Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
John Ferree wrote: For a veggie farm. . . . http://www.flyingbeet.com/electricg/ john Such a conversion could be suitable for the VI Case sitting here in the yard. But it isn't typical of the tractors used around here. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
actually it would probably be a good fix for anything smaller than one of the little Mahindra/International type tractors as well. (older fords would be a good size fit, but i dont know what kind of attatchments are available.) From: Doug Younker [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2007 01:21:21 -0500 John Ferree wrote: For a veggie farm. . . . http://www.flyingbeet.com/electricg/ john Such a conversion could be suitable for the VI Case sitting here in the yard. But it isn't typical of the tractors used around here. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ _ Find a local pizza place, movie theater, and more .then map the best route! http://maps.live.com/default.aspx?v=2ss=yp.bars~yp.pizza~yp.movie%20theatercp=42.358996~-71.056691style=rlvl=13tilt=-90dir=0alt=-1000scene=950607encType=1FORM=MGAC01 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
For a veggie farm. . . . http://www.flyingbeet.com/electricg/ john Doug Younker wrote: Perhaps I'm reading the article too critically. Diesel tractors do not need the PTO to operate cultivation and seeding implements, that I'm aware of, so it would stand to reason an electric tractor wouldn't either. Desi el or electric a PTO will required to operate some crop harvesting implements. Yes in the past their operation was powered by the wheels of horse pulled ancestors. I would have to think their wouldn't be enough time in a 24 hour day for a modern versions of the to do the amount of work powered equipment in a much shorter, but still plenty long,work day. The AC and they hydraulics will need power, perhaps the hydraulics will provide enough heat for the cab during the winter. Certaintly they will be quieter, but hear the chirping birds quit, may be a stretch I'm sure electric tractors will have to be a part of the solution, so it will be interesting to see how they take shape and if over the road electric tractors will be developed alongside them. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
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Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
A set up similar to what diesel railroad locomotives and large earth moving dump trucks should work well in an AG setting. They use A diesel engine to turn a generator and large electric drive axles to provide locomotion. A PTO shaft will work just fine if powered by a hydraulic motor powered by another electric motor operated pump. Hydraulic motors are already used routinely to operate grain augers and other remote power applications where direct shaft PTO's are not convenient or where two implements need to be powered by the same power unit. The newest USN and Recreational Cruise ships are being constructed with electric motors instead of direct propeller shafts. They are also using revolving PODS to eliminate the need for a large underwater rudder system. Eliminating the heavy direct drive systems also removes unnecessary weight that will increase cargo capacity of the vehicles. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
Perhaps I'm reading the article too critically. Diesel tractors do not need the PTO to operate cultivation and seeding implements, that I'm aware of, so it would stand to reason an electric tractor wouldn't either. Desi el or electric a PTO will required to operate some crop harvesting implements. Yes in the past their operation was powered by the wheels of horse pulled ancestors. I would have to think their wouldn't be enough time in a 24 hour day for a modern versions of the to do the amount of work powered equipment in a much shorter, but still plenty long,work day. The AC and they hydraulics will need power, perhaps the hydraulics will provide enough heat for the cab during the winter. Certaintly they will be quieter, but hear the chirping birds quit, may be a stretch I'm sure electric tractors will have to be a part of the solution, so it will be interesting to see how they take shape and if over the road electric tractors will be developed alongside them. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
PTO IS USED during planting and cultivating. Often used to run the planter or sprayer. Larry Ruebush west central IL - Original Message - From: Doug Younker [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2007 1:00 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor Perhaps I'm reading the article too critically. Diesel tractors do not need the PTO to operate cultivation and seeding implements, that I'm aware of, so it would stand to reason an electric tractor wouldn't either. Desi el or electric a PTO will required to operate some crop harvesting implements. Yes in the past their operation was powered by the wheels of horse pulled ancestors. I would have to think their wouldn't be enough time in a 24 hour day for a modern versions of the to do the amount of work powered equipment in a much shorter, but still plenty long,work day. The AC and they hydraulics will need power, perhaps the hydraulics will provide enough heat for the cab during the winter. Certaintly they will be quieter, but hear the chirping birds quit, may be a stretch I'm sure electric tractors will have to be a part of the solution, so it will be interesting to see how they take shape and if over the road electric tractors will be developed alongside them. Doug, N0LKK Kansas USA inc. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
Larry Ruebush wrote: PTO IS USED during planting and cultivating. Often used to run the planter or sprayer. Larry Ruebush west central IL I stand corrected. I'll pay a bit more attention when my my neighbors drill in the wheat this fall. Doug, N0LKK ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] The Case for the Electric Tractor
Forwarded from another list. Here is an interesting article from Global Public Media. -- The Case for the Electric Tractor 30 Jun 2007 The Case for the Electric Tractor Christoffer Hansen and Jason Bradford Post Carbon Institute - Energy Farms Program The discourse has been heating up around biofuel for well over a year now. The classic food versus fuel debate has been engaged recently by the United Nations, while scientists, climate change experts, and farmers begin to question the scale and logistics of biofuel replacement of the current liquid fuel demand. This June, one of us (Dr. Jason Bradford) interviewed Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory staff scientist and Post Carbon Fellow David Fridley on the bi-weekly radio show the Reality Report. The topic for the interview: The Myths of Biofuels finds Bradford and Fridley engaged in a devastating analysis of the scale and logistics of replacing our current fossil fuel demand with ethanol and biodiesel. In short, a large scale industrial biofuel system will wreak havoc on the soil, require an entirely new distribution infrastructure (due to the corrosive nature of ethanol), not easily adapt to the current fleet of USA autos, will compete heavily with food production and natural ecosystems that are seen as potential cellulosic biofuel feedstocks, and will do little to actually replace the current (or future) energy demands of liquid fuel. Two weeks later, the Reality Report picked up where the Fridley show left off and we both joined Yokayo Biofuels President, Kumar Plocher on the show. The question was: If biofuel is not going to be sustainable on a large industrial scale, then would a local biofuel system be an appropriate response to the limitations of long-distance transport and petrol dependent methods of cultivation and processing of biofuel? If biofuel is produced for local consumption how much land would be needed, what crops would be used, and how would they be processed? Again, simple math painted a picture of an inflated hope and hype. We ran the numbers and with the 35,000 acres (14,000 hectares) of remaining prime farm land in Mendocino County approximately 84,900 acres (34,000 ha) would be needed to replace current county diesel consumption if canola was used as the prime feedstock. Additionally, approximately 231,100 acres (94,000 ha) of farm land would be needed to replace the current gasoline consumption with corn-based ethanol. It doesn't really matter much which crops, or combination of crops, are considered--the land base isn't available to support a biofuel industry even on a local scale that meets current fuel demand. These analyses also absurdly assume the use of all agricultural land for fuel production, leaving no room for food! This is unconscionable and not the direction that any serious farmer or environmentaly aware person desires to advocate. As the hype around biofuel already begins to dissipate, serious researchers and planners are advocating curtailment of long distance transport and the adoption of electric vehicles as one of the most sustainable options to replace the work and carbon footprint of the internal combustion engines. Vegetable oils and ethanol are useful products and should not be omitted from agricultural production, but their uses require further consideration. Why do we have to burn these useful feedstocks when they have multiple alternate uses? Should biodiesel production be limited to the reuse of waste food oil? In an article published by AlterNet, David Morris from the Institute of Local Self Reliance makes two important observations related to the uses of vegetable oils and plant-based sugars that are consistent with the position of the Local Energy Farm Program. Morris suggests that human nutrition is the highest use of plants, followed by medicinal uses and possibly clothing [and…] we should first use biomass to substitute for industrial products that use fossil fuels rather than for the fuels themselves. [W]hile there is insufficient biomass to displace a majority of fuels; there is a sufficient quantity to displace up to 100 percent of our petroleum and natural gas-derived chemicals and products. And these are much higher value products. Additionally, he recognizes that: Electricity, not biofuel, will be the primary energy source [note: we consider electricity an energy carrier, with wind, solar radiation, etc. being renewable sources] for an oil-free and sustainable transportation system. But biofuel can play an important role in this future as energy sources for backup engines that can significantly reduce battery costs and extend driving range. While biofuel might remain a short-term transition technology, it is being recklessly advocated by the United States Senate as a panacea for the liquid fuel appetite. One response is to advocate appropriate uses of biofuel, including its role in agriculture. Another is to adapt to new information
