put into this it would shock you. And for what?
To benefit myself? Well, yes, to benefit myself, but not JUST myself...
rather, the scale as a whole. So at least I am not just sitting behind my
keyboard (like the vast majority of my critics)... I am getting something
done... sooner or later... one way or another.
What claim to fame have my critics aside from the two cents worth of criticism
they voiced about what I'm working on simply because it is something they have
no interest in? But that's ok... I'm gonna keep on going. Maybe the next
project I get involved in will interest them, and they can get behind me...
instead of standing in front of me.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: clipper...@att.net
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 08:57 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Uncontrollably Compelled...??
what has alluded this conversation so far, is that except for a fof's, no one
remembers what it was like before kd came along, there was constant on bended
knees with out strecthed arms,
unfortunately, since we ARE the minorities of minorities,we are simply an
after thought for
most manufacturers, including our gauge/scale, we simply are paying the price
for being
a minority, unfortunately this bares thruth, even with kd, we aren't even a
blip on their radar,
so rather than continuing pissing and moaning, form a committee, and draw a
plan that
encompasses the best of all the couplers, i.e. kd, proto max, accumate, shs,
etc, and come
up with a game plan, we then can approach a manufacturer with the
information, so we can
have one standard coupler, but to simply sit in front of a keyboard, with no
life to speak of is ridiculous, if you want debate, go start one with your
wife, and see what she tells you to do!
mel perry
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
Dick,
I think Jim was referring to the EXCESSIVE amount of slack action that the
Kadee couplers definitely have. There is a LOT of play in both the nuckle area
AND the forward motion of the shank/spring design adds even more.
In reality, to be realistic, the amount of slack in the nuckle area alone is
more then enough to be realistic. Even the Cushion Couplers that came on some
International cabooses only had 10.5 of travel, so couplers with no cushion
draft gear had even less - about the same as the play in the Kadee coupler's
nuckle.
But I agree with you that I also like at least a little slack action no matter
where it comes from.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Richard Karnes
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 12:58 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
Jim King wrote:
His design permits Kadee centering without the annoying slack action.
Annoying?? One of my favorite memories is seeing NYC Mohawks (Mountains for
you non-NYC fans) starting a 100-car train. The loco would back up about a car
length, bunching up slack. Then it would pull forward, ever so slowly, taking
out the slack car by car. You could hear the clunk! clunk! clunk! as each
coupler became fully extended and each car leapt into slow motion. The
Mohawks' replacements, Alco FA/FB lash-ups, did the same thing. Thankfully,
this is one of the aspects of running trains on my layout that I really enjoy
-- starting a freight train and listening to the slack take-up as the
locomotive gradually moved forward.
Lest you rebut by observing that the Kadee 802/808 centering springs cause
the caboose to constantly bob longitudinally, I refer you back to my
oft-repeated (in print as well as via electrons) but little-heeded
recommendation (supported by Kadee themselves!) to substitute a knuckle spring
for the too-stiff centering spring.
Dick Karnes
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
Bob,
Have you ever actually seen the drawings I have done showing my design? One
quick look should tell you all you need to know about how my design promises to
be a VAST improvement over the Kadee design for centering.
Go to http://www.trainweb.org/seaboard/SScaleGearBox.htm and look at the images
under the PROTOTYPE PHOTOS AND VIDEO boxes and the FINALIZED DESIGN
boxes.
When Kadee couplers swing to either side, they also slide forward in the gear
box. Also, when you're pulling a train, the coupler pulls out of the gear box
and the spring in the shank tries to pull it back in causing the cars in the
train to go react like a slinky (looking like the train is held together by a
rubber band). My design COMPLETELY eliminates the shank spring and it's slinky
effect.
An added bonus of my design is that you don't have to deal with installing the
shank spring... all you have to do is drop in a small, plastic block into the
shank. The flat spring that replaces the coiled shank spring just drops in
place and is sandwiched between the rear of the coupler and the gearbox's inner
feature, making it MUCH easier to assemble.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Bob Werre
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 05:58 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
If John's centering is dependent on a bronze leaf spring, is it that much
different than the #5?
Bob Werre
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
My design does not incorporate a coiled spring, is uses a flat, rectangular
shaped piece of .006 thick phosphor-bronze strip. A small, solid block
replaces Kadee's coiled shank spring and my flat springs inserts into the box
BEHIND the shank.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: clipper...@att.net
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 06:45 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
perhaps, since john has designed this products, he can give us the dims and
thickness
of his spring, so we experiment with fitting it into the 802 box?
thanks
mel perry
Re: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
I don't doubt that Kadee knows what real couplers look (and operate) like.
But, for the record, I was not being critical (even though I do think their
design is terrible due to it's inherent issues). But the Kadee coupler is NOT
as reliable as it is made out to be... and I am sure that we are about to
find out (as the HO guys already have) that the Kadee product is not the only
one that can attain the level of reliability that it has.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: ctxmf74
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2012 12:04 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Re: Annoying slack action
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, John Degnan Scaler164@... wrote:
When Kadee couplers swing to either side, they also slide forward in the
gear box.
They designed them this way so they can handle sharper curves than they
could with a fixed pivot point. If they didn't slide forward the draft gear box
would have to be wider to handle sharp model train radius curves. They know
what prototype couplers and draft gear look like but they are trying to build a
reliable model train couplers so they make design changesDaveBranum
Re: {S-Scale List} Funky Trackwork
David,
You a Buckner and Garcia fan? Or just arcade coin-op fan?
I have the CD and LP version of that record (Pac-Man Fever) LOL!!!
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: David Engle
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 10:00 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Funky Trackwork
Well, Plunk Your Magic Twanger, Froggy!!
DJE
Re: {S-Scale List} Funky Trackwork
... And let us not forget the nickname, Charlie, in reference to the
Vietnamese...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2012 10:03 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Funky Trackwork
Every nation had a nickname: Yanks (USA), Brits (England), Nips (Japan),
Crouts (Germany), Frogs (French) and so forth.
Re: {S-Scale List} Funky Trackwork
OUTSTANDING! This trackwork easily rates up there among some of the best I've ever seen! I would love to see some videos of models running through these turnouts. John Degnan scaler...@comcast.net scaler...@comcast.net http://www.clag.org.uk/green14.html Dave Heine
Re: {S-Scale List} Cryer Gray Gondola
Amen to that, Jim... expecialy when a heavy hitter is so prone to stating his
(or her) opinion as if it were a fact or as if it should be the final word. I
can appreciate the perspective of others, but I won't bow down to it OR close
other doors because of it.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: raisinone
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, September 10, 2012 07:41 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Cryer Gray Gondola
I am not sure I understand Bill's issue but hope it wouldn't stop anyone from
getting one if it fits their modeling. One concern I have is when one of this
lists heavy hitters bashes a business or a model or a technique (or a
minister!). I hope the rest of us have the sense to take it as one person's
opinion and not Gospel truth...
Jim Kindraka
Re: {S-Scale List} Good day - got stuff done
Well heck... all I did today was play with my kids and their Thomas the Train
toys (and other toys as well)... but nonetheless I had a GREAT day!
Stoking the fires of the next generation of model railroaders...
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
Modeling the Progressive Railroad of the South - The Seaboard Air Line
www.trainweb.org/seaboard
Visit my S Scale Web Pages :
www.trainweb.org/seaboard/s-scale.htm
Member : Southeast Georgia Free-Mo
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Southeast_GA_Free-Mo
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2012 07:18 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Good day - got stuff done
It was a good day. The weather finally cleared up from the hurricane remnants
to be mid 70s. Saw a great Mustang and Shelby show this morning at Holman Ford.
Donna and the doggies came with me. Charlie Leonard met us there and came back
here to start the layout work season back up again. We got through most of the
code 100 turnouts hopefully taking out some of the clunks and bangs for better
operation from when I first put them in. I have 1 more turnout in progress but
ran out of day. Tomorrow morning I should finish it and see how well we did
Thank You,
Bill Lane
Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Steel Horse... Iron Horse... Iron Rail... can you say noicufnoc?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Gale Hall
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 02:03 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Sorry that was supposed to be Iron Rails
gale
- Original Message -
From: Bob McCarthy
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 12:25 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
According to Jeff at HOQUAT he is selling the remaining IRON HORSE
inventory.
Bob McCarthy
From: Gale Hall frisc...@swbell.net
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 7, 2012 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Well, let's see the website doesn't work well and they wouldn't return an
email wanting to know about ordering oneI don't think a buzz will help.
gale hall
- Original Message -
From: Pieter
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2012 11:37 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Hi All;
The latest 1/64 Modeling Guide showed a new S product - Steel Horse
Models 60 ft Gunderson plug door boxcar. No buzz here or on the modern list. I
would think this would be kinda a big deal... I took notice, and I don't even
model the era appropriate for the car!
Pieter Roos
Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Wait, make that noisufnoc... which proves my point.
G
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
I hate it when jokes backfire...
- Original Message -
From: John Degnan
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 02:40 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Steel Horse... Iron Horse... Iron Rail... can you say noicufnoc?
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Gale Hall
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 02:03 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Sorry that was supposed to be Iron Rails
gale
- Original Message -
From: Bob McCarthy
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 12:25 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
According to Jeff at HOQUAT he is selling the remaining IRON HORSE
inventory.
Bob McCarthy
--
From: Gale Hall frisc...@swbell.net
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 7, 2012 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Well, let's see the website doesn't work well and they wouldn't return an
email wanting to know about ordering oneI don't think a buzz will help.
gale hall
- Original Message -
From: Pieter
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2012 11:37 AM
Subject: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Hi All;
The latest 1/64 Modeling Guide showed a new S product - Steel Horse
Models 60 ft Gunderson plug door boxcar. No buzz here or on the modern list. I
would think this would be kinda a big deal... I took notice, and I don't even
model the era appropriate for the car!
Pieter Roos
Re: {S-Scale List} Dock details
Maybe... but I don't think so. I think the HO conversion is still too short in
the door areas.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: trainsjeep88
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 10:11 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} Dock details
Maybe the angle of the photo? Have seen more than one overhead door hit
from lift operator having mast raised too high. Stan
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, John Degnan Scaler164@... wrote:
Looks like that poor guy and his forklift are permanently stuck on that
dock... because based on the photo, the lift is too tall to get inside!
John Degnan
- Original Message -
From: Bill Lane
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2012 07:52 PM
Subject: {S-Scale List} Dock details [1 Attachment]
Here is some of my new details on my REA building dock. Just a few $$$
worth of detail really livened it up a bit.
Thank You,
Bill Lane
Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Apparently so : http://www.pbase.com/dw_thomas/image/52050529
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: Ed
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} New stuff
Steel Horse... Iron Horse... Iron Rail...
John Degnan
Ferrous Equine, perhaps? Ed L.
Re: {S-Scale List} You don't have any of these! NW G3! like this??????
Is that the CG model or the other?
I could actually use a variant of the 65' 6 Mill Gon... to represent a SAL
6500 series prototype. I think I may pick that as one of my next cars to
promote.
Reference : http://www.athearn.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=ATH76509
(model has wrong ends)
I'd probably get about three of these if they were done... in eurethane. :)
Maybe one if they were done in brass.
John Degnan
scaler...@comcast.net
scaler...@comcast.net
- Original Message -
From: John E. Henning
To: S-Scale@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2012 01:56 PM
Subject: Re: {S-Scale List} You don't have any of these! NW G3! like
this??
like this?
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/S-Scale/photos/album/2070313695/pic/list?order=ordinal
John Henning
--- In S-Scale@yahoogroups.com, David Engle rirocket@ wrote:
What is the difference between these and the ones that Mr. Botten put
out, in brass. DJE
The biggest difference is the length, Bill's car is a 65' gon whereas
the Cryer Grey gon is 52' 6.
Bud Rindfleisch
