Re: [Biofuel] Vaporized gasoline engines work as proven to the world by Shell Oil Company in 1973
How does one vaporize all the different components in today's gasoline? Don't all those additives and stuff complicate the situation? John Mike Pelly wrote: We did tests on Vaporized Gasoline carburation on a datsun/nissan 510 and the gas milage results were not all that impressive. We were not able to do any kind of test on a track or somewhere where we could drive flat and straight on a carefully measured amount of gas. In our estimate on our most careful test at the time (1992), we ended up getting about 35mpg on a car that normally got about 28. When doing this test we had (at times) everything dialed in and were able to maintain the proper temperatures and the Exhaust smelled exactly like the exhaust from a Propane Powered Vehicle (this car did not have any cataletic converter on it either. Other times while doing this same test, we did not have our temperatures correct and the car was belching copious amounts of black exhaust (unburned gasoline) and was running like crap. In writing my original paper back in 1992 I recommended this technology would work best in a toyota prius type 'hybrid-electric' car (this was before they even were building the prius) or a stationary gas powered generator. The prius type drive train would work the best because it is easy to maintain an engine RPM range like 2000-2500RPMs somewhere making it easyest to regulate the exhaust heat and fuel pressure/volume and not have the problems we faced with a conventional engine where the RPMs can continually jump from say 500RMP at idle to 4000 for acceleration and back to 1000 for braking or shifting gears, continually. My paper with photos and schematics is written under 'Nom de Plume' of, Frieda Mind and can be found at www.ByronWine.com site: http://www.ByronWine.com/files/1992%20vapor.pdf the paper includes all the information one would ever need to design and build a vaporized gasoline system for a prius type hybrid engine drivetrain. The affirmation for anyone who still doubts this technology, should come from that 1959 Opel that got 376 MPGs back in 1973 and reported in the Febuary 20, 2008 'Seattle PI' newspaper found at this link; http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/351903_needle20.html The tests on this 59 Opel were sponsored by Shell Oil. Granted the car was gutted of many parts and was only going 30 miles per hour on a track But it did get 376mpg! not 75, 100, or 200mpg. It got 376mpgs! This is 7 times the gas milege of a standard Prius, our current state of the art in drive train configurations. My hope is that home inventors will Very Carefully!!! experiment with this technology and build their own versions, even if only on a stationary generator and share their findings. This will help pull this technology out of the locked file cases the car and oil companies have held it in for too long now and out into the spot lights so we can shame the car and oil companies into utilizing this technology Finally! We all need to take some concrete steps towards addressing Global Climate Changes. This advancement would be similar to what thousands of biodiesel homebrewers have been able to do over the past 10 years in making biodiesel a product consumers are now very aware of and demanding to have available to them. Nuff said, Sincerely, Mike __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 3057 (20080426) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Vaporized gasoline engines work as proven to the world by Shell Oil Company in 1973
The level of unburned hydrocarbons in the exhaust tells you beyond a shadow of a doubt whether more perfect combustion can help. Period- the end. No amount of claims and mouse milk can alter this fact - which should be intuitively obvious. Modern engines combust quite well. Kirk John Mullan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How does one vaporize all the different components in today's gasoline? Don't all those additives and stuff complicate the situation? John Mike Pelly wrote: We did tests on Vaporized Gasoline carburation on a datsun/nissan 510 and the gas milage results were not all that impressive. We were not able to do any kind of test on a track or somewhere where we could drive flat and straight on a carefully measured amount of gas. In our estimate on our most careful test at the time (1992), we ended up getting about 35mpg on a car that normally got about 28. When doing this test we had (at times) everything dialed in and were able to maintain the proper temperatures and the Exhaust smelled exactly like the exhaust from a Propane Powered Vehicle (this car did not have any cataletic converter on it either. Other times while doing this same test, we did not have our temperatures correct and the car was belching copious amounts of black exhaust (unburned gasoline) and was running like crap. In writing my original paper back in 1992 I recommended this technology would work best in a toyota prius type 'hybrid-electric' car (this was before they even were building the prius) or a stationary gas powered generator. The prius type drive train would work the best because it is easy to maintain an engine RPM range like 2000-2500RPMs somewhere making it easyest to regulate the exhaust heat and fuel pressure/volume and not have the problems we faced with a conventional engine where the RPMs can continually jump from say 500RMP at idle to 4000 for acceleration and back to 1000 for braking or shifting gears, continually. My paper with photos and schematics is written under 'Nom de Plume' of, Frieda Mind and can be found at www.ByronWine.com site: http://www.ByronWine.com/files/1992%20vapor.pdf the paper includes all the information one would ever need to design and build a vaporized gasoline system for a prius type hybrid engine drivetrain. The affirmation for anyone who still doubts this technology, should come from that 1959 Opel that got 376 MPGs back in 1973 and reported in the Febuary 20, 2008 'Seattle PI' newspaper found at this link; http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/351903_needle20.html The tests on this 59 Opel were sponsored by Shell Oil. Granted the car was gutted of many parts and was only going 30 miles per hour on a track But it did get 376mpg! not 75, 100, or 200mpg. It got 376mpgs! This is 7 times the gas milege of a standard Prius, our current state of the art in drive train configurations. My hope is that home inventors will Very Carefully!!! experiment with this technology and build their own versions, even if only on a stationary generator and share their findings. This will help pull this technology out of the locked file cases the car and oil companies have held it in for too long now and out into the spot lights so we can shame the car and oil companies into utilizing this technology Finally! We all need to take some concrete steps towards addressing Global Climate Changes. This advancement would be similar to what thousands of biodiesel homebrewers have been able to do over the past 10 years in making biodiesel a product consumers are now very aware of and demanding to have available to them. Nuff said, Sincerely, Mike __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 3057 (20080426) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: /pipermail/attachments/20080427/7649fbbb/attachment.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Re: [Biofuel] Vaporized gasoline engines work as proven to the world by Shell Oil Company in 1973
Most all of the components do vaporized given enough heat. We heated to about 300F degrees but did find some nasty looking residues still remaining in the trap afterwards. Always was curious as to what these were. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Mullan Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 4:30 AM To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Vaporized gasoline engines work as proven to the world by Shell Oil Company in 1973 How does one vaporize all the different components in today's gasoline? Don't all those additives and stuff complicate the situation? John Mike Pelly wrote: We did tests on Vaporized Gasoline carburation on a datsun/nissan 510 and the gas milage results were not all that impressive. We were not able to do any kind of test on a track or somewhere where we could drive flat and straight on a carefully measured amount of gas. In our estimate on our most careful test at the time (1992), we ended up getting about 35mpg on a car that normally got about 28. When doing this test we had (at times) everything dialed in and were able to maintain the proper temperatures and the Exhaust smelled exactly like the exhaust from a Propane Powered Vehicle (this car did not have any cataletic converter on it either. Other times while doing this same test, we did not have our temperatures correct and the car was belching copious amounts of black exhaust (unburned gasoline) and was running like crap. In writing my original paper back in 1992 I recommended this technology would work best in a toyota prius type 'hybrid-electric' car (this was before they even were building the prius) or a stationary gas powered generator. The prius type drive train would work the best because it is easy to maintain an engine RPM range like 2000-2500RPMs somewhere making it easyest to regulate the exhaust heat and fuel pressure/volume and not have the problems we faced with a conventional engine where the RPMs can continually jump from say 500RMP at idle to 4000 for acceleration and back to 1000 for braking or shifting gears, continually. My paper with photos and schematics is written under 'Nom de Plume' of, Frieda Mind and can be found at www.ByronWine.com site: http://www.ByronWine.com/files/1992%20vapor.pdf the paper includes all the information one would ever need to design and build a vaporized gasoline system for a prius type hybrid engine drivetrain. The affirmation for anyone who still doubts this technology, should come from that 1959 Opel that got 376 MPGs back in 1973 and reported in the Febuary 20, 2008 'Seattle PI' newspaper found at this link; http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/351903_needle20.html The tests on this 59 Opel were sponsored by Shell Oil. Granted the car was gutted of many parts and was only going 30 miles per hour on a track But it did get 376mpg! not 75, 100, or 200mpg. It got 376mpgs! This is 7 times the gas milege of a standard Prius, our current state of the art in drive train configurations. My hope is that home inventors will Very Carefully!!! experiment with this technology and build their own versions, even if only on a stationary generator and share their findings. This will help pull this technology out of the locked file cases the car and oil companies have held it in for too long now and out into the spot lights so we can shame the car and oil companies into utilizing this technology Finally! We all need to take some concrete steps towards addressing Global Climate Changes. This advancement would be similar to what thousands of biodiesel homebrewers have been able to do over the past 10 years in making biodiesel a product consumers are now very aware of and demanding to have available to them. Nuff said, Sincerely, Mike __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 3057 (20080426) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database
Re: [Biofuel] Vaporized gasoline engines work as proven to the world by Shell Oil Company in 1973
Same reason JPL abandoned the hydrogen assist to complete combustion. Some of the gas was cracked to make hydrogen to propagate flame when the gasoline was too lean to burn by itself. You get lots of crud quickly. Kirk Mike Pelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Most all of the components do vaporized given enough heat. We heated to about 300F degrees but did find some nasty looking residues still remaining in the trap afterwards. Always was curious as to what these were. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of John Mullan Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 4:30 AM To: sustainablelorgbiofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Vaporized gasoline engines work as proven to the world by Shell Oil Company in 1973 How does one vaporize all the different components in today's gasoline? Don't all those additives and stuff complicate the situation? John Mike Pelly wrote: We did tests on Vaporized Gasoline carburation on a datsun/nissan 510 and the gas milage results were not all that impressive. We were not able to do any kind of test on a track or somewhere where we could drive flat and straight on a carefully measured amount of gas. In our estimate on our most careful test at the time (1992), we ended up getting about 35mpg on a car that normally got about 28. When doing this test we had (at times) everything dialed in and were able to maintain the proper temperatures and the Exhaust smelled exactly like the exhaust from a Propane Powered Vehicle (this car did not have any cataletic converter on it either. Other times while doing this same test, we did not have our temperatures correct and the car was belching copious amounts of black exhaust (unburned gasoline) and was running like crap. In writing my original paper back in 1992 I recommended this technology would work best in a toyota prius type 'hybrid-electric' car (this was before they even were building the prius) or a stationary gas powered generator. The prius type drive train would work the best because it is easy to maintain an engine RPM range like 2000-2500RPMs somewhere making it easyest to regulate the exhaust heat and fuel pressure/volume and not have the problems we faced with a conventional engine where the RPMs can continually jump from say 500RMP at idle to 4000 for acceleration and back to 1000 for braking or shifting gears, continually. My paper with photos and schematics is written under 'Nom de Plume' of, Frieda Mind and can be found at www.ByronWine.com site: http://www.ByronWine.com/files/1992%20vapor.pdf the paper includes all the information one would ever need to design and build a vaporized gasoline system for a prius type hybrid engine drivetrain. The affirmation for anyone who still doubts this technology, should come from that 1959 Opel that got 376 MPGs back in 1973 and reported in the Febuary 20, 2008 'Seattle PI' newspaper found at this link; http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/351903_needle20.html The tests on this 59 Opel were sponsored by Shell Oil. Granted the car was gutted of many parts and was only going 30 miles per hour on a track But it did get 376mpg! not 75, 100, or 200mpg. It got 376mpgs! This is 7 times the gas milege of a standard Prius, our current state of the art in drive train configurations. My hope is that home inventors will Very Carefully!!! experiment with this technology and build their own versions, even if only on a stationary generator and share their findings. This will help pull this technology out of the locked file cases the car and oil companies have held it in for too long now and out into the spot lights so we can shame the car and oil companies into utilizing this technology Finally! We all need to take some concrete steps towards addressing Global Climate Changes. This advancement would be similar to what thousands of biodiesel homebrewers have been able to do over the past 10 years in making biodiesel a product consumers are now very aware of and demanding to have available to them. Nuff said, Sincerely, Mike __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 3057 (20080426) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and
Re: [Biofuel] Vaporized gasoline engines work as proven to the world by Shell Oil Company in 1973
Mike, I thought that di (direct injection) was the most efficient because the cylinder is loaded with 100% air, then the fuel is added after the valves close, increasing the volumetric efficiency. The new di petrol Peugeots VWs use this technology. (I don't know how they stop the knocks: perhaps they inject gradually as the fuel burns?) I admit I didn't read your paper, but I guess the vapour is added to the inletted air? I feel this would not be as efficient as a di engine. My explanation for this is that an internal combustion engine is just a heat pump: the nitrogen expands when heated, performing the work. The combustion merely generates the heat that makes the inert gases expand (which is why cars go better in dense cool air) would you mind commenting on my assumptions? regards Doug On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 08:59:36 Mike Pelly wrote: We did tests on Vaporized Gasoline carburation on a datsun/nissan 510 and the gas milage results were not all that impressive. We were not able to do any kind of test on a track or somewhere where we could drive flat and straight on a carefully measured amount of gas. In our estimate on our most careful test at the time (1992), we ended up getting about 35mpg on a car that normally got about 28. When doing this test we had (at times) everything dialed in and were able to maintain the proper temperatures and the Exhaust smelled exactly like the exhaust from a Propane Powered Vehicle (this car did not have any cataletic converter on it either. Other times while doing this same test, we did not have our temperatures correct and the car was belching copious amounts of black exhaust (unburned gasoline) and was running like crap. In writing my original paper back in 1992 I recommended this technology would work best in a toyota prius type 'hybrid-electric' car (this was before they even were building the prius) or a stationary gas powered generator. The prius type drive train would work the best because it is easy to maintain an engine RPM range like 2000-2500RPMs somewhere making it easyest to regulate the exhaust heat and fuel pressure/volume and not have the problems we faced with a conventional engine where the RPMs can continually jump from say 500RMP at idle to 4000 for acceleration and back to 1000 for braking or shifting gears, continually. My paper with photos and schematics is written under 'Nom de Plume' of, Frieda Mind and can be found at www.ByronWine.com site: http://www.ByronWine.com/files/1992%20vapor.pdf the paper includes all the information one would ever need to design and build a vaporized gasoline system for a prius type hybrid engine drivetrain. The affirmation for anyone who still doubts this technology, should come from that 1959 Opel that got 376 MPGs back in 1973 and reported in the Febuary 20, 2008 'Seattle PI' newspaper found at this link; http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/351903_needle20.html The tests on this 59 Opel were sponsored by Shell Oil. Granted the car was gutted of many parts and was only going 30 miles per hour on a track But it did get 376mpg! not 75, 100, or 200mpg. It got 376mpgs! This is 7 times the gas milege of a standard Prius, our current state of the art in drive train configurations. My hope is that home inventors will Very Carefully!!! experiment with this technology and build their own versions, even if only on a stationary generator and share their findings. This will help pull this technology out of the locked file cases the car and oil companies have held it in for too long now and out into the spot lights so we can shame the car and oil companies into utilizing this technology Finally! We all need to take some concrete steps towards addressing Global Climate Changes. This advancement would be similar to what thousands of biodiesel homebrewers have been able to do over the past 10 years in making biodiesel a product consumers are now very aware of and demanding to have available to them. Nuff said, Sincerely, Mike __ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 3057 (20080426) __ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/sustainablelorgbiofuel Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (70,000 messages):
