Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney -completed
Ok, I have done the ones in Sydney + Newcastle- brought the Stand information to the front of the name, I have left the rest of the information alone. I'll make a note in the OSM Aust guidelines about it. I'll have a look at other capitols later. On 24/01/19 14:40, Warin wrote: The ref number is included in the GTFS data which has been applied for in April (last year). https://opendata.transport.nsw.gov.au/dataset/timetables-complete-gtfs (GTFS 'stop_id' I think is OSMs 'ref') https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_data_catalogue As there is an election coming up .. would some political pressure promote the processing of this application? At the moment my thinking on bus stops tagging is name= tag .. move the 'Stand' information to the beginning of the text etc ref= tag ... use this for the reference number - this appears to be used by some renders and is helpful in using transport planners. comment= tag use this for any route information that maybe present. Useful for mappers to check/use for route relations On 22/01/19 13:01, cleary wrote: In Sydney, many stops display the stop number but I'm not sure if we have another source for this data - in NSW, the convention is that the first four numbers are the postcode of the suburb. So all stops in Strathfield would have a 6 or 7 digit number with the first four digits being the postcode for the suburb. For example stands A to D at Strathfield have their numbers included in OSM with the tag "local_ref=" On Tue, 22 Jan 2019, at 12:21 PM, Warin wrote: On 22/01/19 12:03, Sam Wilson wrote: On 1/21/19 4:58 PM, Warin wrote: I have used (misused?) the ref to tag the routes that use that bus stop, then some one has put the stop 'number' in as local_ref. Possibly the stop number is a 'operator_ref' ... whatever, no practical use to the normal person. I actually find the ref super useful, because with the Transperth app in WA you can search by stop ID and it's quicker and a lot more accurate than searching by street name etc. They're displayed in OSMAnd, and that's usually where I get them from. How do you know the number to start your search? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
The ref number is included in the GTFS data which has been applied for in April (last year). https://opendata.transport.nsw.gov.au/dataset/timetables-complete-gtfs (GTFS 'stop_id' I think is OSMs 'ref') https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_data_catalogue As there is an election coming up .. would some political pressure promote the processing of this application? At the moment my thinking on bus stops tagging is name= tag .. move the 'Stand' information to the beginning of the text etc ref= tag ... use this for the reference number - this appears to be used by some renders and is helpful in using transport planners. comment= tag use this for any route information that maybe present. Useful for mappers to check/use for route relations On 22/01/19 13:01, cleary wrote: In Sydney, many stops display the stop number but I'm not sure if we have another source for this data - in NSW, the convention is that the first four numbers are the postcode of the suburb. So all stops in Strathfield would have a 6 or 7 digit number with the first four digits being the postcode for the suburb. For example stands A to D at Strathfield have their numbers included in OSM with the tag "local_ref=" On Tue, 22 Jan 2019, at 12:21 PM, Warin wrote: On 22/01/19 12:03, Sam Wilson wrote: On 1/21/19 4:58 PM, Warin wrote: I have used (misused?) the ref to tag the routes that use that bus stop, then some one has put the stop 'number' in as local_ref. Possibly the stop number is a 'operator_ref' ... whatever, no practical use to the normal person. I actually find the ref super useful, because with the Transperth app in WA you can search by stop ID and it's quicker and a lot more accurate than searching by street name etc. They're displayed in OSMAnd, and that's usually where I get them from. How do you know the number to start your search? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
In Sydney, many stops display the stop number but I'm not sure if we have another source for this data - in NSW, the convention is that the first four numbers are the postcode of the suburb. So all stops in Strathfield would have a 6 or 7 digit number with the first four digits being the postcode for the suburb. For example stands A to D at Strathfield have their numbers included in OSM with the tag "local_ref=" On Tue, 22 Jan 2019, at 12:21 PM, Warin wrote: > On 22/01/19 12:03, Sam Wilson wrote: > > On 1/21/19 4:58 PM, Warin wrote: > >> I have used (misused?) the ref to tag the routes that use that bus > >> stop, then some one has put the stop 'number' in as local_ref. > >> Possibly the stop number is a 'operator_ref' ... whatever, no > >> practical use to the normal person. > > > > I actually find the ref super useful, because with the Transperth app > > in WA you can search by stop ID and it's quicker and a lot more > > accurate than searching by street name etc. They're displayed in > > OSMAnd, and that's usually where I get them from. > > How do you know the number to start your search? > > ___ > Talk-au mailing list > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
On 22/01/19 12:20, Warin wrote: On 22/01/19 12:03, Sam Wilson wrote: On 1/21/19 4:58 PM, Warin wrote: I have used (misused?) the ref to tag the routes that use that bus stop, then some one has put the stop 'number' in as local_ref. Possibly the stop number is a 'operator_ref' ... whatever, no practical use to the normal person. I actually find the ref super useful, because with the Transperth app in WA you can search by stop ID and it's quicker and a lot more accurate than searching by street name etc. They're displayed in OSMAnd, and that's usually where I get them from. How do you know the number to start your search? Arr .. sorry did not absorb that you got them from OSMand .. will have to try that locally here. Yep it works here too... so I have not recorded them here, will add it to the list of 'things to do'. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
On 22/01/19 12:03, Sam Wilson wrote: On 1/21/19 4:58 PM, Warin wrote: I have used (misused?) the ref to tag the routes that use that bus stop, then some one has put the stop 'number' in as local_ref. Possibly the stop number is a 'operator_ref' ... whatever, no practical use to the normal person. I actually find the ref super useful, because with the Transperth app in WA you can search by stop ID and it's quicker and a lot more accurate than searching by street name etc. They're displayed in OSMAnd, and that's usually where I get them from. How do you know the number to start your search? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
On 1/21/19 4:58 PM, Warin wrote: I have used (misused?) the ref to tag the routes that use that bus stop, then some one has put the stop 'number' in as local_ref. Possibly the stop number is a 'operator_ref' ... whatever, no practical use to the normal person. I actually find the ref super useful, because with the Transperth app in WA you can search by stop ID and it's quicker and a lot more accurate than searching by street name etc. They're displayed in OSMAnd, and that's usually where I get them from. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
Yes, I have seen the ref tag used for some number that occurs on the bus stop. I have used (misused?) the ref to tag the routes that use that bus stop, then some one has put the stop 'number' in as local_ref. Possibly the stop number is a 'operator_ref' ... whatever, no practical use to the normal person. The routes that stop at a bus stop .. might better go into a comments tag - help others who might be mapping routes using the already entered bus stops? In crowed space you have to zoom in, as always. Possibly a search function may work? On 22/01/19 11:40, Sam Wilson wrote: I agree, putting the stand name first makes sense. I've been putting ref=1234 tags on stands (with their ID from the sign), but for some reason haven't ever thought to add the name as well; I shall do so from now on. On 1/21/19 4:26 PM, Michael Collinson wrote: In Sweden, I have seen the "F" going into the ref tag. Just a thought, I don't recall how it affects rendering in common schemes. Con: Clash with a more rigorous ref num giving by the transport authority, "40459" or such. Another (complementary) practice is to put just "F" as the name - which has the secondary benefit of being more likely to render out in a crowded space. The other detail perhaps being better suited to the corresponding bus_station node/area/relation. Else, +1 from me, the proposal seems useful to me as a smart refinement of local practice. Mike On 2019-01-22 10:26, Warin wrote: Are there anydissenters? I'll give it a week. Any feed back from other places In Australia? On 21/01/19 20:00, cleary wrote: As a regular user of public transport, I agree. On Mon, Jan 21, 2019, at 4:39 PM, Warin wrote: Hi, At present the names of bus stops goes something like name=Strathfield Station, Albert Rd (Stand F). The web transport trip planers direct you to Stand F, yet this is not very visiblein OSM renderings as that information is last. Would it not be best to have the name put the more detailed information first and the generalproximity information last, much like an address? Such as name=Stand F, Albert Rd, Strathfield Station Thoughts? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
Why not: name=Stand F, Strathfield Station addr:street=Albert Road On 22/1/19 11:26 am, Michael Collinson wrote: > In Sweden, I have seen the "F" going into the ref tag. Just a thought, I > don't recall how it affects rendering in common schemes. Con: Clash with > a more rigorous ref num giving by the transport authority, "40459" or > such. Another (complementary) practice is to put just "F" as the name - > which has the secondary benefit of being more likely to render out in a > crowded space. The other detail perhaps being better suited to the > corresponding bus_station node/area/relation. > > Else, +1 from me, the proposal seems useful to me as a smart refinement > of local practice. > > Mike > > On 2019-01-22 10:26, Warin wrote: >> Are there any dissenters? >> I'll give it a week. >> Any feed back from other places In Australia? >> On 21/01/19 20:00, cleary wrote: >>> As a regular user of public transport, I agree. >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Jan 21, 2019, at 4:39 PM, Warin wrote: Hi, At present the names of bus stops goes something like name=Strathfield Station, Albert Rd (Stand F). The web transport trip planers direct you to Stand F, yet this is not very visiblein OSM renderings as that information is last. Would it not be best to have the name put the more detailed information first and the generalproximity information last, much like an address? Such as name=Stand F, Albert Rd, Strathfield Station Thoughts? >> >> >> ___ >> Talk-au mailing list >> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > > ___ > Talk-au mailing list > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
I agree, putting the stand name first makes sense. I've been putting ref=1234 tags on stands (with their ID from the sign), but for some reason haven't ever thought to add the name as well; I shall do so from now on. On 1/21/19 4:26 PM, Michael Collinson wrote: In Sweden, I have seen the "F" going into the ref tag. Just a thought, I don't recall how it affects rendering in common schemes. Con: Clash with a more rigorous ref num giving by the transport authority, "40459" or such. Another (complementary) practice is to put just "F" as the name - which has the secondary benefit of being more likely to render out in a crowded space. The other detail perhaps being better suited to the corresponding bus_station node/area/relation. Else, +1 from me, the proposal seems useful to me as a smart refinement of local practice. Mike On 2019-01-22 10:26, Warin wrote: Are there anydissenters? I'll give it a week. Any feed back from other places In Australia? On 21/01/19 20:00, cleary wrote: As a regular user of public transport, I agree. On Mon, Jan 21, 2019, at 4:39 PM, Warin wrote: Hi, At present the names of bus stops goes something like name=Strathfield Station, Albert Rd (Stand F). The web transport trip planers direct you to Stand F, yet this is not very visiblein OSM renderings as that information is last. Would it not be best to have the name put the more detailed information first and the generalproximity information last, much like an address? Such as name=Stand F, Albert Rd, Strathfield Station Thoughts? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
In Sweden, I have seen the "F" going into the ref tag. Just a thought, I don't recall how it affects rendering in common schemes. Con: Clash with a more rigorous ref num giving by the transport authority, "40459" or such. Another (complementary) practice is to put just "F" as the name - which has the secondary benefit of being more likely to render out in a crowded space. The other detail perhaps being better suited to the corresponding bus_station node/area/relation. Else, +1 from me, the proposal seems useful to me as a smart refinement of local practice. Mike On 2019-01-22 10:26, Warin wrote: Are there anydissenters? I'll give it a week. Any feed back from other places In Australia? On 21/01/19 20:00, cleary wrote: As a regular user of public transport, I agree. On Mon, Jan 21, 2019, at 4:39 PM, Warin wrote: Hi, At present the names of bus stops goes something like name=Strathfield Station, Albert Rd (Stand F). The web transport trip planers direct you to Stand F, yet this is not very visiblein OSM renderings as that information is last. Would it not be best to have the name put the more detailed information first and the generalproximity information last, much like an address? Such as name=Stand F, Albert Rd, Strathfield Station Thoughts? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
Are there anydissenters? I'll give it a week. Any feed back from other places In Australia? On 21/01/19 20:00, cleary wrote: As a regular user of public transport, I agree. On Mon, Jan 21, 2019, at 4:39 PM, Warin wrote: Hi, At present the names of bus stops goes something like name=Strathfield Station, Albert Rd (Stand F). The web transport trip planers direct you to Stand F, yet this is not very visiblein OSM renderings as that information is last. Would it not be best to have the name put the more detailed information first and the generalproximity information last, much like an address? Such as name=Stand F, Albert Rd, Strathfield Station Thoughts? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
As a regular user of public transport, I agree. On Mon, Jan 21, 2019, at 4:39 PM, Warin wrote: > Hi, > > > At present the names of bus stops goes something like > > name=Strathfield Station, Albert Rd (Stand F). > > > The web transport trip planers direct you to Stand F, yet this is not > very visiblein OSM renderings as that information is last. > > > Would it not be best to have the name put the more detailed information > first and the generalproximity information last, much like an address? > > Such as > > name=Stand F, Albert Rd, Strathfield Station > > > Thoughts? > > > ___ > Talk-au mailing list > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Naming Bus Stops for interchanges in Sydney
Hi, At present the names of bus stops goes something like name=Strathfield Station, Albert Rd (Stand F). The web transport trip planers direct you to Stand F, yet this is not very visiblein OSM renderings as that information is last. Would it not be best to have the name put the more detailed information first and the generalproximity information last, much like an address? Such as name=Stand F, Albert Rd, Strathfield Station Thoughts? ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
