Hello,
I will try to summarize the ongoing thread, to produce a conclusion or
potential plan. Sorry in advance, if I forgot some points.
About the improvement of adding lifespan in PartyRole entity, the "Won't do"
seems to get the consensus, since this improvement do not follow logical
purpose
+1
Thanks
On Tue, Nov 16, 2021 at 05:26:52PM +0100, Jacopo Cappellato wrote:
> This is the second vote thread to publish "Apache OFBiz 18.12.02", the
> second release from the release18.12 branch.
>
> The release files can be downloaded from here:
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ofbiz/
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12369?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17442681#comment-17442681
]
Gil Portenseigne edited comment on OFBIZ-12369 at 11/12/21, 11:04 AM
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12369:
--
Hello [~pierresmits] , i did not manage
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12183?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17442630#comment-17442630
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12183:
--
Hello [~Giulio_MpStyle] ,
Do the patch solved your
Hello,
I'm starting a new thread to discuss with the community about an Improvement
that has been submitted by Pierre Smits [1]
This topic has already been discussed in the past [2] and was conclude by a
lazy consensus not to implement PartyRole lifespan into OFBiz.
Recently, this improvement
[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-5980?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17441568#comment-17441568
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-5980:
-
Thank you [~jleroux] for the sum up, i will send
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-5980?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17440283#comment-17440283
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-5980:
-
Hello [~pierresmits] , [~jleroux] ,
Indeed this bug
+1
Thanks,
Gil
On Sat, Oct 23, 2021 at 05:08:32PM +0200, Jacopo Cappellato wrote:
> This is the vote thread to publish "Apache OFBiz 18.12.01", the first
> release from the release17.12 branch.
>
> The release files can be downloaded from here:
> https://dist.apache.org/repos/dist/dev/ofbiz/
>
Hello Justine,
There is a table `SequenceValueItem` that manage those kind of
sequences, you just need to set a value above you max product Id into
the tuple with SeqName = "Product". Then reboot your OFBiz instance to
empty the current sequence bank in memory.
Regards,
Gil
On Fri, Oct 08,
Hello,
I got a notification of CI that use jdk 1.8 for trunk.
Is there any action that i can do to configure java 11 or more ?
Thanks,
Gil
On Thu, Sep 23, 2021 at 06:03:33AM -0700, Gil Portenseigne wrote:
> [apache/ofbiz-framework] Java CI with Gradle workflow run
>
> Repositor
+1
Thanks,
Gil
On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 10:13:04AM +0200, Nicolas Malin wrote:
> The main is on the title :)
>
> At this time some issue are always present [1], so we have to decide
> whether to launch and move them to the next.
>
> My feeling is after some time on it, we can go ahead and keep
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12320?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:all-tabpanel
]
Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-12320.
Fix Version/s: Upcoming Branch
Resolution: Fixed
> Reintroduce groovy-test-su
Gil Portenseigne created OFBIZ-12320:
Summary: Reintroduce groovy-test-suite test case
Key: OFBIZ-12320
URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12320
Project: OFBiz
Issue Type
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-6988?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17415370#comment-17415370
]
Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-6988:
-
Hello,
There was a duplicated test, so i added
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-6988:
Attachment: OFBIZ-6988-1.patch
> Estimated shipping cost resolution with breaks on pr
Hello,
I used to define `<#ftl output_format="XML">` on top of ftl files for
this purpose.
But having this on file extension looks nice to me.
Thanks Jacques for the head up.
Gil
On Wed, Sep 08, 2021 at 02:59:27PM +0200, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Long ago we opened
Hello,
Currently using release 18.12 for some project we got the habit to
develop using integration test while developing in groovy.
For that usage we use mainly :
groovy-test-suite
That allow coding tests in groovy script that do not need to be compiled
for their execution and executing
Hello Eugen,
[...]
> > I have on my mind to elaborate a framework-core an acceptable minimal
> > circular dependencies and some other present as three dependency
> >
> >* core : common - base - start - entity - service - security - webapp
> >* entityext : core
> >* datafile: core
>
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Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-11808.
Fix Version/s: Upcoming Branch
Resolution: Fixed
Thanks to all of you for your
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12262?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:all-tabpanel
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Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-12262.
Fix Version/s: Upcoming Branch
Resolution: Fixed
> Execute a callb
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12262?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17411213#comment-17411213
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12262:
--
Thanks Nicolas for the review
> Execute a callb
Hello Jacques,
I agree it's better to show the present and future.
Thanks,
Gil
On Mon, Sep 06, 2021 at 11:47:18AM +0300, Eugen Stan wrote:
> On 03.09.2021 20:00, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > We have an old demo. It's the previous stable. I think we should rather
> > think about the
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-12262:
-
Attachment: 0001-Execute-a-callback-with-parameters-from-the-request-.patch
> Exec
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Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-12299.
Fix Version/s: Upcoming Branch
Resolution: Fixed
Push only in trunk yet since some
--- Original Message
> Subject: Re: XML Exports
> From: Gil Portenseigne
> Date: Wed, August 11, 2021 1:39 am
> To: user@ofbiz.apache.org
>
> Hello James,
>
> You can find in webtools [1] several tools to export your data.
> You can select the table to export or
Hello James,
You can find in webtools [1] several tools to export your data.
You can select the table to export or export all data.
Regards,
Gil
[1] https://demo-trunk.ofbiz.apache.org/webtools/control/xmldsdump
On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 07:59:03AM -0700, ja...@productive1.com wrote:
> Is there
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12299?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17394823#comment-17394823
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12299:
--
I just join the patch of a fix, i let some time
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-12299:
-
Attachment: 0001-Jgrowl-label-are-not-well-retrieved-showing-undefine.patch
> Jgr
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-12299:
-
Attachment: (was: image-2021-08-06-16-02-13-516.png)
> Jgrowl label are not w
Gil Portenseigne created OFBIZ-12299:
Summary: Jgrowl label are not well retrieved showing 'undefined'
button
Key: OFBIZ-12299
URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12299
Project
+1
Checksum, signature and tests are OK
Thanks,
Gil
On Mon, Aug 02, 2021 at 12:24:13PM +0200, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> +1
>
> Back and front ends OK
>
> Checksums OK
>
> $ ./verify-ofbiz-release.sh apache-ofbiz-17.12.08.zip
> sha check of file: apache-ofbiz-17.12.08.zip
> Using sha file:
Hello Eugen, and thanks Pierre for the reminder :)
I just wanted to mention there was a previous effort to implement
environment variable configuration [1]. This has not yet be pushed into
trunk, but is used by our customer projects.
You could check the patch and test if it helps you ease the
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12237?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17370657#comment-17370657
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12237:
--
meh, LICENCE file was cleaned on my local repo
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12237:
--
Your memory is quite well :), ok if i understood
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Gil Portenseigne edited comment on OFBIZ-12237 at 6/28/21, 7:49 AM
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12237:
--
Hello,
About the licence compatibility : [https
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-11812:
-
Fix Version/s: Upcoming Branch
> New child element callback on link to go
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Gil Portenseigne reassigned OFBIZ-11812:
Assignee: Gil Portenseigne
> New child element callback on link to go
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Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-11812.
Resolution: Fixed
> New child element callback on link to go out information on dyna
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-11812:
-
Attachment: OFBIZ-11812.patch
> New child element callback on link to go
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12259?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17367445#comment-17367445
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Gil Portenseigne edited comment on OFBIZ-12259 at 6/22/21, 3:32 PM
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12259?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17367445#comment-17367445
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12259:
--
Commited in release18 and trunk, since 17.12.07
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Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-12259.
Resolution: Fixed
> SeoConfigUtil does not maintaince char-replace-or
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-12259:
-
Fix Version/s: (was: Release Branch 17.12)
(was: Trunk
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Gil Portenseigne reassigned OFBIZ-12259:
Assignee: Gil Portenseigne
> SeoConfigUtil does not maintaince char-repl
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-11813?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:all-tabpanel
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Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-11813.
Fix Version/s: Upcoming Branch
Resolution: Implemented
> Add sub-screen decora
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-11813?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:all-tabpanel
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Gil Portenseigne reassigned OFBIZ-11813:
Assignee: Gil Portenseigne
> Add sub-screen decorator DetailScreenDecora
Hello,
Please find answers below :
- Which test classes belong where?
There are two Different types of test (not mentioning selenium webdriver
test)
* Unit test :
Should be quick since compiled and executed at launch of the
application, via the gradle tasks :compileTestJava and
Hello,
The developer Trunk version is the trunk development branch with all the
last new features and improvements.
Every period, a release branch is created and maintained, updated with
bug/security fix only.
During a stabilization period (about one year), stable release are
created from
[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12233?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17345652#comment-17345652
]
Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12233:
--
+1 to commit, there is no technical issue using
Hello,
Good idea,
To add some more about GoodForNewContributors, it seems well used in
GitLab platform :
https://gitlab.com/groups/gitlab-org/-/issues?label_name%5B%5D=good+for+new+contributors
So sticking with it seems nice to me.
Thanks
Le 07/05/2021 à 15:53, Aditya Sharma a écrit :
Hi
Hello,
+1
Tests are OK, basic usage OK, SHA and signature OK
Regards,
Gil
Le 13/04/2021 à 10:39, Jacopo Cappellato a écrit :
This is the vote thread to release a new bug fix release for the
release17.12 branch. This new release, "Apache OFBiz 17.12.07" will
supersede all the previous
[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-12171?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17287075#comment-17287075
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Gil Portenseigne edited comment on OFBIZ-12171 at 2/19/21, 1:36 PM
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-12171:
--
For information under windows system hosts config
+1 for Michael !
Cheers
On Mon, Dec 21, 2020 at 02:57:25PM +0100, Michael Brohl wrote:
> +1 for the initial proposal
>
> with an additional idea: maybe better skip r20 and make a r21 right at the
> beginning of the year with the chance to release also in 21.
>
> This would allow us to catch up
nse,
>
> No I did not, and now I tried it but it is still not showing up at the main
> tab menu, are there any other things that I might have missed?
>
> Thank you so much,
> Daors
>
> On Fri, Nov 13, 2020 at 10:40 AM Gil Portenseigne <
> gil.portensei...@nereide.fr> wrot
Hello Daors,
After installing your plugin, do you have it present in plugins folder
in OFBiz root directory ?
If so have you defined a webapp in its ofbiz-component.xml with the
property :
app-bar-display="true"
Regards,
Gil
On Fri, Nov 13, 2020 at 09:35:39AM -, Daors wrote:
> Hello
Hello James,
When i met this issue, that means that the user you try to impersonate
has not the permission for the current webapp.
Gil
On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 02:34:21PM -, James Yong wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I logged in as admin and tried to impersonate other accounts, but keep
> getting
Hello devs,
This mail introduce the last Chapter of our story that describe in
which context we created some new decorators.
First, we want to recall the common-theme effort objectives :
The common-theme component is the default theme that define every
screens that are available for theme
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-11204?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17115799#comment-17115799
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-11204:
--
Hello [~lodhiravi],
This improvement tend
tions should be decoupled from forms.
> Shall we continue with Part 3?
>
> Regards,
> James
>
> On 2020/01/10 17:58:59, Gil Portenseigne wrote:
> > Hello !
> >
> > In previous thread we focused on the process of how to define a dynamic
> > workflow tha
Hi,
On Wed, Mar 11, 2020 at 05:08:47PM +0100, Michael Brohl wrote:
> >
> > - Adopt Github Pull Request (PR) as the unique channel for code contribution
>
> -1
>
> I don't see a reason why we should not allow patches also. It will make it
> easier for people to contribute who are not able (or
+1
IMO i prefer to rebase and check the commit i push in my local repo.
Thanks
Le 11 mars 2020 16:52:36 GMT+01:00, Mathieu Lirzin
a écrit :
>>> The simple solution to prevent this is to get into the habit of
>>> linearizing history, meaning always rebasing and clean history
>before
>>>
Hello !
While migrating createRequirementFromItemATP, i stumbled upon a comment
from David Jones :
> NOTE DEJ20090902: this service is not called
> anywhere, instead the createATPRequirementsForOrder service (written in
> Java) is called; why this is the case I don't know... -->
I investigate a
Build Source Stamp: [branch trunk] 53a8b812607f9987a1063f18062a5318cafe444c
> Blamelist: Gil Portenseigne
>
> BUILD FAILED: failed shell_2
>
> Sincerely,
> -The Buildbot
>
>
>
signature.asc
Description: PGP signature
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-9984:
-
Hello [~sberg]
Sorry for the delay, i will commit
Nope, same here.
signature.asc
Description: PGP signature
+1
On Thu, Feb 27, 2020 at 06:09:34PM +0100, Michael Brohl wrote:
> +1
>
> ~/Projects/apache-ofbiz/dist-apache-ofbiz-17.12.01
> ../ofbiz-tools/verify-ofbiz-release.sh apache-ofbiz-17.12.01.zip
> sha check of file: apache-ofbiz-17.12.01.zip
> Using sha file: apache-ofbiz-17.12.01.zip.sha512
>
> Michael Brohl
>
> ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de
>
> Am 28.02.20 um 08:49 schrieb Gil Portenseigne:
> > Hello Pierre,
> >
> > If you are talking about impersonation feature, that is not in the 17.12
> > branch.
> >
> > In eith
Hello Pierre,
If you are talking about impersonation feature, that is not in the 17.12
branch.
In either way, administrative tools, if we got access to it, allow what
your are saying. But there is no security issue that grant these
privilege we are aware of. If you do, please share to the
A bit late but +1 !
Thanks
On Fri, Feb 21, 2020 at 09:24:02AM +0100, Jacopo Cappellato wrote:
> This is the vote thread (2nd attempt) to release "Apache OFBiz 17.12.01":
> this is the first release, containing the framework, applications and all
> the plugins from the 17.12 release branches.
>
I second Nicolas opinion. I hope that we will evolve and that will allow
you to come back in the community in the future.
Let me thank you again for your time and kind help.
Gil
On Sat, Feb 22, 2020 at 02:51:28PM +0100, Nicolas Malin wrote:
> It's sad new that you sharing.
>
> This community
Inline,
> > I'm kinda prefer the "opposite approach", but we need to discuss if this
> > improvement is worth the history lost.
> >
> > In the example you chose, i see no issue capitalizing module,
> > resource and other. Updating the rule offer the ability to write a
> > constant like : MoDuLe
OFBiz
> <https://ofbiz.apache.org/>, since 2008
>
> *Apache Trafodion <https://trafodion.apache.org>, Vice President*
> *Apache Directory <https://directory.apache.org>, PMC Member*
> Apache Incubator <https://incubator.apache.org>, committer
> Apach
Hello Michael,
Adapting checkstyle configuration is less impacting to our codebase but
make us stay different from the java standard.
That is the easier path, that will not affect code history.
But about getting nearer from the java standard is IMO a nice to have, to
make pure java developer
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-5426?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17036258#comment-17036258
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-5426:
-
Hello [~pawan],
{{Please use :}}
{{ ./gradlew
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-11342:
--
Thanks [~pierresmits] since 18.12 is not yet
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-11342:
-
Fix Version/s: (was: Release Branch 18.12)
18.12.01
> Er
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-11342:
-
Affects Version/s: (was: Release Branch 17.12)
> Error in user impersonat
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-11342:
-
Fix Version/s: (was: Release Branch 17.12)
> Error in user impersonation with
It's an error while cherry picking the bugFix from trunk.
I will revert.
On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 12:10:46PM +0100, Gil Portenseigne wrote:
> Yes, i'm on it...
> On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 11:56:14AM +0100, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> > It's OK, but we have now a compilation in R17
Yes, i'm on it...
On Wed, Feb 12, 2020 at 11:56:14AM +0100, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> It's OK, but we have now a compilation in R17:
> https://ci.apache.org/builders/ofbizBranch17Framework
>
> Please Gil have a look
>
> Thanks
>
> Le 12/02/2020 à 09:00, Jacques Le Roux a écrit :
> > Hi Michael,
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Gil Portenseigne closed OFBIZ-11342.
Fix Version/s: Trunk
Release Branch 18.12
Release
Yes, it is a good way to go.
Thanks Jacopo
On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 03:38:46PM +0100, Jacopo Cappellato wrote:
> So far it seems that we are in favor of releasing the full version
> (framework + plugins) named "Apache OFBiz 17.12.01" and then also the
> version without the plugins.
> If this is
+1
Regards,
Gil
On Mon, Feb 10, 2020 at 05:02:18PM +0100, Nicolas Malin wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I most in favor to propose two products like :
>
> "Apache OFBiz Framework 17.12.01" (framework)
> and
> "Apache OFBiz Full 17.12.01" (framework + plugins)
>
> For advanced user, they would use
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-11342?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17032513#comment-17032513
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-11342:
--
Three patch that, applied in order do :
* add
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-11342?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:all-tabpanel
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Gil Portenseigne updated OFBIZ-11342:
-
Attachment: 0001-Add-a-new-unit-test-to-validate-adminPermissionTesti.patch
Gil Portenseigne created OFBIZ-11342:
Summary: Error in user impersonation with sub permission
Key: OFBIZ-11342
URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-11342
Project: OFBiz
+1 for the fix.
On Tue, Feb 04, 2020 at 12:22:48PM +0100, Michael Brohl wrote:
> During a migration I found that this bugfix was not backported to the 17.12
> release branch.
>
> Should I do it now?
>
> Regards,
>
> Michael Brohl
>
> ecomify GmbH - www.ecomify.de
>
>
> Am 03.04.18 um 15:06
+1
If we do not decide of replacing Jira with Github or another BT, we must
keep Jira for contribution tracking.
There might be a jira integration in github for that ?
Gil
On Mon, Feb 03, 2020 at 12:16:11PM +0100, Michael Brohl wrote:
> I'm automatically informed about the pull requests, I
patch sets for different environments.
> > > > >
> > > > > We now use a staged configure mechanism which uses a base
> > > > > build file, auto detected machine name and provided
> > > > > parameters to decide which co
I agree with Jacques, i tried several times to participate in the
discussion but i am confused about the situation.
About this situation, Michael, we get your point about the process of
discuss things before modifying not trivial code and I do agree with
that. But there can always be mistakes.
+1
Thanks
On Fri, Jan 31, 2020 at 12:16:54AM +0530, Deepak Dixit wrote:
> +1
>
> Thanks & Regards
> --
> Deepak Dixit
> ofbiz.apache.org
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 30, 2020 at 9:56 PM Nicolas Malin
> wrote:
>
> > +1
> >
> > Same result from my local
> >
> > Nicolas
> >
> > On 30/01/2020 16:06,
Hello Ingo,
For this case, i think I would plan a job to run every X minutes, that
will check if the connexion is alive or, establish it.
The jobPoller will then take care of it after OFBiz is launched.
Depending on the connexion type it might be enough.
AFAIK there is no standard configuration
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-10802?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17024138#comment-17024138
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-10802:
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Mmmh ignore my comment, my mistake was to think
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-10802?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17024132#comment-17024132
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Gil Portenseigne edited comment on OFBIZ-10802 at 1/27/20 7:49 AM
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https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/OFBIZ-10802?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel=17024132#comment-17024132
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Gil Portenseigne commented on OFBIZ-10802:
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Not Sure I understand this, patch, it seems
I wonder if it is bad for the project to have 2 years between two
releases, 16 => 18 => 20
WDYT ?
Gil
On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 05:31:14PM +0100, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> Le 24/01/2020 à 15:09, Nicolas Malin a écrit :
> > On 24/01/2020 14:57, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> >
> > > I must say I'm
+1
On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 11:27:15AM +0100, Jacques Le Roux wrote:
> Hi,
>
> R16 is now an old distribution and has almost reached its end of support. We
> can soon expect a last release but we need to think about the next to be
> released package
>
> Some would prefer to release R17 before
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