Re: [Catalog-sig] V3 PEP-draft for transitioning to pypi-hosting of release files

2013-03-15 Thread Marcus Smith
In addition, maintainers of installation tools are asked to release two updates. The first one shall provide clear warnings [...] The second update for installation tools should change the default mode to allow only installation of package files hosted at the index domain, sounds good to

[Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread holger krekel
Hi all, in particular Philip, Marc-Andre, Donald, Carl and me decided to simplify the PEP and avoid the somewhat awkward ``simple/-with-externals`` index for various reasons, among them Marc-Andre's criticisms. This also means present-day installation tools (shipped with Redhat/Debian/etc.) will

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread PJ Eby
Do we even need the internal/external rel info? I was planning to just use the URL hostname. i.e., are there any use cases for designating an externally-hosted file internal, or an internally-hosted file external? If not, it seems the rel= is redundant. It's also more work to implement, vs.

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread Donald Stufft
On Mar 15, 2013, at 11:15 AM, PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com wrote: Do we even need the internal/external rel info? I was planning to just use the URL hostname. i.e., are there any use cases for designating an externally-hosted file internal, or an internally-hosted file external? If not,

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread holger krekel
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 11:15 -0400, PJ Eby wrote: Do we even need the internal/external rel info? I was planning to just use the URL hostname. i.e., are there any use cases for designating an externally-hosted file internal, or an internally-hosted file external? If not, it seems the

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread Carl Meyer
On 03/15/2013 09:15 AM, PJ Eby wrote: Do we even need the internal/external rel info? I was planning to just use the URL hostname. i.e., are there any use cases for designating an externally-hosted file internal, or an internally-hosted file external? If not, it seems the rel= is

Re: [Catalog-sig] V3 PEP-draft for transitioning to pypi-hosting of release files

2013-03-15 Thread Carl Meyer
Hi Marcus, On 03/15/2013 01:32 AM, Marcus Smith wrote: In addition, maintainers of installation tools are asked to release two updates. The first one shall provide clear warnings [...] The second update for installation tools should change the default mode to allow only

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread PJ Eby
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 12:07 PM, Carl Meyer c...@oddbird.net wrote: On 03/15/2013 09:15 AM, PJ Eby wrote: Do we even need the internal/external rel info? I was planning to just use the URL hostname. i.e., are there any use cases for designating an externally-hosted file internal, or an

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread Donald Stufft
On Mar 15, 2013, at 12:51 PM, PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 12:07 PM, Carl Meyer c...@oddbird.net wrote: On 03/15/2013 09:15 AM, PJ Eby wrote: Do we even need the internal/external rel info? I was planning to just use the URL hostname. i.e., are there any

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread Carl Meyer
On 03/15/2013 10:51 AM, PJ Eby wrote: Giving a blanket pass to all external links doesn't seem like such a good idea to me, This is a very good point, and it should be made clearer in the PEP that we don't recommend a single blanket option to allow all external links, but an option (like

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread M.-A. Lemburg
Thanks, Holger. This version looks a lot better :-) There are still some minor quirks which would need to be addressed more explicitly, but overall, this proposal provides a good way forward. Perhaps it would also be possible to add the secured download links and the caching/proxying ideas to

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread PJ Eby
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 1:39 PM, Carl Meyer c...@oddbird.net wrote: up to you whether you also want to use rel=internal as a hint for implicitly (perhaps with warning) adding to --allow-hosts, That's the bit I don't like. The security model is that if it's not allowed by allowed-hosts, it's

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread M.-A. Lemburg
A little off-topic, but I thought you might enjoy this in the context of all the crypto, hash and signing debate: http://xkcd.com/1181/ Cheers, -- Marc-Andre Lemburg eGenix.com Professional Python Services directly from the Source (#1, Mar 15 2013) Python Projects, Consulting and Support ...

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread Carl Meyer
tl;dr: I see your points, we'll change the PEP to allow clients to use hostnames instead of the rel attributes if they prefer. More comments below: On 03/15/2013 12:59 PM, PJ Eby wrote: That's the bit I don't like. The security model is that if it's not allowed by allowed-hosts, it's *not

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread PJ Eby
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 7:16 PM, Carl Meyer c...@oddbird.net wrote: Ok, pending agreement from Holger I'll make a change in the PEP to explicitly allow clients to make decisions based on either the rel attributes or based on hostnames. Would that be sufficient to address your concerns? Yes.

Re: [Catalog-sig] V4 Pre-PEP: transition to release-file hosting on PYPI

2013-03-15 Thread holger krekel
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 22:01 -0400, PJ Eby wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 7:16 PM, Carl Meyer c...@oddbird.net wrote: Ok, pending agreement from Holger I'll make a change in the PEP to explicitly allow clients to make decisions based on either the rel attributes or based on hostnames.