Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On 15/01/2019 12:00, Martin Wynne wrote: Given that they are part of the public highway, it's puzzling why the Environment Agency feels the need to compulsorily acquire the rights to pass and repass over them? And what about the rest of us? Is it usual for small areas of tarmac in the public highway to be privately owned? Should I give thanks every time I pass that way that the owners have not erected toll booths on each side? Yes it is usual. Being a public highway only gives limited rights regarding moving vehicles and people. Some more rights may arise if it is also maintained at public expense. Whilst I may have originally stated that ownership belongs to the fronting properties (but note that the duty to maintain unadopted public highways does belong to those), public highways will generally be owned by either the fronting properties, or the developer that created those properties. In the latter case, there is a good chance that they have gone out of business and the land was unsellable, so has reverted to the Crown. I live in blocks of flats that were built around the end of a cul de sac, whilst it was unadopted. It is now adopted, but there has been no change to the freehold title as a result, so the end of the road still belongs to the flats, although maintained at public expense. I saw the original title plans for the first place my parents owned, and their boundaries went to the middle of the road. That was possibly before compulsory land registration, so I would need to pay a small fee to see what the registered title plan says. Looking at the new build house they then bought, and noting that it the Land Registry map search is not precise enough to isolate just a road, one find that as well the individual plots, what must be the road itself is identified as "Land associated with xx xx Avenue", where xx xx is constant throughout the estate. I imagine the title register for this will show the builder/developer as the owner. Note that public highways don't have to be adopted (maintained at public expense), so both the legal ownership and maintenance responsibility can be private. Certain statutory undertaking do get a right to ride roughshod over property rights, and being maintained at public expense does appear to include granting rights for things like phone boxes and telecoms cabinets. ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Is the complication anything to do with the history of the Severn Valley Plotlands (not sure if this is its title)? From the names of the chalets on the compulsory purchase order map we're in (or close to) that territory I think. https://hutters.uk/2014/07/27/plotlands-in-jonathan-meades-severn-heaven/ Regards, *Paul* On Tue, 15 Jan 2019 at 12:02, Martin Wynne wrote: > On 14/01/2019 18:14, Andy Robinson wrote: > > All seems rather fishy to me Martin ;-) > > > > Cheers > > Andy > > Hi Andy, > > It is certainly fishy, and also very puzzling. It's clearly not an error > in the mapping, the small areas 1E and 1H have been carefully measured > and specifically numbered (1H is only 10 square metres). > > Given that they are part of the public highway, it's puzzling why the > Environment Agency feels the need to compulsorily acquire the rights to > pass and repass over them? And what about the rest of us? Is it usual > for small areas of tarmac in the public highway to be privately owned? > Should I give thanks every time I pass that way that the owners have not > erected toll booths on each side? > > And what about the other half of the road? Who has the rights to use > that bit? It's a narrow country lane, it is barely possible to use it in > a vehicle without using both sides of it. But now that I know, I shall > certainly do my best to avoid trespassing on the private property half. > > Here's the Google Streetview: > > https://goo.gl/maps/uoJzoo5uf4B2 > > cheers, > > Martin. > > ___ > Talk-GB mailing list > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
All seems rather fishy to me Martin ;-) Cheers Andy -Original Message- From: Martin Wynne [mailto:mar...@templot.com] Sent: 14 January 2019 13:23 To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents > I've yet to see a Land Registry title plan go to the centreline of the road. > I guess it might occasionally for an unadopted highway but typically the > boundary between highway and private property is either at the back of the > pavement or some distance beyond that (verge) depending on location. > > Cheers > Andy Something I was looking at only yesterday. A compulsory purchase order clearly extending to the centreline of the highway: See areas 1E, 1H: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/735144/Map_EA_UnlockingRiverSevern_Lincomb_CPO_1Jul18.pdf Explanation of ownership of areas 1E, 1H: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/675691/EA_Severn_Lincomb_CPO2018_LIT10898.PDF cheers, Martin. ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
I've yet to see a Land Registry title plan go to the centreline of the road. I guess it might occasionally for an unadopted highway but typically the boundary between highway and private property is either at the back of the pavement or some distance beyond that (verge) depending on location. Cheers Andy Something I was looking at only yesterday. A compulsory purchase order clearly extending to the centreline of the highway: See areas 1E, 1H: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/735144/Map_EA_UnlockingRiverSevern_Lincomb_CPO_1Jul18.pdf Explanation of ownership of areas 1E, 1H: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/675691/EA_Severn_Lincomb_CPO2018_LIT10898.PDF cheers, Martin. ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
-Original Message- From: David Woolley [mailto:for...@david-woolley.me.uk] > Boundaries of properties fronted on roads technically extend to the >middle of the road, at least for residential roads, and I have never see >those marked. I've yet to see a Land Registry title plan go to the centreline of the road. I guess it might occasionally for an unadopted highway but typically the boundary between highway and private property is either at the back of the pavement or some distance beyond that (verge) depending on location. Cheers Andy ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
I've added a "citation needed". AFAIK it may only become apparent when you try to sell your house. It is one of the checks that is made by a conveyancer. It depends how strongly they like to apply the rules. One of those things that could slow down a house purchase.but you are quite right people either don't know or ignore itor it is no longer a requirement. On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 at 11:06 David Woolley wrote: > On 14/01/2019 09:03, Jez Nicholson wrote: > > I have summarised this discussion at > > > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Property_extents_in_the_United_Kingdom > > > > "A property owner is legally required to maintain property boundaries > such as fences. This is intended to minimise disputes. So, being able to > manually survey a reasonable property extent is feasible." > > That is either not true, or the law has fallen into disrepute. With the > car parkification of front yards, boundary features in front yards are a > dying species. That definitely applies to the private/adopted land > boundary, but also commonly applies to neighbouring properties. > > Boundaries of properties fronted on roads technically extend to the > middle of the road, at least for residential roads, and I have never see > those marked. > > Private/adopted boundaries are often very difficult to see in shopping > areas, such that most people think that environmental crime is the > responsibility of the council when it is actually on the shop forecourt, > and the responsibility of shopowner. The boundaries between private > forecourts of shops can be even more difficult to see there may be a > change in surface, or a single line of block paving at the adopted land > boundary, but not between shops. > > ___ > Talk-GB mailing list > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On 14/01/2019 09:03, Jez Nicholson wrote: I have summarised this discussion at https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Property_extents_in_the_United_Kingdom "A property owner is legally required to maintain property boundaries such as fences. This is intended to minimise disputes. So, being able to manually survey a reasonable property extent is feasible." That is either not true, or the law has fallen into disrepute. With the car parkification of front yards, boundary features in front yards are a dying species. That definitely applies to the private/adopted land boundary, but also commonly applies to neighbouring properties. Boundaries of properties fronted on roads technically extend to the middle of the road, at least for residential roads, and I have never see those marked. Private/adopted boundaries are often very difficult to see in shopping areas, such that most people think that environmental crime is the responsibility of the council when it is actually on the shop forecourt, and the responsibility of shopowner. The boundaries between private forecourts of shops can be even more difficult to see there may be a change in surface, or a single line of block paving at the adopted land boundary, but not between shops. ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
I have summarised this discussion at https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Property_extents_in_the_United_Kingdom Please feel free to add more facts and references. Regards, Jez On Mon, 14 Jan 2019 at 09:03 Jez Nicholson wrote: > I have summarised this discussion at > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Property_extents_in_the_United_Kingdom > > Please feel free to add more facts and references. > > Regards, > Jez > > On Thu, 10 Jan 2019 at 12:51 SK53 wrote: > >> On Thu, 10 Jan 2019 at 11:39, Frederik Ramm wrote: >> >>> >>> snip >> >> >>> >>> because they're more likely to get shot on private land. Hope this is >>> not so much of a concern in the UK ;) >>> >>> Bye >>> Frederik >>> >>> >> Only if one is a raptor: https://raptorpersecutionscotland.wordpress.com/ >> >> Jerry >> ___ >> Talk-GB mailing list >> Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org >> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb >> > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
I have summarised this discussion at https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Property_extents_in_the_United_Kingdom Please feel free to add more facts and references. Regards, Jez On Thu, 10 Jan 2019 at 12:51 SK53 wrote: > On Thu, 10 Jan 2019 at 11:39, Frederik Ramm wrote: > >> >> snip > > >> >> because they're more likely to get shot on private land. Hope this is >> not so much of a concern in the UK ;) >> >> Bye >> Frederik >> >> > Only if one is a raptor: https://raptorpersecutionscotland.wordpress.com/ > > Jerry > ___ > Talk-GB mailing list > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On Thu, 10 Jan 2019 at 11:39, Frederik Ramm wrote: > > snip > > because they're more likely to get shot on private land. Hope this is > not so much of a concern in the UK ;) > > Bye > Frederik > > Only if one is a raptor: https://raptorpersecutionscotland.wordpress.com/ Jerry ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Hi, On 10.01.19 01:18, Warin wrote: > Even if it were open .. does OSM want it? Parcel boundaries have generally been undesirable in OSM in the past, mostly because to a lack of on-the-ground verifiability. The advice has always been: If there's a fence, map the fence, not the boundary. If there's no fence, then you don't know there's a boundary. If someone needs the boundaries they can use them them from the open data source themselves. That doesn't mean that people have not imported parcels of course. I think that in a discussion on talk-us, someone once claimed that it can be important to know for a rambler if they're on public or private land because they're more likely to get shot on private land. Hope this is not so much of a concern in the UK ;) Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ## N49°00'09" E008°23'33" ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On 10/01/2019 00:18, Warin wrote: Even if it were open .. does OSM want it? I don't see any specific tags for it? landuse=residential combined with addr:* It is something I would definitely want included if it were possible to capture the data. The main reason it is rare at the moment is probably that it is very difficult to deduce boundary lines from aerial images without very detailed local knowledge or surveys, of land that is private. And you do want to have them accurate and up to date. ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
I think in both France & Spain the cadastral information has been used largely for mapping buildings and not land-parcels. In places I know the French cadastral parcel data is difficult to interpret: overlapping parcels; individual buildings as multiple parcels; parcel boundaries not according to the location of the little yellow boundary markers on the ground etc. I presume some of these are artefacts of how the cadastre is maintained by each commune and subsequent digitisation. In some cases cadastral parcels do not seem to be consolidated, so it's impossible to actually derive real property boundaries without some on-the-ground knowledge. I'm pushed to think of lots of things I might do with parcel boundaries: accurate location of urban footpaths is one, nature reserve boundaries another (either directly or because NE data ceases to be encumbered). I don't know how much the parcels will accord with things like field boundaries in rural areas: I'll take a look at the LR Inspire data for S Derbyshire to get an idea. Jerry On Thu, 10 Jan 2019 at 09:07, Dan S wrote: > Op do 10 jan. 2019 om 00:19 schreef Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com>: > > > > Even if it were open .. does OSM want it? > > Is it equivalent to the "cadastral" data that's been used in France and > Spain? > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Cadastre > Their experience could be informative, about what the data can help with > > > I don't see any specific tags for it? > > Make tags if you need them... > > Dan > > ___ > Talk-GB mailing list > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Op do 10 jan. 2019 om 00:19 schreef Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com>: > > Even if it were open .. does OSM want it? Is it equivalent to the "cadastral" data that's been used in France and Spain? https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Cadastre Their experience could be informative, about what the data can help with > I don't see any specific tags for it? Make tags if you need them... Dan ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
I’d maybe see the benefit for this data in more accurate/consistent landuse=residential areas? The whole “do you include the road, or create the area up to the road” decision. Gareth On 10 Jan 2019, at 00:19, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com<mailto:61sundow...@gmail.com>> wrote: Even if it were open .. does OSM want it? I don't see any specific tags for it? And you do want to have them accurate and up to date. --- Example of inaccurate property extent problems .. from Australia - https://www.news.com.au/national/queensland/news/coroner-hits-out-at-police-use-of-google-maps-printouts-in-search-for-missing-man/news-story/0d005d8018e694433313ab2b941c7df4 A recent coroner hit out at the decision to rely on Google Maps printouts in the manhunt — noting that Queensland Police Service (QPS) had better tools available to them to search the area. In fact, the inquest detailed how officers on the case were later given a much more informative aerial map of the area from the local council, at no cost to police whatsoever. “It is quite apparent the quality of the images of the property on this map is far superior to the Google map images used in the search of the property and one wonders if the same mistake in conducting a search of only half the property would have been made if this map had been obtained,” Deputy State Coroner John Lock said in his report. --- There are lots of potential problems from mapping private property extents. Don't think I would want to go there. On 09/01/19 23:40, Andy Robinson wrote: Tom, Jerry, Chris thanks for the very helpful prompts. Cheers Andy From: Chris Hill [mailto:o...@raggedred.net] Sent: 09 January 2019 12:37 To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org<mailto:talk-gb@openstreetmap.org> Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents Here's one of Jerry's blog posts about the not-so-open Land Registry data: https://sk53-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/not-very-inspired-land-registry-open.html and my post about testing using them: https://chris-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/land-registry-inspire-polygons.html As Tom says, these datasets are not Open Data and we cannot use them as a data source in OSM. I feel that the Open Government Licence should not be used in this case as it isn't Open. On 09/01/2019 11:47, SK53 wrote: Hi Andy, Both Chris Hill & I blogged about them at the time, but they NEVER had any semblance of being open data. The same proved to be true of the Land Registry Prices Paid which now can only be used if you are an estate agent. Owen has covered both on his Map Gubbins blog. Have to dash, so no time to find the links. Jerry On Wed, 9 Jan 2019 at 11:07, Andy Robinson mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com>> wrote: As a follow-up, has anyone looked at the OGL licenced INSPIRE Land Registry index polygons? https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/download-inspire-index-polygons Data is in GML format. Cheers Andy -Original Message- From: Andy Robinson [mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com<mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com>] Sent: 09 January 2019 10:56 To: 'David Woolley'; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org<mailto:talk-gb@openstreetmap.org> Subject: RE: [Talk-GB] Property extents On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote: >Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building >outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from >aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards. Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation with Land Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up. Cheers Andy ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org<mailto:Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Even if it were open .. does OSM want it?
I don't see any specific tags for it?
And you do want to have them accurate and up to date.
---
Example of inaccurate property extent problems .. from Australia -
https://www.news.com.au/national/queensland/news/coroner-hits-out-at-police-use-of-google-maps-printouts-in-search-for-missing-man/news-story/0d005d8018e694433313ab2b941c7df4
A recent coroner hit out at the decision to rely on Google Maps
printouts in the manhunt — noting that Queensland Police Service (QPS)
had better tools available to them to search the area.
In fact, the inquest detailed how officers on the case were later given
a much more informative aerial map of the area from the local council,
at no cost to police whatsoever.
“It is quite apparent the quality of the images of the property on this
map is far superior to the Google map images used in the search of the
property and one wonders if the same mistake in conducting a search of
only half the property would have been made if this map had been
obtained,” Deputy State Coroner John Lock said in his report.
---
There are lots of potential problems from mapping private property
extents. Don't think I would want to go there.
On 09/01/19 23:40, Andy Robinson wrote:
Tom, Jerry, Chris thanks for the very helpful prompts.
Cheers
Andy
*From:*Chris Hill [mailto:o...@raggedred.net]
*Sent:* 09 January 2019 12:37
*To:* talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
*Subject:* Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Here's one of Jerry's blog posts about the not-so-open Land Registry data:
https://sk53-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/not-very-inspired-land-registry-open.html
and my post about testing using them:
https://chris-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/land-registry-inspire-polygons.html
As Tom says, these datasets are not Open Data and we cannot use them
as a data source in OSM. I feel that the Open Government Licence
should not be used in this case as it isn't Open.
On 09/01/2019 11:47, SK53 wrote:
Hi Andy,
Both Chris Hill & I blogged about them at the time, but they NEVER
had any semblance of being open data.
The same proved to be true of the Land Registry Prices Paid which
now can only be used if you are an estate agent.
Owen has covered both on his Map Gubbins blog.
Have to dash, so no time to find the links.
Jerry
On Wed, 9 Jan 2019 at 11:07, Andy Robinson mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com>> wrote:
As a follow-up, has anyone looked at the OGL licenced INSPIRE
Land Registry index polygons?
https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/download-inspire-index-polygons
Data is in GML format.
Cheers
Andy
-Original Message-
From: Andy Robinson [mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com
<mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com>]
Sent: 09 January 2019 10:56
To: 'David Woolley'; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
<mailto:talk-gb@openstreetmap.org>
Subject: RE: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote:
>Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building
>outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from
>aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front
yards.
Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation
with Land Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up.
Cheers
Andy
___
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Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Tom, Jerry, Chris thanks for the very helpful prompts. Cheers Andy From: Chris Hill [mailto:o...@raggedred.net] Sent: 09 January 2019 12:37 To: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents Here's one of Jerry's blog posts about the not-so-open Land Registry data: https://sk53-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/not-very-inspired-land-registry-open.html and my post about testing using them: https://chris-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/land-registry-inspire-polygons.html As Tom says, these datasets are not Open Data and we cannot use them as a data source in OSM. I feel that the Open Government Licence should not be used in this case as it isn't Open. On 09/01/2019 11:47, SK53 wrote: Hi Andy, Both Chris Hill & I blogged about them at the time, but they NEVER had any semblance of being open data. The same proved to be true of the Land Registry Prices Paid which now can only be used if you are an estate agent. Owen has covered both on his Map Gubbins blog. Have to dash, so no time to find the links. Jerry On Wed, 9 Jan 2019 at 11:07, Andy Robinson wrote: As a follow-up, has anyone looked at the OGL licenced INSPIRE Land Registry index polygons? https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/download-inspire-index-polygons Data is in GML format. Cheers Andy -Original Message- From: Andy Robinson [mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com] Sent: 09 January 2019 10:56 To: 'David Woolley'; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org Subject: RE: [Talk-GB] Property extents On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote: >Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building >outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from >aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards. Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation with Land Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up. Cheers Andy ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb -- cheers Chris Hill (chillly) ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Here's one of Jerry's blog posts about the not-so-open Land Registry data:
https://sk53-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/not-very-inspired-land-registry-open.html
and my post about testing using them:
https://chris-osm.blogspot.com/2013/10/land-registry-inspire-polygons.html
As Tom says, these datasets are not Open Data and we cannot use them as
a data source in OSM. I feel that the Open Government Licence should not
be used in this case as it isn't Open.
On 09/01/2019 11:47, SK53 wrote:
Hi Andy,
Both Chris Hill & I blogged about them at the time, but they NEVER had
any semblance of being open data.
The same proved to be true of the Land Registry Prices Paid which now
can only be used if you are an estate agent.
Owen has covered both on his Map Gubbins blog.
Have to dash, so no time to find the links.
Jerry
On Wed, 9 Jan 2019 at 11:07, Andy Robinson <mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com>> wrote:
As a follow-up, has anyone looked at the OGL licenced INSPIRE Land
Registry index polygons?
https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/download-inspire-index-polygons
Data is in GML format.
Cheers
Andy
-Original Message-
From: Andy Robinson [mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com
<mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com>]
Sent: 09 January 2019 10:56
To: 'David Woolley'; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org
<mailto:talk-gb@openstreetmap.org>
Subject: RE: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote:
>Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building
>outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from
>aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards.
Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation
with Land Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up.
Cheers
Andy
___
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Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org <mailto:Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org>
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
___
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Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
--
cheers
Chris Hill (chillly)
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Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
Hi Andy, Both Chris Hill & I blogged about them at the time, but they NEVER had any semblance of being open data. The same proved to be true of the Land Registry Prices Paid which now can only be used if you are an estate agent. Owen has covered both on his Map Gubbins blog. Have to dash, so no time to find the links. Jerry On Wed, 9 Jan 2019 at 11:07, Andy Robinson wrote: > As a follow-up, has anyone looked at the OGL licenced INSPIRE Land > Registry index polygons? > https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/download-inspire-index-polygons > > Data is in GML format. > > Cheers > Andy > > -Original Message- > From: Andy Robinson [mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com] > Sent: 09 January 2019 10:56 > To: 'David Woolley'; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org > Subject: RE: [Talk-GB] Property extents > > On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote: > >Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building > >outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from > >aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards. > > Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation with Land > Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up. > > Cheers > Andy > > > > > > ___ > Talk-GB mailing list > Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb > ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
DO NOT USE THIS. You need to read the license properly, and especially the linked document with "third party conditions" from OS that has all sorts of unacceptable restrictions: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/inspire-index-polygons-spatial-data#conditions-of-use https://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/about/governance/policies/inspire-index-polygons-licensing-terms.html I imagine the upcoming hopefully properly free data will basically be the same though. Tom On 09/01/2019 11:06, Andy Robinson wrote: As a follow-up, has anyone looked at the OGL licenced INSPIRE Land Registry index polygons? https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/download-inspire-index-polygons Data is in GML format. Cheers Andy -Original Message- From: Andy Robinson [mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com] Sent: 09 January 2019 10:56 To: 'David Woolley'; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org Subject: RE: [Talk-GB] Property extents On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote: Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards. Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation with Land Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up. Cheers Andy ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb -- Tom Hughes (t...@compton.nu) http://compton.nu/ ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
As a follow-up, has anyone looked at the OGL licenced INSPIRE Land Registry index polygons? https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/download-inspire-index-polygons Data is in GML format. Cheers Andy -Original Message- From: Andy Robinson [mailto:ajrli...@gmail.com] Sent: 09 January 2019 10:56 To: 'David Woolley'; talk-gb@openstreetmap.org Subject: RE: [Talk-GB] Property extents On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote: >Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building >outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from >aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards. Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation with Land Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up. Cheers Andy ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On Wed 09/01/2019 10:35 David Woolley wrote: >Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building >outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from >aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards. Agreed, though I wonder whether this will have any correlation with Land Registry. I'm guessing .gov isn’t that joined up. Cheers Andy ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] Property extents
On 09/01/2019 09:36, Rob Nickerson wrote: It is the land area (e.g. garden boundary of a detached house) rather than the building outline. They deem the building outline to have too high a commercial value under their current funding mechanism. Actually, that seems more valuable to OSM than the building outlines as it is much more difficult to accurately recover from aerial imagery and ground surveys can normally only see front yards. ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
[Talk-GB] Property extents
Hi all, You may recall that the geospatial commission & ordnance survey have announced that they will be releasing "property extents". By chance I found myself in a meeting room with both organisations so I asked what "property extents" means. It is the land area (e.g. garden boundary of a detached house) rather than the building outline. They deem the building outline to have too high a commercial value under their current funding mechanism. I also found out that the commission received over 200 responses (202 I think) hence the delay. They will be providing a summary of the responses. Best regards, Rob ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
