Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
On 29 May 2008, at 10:35, Andy Robinson (blackadder-lists) wrote: Steve Chilton wrote: Sent: 28 May 2008 10:01 PM To: Beau Gunderson Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik See example from UK: http://dev.openstreetmap.org/~steve8/borders.jpg Border between countries England and Scotland is one way (actually probably several ways), tagged admin_level=2. Border between counties Cumbria and Northumberland is another way/ s, tagged admin_level=6. Implicitly the country border is part of the collection of ways that make up the Cumbria county border. There is only one border there, and there only needs to be one way. NB: If you want polygons for areas you probably have to post- process the data to compile them or use relations to group them. This issue comes up with quite a lot of tags. Bus routes for instance where you have more than one route reference running along the same way. In that instance I use a | between each route reference, could we not do the same for admin_level data? ie add all the numbers that are relevant, because in some cases perhaps lower ones do not exist for the location. I would have thought that bus routes would have been done by relations, with one or more relations for the whole route. It is then up to the renderer to deal with the relations appropriately. This means that you can enter more specific information about each route as part of the relation tags. It is highly unlikely that a bus route will go the same route for the whole route. Shaun ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
Steve Chilton wrote: Sent: 28 May 2008 10:01 PM To: Beau Gunderson Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik See example from UK: http://dev.openstreetmap.org/~steve8/borders.jpg Border between countries England and Scotland is one way (actually probably several ways), tagged admin_level=2. Border between counties Cumbria and Northumberland is another way/s, tagged admin_level=6. Implicitly the country border is part of the collection of ways that make up the Cumbria county border. There is only one border there, and there only needs to be one way. NB: If you want polygons for areas you probably have to post-process the data to compile them or use relations to group them. This issue comes up with quite a lot of tags. Bus routes for instance where you have more than one route reference running along the same way. In that instance I use a | between each route reference, could we not do the same for admin_level data? ie add all the numbers that are relevant, because in some cases perhaps lower ones do not exist for the location. Cheers Andy Cheers STEVE -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Beau Gunderson Sent: Wed 5/28/2008 9:14 PM To: Steve Chilton Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik Please clarify one thing: any border that is both a state and national border should be tagged at the highest level (in this case national, admin_level=2) To me this sounds like there is just one way for the state/national border... but... and the state borders will come in too, with their appropriate style. This sounds like there are two ways, one for the state border and one for the national border. This seems to make the most sense to me given the second sentence quoted above. Beau On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 2:06 PM, Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Logically, any border that is both a state and national border should be tagged at the highest level (in this case national, admin_level=2). Similarly in UK any border that is both county and country should be tagged at highest level (country, admin_level=2). That way all the country borders will show at designated zoom levels. When you move to a level that state (or whatever) comes in the country border will already be there (in its appropriate style) and the state borders will come in too, with their appropriate style. Currently there is an /Else filter which picks up borders that have no admin_level set, but it necessarily doesn't come in till higher zooms, which appears to the case for your example below. Cheers STEVE -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Beau Gunderson Sent: Wed 5/28/2008 8:42 PM To: Steve Chilton Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik The US national border with Canada is all tagged with admin_level=4, border_type=state, border=administrative... It also has the left/right countries (at least the bit I looked at in WA did). How should state borders that are also national borders be tagged? Does setting admin_level=2 fix the whole problem? As you can see, they're not currently visible at low zooms: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.83lon=- 118.46zoom=7layers=B00FF Beau On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 1:21 PM, Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The latest mapnik stylesheet has the National borders moved from coming in at z10 to coming in at z7. Now zooms to z6 show the borders as thin blue lines taken from the shape files, and then switch to OSM data at z7 using a slightly thicker purple line. Not all borders show, for one of two reasons - either they are not digitised or are not tagged appropriately. So, it would be useful if folk have a look at their own country/area at z7. Does in show correctly? If not: 1 - check whether it has been digitised. If not - is there a valid, non-copyrighted source for putting in the border alignment. 2 - check whether it is tagged boundary=administrative, admin_level=2. If not - change the tagging to that so that it may show. As a reminder, admin boundaries should be tagged for the admin_level that they are (at the highest level). Country/national borders are always admin_level=2. Internal borders should be tagged according to the suggested schema
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
In message !!AAAuAOKaD4mR3JBOrEpRon92nMgBANp/[EMAIL PROTECTED] Andy Robinson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This issue comes up with quite a lot of tags. Bus routes for instance where you have more than one route reference running along the same way. In that instance I use a | between each route reference, could we not do the same for admin_level data? ie add all the numbers that are relevant, because in some cases perhaps lower ones do not exist for the location. Well using ';' is more normal for such things, and people have indeed been doing that for admin_level. The problem is that it breaks the mapnik rendering as I understand things because osm2pgsql is only able to import one number into the database and depending on the version you have I believe it either fails completely on such multi-valued tags or just imports the first value and ignores the rest. What it should probably do in this case is to find the lowest value and import that, as mapnik will want to render the border in the most significant style. That might be expensive though. Tom -- Tom Hughes ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) http://www.compton.nu/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
The US national border with Canada is all tagged with admin_level=4, border_type=state, border=administrative... It also has the left/right countries (at least the bit I looked at in WA did). How should state borders that are also national borders be tagged? Does setting admin_level=2 fix the whole problem? As you can see, they're not currently visible at low zooms: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.83lon=-118.46zoom=7layers=B00FF Beau On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 1:21 PM, Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The latest mapnik stylesheet has the National borders moved from coming in at z10 to coming in at z7. Now zooms to z6 show the borders as thin blue lines taken from the shape files, and then switch to OSM data at z7 using a slightly thicker purple line. Not all borders show, for one of two reasons - either they are not digitised or are not tagged appropriately. So, it would be useful if folk have a look at their own country/area at z7. Does in show correctly? If not: 1 - check whether it has been digitised. If not - is there a valid, non-copyrighted source for putting in the border alignment. 2 - check whether it is tagged boundary=administrative, admin_level=2. If not - change the tagging to that so that it may show. As a reminder, admin boundaries should be tagged for the admin_level that they are (at the highest level). Country/national borders are always admin_level=2. Internal borders should be tagged according to the suggested schema for that particular country. Details are on the wiki at: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Key:boundary which also explains the accepted way to tag for the countries on either side of the border. Cheers STEVE ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 3:42 PM, Beau Gunderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The US national border with Canada is all tagged with admin_level=4, border_type=state, border=administrative... It also has the left/right countries (at least the bit I looked at in WA did). How should state borders that are also national borders be tagged? I believe those were all imported from the TIGER polygon data, so they were just state borders originally. The ways might need some massaging to make a continuous national border. -Ted ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
Gotcha... I guess my question is this: Does it matter if all of those US states don't have a state border way at the top and there's just one long continuous national border? Or should those borders be left the way they are, duplicated, the duplicates combined and then a national border made from that, so that there are state borders and the national border way next to (or on top of) each other? Beau On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 1:49 PM, Ted Mielczarek [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 3:42 PM, Beau Gunderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The US national border with Canada is all tagged with admin_level=4, border_type=state, border=administrative... It also has the left/right countries (at least the bit I looked at in WA did). How should state borders that are also national borders be tagged? I believe those were all imported from the TIGER polygon data, so they were just state borders originally. The ways might need some massaging to make a continuous national border. -Ted ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
Logically, any border that is both a state and national border should be tagged at the highest level (in this case national, admin_level=2). Similarly in UK any border that is both county and country should be tagged at highest level (country, admin_level=2). That way all the country borders will show at designated zoom levels. When you move to a level that state (or whatever) comes in the country border will already be there (in its appropriate style) and the state borders will come in too, with their appropriate style. Currently there is an /Else filter which picks up borders that have no admin_level set, but it necessarily doesn't come in till higher zooms, which appears to the case for your example below. Cheers STEVE -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Beau Gunderson Sent: Wed 5/28/2008 8:42 PM To: Steve Chilton Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik The US national border with Canada is all tagged with admin_level=4, border_type=state, border=administrative... It also has the left/right countries (at least the bit I looked at in WA did). How should state borders that are also national borders be tagged? Does setting admin_level=2 fix the whole problem? As you can see, they're not currently visible at low zooms: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.83lon=-118.46zoom=7layers=B00FF Beau On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 1:21 PM, Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The latest mapnik stylesheet has the National borders moved from coming in at z10 to coming in at z7. Now zooms to z6 show the borders as thin blue lines taken from the shape files, and then switch to OSM data at z7 using a slightly thicker purple line. Not all borders show, for one of two reasons - either they are not digitised or are not tagged appropriately. So, it would be useful if folk have a look at their own country/area at z7. Does in show correctly? If not: 1 - check whether it has been digitised. If not - is there a valid, non-copyrighted source for putting in the border alignment. 2 - check whether it is tagged boundary=administrative, admin_level=2. If not - change the tagging to that so that it may show. As a reminder, admin boundaries should be tagged for the admin_level that they are (at the highest level). Country/national borders are always admin_level=2. Internal borders should be tagged according to the suggested schema for that particular country. Details are on the wiki at: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Key:boundary which also explains the accepted way to tag for the countries on either side of the border. Cheers STEVE ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
Please clarify one thing: any border that is both a state and national border should be tagged at the highest level (in this case national, admin_level=2) To me this sounds like there is just one way for the state/national border... but... and the state borders will come in too, with their appropriate style. This sounds like there are two ways, one for the state border and one for the national border. This seems to make the most sense to me given the second sentence quoted above. Beau On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 2:06 PM, Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Logically, any border that is both a state and national border should be tagged at the highest level (in this case national, admin_level=2). Similarly in UK any border that is both county and country should be tagged at highest level (country, admin_level=2). That way all the country borders will show at designated zoom levels. When you move to a level that state (or whatever) comes in the country border will already be there (in its appropriate style) and the state borders will come in too, with their appropriate style. Currently there is an /Else filter which picks up borders that have no admin_level set, but it necessarily doesn't come in till higher zooms, which appears to the case for your example below. Cheers STEVE -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Beau Gunderson Sent: Wed 5/28/2008 8:42 PM To: Steve Chilton Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik The US national border with Canada is all tagged with admin_level=4, border_type=state, border=administrative... It also has the left/right countries (at least the bit I looked at in WA did). How should state borders that are also national borders be tagged? Does setting admin_level=2 fix the whole problem? As you can see, they're not currently visible at low zooms: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=48.83lon=-118.46zoom=7layers=B00FF Beau On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 1:21 PM, Steve Chilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The latest mapnik stylesheet has the National borders moved from coming in at z10 to coming in at z7. Now zooms to z6 show the borders as thin blue lines taken from the shape files, and then switch to OSM data at z7 using a slightly thicker purple line. Not all borders show, for one of two reasons - either they are not digitised or are not tagged appropriately. So, it would be useful if folk have a look at their own country/area at z7. Does in show correctly? If not: 1 - check whether it has been digitised. If not - is there a valid, non-copyrighted source for putting in the border alignment. 2 - check whether it is tagged boundary=administrative, admin_level=2. If not - change the tagging to that so that it may show. As a reminder, admin boundaries should be tagged for the admin_level that they are (at the highest level). Country/national borders are always admin_level=2. Internal borders should be tagged according to the suggested schema for that particular country. Details are on the wiki at: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Key:boundary which also explains the accepted way to tag for the countries on either side of the border. Cheers STEVE ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] National borders - mapnik
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 4:14 PM, Beau Gunderson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Please clarify one thing: any border that is both a state and national border should be tagged at the highest level (in this case national, admin_level=2) To me this sounds like there is just one way for the state/national border... but... and the state borders will come in too, with their appropriate style. This sounds like there are two ways, one for the state border and one for the national border. This seems to make the most sense to me given the second sentence quoted above. The US state borders are already split into multiple ways, since they all would have been 250 nodes otherwise. It shouldn't be a problem to further modify them to make parts of them national borders instead. Just make sure to keep the left:state/right:state tags as appropriate. I would agree with Steve that if someone wants to use them as polygons, they should be post-processing anyway. (Or just using the original TIGER data, which is shapefiles.) -Ted ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/talk
