[Vo]:Outline for prosaic black-box generation of higher than chemical heat
Consider a well-insulated box. It contains a reservoir holding a substance with high specific heat and high melting point. Into the reservoir, and through a tube into the box, may flow water, and steam may escape. Internal controls may regulate flow. Hot air may be used to initially heat the substance. How much heat may be stored in the substance and used to vaporize water? It is certainly not limited by chemistry. No claim is made by me that such a device has been used to demonstrate heat generation, only that it is possible, and not particularly difficult.
Re: [Vo]:Outline for prosaic black-box generation of higher than chemical heat
On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 8:59 AM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Consider a well-insulated box. It contains a reservoir holding a substance with high specific heat and high melting point. Into the reservoir, and through a tube into the box, may flow water, and steam may escape. Internal controls may regulate flow. Hot air may be used to initially heat the substance. How much heat may be stored in the substance and used to vaporize water? It is certainly not limited by chemistry. No claim is made by me that such a device has been used to demonstrate heat generation, only that it is possible, and not particularly difficult. Where's the rest of your post? You mean that's it?! I read the entire thing. :-) T
Re: [Vo]:Outline for prosaic black-box generation of higher than chemical heat
I am a chemist (chemical engineer, actually) Can you give some practical examples and heat balances for them? Thanks! Peter On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 4:14 PM, Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Feb 10, 2011 at 8:59 AM, Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Consider a well-insulated box. It contains a reservoir holding a substance with high specific heat and high melting point. Into the reservoir, and through a tube into the box, may flow water, and steam may escape. Internal controls may regulate flow. Hot air may be used to initially heat the substance. How much heat may be stored in the substance and used to vaporize water? It is certainly not limited by chemistry. No claim is made by me that such a device has been used to demonstrate heat generation, only that it is possible, and not particularly difficult. Where's the rest of your post? You mean that's it?! I read the entire thing. :-) T
Re: [Vo]:Outline for prosaic black-box generation of higher than chemical heat
Abd ul-Rahman Lomax a...@lomaxdesign.com wrote: Consider a well-insulated box. It contains a reservoir holding a substance with high specific heat and high melting point. Into the reservoir, and through a tube into the box, may flow water, and steam may escape. Internal controls may regulate flow. Hot air may be used to initially heat the substance. How much heat may be stored in the substance and used to vaporize water? It is certainly not limited by chemistry. It is limited by electron bonds, which is to say chemistry in the largest sense. You can store heat in a solid until it melts, or a liquid until it vaporizes. The higher the specific heat, the more you can store. Of all ordinary substances, water has the highest specific heat. It can store about 10 times more energy than metal. If you pressurize the water, you can make it hot enough to boil water. I would heat it with an electrical resistance heater rather than hot air. Energy is stored by this method in many conventional systems. For example, some solar thermal energy plants store heat in hot oil, so they can continue generating when clouds temporarily cover the sun, or for a while after sunset. No claim is made by me that such a device has been used to demonstrate heat generation, only that it is possible, and not particularly difficult. Not difficult at all, but the energy density is low. I think it is lower than a battery or most chemical fuel. It would be a little tricky to have something like this produce the output performance of the Rossi device. You would have to have a secret remote control that vectors most of the cooling water around the heat source at first, and then gradually sends the water to carry off the heat from the hot material. To store 23,107 kJ, you would have to have a much larger mass of material than you can fit into the Rossi device. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Outline for prosaic black-box generation of higher than chemical heat
At 12:34 PM 2/10/2011, Jed Rothwell wrote: It would be a little tricky to have something like this produce the output performance of the Rossi device. You would have to have a secret remote control that vectors most of the cooling water around the heat source at first, and then gradually sends the water to carry off the heat from the hot material. To store 23,107 kJ, you would have to have a much larger mass of material than you can fit into the Rossi device. Mmmm. how much water did the device heat to 100 C? I haven't looked at the specific heat numbers, but it looks to me like you could have an internal control that would simply send water into the heat source, it would boil rapidly and leave, so you'd control the amount of steam by how much water you let in. Until the heat source approached 100 degrees C, a constant flow of water would produce a constant flow of steam. Using water to hold the heat would require pressure containment, complicating everything. Instead, you couldn't use a very hot metal? Below melting or even molten? Was that figure 23 MJ? Anyway, rough calculation, I came up with about 10 or 15 quarts of iron just below melting. Did I do that right? That's not all that much volume. And if you use molten iron, it's quite a bit more. Gets more dangerous, of course.
