Hiding 'skip nav' links (was Re: [WSG] Image replace or ALT text?)
El jue, 19-02-2004 a las 03:56, Tim Lucas escribió: the source document. People that claim that image replacement is more accessible than img tags are simply wrong. They are just as wrong as those who claim their website is more accessible because they include a div style=display: none;a href=#navSkip to navigation/a/div in the top of their document as most user agents ignore display:none [1]. Regarding this subject, i'd like to point people to these resources on providing accesible 'skip nav' links while avoiding display:none http://www.hicksdesign.co.uk/articles/archives/000180.php http://blog.tom.me.uk/2003/09/13/skipadeedoodah.php#tools HTH -- Manuel González Noriega Simplelógica, construcción web URL: http://simplelogica.net EMAIL: [EMAIL PROTECTED] TELEFONO: (+34) 985 22 12 65 Logicola es el weblog de Simplelógica http://simplelogica.net/logicola/ /pThat's right. We said Frontpage./p * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
[WSG] WSG Member Countries
Just thought you all may be interested in the WSG user base. 136 Australia 2 Austria 6 Belgium 8 Brazil 8 Canada 2 Denmark 1 Finland 1 France 8 Germany 1 Iceland 3 India 1 Indonesia 1 Iraq 4 Italy 1 Jordan 4 New Zealand 1 Norway 1 Peru 2 Philippines 1 Portugal 2 Russia 1 Scotland 2 Singapore 3 Spain 3 Sweden 1 Switzerland 3 The Netherlands 18 United Kingdom 1 Ukraine 45 USA Looks like we're missing only the African continent (and Antarctica I guess). P * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
[WSG] Re: WSG Member Countries
At 00:17 20/2/2004 +1100, Peter Firminger wrote: Just thought you all may be interested in the WSG user base. 8 Brazil ... 1 Portugal I own a discussion list about web standards in portuguese, called Home page architecture. If someone interest in subscribe, please open the link http://www.topica.com/lists/arqhp/ Tanks! * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Re: WSG Member Countries
Hello! So, I'm a Brazilian who is living now in Canada. And I take part in both lists. If someone has conditions to take part in both, I'll advice. This is my first post here, and I'd like to thank you guys in giving us a lot of material about web standards. Ira, who is an authority in our group in Brazil, has been contributing to increase in our country the benefits when we're creating accessible sites. I'm still learning. Every day. Regards, Gean At 00:17 20/2/2004 +1100, Peter Firminger wrote: Just thought you all may be interested in the WSG user base. 8 Brazil ... 1 Portugal I own a discussion list about web standards in portuguese, called Home page architecture. If someone interest in subscribe, please open the link http://www.topica.com/lists/arqhp/ Tanks! * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
RES: [WSG] Re: WSG Member Countries
Another bralizilian here... ...in both lists too. []'s `´ http://www.aranha.com.br/ http://sinistras.aranha.com.br http://www.aranha.com.br/arqdicas http://www.design2.com.br |-Mensagem original- |De: Gean [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] |Enviada em: quinta-feira, 19 de fevereiro de 2004 11:21 |Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED] |Assunto: Re: [WSG] Re: WSG Member Countries | | | |Hello! | |So, I'm a Brazilian who is living now in Canada. And I take |part in both lists. If someone has conditions to take part in |both, I'll advice. | |This is my first post here, and I'd like to thank you guys in |giving us a lot of material about web standards. Ira, who is |an authority in our group in Brazil, has been contributing to |increase in our country the benefits when we're creating |accessible sites. I'm still learning. Every day. | |Regards, | |Gean | | | | | | | | At 00:17 20/2/2004 +1100, Peter Firminger wrote: |Just thought you all may be interested in the WSG user base. | 8 Brazil |... | 1 Portugal | | I own a discussion list about web standards in portuguese, called | Home page architecture. If someone interest in subscribe, please | open the link http://www.topica.com/lists/arqhp/ | | Tanks! | | * | The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ | * | | | |* |The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ |* | | | * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] WSG Member Countries
I think all the Brasilians who are really interested in web standards are subscribed the both lists (Irapuans discution list and WS group). For those who want to know more about web standards in Portuguese, what can I say? Join the group! And the others members of the Web Standards group could post here some interesting WS groups who participate. Here in Brasil we have many web groups which adds great information for web developers. I am relatively new in the list, therefore I dont know if somebody have posted something here about this, but we have some web professionals who care about WS and lot of who dont. But I think its a temporary thing. It will change soon. I have seen more and more people using CSS and XHTML on their works everyday. I think its a tendency in world as well. Did I say something wrong about the Brasilians web standards? All of you also could write Brasil with S. ;) Francisco. - Original Message - From: listas @ d2 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, February 19, 2004 11:55 AM Subject: RES: [WSG] Re: WSG Member Countries Another bralizilian here... ...in both lists too. []'s ` . http://www.aranha.com.br/ . http://sinistras.aranha.com.br . http://www.aranha.com.br/arqdicas . http://www.design2.com.br * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Opera
I code everything to the W3C specs as closely as possible. If I have to pick a browser to 'win', then the choice will be obvious even though I hate doing it. Clients don't care about the 'whys', they just want it to work in what they use and a majority of the public uses. Opera does alright keeping up, but they still got a long way to go before I would ever consider them a main-stream browser. Usually I code the page, checking initially in Safari and Firebird/Mozilla 1.6. After the bulk of the layout is done, launch VPC and test in IE6 Win. If there's no horrible problems, continue working on the page and add real content. Test in each browser again. If everything looks good in Safari and the Moz's, then start adding fixes for IE-Win. This is also when I launch Lynx in the Terminal and check it out there. After that's all done, and it's acceptable in those three above...I try it in IE5.5 Win, IE5.2 Mac, Opera 6 Mac, Opera 7 Win, and NN4 Win. On Feb 18, 2004, at 16:44, Universal Head wrote: I'm curious - does anyone really think that getting things spot on for Opera is important? Hasn't this browser got a miniscule user base? And Opera seems to give me almost as many problems as IE anyway. Interested ... Peter * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
[WSG] Issues with min-height?
Hello, I'm Sarah, and I just joined WSG a few days ago :) I'm just learning CSS and I'm have a bit of trouble with min-height and tableless layouts. I want the content and the sidebar to stretch down all the way to the bottom of the screen. It kind of looks odd when the content/sidebar's background color just stops in the middle of the screen. I was trying to fiddle around with the following min-height hacks but maybe I'm just way over my head here. Any suggestions? Min-height hack: http://www.pixy.cz/blogg/clanky/css-minheight-hack.html ALA article: http://alistapart.com/articles/footers/ URL: http://bonniepink.justagirl.org/ CSS: http://bonniepink.justagirl.org/bp.css - Sarah -- Read or Die http://www.readordie.org/ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] WSG Member Countries
Thanks for the info. I was just thinking about how many subscribers there are from Asia. Hope the user base from Singapore will increase as this is where I am at now. With Regards, Jaime Wong ---Original Message--- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 02/19/04 21:32:57 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] WSG Member Countries Just thought you all may be interested in the WSG user base. 136 Australia 2 Austria 6 Belgium 8 Brazil 8 Canada 2 Denmark 1 Finland 1 France 8 Germany 1 Iceland 3 India 1 Indonesia 1 Iraq 4 Italy 1 Jordan 4 New Zealand 1 Norway 1 Peru 2 Philippines 1 Portugal 2 Russia 1 Scotland 2 Singapore 3 Spain 3 Sweden 1 Switzerland 3 The Netherlands 18 United Kingdom 1 Ukraine 45 USA Looks like we're missing only the African continent (and Antarctica I guess). P * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * . IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here
[WSG] Mozilla problem
Hi group... I'm Kim :o) lets say I have the following site structure: div id=wrapper div id=header header... /div div id=main comtent... /div div id=col content... /div div id=footer content... /div /div .. and I set a 1px solid border on #wrapper, in every browser apart from Mozilla I get the expected result which is a nice 1px border around all my content, however in Mozilla all I get is the border a few pixels under the header. I should add my 3 divs named #main, #col, #footer are floated left which is probably the reason Mozilla can't decide the height. If I assign a fixed height to #wrapper all is well but obviously that isn't very practical. So apart from using JavaScript to calculate the height of #wrapper content, is there a fix for this? I have no problem in Opera, Safari e.t.c so I assume this is a Mozilla bug of some description. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Mozilla problem
Kim Kruse wrote: So apart from using JavaScript to calculate the height of #wrapper content, is there a fix for this? I have no problem in Opera, Safari e.t.c so I assume this is a Mozilla bug of some description. You should be able to add a #clearer div after the #footer div, but still within the #wrapper div. I believe that it can even be empty, it just needs a style of clear: both; This lets Mozilla do the height calculation. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Mozilla problem
Hi Kim,
Welcome to the group. It is a little hard to tell exactly you problem
without a sample (always best to send a URL to a sample and any CSS files so
people can see it in action) but I think your problem may simply be a
clearing issue.
If you float objects inside a container, they are taken out of normal flow,
so the container cannot tell their height.
Here is a demo of how you page could be looking:
http://www.maxdesign.com.au/jobs/css/kimkruse.htm
The top example should show a border just around the top container. The
lower example should show the border running around the outside of the
entire wrapper container. The second example on the page should work as the
floated items have been cleared. This can be done with a number of methods
(and the solution will depend on your particular needs) including:
br clear=all /
div class=clearboth //div ( css would be .clearboth { clear: both; } )
Plus heaps of other options...
If this is your problem, an explanation of why and how is here:
http://www.maxdesign.com.au/presentation/floatsample.htm
Thanks
Russ
Hi group... I'm Kim :o)
lets say I have the following site structure:
div id=wrapper
div id=header
header...
/div
div id=main
comtent...
/div
div id=col
content...
/div
div id=footer
content...
/div
/div
.. and I set a 1px solid border on #wrapper, in every browser apart from
Mozilla I get the expected result which is a nice 1px border around all my
content, however in Mozilla all I get is the border a few pixels under the
header.
I should add my 3 divs named #main, #col, #footer are floated left which is
probably the reason Mozilla can't decide the height. If I assign a fixed
height to #wrapper all is well but obviously that isn't very practical.
So apart from using JavaScript to calculate the height of #wrapper content,
is there a fix for this? I have no problem in Opera, Safari e.t.c so I
assume this is a Mozilla bug of some description.
*
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
*
Thanks
Russ
---
Russ Weakley
Max Design
Phone: (02) 9410 2521
Mobile: 0403 433 980
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.maxdesign.com.au
---
*
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
*
[WSG] Upcoming WSG meetings reminder
Just a quick reminder about two upcoming WSG meetings: SYDNEY WSG MEETING Monday 23 February, 2004 Star City, Darling Harbour, Sydney http://webstandardsgroup.org/go/event6.cfm Special guest - Sean Corfield (Macromedia standards guru) MELBOURNE WSG MEETING Monday 08 March, 2004 Student Union Meeting Room, RMIT, Melbourne http://webstandardsgroup.org/go/event7.cfm Special guest - John Allsopp (one of the original CSS Samurai) Peter and I will also be flying down for this meeting RSVP for either event: [EMAIL PROTECTED] A quick note for WSG members from other cities/countries. Let Peter and I know if you want to set up a WSG meeting in your city and we will let you know how many members are in the area. If there are enough members we will help set a local meeting up. Thanks Russ * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Mozilla problem
More incredibly clear, helpful, well-communicated knowledge from Russ. Thanks mate. Peter On 20/02/2004, at 7:59 AM, russ weakley wrote: If this is your problem, an explanation of why and how is here: http://www.maxdesign.com.au/presentation/floatsample.htm x-tad-bigger /x-tad-biggerUniversal Head Design That Works. 7/43 Bridge Rd Stanmore NSW 2048 Australia T (+612) 9517 1466 F (+612) 9565 4747 E [EMAIL PROTECTED] W www.universalhead.com
RE: [WSG] Padding/Margin in Opera
Not actually related to your problem, but you dont seem to have closed your head tag on the home page, creating problems validating. -Original Message- From: JW [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 20 February 2004 12:03 AM To: WSG - CSS List Subject: [WSG] Padding/Margin in Opera I am converting my entire site from table to css layout. SO far so good until this page! IE6, NS7 and Mozilla Phoenix till Firebird shows ok except for Opera. Attached are the screenshots. Somehow Opera seems to push the footer down. http://designs.sodesires.com/sodcss/index.htmlis where it is located. Test Site. With Regards, Jaime Wong IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here image001.gif
RE: [WSG] Padding/Margin in Opera
Doh careless careless! Thanks for the check James:) With Regards, Jaime Wong ---Original Message--- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 02/20/04 06:54:07 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [WSG] Padding/Margin in Opera Not actually related to your problem, but you dont seem to have closed your head tag on the home page, creating problems validating. -Original Message-From: JW [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, 20 February 2004 12:03 AMTo: WSG - CSS ListSubject: [WSG] Padding/Margin in Opera I am converting my entire site from table to css layout. SO far so good until this page! IE6, NS7 and Mozilla Phoenix till Firebird shows ok except for Opera. Attached are the screenshots. Somehow Opera seems to push the footer down. http://designs.sodesires.com/sodcss/index.htmlis where it is located. Test Site. With Regards, Jaime Wong IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here
Re: [WSG] Issues with min-height?
Sarah, Min-height looks a bit like a lost cause in the meantime (although others on the list may be able to correct me on this). To run your colours to the bottom of the screen, put a background repeat-y in the body. (Assuming your left margin is a fixed width.) Your layout displays a bit oddly in Safari 1.2, by the way. All the best! -Hugh Todd I'm just learning CSS and I'm have a bit of trouble with min-height and tableless layouts. I want the content and the sidebar to stretch down all the way to the bottom of the screen. It kind of looks odd when the content/sidebar's background color just stops in the middle of the screen. * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
[WSG] WSG/NMUG Meeting (Sydney) this Monday, 23 Feb
This Monday evening is the Web Standards Group / National Macromedia User Group Meeting! Everyone is invited. This should be a great evening as developers from around country and around the world converge for MXDU2004 DevCon. SPECIAL EVENT This meeting will be held on Monday night at Star City rather than Thursday at the Australian Museum. Date Monday 23 February, 2004 Time 6:00pm - Social Gathering/Networking 6:30pm - MXDU early registration 7:00pm - Official Start 9:00pm - cash bar provided for post meeting drinks Venue Star City, Darling Harbour, Sydney, Australia http://www.mxdu.com/go/venue/ Cost FREE! Proposed Agenda 7:00pm Welcome: Ed Sullivan, Tim Buntel and Mike Chambers from Macromedia 7:30pm Russ Weakley, Max Design: Practical benefits of web standards for your visitors, your clients and you 8:00pm Sean Corfield, Director of Architecture in IT at Macromedia: Accessible Compliant - a brief look at accessibility and web standards compliance at macromedia.com 8:30pm Panel: Question time http://webstandardsgroup.org/go/event6.cfm See you all there! -- ben bishop MXDU2004 + Macromedia DevCon AsiaPac + Sydney, Australia http://www.mxdu.com/ + 24-25 February, 2004 * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] WSG/NMUG Meeting (Sydney) this Monday, 23 Feb
On 20/02/2004, at 2:01 PM, Ben Bishop wrote: 7:00pm Welcome: Ed Sullivan Ed Sullivan is into web standards? Hey, does this mean they're going to be as big as Elvis? -Hugh Todd * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] WSG/NMUG Meeting (Sydney) this Monday, 23 Feb
not sure... but it may be a DIFFerent ed sullivan Hugh Todd wrote: On 20/02/2004, at 2:01 PM, Ben Bishop wrote: 7:00pm Welcome: Ed Sullivan Ed Sullivan is into web standards? Hey, does this mean they're going to be as big as Elvis? -Hugh Todd * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ * . * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
[WSG] Site check
Hi, Was wondering if anyone with a Mac would be kind enough to check this out was having problems with IE5.2, but any other problems (any browser any platform) would be good to hear about. http://www.swamphen.com/testing/naturalgrocer/index_v05.html BTW Michael D I did change to the dual float model and it made it a lot easier (although it still may not work on IE5.2 for mac!) and I went to MacMall and saw the specials. Made me very interested in a G4 i-book do you know if the US models power supply is easily converted? Cheers James
Re: [WSG] Site check
James, Looks good in everything on my Mac... IE 5.2.3, Safari 1.2, Firefox/Mozilla, and Opera 6.03. *Except* that in Opera the text of Who are we? displays at top right of the white graphic text, and the What's new text appears at the same height but over near the right edge of the grey area. In what looks like Times Bold 9px, black. Have you considered using real text inside your header tabs? Using the sliding doors approach on http://www.alistapart.com ? It would mean that the text inside the tabs could be resized and remain accessible. All the best. -Hugh Todd Was wondering if anyone with a Mac would be kind enough to check this out was having problems with IE5.2, but any other problems (any browser any platform) would be good to hear about. http://www.swamphen.com/testing/naturalgrocer/index_v05.html * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
Re: [WSG] Site check
James, You've touched on an issue alluded to here in the recent past... that of font embedding. It would solve a lot of these disputes! A good half way house may be to find a standard-install PC font (and quite a few come with the OS or with Office) that resembles the one the print designer specifies, find a similar one for the Mac and put that second in the list, then fall back on the usual suspects. I guess you'd be lucky to find exact matches, but you might get close! You would have to admit that people with, say, earlier OSs may see a more prosaic font instead, but argue the merits anyway. The glorious vision of web standards does not easily win over those used to being able to draw on a vast store of fonts and absolute page positioning. They and the client need to see the benefits (eg higher and better ranking in search engines, faster downloads for customers, less server load). I have considered the idea - in fact it is one of my big 'problems' with this site. There is a commercial imperative to stick to the original font for the major site areas (those tabs will actually be changed soon) - the print designer is quite adamant about it. The css navigation bar detailed in alistapart seems to work in everything except Safari 1.0 and Mac IE 5. A shame! So if the client wants js rollovers, you gotta do what you gotta do. Maybe in a few years' time they can be stripped out and replaced with CSS versions. Sigh! But the big issue I have is the use of images in the navigation bar - there will be JS rollovers added to the code as the client wants the rollover effect. I have used CSS rollovers but they seem to break or give bad performance in too many 'commercial' browsers to make the jump. I really want to push the semantics and accessibility further but there is the commercial reality of the client. How do others feel about these issues - particularly with regard the CSS rollovers. -Hugh Todd * The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ *
