Re: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Nope, nothing at all. Just bung it in an IE conditional clause calling a stylesheet containing an HTC behaviour call. IE conditional clause? HTC? *Web Standards* Group? ;) ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Hi Antony, Take a look at the suckerfish dropdowns, which have been improved by htmldog at http://www.htmldog.com/articles/suckerfish/dropdowns/example/ Fully unobtrusive, accessible and still a nice look and feel! Succes, Marc van den Dobbelsteen (WebbForce - The Netherlands) -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Golding, Antony Verzonden: vrijdag 28 januari 2005 8:59 Aan: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Onderwerp: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility Hello all, We have been operating a drop down menu system on http://www.salford.gov.uk for around a year now and in that time, the menu has changed from a pure JavaScript version to the more accessible and semantic UDM4 (http://www.udm4.com). As a local government site, we get tested for accessibility regularly, both internally and by external parties, together with our own tests. Our CMS is still in the dark ages as regards web standards and producing accessible code, but I've managed to get much of the site valid as possible (Google currently indexes 33,700 pages, minus .pdf and .doc files). However one of the more recent external tests indicated that the drop down menu was failing the site due to the way the menu appears if JavaScript is disabled. I'd be interested in any opinions on the menu, with JavaScript enabled and disabled. Also, any alternative script or recommendations would be very useful. Antony (attending @media 2005) Antony Golding Principal e-Government Services Officer Salford City Council E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Telephone: 0161 793 2232 DISCLAIMER: The information in this message is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this message by anyone else is unauthorised. If you are not the intended recipient,any disclosure, copying, or distribution of the message, or any action or omission taken by you in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. Please immediately contact the sender if you have received this message in error. For the full disclaimer please access http://www.salford.gov.uk/e-mail Thank you. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** De informatie opgenomen in dit bericht kan vertrouwelijk zijn en is uitsluitend bestemd voor de geadresseerde. Indien u dit bericht onterecht ontvangt, wordt u verzocht de inhoud niet te gebruiken en de afzender direct te informeren door het bericht te retourneren. The information contained in this message may be confidential and is intended to be exclusively for the addressee. Should you receive this message unintentionally, please do not use the contents herein and notify the sender immediately by return e-mail. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Is there anything wrong with using css and adding a js to 'enable' :hover for everything in ie? Golding, Antony wrote: Hello all, We have been operating a drop down menu system on http://www.salford.gov.uk for around a year now and in that time, the menu has changed from a pure JavaScript version to the more accessible and semantic UDM4 (http://www.udm4.com). As a local government site, we get tested for accessibility regularly, both internally and by external parties, together with our own tests. Our CMS is still in the dark ages as regards web standards and producing accessible code, but I've managed to get much of the site valid as possible (Google currently indexes 33,700 pages, minus .pdf and .doc files). However one of the more recent external tests indicated that the drop down menu was failing the site due to the way the menu appears if JavaScript is disabled. ... ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Nope, nothing at all. Just bung it in an IE conditional clause calling a
stylesheet containing an HTC behaviour call.
Like : !--[if IE]link rel=stylesheet href=css/cw_ie.css
type=text/css media=all /![endif]--
with cs_ie.css containing whatever:
#menubar li {
behavior: url(css/iehover.htc);
}
and the HTC file:
attach event=onmouseover handler=mouseover /
attach event=onmouseout handler=mouseout /
script type=text/javascript
function mouseover() {
for( var x = 0; element.childNodes[x]; x++ ){
if(element.childNodes[x].tagName == 'UL') {
element.childNodes[x].style.display = 'block';
}
}
}
function mouseout() {
for( var x = 0; element.childNodes[x]; x++ ){
if(element.childNodes[x].tagName == 'UL') {
element.childNodes[x].style.display = 'none';
}
}
}
/script
HTH,
Mike Pepper
Accessible Web Developer
Internet SEO and Marketing Analyst
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.visidigm.com
Administrator
Guild of Accessible Web Designers
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.gawds.org
Jixor wrote:
Is there anything wrong with using css and adding a js to 'enable'
:hover for everything in ie?
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Yeah this is what I would do. Just make sure that the site is also
navigable via the top level navigation. Or make different styles for ie
with no js enabled.
Mike Pepper wrote:
Nope, nothing at all. Just bung it in an IE conditional clause calling a
stylesheet containing an HTC behaviour call.
Like : !--[if IE]link rel=stylesheet href=css/cw_ie.css
type=text/css media=all /![endif]--
with cs_ie.css containing whatever:
#menubar li {
behavior: url(css/iehover.htc);
}
and the HTC file:
attach event=onmouseover handler=mouseover /
attach event=onmouseout handler=mouseout /
script type=text/javascript
function mouseover() {
for( var x = 0; element.childNodes[x]; x++ ){
if(element.childNodes[x].tagName == 'UL') {
element.childNodes[x].style.display = 'block';
}
}
}
function mouseout() {
for( var x = 0; element.childNodes[x]; x++ ){
if(element.childNodes[x].tagName == 'UL') {
element.childNodes[x].style.display = 'none';
}
}
}
/script
HTH,
Mike Pepper
Accessible Web Developer
Internet SEO and Marketing Analyst
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.visidigm.com
Administrator
Guild of Accessible Web Designers
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.gawds.org
Jixor wrote:
Is there anything wrong with using css and adding a js to 'enable'
:hover for everything in ie?
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
With java disabled in FF1 the drop downs appear as a long bulleted list and of course everthing else get moved around. Doesn't look like the same site at all. On 1/28/2005 2:59:06 AM, wsg@webstandardsgroup.org wrote: Hello all, We have been operating a drop down menu system on http://www.salford.gov. uk for around a year now and in that time, the menu has changed from a pure JavaScript version to the more accessible and semantic UDM4 (http://www. udm4.com). As a local government site, we get tested for accessibility regularly, both internally and by external parties, together with our own tests. Our CMS is still in the dark ages as regards web standards and producing accessible code, but I've managed to get much of the site valid as possible (Google currently indexes 33,700 pages, minus .pdf and .doc files). However one of the more recent external tests indicated that the drop down menu was failing the site due to the way the menu appears if JavaScript is disabled. I'd be interested in any opinions on the menu, with JavaScript enabled and disabled. Also, any alternative script or recommendations would be very useful. Antony (attending @media 2005) Antony Golding Principal e-Government Services Officer Salford City Council E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Telephone: 0161 793 2232 DISCLAIMER: The information in this message is confidential and may be ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
We have been operating a drop down menu system on http://www.salford.gov.uk for around a year now and in that time, the menu has changed from a pure JavaScript version to the more accessible and semantic UDM4 (http://www.udm4.com). However one of the more recent external tests indicated that the drop down menu was failing the site due to the way the menu appears if JavaScript is disabled. I'd be interested in any opinions on the menu, with JavaScript enabled and disabled. Also, any alternative script or recommendations would be very useful. Antony (attending @media 2005) Anthony- I've not checked your site and am not familiar with that menu system, but it appears they have just updated their menus to be more accessible. How or in what way, I have no clue. This is from their home page: quote Latest Update Saturday 15th January 2005 This release is a signficant update in terms of accessibility, usability, and cross-browser support. Existing users are encouraged to read these release notes carefully, as the changes may affect your current configuration... And the menu's accessibility to screenreaders is greatly improved, so it no longer relies on scripting, and includes any browser-based reader using Opera, Mozilla, Safari or Konqueror (as well as Win/IE). endquote Regards, Ron application/ms-tnef
RE: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Thanks for the responses, guys. The main problem with the script is when JavaScript is disabled, as Bennie mentioned. I thought I had the perfect workaround by only displaying the top level links if JavaScript was disabled, and it looked and worked perfectly, stopping the corruption of the page. Unfortunately I did this by using an additional style sheet that was embedded in a noscript tag in the head... noscriptstyle type=text/css@import url(noscript.css);/style/noscript The new CSS replaced the styles that would have been setup by the JS to make the static menu appear similar to the dropdown. However, the W3C validator reported it was invalid to embed style in noscript, so if anyone has any suggestions to get around this issue, I'd be very grateful. Antony DISCLAIMER: The information in this message is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this message by anyone else is unauthorised. If you are not the intended recipient,any disclosure, copying, or distribution of the message, or any action or omission taken by you in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. Please immediately contact the sender if you have received this message in error. For the full disclaimer please access http://www.salford.gov.uk/e-mail Thank you. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
The point is that the site is still usable... if it looks slightly (or extremely) different that's OK. It is highly unlikly that people will visit a site in more than one browser so what they see is how they think the site should look. Also java, and javascript or not the same thing. Java is a programming language that is complied and delivered as an application, Javascript is a scripting language that is interpreted on the fly by web browsers. Terrence Wood. Bennie Shepherd wrote: With java disabled in FF1 the drop downs appear as a long bulleted list and of course everthing else get moved around. Doesn't look like the same site at all. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Do it the other way around... put the CSS for no javascript support in a
file and attach via a link in the head of your document. Use js to
disable it - thanks to themaninblue for the stylesheet script.
link rel=stylesheet type=text/css href=noscript.css
title=noscript /
script type=text/javascript
// see: http://www.themaninblue.com/writing/perspective/2004/09/21/
function setStylesheet(styleTitle)
{
var currTag;
if (document.getElementsByTagName)
{
for (var i = 0; (currTag =
document.getElementsByTagName(link)[i]); i++)
{
if (currTag.getAttribute(rel).indexOf(style) != -1
currTag.getAttribute(title))
{
currTag.disabled = true;
if(currTag.getAttribute(title) == styleTitle)
{
currTag.disabled = true;
}
}
}
}
return true;
}
setStylesheet('noscript')
/script
Terrence Wood.
Golding, Antony wrote:
The new CSS replaced the styles that would have been setup by the JS to make
the static menu appear similar to the dropdown. However, the W3C validator
reported it was invalid to embed style in noscript, so if anyone has any
suggestions to get around this issue, I'd be very grateful.
**
The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/
See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm
for some hints on posting to the list getting help
**
Re: [WSG] Drop down menu, JavaScript accessibility
Golding, Antony wrote: Unfortunately I did this by using an additional style sheet that was embedded in a noscript tag in the head... noscriptstyle type=text/css@import url(noscript.css);/style/noscript The new CSS replaced the styles that would have been setup by the JS to make the static menu appear similar to the dropdown. However, the W3C validator reported it was invalid to embed style in noscript, so if anyone has any suggestions to get around this issue, I'd be very grateful. Don't use noscript...switch to using DOM manipulation: have the style block there, and use JS to dynamically remove the style node (which it obviously only does when it's enabled...so when JS is off, the style block remain where it is). If I find some time, I may even make a little demo experiment on this on splintered this weekend... -- Patrick H. Lauke _ re·dux (adj.): brought back; returned. used postpositively [latin : re-, re- + dux, leader; see duke.] www.splintered.co.uk | www.photographia.co.uk http://redux.deviantart.com ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
