Re: [WSG] XHTML again
On 7 Jan 2006, at 3:35 pm, Lynne Pope wrote: On 1/7/06, Gunlaug Sørtun [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It is not as easy to hide proprietary and 'not-yet-recommended' CSS from the validator, as it is with all the garbage often needed to make IE/win behave. OTOH: hiding something in a conditional comment (or in a 'non- existent stylesheet', like I do at times) doesn't make it more valid - just hidden. Conditional statements are not hidden, they just do whatever you code them to do. They are a valid markup. Conditional Comments are indeed valid markup. The point here is that, it is a comment, and anything within a cc it is hidden from (X)HTML compliant browsers. Only IE for Windows can take a peak at it. Thus yes, style within a CC is hidden from the validators. BTW: non-valid CSS doesn't affect HTML/XHTML status/validity at all. True. However, if we are coding to standards then it pays to be aware of any coding errors in css. You can't look at each standard in a vacuum. Whatever your css contains won't affect the validity of your (X)HTML. Then, to what Standards are you coding your CSS : CSS 2.0, CSS 2.1 CSS3 ? CSS 2.0 is a hopeless mess, CSS 2.1 is a bit better but still full of contradictions and undefined behaviour. The only part of the whole CSS thing that is pretty stable is the CSS selectors module. http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-selectors/ And when you validate a stylesheet, against what do you validate ? In my case you'd need to check against CSS 3, and even then, you better check against the respective docs (various versions) because the W3C validator doesn't know or support those (namespaces, mediaquerries, css-text amongst them). The text-justify property you mention in a previous message is included in one of those (draft) docs and currently only implemented by MS IE win. It does not validate at all as HTML 4.01 Strict - are you sure you are checking validation against that DOCTYPE? This sounds a bit strange to me. Which source-code should be checked as HTML4.01? Given the fact that the validator is fed an XHTML1.1 page with the correct MIME-type by default, is it even possible to check that source-code as HTML? I would think not. Enforcing the validator wouldn't work - and it shouldn't since the source-code isn't 'HTML4.01 Anything' when it's served to the validator. And your point is? I made the comment that the site does not validate as HTML 4.01, did you see me say how I validated it? Anyone designing a site to render as one DOCTYPE in some browsers and another DOCTYPE for other browsers, and who wishes to have the pages validate against both DOCTYPES would, I assume, check the validation for both. This can be done in many ways, such as entering the source code, or in cases where the person looking at the code is sufficiently experienced, just looking can show there are errors. I manually validated 3 random pages from Bobby's site: accessing the page with an older browser, copy the source code and pasting that into the textarea of my local copy of the W3C validator (@v 0.7.1): all validated correctly as html 401 strict. Georg point is: if you send a url to the validator, it will validate against xhtml, because that is the way the data is sent to it (with mime type application xhtml+xml). Philippe --- Philippe Wittenbergh http://emps.l-c-n.com/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] horizontal list padding
This seems incredible. I just spent 3 hours trying to make a simple horizontal list 38px high with links centered and padded top and bottom. I cannot do it, here comes tables for me. Was at listomatic too. Bruce Prochnau ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] horizontal list padding
Formula for success. Get tired and frustrated, then write a note to web standards group complaining. Ten seconds later see a comma that was missed in stylesheet. sheesh, sorry all Bruce Prochnau ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] XHTML again
Lynne Pope wrote: The validators themselves tell you that they have limitations. A page can validate according to the W3C online service but, in fact, not be valid. I think Philippe covered the validity-points pretty well. It all comes down to how closely any developer wishes to adhere to standards and how much of a purist anyone is when it comes to correct coding ;) Oh, we can paste a valid example from the standards into a validator, and it may choke on it. So much for limitations. Think someone will have to purify the standards and the validators a bit more, before we announce purity based on them. Standards are pretty useful tools - when browsers adhere to them. Maybe they will - one day. regards Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] horizontal list padding
We have all been there before Bruce... : ) Formula for success. Get tired and frustrated, then write a note to web standards group complaining. Ten seconds later see a comma that was missed in stylesheet. sheesh, sorry all Bruce Prochnau ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] horizontal list padding
I find I cannot do a list today. Not one simple list that works in ie and firefox. 4 hours Bruce Prochnau Jeff D. Reid wrote: We have all been there before Bruce... : ) Formula for success. Get tired and frustrated, then write a note to web standards group complaining. Ten seconds later see a comma that was missed in stylesheet. sheesh, sorry all Bruce Prochnau ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] Semantic image gallery software
Hi all, An open-source (GPL, PHP-based) project I'm involved in, cat-scan ( http://cat-scan.net/ ) reached version 1.0 last week, which is essentially a(nother) gallery application, the defining differences being that it uses flat files for everything (so no databases required), and delivers semantic markup right out of the box. It also builds friendly URIs and a bunch of other cool stuff, like Atom and RSS feeds. I'd be interested to hear people's comments on it from a web-standards perspective (and possibly from other perspectives too, off-list). LINKS - Website: http://cat-scan.net/ Features list: http://cat-scan.net/features.html Blog: http://blog.cat-scan.net/ Demo: http://demo.cat-scan.net/ Kind regards, Joshua Street http://joahua.com/ +61 (0) 425 808 469 ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
[WSG] CSS help with bullet removal in IE view
My partner and I have a tagboard on our site and it looks greate in FF,
but when you view in IE there are round bullets. Can someone help me get
rid of the bullets? My partner did email the creator of the tagboard,
but never heard back.
Unfortunately, I cannot offer the link because it sits behind our paid
members area with a passgate. I can show you the CSS here in the email
if that is ok.
Any help for this newbie would be greatly appreciated!
This CSS comes with the tagboard, so it's not my code:
#chatoutput {
/* Height of the shoutbox*/
height: 250px;
/*Uncomment width below*/
/*width: 170px;*/
/* Horizontal Scrollbar Killer */
padding: 6px 8px;
/* Borders */
border: 1px solid #efc1c3;
border-width: 1px;
font: 10px helvetica, arial, sans-serif;
color: #9a9a9a;
background: #FF;
overflow: auto;
margin-top: 10px;
}
#chatoutput span {
font-size: 1.1em;
color: #efc1c3;
}
#chatForm label, #shoutboxAdmin {
display: block;
margin: 4px 0;
}
#chatoutput a {
font-style: normal;
font-weight: bold;
color: #efc1c3}
/* User names with links */
#chatoutput li span a {
font-weight: normal;
display: inline !important;
border-bottom: 1px solid #efc1c3}
#chatForm input, #chatForm textarea {
width: 120px;
display: block;
margin: 0 auto;
}
#chatForm textarea {
width: 150px;
}
#chatForm input#submitchat {
width: 70px;
margin: 10px auto;
border: 1px solid;
padding: 2px;
}
#chatoutput ul#outputList {
padding: 0;
position: static;
margin: 0;
}
#chatoutput ul#outputList li {
padding: 4px;
margin: 0;
color: #9a9a9a;
background: none;
font-size: 1em;
list-style: none;
}
/* No bullets from Kubrick et al. */
#chatoutput ul#outputList li:before {
content: '';
}
ul#outputList li:first-line {
line-height: 16px;
}
#lastMessage {
padding-bottom: 2px;
text-align: center;
border-bottom: 1px solid #efc1c3;
}
em#responseTime {
font-style: normal;
display: block;
}
#chatoutput .wp-smiley {
vertical-align: middle;
}
Thanks,
Artemis
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] CSS help with bullet removal in IE view
list-style:none; on the UL should work well... failing that, try playing with padding: on the list. On 1/8/06, Artemis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My partner and I have a tagboard on our site and it looks greate in FF, but when you view in IE there are round bullets. Can someone help me get rid of the bullets? ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] CSS help with bullet removal in IE view
Original Message From: Joshua Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re:[WSG] CSS help with bullet removal in IE view Date: 1/7/2006 17:58 list-style:none; on the UL should work well... failing that, try playing with padding: on the list. Thank you, Josh. I did try the list-style: none; (sorry, I failed to mention that before). I even got desperate and tried list-style-type: none; and that didn't seem to help either lol. But, I did as you suggested and played with the padding. It didn't remove the bullets, but it scooted the text over far enough to hide them without messing up the look hehe. I'm happy now :) Thanks ever so much for your help and suggestion! Artemis ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
