[Biofuel] WVO in PA, USA
I'm having a hard time finding WVO. I need 500 Gallons per month and I'm tired of driving around and fighting for oil at every restaurant within 10 miles. I've found other companies in other states that sell and deliver larger quantities but nothing close to home. I'm just outside of Philadelphia - has anyone heard or run into such an animal. Thanks, Roger ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] WVO in PA, USA
A combination...My F250 Diesel, Oil Heat, My father's F250, and some for the neighbor's house. I suppose the 500 Gallons is a winter number - maybe 300 gallons in the summer to support the lot of us. I go through about 250 gallons a month myself (in the winter). That's only 1 tank per week in the truck (26 gal). Plus I have a few friends asking for any surplus I have. Currently, I'm only acquiring about 100 gallons a month, which is more hassle than I imagined. Between driving up to 30 minutes away and then trying to get the sludge from the good stuff, it doesn't seem worth it compared to over $5 a gal for diesel and heating oil is right behind at $4.69. Keith Addison wrote: Keith Addison wrote: I'm having a hard time finding WVO. I need 500 Gallons per month and I'm tired of driving around and fighting for oil at every restaurant within 10 miles. I've found other companies in other states that sell and deliver larger quantities but nothing close to home. I'm just outside of Philadelphia - has anyone heard or run into such an animal. Thanks, Roger Why do you need so much oil? That should be enough for 12 people. This is the US Keith :) Yes, Chip, I know. :-) But it just doesn't wash. I also come from a big country, not that big, but big enough, so I know something about it. I quite often used to drive 1,000 miles each way for the weekend, or 400 each way for a different weekend. In an 850cc Mini, foot flat all the way at 80 mph, and not very much gas used. (I'm not small, 6ft 2in.) Japan's a big country too, in its way, narrow but long. Where you guys need a 6.8 litre F250 truck the Japanese use little 660cc K-trucks, for just about everything, very economical, tough and capable. Good 4x4 too, not easy to get stuck in a K-truck. They're real trucks, but miniaturised, not made-over cars. I don't think Japan would work very well without its K-trucks, I can see it sort of slowly grinding to a halt. There are K-cars too, all the K-vehicles have low taxes to encourage people to buy them. I wonder if your F250s accomplish that much more work than Japan's K-trucks do (let alone 10 times as much work, since they're 10 times as big), and what the real costs might be per unit of work accomplished in each case, or some such efficiency comparison. I've no idea where to find such data, if anywhere, but it might be a surprise. Anyway, the cases you describe don't seem to be typical for the US, according to these stats, source U.S. Department of Transportation: Average annual fuel consumed per vehicle (gallons) - Passenger car - 2005: 541 Average miles traveled per vehicle (thousands) - Passenger car: 12.4 http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004727.html That's about what I thought, 12,000 miles a year, 500 gallons. So yes, Roger's 500 gallons a month should be enough for 12 people. I don't know, but I don't think he's in the same situation as you. He says he's just outside Philadelphia, he said before he works for a laboratory surplus equipment company, in Philadelphia I guess, though maybe not. So why does he need so much fuel? Interesting numbers at that infoplease page. Number of passenger cars registered 1960: 61,671,000 2005: 135,568,000 Did the US get twice as big in the meantime? No: Vehicle-miles traveled - Passenger car 1960: 587,000,000 2005: 1,689,965,000 It got three times as big! LOL! Sorry. snip But still I see no real changes, just individual disasters. That's the problem eh? Ordinary people, the real ones, get hurt first, and the toy people don't feel a thing. I suppose long-haul will go by train, or not at all, trucks will be for local. Hm. The Japanese don't export the K-vehicles, but I think you can get second-hand K-trucks in the US now. Maybe some of your trucker friends might be interested in this: http://www.best-used-tractors.com/mini_truck.html Used Japanese 4X4 K-class Mini Trucks, Micro Trucks - US and Canada The Japanese have been making right hand drive light duty trucks for decades which Best Used Tractors can now import used in containers to the US, to Canada, and to many other countries around the globe. Bit of money to be made there, I think. Could even be trendy, sort of an anti-Hummer. Best Keith Lemme see, 500 gal of svo, could yield 500 gals of bd, for a 30 day month, that's ~17 gallons a day, in my F-250, that get's 16-20mpg,if I drive it really gently, that's 300 miles a day, but that's every day. Since I live 127 miles from where I work, I could *almost* burn that much. However, I don't commute, I only go home on the weekends, and I don't drive the truck :) Some folks will boggle at that. But around here, it's not as far-fetched as one might -at first blush- think. Of the 80-some-odd folks that I work with, more than half of them commute more than 50 miles a day, some
[Biofuel] Bad Week?
I made two batches lately and both raise questions. The first... I tried stir-washing for the first time. The water separated out, slightly cloudy but I'm left with a thin butterscotch looking biodiesel. It's been settling for a few days, even added heat up to 165°F. No change. Any thoughts? The second... I made a batch from a new oil source. I made a 1L test batch with a titration of 5.6. Higher than what I used to but the test batch came out good. I duplicated it on a 55gal batch; I mixed for 1 hour and held at 137°F for the process. Now I have some concoction that has a watery-looking dark brown layer on top and a light brown on the bottom. No glyercine separated. When I mix with the pump on the reactor, the two layers don't want to mix together. It looks like milk and alcohol. I did a wash test, mixing the tank while pulling a sample. It looks water-soluble - no separation, no defined layers, just a consistent mixture. Any thoughts here? It's not soap...so what is it? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Algae In Storage Tank?
I've been warned of this but haven't seen any thing yet. I keep my finished biodiesel in a 275-Gal Oil Tank. Someone my dad was talking to said they had problems with algae growing in their tank. Just wondering if any one else has encountered this and if there is something I can do to prevent it. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Worst WVO Ever?
I'd cut it with some better oil, but I've never tried any that bad either. Thomas Kelly wrote: Hi All, I was offered a dumpster full of WVO. New owner of a diner inherited it from the previous owner. I tested a sample . clean, fairly light in color . titrated 19g KOH/L !!! (My previous high was 11 g KOH/L, but that oil was very dark.) The label on the dumpster says that the kitchen grease will be returned to the food chain as a component of animal feed. I would just as soon keep it out of the food chain and make 100+ gal of biodiesel. Will the two stage acid/base method handle such WVO as this? Am I looking for trouble pumping out, and getting stuck with, 100+ gal of burnt-out oil? The new owner is willing to give me his WVO which is nothing like what's in the dumpster. Advice appreciated, Tom -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080528/5b167be5/attachment.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Titration
I have some oil from a small pizza shop; it's real dark and it titrates at about 11. I was going to just add some to each batch of 'better' oil to use it - thinning it out like that should be ok, right? PS - Thanks to all those that helped me along the way. It looks like all the 'problems' I was having was nothing more than a little glycerine at the bottom of the separation funnel, settling after draining the majority of it out. Just a little sticking to the walls I guess. The last two batches couldn't have come out better now that I know what to look for. Ken Provost wrote: On May 6, 2008, at 8:45 AM, Brian Schneider wrote: Jan, You say that my concentration is very weak compared to the standard solutions. Do you mean the standard solution to titrate waste oil with, or are you just meaning weak in general? If it is weak compared to what should be used for waste oil, what is the standard strength? 0.1% NaOH solution is what many people use for titration, including me. As Jan points out, you should be titrating just one ml of your oil in enough isopropyl alcohol to dissolve any free fatty acids (10 ml of isopropanol is fine, but not critical). If this is your procedure, your 12-15 titration result is valid. Quite high (worse than anything I've ever used), but lots of folks get oil like that regularly. The normal single-stage base-catalyzed process would make lots of soap, likely reducing your yield drastically. A combination acid-base process could work, but I wouldn't recommend it for a novice. You could try to get some cleaner oil titrating at, say, 1 or 2 ml, and mix in some of the rancid stuff to use it up gradually. Virgin oil, except palm and olive, would typically titrate somewhere between 0 and 1 ml. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080506/981085f9/attachment.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Water in my Methanol
Any suggestions? It looks like water got in my new 55-gal drum of Methanol. I keep it outside for obvious reasons but it looks like water got in somehow. The only thought I had was to set up a distiller to heat up the mixture to 160°F and then cool the vapor into another vessel much like the methanol-recovery system. This would be on a small scale thought. Just thought I would ask. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] We Need To Solve The Oil Crisis--Now
I was going to say the same. Not sure on how to do it, but it's going to take a full-fledged attitude change from everyone - not more legislation. How do you convince an entire nation that, for the good of the country and oneself, not to buy the Hummer, to car-pool, stop eating GM foods, and avoid high-fructose corn syrup. The argument continues to school shootings, drugs, etc. When did these things become OK? More laws don't fix a damn thing - look at the 'War on Drugs' or Washington DC where handgun ownership is illegal and the crime is the worst in the country. Chip Mefford wrote: Brian Schneider wrote: Hello, Just a comment, why don't we in the US do something else that was done in the 70's oil crisis...drop the speed limit back to 55. There were a *lot* of problems with this. I'm not going to go into it all, in fact, I'm barely going to scratch the surface. But essentially, the nationwide 55mph speed limit was about as popular as prohibition, and caused many of the same problems. In interest of full disclosure, when ever I hear 'There ought to be a law, I duck. We have plenty of laws. a few orders of magnitude too many I'd say. In fact, I'd point to the current state of affairs as my primary exhibit in the 'laws don't fix anything' presentation. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080424/eda842c3/attachment.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil
Sounds like we ended up at the same place. Hence why I was very perplexed at the wash test results, etc. I'll be in touch with my findings this weekend - I'm sure to be busy on more test runs. Thanks, Roger Thomas Kelly wrote: Update on peanut oil test batch: Because the biodiesel produced from a peanut oil test batch did not appear to pass the Jan W. methanol quality test (mix turned white; white precipitate settled), I reprocessed the biodiesel layer. No glycerin dropped out. The hot, reprocessed mix was clear and light yellow in color. I did a quality test on the reprocessed BD and again, the mix turned white. The methanol I used came from a shed; temp ~ 35F/2C, so I gently heated the methanol-BD mix and the white disappeared - clear solution. The solution stayed clear until it approached room temp (my kitchen: 65F/18C) at which point it began to cloud up again. At 70 - 75F (21 - 26C) the BD is completely soluble in methanol = passed the test. The reprocessed BD remains clear at room temp, but cooling it below 60F wisps of white begin to form. Ken P. (3/21/08): Peanut oil is about 75-80% oleic and linoleic, with the remainder almost entirely saturated (palmitic, stearic, and longer). I would expect biodiesel made from it to show precipitates at temperatures lower than maybe 65 F. I think Ken nailed it. The test batch was actually a success. At cool temps like my basement, an outdoor shed, or even my kitchen, the BD begins to cloud and then gel. I put the remaining peanut oil in my refrigerator. At about 40F (5C) there is a white layer on the bottom of the container. It has been my opinion and experience that the cloud point and pour point of biodiesel reflects the cloud and pour point of the veg. oil it was made from. Because the peanut oil did not cloud in my basement 55 - 60F (13- 15C), I didn't think the BD made from it would cloud at that temp. I'm still perplexed on that issue, but ... ? It might be a good idea to avoid processing peanut oil, especially newbies who are doing test batches. What other oils would fall into this category? Again, Ken P: Many oils, including palm and olive (don't know about peanut) have high FFA levels as typically sold. The wash test results on successfully processed peanut oil gives very unusual results: creamy white BD layer on top of a white water layer, with a thin white soap layer between. Using hot water gives better definition, but is generally viewed as cheating on the test. The washed/dried BD is very clear and almost colorless. Newbies might want to stick to canola, corn, soy oils for test batches. Best to All, Tom - Original Message - From: Thomas Kelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, April 03, 2008 8:55 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil Roger, Peanut oil is interesting stuff. I just did a test batch with peanut oil Planter's 100% pure. Titration: 0ml0.1% KOH (90% pure) Less glycerine dropped out than I expect. Incomplete reaction? I let it settle for about an hour and then did a (solubility in methanol) quality test. - the mix turned white a white cloud' is settling in the methanol. (I've never seen anything like it w. fresh or waste veg oil.) I just did a wash test on a small sample - exactly what you described: White, on white, on white: cloudy white top layer (BD?), cloudy white bottom layer (water), thin soap layer (white) in between. I had to hold the container in front of a bright light to see contrast. After three shake washes I heated the top layer to get the water to drop out clear layer only slightly yellow. I did another quality test (methanol sol.) and again got white. I did a wash test and a quality test on untreated peanut oil -- oil settled out Maybe there are unreacted mono- di- glycerides that behave oddly in the wash and methanol tests. If I get a chance I will reprocess the sample of biodiesel that remains from the test batch. Maybe you just picked the wrong oil to start doing test batches on. I hope you are having better success with a different oil. I'm on my way to quality test a batch that is finishing up. Hopefully I'll have better luck on the mix of waste oil than I did on the peanut oil. Tom - Original Message - From: Roger [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 1:41 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil Sorry for the excitement and frustration. I've made 4 or 5 1L batches with virgin peanut oil with no luck. 1L Clean, Virgin, Peanut
Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil
Thanks for your help Keith...Sorry for questioning in such a manner. In my absence of success, I was looking for something to compare to. As in, this is what is looks like when you have water contamination, or this is what it looks like when you need more caustic. I know it's not quite that simple but I wasn't bad-mouthing your website nor demanding you post a picture-book recipe. You questioned many of my thoughts and questions below. My biggest question was I was with the wash test, I was getting a lot of soap if not all soap. In hindsight, all 5 first batches were soap it looks like. Each one separated, but with a soap layer and a water layer. It just didn't look like the website picture and I didn't know where I was going wrong. -Roger Keith Addison wrote: Hello Roger That is the only thing missing from J2F, pictures with typical results and adjustments necessary to make improvements. Perhaps in your opinion, but not in mine. I've quite often thought of removing the two pictures there are. You're a case in point. You keep talking about the pictures: I wish there was more pictures - not sure if I'm adding too much of something or too little or what. This is what the picture caption says: Wash-test with unwashed biodiesel -- left, after a violent 10-second shaking; right, biodiesel and water separated cleanly within minutes. The biodiesel will be cloudy, and the water can be milkier than this, but as long as it separates quickly and cleanly, it passes the test. The text says this: The biodiesel should separate from the water in half an hour or less, with amber biodiesel on top and milky water below. ... If you have an emulsion any thicker than the normal paper thin interface layer between oil and water, the batch should probably be retreated. This is what you said in your second message: The last batch of 6.0g separated the quickest, less than a minute - the others longer up to 15 minutes or so. ... With each wash test I got cloudy water with a very thin white line between. The biodiesel looks cloudy white. So what's your problem? But you also say: However, it doesn't look quite like what J2F described as good fuel. Ho-hum. Now with your new tests you say this: Picture C is after an hour of settling. The is the best wash test I've gotten but it looks like a lot of soap in there. That doesn't make sense. You said one of your previous tests separated in less than a minute with a very thin white line between, which is fine, but you say this new one is the best test you've had, it settled for an hour and according to the picture only 15ml of the 20ml of biodiesel you put in has separated. Would you mind explaining that please? Did you read the next bit, after the wash-test: What should you do if your fuel doesn't pass the wash-test? And Tom's explanation of How to use the quality tests a bit further down? You also said this: And, with the rest of the batch in a jar in the garage, each one has turned to mush. Looks like the inside of a melon or something. And previously: Has anyone tried this? [Peanut oil] It's all I had laying around to start with but I keep getting a questionable result. Since it was new, I tried the same recipe for virgin vegetable oil and it didn't really pass the wash test and as soon as it got cold, it turned into sludge. You said that twice, and you were asked about it but didn't explain. I'm puzzled about why you'd go to all the trouble of setting yourself up with everything you need to make test batches and then, for the most important item, the oil itself, you use all I had laying around to start with, and when you keep getting a questionable result, you persist with it instead of dumping it and getting some decent oil to work with. Obviously, IF you're following the instructions, your whatever I had lying around oil is the most likely culprit, no? When you applied to join the list, you told the listadmin: Just starting out with my first test batches and had a few questions that aren't covered on J2F. Please add me to the list. But it says at the list website subscribe section that you don't need to join the list to learn how to make biodiesel. Did you read that bit, or didn't you believe it? Listadmin reminded you of it: Please read this: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html#learn NOTE: You don't need to join the Biofuel list to learn how to make biodiesel. Start here: Where do I start? http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#start Follow the instructions, step by step. Study everything on that page and the next page and at the links in the text. It tells you everything you need to know. Many list members who've done it themselves say the same thing. If you ask novice questions at the list that have been answered many
Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil
That is what I was looking for. I was following the recipe to the 'T' and was wondering where I was going wrong. Anything is possible. The methanol came from Quaker City Chemical in a 55-Gal Drum, 99.9%. I opened the drum, removed 2 liters with a new, unused pump, then sealed the Nalgene containers and the drum back up. I assumed it would be water-less, but I may have missed something. Suppose there is water in the drum - does that make it useless? Any way to fix that? I used a name brand oil from the grocery store (not sure now what it was now.) That shouldn't be the problem. I'll buy the yellow Heet bottle and try again. In the meantime, I'll practice titration with my pH meter and find some phenolphthalein to try as well. I thought the pH meter would be easy to use and just as good but I'm not familiar with using one - so training my be necessary. I also don't have the calibration solutions yet either. Working for a surplus lab equipment company, we get all kinds of neat stuff - but more often than not it's not all there and that is even if I know what it is. The peanut oil I have came from Costco in the big jug. I used half for a turkey and figured it would be worth trying out. That'll be next. Thanks for your help, Roger Thomas Kelly wrote: Roger, I'm stumped by the third photo. Why so much soap when you used new veg oil. I'm surprisd it separated at all. You are certain the methanol is dry? Soap forms when there is water contamination. Soap forms when Free Fatty Acids are present. Ken P. responded to you on March 31: It's ALWAYS a good idea to titrate, even virgin oil. Many oils, including palm and olive (don't know about peanut) have high FFA levels as typically sold. The reason for using new, unused veg oil of our first test batches is to decrease the number of variables we are dealing with. It is best to avoid titration until you get the basic process under your belt. It is assumed that new oil doesn't have to be titrated. This may not be the case. Suggestions: 1. Pick up a container of Heet (brand of gas line antifreeze) Yellow container, NOT Red. (If it is available to you.) ~ $1.50/300ml. (US). It is dry methanol. 2. I did my test batches using a name brand corn oil. The people I have helped in my neigborhood have done the same. We had no problems with FFAs. Maybe you should invest in a bottle of name brand corn oil . or is that what you already did? As for pH meters: (Ken P): pH really only makes sense when referring to a water-based solution. Sticking pH paper or pH meter into biodiesel gives spurious results in most cases. I often measure the pH of my wash water as a check of how much lye and soaps may be left in the biodiesel, but never the biodiesel (or oil) itself. Get Phenolphthalein (dissolved in alcohol) for titrations. We'll deal with the mysterious peanut oil and with you WVO after you succeed w. the test batches. I'm now curious about peanut oil. I'll see about getting some and doing a test batch myself. Tom - Original Message - From: Roger [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2008 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil New Results...Better I think. I tried another batch last night with vegetable oil with 'better' results. 1L Clean, Virgin, Vegetable Oil 200ml Methanol 5.5g of 90% KOH (All with very similar results) 55°C Temp via Hotplate Agitation: Fast Stirring for 30 minutes via Hotplate Here are some pictures of what I have so far... http://tesi.servepics.com/roger/BD-4208-01a.JPG http://tesi.servepics.com/roger/BD-4208-01b.JPG http://tesi.servepics.com/roger/BD-4208-01c.JPG I let it settle for 14 hours. Picture A is of the results. Picture B is right after shaking 20ml of BD and 20ml of water (both at room temperature) Picture C is after an hour of settling. The is the best wash test I've gotten but it looks like a lot of soap in there. So my question is... which way do I need to go to make it better? More KOH? I'm using very accurate measurements. (Digital balance accurate to 0.001g, Graduated cylinders, etc.) No water contamination that I'm aware of and taking precautions not to have any. That is the only thing missing from J2F, pictures with typical results and adjustments necessary to make improvements. Haven't tried the methanol test yet (still at work). Now, when I used peanut oil with the same recipe, I got a cloudy, opaque water and cloudy whiteish BD after the wash test. Any thoughts on which way I need to go with that? I presume I'll have to titrate it and make adjustments from there. I need a pH probe to go with my meter before I can proceed with the peanut oil or used oil. Thomas Kelly wrote: Roger, Now we're getting somewhere
Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil
New Results...Better I think. I tried another batch last night with vegetable oil with 'better' results. 1L Clean, Virgin, Vegetable Oil 200ml Methanol 5.5g of 90% KOH (All with very similar results) 55°C Temp via Hotplate Agitation: Fast Stirring for 30 minutes via Hotplate Here are some pictures of what I have so far... http://tesi.servepics.com/roger/BD-4208-01a.JPG http://tesi.servepics.com/roger/BD-4208-01b.JPG http://tesi.servepics.com/roger/BD-4208-01c.JPG I let it settle for 14 hours. Picture A is of the results. Picture B is right after shaking 20ml of BD and 20ml of water (both at room temperature) Picture C is after an hour of settling. The is the best wash test I've gotten but it looks like a lot of soap in there. So my question is... which way do I need to go to make it better? More KOH? I'm using very accurate measurements. (Digital balance accurate to 0.001g, Graduated cylinders, etc.) No water contamination that I'm aware of and taking precautions not to have any. That is the only thing missing from J2F, pictures with typical results and adjustments necessary to make improvements. Haven't tried the methanol test yet (still at work). Now, when I used peanut oil with the same recipe, I got a cloudy, opaque water and cloudy whiteish BD after the wash test. Any thoughts on which way I need to go with that? I presume I'll have to titrate it and make adjustments from there. I need a pH probe to go with my meter before I can proceed with the peanut oil or used oil. Thomas Kelly wrote: Roger, Now we're getting somewhere. The original separation looks great - waited at least 12 hours but separates in about 2 hours. Obvious layers with a slightly hazy, pale yellow biodiesel layer and clear, darker by-product layer. Separated by pouring the biodiesel off the top. Looks to be about 1.1L of biodiesel for each batch. You are getting a clear split. You have made biodiesel. You may well have some unreacted mono and di glycerides in with the BD. - Have you tried a quality test on the unwashed biodiesel? i.e. the Jan W. solubility in methanol test describes at JtF? - I would be very careful not to include any glycerin mix when you pour the biodiesel off the top. In fact I would avoid pouring altogether. Draw the BD off using a pipette or do the following: Get a few .5 L - 1L clear plastic sports drink bottle (PET bottles) that have twist open/close tops. Some water bottles have pull-to-open push-to-close tops. Process as usual, allow to cool a bit and then pour the mix into one of the bottles. Allow the biodiesel-glycerin mix to settle in a closed and inverted bottle. After 12 - 24 hours drain out the glycerin from the bottom. If any unreacted glycerides are present, even a small amount of glycerin/soap contamination will prolong separation time during the wash test. With each wash test I got cloudy water with a very thin white line between. The biodiesel looks cloudy white. With each wash test I got cloudy water with a very thin white line between. Do you mean: Cloudy water on bottom, with a very thin white line between the cloudy water on bottom and something darker on top? This would be a good thing. When you say: The biodiesel looks cloudy white. I'm a bit confused. If the biodiesel is white, you wouldn't be able to see the very thin white line between. It would just be white on top of white. Is the biodiesel layer (on top) darker than the thin white line? Again, a good thing. However, it doesn't look quite like what J2F described as good fuel. Do you mean after doing a wash test? It will not yet be good fuel. It will take more than shaking with water once to get the contaminants out of the BD. After 3 or 4 washes, the wash water should be clear and the same pH as the water that was added. The BD will be cloudy because water will be suspended in it. The next step is to dry the BD. Heat it gently. You might put your tube of BD in a hot water bath. As the mix heats up water will fall out and the BD will clear. I do my wash tests in the same PET bottles described above. Equal volumes of water and BD~150ml of each. Shake vigorously. With top closed, invert, and drain after water settles out. Add clean water repeat. The last batch of 6.0g separated the quickest, less than a minute - the others longer up to 15 minutes or so. It might be that your KOH is not 90% pure @ 90% purity you would use 5.45g KOH/L of unused oil @ 85% purity you would use 5.76g KOH/L of unused oil Doing the methanol quality test on the BD before you wash it or after you wash and then dry it would tell us more about your success in achieving a complete conversion of the veg oil. And, with the rest of the batch in a jar in the garage, each one has turned to mush. Looks like the inside of a melon or something
[Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil
Has anyone tried this? It's all I had laying around to start with but I keep getting a questionable result. Since it was new, I tried the same recipe for virgin vegetable oil and it didn't really pass the wash test and as soon as it got cold, it turned into sludge. I wish there was more pictures - not sure if I'm adding too much of something or too little or what. I'm using some nice equipment (I work for a laboratory surplus equipment company) such as a lab scale, pH meter, quality glassware, hotplate stirrer and a 2L reaction vessel. I'm holding the temperature right on, mixing for 30 minutes, etc. I have 90% KOH and 99.9% methanol from a local chem distributor. Not sure when I'm doing wrong, but any advice would be great. I made a 2x75Gal machine that I am dying to use and the used oil is piling up. Also, I don't know if I'm using my pH meter correctly. Can someone give directions on proper use of one of these? If anyone needs any special equipment, just ask. I even have tanks, etc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Newby
I use Quaker City Chemical and they sent me a 55-Gal drum the next day. 1-800-877-CHEM The price seemed reasonable and shipping was included. Not sure one their distribution area. Hope that helps - Roger Thomas Kelly wrote: Jim, I have gotten methanol from VP Racing Fuels. It was always good quality dry. That said, I haven't had much luck with my initial 1L batches... No split? BD Fails wash test? Fails quality test? Tom - Original Message - From: James Pfeiffer [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org; biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, March 29, 2008 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Newby I'm a newby as well... but have been able to get methanol for my test batches in a 5 gallon size from a local VP Racing Fuels distributor. go to their website to find a distributor in your area. http://www.vpracingfuels.com/vp_01_fuels.html That said, I haven't had much luck with my initial 1L batches... I'm hoping the quality of the methanol isn't contributing to the problem but I don't really know how to check the quality of the methanol. Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2008 15:57:47 -0400 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: [Biofuel] Newby Hi, Can anyone give me some info on locating methanol? Just starting up small scale biodiesel processing. thanks, Steve -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080329/0d330b40/attachment.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ In a rush? Get real-time answers with Windows Live Messenger. http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_realtime_042008 -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080329/0614360a/attachment.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080331/8f55f9bf/attachment.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil
Sorry for the excitement and frustration. I've made 4 or 5 1L batches with virgin peanut oil with no luck. 1L Clean, Virgin, Peanut Oil 200ml Methanol 5.4g, 5.5g, 5.6g, 6.0g of 90% KOH (All with very similar results) 55°C Temp via Hotplate Agitation: Fast Stirring for 30 minutes via Hotplate The original separation looks great - waited at least 12 hours but separates in about 2 hours. Obvious layers with a slightly hazy, pale yellow biodiesel layer and clear, darker by-product layer. Separated by pouring the biodiesel off the top. Looks to be about 1.1L of biodiesel for each batch. It's slightly colder in my garage, but not outside temperate. I'd say roughly 55°F or so. Each wash test was with 20ml of product and 20ml of water in a 50ml plastic tube. The final wash test I performed inside with warmer water. With each wash test I got cloudy water with a very thin white line between. The biodiesel looks cloudy white. The last batch of 6.0g separated the quickest, less than a minute - the others longer up to 15 minutes or so. However, it doesn't look quite like what J2F described as good fuel. And, with the rest of the batch in a jar in the garage, each one has turned to mush. Looks like the inside of a melon or something. My first thought was that peanut oil was different enough from vegetable oil that I would need to titrate it and change the KOH amount. However, I wasn't having much luck with the pH meter. One time it would be add 0.4gm of KOH and the next time 0.01g would be too much. I thought I didn't know how to use the meter. The processor I made (assuming I would be using it by now) has 2) 75 gallon tanks with individual heaters, controls, pumps, and stirrers. It can be used as a 150gal unit or a 2-stage 75gal unit. (I've attached a picture.) I can't wait to try it but haven't used it yet for fear of making a lot of soap. Your thoughts are greatly appreciated. Thomas Kelly wrote: Roger, Back up a bit. Has anyone tried this? It's all I had laying around to start with but I keep getting a questionable result. By tried this do you mean peanut oil? If so, I have run batches with peanut oil mixed in. Since it was new, I tried the same recipe for virgin vegetable oil and it didn't really pass the wash test and as soon as it got cold, it turned into sludge. Got cold???The wash test is done at room temp 70-ish F (20-ish C) I made a 2x75Gal machine that I am dying to use and the used oil is piling up. (What's a 2x75Gal machine? a 75 Gal processor? 150 Gal processor?) Hold on now cowboy . let's not sign up for a marathon run before we up and walking. You don't want to turn gallons of good oil into gallons of goop. You might start by telling us step-by-step what you are doing. Ex 1L fresh, unused vegetable oil 200ml methanol 5.45 g of 90% KOH Method of agitation? Temp? 30 minutes reaction time Do you get a clear split? How long do you let it settle? How do you separate the settled glycerine mix from the biodiesel (separatory funnel?) Describe the results of the wash test, done at room temp, as to time for separation + appearance of layers. While it is important to be able to measure accurately, especially for 1L test batches, I have gotten along fine w/o a pH meter. Best Wishes, Tom - Original Message - From: Roger [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 10:13 AM Subject: [Biofuel] Test Batches with Peanut Oil Has anyone tried this? It's all I had laying around to start with but I keep getting a questionable result. Since it was new, I tried the same recipe for virgin vegetable oil and it didn't really pass the wash test and as soon as it got cold, it turned into sludge. I wish there was more pictures - not sure if I'm adding too much of something or too little or what. I'm using some nice equipment (I work for a laboratory surplus equipment company) such as a lab scale, pH meter, quality glassware, hotplate stirrer and a 2L reaction vessel. I'm holding the temperature right on, mixing for 30 minutes, etc. I have 90% KOH and 99.9% methanol from a local chem distributor. Not sure when I'm doing wrong, but any advice would be great. I made a 2x75Gal machine that I am dying to use and the used oil is piling up. Also, I don't know if I'm using my pH meter correctly. Can someone give directions on proper use of one of these? If anyone needs any special equipment, just ask. I even have tanks, etc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel processing plant
Hi Keith: Many thanks for your valuable response and suggestion. Roger Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Hi Roger Hi Keith: Thanks for your answer. :-) It was a question. I haven't produce any liter of biodiesel yet but I'm in contact with the University of Agraria of Lima Peru who has developed a very and basic biodiesel plant in a lab and has made investigations about the market oil sources and the statistics of Peruvian Market needs. Actually the master of that project will be part of my company organization. I've studied a post graduate of nuclear engineer in Argentina and have other people with outstanding acomplishment who will work with me. Partnerts of other conuntries are wellcome if you are interested in this project. Any suggestion will be appreciate. Judging from what's happened to many other people, I don't think your qualifications and those of your partners will help you very much if you start in the wrong place. I suggest you start here: Where do I start? http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#start ... where it says Start with the process, NOT with the processor. The processor comes later. Which would you prefer - a failed batch of one litre or a failed batch of 1,000 litres? Learn how to make your biodiesel first. Follow the instructions, step by step. Study everything on that page and the next page and at the links in the text. It tells you everything you need to know. Anyway, why would you prefer a lab version of a biodiesel plant when you have ready access right here to processor designs that have been tried and tested by thousands of people in the real world? Also, a biodiesel plant making 1,000 litres a day is not small, that's far in excess of what would (or should) be needed by an individual, or by a sustainable farm. Is this to be a community-based project or simply a business for profit? The Biofuel mailing list is not seen as a source of free consultancy for commercial operations. It's not against commercial operations either, but its main focus is small-scale, local community level or individual projects. Thank you very much again and I apologise any mispelling. Here is a little difficult to practice my english. Your English is just fine, please don't be embarrassed about it. Best Keith Best regards Roger L. Cotrina Calle Juan Gris 230, Suite 303 San Borja -Lima Peru Phone: 51-1-226-0700 Cel: 51-1-9018-6300 Keith Addison escribió: Hello Roger Have you made any biodiesel yet? Best Keith Dear members: . Estimated friends: This is Roger Cotrina from Lima - Peru. I am gliding to install a small biodiesel plant to obtain 1,000 daily liters of biodiesel using oil of palm and recycled oils. May someone recommend to me some plant or brand of this capacity and the manufacturer? This step that dare is the preliminary one to develop a bigger project in the jungle of Peru taking the great advantages of the tax incentives that the government has given recently. Reards Roger Cotrina ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ __ Correo Yahoo! Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis! Regístrate ya - http://correo.yahoo.com.mx/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
Re: [Biofuel] Subject: Biodiesel processing plant
Hi Simon: Thanks a lot for your answer. This will be my pleasure to contact with your brother in law. I'm pretty far from Cajamarca but this will be interesting to talk with him. Does he speak spanish or english? My phone number is 51-1-226-0700 and my cel is 51-1-9018-6300. He can contac with me by mail also. Roger Cotrina Simon Fowler MADUR-SALES [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Hi Roger, my brother in law just planted 15 hectares of rapeseed in the area of Cajamarca. Maybe you would like to get in touch with him as well. He is thinking on the same lines if the stuff will grow properly there. Simon Fowler MADUR ELECTRONICS Voitgasse 4 A-1220 Vienna Phone: + 43-1-2584502 Fax: + 43-1-2584502-22 E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Our homepage: www.madur.com, www.madur.at, www.madurusa.com Message: 6 Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 17:39:15 -0500 (CDT) From: Roger Cotrina Subject: [Biofuel] Biodiesel processing plant To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Dear members: . Estimated friends: This is Roger Cotrina from Lima - Peru. I am gliding to install a small biodiesel plant to obtain 1,000 daily liters of biodiesel using oil of palm and recycled oils. May someone recommend to me some plant or brand of this capacity and the manufacturer? This step that dare is the preliminary one to develop a bigger project in the jungle of Peru taking the great advantages of the tax incentives that the government has given recently. Reards Roger Cotrina __ Correo Yahoo! Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ?gratis! Reg?strate ya - http://correo.yahoo.com.mx/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ __ Correo Yahoo! Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis! Regístrate ya - http://correo.yahoo.com.mx/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel processing plant
Hi Keith: Thanks for your answer. I haven't produce any liter of biodiesel yet but I'm in contact with the University of Agraria of Lima Peru who has developed a very and basic biodiesel plant in a lab and has made investigations about the market oil sources and the statistics of Peruvian Market needs. Actually the master of that project will be part of my company organization. I've studied a post graduate of nuclear engineer in Argentina and have other people with outstanding acomplishment who will work with me. Partnerts of other conuntries are wellcome if you are interested in this project. Any suggestion will be appreciate. Thank you very much again and I apologise any mispelling. Here is a little difficult to practice my english. Best regards Roger L. Cotrina Calle Juan Gris 230, Suite 303 San Borja -Lima Peru Phone: 51-1-226-0700 Cel: 51-1-9018-6300 Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] escribió: Hello Roger Have you made any biodiesel yet? Best Keith Dear members: . Estimated friends: This is Roger Cotrina from Lima - Peru. I am gliding to install a small biodiesel plant to obtain 1,000 daily liters of biodiesel using oil of palm and recycled oils. May someone recommend to me some plant or brand of this capacity and the manufacturer? This step that dare is the preliminary one to develop a bigger project in the jungle of Peru taking the great advantages of the tax incentives that the government has given recently. Reards Roger Cotrina ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ __ Correo Yahoo! Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis! Regístrate ya - http://correo.yahoo.com.mx/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/
[Biofuel] Biodiesel processing plant
Dear members: . Estimated friends: This is Roger Cotrina from Lima - Peru. I am gliding to install a small biodiesel plant to obtain 1,000 daily liters of biodiesel using oil of palm and recycled oils. May someone recommend to me some plant or brand of this capacity and the manufacturer? This step that dare is the preliminary one to develop a bigger project in the jungle of Peru taking the great advantages of the tax incentives that the government has given recently. Reards Roger Cotrina __ Correo Yahoo! Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam ¡gratis! Regístrate ya - http://correo.yahoo.com.mx/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] High mileage, low emissions - and no big-rig noise
..hi keith..i wood like to know if ??you can take 5 .gal. of w v o. and add 5gal. of ..diesel fuel to it / mix it up. to get 10gals. of 50/50mix ??WILL IT WORK in a fuel tank in my truck ??is a F 250 HD DIESEL 1997..??oooyes and por it in a filter first.. ..??WILL IT WORK.. thanks roger.. Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/1018/p16s01-wmgn.html | csmonitor.com Work Money from the October 18, 2004 edition High mileage, low emissions - and no big-rig noise By Eric C. Evarts | Correspondent of The Christian Science Monitor The last time America got excited about diesels, gasoline cost more than it does today in real terms and Ronald Reagan was president. But diesels have come a long way. Five new models are hitting the market this year. Take Volkswagen, which has sold diesels in the US - and improved upon them - since 1987. Driving one of its long-running Golf, Jetta, or New Beetle models, it's hard to tell the difference from a gasoline-powered car. The diesel engine grumbles a bit while idling and the back of the car smells a little until the engine warms. It also reaches high speeds without having to rev as fast. But other than that, you'd never know it was a diesel until you fill it up - and these cars register more than 40 miles per gallon. Many reviewers - and apparently buyers, too - prefer these fuel-efficient engines to their respective gasoline models. That's certainly true with the VW Touareg, which offers a powerful V10 diesel engine with twin turbochargers. The engine generates 310 horsepower and enough torque to tow a 7,700-pound boat. Under normal driving conditions, it gets 17 m.p.g. in the city and 23 m.p.g. on the highway. The Touareg's gasoline V8 has slightly more horsepower but only gets 13 m.p.g. in the city and 18 on the highway. The 500 Touareg diesels VW will sell this year also cost $15,000 more than the gas V8 models. The company's new Passat diesel, however, costs only $300 more than its gasoline counterpart and an automatic transmission comes standard. The Passat uses a slightly larger 134-horsepower version of the four-cylinder turbo-diesel in the Jetta, Golf, and New Beetle. Performance VW Magazine recently picked the diesel as its favorite among four Passat engines. Of the other new diesels this year - the Mercedes-Benz E320 CDI, the Jeep Liberty CRD, and the redesigned Kia Sportage - the best is the Mercedes. It drives much like most diesels with two exceptions. Once up to speed, the E320 CDI is quiet as can be and really zips once the throttle is held open a couple seconds. It also feels far faster than the E320s gasoline V6. Other automakers plan to introduce new diesels after 2006. That's when low-sulfur fuel is expected to become available, allowing the new diesels to meet the next round of tighter pollution standards. Ford executives recently called diesels the answer to higher oil prices, higher fuel-mileage requirements, and low greenhouse-gas emissions. Perhaps the best evidence for America's increasing interest in diesels is that premium buyers are willing to pay for them. Diesels generally cost about $1,000 more to build than comparable gasoline engines. But thousands of buyers are shelling out an extra $2,520 for the diesel VW Jetta (after cash incentives on the gasoline version), which gives them 25 percent better fuel economy, lower greenhouse gas emissions, and the ability to burn a wide variety of fuels if Middle East oil becomes too expensive. ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
[biofuel] John Deere, approves biodiesel
JOHN DEERE APPROVES ECO-FRIENDLY BIODIESEL FUEL FOR ITS PRODUCTS Lenexa, Kansas (December 3, 2001) -- John Deere has approved the use of soy-based Biodiesel in all of its diesel-powered products. This announcement is just the latest step in John Deere's ongoing 35-year commitment to the development of bio-based alternative fuels that benefit both the environment and the agricultural community. We're excited to be able to support the use of Biodiesel in our products, notes Ted Breidenbach, Manager of Worldwide Engine Engineering for John Deere Power Systems. Biodiesel is a valuable tool for helping reduce engine emissions. It also stands as one of the linchpins in the movement to develop alternative uses for commodity products that can ultimately deliver more value to our producer customers. The quality of Biodiesel as a fuel source has improved tremendously in recent years, Breidenbach adds. We're confident that when it's used per factory specifications it will generate the performance producers have come to expect from their John Deere equipment. After thorough testing and analysis John Deere engineers have developed the following guidelines to help ensure optimum use of Biodiesel: Customers should consult with their local fuel suppliers to be sure the Biodiesel fuel meets the ASTM PS 121-99 or DIN 51606 fuel specifications. Biodiesel, by definition is biodegradable, so the higher the concentration of Biodiesel in a fuel blend, the more susceptible the fuel is to degradation and water absorption. While rapeseed methyl ester (RME) concentrations up to 100% have been run successfully, concentrations of up to five percent Biodiesel have shown improvement in fuel lubricity while minimizing the potential problems associated with fuel degradation. Operators should keep storage and vehicle tanks as full as possible to prevent moisture. Storage tanks should be protected from extreme temperatures and extended storage of Biodiesel fuel should be limited. Routine monitoring of the fuel's water content is also recommended. Following these guidelines will ensure normal warranty coverage on products fueled by Biodiesel blends.* John Deere will continue to support further development and use of Biodiesel and additional alternative uses for agricultural commodities. This commitment is evident in the company's support of renewable fuels legislation and in John Deere's ongoing exploration and use of soy-based resins to replace sheet metal on products. An example of this technology is the HarvestForm panels that will be used on John Deere Combines built in 2002. These panels are made from a special polymer derived from corn and soybeans. These are exciting technologies that will have long-term benefits for producers, consumers and every citizen with environmental concerns, Breidenbach says. Biodiesel can also be used in older model tractors and engines. Please check with your local John Deere dealer or fuel supplier for details. One of the world's oldest and most respected enterprises, John Deere (www.JohnDeereAg.com) creates smart and innovative solutions, in the form of advanced machines, services and concepts, for customers on the farmsite, worksite, and homesite worldwide. * Users of John Deere Emission Certified Engines, are responsible for obtaining any appropriate local, state, and national exemptions required for the use of Biodiesel. Barry E. Nelson Ph: 913-310-8324 Fax: 913-310-8394 E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] ResourceOptions
Greetings, How will 21st century civilization survive the loss of oil and other vital resources ? ResourceOptions is the discussion of alternative resources. Join us at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ResourceOptions or subscribe by email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Roger Applet (Group Creator) _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: biodiesel washing
I just completed my first succesful wash of 120 liters of Biodiesel. I added acid (vinegar) to the first water, and followed the Idaho technique. I measured the PH of the wash water, as I drained it off. The first wash was 6.8, then 8.9, then finally 8.3. Does this agree with your results / experience? The fuel is beautiful and very clear. I ran a test by putting two samples in the freezer, and see which one cloulded up a,d/or froze first. The non-washed got thick and froze first. Is there any official test for clould point? Is clould point a direct reflection of what temperature the fuel solidifies? - Original Message - From: Aleksander lt;kac To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday, March 25, 2001 11:00 PM Subject: [biofuel] Re: biodiesel washing --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], Roger Leischner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Aleks, Thank-you for your info. on washing and ph measurment. Could you please describe your method of PH measurment for biodiesel, including the type of probe. Also if possible, I'd like your comments on exactly how it is possible to measure ph of a non-aquious substasnce (oil). Hi Roger, I measure pH with a pH meter, ordinary glass probe. Mine was pretty expensive, but it stabilizes quite nicely. Before I used pH paper - very consistant measurement, but expensive and not accurate enough. I don't measure anymore, because of consistant wash results. A friend of mine has bought a cheap digital pH tester. It's nice, small, easy to use, but a bit lively. It takes a while to stabilize. It is possible to measure pH if there are any ions (H3O+ nad OH-)in a liquid. Alcohols are acidic, so are most natural oils... One of the strongest proton acceptors (a base) in nature is an organic compound, and so on. If a compound is of organic origin, that doesn't mean that it don't exchanges protons, in aqua or different liquids. Proton exchange is what pH is basically all about. Cheers, Aleks Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-~ Make good on the promise you made at graduation to keep in touch. Classmates.com has over 14 million registered high school alumni--chances are you'll find your friends! http://us.click.yahoo.com/03IJGA/DMUCAA/4ihDAA/FZTVlB/TM -_- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: biodiesel washing
David Teal Wrote: Leave a small sample in a glass jar for a week and see if anything collects on the bottom. 8.3 seems high for a finished product :-( Dave thanks. I'm sorry, it appears I was not clear that I was measuring the PH of the wash water, NOT the biodiesel itself. I have had terrible luck trying to get accurate readings of PH from Biodiesel. My concept was to measure the PH from the wash water, and when the there is very little change, it must be pretty well neutral as my wash water. What is your proceedure? - Original Message - From: David Teal To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, March 26, 2001 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] Re: biodiesel washing Roger Leischner wrote: I just completed my first succesful wash of 120 liters of Biodiesel. I added acid (vinegar) to the first water, and followed the Idaho technique. I measured the PH of the wash water, as I drained it off. The first wash was 6.8, then 8.9, then finally 8.3. Does this agree with your results / experience? This indicates that the first acid wash has not neutralised the alkali biodiesel, suggest a longer (warmer?) bubble time. It is possible that some fine caustic glycerol globules remain in the oil, in which case suggest longer post-reaction settlement time. Leave a small sample in a glass jar for a week and see if anything collects on the bottom. 8.3 seems high for a finished product :-( David T Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Paid Net2phone Advertisement - Click Here! Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-~ Make good on the promise you made at graduation to keep in touch. Classmates.com has over 14 million registered high school alumni--chances are you'll find your friends! http://us.click.yahoo.com/03IJGA/DMUCAA/4ihDAA/FZTVlB/TM -_- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] Re: biodiesel washing
Aleks, Thank-you for your info. on washing and ph measurment. Could you please describe your method of PH measurment for biodiesel, including the type of probe. Also if possible, I'd like your comments on exactly how it is possible to measure ph of a non-aquious substasnce (oil). Thanks, Roger - Original Message - From: Aleksander lt;kac To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2001 11:59 PM Subject: [biofuel] Re: biodiesel washing --- In [EMAIL PROTECTED], satish rehpade [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Aleks, Thanks for your suggetions. But still I want to clear the point, How Why my biodiesel will damage the high pressure pump injector system. Read Up thread. I want to know you that my biodiesel have pH 7.5 (WITHOUT WASHING) where as petroleum diesel avilable in India have pH 9. Please give your suggetions. Biodiesel 7.5 is not possible. Wrong measuring. Biodiesel after the base stage has a pH arround 10. Diesel 9 is also not possible. Wrong measurement again. When was the last time you calibrated yout pH meter and how old is your calibration buffer? Calibrate, measure, be sure that diesel is strongly neutral. Yahoo! Groups Sponsor Paid Net2phone Advertisement - Click Here! Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-~ We give away $70,000 a month! Come to iWin.com for your chance to win! http://us.click.yahoo.com/olMXHC/BJVCAA/4ihDAA/FZTVlB/TM -_- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
