Re: [abcusers] abc2ps?
Gianni Cunich [EMAIL PROTECTED] extolled the virtues of "MusixTex". If it really serves the purposes of many users, I am sure that it will soon come to dominate the scene, with or without pre-processors. If a pre-processor to MusixTex is the answer to everything then I'm sure someone (possibly even Bryan) will write it. Time will tell. I think it is a strength of ABC that there have been many different approaches, each with different virtues and vices. It is certainly true that I (and I suspect most other developers) first do the things that we need ourselves - because we need them! But a lot of other stuff gets done too. Laurie To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] abc2ps?
"Laurie" == Laurie Griffiths [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Laurie Gianni Cunich [EMAIL PROTECTED] Laurie extolled the virtues of "MusixTex". Laurie If it really serves the purposes of many users, I am sure that Laurie it will soon come to dominate the scene, with or without Laurie pre-processors. No, you haven't looked at it. It won't dominate the scene if people have to type and edit it directly. Laurie If a pre-processor to MusixTex is the answer to everything Laurie then I'm sure someone (possibly even Bryan) will write it. There are people (including the principal maintainer of MusiXTeX) doing a lot of good work in PMX, which is an ABC-like preprocessor, which nevertheless allows a lot of control over the look of the output. There are also people extending LINUX-based sequencers to export it, and recent versions will export MIDI. So I think it's starting to be the answer to a lot of things. The big reason I can't tell you more from personal experience is that most of the music I'm interested in is vocal music, and you need a preprocessor to the preprocessor for that, which I've never managed to install correctly. If you aren't interested in lyrics, and have a LINUX system, MusiXTeX and PMX will both install from RPMS, and theres a wide body of examples of how to use them at http://www.gmd.de/Misc/Music/. I might add that abc2mtex was the original ABC application, as well as one of the early MusiXTeX preprocessors, so if you don't need the recently added features of ABC (like multiple voices and lyrics), you can experiment with MusiXTeX output without learning a new input language. One of the reasons I'm encouraging this is that I'd really love it if someone would update abc2mtex to include the newer features. John Walsh has done some preliminary investigation, which is on my list to post the results of some day. Another route to investigate would be an abc2pmx translator. -- Laura (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] , http://www.laymusic.org/ ) (617) 661-8097 fax: (801) 365-6574 233 Broadway, Cambridge, MA 02139 To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
MusixTeX (was Re: [abcusers] abc2ps?)
Hi all! De : Laura Conrad [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: samedi 20 janvier 2001 13:47 "Laurie" == Laurie Griffiths [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Laurie Gianni Cunich [EMAIL PROTECTED] Laurie extolled the virtues of "MusixTex". Laurie If it really serves the purposes of many users, I am sure that Laurie it will soon come to dominate the scene, with or without Laurie pre-processors. No, you haven't looked at it. It won't dominate the scene if people have to type and edit it directly. You are right! [...] The big reason I can't tell you more from personal experience is that most of the music I'm interested in is vocal music, and you need a preprocessor to the preprocessor for that, which I've never managed to install correctly. I have M-Tx here on my Windows box and it's really easy to run. The language is easy (not that far from abc) and can use lyrics in an easy way. The M-tx - PMX - MusixTeX - dvips road can seem clumsy at first sight but, with a little batch script, it is very fast: anyway, faster and more reliable than Lilypond. I might add that abc2mtex was the original ABC application, as well as one of the early MusiXTeX preprocessors, so if you don't need the recently added features of ABC (like multiple voices and lyrics), you can experiment with MusiXTeX output without learning a new input language. Yes, but the note spacing algorithm in PMX is far more elegant. One of the reasons I'm encouraging this is that I'd really love it if someone would update abc2mtex to include the newer features. John Walsh has done some preliminary investigation, which is on my list to post the results of some day. Another route to investigate would be an abc2pmx translator. Perhaps, an abc2M-Tx would be simpler (for lyrics use). IMHO, as it is, abc is really better than PMX and M-Tx in 2 aspects: [1] easy note entry and easy reading: PMX and M-Tx use pitch coding relatively to the note before, which is sometimes fast to enter but is always harder to read and edit. [2] the database structure of tune files, to store, search... tunes. and, even if the current multiclones situation is not really easy to grasp for a beginning user, abc2ps makes direct postscript output (which makes beautiful PDF, an easy way to send tunes to non abc litterate music friends: they are still numerous). Type III fonts produced by MusixTeX take a lot of place (PDF file size) and are very ugly to read in the current state of Acrobat Reader. And the library of PS music symbols build by Methfessel for abc2ps is really not bad! Happy abcing! Christophe To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] abc2ps?
A few replies to a few emails... Hi Chris You wrote Thanks; I will give it a try and see. I haven't had a lot of luck with TeX, though; I tried to build and install on my system, and it failed miserably. :) (I'll try a Linux machine next and see what happens). Under Windows I have had no problems with MikTek, the Gnu Tex/Latex distribution. In case, get in touch with me outside the list. Meanwhile, have a look at the MusixTex user guide, page 28 and page 29 - that should be the solution to your problems. Ciao Andrea Come sopra: contattami direttamente. Hi, Laura You wrote There are people (including the principal maintainer of MusiXTeX) doing a lot of good work in PMX, which is an ABC-like preprocessor, which nevertheless allows a lot of control over the look of the output. There are also people extending LINUX-based sequencers to export it, and recent versions will export MIDI. So I think it's starting to be the answer to a lot of things. The big reason I can't tell you more from personal experience is that most of the music I'm interested in is vocal music, and you need a preprocessor to the preprocessor for that, which I've never managed to install correctly. I assume that the preprocessor to the preprocessor you have mentioned is Musixlyr,which is in fact not really user friendly. I assume you have never tried M-Tx, the one Christophe Declercq suggested, which uses the Musixlyr package, but offers an input language that's even easier than the one adopted by PMX, has been designed to insert lyrics in a PMX file, and under Windows is easy to install (you have to copy the binaries in the folder you prefer!). Well, in fact this is not the first time I talk of M-Tx on this list. I even posted a couple of weeks ago a tune in both abc and mtx notation for comparison - as usual, it got ignored (I guess, as far as the abc notation is concerned, that the Dead Sea Scrolls are a more relevant matter fot the subcribers!). In fact the mtx notation might seem a bit confusing for those that are used to the abc, but once you got the hang of it - i.e. you learn to think in relative rather that absolute note pitches - (and here, I firmly disagree with Christophe), in terms of human readability it's not second to it, at least for easy scores. For complex scores in turn, with multivoices and extra lyric lines, let me tell that I find mtx better than any suggestion I have read about the V: lines inclusion in the future abc standard. I agree with Christophe when he states that the database structure of an abc file is excellent to "store, search...tunes". I would ask him to read again what I wrote, though - I wasn't suggesting that WE should convert from abc to mtx, but only that A CONVERTER to a full featured typesetting package would be helpful. And I mean helpful for those that have the need (occasionally or extensively) to print complex scores with features that, even if quite common in printed Western music scores, the abc notation standard doesn't cover, and therefore the native amatorish abc software haven't implemented yet (although, since the future developments of the standard seem to be in the hands of the minority of developers that monipolize this mailing list, we could easily tell the opposite is true as well - only the new features that will be experimentally implemented in those softewares are likely to enter the standard!). Given this, we could store, swap, upload on the web our tunes... in abc format, and resort to the converter when we need a printed score. By the way, I haven't noticed the PDF files produced by Tex are ugly to read with the Acrobat Reader: I usually prefer to use Ghostscript, both to view and print PostScript files. Anyway, they probably look perfect once printed (as the PDF files produced converting the PostScript files obtained with Acrobat Distiller drivers with GosthScript), which I suppose is what people usually do with music scores). That they are heavier files, I couldn't care less: when abc2ps and its clones will offer me the same feature musixTex currently does, this will be something I will consider. So far, in comparison we are to a scarce third: no match at all! Anyway, Laura, have a look at the M-Tx user guide, and I am sure we will find matters for further discussion. Regards Gianni To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] abc2ps?
Hoo, I didn't mean to start up a religious war here... Let me just thank everyone for the suggestions and I will go off and investigate. I prefer to play on Unix-style systems, but I'll check these things out. A more focused (and less loaded) question: the developer of abc2ps included an "R" (roll) command which puts a cap-like symbol over a note. Is this in fact a standard notation in some form of music I don't know about? Or am I assuming that his roll is percussion related, when in fact it applies to some other instrument(s)? The reason I'm asking, is that if this is a completely useless notation symbol, then I would propose to the developer(s) that it be replaced by something more useful - for me, anyway. - Chris To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
Re: [abcusers] abc2ps?
A more focused (and less loaded) question: the developer of abc2ps included an "R" (roll) command which puts a cap-like symbol over a note. Is this in fact a standard notation in some form of music I don't know about? Or am I assuming that his roll is percussion related, when in fact it applies to some other instrument(s)? The reason I'm asking, is that if this is a completely useless notation symbol, then I would propose to the developer(s) that it be replaced by something more useful - for me, anyway. - Chris In Irish dance music, the roll is a standard decoration--actually a standardized way to play either two or three melody notes. (Exactly how it's played depends on the instrument playing it---fiddles and accordions play rolls quite differently.) Since Breanann Breathnach's time, the usual notation for this is a kind of cap over the note, but early implementations of abc put a twiddle over the note instead, so that's probably the more standard notation in the abc world now. Abc2ps has a choice in the C-code: I think it's "DECO_IS_ROLL" which you can set to zero or one before compiling to get the behavior you want: that is, when the abc is "BE ~E2", it controls whether you get the roll sign over the E2 or the twiddle. Some implementations of abc use RE2 to denote roll, ~E2 to get the twiddle. My own feeling is that the twiddle denotes a turn, which is quite different from a roll, and I want "~E2" to come out with the roll sign over the E2, not the twiddle. Else it breaks a couple of MB's of my abc's, and rather than replace the twiddles by R's in all my files, I'd rather simply use a program which can be configured to interpret the roll correctly. Cheers, John Walsh To subscribe/unsubscribe, point your browser to: http://www.tullochgorm.com/lists.html
