Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] Opentrail - What development environments would be best for mobile compatibility?
Not if you want to make a better map for OSM. Well, if your definition of better includes open, then no. I'm afraid that the number of people using iPhones will be quite small compared to normal phones, no matter how much you want it. Perhaps it's the £1000 you have to shell out. exactly. For phones: Exactly. If the application is aimed at the mass market / normal people, then go for what most phones have. java (j2me) If the application is aimed at techies then go for something that more techies are likely to have - possibly S60/90/python, and then you can leverage some increased technology but sacrifice numbers of users Just have a look at existing mobile phone software and see what they offer, the commercial efforts extend out with multiple formats to cover as many phones as possible, but they all seem to support j2me. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] Opentrail - What development environments would be best for mobile compatibility?
On Sat, Jan 26, 2008 at 12:29:33AM +0100, Frederik Ramm wrote: Well, if your definition of better includes open, then no. Sometimes when talking about OSM I say provocatively that we're so ruthlessly pragmatic that we would even switch to Oracle if someone gave us the stuff for free and it worked better than what we currently have. First, I don't think that attitude is prevalent in OSM. For example every potential data source gets scrutinized for openess nearly to Debian like levels. And secondly, even if it is so for the community at large, it is not why I personally am attracted to this project. If I were pragmatic I would just use google maps... Nick's comment is in sync with that and it has a certain appeal; focusing too much on open sometimes makes you a grumpy ideologist. So be it then :) On the other hand, being one of the old(er) school hackers myself, I am often irritated at the warm embrace that Apple get from large parts of what I used to consider a critical geek community. At the 24c3 in December, an awful lot of hackers were seen with Mac notebooks, and not even with Linux on them - they seem to have no issue with every second application offering you to shop directly from the file menu, plus generously phoning home about all sorts of things you do. But then this is the generation that blogs and twitters and plazes... maybe, and I don't mean this in a rhetorical sense, maybe my generation has simply overrated privacy. I wouldn't mind the shop menu if their software didn't suck so much... Which unfortunatly it does in large amounts. Europe UK : This week Nokia announced that the N95 handset, noted for its next-generation services including GPS, has sold a million units. This amounts to a significant success for a Smartphone in the UK market. Well, that's a significant body of potential mappers there... cu bart ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] Opentrail - What development environments would be best for mobile compatibility?
bvh wrote: On Sat, Jan 26, 2008 at 12:29:33AM +0100, Frederik Ramm wrote: Well, if your definition of better includes open, then no. Sometimes when talking about OSM I say provocatively that we're so ruthlessly pragmatic that we would even switch to Oracle if someone gave us the stuff for free and it worked better than what we currently have. First, I don't think that attitude is prevalent in OSM. For example every potential data source gets scrutinized for openess nearly to Debian like levels. Sure, but it's possible to be an open geodata kind of guy without being a free software kind of guy. Just because I'm insistent about the cleanliness of our map data doesn't mean I want to give up my Mac and all the lovely closed-source software on it. cheers Richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] Opentrail - What development environments would be best for mobile compatibility?
On Sat, Jan 26, 2008 at 11:20:52AM +, Richard Fairhurst wrote: Sure, but it's possible to be an open geodata kind of guy without being a free software kind of guy. Just because I'm insistent about the cleanliness of our map data doesn't mean I want to give up my Mac and all the lovely closed-source software on it. That is a strawman : I never suggested you should give up your Mac and associated software, just that it is an odd advice to steer other people towards it in the context of an open project. Moreover, I don't think your position is internally consistent. The data is nearly useless without the programs to do something interesting with it. What good would it be for the geo data to be open if the preferred way of accessing it is closed? Then you can just as well use the lovely google maps on your iphone and be done with it. cu bart ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] Opentrail - What development environments would be best for mobile compatibility?
bvh wrote: Moreover, I don't think your position is internally consistent. The data is nearly useless without the programs to do something interesting with it. What good would it be for the geo data to be open if the preferred way of accessing it is closed? I think preferred is the key. OSM's a broad church and, most of the time, there is no preferred way: we don't turn people away because they choose to use closed source software, closed formats or whatever. For example, we are, by open project standards, very welcoming towards those who use Windows. cheers Richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] Opentrail - What development environments would be best for mobile compatibility?
Hi, Well, if your definition of better includes open, then no. Sometimes when talking about OSM I say provocatively that we're so ruthlessly pragmatic that we would even switch to Oracle if someone gave us the stuff for free and it worked better than what we currently have. Nick's comment is in sync with that and it has a certain appeal; focusing too much on open sometimes makes you a grumpy ideologist. On the other hand, being one of the old(er) school hackers myself, I am often irritated at the warm embrace that Apple get from large parts of what I used to consider a critical geek community. At the 24c3 in December, an awful lot of hackers were seen with Mac notebooks, and not even with Linux on them - they seem to have no issue with every second application offering you to shop directly from the file menu, plus generously phoning home about all sorts of things you do. But then this is the generation that blogs and twitters and plazes... maybe, and I don't mean this in a rhetorical sense, maybe my generation has simply overrated privacy. But I digress. But what's the actual penetration of devices with GPS onboard? No idea, but I would certainly be interested in some numbers. IIRC there was some press blurb in dec 2007 about 1 million N95's sold? Yes, here: http://www.3g.co.uk/PR/Dec2007/5492.htm Europe UK : This week Nokia announced that the N95 handset, noted for its next-generation services including GPS, has sold a million units. This amounts to a significant success for a Smartphone in the UK market. Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail [EMAIL PROTECTED] ## N49°00.09' E008°23.33' ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-dev] Opentrail - What development environments would be best for mobile compatibility?
On Fri, Jan 25, 2008 at 04:29:55PM +, Nick Black wrote: Odd advice from a mailing list of an _open_ source/data/whatever project. Not if you want to make a better map for OSM. Well, if your definition of better includes open, then no. a better perspective. At least for that one there are already devices out there with built in GPS... But then you loose some of the But what's the actual penetration of devices with GPS onboard? No idea, but I would certainly be interested in some numbers. IIRC there was some press blurb in dec 2007 about 1 million N95's sold? cu bart ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
