On 1/7/21 9:53 AM, Phil Perry wrote:
> On 07/01/2021 09:47, Jamie Burchell wrote:
>> Didn't the CentOS Vault repo ensure that every package ever published
>> was still available?
>>
>
> Yes, it did, but that is not the intention for CentOS Stream moving
> forward. Only packages in CentOS Linux
Le 08/01/2021 à 10:01, Fabian Arrotin a écrit :
> With my SysAdmin hat on, I'd say that the only real impacting bit is the
> shorter lifetime (5y instead of 10)
10 years of support instead of 5 has been the main argument here for using
CentOS instead of Debian with the LTS repositories.
--
On 8/1/2021 11:01 π.μ., Fabian Arrotin wrote:
With my SysAdmin hat on, I'd say that the only real impacting bit is the
shorter lifetime (5y instead of 10), but with overlap between stream
versions, so one would have time to have a look, reflect in automation,
reinstall/migrate, enjoy
With my
Il 2021-01-08 10:01 Fabian Arrotin ha scritto:
With my SysAdmin hat on, I'd say that the only real impacting bit is
the
shorter lifetime (5y instead of 10), but with overlap between stream
versions, so one would have time to have a look, reflect in automation,
reinstall/migrate, enjoy
One key
On 05/01/2021 20:32, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> Hello
>
> I've recently discovered the announcement regarding the change in direction
> for the CentOS project and I imagine like many others, I'm confused and
> concerned about what this means moving forward.
>
>
> Given we are not developing
On 07/01/2021 09:47, Jamie Burchell wrote:
Didn't the CentOS Vault repo ensure that every package ever published was still
available?
Yes, it did, but that is not the intention for CentOS Stream moving
forward. Only packages in CentOS Linux are moved to the vault at point
release time.
> On Jan 7, 2021, at 3:47 AM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
>
> Didn't the CentOS Vault repo ensure that every package ever published was
> still available?
>
You should come to realizing that things changed. They are not what they were.
With all fairness no one can say what will be true in a
Didn't the CentOS Vault repo ensure that every package ever published was still
available?
> On 7 Jan 2021, at 07:03, Gordon Messmer wrote:
>
> On 1/6/21 8:01 PM, Strahil Nikolov via CentOS wrote:
>> - No chance to "yum history undo last" as there are no older packages
>
>
> I've seen that
On 1/6/21 8:01 PM, Strahil Nikolov via CentOS wrote:
- No chance to "yum history undo last" as there are no older packages
I've seen that mentioned as a change pretty frequently, but I don't
think it is in any meaningful sense.
In CentOS Stream, package versions may be rebased
>At the moment my question possibly would have been better phrased "Why >isn't
>Streama suitable platform for a production web server".
It is , but expect rough edges.
The differences will be :
- Shorter lifetime .If you skip the first 2 minor releases -it will be shorter
- No chance to "yum
On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 7:59 PM Stephen John Smoogen
wrote:
>
> OK it looks like whatever I say is going to be taken to extremes so this
> will be my last email on this.
>
> I am not saying Tomcat is a dead technology. It is a technology which has
> certain use cases and deployments which the
On Wed, Jan 6, 2021, 2:44 PM Jamie Burchell wrote:
> I'll be the first to admit I don't like change and arguably I'm in the
> wrong industry for that, but that's another matter. However I don't want to
> throw away years of experience with CentOS/Fedora and time invested (mine
> personally and
I'll be the first to admit I don't like change and arguably I'm in the wrong
industry for that, but that's another matter. However I don't want to throw
away years of experience with CentOS/Fedora and time invested (mine personally
and my company's) learning and perfecting setups of which I
On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 13:48, Gianluca Cecchi
wrote:
> On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 7:43 PM Stephen John Smoogen
> wrote:
>
> >
> > I honestly have no idea how much Tomcat is used anymore. The various
> places
> > that I worked previously or have contacts with have killed it off by
> moving
> >
On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 7:43 PM Stephen John Smoogen
wrote:
>
> I honestly have no idea how much Tomcat is used anymore. The various places
> that I worked previously or have contacts with have killed it off by moving
> whatever used it to external cloud services versus JBOSS or anything else.
>
On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 12:42, Simon Matter wrote:
> > On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 11:17, Simon Matter
> wrote:
> >
> >> > On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 07:50, Simon Matter
> >> wrote:
>
> > I didn't say or mean that. My answer is that it is complicated and more
> > meant that the software you expect requires
On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 8:30 AM Jamie Burchell wrote:
>
> We use Ansible "to a point" in that it sets up what we consider to be our
> preferred server (Droplet) for a specific purpose, then we deploy projects on
> them and tweak non-Ansible managed project configs. It's not old-school
> scripts
> On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 11:17, Simon Matter wrote:
>
>> > On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 07:50, Simon Matter
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> > Am 06.01.21 um 03:01 schrieb Scott Robbins:
>> >> >> On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
>> >> >>> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has
On 1/6/21 9:20 AM, Nicolas Kovacs wrote:
Broken packages explained away are still broken packages.
I'm not sure how your system got in to a broken state, though. If you
have a working system, and one repo updates a package to remove a
dependency of a currently working package, those
Le 06/01/2021 à 18:08, Gordon Messmer a écrit :
> What I do see is that the sclo-php72-php-pecl-imagick has a dependency on
> libMagickCore.so.5()(64bit), which is recorded in the rpm package. If you
> have
> a package from a third party repository (either EPEL or SCLO, or others), and
> it
On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 11:17, Simon Matter wrote:
> > On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 07:50, Simon Matter
> wrote:
> >
> >> > Am 06.01.21 um 03:01 schrieb Scott Robbins:
> >> >> On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> >> >>> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a
On 1/5/21 11:31 PM, Nicolas Kovacs wrote:
No, this was an actual problem I had back in April 2020. Upgrading from CR
broke imagemagick
At the time, you described that problem as:
I got an alert from Yum-Cron this morning:
Failed to check for updates with the following error message:
Failed
On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process of
> destroying and rebuilding every X years. Even Microsoft has gone the Apple
> way and just perpetually updates Windows 10 now.
Red Hat is working on this with
> On Jan 6, 2021, at 12:53 AM, Gordon Messmer wrote:
>
> On 1/5/21 6:30 PM, Valeri Galtsev wrote:
>> I was not comparing CentOS Stream with CentOS (former 10 year life cycle
>> system), I was comparing CentOS Stream with Debian (and clones) LTS.
>
>
> The original message came from a CentOS
> On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 07:50, Simon Matter wrote:
>
>> > Am 06.01.21 um 03:01 schrieb Scott Robbins:
>> >> On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
>> >>> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process
>> of
>> >>> destroying and rebuilding every X
On Wed, 6 Jan 2021 at 07:50, Simon Matter wrote:
> > Am 06.01.21 um 03:01 schrieb Scott Robbins:
> >> On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> >>> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process of
> >>> destroying and rebuilding every X years. Even
We use Ansible "to a point" in that it sets up what we consider to be our
preferred server (Droplet) for a specific purpose, then we deploy projects on
them and tweak non-Ansible managed project configs. It's not old-school scripts
and it's not quite a one-liner to deploy everything. It's
On Tue, Jan 5, 2021 at 6:32 PM Jamie Burchell wrote:
>
> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process of
> destroying and rebuilding every X years. Even Microsoft has gone the Apple
> way and just perpetually updates Windows 10 now.
>
Do you use tools like
Hmm, I see a relation here.
C7Linux - 2024
C8Linux - 2021
So I assume:
C6Linux - 2027
C5Linux - 2030
C4Linux - 2033
...
Interesting.
On Tue, 5 Jan 2021, 21:44 Phil Perry, wrote:
> On 05/01/2021 19:32, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> > Hello
> >
> > I've recently discovered the announcement regarding
> Am 06.01.21 um 03:01 schrieb Scott Robbins:
>> On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
>>> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process of
>>> destroying and rebuilding every X years. Even Microsoft has gone the
>>> Apple
>>> way and just
Am 06.01.21 um 03:01 schrieb Scott Robbins:
On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process of
destroying and rebuilding every X years. Even Microsoft has gone the Apple
way and just perpetually updates Windows
Am 05.01.21 um 23:51 schrieb Gordon Messmer:
On 1/5/21 11:32 AM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
is the change a non-issue for my use-case?
Probably. For a lot of users, Stream is a drop-in replacement that's
better than CentOS was, because it gets updates consistently and doesn't
suffer from
On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 1:22 AM Gordon Messmer
wrote:
> On 1/5/21 3:39 PM, Valeri Galtsev wrote:
> > And as someone mentioned, these other distributions have long great
> > record of system upgrade from one release to another. CentOS has no
> > record (and probably no upgrade engineered yet). In
Le 06/01/2021 à 08:48, John R. Dennison a écrit :
> To be fair it was only broken because you kept it broken; you could have
> backed out the CR updates and waited for the point release to go GA and
> be on ABI parity with EPEL.
I used the CR updates because back then the official repositories
On Wed, Jan 06, 2021 at 08:31:34AM +0100, Nicolas Kovacs wrote:
>
> No, this was an actual problem I had back in April 2020. Upgrading from CR
> broke imagemagick, so I couldn't use the corresponding PHP modules, so my
> Roundcube installation was broken for a few weeks.
To be fair it was only
Le 06/01/2021 à 08:06, Gordon Messmer a écrit :
> Are you describing an actual problem, right now, or is that an invented
> example?
No, this was an actual problem I had back in April 2020. Upgrading from CR
broke imagemagick, so I couldn't use the corresponding PHP modules, so my
Roundcube
On 1/5/21 10:47 PM, Nicolas Kovacs wrote:
And in the past, things have been known to break. Activate the CR repository,
and suddenly libmagick is broken because it hasn't been rebuilt yet against the
new version.
Are you describing an actual problem, right now, or is that an invented
On 1/5/21 6:30 PM, Valeri Galtsev wrote:
I was not comparing CentOS Stream with CentOS (former 10 year life cycle
system), I was comparing CentOS Stream with Debian (and clones) LTS.
The original message came from a CentOS user who asked "is the change a
non-issue for my use-case?"
So,
Le 06/01/2021 à 01:22, Gordon Messmer a écrit :
> CentOS Stream will be compatible with EPEL to the same extent that new point
> releases are compatible with EPEL.
And in the past, things have been known to break. Activate the CR repository,
and suddenly libmagick is broken because it hasn't been
> On Jan 5, 2021, at 6:22 PM, Gordon Messmer wrote:
>
> On 1/5/21 3:39 PM, Valeri Galtsev wrote:
>> And as someone mentioned, these other distributions have long great record
>> of system upgrade from one release to another. CentOS has no record (and
>> probably no upgrade engineered yet).
On Tue, Jan 05, 2021 at 11:31:34PM +, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process of
> destroying and rebuilding every X years. Even Microsoft has gone the Apple
> way and just perpetually updates Windows 10 now.
I'm not sure how it will go.
> We will need to (manually) migrate to Stream 9.x after 5 years
> instead of
> 10 though?
Most probably after 3 years. Currently stream should be equal to RHEL
8.4 .
Best Regards,
Strahil Nikolov
___
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
On 1/5/21 3:39 PM, Valeri Galtsev wrote:
And as someone mentioned, these other distributions have long great
record of system upgrade from one release to another. CentOS has no
record (and probably no upgrade engineered yet). In that respect
CentOS Stream is way behind...
In that respect,
On 1/5/21 5:19 PM, Gordon Messmer wrote:
On 1/5/21 3:02 PM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
We will need to (manually) migrate to Stream 9.x after 5 years instead of
10 though?
Yes. CentOS Stream has a lifecycle comparable with other LTS
distributions.
And as someone mentioned, these other
>
> Given we are not developing drivers or applications (other than websites
> and web applications), is the change a non-issue for my use-case? I've seen
> it written that CentOS Stream is the "development version" of RHEL but also
> that we shouldn't have considered RHEL to be the beta for
Off topic for sure, but it's a shame this has to be a manual process of
destroying and rebuilding every X years. Even Microsoft has gone the Apple
way and just perpetually updates Windows 10 now.
On Tue, 5 Jan 2021 at 23:20, Gordon Messmer
wrote:
> On 1/5/21 3:02 PM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> >
On 1/5/21 3:02 PM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
We will need to (manually) migrate to Stream 9.x after 5 years instead of
10 though?
Yes. CentOS Stream has a lifecycle comparable with other LTS distributions.
___
CentOS mailing list
CentOS@centos.org
On Tue, Jan 5, 2021, 5:03 PM Jamie Burchell wrote:
> > Probably. For a lot of users, Stream is a drop-in replacement that's
> better than CentOS was
>
> We will need to (manually) migrate to Stream 9.x after 5 years instead of
> 10 though?
>
>
Well that's the part that hasn't fully been laid
> Probably. For a lot of users, Stream is a drop-in replacement that's
better than CentOS was
We will need to (manually) migrate to Stream 9.x after 5 years instead of
10 though?
On Tue, 5 Jan 2021 at 22:51, Gordon Messmer
wrote:
> On 1/5/21 11:32 AM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
> > is the change
Le 05/01/2021 à 22:59, Frank Cox a écrit :
> I don't have any particular love for Oracle, but since they pay X number of
> people to keep Oracle Linux current with RHEL and updated, they shouldn't
> have any problems with burn-out or a lack of long-term interest on the part
> of volunteers that
> If security was a priority for you, as it was for me, then CentOS wasn't
really suitable for public-facing services
You mean in terms of security patch release time presumably?
> If you're building software that you intend to deploy on RHEL
We're not building or compiling software.
On Tue,
In that case, it sounds like a non-issue for the way we currently use
CentOS.
As there's a simple migration from CentOS 8 to Stream and Digital Ocean
currently provide CentOS 8 images, it'll be interesting to see what they do
moving forward.
___
CentOS
On 1/5/21 11:32 AM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
is the change a non-issue for my use-case?
Probably. For a lot of users, Stream is a drop-in replacement that's
better than CentOS was, because it gets updates consistently and doesn't
suffer from periods in which no updates are available,
On 1/5/21 2:27 PM, Jamie Burchell wrote:
We already
automatically update our systems with yum-cron / dnf automatic and I'm
reading that if we're already doing that, Stream isn't going to be a
departure
I'd have said the same: If you trust CentOS enough to update
automatically, then Stream
> but it seems too early in the game to make the decision to depend on
it. That may change over the course of the next few months.
Yes this is how I feel but conveyed badly in my last. It's currently a
concept and not a viable distro to move to and in some cases there is only
a year to make the
On Tue, 5 Jan 2021 21:32:18 +
Jamie Burchell wrote:
> The uncertainty is frustrating and unsettling.
I certainly agree with you on this point!
Personally, while I haven't made an actual decision on which way I'm going with
my own projects, I'm currently leaning toward Oracle Linux. I
Consider me firmly schooled and I apologise if I have caused any upset with
my comment. My understanding of the situation was the result of pouring
over countless threads where it's difficult to filter out the facts and
reality. It's encouraging for sure that there's potentially at least one
ship
On Tue, Jan 5, 2021 at 3:32 PM Jamie Burchell
wrote:
> I'm sure it's my lack of understanding, but there feels too much hope
> pinned on "Rocky", which seems like one person (albeit a key person) going
> it alone with the hope of a community following of disgruntled people. I
> see a single
I guess we need to wait and see how the dust settles. For those lucky
enough to still be on CentOS 7, there's a bit of breathing space although
these things take time to plan and implement of course. Those unlucky
enough to have updated to CentOS 8 have less than a year to decide to move
to stream
The question for me, too is going to be, what will the VPS providers do?
Digital Ocean, Vultur, etc. I'll be at their mercy, without trying to create
my own image, if that's even possible.
Hopefully something emerges as the popular replacement (e.g. "Rocky"), and they
support spinning up
> Given we are not developing drivers or applications (other than
> websites
> and web applications), is the change a non-issue for my use-case?
If you decide to go with Stream, you will need to test carefully each
version and use some kind of repository management - as there will be
no older
On 05/01/2021 19:32, Jamie Burchell wrote:
Hello
I've recently discovered the announcement regarding the change in direction
for the CentOS project and I imagine like many others, I'm confused and
concerned about what this means moving forward.
I work for a small web development agency and we
Hello
I've recently discovered the announcement regarding the change in direction
for the CentOS project and I imagine like many others, I'm confused and
concerned about what this means moving forward.
I work for a small web development agency and we offer hosting as part of
our package to
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