Re: [talk-au] Licence mention for static mapon NiceLocal.com.au

[Ben Kelley]

It needs attribution for the static map as well I think.


 - Ben Kelley.

On 18/2/22 15:55, Stéphane Guillou via Talk-au wrote:

Hi all

I just sent a message to NiceLocal.com.au about the copyright 
requirements of OSM, because my understanding is that the static map 
on their shop profiles does not respect them.


For example: https://nicelocal.com.au/brisbane/shops/campus_news/

However, because clicking the map opens a slippy map that does mention 
the data source, I wanted to ask the list: does it follow OSM's 
requirements, or does it need to add an OSM mention next/over the 
static map as well?


Cheers


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[talk-au] Licence mention for static mapon NiceLocal.com.au

[Stéphane Guillou via Talk-au]

Hi all

I just sent a message to NiceLocal.com.au about the copyright 
requirements of OSM, because my understanding is that the static map on 
their shop profiles does not respect them.


For example: https://nicelocal.com.au/brisbane/shops/campus_news/

However, because clicking the map opens a slippy map that does mention 
the data source, I wanted to ask the list: does it follow OSM's 
requirements, or does it need to add an OSM mention next/over the static 
map as well?


Cheers

--
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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[osm.talk-au]

Well, it was showing for me too like in the screenshot when I looked at it at 
first.

 

But as I said, a Ctrl+F5 fixed that.

 

(Lisa, the technical explanation below isn’t really important to you)

 

Now, in this case, because I never looked at that area before, it can’t have 
been my local cache in the browser that was the problem.

 

Ctrl+F5 (instead of just F5) doesn’t just invalidate the cache in the local 
browser, it afterwards sends the requests to reload the data with a “do not 
cache” flag set in the HTTP header, this will in turn force the CDN to not just 
take the tile out of it’s cache but to go back to the actual render server to 
request an updated image.

 

This is exactly why I keep telling people to use Ctrl+F5 (instead of e.g. 
simply turning off caching in their browser, which wouldn’t cause the “do not 
cache” flag on requests to the CDN.

 

Also, in this case a single Ctrl+F5 directly loaded the updated tile, but 
sometimes you have to do it multiple times. The reason why it updated directly 
this time is because the render server already had the new tile rendered, so 
could hand it out directly. But if the render server gets a request for a tile 
that’s “dirty” (needs to be re-rendered) it will still return the dirty tile, 
but will either queue up the rendering of it or possibly push it up the queue 
if it already is queued for rendering. In that case it takes at least one 
additional request after the tile has been rendered to update the tile in the 
browser.

 

From: Stéphane Guillou via Talk-au  
Sent: Friday, 18 February 2022 14:35
To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Cc: Stéphane Guillou 
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

 

Hi Lisa

The tiles (i.e. the rendered images shown on openstreetmap.org) take a while to 
be updated, sometimes a couple of days. It is not immediate.

I assume that that's the issue here?

For example, I just removed a shop that closed down: 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/117545570

However, on the map, it still shows (at the time of writing): 



Note that I turned on the "layers > map data" option, which shows in blue the 
existing data in the database. As you can see, the database does not include 
the shop Campus News anymore, but it is still shown on the tile.

So if that's the issue, the image should update in the next few hours or days!

Cheers

On 18/2/22 14:16, Lisa wrote:

Thank you for such a quick response :)

 

When I go into Edit mode the old node that needs to be removed isn't 
displaying, but when I am not in edit mode I can see it?

Am I using the wrong method of editing it?

Or do I need to do something else?

 

TIA, Lisa

 

 

On Fri, Feb 18, 2022 at 2:59 PM stevea mailto:stevea...@softworkers.com> > wrote:

On Feb 17, 2022, at 7:51 PM, Lisa mailto:lisalatha...@gmail.com> > wrote:
(a question)

Hi Lisa:  I'm assuming you are using the iD editor.  It seems you know the 
difference between the new node being correct and the old node "needing to go," 
you can click on a node and delete it like this:

Select the node with a single click,
Press and hold until a pop-right menu toggles off (usually to the right, might 
be to the left), let go of the mouse button,
Slide your finger pointer down to the bottom icon, the trash can icon, and when 
hovered over it, click.

You just deleted the node.

Happy mapping!





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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[stevea]

Lisa, also, please know that it can take different times for the various "zoom 
levels" of the map to show the same data.  For example, zoomed way up close, 
all might look correct, then you zoom out (and it's OK), but you zoom out "one 
more level" and it's like it was yesterday, or two days ago.  The "rendering" 
of the map simply needs to "catch up," and this can take minutes, hours, days 
or even weeks (at wide zoom levels for particular items).
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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[stevea]

Yup, Lisa, what Thorsten said:  it may be that somebody else has made an edit 
"in the meantime" and you are really seeing the nodes in the map as they are 
"right now."

It may be that you are witnessing that many people can edit the same data.  
When this gets messy," it is called an "Edit Conflict" and it can take some 
specialized steps that can get technical to "back things out" and resolve both 
edits into one, single cohesive thing that all of the data should be.  That 
doesn't happen very often, but it does happen.
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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[Stéphane Guillou via Talk-au]

Hi Lisa

The tiles (i.e. the rendered images shown on openstreetmap.org) take a 
while to be updated, sometimes a couple of days. It is not immediate.


I assume that that's the issue here?

For example, I just removed a shop that closed down: 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/117545570


However, on the map, it still shows (at the time of writing):

Note that I turned on the "layers > map data" option, which shows in 
blue the existing data in the database. As you can see, the database 
does not include the shop Campus News anymore, but it is still shown on 
the tile.


So if that's the issue, the image should update in the next few hours or 
days!


Cheers

On 18/2/22 14:16, Lisa wrote:

Thank you for such a quick response :)

When I go into Edit mode the old node that needs to be removed isn't 
displaying, but when I am not in edit mode I can see it?

Am I using the wrong method of editing it?
Or do I need to do something else?

TIA, Lisa


On Fri, Feb 18, 2022 at 2:59 PM stevea  wrote:

On Feb 17, 2022, at 7:51 PM, Lisa  wrote:
(a question)

Hi Lisa:  I'm assuming you are using the iD editor.  It seems you
know the difference between the new node being correct and the old
node "needing to go," you can click on a node and delete it like this:

Select the node with a single click,
Press and hold until a pop-right menu toggles off (usually to the
right, might be to the left), let go of the mouse button,
Slide your finger pointer down to the bottom icon, the trash can
icon, and when hovered over it, click.

You just deleted the node.

Happy mapping!


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You can encrypt our communications by using OpenPGP. My public key 4E211060 is 
available on the keys.gnupg.net server.

Other ways to interact with me are listed on my contact 
page:http://stragu.gitlab.io/contact/
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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[nwastra nwastra]

Hi
You just need to wait longer for the render of the OSM to catch up with your 
edit.
Try refreshing your browser or try the Tor browser which which is unlikely to 
be caching the OSM tiles in the area.
The node is deleted at the old address and there are two nodes for the business 
at the new address.

(resent to talk-au)

> On 18 Feb 2022, at 1:51 pm, Lisa  > wrote:
> 
> I can see that the new node is located correctly at Wilson Street but the 
> original node is still showing as well at 191 Mount Street?
> When I go into edit mode it is not showing at the Mount Street address? 
> How can I remove the original node as it is no longer valid, they do not 
> operate at the old address?

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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[nwastra nwastra]

Hi
please check if the two nodes for the business are still valid or needed.
One has a note as follows which was added in 2021…. note=Administration, no 
childcare takes place here

(resent to talk-au)

> On 18 Feb 2022, at 2:20 pm, nwastra nwastra  > wrote:
> 
> and there are two nodes for the business at the new address.

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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[osm.talk-au]

The edit mode shows the data as it exists in the database at that moment. So if 
the node disappears when you go into edit mode, then everything is correct in 
the database and you don’t need to do anything there anymore.

 

The map view outside the editor is not updated in realtime, it can take various 
amounts of time (from seconds to days, depending on zoom level and how busy the 
render servers are) for the new tile to get rendered.

 

In your case I assume the problem is actually that your browser or something 
else between your eyes and the render server is still caching the old tile.

 

You can try Cltr+F5 (repeat 2-3 times if necessary) to force your browser to 
update it’s cache and see if that helps.

 

From: Lisa  
Sent: Friday, 18 February 2022 14:16
To: stevea 
Cc: talk-au@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

 

Thank you for such a quick response :)

 

When I go into Edit mode the old node that needs to be removed isn't 
displaying, but when I am not in edit mode I can see it?

Am I using the wrong method of editing it?

Or do I need to do something else?

 

TIA, Lisa

 

 

On Fri, Feb 18, 2022 at 2:59 PM stevea mailto:stevea...@softworkers.com> > wrote:

On Feb 17, 2022, at 7:51 PM, Lisa mailto:lisalatha...@gmail.com> > wrote:
(a question)

Hi Lisa:  I'm assuming you are using the iD editor.  It seems you know the 
difference between the new node being correct and the old node "needing to go," 
you can click on a node and delete it like this:

Select the node with a single click,
Press and hold until a pop-right menu toggles off (usually to the right, might 
be to the left), let go of the mouse button,
Slide your finger pointer down to the bottom icon, the trash can icon, and when 
hovered over it, click.

You just deleted the node.

Happy mapping!

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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[stevea]

On Feb 17, 2022, at 8:16 PM, Lisa  wrote:
> Thank you for such a quick response :)

OSM:  We aim to please!

> When I go into Edit mode the old node that needs to be removed isn't 
> displaying, but when I am not in edit mode I can see it?
> Am I using the wrong method of editing it?
> Or do I need to do something else?

It's not that you are or aren't using a "wrong" method of editing it, there are 
several (almost MANY!) methods.  At this point it is that I don't know WHICH 
"editor" you are using.  The word "editor" can be "software editor" (like iD, 
the more-or-less "default" editor built-into a web browser you get when you 
surf to www.osm.org.  Many people use iD, especially novices.  Or, "editor" it 
can mean "human editor," like you, when you edit in OSM (using a "software 
editor" of OSM).  Whew!

So, when you click the little down-arrow to the right of "Edit" at the top of 
your OSM browser page, do you select "Edit with iD (in-browser editor)"?

Or, maybe you are not on a computer / desktop / laptop (or even tablet) and 
using a web browser, you might be on a smart-phone and using an app to edit 
OSM, like Maps.Me or OsmAnd (there are lots and lots of these).  Or, you might 
even be on a smartphone, but still using a browser (in which case, you could 
use iD like that, but editing can be "crowded").

As I don't know which (software) editor you (the human editor) are using, but I 
guessed iD (and maybe I'm wrong), I'll need to know "which software editor" are 
you using, human editor named Lisa?

And we can go from there (I hope, I don't know everything about all of them!)

If you wish, we can take it "off-list" (between us, excluding 
talk-au@openstreetmap.org in our email distribution).

Steve
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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[Lisa]

Thank you for such a quick response :)

When I go into Edit mode the old node that needs to be removed isn't
displaying, but when I am not in edit mode I can see it?
Am I using the wrong method of editing it?
Or do I need to do something else?

TIA, Lisa


On Fri, Feb 18, 2022 at 2:59 PM stevea  wrote:

> On Feb 17, 2022, at 7:51 PM, Lisa  wrote:
> (a question)
>
> Hi Lisa:  I'm assuming you are using the iD editor.  It seems you know the
> difference between the new node being correct and the old node "needing to
> go," you can click on a node and delete it like this:
>
> Select the node with a single click,
> Press and hold until a pop-right menu toggles off (usually to the right,
> might be to the left), let go of the mouse button,
> Slide your finger pointer down to the bottom icon, the trash can icon, and
> when hovered over it, click.
>
> You just deleted the node.
>
> Happy mapping!
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Re: [talk-au] Help - Node relocation

[stevea]

On Feb 17, 2022, at 7:51 PM, Lisa  wrote:
(a question)

Hi Lisa:  I'm assuming you are using the iD editor.  It seems you know the 
difference between the new node being correct and the old node "needing to go," 
you can click on a node and delete it like this:

Select the node with a single click,
Press and hold until a pop-right menu toggles off (usually to the right, might 
be to the left), let go of the mouse button,
Slide your finger pointer down to the bottom icon, the trash can icon, and when 
hovered over it, click.

You just deleted the node.

Happy mapping!
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[talk-au] Fwd: Help - Node relocation

[Lisa]

Hi OSM community,

Can someone help me with an issue I am having?

I have tried to update the location of a business after it relocated to new
premises.

*Spraoi Childcare, Burnie Tasmania*

It was originally located at 191 Mount Street, Burnie Tasmania but has
since moved to 110 Wilson Street, Burnie Tasmania.
I can see that the new node is located correctly at Wilson Street but the
original node is still showing as well at 191 Mount Street?
When I go into edit mode it is not showing at the Mount Street address?
How can I remove the original node as it is no longer valid, they do not
operate at the old address?

Assistance with this would be much appreciated.

Lisa
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Re: [talk-au] Shared Zones (Or, Living Streets in car parks?)

[Stéphane Guillou via Talk-au]

I agree with Andrew's tagging guidelines update. I was never happy with 
tagging a way as a "living street" when it was obviously a driveway with 
a sign slapped onto it to basically say "drivers, please be careful, 
pedestrians might cross at any spot".
On rendered data, it often makes it look like the area is a lot more 
active travel-friendly and "enjoyable to hang out on" than it actually 
is on the ground...


Cheers

On 17/2/22 11:23, Dian Ågesson wrote:


Hey Graeme,

Spotting your change certainly reminded me of the shared zone signs 
I’ve been seeing, but not because it is tagged incorrectly. It’s been 
on my to do list since I nearly got run over eating a Bunnings sausage 
over Xmas!


I think that this is a good example of a true “living street”; it 
would not have been a service road if not signed as a shared zone, and 
is intended to be shared space to encourage pedestrian traffic.


Similar examples I am familiar with include Fitzroy St, St Kilda at 
Acland Street; Kananook Creek Boulevard South in Frankston between 
Playne and Davey; and Hardware Lane, Melbourne, at the Bourke Street 
Carpark.


I have noticed that a lot of “true” living streets in Melbourne are 
busy roads that have been handed back to pedestrian traffic, or are in 
new, sterilised (soulless) places like Docklands.


Dian

On 2022-02-17 10:32, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:


This discussion started in response to something that I mapped.
I was clearing a note / Inspector issue nearby & wondered why this 
street appeared differently on the map:

https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/216566993
Had a look & it was tagged as a service-alley which just didn't seem 
right, but neither did =residential, so I changed it to =tertiary 
(=unclassified may have been better?).
Question was raised as to whether it should be, so I've now changed 
it to =living_street pending outcome of these discussions.

Here it is FYI:
https://goo.gl/maps/g3jpqjDQLgCktmfc7
https://goo.gl/maps/wNQyQo7RZRyg94pg8
So what do we think it should be?
Thanks
Graeme


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You can encrypt our communications by using OpenPGP. My public key 4E211060 is 
available on the keys.gnupg.net server.

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page:http://stragu.gitlab.io/contact/
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