Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
On 2012-03-30 3:18 AM, steve st...@steve-ss.com wrote: El 29/03/12 22:36, Miguel Medalha escribió: Charles wrote: The stuff in t he roaming profiles (very little) is copied back/forth at login/out, the stuff in t he redirected folders is *synchronized* at all times using the Offline Files technology that has long existed in Microsofts products. I create a file and store it on my desktop. roaming profile It is stored locally until I log off whereupon it is synced to the server. Correct... desktop folder redirected The file is only ever stored at the destination. Incorrect (again, unless you have changed the default, and again, I am not even sure this is possible, and definitely it is most likely not recommended). Edits are instantaneously synced, not only when I log off. Correct... they are *synced*... which means they exist in *both* locations, *not* '*only* on the destination/redirected folder'... -- Best regards, Charles -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
On 2012-03-30 12:35 PM, Charles Marcus cmar...@media-brokers.com wrote: I was simply pointing out that the *default* behavior was to always cache all data in redirected folders on the local client using the tried and true 'offline files' technology, but in a different way with respect to Redirected Folders (with Windows 7, which, in case you hadn't noticed, is the subject being discussed) - it synchronizes *as changes are made*, *in the background*, not at logon/logoff. And of course, all of my replies also 'assume' that Samba behaves the same way as Windows Server with Win 7 Clients - meaning, the default behavior is to *always* *cache* (and sync in the background) all redirected folder data on the local client. Can anyone with *definitive* knowledge please comment on whether or not this is true (it will affect my decision on replacing our Windows Servers with Samba sometime in the next year or so)? Also, I am curious if it is even possible to disable the local caching on the client (although as I have said, I personally cannot think of *any* reason/scenario where that would be a good idea - if you truly never want *any* data residing on the local client, use THIN clients, that is what they are for). -- Best regards, Charles -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
El 29/03/12 22:36, Miguel Medalha escribió: The stuff in t he roaming profiles (very little) is copied back/forth at login/out, the stuff in t he redirected folders is *synchronized* at all times using the Offline Files technology that has long existed in Microsofts products. Hi I'm coming to back to Windows after a 12 year absence so please forgive my questions. Just coming back to my original post for a moment, e.g. I create a file and store it on my desktop. roaming profile It is stored locally until I log off whereupon it is synced to the server. desktop folder redirected The file is only ever stored at the destination. Edits are instantaneously synced, not only when I log off. Is this correct? What is the equivalent of folder redirection in Linux? Thanks, Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 2:18 AM, steve st...@steve-ss.com wrote: What is the equivalent of folder redirection in Linux? I would say the closest analogy would be a symlink to an NFS mount that's outside of /home, but not exactly. it's not really as simple as just a symlink. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
Hi I'm coming to back to Windows after a 12 year absence so please forgive my questions. Just coming back to my original post for a moment, e.g. I create a file and store it on my desktop. roaming profile It is stored locally until I log off whereupon it is synced to the server. desktop folder redirected The file is only ever stored at the destination. Edits are instantaneously synced, not only when I log off. Is this correct? Yes. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
Miguel - please stop sending to me directly, I am on the list. On 2012-03-29 4:36 PM, Miguel Medalha miguelmeda...@sapo.pt wrote: NO, IT DOESN'T! Microsoft disagrees - see below. You are introducing a new theme altogether: Offline Files. No, I am not. Redirected Folders *uses* the Offline Files technology (by default at least), so it is 100% on point for discussing Redirected Folders. I was simply pointing out that the *default* behavior was to always cache all data in redirected folders on the local client using the tried and true 'offline files' technology, but in a different way with respect to Redirected Folders (with Windows 7, which, in case you hadn't noticed, is the subject being discussed) - it synchronizes *as changes are made*, *in the background*, not at logon/logoff. All comments below will assume a Windows 7 client, and Redirected Folders configured per the defaults. On a local and *reliable* network, you can use folder redirection *without* Offline Files. I did it and it works. No network is 100% reliable. Things break. This is I imagine why the default behavior is to cache Redirected Folders on the local clients. I prefer less headaches if/when they do, so this default makes sense to me. What you describe is the behavior of normal *roaming profiles*. No... you can use a combination of roaming profiles and redirected folders for the best result, which is what I do. That's precisely what I was advocating. Please read my posts. Oh, I did, but you were claiming that Redirected Folders were not stored locally, which is plain *wrong* unless you have intentionally *changed* the *default* behavior of Redirected Folders, which is to cache everything on the local client and keep things synchronized in the background. The stuff in the roaming profiles (very little) is copied back/forth at login/out, the stuff in t he redirected folders is *synchronized* at all times using the Offline Files technology that has long existed in Microsofts products. Maybe you were not very clear in your first post. You said the following: Folder Redirection will always (...) store local cached copy of those folders on the local computer... what it accomplishes is it saves all of the copying back and forth when logging in/out. which is not true. Even with Offline Files, only the files you are working with will be synchronized back and forth. The redirected folders themselves and the files previously stored therein will not be transferred to the client machine. Wrong, again. The *first* time a user logs in to a different computer, the contents will be copied down to the local computers cache - *in the background* (so it doesn't slow down the logon like it does with XP). Apparently you didn't bother to read the rest of that article at the link I referenced, so here is all of the pertinent info - you'll see that Redirected Folders indeed *does* store *everything* in a local cache, only copies everything down at logon the *first* time the user logs in on a particular computer (but does so in the background), and that it synchronizes changes as they are made *in the background*, not at logoff: Folder Redirection improvements in Windows 7 The Folder Redirection feature in the Windows operating system allows administrators to redirect user folders such as Documents, Pictures, or Music to shared folders that are hosted on servers. Folder Redirection is used in conjunction with the Offline Files technology to ensure that the user’s data is available when the network connection to the server that is hosting a redirected folder becomes latent or unavailable. When the network connection is slow or unavailable, Offline Files routes requests for the user folders that are stored on the server to the local computer cache. Users read and write from their local cache. Offline Files synchronizes new and changed files and folders from the local computer cache to the server when the network becomes available or in the background when the connection is slow. The first time a user logs on, Offline Files moves all files and folders from their current location to the local cache. Then, Offline Files synchronizes the data from the local cache with the redirected user folder on the server. The user is blocked from logging on to the computer during this task. In earlier versions of the Windows operating system, redirected user folders that contained large amounts of data or a large number of files and folders could cause delays with the user logon process, increasing the time before the user could reach the desktop. This delay could become significant when the network connection between the user’s computer and the server was slow, because the Windows operating system did not present the user’s desktop until the file synchronization between the client and server completed. Windows 7 optimizes the first-time logon process with Folder Redirection. Windows 7
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
On 2012-03-29 2:00 PM, steve st...@steve-ss.com wrote: El 27/03/12 17:32, Miguel Medalha escribió: If you want the files only on the server, you should look into Folder redirection. The Samba docs contain good info on that. You can use roaming profiles only, folder redirection only, or a combination of both, which I usually consider the more appropriate option. Samba-3 by Example -- Configuration of Default Profile with Folder Redirection http://www.samba.org/samba/docs/man/Samba-Guide/happy.html#redirfold My main concern was the filling up of the local disk with user profiles. A user may for example only log onto one particular box once and then never again. Of the three you mention above, which one corresponds to 'always read the profle from the server and store nothing on the local disk'? None... Folder Redirection will always (I think - or maybe Samba has a way to disable this, but I don't think it would be a good idea at all) store local cached copy of those folders on the local computer... what it accomplishes is it saves all of the copying back and forth when logging in/out. If you want to use thin clients, use thin clients, don't cripple Redirected Folders. -- Best regards, Charles -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
Of the three you mention above, which one corresponds to 'always read the profle from the server and store nothing on the local disk'? None... Isn't there a way with group policies to have the client delete the roaming profile after the user logs out. I think that would solve the OP''s problem. John -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
Folder Redirection will always (I think - or maybe Samba has a way to disable this, but I don't think it would be a good idea at all) store local cached copy of those folders on the local computer... what it accomplishes is it saves all of the copying back and forth when logging in/out. NO, IT DOESN'T! What you describe is the behavior of normal *roaming profiles*. Folder redirection *does not* move files back and forth. The files in redirected folders will always reside on the server. I know this not only from theory but *from experience*. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
Isn't there a way with group policies to have the client delete the roaming profile after the user logs out. I think that would solve the OP''s problem. Yes, there's a way to do that. But it doesn't solve the problem of having to transfer maybe hundreds of megabytes or even worse each time you log in to the domain. Back when the idea of roaming profiles was first put to practice (Windows 2000), user profiles were MUCH smaller than they are today. So, the use of roaming profiles with folder redirection seems to me the most appropriate way to deal with this. Please note that the Local Settings component of the profile should not be redirected. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
On 2012-03-29 3:36 PM, Miguel Medalha miguelmeda...@sapo.pt wrote: Folder Redirection will always (I think - or maybe Samba has a way to disable this, but I don't think it would be a good idea at all) store local cached copy of those folders on the local computer... what it accomplishes is it saves all of the copying back and forth when logging in/out. NO, IT DOESN'T! Microsoft disagrees - see below. What you describe is the behavior of normal *roaming profiles*. No... you can use a combination of roaming profiles and redirected folders for the best result, which is what I do. The stuff in t he roaming profiles (very little) is copied back/forth at login/out, the stuff in t he redirected folders is *synchronized* at all times using the Offline Files technology that has long existed in Microsofts products. Folder redirection *does not* move files back and forth. Yes, it does, but it does so on an ongoing basis (except for the first logon). When the user creates a new file in a redirectd folder, it is saved *simultaneously* to both the local cache and the server side folder. The files in redirected folders will always reside on the server. I know this not only from theory but *from experience*. Yes, but they will *also* reside on the *local computer*. From the below link: Folder Redirection improvements in Windows 7 The Folder Redirection feature in the Windows operating system allows administrators to redirect user folders such as Documents, Pictures, or Music to shared folders that are hosted on servers. Folder Redirection is used in conjunction with the Offline Files technology to ensure that the user’s data is available when the network connection to the server that is hosting a redirected folder becomes latent or unavailable. http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ff458273%28v=ws.10%29.aspx -- Best regards, Charles -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
NO, IT DOESN'T! Microsoft disagrees - see below. You are introducing a new theme altogether: Offline Files. On a local and *reliable* network, you can use folder redirection *without* Offline Files. I did it and it works. What you describe is the behavior of normal *roaming profiles*. No... you can use a combination of roaming profiles and redirected folders for the best result, which is what I do. That's precisely what I was advocating. Please read my posts. The stuff in t he roaming profiles (very little) is copied back/forth at login/out, the stuff in t he redirected folders is *synchronized* at all times using the Offline Files technology that has long existed in Microsofts products. Maybe you were not very clear in your first post. You said the following: Folder Redirection will always (...) store local cached copy of those folders on the local computer... what it accomplishes is it saves all of the copying back and forth when logging in/out. which is not true. Even with Offline Files, only the files you are working with will be synchronized back and forth. The redirected folders themselves and the files previously stored therein will not be transferred to the client machine. This makes a big difference because we may be talking about Gigabytes of data. A roaming profile without folder redirection does transfer the whole profile, which might have been a good idea a decade ago but is not feasible with the amounts of data we work with today. Yes, but they will *also* reside on the *local computer*. As I said before, only the files you are modifying will have a local instance, which will be synchronized to the server at logout. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
This is also worth reading: http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ff183315%28WS.10%29.aspx This is important: « Exclusion List The Exclusion List feature reduces synchronization overhead and disk space usage on the server, and speeds up backup and restore operations, by excluding files of certain types from replication across all Folder Redirection clients. Prior to Windows 7, all files in an Offline Files folder were replicated to the server. This often meant that a users’ personal files or large files not relevant to the enterprise were replicated to one or more servers, thereby consuming disk space and slowing backup and restore times. On Windows 7, administrators can use the Offline Files Exclusion List feature to prevent files of certain types (for example, MP3 files) from being synchronized. The list of file types is configured by the IT administrator by using Group Policy. » -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
El 27/03/12 17:32, Miguel Medalha escribió: 2. Is it correct that the profile files are not synced until the user logs off? That is the correct working of roaming profiles. If you want the files only on the server, you should look into Folder redirection. The Samba docs contain good info on that. You can use roaming profiles only, folder redirection only, or a combination of both, which I usually consider the more appropriate option. Samba-3 by Example -- Configuration of Default Profile with Folder Redirection http://www.samba.org/samba/docs/man/Samba-Guide/happy.html#redirfold Hi My main concern was the filling up of the local disk with user profiles. A user may for example only log onto one particular box once and then never again. Of the three you mention above, which one corresponds to 'always read the profle from the server and store nothing on the local disk'? Thanks, Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
El 28/03/12 22:56, steve escribió: El 27/03/12 17:32, Miguel Medalha escribió: Of the three you mention above, which one corresponds to 'always read the profle from the server and store nothing on the local disk'? Sorry. Cancel that. I missed the folder redirection and btw tks 4 t Real men don't click. I didn't realise it was so complex. . . Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
[Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
Hi Samba4 DC and win 7 clients. The user profiles are stored in a profiles share: [profiles] path = /home/CACTUS/profiles read only = No This works OK and the user can logon to different boxes with the same profile. The profile folders such as Desktop, Downloads etc. however, also appear stored on the local disk under c:\users\username. Any file saved e.g. on the Desktop, is not saved to the roaming profile until the user logs off. It seems pointless to have a roaming _and_ a local profile. A few qns: 1. What am I doing wrong? 2. Is it correct that the profile files are not synced until the user logs off? 3. Unless /the profiles folder is world read/write, the user gets logged on with a temporary profile. Correct? Thanks, Steve -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
On 3/27/2012 5:55 AM, steve wrote: Hi Samba4 DC and win 7 clients. The user profiles are stored in a profiles share: [profiles] path = /home/CACTUS/profiles read only = No This works OK and the user can logon to different boxes with the same profile. The profile folders such as Desktop, Downloads etc. however, also appear stored on the local disk under c:\users\username. Any file saved e.g. on the Desktop, is not saved to the roaming profile until the user logs off. It seems pointless to have a roaming _and_ a local profile. A few qns: 1. What am I doing wrong? 2. Is it correct that the profile files are not synced until the user logs off? 3. Unless /the profiles folder is world read/write, the user gets logged on with a temporary profile. Correct? Thanks, Steve 1. looks like your doing nothing wrong. 2. correct. 3. there maybe a few tricks to deal with this but at the moment I do not know what they are. what you might be looking for is to remap user folders, this would be in the group policies. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
On Tue, Mar 27, 2012 at 7:55 AM, steve st...@steve-ss.com wrote: This works OK and the user can logon to different boxes with the same profile. The profile folders such as Desktop, Downloads etc. however, also appear stored on the local disk under c:\users\username. Any file saved e.g. on the Desktop, is not saved to the roaming profile until the user logs off. this is exactly how roaming profiles work. it syncs at logon and logoff. What you are looking for is called folder redirection, most of the user folders can be redirected, but certain things can't mostly because MS doesn't want to trust a network drive for something like a registry hive. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
Re: [Samba] windows 7 roaming profiles
2. Is it correct that the profile files are not synced until the user logs off? That is the correct working of roaming profiles. If you want the files only on the server, you should look into Folder redirection. The Samba docs contain good info on that. You can use roaming profiles only, folder redirection only, or a combination of both, which I usually consider the more appropriate option. Samba-3 by Example -- Configuration of Default Profile with Folder Redirection http://www.samba.org/samba/docs/man/Samba-Guide/happy.html#redirfold There's another good web page about this issue (Windows System Management: Real Men Don't Click) but it seems unavailable now. I have it in my archives and I will send it to your email address as a .mht file. -- To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the instructions: https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
