Re: [WSG] Image Transitions Without Flash (URL fixed)
Marilyn Langfeld wrote: On the Mac side, it works correctly in Firefox 1.0, Safari, 1.2.3, Netscape 7.2. The images change in IE 5.2 but no fade; nothing happens (stays on the first image and doesn't advance) in Opera 6.03. Thanks for the feedback. Regarding Opera 6, it either doesn't support setInterval() (which it claims to do) or you have JavaScript disabled (which is my guess). Whatever the case might be, you helped find a bug which I didn't previously noticed because I was using an odd number of images: it skips every other image because setting opacity to 0 is only equivalent to being invisible IF OPACITY IS SUPPORTED! Otherwise, only the front picture is visible. Ironically, fixing the problem would actually simplify the code. Where as now I need to track in which direction I'm fading (front to back of back to front), after I fix it I won't. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Video Files
Hi. For 30mb movies that is not a good idea. Browser will try to save whole file before sending it to application. This eliminates streaming. Not quite correct. When the QuickTime Movie is authored correctly, QuickTime plays the Video while it still downloads. Greetings, Michael Vogt ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Video Files
For 30mb movies that is not a good idea. Browser will try to save whole file before sending it to application. This eliminates streaming. Not quite correct. When the QuickTime Movie is authored correctly, QuickTime plays the Video while it still downloads. You'd have to make few kb dummy quicktime movie that downloads another, right? -- regards, Kornel Lesiski ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Video Files
Larry Rappaport has created a disturbance in the Force. I felt its presence on 12/14/2004 1:57 PM. Its substance was as follows: Regardless of what you do, I'd mention in or near the link the size of the .mov it's linked to. 30 meg is pretty slow even with broadband. You might include a small chart listing download times assuming different connections. How do I calculate download times though? I mean, how long something takes to download here at work varies quite a bit with all the weird things people do to our poor servers... How can I find an objective estimate? Is that even possible? Charlie ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Video Files
I believe either Dreamweaver or Fireworks will do that for you, or you could browse the web - there are several sites which will let you borrow the figures. -- Larry Mail may be sent to rapp at lmr dot com. Please use plain text only as html is filtered out as spam. On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 15:02:33 -0500, you wrote (with possible editing): Larry Rappaport has created a disturbance in the Force. I felt its presence on 12/14/2004 1:57 PM. Its substance was as follows: Regardless of what you do, I'd mention in or near the link the size of the .mov it's linked to. 30 meg is pretty slow even with broadband. You might include a small chart listing download times assuming different connections. How do I calculate download times though? I mean, how long something takes to download here at work varies quite a bit with all the weird things people do to our poor servers... How can I find an objective estimate? Is that even possible? Charlie ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] breadcrumbs - nice implementation
David I agree it's not perfect =) point is: the language changes the role of the breadcrumb form informational to navigational, And at least I noticed it... usually I don't see breadcrumbs or simply go so what? There are a lot of things about breadcrumbs that simply don't make sense, particularly where there are multiple pathways to the content. For example, in a typical blog (with categories) there is always at least two hierarchies that content lives in: the post date, and the category. Terrence Wood. On 2004-12-15 10:42 AM, David Laakso wrote: Why would I click return to when I've never been there in the first place? And why when I get to where I return to, do I need to click the back-button in order to back where I started from? David -- You know you've achieved perfection in design, not when you have nothing more to add, but when you have nothing more to take away. -Antoine de Saint-Exupery ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] pop quiz: calculating specificity of group selectors
On 15 Dec 2004, at 9:46 AM, John Allsopp wrote:
which has the higher specificity
h1 {}
or
h1, h2 {}
(don't worry about the order in the style sheet, just in an absolute
sense)
Relevant part of the CSS specification is here
http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/cascade.html#specificity
FWIW, I think it is ambiguous. But strictly thinking,
count the number of element names and pseudo-elements in the selector
I interpret to mean that the group is of specificity 2, and so higher
than the type selector, of specificity 1
Or do they both have a specificity of 1?
My 2c:
When they say 'count the number of element names...', I think they're
referring to, e.g.
body div#container div#header h1 {}
which would give 4. I think in your example, the comma between the h1
and h2 effectively renders them as *separate* selectors, so they're 1
each...
N
___
Omnivision. Websight.
http://www.omnivision.com.au/
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Re: [WSG] breadcrumbs - nice implementation
You can also do this with _javascript_:Here's
the script I use that outputs the following (check out the title
tag!):www.grafx.com.au :: v2 :: scripting :: breadCrumbs.html
// Breadcrumbs Scriptvar path = "";var
href = "">var s = href.split("/");for (var
i=3;i(s.length-1);i++) {path+="a
href="" title=\"Go up "+
(s.length-i-1) +" levels to "+s[i]+"\""+unescape(s[i])+"/a ::
";}i=s.length-1;path+="a
href="" title=\"You are
currently viewing this page\""+s[i]+"/a";var url =
"">document.writeln(url);
:o)
Richard- Original Message
- From: "Terrence Wood" [EMAIL PROTECTED]To:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 7:36
AMSubject: [WSG] breadcrumbs - nice implementationFollowing the
recent discussion(s) here about breadcrumbs I thought I'd share this link to
an interesting breadcrumb implementation (and handy snippet of
php):http://www.de-generationx.net/blog/archives/2004/09/20/629/What
is interesting to me about this implementation is how through the choice of
wording the use of the breadcrumbs is explicitly navigation ("return to"),
whereas they usually appear to be informative ("you are
here").Terrence Wood.-- "You know you've
achieved perfection in design, not when you have nothing more to add, but
when you have nothing more to take away." -Antoine de
Saint-Exupery**The
discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/See
http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfmfor some hints on
posting to the list getting
help**
Re: [WSG] Length of ALT attribute
Not sure about recommended length, but there is the LONG DESC tag for longer descriptions of images. Personally, I feel alt text should be short and only contain bare essentials. On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 11:51:08 +1100, Anura Samara [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a recommend length for ALT attributes? Or different implementations of ALT attributes between browsers that affect the length? In response to some accessibility testing, I am working on modifying some ALT attributes on images used in our online annual report, and as you can imagine some of them are a bit long - the longest I have at the moment is 53 words/280 characters. And in case anyone is wondering, yes, we do have long text descriptions for each image - the text I have for the ALT attribute is essentially the modified first sentence from the long description. Thanks for any pointers, Anura ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Website Designer/Developer www.nataliebuxton.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Float problem (perhaps) in IE 5 on www.mccn.org.au
I've just released... http://www.mccn.org.au/ ...and realised a little late that some last minute tweaks (possibly) have thrown out the Stay Informed column on the home page in PC IE 5. Usually I'd battle on and crack it but I'm a little battle weary and this seems to work fine in IE 6 PC, IE 5 Mac, Opera 6 Mac, Firefox 1.0 Mac so I'm calling for assistance. Oh and if there are any other things people would like to point out please feel free. Thanks in advance, Nick ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Length of ALT attribute
In his accessibility book, Joe Clark suggests a maximum of 255 characters is a good guideline. After that, simplify your image or create a longdesc. On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 12:51:32 +1100, Natalie Buxton [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not sure about recommended length, but there is the LONG DESC tag for longer descriptions of images. Personally, I feel alt text should be short and only contain bare essentials. On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 11:51:08 +1100, Anura Samara [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is there a recommend length for ALT attributes? Or different implementations of ALT attributes between browsers that affect the length? In response to some accessibility testing, I am working on modifying some ALT attributes on images used in our online annual report, and as you can imagine some of them are a bit long - the longest I have at the moment is 53 words/280 characters. And in case anyone is wondering, yes, we do have long text descriptions for each image - the text I have for the ALT attribute is essentially the modified first sentence from the long description. Thanks for any pointers, Anura ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Website Designer/Developer www.nataliebuxton.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] link rel not working. @import ok!
Brett Walsh wrote: All of my style sheets are included using link rel= / but one of the style sheets was not being applied. I say all as there are actually about 5 style sheets, some dynamically included. I thought there might be a restriction on the number of sheets allowed. Is there? I changed the problem style sheet to be included using @import and the all styles were applied as expected. It won't work using link rel and I don't understand why. Have you tried placing the stylesheet link that is not being applied at the top of the list? If the styles contained in it are applied, then it would seem there is some unexpected limitation (or one of the other stylesheets has identifiers with great specificity that are overriding what the last included stylesheet contains). And it may be FF and not IE. I haven't checked the W3C to see if there is a specific intentional limitation to which the browser is adhering. If it doesn't work, then there is something odd about the file itself (possibly missing a closing bracket somewhere that is causing a problem). Just a few ideas to further narrow down the possibilities on the issue at hand. Charles Martin ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] link rel not working. @import ok!
Thanks Charles. I'll try both those things now. Cheers -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Charles Martin Sent: Wednesday, 15 December 2004 3:52 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [WSG] link rel not working. @import ok! Brett Walsh wrote: All of my style sheets are included using link rel= / but one of the style sheets was not being applied. I say all as there are actually about 5 style sheets, some dynamically included. I thought there might be a restriction on the number of sheets allowed. Is there? I changed the problem style sheet to be included using @import and the all styles were applied as expected. It won't work using link rel and I don't understand why. Have you tried placing the stylesheet link that is not being applied at the top of the list? If the styles contained in it are applied, then it would seem there is some unexpected limitation (or one of the other stylesheets has identifiers with great specificity that are overriding what the last included stylesheet contains). And it may be FF and not IE. I haven't checked the W3C to see if there is a specific intentional limitation to which the browser is adhering. If it doesn't work, then there is something odd about the file itself (possibly missing a closing bracket somewhere that is causing a problem). Just a few ideas to further narrow down the possibilities on the issue at hand. Charles Martin ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Webstandards for your iPod
Well, John and Maxine must have been busy... Westciv's Complete CSS Guide is now available as a free CSS podGuide for the iPod: http://www.westciv.com/news/podguide.html Interesting stuff Russ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Float problem (perhaps) in IE 5 on www.mccn.org.au
Hi Bert, Being a minimalist, all those images for bullets do seem a little archaic. You should be able to achieve the same with css (non repeating background image and padding on the li/dd for instance). If nothing else, it cuts down on code and makes it easier to change the look of these lists later. Well this is kind of a first release and will be adjusted according to feedback so yes you're right. I'm not overly keen on the bullets but after building the entire content management system to run this thing as well as do the front end there are plenty of loose threads. Also, if I reduce font size even one notch, those lists start to indent with a cascading effect. Using a background image and padding might resolve that issue too. Yes thanks very much for noting that, you unwittingly solved a bug that had been reported by a user. and I agree your approach above is probably the best one. I note you have a form inside a fieldset. That should really be the other way around (the validator doesn't complain about it, but it's back-to-front) I was actually unaware that that was the case. I have in another form, done it as you say... http://www.mccn.org.au/subscribe.php ...but have to admit ignorance to which was the right way Finally, you have quite a few paragraphs with all content emphasised. If it's that important, why not make it a heading? If it's purely for presentation, why not just apply an italic style to the paragraph? Similarly, why are your headings h4 when there's no h2 or h3 on the page? Curious Well that's a good question and the weak reason is because the header sizes are used across the site. It's really, I have to admit, a bit of a rushed styling reason at this temporary stage (i.e. anticipating changes after feedback). The rest of the pages are a little more semantically structured. Many thanks Bert that was all very helpful, Nick ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Float problem (perhaps) in IE 5 on www.mccn.org.au
http://www.mccn.org.au/ ...and realised a little late that some last minute tweaks (possibly) have thrown out the Stay Informed column on the home page in PC IE 5. I'm picking IE5 is getting understand body.threecolumn #content wrong - try a local #content style to check. Also, space missing in text after comma under Learn More: information,research papers. Otherwise, very nice cheers Jamie Mackay -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] on behalf of Nick Lo Sent: Wed 12/15/2004 4:56 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Subject:[WSG] Float problem (perhaps) in IE 5 on www.mccn.org.au I've just released... Usually I'd battle on and crack it but I'm a little battle weary and this seems to work fine in IE 6 PC, IE 5 Mac, Opera 6 Mac, Firefox 1.0 Mac so I'm calling for assistance. Oh and if there are any other things people would like to point out please feel free. Thanks in advance, Nick ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The information contained in this email message is intended only for the addressee and is not necessarily the official view or communication of the Ministry for Culture and Heritage. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this message or the information in it. If you have received this message in error, please email or telephone the sender immediately. ** winmail.dat
[WSG] Some links for light reading (14/12/04)
Clearing floated images in body text: http://www.456bereastreet.com/archive/200412/clearing_floated_images_in_body _text/ Float layouts: http://www.autisticcuckoo.net/archive.php?id=2004/12/10/floating Relatively Absolute: http://www.autisticcuckoo.net/archive.php?id=2004/12/07/relatively-absolute Couloir.org: Resizing, Fading Slideshow Demo: http://www.couloir.org/js_slideshow/ Getting Started with Accessibility Assessments: http://ausweb.scu.edu.au/aw03/papers/arch2/paper.html W3C WCAG Working Group is requesting your feedback on the latest Working Draft of the Web Content Accessibility Guidelines: http://www.w3.org/TR/2004/WD-WCAG20-20041119/ Introduction to Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) 2.0 Working Draft Documents: http://www.w3.org/WAI/intro/wcag20 Google suggest - see it in action: http://www.google.com/webhp?complete=1 Flash Totanus Loader: all that boring stuff about Macromedia Flash and Xhtml: http://matteo.balocco.free.fr/tfl/ Mozilla aims for mobile browser market: http://news.com.com/Mozillaaimsformobilebrowsermarket/2100-1032_3-5483683.ht ml Thanks Russ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Article length usability
Somewhat off topic, but here's a quick reply and resource... I don't think the length is a big usability factor. What's more important is that the article contains relevant information and is readable. If people are finding what they want in your article they will continue reading and scrolling. When they aren't finding what they want that's when you'll lose them, and that's also when they'll form a negative opinion of your content whether it's 20 pages long or 2. Check UIE's research for some info on this topic: http://www.uie.com/articles/page_scrolling/ Chris Rizzo -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joshua White Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2004 4:39 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [WSG] Article length usability Chris Kennon wrote: I've been unable to find exact info on the length of an article published on the web and it's impact on usability. At what page length does an article become tedious to the user? It might be a worth a visit to the newsstand and take a couple of newspapers, using their technique - runs a story/article on the basis of 3-4 paragraphs long and have a recommended reading age of 12 years old. Although that level of reading age varies what kind of content you're delivering. Keep sentences simple and concise. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** DISCLAIMER: The information contained in this message or any of it's attachments may be privileged and confidential and intended for the exclusive use of the addressee. The views expressed may not be ofdficial policy but the personal views of the originator. If you are not the addressee any disclosure, reproduction, distribution, other dissemination or use of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you received this message in error please notify the sender immediately and permanently delete this message. All messages sent by this organisation are checked for viruses using the latest anti-virus products. This does not and can not however guarantee that a virus has not been transmitted. Please therefore ensure that you take your own precautions for the detection and eradication of viruses. ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Image Transitions Without Flash (URL fixed)
Hi Mordechai, Glad to help! I checked and Opera prefs show both Java and Javascript enabled. I just downloaded Opera 7. I thought it was only available for purchase, but see it's available with ads, as 6 is. Tried the slideshow. No transitions, but the slides to move now (is that because you fixed the show)--Java and Javascript both enabled out of the box. Went back to retry 6. Still stuck on slide 1. Best regards, Marilyn Langfeld http://www.langfeldesigns.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] +1.301.598.3300 business phone +1.301.598.0532 fax +1.202.390.8847 mobile On Dec 14, 2004, at 10:08 AM, Mordechai Peller wrote: Marilyn Langfeld wrote: On the Mac side, it works correctly in Firefox 1.0, Safari, 1.2.3, Netscape 7.2. The images change in IE 5.2 but no fade; nothing happens (stays on the first image and doesn't advance) in Opera 6.03. Thanks for the feedback. Regarding Opera 6, it either doesn't support setInterval() (which it claims to do) or you have JavaScript disabled (which is my guess). Whatever the case might be, you helped find a bug which I didn't previously noticed because I was using an odd number of images: it skips every other image because setting opacity to 0 is only equivalent to being invisible IF OPACITY IS SUPPORTED! Otherwise, only the front picture is visible. Ironically, fixing the problem would actually simplify the code. Where as now I need to track in which direction I'm fading (front to back of back to front), after I fix it I won't. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Video Files
From: Charlie Barr A client on an old website we designed is asking us about putting up Quick Time videos on their website. [...] what would be the best way to have them available. Why not just link to the .mov file? It will then open in whatever way the users want, or at least give them the option of deciding what to do with it. Patrick Patrick H. Lauke Webmaster / University of Salford http://www.salford.ac.uk ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Video Files
Hello all, A client on an old website we designed is asking us about putting up Quick Time videos on their website. The file sizes vary a lot -- anywhere from a couple megs to about 30MB -- and I wondered what would be the best way to have them available. Is it a bad idea to have them inline, for example? How about on a page without any other content (i.e. just the .mov embedded and the navigation)? Also, what do I want to use, embed, object, something else...? I've never done anything like this before, so even the most basic tutorial would be useful to me. Thanks in advance! Charlie ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Video Files
Regardless of what you do, I'd mention in or near the link the size of the .mov it's linked to. 30 meg is pretty slow even with broadband. You might include a small chart listing download times assuming different connections. -- Larry [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Tue, 14 Dec 2004 12:03:00 -0500, you wrote (with possible editing): Hello all, A client on an old website we designed is asking us about putting up Quick Time videos on their website. The file sizes vary a lot -- anywhere from a couple megs to about 30MB -- and I wondered what would be the best way to have them available. Is it a bad idea to have them inline, for example? How about on a page without any other content (i.e. just the .mov embedded and the navigation)? Also, what do I want to use, embed, object, something else...? I've never done anything like this before, so even the most basic tutorial would be useful to me. Thanks in advance! Charlie ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Image Transitions Without Flash (URL fixed)
Marilyn Langfeld wrote: I just downloaded Opera 7. I thought it was only available for purchase, but see it's available with ads, as 6 is. Tried the slideshow. No transitions, but the slides to move now (is that because you fixed the show) Since I had only uploaded the fixed JavaScript moments before seeing your response, the answer is no. --Java and Javascript both enabled out of the box. Went back to retry 6. Still stuck on slide 1. Since I'm not using Java, its setting shouldn't matter. The lack of fading is due to lack of opacity support. Firefox supports opacity itself, while Safari and older Geckos support KHTMLOpacity and MozOpacity, respectively, and even IE6 has support through a filter. I had thought IE5.5 did, too, so I'll need to look into it some more. Regarding staying on the first image, as near as I can tell from Opera's Web site, V6 lacks sufficient DOM support. Even IE 5.01 supports it enough. For shame, Opera, for shame. At least Opera 7 is better. A note regarding the technique I used: While fading one image from 0% to 100%, the other image goes from 100% to 0%. IMHO, it produces a nicer effect than only fading one of them. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] breadcrumbs - nice implementation
On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 09:36:42 +1300, Terrence Wood [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Following the recent discussion(s) here about breadcrumbs I thought I'd share this link to an interesting breadcrumb implementation (and handy snippet of php): http://www.de-generationx.net/blog/archives/2004/09/20/629/ What is interesting to me about this implementation is how through the choice of wording the use of the breadcrumbs is explicitly navigation (return to), whereas they usually appear to be informative (you are here). Terrence Wood. Terrence, Granted I'm a novice, nevertheless I'm confused. Why would I click return to when I've never been there in the first place? And why when I get to where I return to, do I need to click the back-button in order to back where I started from? David -- http://www.dlaakso.com/ Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] pop quiz: calculating specificity of group selectors
Perhaps someone has seen, or has a definitive answer to this question
which has the higher specificity
h1 {}
or
h1, h2 {}
(don't worry about the order in the style sheet, just in an absolute
sense)
Relevant part of the CSS specification is here
http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/cascade.html#specificity
FWIW, I think it is ambiguous. But strictly thinking,
count the number of element names and pseudo-elements in the selector
I interpret to mean that the group is of specificity 2, and so higher
than the type selector, of specificity 1
Or do they both have a specificity of 1?
Thanks, interested in people's thoughts,
john
John Allsopp
:: westciv :: http://www.westciv.com/
software, courses, resources for a standards based web
:: style master blog :: http://westciv.typepad.com/dog_or_higher/
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Re: [WSG] Video Files
Larry Rappaport wrote: 30 meg is pretty slow even with broadband. Even with a T1 at maximum utilization it would take around 3 minutes; slightly more than the recommended 8 seconds for a page load. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Video Files
On 15 Dec 2004, at 9:47 AM, Mordechai Peller wrote: 30 meg is pretty slow even with broadband. Even with a T1 at maximum utilization it would take around 3 minutes; slightly more than the recommended 8 seconds for a page load. To apply the '8 second rule' to *every* page on the web is patently absurd. You seem to be suggesting that no content that can't be delivered in 8 seconds should be published. I think you'll find that rule is intended for home pages, and applies to visitors' notoriously short attention spans. I would imagine that someone who wanted to view such a huge file (and had been told the size on the referring page) badly enough would wait for the download, even on dialup. My 2c... and in any case, now OT. N ___ Omnivision. Websight. http://www.omnivision.com.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] pop quiz: calculating specificity of group selectors
They are both equal, because of the comma separation.
Cheers
Jeff Lowder
Accessibility 1st
Website: http://www.accessibility1st.com.au
On 15/12/04 9:46 AM, John Allsopp [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Perhaps someone has seen, or has a definitive answer to this question
which has the higher specificity
h1 {}
or
h1, h2 {}
(don't worry about the order in the style sheet, just in an absolute
sense)
Relevant part of the CSS specification is here
http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/cascade.html#specificity
FWIW, I think it is ambiguous. But strictly thinking,
count the number of element names and pseudo-elements in the selector
I interpret to mean that the group is of specificity 2, and so higher
than the type selector, of specificity 1
Or do they both have a specificity of 1?
Thanks, interested in people's thoughts,
john
John Allsopp
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Re: [WSG] Video Files
Larry Rappaport has created a disturbance in the Force. I felt its presence on 12/14/2004 4:20 PM. Its substance was as follows: I believe either Dreamweaver or Fireworks will do that for you, or you could browse the web - there are several sites which will let you borrow the figures. Well I don't have either so I'll have to Google myself some answers. As for methods, the clients have (as of this email) said they want them all available as links for viewing/downloading, so I *probably* won't have to monkey with inline video content. However, thanks to everyone who gave me information on that subject; my knowledge of multimedia presentation is pretty sparse, so the more I can learn, the better. And thanks to everyone else who weighed in on how to present multimedia content in general. Charlie P.S. Speaking from personal experience, if I want a file badly enough, I will try to download ridiculously huge files. Over dialup, on a Pentium II laptop with 32 MB of RAM, running Windows ME and IE 5... you get the picture. More importantly, in this case no one will have to download the .mov files since it'll be a text link anyway. Cheers! ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] x-browser javascript: is this OT?
Barry Beattie wrote: so, are these sort of Q's OK here? I'd guess so, as cross browser Javascript tends to be as per EcmaScript / the W3C DOM. Quirksmode.org is the best resource I've found for cross browser javascript. I've written a few widgets (anyone can use them, they're public domain), http://holloway.co.nz/sa/icons.html drop down list containing icons; http://holloway.co.nz/wsg/branded-resize dragable image for frame resizing, with a minimum width collapse like a conventional windows app. If anyone improves them please send patches though. .Matthew Cruickshank http://holloway.co.nz/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] A land of wasted web opportunity
Ummm.. hate to gripe about this but... YOU'VE GOT TO BE KIDDING! I don't know about many of you guys, but I'd love my company to be a member of the W3C. Considering my company has about 4 members of staff, I'm wondering where we can dig up the AUD $7765 for membership Still, it's a good thing we have an annual gross revenue, as measured by the most recent audited statement, of less than $US 50,000,000. http://www.w3.org/Consortium/Prospectus/ Who, exactly do they expect to become members? :o( Richard - Original Message - From: Amit Karmakar [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, December 15, 2004 10:14 AM Subject: [WSG] A land of wasted web opportunity An interesting read on how Australia is a wasted country!!! http://smh.com.au/news/Next/A-land-of-wasted-web-opportunity/2004/12/13/1102 786984178.html?oneclick=true Well I tend to disagree but I think Ivan is mainly talking about big companies down here that are not part of the W3C. Surely that is an area that needs focus but: I often hear people in Australia say they are too small to do anything, they are happy to let the big guys in the US fight out the standards and they will just use them makes me wonder if he has heard of WSG, WE04, and many others out there... isnt it the other way around? Regards, Amit Karmakar http://karmakars.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Length of ALT attribute
Is there a recommend length for ALT attributes? Or different implementations of ALT attributes between browsers that affect the length? In response to some accessibility testing, I am working on modifying some ALT attributes on images used in our online annual report, and as you can imagine some of them are a bit long - the longest I have at the moment is 53 words/280 characters. And in case anyone is wondering, yes, we do have long text descriptions for each image - the text I have for the ALT attribute is essentially the modified first sentence from the long description. Thanks for any pointers, Anura ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Extending Clagnuts 'Onload Image Fades Without Flash' tutorial
Sorry about the mixup, the tutorial etc was fixed a few days ago but hadn't put it back up... http://www.blog.nortypig.com/tutorials/tute1.php Norty Pig Web Development _ Are you right for each other? Find out with our Love Calculator: http://fun.mobiledownloads.com.au/191191/index.wl?page=191191text ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] link rel not working. @import ok!
Hey everyone, Without showing any code I was wondering if anyone is aware of this problem. Hopefully it is common. I was having trouble with some styles not being applied to elements in a page I was working on. All of my style sheets are included using link rel= / but one of the style sheets was not being applied. I say all as there are actually about 5 style sheets, some dynamically included. I thought there might be a restriction on the number of sheets allowed. Is there? I changed the problem style sheet to be included using @import and the all styles were applied as expected. It won't work using link rel and I don't understand why. Anyone experienced this before? Testing in ff. Regards, Brett ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] A land of wasted web opportunity
I would suggest you click on the 'react to this article' and have your say. If you blog, well surely talk about it! It certainly is worth the effort. On Wed, 15 Dec 2004 12:47:47 +1100, Cook, Graham R [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Look also at the costs, the 5 Oz members are all govt affiliated - US$5,750 membership, Large organisations US$57,500. I would have to write some business case to justify that. Graham Cook (Telstra) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amit Karmakar Sent: Wednesday, 15 December 2004 10:14 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [WSG] A land of wasted web opportunity An interesting read on how Australia is a wasted country!!! http://smh.com.au/news/Next/A-land-of-wasted-web-opportunity/2004/12/13/1102 786984178.html?oneclick=true Well I tend to disagree but I think Ivan is mainly talking about big companies down here that are not part of the W3C. Surely that is an area that needs focus but: I often hear people in Australia say they are too small to do anything, they are happy to let the big guys in the US fight out the standards and they will just use them makes me wonder if he has heard of WSG, WE04, and many others out there... isnt it the other way around? Regards, Amit Karmakar http://karmakars.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** -- Regards, Amit Karmakar http://karmakars.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Length of ALT attribute
Couldn't find reference to the 255 characters but did find this: quote Keep the alt text short. There is no set limit on the length of an alt text, but as we shall see shortly, a very long alt may not be fully displayed when image-loading is turned off or when the browser cannot locate the image file. By convention, limit alt texts to 1,024 characters (1 K) or less. When it comes to writing the actual text, remember that alt takes the place of the graphic. Tell us what the picture is or represents or sum up its function, but don¹t tell us that it¹s a picture. I¹ll give you actual examples in a moment, but steer clear of writing a sort of metaalt text, like ³Picture of sunset over Darling Harbour² or ³Picture of company logo.² /quote http://joeclark.org/book/sashay/serialization/Chapter06.html In his accessibility book, Joe Clark suggests a maximum of 255 characters is a good guideline. After that, simplify your image or create a longdesc. Is there a recommend length for ALT attributes? Or different implementations of ALT attributes between browsers that affect the length? In response to some accessibility testing, I am working on modifying some ALT attributes on images used in our online annual report, and as you can imagine some of them are a bit long - the longest I have at the moment is 53 words/280 characters. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Float problem (perhaps) in IE 5 on www.mccn.org.au
Hi Nick http://www.mccn.org.au/ Can't help you on the MSIE 5 issue, but I an provide some comments (looked at the home page only). Overall, I like the way you've done this. Being a minimalist, all those images for bullets do seem a little archaic. You should be able to achieve the same with css (non repeating background image and padding on the li/dd for instance). If nothing else, it cuts down on code and makes it easier to change the look of these lists later. Also, if I reduce font size even one notch, those lists start to indent with a cascading effect. Using a background image and padding might resolve that issue too. I note you have a form inside a fieldset. That should really be the other way around (the validator doesn't complain about it, but it's back-to-front) . Finally, you have quite a few paragraphs with all content emphasised. If it's that important, why not make it a heading? If it's purely for presentation, why not just apply an italic style to the paragraph? Similarly, why are your headings h4 when there's no h2 or h3 on the page? Curious Regards -- Bert Doorn, Web Developer Better Web Design http://www.betterwebdesign.com.au/ Fast-loading, user-friendly websites ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Length of ALT attribute
Thanks for the help everyone. I had heard about 255 characters before but couldn't find any definitive references to it. The issue with characters being cut off may be a concern - we'll need to cram some important words in the first characters of the text. And yes, we have long descriptions for the images already. As I said at the start, the longest is 280 characters so I'll assume that is safe. Now, what is that old saying about assume... Anura ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
