Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-07-01 Thread srid
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 2:53 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: anyway I suddenly remembered back in 1980s I had a pen and notebook and used to write large amounts of pseudocode in it - I remember spending a week in a farm with no electricity and writing enormous amounts of code. So

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-07-01 Thread Baiju M
CRC Cards might be useful: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Class-responsibility-collaboration_card Regards, Baiju M ___ BangPypers mailing list BangPypers@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/bangpypers

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-28 Thread Jeffrey Jose
[OFFTOPIC] %s/corporate/enterprise/g FTFY. /jeff On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 10:56 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.orgwrote: On Saturday 26 June 2010 21:02:52 shameek ghosh wrote: Well...Although I have not done this much, but I believe a modelling tool like UML helps when you show

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-26 Thread Dark Seid
Well, I vote for pencil :). That said, I start with a pencil and paper (or whiteboard) to help me understand things at a high level and then move to writing specs. My primary design tool for detail design is a TDD framework. Best, Sidu. http://blog.sidu.in http://c42.in On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-26 Thread shameek ghosh
Well...Although I have not done this much, but I believe a modelling tool like UML helps when you show your design to somebody else and secondly there might be cases where UML like modelling tools may also be converted to some specific code. I do beleive the second point is an important reason

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-26 Thread Noufal Ibrahim
On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 9:02 PM, shameek ghosh shamee...@gmail.com wrote: Well...Although I have not done this much,  but I believe a modelling tool like UML helps when you show your design to somebody else and secondly there might be cases where UML like modelling tools may also be converted

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-26 Thread shameek ghosh
I do believe the second point is an important reason why domain specific modelling tools are very important that can generate platform specific code.Something like UML to C++ might be available.I am not certain though. I worry about maintainability and bitrot in the long run when code is

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-26 Thread Noufal Ibrahim
On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 12:13 AM, shameek ghosh shamee...@gmail.com wrote: I do believe the second point is an important reason why domain specific modelling tools are very important that can generate platform specific code.Something like UML to C++ might be available.I am not certain though.

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-26 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
On Saturday 26 June 2010 21:02:52 shameek ghosh wrote: Well...Although I have not done this much, but I believe a modelling tool like UML helps when you show your design to somebody else and secondly there might be cases where UML like modelling tools may also be converted to some specific

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Anand Balachandran Pillai
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:22 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.orgwrote: hi, what tools do people use when designing software? I tried dia once or twice but found it rather cumbersome For me it is almost always a long walk, with just the ideas floating inside my head. After the end of

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread steve
On 06/25/2010 11:04 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 10:57:00 Elvis Joel D'Souza wrote: program has to do something one has to sketch out the data structures and functions that are needed to get the thing done with the least possible effort. I think you are

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Noufal Ibrahim
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:34 AM, Anand Balachandran Pillai abpil...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 8:22 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.orgwrote: hi, what tools do people use when designing software? I tried dia once or twice but found it rather cumbersome  For me it is

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Saju Pillai
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 2:23 PM, Anand Balachandran Pillai abpil...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 12:37:25 Saju Pillai wrote: I am allergic to any design tool more complex than pen paper well,

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Noufal Ibrahim
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 12:37:25 Saju Pillai wrote: I am allergic to any design tool more complex than pen paper well, we seemed have almost reached a consensus - now all we need to decide is the pros and cons of

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Roshan Mathews
n Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 14:59, Noufal Ibrahim nou...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 12:37:25 Saju Pillai wrote: I am allergic to any design tool more complex than pen paper well, we seemed have almost

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Srinivas Reddy Thatiparthy
well, we seemed have almost reached a consensus - now all we need to decide is the pros and cons of pen versus pencil. Well Kenneth, that's a personal decision.My best suggestion is ,use whatever you are comfortable with. rant Your goal matters not the means.:) /rant Regards, Srini T.

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
On Friday 25 June 2010 14:23:19 Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote: well, we seemed have almost reached a consensus - now all we need to decide is the pros and cons of pen versus pencil. I support pencil because, 1. It can be sharpened 2. It doesn't cause those splotches in your hand

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Noufal Ibrahim
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 3:23 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 14:23:19 Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote: well, we seemed have almost reached a consensus - now all we need to decide is the pros and cons of pen versus pencil.  I support pencil because,  

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Anand Balachandran Pillai
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 3:02 PM, Roshan Mathews rmath...@gmail.com wrote: n Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 14:59, Noufal Ibrahim nou...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 12:37:25 Saju Pillai wrote: I am allergic to

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread Anand Balachandran Pillai
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 3:23 PM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.orgwrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 14:23:19 Anand Balachandran Pillai wrote: well, we seemed have almost reached a consensus - now all we need to decide is the pros and cons of pen versus pencil. I support pencil

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-25 Thread ThinRhino
On 25 June 2010 18:06, Anand Balachandran Pillai abpil...@gmail.com wrote: There are these pen-pencil type contraptions where you push many pencil-heads one after another and finally one sticks out at the other end. They are pretty cool and no potential threat to life from sharpeners. I

[BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
hi, what tools do people use when designing software? I tried dia once or twice but found it rather cumbersome -- Regards Kenneth Gonsalves Senior Associate NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC ___ BangPypers mailing list BangPypers@python.org

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Noufal Ibrahim
Nothing beats a clean white sheet of paper and a nice pen for me. No enforced structure. No barriers. Once I start, I use org mode to keep a log/track. I also find that writing documentation before the program is fully done clears things in my head. On 6/25/10, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Roshan Mathews
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 08:22, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: what tools do people use when designing software? I tried dia once or twice but found it rather cumbersome UI? http://www.balsamiq.com/products/mockups is popular. I prefer paper/whiteboard. Nothing beats having a

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
On Friday 25 June 2010 08:35:23 Roshan Mathews wrote: On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 08:22, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: what tools do people use when designing software? I tried dia once or twice but found it rather cumbersome UI? http://www.balsamiq.com/products/mockups is

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Roshan Mathews
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 09:03, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: UI?  http://www.balsamiq.com/products/mockups is popular.  I prefer paper/whiteboard.  Nothing beats having a designer do it for you. what do you mean by 'having a designer do it for you'? There are people who do UI

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
On Friday 25 June 2010 09:34:42 Roshan Mathews wrote: On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 09:03, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: UI? http://www.balsamiq.com/products/mockups is popular. I prefer paper/whiteboard. Nothing beats having a designer do it for you. what do you mean by 'having

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Elvis Joel D'Souza
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:52 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.orgwrote: On Friday 25 June 2010 09:34:42 Roshan Mathews wrote: On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 09:03, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: UI? http://www.balsamiq.com/products/mockups is popular. I prefer

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Senthil Kumaran
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 10:52:47AM +0530, Kenneth Gonsalves wrote: I am not talking of ui design - I am talking about program design. I do not know what the technical word for it is but what I mean is that when a program has to do something one has to sketch out the data structures and

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
On Friday 25 June 2010 10:57:00 Elvis Joel D'Souza wrote: program has to do something one has to sketch out the data structures and functions that are needed to get the thing done with the least possible effort. I think you are referring to Design Patterns Head First Design Patterns

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Balachandran Sivakumar
Hi, On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:04 AM, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: I am not referring to Design Patterns - I think flow charting is the word I am looking for You can use UML with its Sequence Diagrams and State machine diagrams etc. to design/model systems. There are

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
On Friday 25 June 2010 11:01:34 Senthil Kumaran wrote: I am not talking of ui design - I am talking about program design. I do not know what the technical word for it is but what I mean is that when a program has to do something one has to sketch out the data structures and functions that

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Kenneth Gonsalves
On Friday 25 June 2010 11:09:01 Balachandran Sivakumar wrote: I am not referring to Design Patterns - I think flow charting is the word I am looking for You can use UML with its Sequence Diagrams and State machine diagrams etc. to design/model systems. There are tools like BoUML

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread ThinRhino
On 25 June 2010 10:52, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: I am not talking of ui design - I am talking about program design. I do not know what the technical word for it is but what I mean is that when a program has to do something one has to sketch out the data structures and

Re: [BangPypers] designing programs

2010-06-24 Thread Roshan Mathews
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 11:17, Kenneth Gonsalves law...@au-kbc.org wrote: for one particular very complicated program, I modelled the whole workflow in dia - and found that the code worked perfectly on the first try. But I found dia a bit cumbersome, so I am looking for an alternative. I tried