Re: [libreoffice-website] Re: Banner for website
Hi all,
sorry, all my responses to the Website list are getting garbled. Don't
know what's up with that.
Anywho this is in relation to the clover leaf in the pigs mouth;
Christoph, I think it's cute and I like the optimism it portrays. I
would only remove the stroke from the leaves because I've avoided using
strokes in the pig.
...
Bernhard and Marc, I hate to be a downer, but in relation to the
clover-leaf being a symbol for LibO as a whole, I'm not sure about that,
I think the link is weak.
Clover leaf (luck, prosperity) makes sense at donation-time but what is
the link between Office software and luck in general? Bit of a stretch.
And I don't think we want the negative connotations that come with a
luck symbol (eg: you need a lot of luck to be able to use writer well).
Besides, when I think Libre, I think of /intentional/ actions of purpose
(like liberation and freedom), not luck.
I think when thinking symbolism to represent the whole project, we
should be looking for things that suggest strength, determination and
will-power.
But that's just my take.
-Nik
P.S. While I'm here, did anyone have suggestions about what other
graphics I could make for the fund-raising effort?
Some good ideas would be handy if you've got'em. I'm running on empty.
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Re: Re: Re: [libreoffice-website] Banner for website
Hi all, sorry for not replying with thread,, the message body is getting garbled. On 6:59 AM, Christoph Noack wrote: Cool, thanks for the proposal ... and moreover, thanks for jumping especially since your time is limited (as I know very well). Thanks Christoph, I've got a quick break in my research so I can pitch in a little more this week. I might go into details in a personal email, but the outcome was good! =) So I have 1 week of free time Besides, this is a somewhat urgent LibO matter right? (the fund-raising) So, I'd like to ask you for holding the breath (more or less), so that I can collect everything I'm aware about on a wiki page. I hope that this will make our life much easier ... it worked very well for the icons, so let's do that for the banner as well. Even if it costs another few hours. Agreed? Sure, thanks for doing that! In the mean time, people mentioned images for the donations pages would be helpful. I've created 2 cartoon images that might be useful (or maybe not =). It's a piggy-bank and a coin-stack, they aren't great or many, but it's all I could get done in a couple of hours =( Here is the preview PNG; http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:Donation_preview.png and here is the SVG; http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/cgi_img_auth.php/5/56/TDF_donationCartoons.svg Hope you find a use for them somewhere (on donation webpages/banners). If they are useful I'll make more. If you do use them, make sure they are small otherwise the subtle flaws will be more visible. Ah, and Nik, is there a chance to borrow some minutes of your precious time for some focused discussion or to get the source of your proposal? Pfft precious time, you're priceless Christoph =) I've uploaded the PSD here; http://tdf.nikashsingh.com/misc/FundraisingBanner_Cleaner.psd Consider it whatever license will allow you to do whatever you need with it, attribution-less, no-rights-reserved kinda deal. I'd be happy to join a focused discussion too. Actually I have a whole buncha stuff I've been saving up for a chat on the Design-list. I think Johannes is going to cover a lot of that, though =) By the way, this banner; http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:LibreOffice_FoundationChallenge_WebBanner_728x60.png Is looking BLOODY amazing. -Nik -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to website+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/website/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: Re: [libreoffice-website] Banner for website
Hi all, On 6:59 AM, David Nelson wrote: Hi, :-) I'd love to see some different ideas from the other guys, especially Paulo, and from Nikash... David Nelson Geez David that's mighty flattering of you. You'll make a grown man blush with that kinda talk old chap =) I'm sorry if I've missed the boat or if better ideas were discussed, I've a mountain of Email to conquer, I just wanted to respond quickly. I've uploaded another idea here; http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:FundraisingBanner.jpg While I'd agree that the current banner is clear, I think it is important to create a /pleasant/ atmosphere around the progress-meter (which the blue will do nicely, and red, for me at least, is creating uneasiness and certainly not a positive association), not a sense of panicked-urgency even /if/ that is the case. I also think it shouldn't be contained in a conventional box/banner because people have become immune to top-banner ads, there is a greater chance they will ignore it if it looks like an advertisement. Oh and I should mention, the current banner breaks the page formatting on my computer. See capture; http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/File:BrokenBanner.jpg (I'm in the unfortunate position of using an old windows XP machine / resolution 1280x800 / Firefox3.6.13, but I imagine there's plenty of people in this ruddy old boat) Again, disregard this if it's too late. Sorry I couldn't help earlier. Time, she is always running out on me. -Nik PS. When it is pertinent, I'd like to raise the matter of streamlining the chat/facebook/extensions links on the homepage. They look scruffy and make the page busy, I'm sure there's a way of reducing the visual clutter. Let me know if anyone is interested in this as well. -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to website+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/website/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
Re: RE: [libreoffice-website] Libreoffice.org website dev sitrep 2011-02-02 - [Was: Work on the Why? pages]
Narayan, On 6:59 AM, Narayan Aras wrote: Hi Nik 1. The website project has no graphic designer on board-why? By your logic, everyone else has time to be part of every other list. Their time is expendable, yours is precious right? Tell me, how many lists are you a part of? Do you practice what you preach or are you just talking sh!+? You seem to expect a lot of others and deliver very little yourself. 2. There is no planned wireframe/icons for home page, and other sets of pages- why? There is no search functionality on the LibO site, why? There is no option for users to log in using facebook connect and comment on features, why? There is no website for us Australian LibO users wanting to exchange and rate wombat and koala templates, why? There is no option on the CMS to allow users to upload pictures of their grandma's using Impress, why? Oh my bad, I should probably work closely with this list regarding these matters rather than expect that you would read my mind, right? And I should probably understand that you chaps are busy and my requests aren't the most urgent matters you deal with, yes? Geez, that'd be nice of me! 2. We raced against launch date, missed it and still no graphic inputs-why? Don't you think someone from your team had to contribute? I'm probably wasting my time repeating what others have already told you, so, -snip-. Please do not search for any motives- We are terribly short of web designer(s). We are not. We have a Design list full. You wouldn't know because you didn't really want to work with us. You simply want to bring in someone you know from work and are fond of. If you need to build a better relationship with your workmates, do it at work. Have a beer, shoot some pool, indulge in a little bro-mance, whatever. LibO is not your social tool. The time is running out- The website is far from ready. And I happened to have access to an excellent source. There is nothing more to it. Interesting, time is running out? who decided that? you? has the site gone offline? have the CSS styles dropped out? is there a meteor heading towards the LibO servers? IS THE PRESIDENT OF THE INTERNETS ABOUT TO EVALUATE OUR WEBSITE TO DEEM IT WEB-WORTHY??? Your matter of urgency seems somewhat self-imposed. I want the best possible website for LibO as soon as possible much more than you do, but I have a better understanding of what possible means and I recognise that our community of VOLUNTEERS is working flat-out on their respective tasks. I wouldn't be a big enough jerk to impose my priorities onto others, let alone onto other lists. But you don't seem limited by these rational concerns. Regards, -Narayan Ooooh this is going to be long, but you've wasted so much of everyone else's time, I don't feel obligated not to waste yours. ... Of course I feel uncomfortable saying this on a list which is not where I make my primary contribution to this project, but multiple people have tried to reason with you, but you're not open to that. Let me put it simply... I don't know whether you are genuinely interested in the well-being of this project, but you don't behave like such a person. For three reasons; 1. You don't seem to value anyone's opinion but your own. 2. You don't seem to respect people in this community that the community respects. 3. You don't seem capable of negotiating or understanding that your one vote does not outweigh the vote of many others. People have tried to steer you gently in the right direction, or encouraged you, but your blind faith in your opinion has become somewhat of a problem. I've been watching quietly for ages, imagine my irritation that I actually have to write this at all? OpenSource projects have a fundamental problem in that people who cause delays and argue more than they contribute *can't* be /told/ to leave, they have to realise it for themselves that they have become a burden. A /burden/, Narayan. You seem to be exploiting this loophole a great deal. While I, personally would love to see you leave for good, I'm sure others would suggest you take some time out and really contemplate whether you are really in this for the right reasons; and whether your input is actually benefiting others, rather than slowing them down. If you DO decide to return after that time-out (that I suspect you don't think you need to take), when you come back, *DON'T insult the members of this community like you have done the last few days*. I'm sure you think you're making a mockery of some members of this project, but in truth, all I see is how much *you can't /cooperate/*, let alone */collaborate/*. Frankly, you're making an ass of yourself while you post smiley faces and assume you're being clever. Members like Charles SCHULZ are founding members of this community, no matter what you say, they will retain the support and admiration of this community *long* after you're gone. How DARE you assume you even
Re: RE: [libreoffice-website] Libreoffice.org website dev sitrep 2011-02-02 - [Was: Work on the Why? pages]
the community. Like everyone here has done. It might not be the most immediate solution, but how often is the /immediate/ solution the /best/ solution? I'm appealing to your pragmatism, to trust that slow and steady will win this race. Sorry Ivan. I've undone all your hard work in diplomacy. I don't know how you are the tolerant man you are. But if I scream in one ear while you speak softly in the other, I'm sure one of us will get through, otherwise we'll just have an odd conversation. But this is only the crutch of one man. I don't think the entire Website team has supported this suggestion to bypass the Design team rather than work with them? ... I quite admired what you and Mike all went through recently to establish yourselves as valid voices in this community. It would be a shame if all that determination were driven by self-gratification, instead of true conviction. -Nik. PS. This Email IS insulting, but only to Narayan+anyone-else-who-thinks-our-community-is-composed-of-ONLY-the-Website-team. If you've taken offence to it, no apologies, and rest assured, I'm as uninterested in working with you, as you are me. On 6:59 AM, Narayan Aras wrote: Hi Ivan, After all, we are NOT screening a thousand contenders to select the lucky winner. So why do you feel this compulsion to get the designer approved by the Design team? I wanted to bring a designer strictly one time; only for the website work (not on permanent basis). He would have done this as a big favor to me. So I proposed that he should be doing his good deed and go his way, but I could not have him judged. He would have been a rescuer, not a supplicant. I think there might be a misunderstanding here. The focus of the Design team is much broader than the website. For one, it has a focus on branding, which will necessarily set constraints on the website design (e.g. which colors to use, what kinds of styles to develop, etc). It also has a focus on user experience, which includes (among many other things) wireframing. From what I gather, you are interested in these topics. They can certainly be discussed here on the website list, but to get the big picture, I would suggest you also subscribe to the Design list to keep up with related developments. I think you'll be surprised by the talent we have and it would be great to have you on board. sure! :) And about this approval per se- How appropriate is it? How exactly will the Design team approve the designer? You know the professional profile of my friend. Do we have bigger web professionals on board who can judge him? Not necessarily, but I don't like the implication of what you are saying because you are implicitly making a judgement yourself. No one can come in expecting a mandate to be handed over to them just because they are a professional - they will need to show that they can make tangible contributions to meet the needs of the project *now*. This will allow them to establish merit and have their suggestions taken seriously in the future. He was NOT interested in joining the team. He agreed to help out only because I requested. He would have done his design, gifted it to me (to Libo) and moved on. Why do we have to harass such good samaritans with our approval process? If our car is wrecked on the road, and if someone is offering first aid, do we subject him to full approval process? Or just grab his offer thankfully? And what has this to do with the OS model?? I refuse to believe that an OS project has to be run unprofessionally as a policy. Website design is a specialized field, and even an OS project would have to follow its norms. Yes, there are some norms we need to follow, but there are also norms set by the project that website designers will need to follow. We are a collaborative volunteer community, not a web design firm. The dynamics are rather different - it can be a lot more complicated, much slower, but also very rewarding when it's done. While handling guests. we have to be extra courteous, and not make them jump hoops in the name of rules. No I think the root cause is that some members lack knowledge of this field (website design). Then they try to make it up with common sense. This results in conflicts. I'm going to rewrite your statement in a way that I hope will make an important point. Please don't interpret it as if it refers to you specifically but rather try to see the point behind it (i.e., we need 'institutional knowledge' within the project as much as we need 'expertise' in a specific discipline): Some members lack the knowledge of this project (LibreOffice). Then they try to make it up with the way things are done elsewhere (be it design school, web design firms, commercial/'real life' experience, even other open source projects, etc). This results in conflicts. UX principles will remain universal, as applied to a website for any purpose. It has nothing to do with organizational dynamics. Are dynamics responsible
Re: Re: [libreoffice-website] Inviting a new web designer to work with us (was: LibO website dev..)
On 6:59 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote: Hi, Le Fri, 04 Feb 2011 11:12:01 +0100, Bernhard Dippoldbernh...@familie-dippold.at a écrit : content snipped And as this is my personal point of view (but based on years of experience in this community), I'd like others to add a short +1 or -1 to this summary showing if I met their point of prioritizing collaboration over single time donation. -1 to inviting a new web designer. best, Charles. -2 to inviting a new web designer. We are an open-source /project/, not /design orphans/. We don't need donations of graphic design, we need contributions made by /volunteers/ in our *community*. -Nik -- Unsubscribe instructions: E-mail to website+h...@libreoffice.org List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/www/website/ *** All posts to this list are publicly archived for eternity ***
