Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Ben Laenenbenlae...@gmail.com wrote: MP wrote: So currently, if I want to know how was the way drawn in time T, I had to get history of the way, then find out which nodes were used by the way in time T, then get history from each of the nodes and pick appropriate node from the history, given the time. Then combine this into output XML which I can view Is there some automated tool that will do that? Now, what I really want to see here is something similar, but for relations: being able to ask for a certain version of a relation from the history and seeing how it looked back then with its members also like they were at that time. But remember that the nodes in way change, and the positions of the nodes change, without the version number of the relation incrementing. So you don't really want a system that shows you what the relation X version Y looks like, you want relation X timestamp T. Does anyone want to propose a moniker for point releases of objects i.e. all the variations in a object over time that occur between version increments on the object itself? Cheers, Andy If someone edits some roads nowadays and doesn't see that there are route relations on the roads you could end up easily with a situation where it's virtually impossible to know how the route was going, because ways were moved, merged, and deleted, and the list of way ids you get from the history is not helping a bit. The only option would then be to search for and contact the person who created that route there and hope that he's still active in OSM and still has his notes somewhere so he can retag that route. If not, then the only option to fix something is to resurvey, and that seems like a waist of time given that the information is in the database. Ben ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
On 14 Jun 2009, at 01:49, Frederik Ramm wrote: Hi, There are no full history dumps currently - having such dump would enable this type of query quite easily. I am sure we will have them at some point in time. Well, there could be slight problem with pre-0.6 data (no order in relations) and pre-0.5 (extra segment elements in addition to nodes and ways) Way history was completely dropped on the 0.4 to 0.5 changeover so you will not be able to access any way data before that. so this maybe need some conversions. I am not sure what was before 0.4 (could be some problems too...) The 0.3 to 0.4 changeover did not, to my knowledge, drop any data. And before 0.3 OSM was so small that whatever was there at the time can safely be ignored ;-) I look forward to API 0.9 where we can say And before 0.6 OSM was so small that whatever was there at the time can safely be ignored ;-) Best Steve ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
MP wrote: So currently, if I want to know how was the way drawn in time T, I had to get history of the way, then find out which nodes were used by the way in time T, then get history from each of the nodes and pick appropriate node from the history, given the time. Then combine this into output XML which I can view Is there some automated tool that will do that? Ahem, Potlatch. Doesn't have any truck with any of this XML crap though. ;) cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/full-history-of-a-way--tp24016602p24019387.html Sent from the OpenStreetMap - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
Hi, There are no full history dumps currently - having such dump would enable this type of query quite easily. I am sure we will have them at some point in time. Well, there could be slight problem with pre-0.6 data (no order in relations) and pre-0.5 (extra segment elements in addition to nodes and ways) Way history was completely dropped on the 0.4 to 0.5 changeover so you will not be able to access any way data before that. so this maybe need some conversions. I am not sure what was before 0.4 (could be some problems too...) The 0.3 to 0.4 changeover did not, to my knowledge, drop any data. And before 0.3 OSM was so small that whatever was there at the time can safely be ignored ;-) Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
On 14/06/2009, Richard Fairhurst rich...@systemed.net wrote: MP wrote: So currently, if I want to know how was the way drawn in time T, I had to get history of the way, then find out which nodes were used by the way in time T, then get history from each of the nodes and pick appropriate node from the history, given the time. Then combine this into output XML which I can view Is there some automated tool that will do that? Ahem, Potlatch. Doesn't have any truck with any of this XML crap though. ;) Well, potlatch have feature of reverting to earlier version of way, but doesn't that reverting have a side effect of actually reverting the way? I want only examine the older version, since I know only the newer is correct. Martin ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 1:08 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Perhaps this could be improved in 0.7, by having some [way|relation]/#id/history-full call, which will return history of referenced way (or relation), including history of all node (ways) that was referenced at least in one of the historic or current versions. Sort of combination of /history and /full I'd rather hope someone builds some kind of time machine service that has these capabilities (plus a give me this area as it was last year API call). There is no pressing reason to burden the central API with I would love to implement the give me this area as it was last year server when I find time. Around 1000 lines of blindingly fast C code. Here are some of my notes. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/index.php/Talk:OSM_Protocol_Version_0.6 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
MP wrote: Well, potlatch have feature of reverting to earlier version of way, but doesn't that reverting have a side effect of actually reverting the way? Only if you save it. If you use the edit with save mode and don't save, you can just look. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/full-history-of-a-way--tp24016602p24020993.html Sent from the OpenStreetMap - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
Richard Fairhurst wrote: Only if you save it. If you use the edit with save mode and don't save, you can just look. What I've always thought could be useful is that when you select an earlier version from the popup, it would show on the map as well. Often there's multiple previous edits, and you're not always sure which is the one you want to go back to. You could visually check a few, before you decide to go which one to revert to. -- Lennard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
2009/6/14 MP singular...@gmail.com: Perhaps this could be improved in 0.7, by having some [way|relation]/#id/history-full call, which will return history of referenced way (or relation), including history of all node (ways) that was referenced at least in one of the historic or current versions. Sort of combination of /history and /full There are several problems with this - one is that (as you've discovered) it is quite expensive to compute as you have to go back to the timestamps. Further back in history the timestamps may not even be accurate enough to give the correct answer in fact. as in the early days there were various inconsistencies in the way the timestamps were generated. On top of that it wouldn't really give the full picture - after all there may be multiple versions of a node in the time window for a given way version. So would need to create intermediate way versions to show places where the tags of the way stayed the same but the shape changed because a node was moved. Tom -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://www.compton.nu/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
Hi, MP wrote: So currently, if I want to know how was the way drawn in time T, I had to get history of the way, then find out which nodes were used by the way in time T, then get history from each of the nodes and pick appropriate node from the history, given the time. Then combine this into output XML which I can view If you often have this kind of query, consider downloading and suitably preparing some old planet files for quick access to old data with proper referential integrity. Perhaps this could be improved in 0.7, by having some [way|relation]/#id/history-full call, which will return history of referenced way (or relation), including history of all node (ways) that was referenced at least in one of the historic or current versions. Sort of combination of /history and /full I'd rather hope someone builds some kind of time machine service that has these capabilities (plus a give me this area as it was last year API call). There is no pressing reason to burden the central API with that once we figure out how to publish full history dumps. Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09 E008°23'33 ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] full history of a way?
MP wrote: There are no full history dumps currently - having such dump would enable this type of query quite easily. I think the daily diffs could be used for help if the changes are fresh (less than 14 days). Are there any nearby plans for full history dumps? This shouldn't probably be very hard, instead of having only one node/way/relation in the result you will have many with same ID and different timestamp as the history progresses. You'll have just to mark deleted objects somehow (those that have history, but they are not in current data) Basically, once the initial dump will be done, you can just concatenate any changes :) There are plans for full history dumps. In fact osmosis (which produces the existing diffs) can already produce full history diffs but they're not enabled at the moment. The current minute changesets have a problem where they occasionally miss data. Once we get this ironed out I'll take another look at full history diffs. Some sample data is available here: http://planet.openstreetmap.org/history/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
