Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

Thanks everyone!

Mateusz, the Oz only option would be very useful, so thanks for putting
that suggestion through.

Thanks

Graeme
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Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Mateusz Konieczny]

There is http://osmlab.github.io/name-suggestion-index/brands/index.html 

intended as readable index of data. Though it is containing only partial 
extract - 
for example match information seems currently missing, maybe it would be worth 
adding there.
I opened https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/issues/2734 
 for this idea.


At this moment I see no way to exclude entries known to be not existing in 
Australia,
but it should be relatively easy to add this - would it be useful?
I opened https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/issues/2733 
 for this idea.

1 Jun 2019, 08:43 by graemefi...@gmail.com :

> Is there a simple, easy to read (ie not Github code! :-)) list of these 
> preset names?
>
See above! JSON is often described as human-readable, it is more of
programmer-readable but it is not so terrible.

For full data info one can start at
https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/tree/master/brands 

select first key and later its value.

For given entry, for example
https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/amenity/fuel.json#L535
 

it has some info:

> "amenity/fuel|Costco Gasoline"
name of the entry

> "countryCodes": ["au", "ca", "mx", "us"],
limited to this countries (Australia, Canada, Mexico, USA) 

> "matchNames": ["costco","costco gas","costco wholesale"],
this names are considered as substandard names for this object type,
may be used by validators, likely to be used by iD validator 

> "nomatch": ["amenity/pharmacy|Costco Pharmacy","shop/wholesale|Costco"],
lists entries with similat names but not actually duplicates (mostly internal 
use)

> "tags"
Tags that OSM element is expected to have (added by Vespucci/iD on creating it,
iD validator maybe is also using this info)

There is also matchTags that may list ways how that specific entry 
is often mistagged - see for example
https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/amenity/payment_centre.json#L4
 



> Thanks
>
> Graeme
>
>
> On Wed, 29 May 2019 at 22:00, Mateusz Konieczny <> matkoni...@tutanota.com 
> > > wrote:
>
>> Can you link to an affected OSM object? It sounded like something caused by 
>> name-suggestion-index, but I see no matches in
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/amenity/fuel.json
>>  
>> 
>> that would cause this.
>>
>> The same for
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
>>  
>> 
>>
>> It also appears to not be caused by recent changes from looking at
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
>>  
>> 
>> and
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/0d944dde401119d3aa767c18b68ee44b112fa4ba/brands/amenity/fuel.json
>>  
>> 
>>
>> ---
>>
>> BTW, I made a small tool that list what name-suggestion-index considers as 
>> matches -
>> examples from Manhattan:
>>
>> name=Adidas - proposed change from `shop=clothes` to `shop=sports` >> 
>> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/6187504686 
>> 
>>
>>
>> name=Dollar Tree - proposed change from `shop=convenience` to 
>> `shop=variety_store` >> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5625761131 
>> 
>>
>>
>> name=Timberland - proposed change from `shop=shoes` to `shop=clothes` >> 
>> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2709306607 
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> name=FedEx Office - proposed change from `amenity=post_office` to 
>> `shop=copyshop` >> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5978745700 
>> 
>>
>>
>> Such list may be used both to look for some mistakes in a local area and for 
>>
>> mistakes in name-suggestion-index.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> If somebody would be interested I can generate it for any location (I need 
>> just location, 
>>
>> how large area should be covered and how long list is requested)
>>
>> 29 May 2019, 01:17 by >> osm.li...@chuq.net >> :
>>
>>> Thanks Alex and 

Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Phil Wyatt]

It’s pretty easy here

http://osmlab.github.io/name-suggestion-index/brands/amenity/fuel.html


Cheers - Phil, 
On the road with his iPad 

> On 1 Jun 2019, at 4:43 pm, Graeme Fitzpatrick  wrote:
> 
> Is there a simple, easy to read (ie not Github code! :-)) list of these 
> preset names?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Graeme
> 
> 
>> On Wed, 29 May 2019 at 22:00, Mateusz Konieczny  
>> wrote:
>> Can you link to an affected OSM object? It sounded like something caused by 
>> name-suggestion-index, but I see no matches in
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/amenity/fuel.json
>> that would cause this.
>> 
>> The same for
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
>> 
>> It also appears to not be caused by recent changes from looking at
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
>> and
>> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/0d944dde401119d3aa767c18b68ee44b112fa4ba/brands/amenity/fuel.json
>> 
>> ---
>> 
>> BTW, I made a small tool that list what name-suggestion-index considers as 
>> matches -
>> examples from Manhattan:
>> name=Adidas - proposed change from `shop=clothes` to `shop=sports` 
>> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/6187504686
>> 
>> name=Dollar Tree - proposed change from `shop=convenience` to 
>> `shop=variety_store` https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5625761131
>> 
>> name=Timberland - proposed change from `shop=shoes` to `shop=clothes` 
>> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2709306607
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> name=FedEx Office - proposed change from `amenity=post_office` to 
>> `shop=copyshop` https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5978745700
>> 
>> Such list may be used both to look for some mistakes in a local area and for 
>> 
>> mistakes in name-suggestion-index.
>> 
>> 
>> If somebody would be interested I can generate it for any location (I need 
>> just location, 
>> 
>> how large area should be covered and how long list is requested)
>> 
>> 29 May 2019, 01:17 by osm.li...@chuq.net:
>> Thanks Alex and Ian,
>> 
>> So it seems there are plenty of standard Caltex service stations in 
>> Australia - any advice on how to stop entries labelled "Caltex" from auto 
>> resolving to a "Woolworths Petrol" location when "update these tags" is used?
>> 
>> Just changed the "brand" on the second entry in my original post from 
>> "Caltex" to "Caltex Woolworths"?
>> 
>> I could play about of course, but I don't want to break things!
>> 
>> Regards,
>> Charles
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 3:42 PM Ian Sergeant  wrote:
>> Strictly speaking, I don't think that's true.  Some Caltex operated sites 
>> still branded as Woolworths Caltex, and offered the Woolworths facilities.  
>> You couldn't tell just by looking who owned what. 
>> 
>> Of course, now Woolworths has sold all its fuel outlets, and doesn't operate 
>> as a fuel retailer any longer.
>> 
>> I'd go by the name on the sign - as these are likely to change over the past 
>> few months as the Caltex owned stores all revert to form.
>> 
>> Ian.
>> 
>> On Tue, 28 May 2019 at 14:51, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir  
>> wrote:
>> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 1:55 PM Charles Gregory  wrote:
>> Are "Caltex" and "Caltex Woolworths" identical in some parts of Australia?
>> 
>> "What is the difference between [the 535] Woolworths Caltex and [the 680] 
>> Caltex locations? 
>> Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths owned fuel location, that sells Caltex 
>> fuel. The shop at a Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths store.  
>> The shop at a Caltex location can be a Star Mart, Star Shop or The Foodary."
>> https://www.caltex.com.au/woolworths  
>> 
>> The map on their website makes a distinction between the two when you click 
>> on it https://www.caltex.com.au/find-a-caltex 
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Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Graeme Fitzpatrick]

Is there a simple, easy to read (ie not Github code! :-)) list of these
preset names?

Thanks

Graeme


On Wed, 29 May 2019 at 22:00, Mateusz Konieczny 
wrote:

> Can you link to an affected OSM object? It sounded like something caused
> by
> name-suggestion-index, but I see no matches in
>
> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/amenity/fuel.json
> that would cause this.
>
> The same for
>
> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
>
> It also appears to not be caused by recent changes from looking at
>
> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
> and
>
> https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/0d944dde401119d3aa767c18b68ee44b112fa4ba/brands/amenity/fuel.json
>
> ---
>
> BTW, I made a small tool that list what name-suggestion-index considers as
> matches -
> examples from Manhattan:
>
> name=Adidas - proposed change from `shop=clothes` to `shop=sports`
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/6187504686
>
> name=Dollar Tree - proposed change from `shop=convenience` to
> `shop=variety_store` https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5625761131
>
> name=Timberland - proposed change from `shop=shoes` to `shop=clothes`
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2709306607
>
>
> name=FedEx Office - proposed change from `amenity=post_office` to
> `shop=copyshop` https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5978745700
>
> Such list may be used both to look for some mistakes in a local area and
> for
> mistakes in name-suggestion-index.
>
>
> If somebody would be interested I can generate it for any location (I need
> just location,
> how large area should be covered and how long list is requested)
>
> 29 May 2019, 01:17 by osm.li...@chuq.net:
>
> Thanks Alex and Ian,
>
> So it seems there are plenty of standard Caltex service stations in
> Australia - any advice on how to stop entries labelled "Caltex" from auto
> resolving to a "Woolworths Petrol" location when "update these tags" is
> used?
>
> Just changed the "brand" on the second entry in my original post from
> "Caltex" to "Caltex Woolworths"?
>
> I could play about of course, but I don't want to break things!
>
> Regards,
> Charles
>
>
>
> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 3:42 PM Ian Sergeant  wrote:
>
> Strictly speaking, I don't think that's true.  Some Caltex operated sites
> still branded as Woolworths Caltex, and offered the Woolworths facilities.
> You couldn't tell just by looking who owned what.
>
> Of course, now Woolworths has sold all its fuel outlets, and doesn't
> operate as a fuel retailer any longer.
>
> I'd go by the name on the sign - as these are likely to change over the
> past few months as the Caltex owned stores all revert to form.
>
> Ian.
>
> On Tue, 28 May 2019 at 14:51, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir 
> wrote:
>
> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 1:55 PM Charles Gregory 
> wrote:
>
> Are "Caltex" and "Caltex Woolworths" identical in some parts of Australia?
>
> "What is the difference between [the 535] Woolworths Caltex and [the 680]
> Caltex locations?
> Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths owned fuel location, that sells Caltex
> fuel. The shop at a Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths store.
> The shop at a Caltex location can be a Star Mart, Star Shop or The
> Foodary."
> https://www.caltex.com.au/woolworths
>
> The map on their website makes a distinction between the two when you
> click on it https://www.caltex.com.au/find-a-caltex
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Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Mateusz Konieczny]

Can you link to an affected OSM object? It sounded like something caused by 
name-suggestion-index, but I see no matches in
https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/amenity/fuel.json
 

that would cause this.

The same for
https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/blob/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
 


It also appears to not be caused by recent changes from looking at
https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/master/brands/shop/convenience.json
 

and
https://github.com/osmlab/name-suggestion-index/commits/0d944dde401119d3aa767c18b68ee44b112fa4ba/brands/amenity/fuel.json

---

BTW, I made a small tool that list what name-suggestion-index considers as 
matches -
 examples from Manhattan:

name=Adidas - proposed change from `shop=clothes` to `shop=sports` 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/6187504686


name=Dollar Tree - proposed change from `shop=convenience` to 
`shop=variety_store` https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5625761131


name=Timberland - proposed change from `shop=shoes` to `shop=clothes` 
https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2709306607





name=FedEx Office - proposed change from `amenity=post_office` to 
`shop=copyshop` https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5978745700


Such list may be used both to look for some mistakes in a local area and for 

mistakes in name-suggestion-index.




If somebody would be interested I can generate it for any location (I need just 
location, 

how large area should be covered and how long list is requested)

29 May 2019, 01:17 by osm.li...@chuq.net :

> Thanks Alex and Ian,
>
> So it seems there are plenty of standard Caltex service stations in Australia 
> - any advice on how to stop entries labelled "Caltex" from auto resolving to 
> a "Woolworths Petrol" location when "update these tags" is used?
>
> Just changed the "brand" on the second entry in my original post from 
> "Caltex" to "Caltex Woolworths"?
>
> I could play about of course, but I don't want to break things!
>
> Regards,
> Charles
>
>
>
> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 3:42 PM Ian Sergeant <> inas66+...@gmail.com 
> > > wrote:
>
>> Strictly speaking, I don't think that's true.  Some Caltex operated sites 
>> still branded as Woolworths Caltex, and offered the Woolworths facilities.  
>> You couldn't tell just by looking who owned what. 
>>
>> Of course, now Woolworths has sold all its fuel outlets, and doesn't operate 
>> as a fuel retailer any longer.
>>
>> I'd go by the name on the sign - as these are likely to change over the past 
>> few months as the Caltex owned stores all revert to form.
>>
>> Ian.
>>
>> On Tue, 28 May 2019 at 14:51, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir <>> maxi...@gmail.com 
>> >> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 1:55 PM Charles Gregory <>>> osm.li...@chuq.net 
>>>  wrote:
>>>
 Are "Caltex" and "Caltex Woolworths" identical in some parts of Australia?


>>> "What is the difference between [the 535] Woolworths Caltex and [the 680] 
>>> Caltex locations? 
>>> Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths owned fuel location, that sells Caltex 
>>> fuel. The shop at a Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths store.  
>>> The shop at a Caltex location can be a Star Mart, Star Shop or The Foodary."
>>> https://www.caltex.com.au/woolworths 
>>> >>
>>> The map on their website makes a distinction between the two when you click 
>>> on it >>> https://www.caltex.com.au/find-a-caltex 
>>> >> ___
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>>>  >>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au 
>>> 
>>>
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Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Charles Gregory]

Thanks Alex and Ian,

So it seems there are plenty of standard Caltex service stations in
Australia - any advice on how to stop entries labelled "Caltex" from auto
resolving to a "Woolworths Petrol" location when "update these tags" is
used?

Just changed the "brand" on the second entry in my original post from
"Caltex" to "Caltex Woolworths"?

I could play about of course, but I don't want to break things!

Regards,
Charles



On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 3:42 PM Ian Sergeant  wrote:

> Strictly speaking, I don't think that's true.  Some Caltex operated sites
> still branded as Woolworths Caltex, and offered the Woolworths facilities.
> You couldn't tell just by looking who owned what.
>
> Of course, now Woolworths has sold all its fuel outlets, and doesn't
> operate as a fuel retailer any longer.
>
> I'd go by the name on the sign - as these are likely to change over the
> past few months as the Caltex owned stores all revert to form.
>
> Ian.
>
> On Tue, 28 May 2019 at 14:51, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir 
> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 1:55 PM Charles Gregory 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Are "Caltex" and "Caltex Woolworths" identical in some parts of
>>> Australia?
>>>
>>> "What is the difference between [the 535] Woolworths Caltex and [the
>> 680] Caltex locations?
>> Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths owned fuel location, that sells Caltex
>> fuel. The shop at a Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths store.
>> The shop at a Caltex location can be a Star Mart, Star Shop or The
>> Foodary."
>> https://www.caltex.com.au/woolworths
>>
>> The map on their website makes a distinction between the two when you
>> click on it https://www.caltex.com.au/find-a-caltex
>> ___
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>> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
>>
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Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Ian Sergeant]

Strictly speaking, I don't think that's true.  Some Caltex operated sites
still branded as Woolworths Caltex, and offered the Woolworths facilities.
You couldn't tell just by looking who owned what.

Of course, now Woolworths has sold all its fuel outlets, and doesn't
operate as a fuel retailer any longer.

I'd go by the name on the sign - as these are likely to change over the
past few months as the Caltex owned stores all revert to form.

Ian.

On Tue, 28 May 2019 at 14:51, Alex (Maxious) Sadleir 
wrote:

> On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 1:55 PM Charles Gregory 
> wrote:
>
>> Are "Caltex" and "Caltex Woolworths" identical in some parts of Australia?
>>
>> "What is the difference between [the 535] Woolworths Caltex and [the 680]
> Caltex locations?
> Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths owned fuel location, that sells Caltex
> fuel. The shop at a Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths store.
> The shop at a Caltex location can be a Star Mart, Star Shop or The
> Foodary."
> https://www.caltex.com.au/woolworths
>
> The map on their website makes a distinction between the two when you
> click on it https://www.caltex.com.au/find-a-caltex
> ___
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Re: [talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Alex (Maxious) Sadleir]

On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 1:55 PM Charles Gregory  wrote:

> Are "Caltex" and "Caltex Woolworths" identical in some parts of Australia?
>
> "What is the difference between [the 535] Woolworths Caltex and [the 680]
Caltex locations?
Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths owned fuel location, that sells Caltex
fuel. The shop at a Woolworths Caltex is a Woolworths store.
The shop at a Caltex location can be a Star Mart, Star Shop or The Foodary."
https://www.caltex.com.au/woolworths

The map on their website makes a distinction between the two when you click
on it https://www.caltex.com.au/find-a-caltex
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[talk-au] Caltex on name-suggestion-index

[Charles Gregory]

Are "Caltex" and "Caltex Woolworths" identical in some parts of Australia?

I'm asking because I'm matching a few brands of local chains on OSM, and
notice that Caltex entries default to Woolworths Petrol.

The NSI info seems to have both using "brand=Caltex" but the Woolworths
ones take priority in Australia:

http://osmlab.github.io/name-suggestion-index/brands/amenity/fuel.html

"amenity/fuel|Caltex": {
"tags": {
"amenity": "fuel",
"brand": "Caltex",
"brand:wikidata": "Q277470",
"brand:wikipedia": "en:Caltex",
"name": "Caltex"
}
},

"amenity/fuel|Woolworths Petrol": {
"countryCodes": ["au"],
"nomatch": [
"shop/convenience|Woolworths Petrol"
],
"tags": {
"amenity": "fuel",
"brand": "Caltex",
"brand:wikidata": "Q5023980",
"brand:wikipedia": "en:Caltex Woolworths",
"name": "Woolworths Petrol"
}
},

I'm thinking it might be a local idiosyncrasy - there are a range of Caltex
stations near me in southern Tasmania - some are owned/co-branded under a
local company (Bennetts Petroleum), some are Caltex Woolworths branded, and
there may be others which are neither.

Any input welcome!

Charles
(user:chuq on OSM)
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