Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

2013-04-02 Thread Wikus Snijman
I agree with Kirk. Please remove me as well, please

 Kirk McLoren kirkmclo...@yahoo.com 31/03/2013 01:28 
read the archives
its all there extensive and detailed








From: Stephen Rhodes captb...@gmail.com
To: Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org 
Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 12:51 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

When I signed up for this, I mistakenly thought there would be some info on 
sustainable bio-diesel info.  This is just a blog for people who want to be 
heard.  
Please remove my name from a this mailing lost.
Ty
SR
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Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

2013-04-02 Thread José María Montenegro
Me too. Nothing (or almost nothing) related with biofuels at this time
here... If somebody knows an automatic way to do, please reply.


2013/4/2 Wikus Snijman snijm...@arc.agric.za

 I agree with Kirk. Please remove me as well, please

  Kirk McLoren kirkmclo...@yahoo.com 31/03/2013 01:28 
 read the archives
 its all there extensive and detailed







 
 From: Stephen Rhodes captb...@gmail.com
 To: Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 12:51 PM
 Subject: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

 When I signed up for this, I mistakenly thought there would be some info
 on sustainable bio-diesel info.  This is just a blog for people who want to
 be heard.
 Please remove my name from a this mailing lost.
 Ty
 SR
 ___
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 Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel
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Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

2013-04-02 Thread detbellestarr
Please remove my name also. This is not the list I thought I was signing up 
for. Thank you.



 From: José María Montenegro tote...@gmail.com
To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org 
Sent: Monday, April 1, 2013 11:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please
 
Me too. Nothing (or almost nothing) related with biofuels at this time
here... If somebody knows an automatic way to do, please reply.


2013/4/2 Wikus Snijman snijm...@arc.agric.za

 I agree with Kirk. Please remove me as well, please

  Kirk McLoren kirkmclo...@yahoo.com 31/03/2013 01:28 
 read the archives
 its all there extensive and detailed







 
 From: Stephen Rhodes captb...@gmail.com
 To: Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 12:51 PM
 Subject: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

 When I signed up for this, I mistakenly thought there would be some info
 on sustainable bio-diesel info.  This is just a blog for people who want to
 be heard.
 Please remove my name from a this mailing lost.
 Ty
 SR
 ___
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 Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel
 ___
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 Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel

 This message is confidential and may be covered by legal professional
 privilege. It must not be read, copied, disclosed or used in any other
 manner by any person other than the addressee(s). Unauthorised use,
 disclosure or copying is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. The views
 expressed in this email are those of the sender, unless otherwise stated.
 If you have received this email in error, please contact ARC Service Desk
 immediately. (mailto:serviced...@arc.agric.za)

 To report incidents of fraud and / or corruption in the ARC use our Ethics
 Hotline by:

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Re: [Biofuel] Solar panels may cost all households

2013-04-02 Thread Doug
Yikes!

 There have also been rumours in Australia that households could be charged for 
´service availability´, where you would be charged even if you go off grid. 
Hopefully it will remain a rumour
 There is a Solar Company here in Lismore that is using LiPo cells to cut the 
draw at peak charge times too. Apparently it is very close to cost effective 
now (with power prices still rising in Australia)

regards Doug


On Tue, 02 Apr 2013 08:16:02 +0800
Tony cr...@vianet.net.au wrote:

 
 
 
 http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/newshome/16410796/solar-panels-may-cost-all-households/
 
 Solar panels may cost all households
 
 Daniel Mercer, The West Australian Updated March 21, 2013, 2:10 am
 
 http://l.yimg.com/ea/img/-/130321/a_230209habecoideas1_18kjmp7-18kjmpb.jpg
 Solar panels may cost all households
 
 
 Solar panels
 
 WA households could have to pay a higher fixed charge for their 
 electricity bills under a shake-up that would be aimed at recouping 
 the spiralling cost of solar panels to the network.
 
 Amid concern from Western Power that households with solar panels are 
 not paying their share of the grid's upkeep costs, it is understood 
 the State Government may look at reforming the structure of bills.
 
 One option likely to be considered is charging a higher service fee, 
 which currently amounts to 41.5 a day, or about $150 a year, for 
 household customers of Synergy and Horizon. To offset the increase, 
 the Government would lower variable charges, which according to last 
 year's State Budget account for $1443 of the typical household 
 electricity bill a year.
 
 However, though households which cut their electricity use would not 
 necessarily be worse off under such a change - and might be better 
 off - those unable to cut their use could be slugged even more.
 
 The possible reform is expected to be discussed as part of the energy 
 roundtable convened by former energy minister Peter Collier to 
 consider ways of reforming the State's electricity sector.
 
 Although the forum has met only once since it was established in 
 October, there were predictions it would be maintained under Mike 
 Nahan as Energy Minister.
 
 The boss of Western Power, Paul Italiano, warned in October that 
 households with solar panels were able to shirk paying their fair 
 share for the upkeep of WA's network of poles and wires.
 Mr Italiano said households with photovoltaic cells drew less energy 
 from the grid and so had lower electricity bills, despite needing the 
 same level of service as people without the systems.
 
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-- 
Doug lema...@internode.on.net
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Re: [Biofuel] Solar panels may cost all households

2013-04-02 Thread Tony


Hi Doug
Some 10 years ago here in the West  ( 100km N/E of Perth)
when the Shire was Putting in Deep sewage down my street
I said I didnt want it I would rather have a Clivus Multrim Composting Toilet
and Grey water system  the Response was it is GOING PAST YOUR PLACE
so you pay for it ! wether you hook into it or not

The same Feed back was for the Rubbish removal as 
well I would have rather paid a nominal fee

and take i to the Tip my self when needed

In our society you get fined if you DO OR DON'T look after the environment
either way they win !

Tony


At 10:16 PM 2/04/2013 +1100, you wrote:

Yikes!

 There have also been rumours in Australia that 
households could be charged for ´service 
availability´, where you would be charged even 
if you go off grid. Hopefully it will remain a rumour
 There is a Solar Company here in Lismore that 
is using LiPo cells to cut the draw at peak 
charge times too. Apparently it is very close 
to cost effective now (with power prices still rising in Australia)


regards Doug


On Tue, 02 Apr 2013 08:16:02 +0800
Tony cr...@vianet.net.au wrote:




 
http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/newshome/16410796/solar-panels-may-cost-all-households/


 Solar panels may cost all households



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Re: [Biofuel] Solar panels may cost all households

2013-04-02 Thread Zeke Yewdall
Lots of talk of the costs imposed on other people by people who install
solar panels, but no mention of the benefit that people who install solar
panels are giving to all of society by reducing pollution and greenhouse
gas emissions

On Mon, Apr 1, 2013 at 6:16 PM, Tony cr...@vianet.net.au wrote:




 http://au.news.yahoo.com/**thewest/a/-/newshome/16410796/**
 solar-panels-may-cost-all-**households/http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/newshome/16410796/solar-panels-may-cost-all-households/

 Solar panels may cost all households

 Daniel Mercer, The West Australian Updated March 21, 2013, 2:10 am

 http://l.yimg.com/ea/img/-/**130321/a_230209habecoideas1_**
 18kjmp7-18kjmpb.jpghttp://l.yimg.com/ea/img/-/130321/a_230209habecoideas1_18kjmp7-18kjmpb.jpg
 
 Solar panels may cost all households


 Solar panels

 WA households could have to pay a higher fixed charge for their
 electricity bills under a shake-up that would be aimed at recouping the
 spiralling cost of solar panels to the network.

 Amid concern from Western Power that households with solar panels are not
 paying their share of the grid's upkeep costs, it is understood the State
 Government may look at reforming the structure of bills.

 One option likely to be considered is charging a higher service fee, which
 currently amounts to 41.5 a day, or about $150 a year, for household
 customers of Synergy and Horizon. To offset the increase, the Government
 would lower variable charges, which according to last year's State Budget
 account for $1443 of the typical household electricity bill a year.

 However, though households which cut their electricity use would not
 necessarily be worse off under such a change - and might be better off -
 those unable to cut their use could be slugged even more.

 The possible reform is expected to be discussed as part of the energy
 roundtable convened by former energy minister Peter Collier to consider
 ways of reforming the State's electricity sector.

 Although the forum has met only once since it was established in October,
 there were predictions it would be maintained under Mike Nahan as Energy
 Minister.

 The boss of Western Power, Paul Italiano, warned in October that
 households with solar panels were able to shirk paying their fair share for
 the upkeep of WA's network of poles and wires.
 Mr Italiano said households with photovoltaic cells drew less energy from
 the grid and so had lower electricity bills, despite needing the same level
 of service as people without the systems.

 __**_
 Sustainablelorgbiofuel mailing list
 Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.**sustainablelists.orgSustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 http://lists.eruditium.org/**cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/**
 sustainablelorgbiofuelhttp://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel

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Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

2013-04-02 Thread Zeke Yewdall
Wow... did none of you read Darryl's email of March 30th which reiterated
how to unsubscribe?

On Tue, Apr 2, 2013 at 1:46 AM, detbellestarr detbellest...@yahoo.comwrote:

 Please remove my name also. This is not the list I thought I was signing
 up for. Thank you.


 
  From: José María Montenegro tote...@gmail.com
 To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Monday, April 1, 2013 11:35 PM
 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

 Me too. Nothing (or almost nothing) related with biofuels at this time
 here... If somebody knows an automatic way to do, please reply.


 2013/4/2 Wikus Snijman snijm...@arc.agric.za

  I agree with Kirk. Please remove me as well, please
 
   Kirk McLoren kirkmclo...@yahoo.com 31/03/2013 01:28 
  read the archives
  its all there extensive and detailed
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
  
  From: Stephen Rhodes captb...@gmail.com
  To: Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
  Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 12:51 PM
  Subject: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please
 
  When I signed up for this, I mistakenly thought there would be some info
  on sustainable bio-diesel info.  This is just a blog for people who want
 to
  be heard.
  Please remove my name from a this mailing lost.
  Ty
  SR
  ___
  Sustainablelorgbiofuel mailing list
  Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 
 http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel
  ___
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  Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 
 http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel
 
  This message is confidential and may be covered by legal professional
  privilege. It must not be read, copied, disclosed or used in any other
  manner by any person other than the addressee(s). Unauthorised use,
  disclosure or copying is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. The
 views
  expressed in this email are those of the sender, unless otherwise stated.
  If you have received this email in error, please contact ARC Service Desk
  immediately. (mailto:serviced...@arc.agric.za)
 
  To report incidents of fraud and / or corruption in the ARC use our
 Ethics
  Hotline by:
 
  Phone number  : 0800 000 604
  Fax number  : 0800 00 7788
  Email address   : a...@tip-offs.com
   Please Call me  : 32840
   Website: www.tip-offs.com
 
  For more information on the ARC Ethics Hotline, please visit our website
  at www.arc.agric.za.
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Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

2013-04-02 Thread Bruno M.
If you guys are not illiterate, and you did the SUBscribing yourself,  
why don't you do the UNsubscribe also yourself?
Follow the links that you'll find in every message from this listserv. 
... see Header  footers.


List-Unsubscribe: 
http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/sustainablelorgbiofuel,

mailto:sustainablelorgbiofuel-requ...@lists.sustainablelists.org?subject=unsubscribe

List-Help: 
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For the blind, click here : 
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Grts
Bruno M.

Op 2-4-2013 8:27, Wikus Snijman schreef:

I agree with Kirk. Please remove me as well, please


Kirk McLoren kirkmclo...@yahoo.com 31/03/2013 01:28 

read the archives
its all there extensive and detailed


From: Stephen Rhodes captb...@gmail.com
To: Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 12:51 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

When I signed up for this, I mistakenly thought there would be some info on 
sustainable bio-diesel info.  This is just a blog for people who want to be 
heard.
Please remove my name from a this mailing lost.
Ty
SR
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==


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Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

2013-04-02 Thread Jorge Montiel
Please remove my name too.
Dr. Jorge Montiel


From: detbellestarr detbellest...@yahoo.com
To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org 
sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org 
Sent: Tuesday, April 2, 2013 12:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

Please remove my name also. This is not the list I thought I was signing up 
for. Thank you.



From: José María Montenegro tote...@gmail.com
To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org 
Sent: Monday, April 1, 2013 11:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

Me too. Nothing (or almost nothing) related with biofuels at this time
here... If somebody knows an automatic way to do, please reply.


2013/4/2 Wikus Snijman snijm...@arc.agric.za

 I agree with Kirk. Please remove me as well, please

  Kirk McLoren kirkmclo...@yahoo.com 31/03/2013 01:28 
 read the archives
 its all there extensive and detailed







 
 From: Stephen Rhodes captb...@gmail.com
 To: Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 12:51 PM
 Subject: [Biofuel] remove from mailing list please

 When I signed up for this, I mistakenly thought there would be some info
 on sustainable bio-diesel info.  This is just a blog for people who want to
 be heard.
 Please remove my name from a this mailing lost.
 Ty
 SR
 ___
 Sustainablelorgbiofuel mailing list
 Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel
 ___
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 Sustainablelorgbiofuel@lists.sustainablelists.org
 http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel

 This message is confidential and may be covered by legal professional
 privilege. It must not be read, copied, disclosed or used in any other
 manner by any person other than the addressee(s). Unauthorised use,
 disclosure or copying is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. The views
 expressed in this email are those of the sender, unless otherwise stated.
 If you have received this email in error, please contact ARC Service Desk
 immediately. (mailto:serviced...@arc.agric.za)

 To report incidents of fraud and / or corruption in the ARC use our Ethics
 Hotline by:

 Phone number  : 0800 000 604
 Fax number      : 0800 00 7788
 Email address   : a...@tip-offs.com
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  Website: www.tip-offs.com

 For more information on the ARC Ethics Hotline, please visit our website
 at www.arc.agric.za.
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[Biofuel] Dividing Up The Pie, U.S., U.K. Chiefs To Hold Historic Strategy Meeting

2013-04-02 Thread robert and benita rabello

Dividing Up The Pie
U.S., U.K. Chiefs To Hold Historic Strategy Meeting

By VAGO MURADIAN and MARCUS WEISGERBER

March 31, 2013 Information Clearing House -Defense News - WASHINGTON 
--- In what is believed to be the first time since the 1940s, the entire 
British defense staff will be here March 25 to discuss long-range 
strategy and the impact of budget cuts with their U.S. counterparts, 
according to U.S. and British sources.


The meeting is reminiscent of the Combined Chiefs of Staff, when British 
and American military leaders joined forces during World War II. Both 
nations are undergoing significant budgetary reductions and will 
continue to rely on each other in future years for support. 
Understanding what capabilities will survive and won't is essential to 
long-term strategic planning.


The relationship military to military is very strong. We have common 
interest in how we meet the financial constraints placed on both 
nations, but also on issues like how we manage the drawdown in 
Afghanistan and also how we reconfigure post Afghanistan, said Sir 
Gerald Howarth, a member of parliament and the ex-defense minister 
responsible for international security affairs from 2010 to 2012.


We have a huge amount of strategic issues to discuss where we have a 
very large level of common interest, he said.


A Defence Ministry spokesman characterized the meeting as private and 
declined further comment.


In the U.S., spokesmen for the Office of the Secretary of Defense and 
the Joint Chiefs of Staff did not respond to questions.


U.S. and British military leaders regularly discuss ongoing issues. 
What's different about this series of meetings is they will focus not on 
immediate budget, program or operational issues, but the strategic 
future of the Anglo-American alliance, including deepening cooperation.


In addition to the U.S. Joint Chiefs, British attendees are expected to 
include Gen. Sir David Richards, chief of the Defence Staff; Gen. Sir 
Nicholas Houghton, vice chief of the Defence Staff, who will take over 
as chief when Richards retires later this year; Air Chief Marshal Sir 
Stephen Dalton, chief of the Air Staff; Adm. Sir George Zambellas, 
incoming Navy first sea lord; Gen. Sir Peter Wall, chief of the General 
Staff; and Air Chief Marshal Sir Stuart Peach, commander of Joint Forces 
Command, sources said.


The U.S. and U.K. regularly share the most sensitive military 
intelligence, technology and equipment, including submarine-launched 
nuclear ballistic missiles. Britain over the past decade in particular 
has shaped its capabilities to dovetail with U.S. forces.


The British are the leading developmental partner on the U.S.-led F-35 
fighter program with Lockheed Martin and have in their inventory Boeing 
C-17 transports, Chinook and Apache helicopters and Lockheed C-130 cargo 
aircraft. In addition, the Royal Air Force is buying highly sensitive 
RC-135 Rivet Joint intelligence planes produced by L-3 Communications in 
the U.S., making London the only international customer for that program.


The meeting comes as the Pentagon faces $500 billion in spending cuts 
over the coming decade, which will force senior leaders to make 
difficult choices. The British delegation arrives with particular 
experience in that area, having faced even deeper budget cuts --- in 
percentage terms --- over the past several years, forcing major reforms 
to force structure, organization and acquisition programs in that time.


Getting value for money and efficiency is something we have focused a 
considerable amount of attention on, and we can offer them advice in 
that area, Howarth said.


Still, the British budget is a fraction of that of the U.S. In fact, at 
$62.7 billion in 2011, the British budget is not much larger than the 
size of the annual cuts faced by the Americans. Under mandatory cuts for 
the remainder of 2013, the Pentagon is reducing its budget by $46 billion.


Yet the U.S. military could learn a thing or two from its British 
counterparts when it comes to consolidation, especially within the 
headquarters staff ranks, said Barry Pavel, the director of the Brent 
Scowcroft Center on International Security at the Atlantic Council here.


I think [the U.S.] can learn a lot, Pavel said. There's a lot of 
inefficiencies in our headquarters. They've taken jointness ... to new 
levels that we haven't yet done.


But the British, having cut so deeply, are also in need. They are going 
to have to leverage the U.S. to a greater degree, or try to, Pavel said.


To get leaner and reduce overhead in recent years, the British military 
consolidated its war colleges into a single school and created an 
operational command center outside of London to oversee operations, 
according to retired British Army Brig. Gen. Ben Barry, now with the 
International Institute for Strategic Studies think tank in London.


The U.S. Defense Department is already preparing for force structure 
reductions in 

[Biofuel] Regime Change Begins at Home

2013-04-02 Thread robert and benita rabello

 Regime Change Begins at Home



By Stephen Lendman



March 31, 2013 Information Clearing House - Charles Derber's book by 
that title says it's the only way to free America from corporate rule. 
It transformed America from we the people to what CEOs say goes.




It put monied interests in charge. Presidents, legislators, and high 
level bureaucrats serve them. Whatever they want they get. 
Institutionalized injustice follows. It's longstanding. Vital change 
more than ever is needed.




America had previous corporate regimes. None match today's extremism. 
Bold, creative strategies are needed to change things. Commitment 
creates possibilities. Nothing worth struggling for is easy. Failure to 
try assures disaster.




America's on a fast track to full-blown tyranny. It's a hair's breath 
away. Preventing it is top priority. It begins with knowledge. It 
involves knowing what's at stake.




Money power runs America. Fundamental freedoms are on the chopping block 
for elimination. Preventing it takes commitment.




Challenging authority is essential. Social movements are pivotal forces. 
They work. Abolitionists, labor movements, and civil rights activists 
proved it.




Collective activism has power. What better time to use it than now. 
America's waging political, social, financial, and hot wars. It's doing 
it globally. It's happening at home and abroad. Constitutional 
protections are disappearing. America's social contract is being destroyed.




Militarization, permanent wars, and unchallenged global dominance 
reflect policy. So does police state harshness. Dissent is endangered. 
Privilege is entrenched. Fundamental freedoms are eroding. Beneficial 
social change isn't tolerated.




Electoral politics doesn't work. Duopoly power runs America. Republicans 
and Democrats reflect two sides of the same coin. Not a dime's worth of 
difference separates them. Throwing out bums assures new ones. It 
happens every time.




Names and faces change. Policies remain unchanged. They're longstanding. 
They're cruel, malicious and unjust. Washington is too pernicious, 
corrupt and dysfunctional to fix.




Vital change is needed. Revolution is the only solution. Authority must 
be challenged disruptively. Doing so requires mobilizing it. Egalitarian 
reform is essential. Grass roots activism is key. Popular struggles 
depend on it.




Ordinary people have enormous power. Key is using it. It takes more than 
marches, rallies, slogans or violence. It takes sustained commitment, 
withdrawing cooperation, breaking entrenched rules, challenging 
reprisals, and staying the course.




Change occurs bottom up. It never comes top down. Dark forces relinquish 
nothing willingly. Concessions come when forced. Struggling for rights 
achieves them. There's no other way.




Powerful interests run today's America. They take full advantage. 
Absolute power corrupts them absolutely. They're free to steal, plunder, 
exploit, accumulate wealth, and dominate. They do it at our expense.




Inequality is unprecedented. America the beautiful never existed and 
doesn't now. Calling it a land of opportunity defies reality. Democratic 
freedoms are incompatible with predatory capitalism. Everyone's on their 
own sink or swim.




Privileged few alone benefit. Others are used and abused. Adam Smith 
said nominal democracy should be instituted for the defense of the rich 
against the poor. It's more than ever true today.




Corporatism is empowered. It rules the world. Military might supports 
it. Fundamental rights don't matter. The world's richest most developed 
country spurns them. It thumbs its nose at what matters most.




Growing poverty, unemployment, hunger, homelessness, and human misery 
follow. Plutocratic sharks don't care. Bottom line priorities alone 
matter. Money is used to make more of it. Enough is never enough.




Human needs and welfare are sacrificed. Exploitation is 
institutionalized. American style democracy assures it. Michael Parenti 
calls it democracy for the few. It's the best money can buy.




America's wealthy class dominates. Ordinary people have no say. What 
democratic mandate directed government to transfer wealth to the 
privileged few? Why are ordinary people left out?




Why do corporate giants get huge handouts? Why are they licensed to 
steal? Why are wars fought to enrich them? Why are democratic freedoms 
compromised to serve them?




Achieving equitable change isn't rocket science. Putting money power in 
public hands is a good way to start.




So is prioritizing justice, fairness, full employment, a minimum living 
wage, universal healthcare, free education to the highest levels, other 
vital social services, peace, and government by and for everyone equitably.




America's current system failed. When disrobed and exposed to the light 
of day, America's rulers have feet of clay. Their time has past. Social 
restructuring for everyone is needed. Mobilizing effectively can get 

[Biofuel] Inscribe

2013-04-02 Thread Steven Finger


Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [Biofuel] Inscribe

2013-04-02 Thread Bruno M.
Illerated indeed, it seems, try again but write unsubscribe  
correctly this time


 u n s u b s c r i b e  notINsubscribe

And to the correct address 
sustainablelorgbiofuel-requ...@lists.sustainablelists.org

this is not the same as the list address for messages to other members!

see list mail headers:

List-Unsubscribe: 
http://lists.eruditium.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/sustainablelorgbiofuel,

mailto:sustainablelorgbiofuel-requ...@lists.sustainablelists.org?subject=unsubscribe


not sent from an iphone
Bruno M.
~~

Op 2-4-2013 19:01, Steven Finger schreef:


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Re: [Biofuel] Solar panels may cost all households

2013-04-02 Thread Darryl McMahon

Hi Zeke,

for most for-profit power generators, their emissions (heat, CO2, 
conventional pollutants, noise, toxins, carcinogens, etc.) are just 
'externalities' they impose on society.  Thus, the lack of these things 
are also an externality.  Unless they can find a way to generate revenue 
from the damage not being done, these benefits are by definition of no 
value (cannot be 'internalized' for profit).


The concept of the 'triple-bottom-line' is a nice construct for trying 
to score something for reduction of environmental costs.  However, in my 
experience, the only thing that really matters to a corporation is 
money.  So, if you want to encourage a particular direction or action, 
the incentive needs to be financial.  That's what governments and mass 
action by consumers is supposed to do.  (Government interventions, tax 
structures and effective consumer boycotts are amazingly effective, 
sometimes amazingly so.  Our federal government seriously damaged the 
residential real estate market recently with a couple of measures, one 
of which should have resulted in the resignation of the Finance Minister).


That's why I favour things like a carbon tax, environmental surety 
performance bonds and serious fines for violations (that get enforced).


Once the owners of those solar panels that are grid connected get to the 
point they are producing a substantial amount of power, I wonder what 
impact they would have if they all elected to shut off their connection 
(supply to grid) on a hot summer weekday afternoon when demand is high? 
 I wonder if a group action would get the utility's attention.


Darryl

On 02/04/2013 10:58 AM, Zeke Yewdall wrote:

Lots of talk of the costs imposed on other people by people who install
solar panels, but no mention of the benefit that people who install solar
panels are giving to all of society by reducing pollution and greenhouse
gas emissions

On Mon, Apr 1, 2013 at 6:16 PM, Tony cr...@vianet.net.au wrote:


snip


--
Darryl McMahon

Author, The Emperor's New Hydrogen Economy
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[Biofuel] Quality not quantity

2013-04-02 Thread Tony


It looks like The Biofuel's group is being Refined
to real Quality of character not quantity.

Tony

1-
I really wonder what gives us the right
to wreck this poor planet of ours.
- Kurt Vonnegut Jr. (1922-2007)


2-
Happiness comes when your work and words
are of benefit to yourself and others.

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