Re: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET?
The first we actually applies more to the world than just MS. This is something that we've shipped w/ the past 2 or 3 betas. The we're is definitely MS / the IronPython team. The main concern is that we are shoe-horning a dynmamic language into a static world and that's not really the right thing to do. With enough effort we might be able to pull it off, but there might be a better way to go which enables ASP.NET w/o the feeling of it not being Python. There might also always be rough edges that we can never quite make work correctly - and given we've spent all this time making IronPython work like CPython we don't want to just throw that away. Just to give you some concrete examples of what doesn't work with the static compiler we have today: Multiple inheritance Overloading functions when there are multiple virtuals to overload Inheriting from assemblies dynamically added at runtime (e.g. clr.AddReference) Dealing w/ well-known names that aren't really well-known (e.g. object, property, etc...) and can be redefined OTOH you should be able to do all of this once you're inside ASP.NET script tags modulo bugs (which there are probably plenty of). We're still researching other options so it's a little too soon to say what the alternatives would look like. And the final two questions I don't think we have answers to right now, but we'll be sure to let you know when we have more to say. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Will Sadkin Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 10:25 AM To: 'Discussion of IronPython' Subject: Re: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET? Hi Dino, Please excuse me, as I'm new to this list: I assume we in that sentence is Microsoft? (The response provided leads to some obvious follow questions:) - What are the concerns/issues with this approach? Isn't this the intended mechanism for extending support for new stuff under ASP.NET? - If you decide that it's not the right way to do it, what are the alternatives for doing ASP.NET and Python, and how would they work? - Is Microsoft actually planning a supported integration w/IP and ASP.NET? - Can you tell us when will there be a real strategy/beta that I *can* make bets on? /Will Dino Viehland wrote: We actually do have a PythonCodeProvider that can be enabled by setting up a web.config that points at IronPython.dll's PythonProvider class. It is highly experimental and using this compilation mode doesn't pass our full test suite - in other words you might find some features work incorrectly or don't work at all. We're also investigating other options to try and come up w/ the right model here - we're not sure this is the right way to do ASP.NET Python together. This might give you something to play with and as always we'd love to hear your feedback, but you probably don't want to make any long-term bets on it. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Will Sadkin Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 8:10 AM To: 'users@lists.ironpython.com' Subject: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET? Except for one casual mention of this back in August of last year, I can't find any mention of any plans for this. For me, this is the holy grail for IronPython; I need a rapid webapp design and implementation framework, but ideally would like to use Python to drive the business logic behind it. Can anyone on this list provide any information about any plans and or target dates for IronPython's integration into the ASP.NET framework? /Will Sadkin Parlance Corporation ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com
Re: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET?
Dino wrote: snip The main concern is that we are shoe-horning a dynmamic language into a static world and that's not really the right thing to do. With enough effort we might be able to pull it off, but there might be a better way to go which enables ASP.NET w/o the feeling of it not being Python. There might also always be rough edges that we can never quite make work correctly - and given we've spent all this time making IronPython work like CPython we don't want to just throw that away. /snip One pythonic way of hosting IronPython within ASP.NET is to use WSGI (http://wsgi.org/wsgi/What_is_WSGI) Seo did the original work and I have made his stuff more WSGI PEP compliant and work with the latest IronPython Beta hosting API. SInce Seo is not near a network connection for a few weeks and cannot add these changes to his code, I have put my changes up under subversion at: http://svn.isapi-wsgi.python-hosting.com/sandbox/mark/ironpy-wsgi/ It does give you access to true ASP.NET page generation, needs some docs and a lillte more work. But I have been using it for RSS/Atom feed generation from a ADO.NET database under both IIS ASP.NET and Apache mod_mono. This email post of Seo's should help you get going: http://lists.ironpython.com/pipermail/users-ironpython.com/2006-March/002049.html Mark ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com
Re: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET?
On 7/26/06, Mark Rees [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It does give you access to true ASP.NET page generation, needs some docs and a lillte more work. Opps, a small typo, I meant: It does not give you access to true ASP.NET page generation, Sorry if the typo got people excited. :-) Mark ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com
Re: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET?
If you could combine something like Twisted with ASP.NET...woohoo! On 7/25/06, Dino Viehland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We actually do have a PythonCodeProvider that can be enabled by setting up a web.config that points at IronPython.dll's PythonProvider class. It is highly experimental and using this compilation mode doesn't pass our full test suite - in other words you might find some features work incorrectly or don't work at all. We're also investigating other options to try and come up w/ the right model here - we're not sure this is the right way to do ASP.NET Python together. This might give you something to play with and as always we'd love to hear your feedback, but you probably don't want to make any long-term bets on it. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Will Sadkin Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 8:10 AM To: 'users@lists.ironpython.com' Subject: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET? Except for one casual mention of this back in August of last year, I can't find any mention of any plans for this. For me, this is the holy grail for IronPython; I need a rapid webapp design and implementation framework, but ideally would like to use Python to drive the business logic behind it. Can anyone on this list provide any information about any plans and or target dates for IronPython's integration into the ASP.NET framework? /Will Sadkin Parlance Corporation ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com
Re: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET?
Hi Dino, Please excuse me, as I'm new to this list: I assume we in that sentence is Microsoft? (The response provided leads to some obvious follow questions:) - What are the concerns/issues with this approach? Isn't this the intended mechanism for extending support for new stuff under ASP.NET? - If you decide that it's not the right way to do it, what are the alternatives for doing ASP.NET and Python, and how would they work? - Is Microsoft actually planning a supported integration w/IP and ASP.NET? - Can you tell us when will there be a real strategy/beta that I *can* make bets on? /Will Dino Viehland wrote: We actually do have a PythonCodeProvider that can be enabled by setting up a web.config that points at IronPython.dll's PythonProvider class. It is highly experimental and using this compilation mode doesn't pass our full test suite - in other words you might find some features work incorrectly or don't work at all. We're also investigating other options to try and come up w/ the right model here - we're not sure this is the right way to do ASP.NET Python together. This might give you something to play with and as always we'd love to hear your feedback, but you probably don't want to make any long-term bets on it. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Will Sadkin Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 8:10 AM To: 'users@lists.ironpython.com' Subject: [IronPython] IronPython (PythonCodePovider) for ASP.NET? Except for one casual mention of this back in August of last year, I can't find any mention of any plans for this. For me, this is the holy grail for IronPython; I need a rapid webapp design and implementation framework, but ideally would like to use Python to drive the business logic behind it. Can anyone on this list provide any information about any plans and or target dates for IronPython's integration into the ASP.NET framework? /Will Sadkin Parlance Corporation ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com ___ users mailing list users@lists.ironpython.com http://lists.ironpython.com/listinfo.cgi/users-ironpython.com
