Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
ok i keep getting conflicting answers, but appreciate the help. let me make sure im clear.it is possible to find a model engine that runs off diesel only? that message from your friend that you quoted keith, makes it sound like the enya(spelling) engine i gave a link to would workif not than those sites you provided would have themim confused jeff From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 12:50:38 +0900 I wrote to David Teal at the time. Like him, I was also playing with model aircraft and tiny diesel motors 45 years ago, but unlike him I don't still have them! Here's part of his reply: The Japanese produce well regarded model aircraft engines, but practically all of them are glowplug ignition running on methanol-based fuel. These are NOT suitable for biodiesel as it will not mix with the other ingredients. Model diesel engines, with a compression screw on top, are mostly made in UK (prominent makes being PAW and Irvine) and Europe (Italy, Russia, Czech). USA is way down the list but Davies Diesels offer conversion kits for many popular glow motors. In Japan, I can only think of the Enya .15 cu in. diesel and I'm not sure this is a current model. The Chinese manufacturers are known for cloning engines from all over, including some replicas of classic British diesels. Now that they have come round to understanding metallurgy (expansion, stiffness, wear properties) and the meaning of machining tolerances, these actually work pretty well, if not better than the originals. I suggest you seek out replica Oliver Tiger, Rivers Silver Arrow etc. Chinese diesels. They are 2.5 cc and there are loads of airframe designs wich will suit them. There is also an original Chinese design called Silver Swallow. The original was crap, but I have heard that they have re-vamped it to good effect. Here are some sites: http://www.flairproducts.co.uk/Engines/CS_Diesels/VintageDiesels.htm Vintage Diesel Engines http://www.progress.charitydays.co.uk/ Progress Aero Works - Precision Engineering - Home of Eifflaender's PAW diesel engines We'll get one of these diesel motors and build a plane for it, very useful for demos. Best Keith Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey Hello Jeffrey Yes. Well, mostly. From: David Teal [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 Subject: Re: [wastewatts] Kero and Vegie oil mix ( was Re: Ethanol / Methanol ( long ) ) Another field where we use kero (paraffin over here) mixed with vegoil (castor) is model aircraft diesel engines. The usual mix is 30% castor, 30% ether and 40 % paraffin. I have a good number of these engines and have been operating them for 45 years. I did some trials a year or two back and mixed 70% biodiesel with 30% ether (no oil at all). Several engines ran perfectly well on this mix with no overheating or other sign of lack of lubrication. This tends to confirm poor lubricity of 'kero'. Aeolus These are diesels. The glowplug motors (not diesels) run on methanol and a brew of other stuff, some of it not very nice. I don't know if you could substitute ethanol, but I think you'd need the other stuff anyway. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ _ Get ready for school! Find articles, homework help and more in the Back to School Guide! http://special.msn.com/network/04backtoschool.armx ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
Not from me, and not here. but appreciate the help. let me make sure im clear.it is possible to find a model engine that runs off diesel only? No. It's simple enough. You're in the US, right? The first model diesel motor was developed in the US, but diesels have never been popular there - almost all model motors used there have been glow-plug motors, which are not diesels. Glow-plug means diesel in the motor world, but not in the model world - model glow-plug motors are more like spark-ignition motors, gasoline, not diesels, they're made differently and they use different fuel (alcohol and nitro methane). Elsewhere model diesels have been more popular. These are true diesels, compession-ignition motors, but they won't run on pure diesel fuel of any kind, whether petro-diesel of any grade, kerosene, or vegetable oil (castor) - they need 30% ether. You can use biodiesel, but you still need the 30% ether. You can also convert glow-plug motors to use model diesel fuel (including the 30% ether), which is something Americans might want to do, but other people will just get a diesel motor. Ed Beggs posted the link to the company that sells conversion kits. You still have to buy the glow-plug motor. that message from your friend that you quoted keith, makes it sound like the enya(spelling) engine i gave a link This one: http://www.modelflight.com.au/rc_model_accessories/enya_15ss_deisel_co ntrol_line.htm Yes, that's a diesel, it says so. Same as the others, needs ether too. But it's expensive, and you're going to have to import it anyway - that's an Australian site. Get a PAW from the UK. to would workif not than those sites you provided would have themim confused Why do you want the motor? You're after any diesel motor, right? What for? To see if your biodiesel works? You don't need a motor to tell you that. Make it right and check it with the usual quality tests and it'll work. A motor won't tell you much anyway - you can chuck any junk in a diesel and it'll probably work, but for how long? Get your BD to pass the quality tests, much more useful information. Gregg Davidson, who's been posting here, has been using his biodiesel in his gasoline lawnmower and gasoline cars at 10-15% concentration until he gets a diesel car. Did you follow that thread? It's in the archives. Best wishes Keith Addison jeff From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 12:50:38 +0900 I wrote to David Teal at the time. Like him, I was also playing with model aircraft and tiny diesel motors 45 years ago, but unlike him I don't still have them! Here's part of his reply: The Japanese produce well regarded model aircraft engines, but practically all of them are glowplug ignition running on methanol-based fuel. These are NOT suitable for biodiesel as it will not mix with the other ingredients. Model diesel engines, with a compression screw on top, are mostly made in UK (prominent makes being PAW and Irvine) and Europe (Italy, Russia, Czech). USA is way down the list but Davies Diesels offer conversion kits for many popular glow motors. In Japan, I can only think of the Enya .15 cu in. diesel and I'm not sure this is a current model. The Chinese manufacturers are known for cloning engines from all over, including some replicas of classic British diesels. Now that they have come round to understanding metallurgy (expansion, stiffness, wear properties) and the meaning of machining tolerances, these actually work pretty well, if not better than the originals. I suggest you seek out replica Oliver Tiger, Rivers Silver Arrow etc. Chinese diesels. They are 2.5 cc and there are loads of airframe designs wich will suit them. There is also an original Chinese design called Silver Swallow. The original was crap, but I have heard that they have re-vamped it to good effect. Here are some sites: http://www.flairproducts.co.uk/Engines/CS_Diesels/VintageDiesels.htm Vintage Diesel Engines http://www.progress.charitydays.co.uk/ Progress Aero Works - Precision Engineering - Home of Eifflaender's PAW diesel engines We'll get one of these diesel motors and build a plane for it, very useful for demos. Best Keith Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey Hello Jeffrey Yes. Well, mostly. From: David Teal [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 Subject: Re: [wastewatts] Kero and Vegie oil mix ( was Re: Ethanol / Methanol ( long ) ) Another field where we use kero (paraffin over here) mixed with vegoil (castor) is model aircraft diesel engines. The usual mix is 30% castor, 30% ether and 40 % paraffin. I have a good number of these engines and have been operating them for 45 years. I did some trials a year or two back and mixed 70% biodiesel with 30% ether (no oil at all). Several engines ran perfectly well on this mix
Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
Hi Jeff... These models are called diesels but do not run on Diesel fuel... I have a few. The fire off on compression as does a diesel.. the other model engines have glow plugs and run on an alchol based fuel. The diesels run on a fuel based on ether/castor oil and kerosene. Saul Jeff s wrote: hey jeffrey, i had the same question and i think there are some older air plane engines that run off diesel and i think this website even has some newer models for around 150 dollars american http://www.modelflight.com.au/rc_model_accessories/enya_15ss_deisel_control_line.htm you might have to manually type that addy into your browser...let me know what you think or what feedback you get thanks jeff From: Jeffrey Kumjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Biofuel] Model fuel Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2004 12:14:27 -0700 (PDT) Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
methanol,some oil and nitro for power. From: Saul Juliao [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel Date: Sun, 03 Oct 2004 21:45:12 -0400 Hi Jeff... These models are called diesels but do not run on Diesel fuel... I have a few. The fire off on compression as does a diesel.. the other model engines have glow plugs and run on an alchol based fuel. The diesels run on a fuel based on ether/castor oil and kerosene. Saul Jeff s wrote: hey jeffrey, i had the same question and i think there are some older air plane engines that run off diesel and i think this website even has some newer models for around 150 dollars american http://www.modelflight.com.au/rc_model_accessories/enya_15ss_deisel_control_line.htm you might have to manually type that addy into your browser...let me know what you think or what feedback you get thanks jeff From: Jeffrey Kumjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Biofuel] Model fuel Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2004 12:14:27 -0700 (PDT) Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ _ MSN Search, for accurate results! http://search.msn.nl ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
model aircraft and tiny diesel motors 45 years ago, but unlike him I don't still have them! Here's part of his reply: The Japanese produce well regarded model aircraft engines, but practically all of them are glowplug ignition running on methanol-based fuel. These are NOT suitable for biodiesel as it will not mix with the other ingredients. Model diesel engines, with a compression screw on top, are mostly made in UK (prominent makes being PAW and Irvine) and Europe (Italy, Russia, Czech). USA is way down the list but Davies Diesels offer conversion kits for many popular glow motors. In Japan, I can only think of the Enya .15 cu in. diesel and I'm not sure this is a current model. The Chinese manufacturers are known for cloning engines from all over, including some replicas of classic British diesels. Now that they have come round to understanding metallurgy (expansion, stiffness, wear properties) and the meaning of machining tolerances, these actually work pretty well, if not better than the originals. I suggest you seek out replica Oliver Tiger, Rivers Silver Arrow etc. Chinese diesels. They are 2.5 cc and there are loads of airframe designs wich will suit them. There is also an original Chinese design called Silver Swallow. The original was crap, but I have heard that they have re-vamped it to good effect. Here are some sites: http://www.flairproducts.co.uk/Engines/CS_Diesels/VintageDiesels.htm Vintage Diesel Engines http://www.progress.charitydays.co.uk/ Progress Aero Works - Precision Engineering - Home of Eifflaender's PAW diesel engines We'll get one of these diesel motors and build a plane for it, very useful for demos. Best Keith Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey Hello Jeffrey Yes. Well, mostly. From: David Teal [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 Subject: Re: [wastewatts] Kero and Vegie oil mix ( was Re: Ethanol / Methanol ( long ) ) Another field where we use kero (paraffin over here) mixed with vegoil (castor) is model aircraft diesel engines. The usual mix is 30% castor, 30% ether and 40 % paraffin. I have a good number of these engines and have been operating them for 45 years. I did some trials a year or two back and mixed 70% biodiesel with 30% ether (no oil at all). Several engines ran perfectly well on this mix with no overheating or other sign of lack of lubrication. This tends to confirm poor lubricity of 'kero'. Aeolus These are diesels. The glowplug motors (not diesels) run on methanol and a brew of other stuff, some of it not very nice. I don't know if you could substitute ethanol, but I think you'd need the other stuff anyway. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
Keith Addison wrote: These are diesels. The glowplug motors (not diesels) run on methanol and a brew of other stuff, some of it not very nice. I don't know if you could substitute ethanol, but I think you'd need the other stuff anyway. Best wishes Keith Nitromethane No, it's not very nice, but you probably could use some ethanol instead of the methanol in the mix. Some hobby shops blend their own fuel, it may be worthwhile to ask around. -- -- Martin Klingensmith http://infoarchive.net/ http://nnytech.net/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
RE: [Biofuel] Model fuel
hey jeffrey, i had the same question and i think there are some older air plane engines that run off diesel and i think this website even has some newer models for around 150 dollars american http://www.modelflight.com.au/rc_model_accessories/enya_15ss_deisel_control_line.htm you might have to manually type that addy into your browser...let me know what you think or what feedback you get thanks jeff From: Jeffrey Kumjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Biofuel] Model fuel Date: Sat, 2 Oct 2004 12:14:27 -0700 (PDT) Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ _ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
[Biofuel] Model fuel
Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
Hello Jeffrey Yes. Well, mostly. From: David Teal [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 Subject: Re: [wastewatts] Kero and Vegie oil mix ( was Re: Ethanol / Methanol ( long ) ) Another field where we use kero (paraffin over here) mixed with vegoil (castor) is model aircraft diesel engines. The usual mix is 30% castor, 30% ether and 40 % paraffin. I have a good number of these engines and have been operating them for 45 years. I did some trials a year or two back and mixed 70% biodiesel with 30% ether (no oil at all). Several engines ran perfectly well on this mix with no overheating or other sign of lack of lubrication. This tends to confirm poor lubricity of 'kero'. Aeolus These are diesels. The glowplug motors (not diesels) run on methanol and a brew of other stuff, some of it not very nice. I don't know if you could substitute ethanol, but I think you'd need the other stuff anyway. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
Re: [Biofuel] Model fuel
try some veggie with alcohol. Steve Spence http://www.green-trust.org - Original Message - From: Jeffrey Kumjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 02, 2004 3:14 PM Subject: [Biofuel] Model fuel Can you make a model aircraft engine run on biofuel? Jeffrey ___ Do you Yahoo!? Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! http://vote.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://wwia.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/biofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuel archives at Infoarchive.net (searchable): http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
